Okay this is probably a dumb question but it happened last night and while it does make sense at the same time it doesn't.
Okay so last night i was Playing my new Zombie deck, so it is not that great. I was doing a comb with gis in which each turn i was getting4 new zobies each turn.
Well that was the plan anyone, get a nice big army and then swing for the win.
Instead he played Fiend hunter and targets Gisa, Then before Gisa was Exiled he uses Roon of the Hidden Realm's ability on Fiend hunter. Now that is fine as it comes back when he leaves teh battlefield, but there is an issue. The ability only works when he is on the battlefield. in order for him to exil he has to be on the battlefield. Would he be able to exile Fiend hunter with roon before gisa is exile (But on the stack to be exiled) and thus permanently exile Gisa? (To me it just seems weird that Gisa would not return even with the cofusing stack triggers/effects I fugured due to layering gisa would be exiled before he could be allowed to actvate roon's ability.
To satisfy your Curiosity i am talking about Ghoulcaller Gisa but the creature i had did not matter in this equation.
Yeah, it's legit. He responds to the exile of your guy by making the Fiend Hunter leave play, which makes his "return exiled creature to play" trigger go off, which does nothing, and then his original exiling trigger goes off, eating your creature forever. Compare the wording on Fiend Hunter and Banisher Priest, who's a later card that's worded in a manner that avoids such mishaps.
Fiend Hunter, differently from his newer, fixed cousins, has two abilities, one which exiles, another one that brings what he exiled back. One of the ways of exploring it is removing him from the battlefield with the exiling trigger on stack. It exiles one target permanently, and if you are blinking him, you get to exile something else when he comes back. This happens because the exile trigger has no IF or while clauses, and the game stops following Fiend Hunter as an entity once he changes zones. The exiling still happens, but the return trigger on top resolves while there's nothing removed yet to bring back.
Yeah, it's legit. He responds to the exile of your guy by making the Fiend Hunter leave play, which makes his "return exiled creature to play" trigger go off, which does nothing, and then his original exiling trigger goes off, eating your creature forever. Compare the wording on Fiend Hunter and Banisher Priest, who's a later card that's worded in a manner that avoids such mishaps.
Okay so it works because Gisa is still waiting for the effect to exile her takes effect.
In fact, when Fiend Hunter enter the battlefield, his first ability is put on the stack, in response, one could use Roon of the Hidden Realm's ability on Fiend Hunter, what happen is the flip ability goes first, then, since Fiend Hunter left the battlefield, his second ability trigger before the first one, thus the creature is returned, however since the creature never left in the first place, nothing happen, then his first ability trigger and the creature is exiled permanently. He then come back and exile something else.
How does banisher priest's wording change how it works? Rumpy said it does but i fail to see it. (or is he saying that it is the same effect, just worded to be less confusing?)
Since Banisher Priest's ability is one unique ability, it can't happen separatly.
Thus, you can't do shenanigans with flip abilities with Banisher Priest.
Banisher Priest has a single ability, and it is worded in a way that makes a different rule apply to it. An effect like Banisher Priest's which causes a zone change but specifies a duration for it ("until ~ leaves the battlefield") (a) causes the card that changed zones to come back immediately when the duration ends and (b) doesn't cause the zone change at all if the duration ends before the zone change can happen in the first place.
Banisher Priest has one trigger exiling the target for a duration (as long as it's on the battlefield). Once the duration expires, the creature retunrs immediately (no trigger involved here). And if the Priest leaves the battlefield before its trigger resolves, the duration ended before it began, making the exile trigger do nothing.
According to the wording, wouldn't it work with Banisher Priest as well?
Baniser Priest enters and ETB goes ont he stack
Then in response to the trigger, Banisher is cloud shifted.
The Trigger goes off, and the trageted creature is "Exiled until Banisher priest leaves the battlefield"
Since it is no longer on the battlefeild, that will never happen, and it's perma gone?
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern:
Affinity
Naya Burn
Merfolk
White Blue Midrange
Boggles
Grixis Delver
Esper Control(It's semi playable, believe it or not! Dont bring it to a tourny you care about winning though)
No - it doesn't work with Banisher Priest due to how it's worded. The duration is 'until it leaves the field', but it ended before it began, so does nothing.
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Okay so last night i was Playing my new Zombie deck, so it is not that great. I was doing a comb with gis in which each turn i was getting4 new zobies each turn.
Well that was the plan anyone, get a nice big army and then swing for the win.
Instead he played Fiend hunter and targets Gisa, Then before Gisa was Exiled he uses Roon of the Hidden Realm's ability on Fiend hunter. Now that is fine as it comes back when he leaves teh battlefield, but there is an issue. The ability only works when he is on the battlefield. in order for him to exil he has to be on the battlefield. Would he be able to exile Fiend hunter with roon before gisa is exile (But on the stack to be exiled) and thus permanently exile Gisa? (To me it just seems weird that Gisa would not return even with the cofusing stack triggers/effects I fugured due to layering gisa would be exiled before he could be allowed to actvate roon's ability.
To satisfy your Curiosity i am talking about Ghoulcaller Gisa but the creature i had did not matter in this equation.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
Okay so it works because Gisa is still waiting for the effect to exile her takes effect.
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
Thus, you can't do shenanigans with flip abilities with Banisher Priest.
Former Rules Advisor
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(The Gamers: Dorkness Rising)
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Baniser Priest enters and ETB goes ont he stack
Then in response to the trigger, Banisher is cloud shifted.
The Trigger goes off, and the trageted creature is "Exiled until Banisher priest leaves the battlefield"
Since it is no longer on the battlefeild, that will never happen, and it's perma gone?
Affinity
Naya Burn
Merfolk
White Blue Midrange
Boggles
Grixis Delver
Esper Control(It's semi playable, believe it or not! Dont bring it to a tourny you care about winning though)
Legacy:
Miracles
Deathblade