I think you guys are swinging too negative. She's no Jace, but she is absolutely a Nahiri or better. She's a very fine walker and I think you WILL see her played in Modern and perhaps even Legacy and Vintage from time to time. Remember, Dack was a $50.00 walker until reprint based solely on on Vintage play, almost.
Look at Jace, Vryn's Prodgy. Down to $30 now but poised to increase. That's Chandra.
Nahiri is only a $20 walker though. $16 low.
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Dack was also only available in a criminally underopened set, AND he's clearly the best card from the set. Chandra is good, but there are a lot of good cards in Kaladesh (it has a cycle of rare duals, which is always nice for value), plus people are going to be opening it for the lottery tickets. So I see the argument against her pulling a Dack as one of supply, not card quality.
Conspiracy wasn't criminally under opened, it has been in easily available until earlier this year it sold so well.
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Dack was also only available in a criminally underopened set, AND he's clearly the best card from the set. Chandra is good, but there are a lot of good cards in Kaladesh (it has a cycle of rare duals, which is always nice for value), plus people are going to be opening it for the lottery tickets. So I see the argument against her pulling a Dack as one of supply, not card quality.
Conspiracy wasn't criminally under opened, it has been in easily available until earlier this year it sold so well.
I think that's the point of being criminally underopened. It didn't sell well so it sat on shelves FAR longer than it should have. The result was the second print run probably didn't happen and it is still available.
Dack was also only available in a criminally underopened set, AND he's clearly the best card from the set. Chandra is good, but there are a lot of good cards in Kaladesh (it has a cycle of rare duals, which is always nice for value), plus people are going to be opening it for the lottery tickets. So I see the argument against her pulling a Dack as one of supply, not card quality.
Conspiracy wasn't criminally under opened, it has been in easily available until earlier this year it sold so well.
I think that's the point of being criminally underopened. It didn't sell well so it sat on shelves FAR longer than it should have. The result was the second print run probably didn't happen and it is still available.
First Conspiracy was not a limited print run. It was print-to-demand:
tappwater2 asked: There's a conspiracy going around that Conspiracy is going to have a very limited print run, can you please deny this so I can not be sad?
MaRo: Conspiracy will *not* have a limited print run. We are willing to reprint if there is enough demand.
So if you saw it on shelves, it was probably because stores could - and did - just order more.
The trouble with conspiracy was that while it had a lot of initial hype and enjoyment from players who wanted to play it. It never had near the demand of a typical standard set. One possibility is that wizards did their usual initial large print run, stores bought in on however much they felt they might be able to move (still no where near standard set amounts), and wizards/distributors still had left over product from that initial large print run that slowly filtered out as shops who had the demand restocked.
The other possibility is yes, there was enough initial demand to run through the initial print run, and they made a second (but as usual smaller print run), but by that time demand had begun to, and did wane, and now there are a ton of unopened boxes running around the internet collecting dust, until it eventually gets old enough to where collectors or drafters decided to start gobbling them up at fairly cheap prices and the prices begin to rise as the supply begins to dip as almost inevitably always happens over time assuming the sets aren't terrible value wise/gimmick wise/etc.
For now though the first conspiracy set is still plenty well available all over the place from what I have seen online, in fairly large quantities. I still see regular sales of the original conspiracy boxes fairly often which is usually a sign of lack of demand and reasonably high stock levels left.
As for the singles values. The fact that the set wasn't opened nearly as much as a standard set (and never will be), was a reason that something like Dack was able to stay as high as he was until he got reprinted and then the price dive bombed accordingly.
In the case of the new Chandra, its in a large 1st set of a new block standard set, with several new planeswalkers, a new good cycle of duals (to finish off an old reasonably popular cycle), as well as several other decent cards in the set garnering attention, and of course last but certainly not least.... The special foil artifacts which are sure to have that fun lottery ticket effect to get people to open them for as we have seen similarly in the past. So supply isn't going to be anywhere near as low as Dack was, or even is now after the reprinting.
If it ends up being a multi-format all star in addition to a potential standard all star, then that's certainly something in the high value camp, but if not, then it dropping to $30 I could easily see happening. Time, as with all such things, will tell. Personally I would be patient if I was looking to pick some up.
I think that's the point of being criminally underopened. It didn't sell well so it sat on shelves FAR longer than it should have. The result was the second print run probably didn't happen and it is still available.
From jshrwd:
First Conspiracy was not a limited print run. It was print-to-demand:
I understand that it was printed to demand. However, if the first run completely sells out, there is reason to do a second run. The point I was trying to make was that the first run (which is typically printed to a forecasted demand) didn't sell out and therefore didn't require another run.
This is pure speculation of course, but it is obvious that the demand clearly didn't meet Hasbro's expectations and is why supply was so abundant for so long.
/edit and of course I should have read JeffB's response. He explained everything far more eloquently than I did.
Hopefully this thread serve as warning enough for people to save their money.
Approaching $20.
Thanks for all the great discussion. I think moving forward people should have the message that preordering planeswalkers is just simply burning money.
Red midrange lol smh. People have been using the 5 mana Jace more because it scrys and draws which is real card advantage.
I still have faith in this card. She fits into pretty much any current red deck in standard with, perhaps, RW tokens being the lone exception.
Though it's hard to be a dominant Planeswalker in this current standard format because there are so many tier 1 decks right now. Her price tag is a victim of the exceptional variety of standard. That's not entirely a bad thing.
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Nahiri is only a $20 walker though. $16 low.
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Conspiracy wasn't criminally under opened, it has been in easily available until earlier this year it sold so well.
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I think that's the point of being criminally underopened. It didn't sell well so it sat on shelves FAR longer than it should have. The result was the second print run probably didn't happen and it is still available.
First Conspiracy was not a limited print run. It was print-to-demand:
So if you saw it on shelves, it was probably because stores could - and did - just order more.
The other possibility is yes, there was enough initial demand to run through the initial print run, and they made a second (but as usual smaller print run), but by that time demand had begun to, and did wane, and now there are a ton of unopened boxes running around the internet collecting dust, until it eventually gets old enough to where collectors or drafters decided to start gobbling them up at fairly cheap prices and the prices begin to rise as the supply begins to dip as almost inevitably always happens over time assuming the sets aren't terrible value wise/gimmick wise/etc.
For now though the first conspiracy set is still plenty well available all over the place from what I have seen online, in fairly large quantities. I still see regular sales of the original conspiracy boxes fairly often which is usually a sign of lack of demand and reasonably high stock levels left.
As for the singles values. The fact that the set wasn't opened nearly as much as a standard set (and never will be), was a reason that something like Dack was able to stay as high as he was until he got reprinted and then the price dive bombed accordingly.
In the case of the new Chandra, its in a large 1st set of a new block standard set, with several new planeswalkers, a new good cycle of duals (to finish off an old reasonably popular cycle), as well as several other decent cards in the set garnering attention, and of course last but certainly not least.... The special foil artifacts which are sure to have that fun lottery ticket effect to get people to open them for as we have seen similarly in the past. So supply isn't going to be anywhere near as low as Dack was, or even is now after the reprinting.
If it ends up being a multi-format all star in addition to a potential standard all star, then that's certainly something in the high value camp, but if not, then it dropping to $30 I could easily see happening. Time, as with all such things, will tell. Personally I would be patient if I was looking to pick some up.
I understand that it was printed to demand. However, if the first run completely sells out, there is reason to do a second run. The point I was trying to make was that the first run (which is typically printed to a forecasted demand) didn't sell out and therefore didn't require another run.
This is pure speculation of course, but it is obvious that the demand clearly didn't meet Hasbro's expectations and is why supply was so abundant for so long.
/edit and of course I should have read JeffB's response. He explained everything far more eloquently than I did.
Approaching $20.
Thanks for all the great discussion. I think moving forward people should have the message that preordering planeswalkers is just simply burning money.
Red midrange lol smh. People have been using the 5 mana Jace more because it scrys and draws which is real card advantage.
Though it's hard to be a dominant Planeswalker in this current standard format because there are so many tier 1 decks right now. Her price tag is a victim of the exceptional variety of standard. That's not entirely a bad thing.