As I understand it, if a spell or ability targets Volrath, the shapestealer * and Volraths second ability is used to copy a (legal) target in response, the spell or ability targeting Volrath will no longer effect him because he is no longer a legal target.(Similar to Scion of the Ur-Dragon s ability)
Is this correct?
If so my question is as follows, if Volrath is targeted by a spell and his second ability is used to "fizzle" the spell targeting him and in response another spell is cast targeting Volrath, can volrath use his second ability targeting the same target he targeted in the first instance to "fizzle" the second spell targeting him?
Nothing about using Volrath's ability makes him an illegal target in either case. He is still the same object and still a legal target for Chaos Warp since he is still a permanent.
The only ways for this to do anything is to target something of yours with Hexproof with Volrath or turn Volrath into an illegal target by making him a different color or permanent type (if you copy an animated land for example to turn him into a noncreature land). But just changing what he looks like doesn't do enough to "fizzle" anything. So, in your first scenario, Chaos Warp shuffles him in even if he looks like a Triskelion meaning the Path to Exile isn't necessary. And the second scenario will still have Warp shuffle him in.
I am also not sure what your comment about Scion was meant to convey but either there is a misunderstanding with that ability as well or something different is happening.
As I understand it, if a spell or ability targets Volrath, the shapestealer * and Volraths second ability is used to copy a (legal) target in response, the spell or ability targeting Volrath will no longer effect him because he is no longer a legal target.(Similar to Scion of the Ur-Dragon s ability)
Is this correct?
No. Volrath may look differently, but he is still the same object. If the new characteristics he aquires still match the targeting restrictions of the spell, it will still affect him. Scion of the Ur-Dragon works the same.
608.2. If the object that’s resolving is an instant spell, a sorcery spell, or an ability, its resolution may involve several steps. The steps described in rules 608.2a and 608.2b are followed first. The steps described in rules 608.2c–k are then followed as appropriate, in no specific order. The step described in rule 608.2m is followed last.
[...]
608.2b If the spell or ability specifies targets, it checks whether the targets are still legal. A target that’s no longer in the zone it was in when it was targeted is illegal. Other changes to the game state may cause a target to no longer be legal; for example, its characteristics may have changed or an effect may have changed the text of the spell. If the source of an ability has left the zone it was in, its last known information is used during this process. If all its targets, for every instance of the word “target,”are now illegal, the spell or ability doesn’t resolve.It’s removed from the stack and, if it’s a spell, put into its owner’s graveyard. Otherwise, the spell or ability will resolve normally. Illegal targets, if any, won’t be affected by parts of a resolving spell’s effect for which they’re illegal. Other parts of the effect for which those targets are not illegal may still affect them. If the spell or ability creates anycontinuous effects that affect game rules (see rule 613.11), those effects don’t apply to illegal targets. If part of the effect requires information about an illegal target, it fails to determine any such information. Any part of the effect that requires that information won’t happen.
[...]
Hello there,
As I understand it, if a spell or ability targets Volrath, the shapestealer * and Volraths second ability is used to copy a (legal) target in response, the spell or ability targeting Volrath will no longer effect him because he is no longer a legal target.(Similar to Scion of the Ur-Dragon s ability)
Is this correct?
If so my question is as follows, if Volrath is targeted by a spell and his second ability is used to "fizzle" the spell targeting him and in response another spell is cast targeting Volrath, can volrath use his second ability targeting the same target he targeted in the first instance to "fizzle" the second spell targeting him?
Example 1:
Chaos Warp is cast Targeting Volrath, the shapestealer. In response Volrath, the shapestealer s second ability is used to target Triskelion. In response of that Path to Exile is cast targeting Volrath, the shapestealer. In response Volrath, the shapestealer s second ability is used again to target the same Triskelion.
Example 2:
Chaos Warp is cast Targeting Volrath, the shapestealer. In response Volrath, the shapestealer s second ability is used to target himself (Volrath has a counter on it).
Will both these instances make it so that volrath is no longer a legal target for the spells targeting him?
I am looking for the section(s) in the rulings that go over this and or a clear answer as to why it works this way or not.
* Volrath = Volrath, the shapestealer
The only ways for this to do anything is to target something of yours with Hexproof with Volrath or turn Volrath into an illegal target by making him a different color or permanent type (if you copy an animated land for example to turn him into a noncreature land). But just changing what he looks like doesn't do enough to "fizzle" anything. So, in your first scenario, Chaos Warp shuffles him in even if he looks like a Triskelion meaning the Path to Exile isn't necessary. And the second scenario will still have Warp shuffle him in.
I am also not sure what your comment about Scion was meant to convey but either there is a misunderstanding with that ability as well or something different is happening.
No. Volrath may look differently, but he is still the same object. If the new characteristics he aquires still match the targeting restrictions of the spell, it will still affect him. Scion of the Ur-Dragon works the same.
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This misunderstanding of the rules seems to stem from a misconception I hade about cards changing names effecting their legality.
Thank you for clearing this up