MTG Salvation

DEBT TO THE DEATHLESS

What do you guys think about this card, im runing one copy on my Esper control deck, and its amazing specially when using things as Solemn Simulacrum to get that second land drop.
I use the think twice, Azorius charm and Jace, Architect of Thought to dig for it and works pretty well.

but what is your opinion? to slow for modern? to unrealiable? to heavy color-wise?

Let me know. i think its solid gold.

Way too slow. This card only starts to be decent once you have 8 mana. And even there it's not good, you would be better off just playing Sorin's Vengeance (which is also not that great).

If you want to run a mana sink in esper play Sphinx's Revelation; instant speed + drawing cards + less mana to be good = much, much better than debt.

Debt to the Deathless is the kind of card you want in big multiplayer games. It starts being better than Exsanguinate at 7 mana (giving you a drain of 6 instead of 5 with Exsanguinate) and gets better with more mana. These cards aren't meant for 1 vs 1.

I think its only "alright" at 8 mana... when Sphinxs draws you 5 and gains you 5. Drawing usually better.

Quote from Lantern

I think its only "alright" at 8 mana... when Sphinxs draws you 5 and gains you 5. Drawing usually better.

At 8 mana you're looking at a 16 point life swing, which should usually (but not always) end the game.

Now, if you can ramp to 14 mana, that's a different story.

But yes, this is a commander card more than a 1v1 card.

I use it with Crypt Ghast in my MBC deck, mostly just because the artwork on the card is just too good to pass up.

If you're looking for a card to dump mana into that's more budget than sphinx's revelation and you're running black, how about profane command?

Quote from Mrow_Mix

If you're looking for a card to dump mana into that's more budget than sphinx's revelation and you're running black, how about profane command?

This is actually a great suggestion. It's more versatile and less costly, and that life gain is the inferior aspect of the card anyway.

Why not just use Exsanguinate?

Quote from DrWorm

Why not just use Exsanguinate?

If you're not expecting Leylines, Exsanguinate is inferior past five mana.

Quote from Laimbrane

At 8 mana you're looking at a 16 point life swing, which should usually (but not always) end the game.

No, at 8 mana you're looking at a 8 point life swing. Hence why I said at 8 mana it only starts to get decent. Anything less it's really bad and anything more it's just OK. As Lantern said, for 8 mana it's much better to draw 5 cards and gain 5 at instant speed via revelation.

Debt to the Deathless is a terrible card in practically any 60 card constructed format and always will be. I'm surprised this thread didn't die out while I was gone.

Quote from Tom

Debt to the Deathless is a terrible card in practically any 60 card constructed format and always will be. I'm surprised this thread didn't die out while I was gone.

60 cards multiplayer is a thing. Exsanguinate is among the best spell in the format. Debt to the Deathless has its place there too.

I just think this card is completely unreasonable everywhere outside of limited. It costs an entire turn late in the game, and basically all your mana. If you're leaving up counters, then you're not even casting it for that much. The minimum I ever want to cast Sphinx's for is x=6, so the cmc=6. If I want to cast this for 3, that's 7 total. Considering it's just a 6 point life swing, it's not that insane in constructed.

In limited it's fine because it can buy you the last turn and you don't really expect anything broken. In constructed though, I'd much rather 3 cards than 3 life, every time. When I consider having up to 4 copies of cards and wanting to draw specific cards, it does a lot more. In limited there's a good chance I don't really draw anything specifically good, but even there I think drawing 3 cards is great. That's why Opportunity is widely accepted as the best uncommon in M14 limited.

Ultimately, I don't think there's a place anywhere in constructed. I want to play a control deck in order to hit land drops and make this work, and I would rather Sphinx's Revelation every time, if I had to choose only one or the other.

Sanguine Bond + Debt or Exsanguinate. Discuss?

Its a fun card, that is absurd in multiplayer and surprisingly underrated. I actually built a deck around it if anyone is interested, BW control deck I call Sorin's Debt, I beat Zoo, Mono Green Ramp, and other creature based decks with it. Would love some feedback.

Late game monster!
There are so many people bashing debt to the deathless but in a multiplayer game this card has single handedly won at least 30% of the games i play. My deck is 5 color control, but it worked fine in whiteblack control. Both decks run some mana ramp, making it more effective, but it increases in power exponentially after 8 mana. Mtg is a strategy game, right? Don't play it as soon as you draw it, play it when it counts. I wipe 4 player boards consistently with veterans on my table. Think at 10 mana, 12 damage per opponent, 48 life gained. If there is an opponent to survive, they have 5 health compared to your 60. This is a great card and i would recommend it to anyone who doesnt play in my group.