I decided that i would write another short article because i'm bored. In this article i will be expressing two sides of the game state today and what is effecting it. This is not a rant, just thoughts typed down. I hope you enjoy the read.
I've always asked this question to people; "In your opinion, do you think WoTC is killing MTG, or is the Internet killing MTG?"
I get a fair amount of responses from different sides, and i understand both sides, but i'm going to tell you MY opinion.
WoTC is Killing MTG
With the rarity changes, the Power Creep, etc etc, people are saying WoTC is killing MTG. Why? Because they dont give a crap. They practice a bad business of not listening to the customer. The customer is what keeps you afloat, and when the customer demands something and its in your power to deliver and you dont, then thats bad business. Many times i have seen developers call things "over powered" or a "mistake" simply for the fact that they know certain pro's who say so. And as the saying goes "A pro says it, WoTC wills it". Bad designers (in the sense of they think they know everything) is killing this game. They refuse to see what mistakes they have made and in return, they print bigger mistakes to take care of the lesser mistake. Its a horrible cycle. It kills this game more and more everytime they do it.
The "NWO"
When it comes to magic gameplay, those who have been around for more than 6 years have seen it change drastically. From the Power Creep, to the rules changes that make the game...well, different. Is different bad? Sometimes, yes it is. For example, take Coca-Cola. You see them come out with different products and try new things, but you dont open a can of original Coke and taste Root Beer. Why? Because they know they have something loved and it shouldnt change like that. What is WoTC doing to change our beloved game drastically?
1. Power Creep - The power level of cards is absurd now a days. New players dont really understand this very much, and thats understandable, but for those who have been around and seen it happen, you will instantly laugh when someone says that Power is not an issue. For the new players, look up the set Homelands. Analyze the cards. Then you will see what we mean. Another example is that for YEARS the most powerful creature in MTG was Serra Angel. Yeah, that should tell you something.
2. Blatant Disregard for Eternal Formats - This one kind of goes hand in hand with the above statement. I understand that Legacy wont be a major Pro Tour or Worlds format. But honestly, its like WoTC forgets the cards they print up that are powerful, and continue to make more absurd cards for eternal formats. Take Mental Misstep for example. This card is banned in three formats. One of those formats is Legacy. A card to see a banning so quick in legacy (it was banned FAST) means that its absurd. Not only did this give mono red decks a way to deal with our stuff, but it also countered almost every single turn 1 play. All for 2 life. Its cards like Mental Misstep that make me think that wizards just doesnt care. I know what you are thinking. "well, it got banned didnt it?". Sure, it did, you are very much so right, but thats not the point. The point is that, that card should of never of seen printing to begin with. Simple.
3. Rules Changes - In 2010, WoTC changed a few things. Some people take a sigh of relief knowing these rules were changed, but others were disappointed because it took some strategy out of the game. If you are new to this game, the rules they changed (Among others) is Mana Burn, and Damage on the Stack. New players may not understand why people were upset, but in all reality, it added a sense of strategy to not over tap as to not get burned, or to use combat tricks to get the most out of your creatures. Now with 2013 here, more rules are changing. The Legend/Planeswalker rule is changing. Thats the biggest one for me personally. Some people just dont understand how huge this rules change is. How powerful creatures become because of this. The absurd things you can do with PW's now. It was a rule that needed to stay the way it was. The worst mistake you can make with anything is trying to reinvent the wheel. Thats what they are doing. They are taking MTG, and trying to reinvent it into something completely different. Thats a huge problem. Many great products have crashed and burned for this reason. We all know the reason they are doing it, which brings me to...
4. Catering to New Players - This. This is the reason our game is changing. People say that with society, all things must evolve and change. That is not the case at all. For WoTC to completely ignore their player base that MADE THE GAME WHAT IT IS, is a slap in the face. Without us old school players, none of the new players would be playing today. Its as simple as that. They are evolving this game at a rapid pace for the simple reason as to steal away players from other games that compete heavily (Yu-Gi-Oh). Whether people want to admit it or not, the state of standard is basically YGO. You turn creatures sideways. The power creep on cards is to blame. Combat tricks like in Eternal Formats is not seen as much. They print creatures that play the game for you. Its as simple as that. People are going to rage and say i'm a noob for saying this, but its THEM who is blinded. If you cant see that this game is turning into a different game, well, i just dont know what to tell you. Maybe you havent been around long, or maybe you just dont want to admit it, but the fact remains, this game is not what we used to love
They know that they can release a new product and people will buy it no matter what. Dont believe me? I know people who payed 20 dollars a pack for MM. 20 DOLLARS!!! With that kind of money you might as well buy scratch off lottery tickets. With them doing this, its slowing turning the game away from what it once was.
...Or is it?
The Internet is killing MTG at a quickening pace
The Internet blowing up means a lot of things for us MTG players. A few great, a few good, a LOT bad.
The Good
1. Event Scheduling / Advertisement - without the internet, event scheduling would be a nightmare. You would have to print off fliers and mail them to to every store across the United States for a major event. GP Vegas wouldnt of had the turn out it had, and the game probably would be NEARLY as popular as it is today. Now, all you have to do, is log online and look up what events are near you, and go. Simple. I remember having to ask around if anybody heard about any new events etc. It was dreadful. But on the flip side, it was also more rewarding going to one of these events. Would i go back? Nope lol.
2. Spoiler Season - People take this one for granted a lot. That shouldnt be the case. If i remember correctly, before the glorious internet blew up so huge, you had to get your spoilers from a magazine. Yeah, a magazine. Can you imagine knowing that a set is about to drop, and only a few days before it does, THEN you get to see what is in it. Stressful to deck build huh? But that was the case back in the day. We didnt have awesome forums like MTGS to show us before hand what was coming out and give us time to plan things out. It was just look for a few days, pray you do good at drafting. Thats when the REAL deck builders shined. You dont know how good you are until you get handed a pack of cards, and you have to build a deck not knowing what is inside. True story. Lovin the spoilers.
The Bad
1. Netdecking - The fact that you can now go online with a credit card and be competitive is not good. Back in the day WoTC refused to tell you what decks champs played with. Thats fact. They wanted everyone to be themselves and original and figure it out. Now a days you can go online with some money and build the best deck of the format and win. Sure, you have to pilot it to victory, but when you are playing with the best cards, it hard to not win if you play smart. This is killing the game. It makes Standard unfun and a giant tournament mirror match. You see the same decks over and over and over and it gets boring. Thats why people are quitting standard. This game is becoming less about deck building, and more about internet research and a credit card. When i first started playing competitively, i would sit there and analyze my card pool and build what I thought was best. Did it always work? Not by a long shot, but when it DID WORK, it was so much more rewarding. People who netdeck (90% of the players) dont know that feeling to well. Winning is great, but in my opinion, you arnt winning with what you gave yourself, you are winning with what other people gave you. Its just not as fun.
2. Forums/Faceless Players - This one can be said about anything, but i am going to apply it to the MTG community. With the internet, we can all go online, make a goofy forum name, and post words to other people. With that, we run into people whose intent is just to come on here, and down talk everyone to make themselves feel better. Thats horrible for this community. I've had friends quit this game because people keep on downtalking them, and calling them garbage etc, for their OPINIONS. Sure, it may seem silly to some people, but the fact is, is that humans are wired for emotions. Sometimes, the things you say really effect what players do. Calling someone a noob and not knowing what they are talking about is bad. I am guilty of it too, i'll admit it, but not to the extent of me just flaming the **** out of people. Good players quit that way because they dont want to deal with it. Its true. Not having a face gives people a false sense of security and they become someone they are not. People find it hilarious. But remember this one thing. Say you have a little brother/sister who is playing this game, and they state their opinion, and get trolled to the point of quitting the game entirely. How would you feel? You'd be pissed to know that someone said those things and made your sibling quit. Trust me, i've seen it. So please, think before you act.
3. 2nd Market Sales - This is probably the BIGGEST one. The second market of MTG is absolutely KILLING this game. This game has turning into "i have more money, i win". You've seen it, you've felt the effects. Sure, i guess some people like it because they crack a pack and get a foil Voice of Resurgence (about 120 dollar card at this time). But other than that, it takes a full time job and a 2nd mortgage just to play this game. It sucks, but thats how it is. I swear right now though, if spoilers came along and nobody posted ANYTHING about the cards spoiled, the pre-sale prices would be dirty cheap. No hype, no over inflation. And by the time they realized what was going on, everyone has what they need and poof, we won lol. I know that will never happen in a million years, but its true. We need to figure out, as a community, how to stop 2nd market prices from making this game backbreaking.
So to wrap this up, i just wanna say, that its not JUST WoTC killing this game, and its not JUST the Internet, its a combination of both. Hopefully if you read this this you enjoyed what you read, whether you agree or not. These are my opinions. I'm not trying to shove it down your throats, i just wanted to give another outlook on what the state of MTG is at right now. Thanks for reading!!!
Some of your key premises don't support your conclusion.
i would like to point out that these were thoughts coming into my head as i was typing them. I didnt write this down, proof-read it, or anything, just thoughts as they came. So if some of it doesnt make sense, i apologize in advance
I think some of your arguments are very biased. For instance, "the power level of cards in absurd these days". No, only creatures have power creeped. I mean, back when Serra Angel was the best creature, wasn't necropotence running around? This has been discussed way too often already so I won't delve into it, but I don't think it's fair to ignore how spells have gotten so much worse and just make a blanket statement like that.
I really don't mind what wizards are doing. As a business they obviously have to expand the game. Legacy is very inaccessible, so it makes sense to focus on it less.
i would like to point out that these were thoughts coming into my head as i was typing them. I didnt write this down, proof-read it, or anything, just thoughts as they came. So if some of it doesnt make sense, i apologize in advance
Perhaps if you want to call it an article, you should do those things. If you want people to understand or agree with you, it helps if you 1) make sense, and 2) support your points logically. Stream of consciousness complaining fits in well on this forum, but as the man said, your key premises don't support your conclusion.
I think some of your arguments are very biased. For instance, "the power level of cards in absurd these days". No, only creatures have power creeped. I mean, back when Serra Angel was the best creature, wasn't necropotence running around? This has been discussed way too often already so I won't delve into it, but I don't think it's fair to ignore how spells have gotten so much worse and just make a blanket statement like that.
I really don't mind what wizards are doing. As a business they obviously have to expand the game. Legacy is very inaccessible, so it makes sense to focus on it less.
i guess the reason i only mention creatures is BECAUSE of the creature power creep, spells had to get more powerful.
With the rarity changes, the Power Creep, etc etc, people are saying WoTC is killing MTG. Why? Because they dont give a crap. They practice a bad business of not listening to the customer. The customer is what keeps you afloat, and when the customer demands something and its in your power to deliver and you dont, then thats bad business.
What makes you think Wizards doesn't listen to customers? What they don't do is adapt every idea that customers have. No business does. Because customers just know what they want, they don't know what's good for business.
Their actions in the past have made it pretty clear they do listen to feedback.
1. Power Creep
Homelands is a horrible example when trying to show "power creep", seeing as how it's probably the most underpowered set of all time. And I wouldn't say it's all cards, just creatures. Creatures were woefully underpowered for a long time, to the point they weren't even worth using. In a game where the focus was combat between creatures.
I don't see how stronger creatures ruins the game. If anything, everyone's playing with the same card pool.
2. Blatant Disregard for Eternal Formats
Know what format Mental Misstep didn't get banned in? Standard. It was a perfectly fine, fair card there.
Standard is the format they care most about. That doesn't mean they don't care about Legacy, but it does mean that if a card is problematic in that format but okay in Standard, Standard is going to get priority. It's a lot easier to manage a card pool of a few thousand than a card pool of over 10,000. And they do occasionally design a few cards for Legacy. I think Mental Misstep was one of them. Oops.
3. Rules Changes
Totally agree. Taking away that silly Damage on the Stack change was the best thing they ever made. Don't know why they ever changed the rules to allow it. They should undo all the rules changes they've made, that way, when you play your Legendary creature, nobody else can play theirs until yours dies.
Get over it. The rules change, and despite knee-jerk reactions, they tend to change for the better. Rules that don't make the game better get changed again (like damage on the stack - you are aware that was a rules change, right?). And you seem to also think "strategy" and "complexity" are the same. Tapping your lands the right way isn't a strategy, it's the basics of the rules. Unsummoning your creature with damage on the stack isn't a strategic decision, it's the only correct one. Choosing between doing damage or saving your creature, THAT is a strategic decision. And really, the most absurd thing you can do under the new rules is use a PW, play a PW, then use the new PW. Good play, but not exactly gamebreaking.
4. Catering to New Players[/quote]Why shouldn't they make the game more accessible for new players? New players are the lifeblood of the game. Older players just complain about how creatures are now part of a game that features creature combat heavily, and do what they can to resist change. Things change. The game changes. And as one of those "old-school" players who absolutely hated what the game was and absolutely loves what it became, it's changed for the better.
The only thing I have to say about the whole "internet" section is "So?". The good is awesome and the bad sucks, but there's not a whole lot that can be done about it.
Anyways, I do have one question - if Wizards is killing the game, why is it more popular than it has ever been, even during the initial CCG rush? I'm not sure that making decisions that push sales and player base is killing the game.
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i guess the reason i only mention creatures is BECAUSE of the creature power creep, spells had to get more powerful.
??
But they haven't. If your argument of creature power creep is by comparing current creatures to serra angel, then why can't we compare current non-creature spells to stuff like necropotence?
Relative to old times, its not power creep so much as power shift.
Wow, I don't even know where to start on this. So much misinformation or lack of understanding of where the game is and where it is going.
I mean, look at some of these points. Netdecking? Seriously? This is killing magic? Or cards being worth money is killing magic?
I guess you would be happy if all the cards would be from Fallen Empires and Homelands and be worth what those cards are huh?
Netdecking is just the refining of an original deck over and over again to get the optimal build. Why not play a good version of a deck if you are trying to win?
I could go on, but it would just be a waste of breathe I think...
ya know lol, i touched on a lot of points here, as opinions. But, the points i posted on are points constantly brought up by players. Sure, one person may love the rules changes, but hate how the internet has effected the game, etc.
BTW, my conclusion was that neither are killing the game as a singleton, they both have a huge role to play in it. So how was that different than what i stated?
I read a few opening sentences and couldn't continue. You clearly have no grasp of what you speak. You do understand magic is stronger now than it ever has been? You recall modern masters...even at its inflated pack prices charged by dealers, flew off the shelves. The largest gaming tournament ever took place this weekend at vegas.
Wow, I don't even know where to start on this. So much misinformation or lack of understanding of where the game is and where it is going.
I mean, look at some of these points. Netdecking? Seriously? This is killing magic? Or cards being worth money is killing magic?
I guess you would be happy if all the cards would be from Fallen Empires and Homelands and be worth what those cards are huh?
Netdecking is just the refining of an original deck over and over again to get the optimal build. Why not play a good version of a deck if you are trying to win?
I could go on, but it would just be a waste of breathe I think...
netdecking is copying an original idea, winning with it, and claiming you're the best. Many of the players on here (standard exclusive players) netdeck till their eyes bleed and think they are the end all be all of magic. Thats the problem. The skill level has dropped in standard and a little bit in modern.
I read a few opening sentences and couldn't continue. You clearly have no grasp of what you speak. You do understand magic is stronger now than it ever has been? You recall modern masters...even at its inflated pack prices charged by dealers, flew off the shelves. The largest gaming tournament ever took place this weekend at vegas.
so THIS is what people are grasping from what i wrote? That MTG is bigger than ever? I didnt deny that it wasnt huge at all. Its the most selling CCG of all time. Simple and period.
What i stated was, was that the aspects that are going into the GAME are killing the GAME.
For instance, Final Fantasy has been around since NES. After 7, the game was garbage. Is that an opinion? Yeah it is, but as an opinion, a lot of people agree that after FF7, the game turned to ****. Is it still the biggest RPG still running today? Yessir, but it doesnt mean that the games released arnt garbage.
netdecking is copying an original idea, winning with it, and claiming you're the best. Many of the players on here (standard exclusive players) netdeck till their eyes bleed and think they are the end all be all of magic. Thats the problem. The skill level has dropped in standard and a little bit in modern.
I don't mean to be rude, but once again I find that an incredibly biased view. It's clear you've already made up your mind without considering the other side of the argument.
If everyone has access to the best deck, then shouldn't skill level be the next most important determinant?
I don't mean to be rude, but once again I find that an incredibly biased view. It's clear you've already made up your mind without considering the other side of the argument.
If everyone has access to the best deck, then shouldn't skill level be the next most important determinant?
this is true, that skill should be the next factor. I never said it wasnt. Please read my netdecking part again pls.
Sure, you have to pilot it to victory, but when you are playing with the best cards, it hard to not win if you play smart
thats what i said. But when the decks run themselves, its hard to "not win". Only in a mirror will it come down to skill, and then on top of that, its "who draws this first" or "who plays that first".
The "NWO"
1. Power Creep - The power level of cards is absurd now a days. New players dont really understand this very much, and thats understandable, but for those who have been around and seen it happen, you will instantly laugh when someone says that Power is not an issue. For the new players, look up the set Homelands. Analyze the cards. Then you will see what we mean. Another example is that for YEARS the most powerful creature in MTG was Serra Angel. Yeah, that should tell you something.
Creatures are better, not every card. Consider that the best counterspell in Standard is Dissipate. That card is terrible compared to Counterspell, and that's not even getting into Mana Drain or Force of Will.
Also, homelands was regarded by everyone at the time as a terrible set (at the very least in terms of power level). Consider Arabian Nights: many creatures in that set are quite reasonable even by modern standards, the best of which being Kird Ape.
2. Blatant Disregard for Eternal Formats - This one kind of goes hand in hand with the above statement. I understand that Legacy wont be a major Pro Tour or Worlds format. But honestly, its like WoTC forgets the cards they print up that are powerful, and continue to make more absurd cards for eternal formats. Take Mental Misstep for example. This card is banned in three formats. One of those formats is Legacy. A card to see a banning so quick in legacy (it was banned FAST) means that its absurd. Not only did this give mono red decks a way to deal with our stuff, but it also countered almost every single turn 1 play. All for 2 life. Its cards like Mental Misstep that make me think that wizards just doesnt care. I know what you are thinking. "well, it got banned didnt it?". Sure, it did, you are very much so right, but thats not the point. The point is that, that card should of never of seen printing to begin with. Simple.
There are 59 cards on the legacy banlist. Out of those, do you know how many were first printed in a modern border? 2: Skullclamp and Mental Misstep. The 57 other cards on the list are just as completely busted, but they are all much older.
If anything, recent sets have provided interesting changes to legacy without being borken. Abrupt decay, Deathrite Shaman, Snapcaster Mage and Lilliana of the Veil are all huge players in the legacy metagame right now, and they're all powerful cards without being broken.
3. Rules Changes - In 2010, WoTC changed a few things. Some people take a sigh of relief knowing these rules were changed, but others were disappointed because it took some strategy out of the game. If you are new to this game, the rules they changed (Among others) is Mana Burn, and Damage on the Stack. New players may not understand why people were upset, but in all reality, it added a sense of strategy to not over tap as to not get burned, or to use combat tricks to get the most out of your creatures.
Mana burn matter in almost no circumstances except ones created by card designed to take advantage of it (consider piracy). It did not alter any strategy, ever.
As for Damage on the stack, yes, it altred how some cards were played, but in almost every circumstance the choice of what to do considering damage on the stack was obvious. Take sacrificing a Mogg Fanatic, for instance. Chump, damage on the stack, in response sac it. Wow, that was hard.
It's not because a rule is counterintuitive that it adds any amount of strategy to the game, it just makes the learning curve harder; this is not a good thing.
Besides, as was said earlier in the thread, DotS was itself an invention.
Now with 2013 here, more rules are changing. The Legend/Planeswalker rule is changing. Thats the biggest one for me personally. Some people just dont understand how huge this rules change is. How powerful creatures become because of this. The absurd things you can do with PW's now. It was a rule that needed to stay the way it was.
Actually, basically no creature is truly affected by this. Sure, now your Vendillion Clique can act as just a bad discard spell if you need it to, but the cards that are actually affected by this are mana sources ( Gaea's Cradle, Mox Opal).
I'll remind you that legendary rules already changed once, back before Kamigawa Block. It did not kill the game.
The worst mistake you can make with anything is trying to reinvent the wheel. Thats what they are doing. They are taking MTG, and trying to reinvent it into something completely different.
Yes. A completely different game where you cast spells using mana of 5 different colors, generally produced from lands, and there are artifacts and enchantments and creatures that attack and block and...
They are taking MTG, and trying to reinvent it into something completely different. Thats a huge problem. Many great products have crashed and burned for this reason. We all know the reason they are doing it, which brings me to...
Ford Better bring back the Model T! That was plenty good for my Great-Grandparents, why'd they ever change it?
4. Catering to New Players - This. This is the reason our game is changing. People say that with society, all things must evolve and change. That is not the case at all. For WoTC to completely ignore their player base that MADE THE GAME WHAT IT IS, is a slap in the face. Without us old school players, none of the new players would be playing today. Its as simple as that. They are evolving this game at a rapid pace for the simple reason as to steal away players from other games that compete heavily (Yu-Gi-Oh). Whether people want to admit it or not, the state of standard is basically YGO. You turn creatures sideways. The power creep on cards is to blame. Combat tricks like in Eternal Formats is not seen as much. They print creatures that play the game for you. Its as simple as that. People are going to rage and say i'm a noob for saying this, but its THEM who is blinded. If you cant see that this game is turning into a different game, well, i just dont know what to tell you. Maybe you havent been around long, or maybe you just dont want to admit it, but the fact remains, this game is not what we used to love
Ah yes, the old "If you don't agree with me you're a moron" chestnut. Powerful creatures does not mean they're easy to play. Consider Snapcaster Mage and Deathrite Shaman.
Also... Combat tricks in eternal formats? What? Which ones? I can't name a single combat trick played in legacy or vintage. And I'm pretty sure this has been true since the inception of legacy, and has been true in vintage much longer.
They know that they can release a new product and people will buy it no matter what. Dont believe me? I know people who payed 20 dollars a pack for MM. 20 DOLLARS!!! With that kind of money you might as well buy scratch off lottery tickets. With them doing this, its slowing turning the game away from what it once was.
Paying 20$ for a pack of MM is moronic. That said, opening a pack hoping for value is the very essence of the game. It has always been a TCG, which necessitates packs of random cards, with better and worse ones. Sure, it used to be chase cards were Shivan Dragon... But in that same set existed the moxen, Black Lotus, and Time Walk. If that's not a lottery ticket I don't know what is.
1. Netdecking - The fact that you can now go online with a credit card and be competitive is not good. Back in the day WoTC refused to tell you what decks champs played with. Thats fact. They wanted everyone to be themselves and original and figure it out. Now a days you can go online with some money and build the best deck of the format and win. Sure, you have to pilot it to victory, but when you are playing with the best cards, it hard to not win if you play smart.
It's like you assume playing smart is someone everything does (or can do). If it was so easy, we wouldn't keep seeing the same players over and over making money at Grand Prix and Pro Tours.
If everyone has access to the same cards, thne everyone is on an equal footing. It stands to reason that if you voluntarily try to avoid every card people see as powerful, your deck is not going to do well. This does not make you a unique snowflake that deserves to win, it merely makes you a player using a suboptimal deck.
This is killing the game. It makes Standard unfun and a giant tournament mirror match. You see the same decks over and over and over and it gets boring. Thats why people are quitting standard. This game is becoming less about deck building, and more about internet research and a credit card. When i first started playing competitively, i would sit there and analyze my card pool and build what I thought was best. Did it always work? Not by a long shot, but when it DID WORK, it was so much more rewarding. People who netdeck (90% of the players) dont know that feeling to well. Winning is great, but in my opinion, you arnt winning with what you gave yourself, you are winning with what other people gave you. Its just not as fun.
Bull****. Standard is incredibly diverse at the moment. 3 flavours of Aristocrats, 3 flavours of UWx control, Jund Midrange, Jund Aggro, Junk reanimator, Naya Blitz, Naya Midrange, RG aggro, 4C Reanimator (Frites), Bant Auras. These are all decks that have performed well over the past 8-9 months; this is incredibly diverse. Which deck you choose, and the specific card choices within those decks, are incredibly metagame-dependent decisions, and there is a lot of skill both in choosing a deck and adapting it to the field.
There are also a lot of rogue decks that can perform admirably at an FNM level that aren't quite good enough for the bigtime, but are still good decks.
I'd also like to say that "netdecking" is really nothing new. It's been going on for years... and the game is more popular then ever. Netdecking is not killing the game.
3. 2nd Market Sales - This is probably the BIGGEST one. The second market of MTG is absolutely KILLING this game. This game has turning into "i have more money, i win". You've seen it, you've felt the effects. Sure, i guess some people like it because they crack a pack and get a foil Voice of Resurgence (about 120 dollar card at this time). But other than that, it takes a full time job and a 2nd mortgage just to play this game. It sucks, but thats how it is.
. Again, this has been happening forever. Power has been worth ridiculous amounts of money ever since people realized that MTG wasn't going away.
Also, I'm plenty able to support my gaming through a 11.50$/hr job. Sure, I can't just buy Shardless BUG in legacy, but I own a cheap legacy deck (Burn) and a few modern decks (Burn, UR Storm, most of UWR midrange/control), as well as a few standard decks. Most of all, though, If I want to play a deck, I can just borrow cards from friends.
I swear right now though, if spoilers came along and nobody posted ANYTHING about the cards spoiled, the pre-sale prices would be dirty cheap. No hype, no over inflation. And by the time they realized what was going on, everyone has what they need and poof, we won lol. I know that will never happen in a million years, but its true. We need to figure out, as a community, how to stop 2nd market prices from making this game backbreaking.
That's not how it works. it's all about supply and demand. If lots of people want to buy the same card, then the card of the price rises, regardless of whether or not people are talking about the card. Voice is a good card (lots of demand) in a bad set (little offer, because cracking packs for card won't get you value).
So to wrap this up, i just wanna say, that its not JUST WoTC killing this game, and its not JUST the Internet, its a combination of both. Hopefully if you read this this you enjoyed what you read, whether you agree or not. These are my opinions. I'm not trying to shove it down your throats, i just wanted to give another outlook on what the state of MTG is at right now. Thanks for reading!!!
You are begging the question. Youa re assuming the game is dying, and the looking at why this is true. Yet MTG is not dying. It is more popular then ever. Hell, you posted this as 4500 people are playing MTG in Vegas. Biggest Magic event ever, by far. Where is the evidence Magic is suffering?
There is very little factual basis in any of this (as has been shown by the users replying here). We really don't need another "Magic is dying" thread. Magic is alive and well, and popular than at any point in it's entire history going into it's 20th Anniversary.
Closing this thread before it derails into flaming and trolling the OP.
I've always asked this question to people; "In your opinion, do you think WoTC is killing MTG, or is the Internet killing MTG?"
I get a fair amount of responses from different sides, and i understand both sides, but i'm going to tell you MY opinion.
With the rarity changes, the Power Creep, etc etc, people are saying WoTC is killing MTG. Why? Because they dont give a crap. They practice a bad business of not listening to the customer. The customer is what keeps you afloat, and when the customer demands something and its in your power to deliver and you dont, then thats bad business. Many times i have seen developers call things "over powered" or a "mistake" simply for the fact that they know certain pro's who say so. And as the saying goes "A pro says it, WoTC wills it". Bad designers (in the sense of they think they know everything) is killing this game. They refuse to see what mistakes they have made and in return, they print bigger mistakes to take care of the lesser mistake. Its a horrible cycle. It kills this game more and more everytime they do it.
The "NWO"
When it comes to magic gameplay, those who have been around for more than 6 years have seen it change drastically. From the Power Creep, to the rules changes that make the game...well, different. Is different bad? Sometimes, yes it is. For example, take Coca-Cola. You see them come out with different products and try new things, but you dont open a can of original Coke and taste Root Beer. Why? Because they know they have something loved and it shouldnt change like that. What is WoTC doing to change our beloved game drastically?
1. Power Creep - The power level of cards is absurd now a days. New players dont really understand this very much, and thats understandable, but for those who have been around and seen it happen, you will instantly laugh when someone says that Power is not an issue. For the new players, look up the set Homelands. Analyze the cards. Then you will see what we mean. Another example is that for YEARS the most powerful creature in MTG was Serra Angel. Yeah, that should tell you something.
2. Blatant Disregard for Eternal Formats - This one kind of goes hand in hand with the above statement. I understand that Legacy wont be a major Pro Tour or Worlds format. But honestly, its like WoTC forgets the cards they print up that are powerful, and continue to make more absurd cards for eternal formats. Take Mental Misstep for example. This card is banned in three formats. One of those formats is Legacy. A card to see a banning so quick in legacy (it was banned FAST) means that its absurd. Not only did this give mono red decks a way to deal with our stuff, but it also countered almost every single turn 1 play. All for 2 life. Its cards like Mental Misstep that make me think that wizards just doesnt care. I know what you are thinking. "well, it got banned didnt it?". Sure, it did, you are very much so right, but thats not the point. The point is that, that card should of never of seen printing to begin with. Simple.
3. Rules Changes - In 2010, WoTC changed a few things. Some people take a sigh of relief knowing these rules were changed, but others were disappointed because it took some strategy out of the game. If you are new to this game, the rules they changed (Among others) is Mana Burn, and Damage on the Stack. New players may not understand why people were upset, but in all reality, it added a sense of strategy to not over tap as to not get burned, or to use combat tricks to get the most out of your creatures. Now with 2013 here, more rules are changing. The Legend/Planeswalker rule is changing. Thats the biggest one for me personally. Some people just dont understand how huge this rules change is. How powerful creatures become because of this. The absurd things you can do with PW's now. It was a rule that needed to stay the way it was. The worst mistake you can make with anything is trying to reinvent the wheel. Thats what they are doing. They are taking MTG, and trying to reinvent it into something completely different. Thats a huge problem. Many great products have crashed and burned for this reason. We all know the reason they are doing it, which brings me to...
4. Catering to New Players - This. This is the reason our game is changing. People say that with society, all things must evolve and change. That is not the case at all. For WoTC to completely ignore their player base that MADE THE GAME WHAT IT IS, is a slap in the face. Without us old school players, none of the new players would be playing today. Its as simple as that. They are evolving this game at a rapid pace for the simple reason as to steal away players from other games that compete heavily (Yu-Gi-Oh). Whether people want to admit it or not, the state of standard is basically YGO. You turn creatures sideways. The power creep on cards is to blame. Combat tricks like in Eternal Formats is not seen as much. They print creatures that play the game for you. Its as simple as that. People are going to rage and say i'm a noob for saying this, but its THEM who is blinded. If you cant see that this game is turning into a different game, well, i just dont know what to tell you. Maybe you havent been around long, or maybe you just dont want to admit it, but the fact remains, this game is not what we used to love
They know that they can release a new product and people will buy it no matter what. Dont believe me? I know people who payed 20 dollars a pack for MM. 20 DOLLARS!!! With that kind of money you might as well buy scratch off lottery tickets. With them doing this, its slowing turning the game away from what it once was.
...Or is it?
The Internet blowing up means a lot of things for us MTG players. A few great, a few good, a LOT bad.
The Good
1. Event Scheduling / Advertisement - without the internet, event scheduling would be a nightmare. You would have to print off fliers and mail them to to every store across the United States for a major event. GP Vegas wouldnt of had the turn out it had, and the game probably would be NEARLY as popular as it is today. Now, all you have to do, is log online and look up what events are near you, and go. Simple. I remember having to ask around if anybody heard about any new events etc. It was dreadful. But on the flip side, it was also more rewarding going to one of these events. Would i go back? Nope lol.
2. Spoiler Season - People take this one for granted a lot. That shouldnt be the case. If i remember correctly, before the glorious internet blew up so huge, you had to get your spoilers from a magazine. Yeah, a magazine. Can you imagine knowing that a set is about to drop, and only a few days before it does, THEN you get to see what is in it. Stressful to deck build huh? But that was the case back in the day. We didnt have awesome forums like MTGS to show us before hand what was coming out and give us time to plan things out. It was just look for a few days, pray you do good at drafting. Thats when the REAL deck builders shined. You dont know how good you are until you get handed a pack of cards, and you have to build a deck not knowing what is inside. True story. Lovin the spoilers.
The Bad
1. Netdecking - The fact that you can now go online with a credit card and be competitive is not good. Back in the day WoTC refused to tell you what decks champs played with. Thats fact. They wanted everyone to be themselves and original and figure it out. Now a days you can go online with some money and build the best deck of the format and win. Sure, you have to pilot it to victory, but when you are playing with the best cards, it hard to not win if you play smart. This is killing the game. It makes Standard unfun and a giant tournament mirror match. You see the same decks over and over and over and it gets boring. Thats why people are quitting standard. This game is becoming less about deck building, and more about internet research and a credit card. When i first started playing competitively, i would sit there and analyze my card pool and build what I thought was best. Did it always work? Not by a long shot, but when it DID WORK, it was so much more rewarding. People who netdeck (90% of the players) dont know that feeling to well. Winning is great, but in my opinion, you arnt winning with what you gave yourself, you are winning with what other people gave you. Its just not as fun.
2. Forums/Faceless Players - This one can be said about anything, but i am going to apply it to the MTG community. With the internet, we can all go online, make a goofy forum name, and post words to other people. With that, we run into people whose intent is just to come on here, and down talk everyone to make themselves feel better. Thats horrible for this community. I've had friends quit this game because people keep on downtalking them, and calling them garbage etc, for their OPINIONS. Sure, it may seem silly to some people, but the fact is, is that humans are wired for emotions. Sometimes, the things you say really effect what players do. Calling someone a noob and not knowing what they are talking about is bad. I am guilty of it too, i'll admit it, but not to the extent of me just flaming the **** out of people. Good players quit that way because they dont want to deal with it. Its true. Not having a face gives people a false sense of security and they become someone they are not. People find it hilarious. But remember this one thing. Say you have a little brother/sister who is playing this game, and they state their opinion, and get trolled to the point of quitting the game entirely. How would you feel? You'd be pissed to know that someone said those things and made your sibling quit. Trust me, i've seen it. So please, think before you act.
3. 2nd Market Sales - This is probably the BIGGEST one. The second market of MTG is absolutely KILLING this game. This game has turning into "i have more money, i win". You've seen it, you've felt the effects. Sure, i guess some people like it because they crack a pack and get a foil Voice of Resurgence (about 120 dollar card at this time). But other than that, it takes a full time job and a 2nd mortgage just to play this game. It sucks, but thats how it is. I swear right now though, if spoilers came along and nobody posted ANYTHING about the cards spoiled, the pre-sale prices would be dirty cheap. No hype, no over inflation. And by the time they realized what was going on, everyone has what they need and poof, we won lol. I know that will never happen in a million years, but its true. We need to figure out, as a community, how to stop 2nd market prices from making this game backbreaking.
So to wrap this up, i just wanna say, that its not JUST WoTC killing this game, and its not JUST the Internet, its a combination of both. Hopefully if you read this this you enjoyed what you read, whether you agree or not. These are my opinions. I'm not trying to shove it down your throats, i just wanted to give another outlook on what the state of MTG is at right now. Thanks for reading!!!
i would like to point out that these were thoughts coming into my head as i was typing them. I didnt write this down, proof-read it, or anything, just thoughts as they came. So if some of it doesnt make sense, i apologize in advance
I really don't mind what wizards are doing. As a business they obviously have to expand the game. Legacy is very inaccessible, so it makes sense to focus on it less.
Perhaps if you want to call it an article, you should do those things. If you want people to understand or agree with you, it helps if you 1) make sense, and 2) support your points logically. Stream of consciousness complaining fits in well on this forum, but as the man said, your key premises don't support your conclusion.
i guess the reason i only mention creatures is BECAUSE of the creature power creep, spells had to get more powerful.
What makes you think Wizards doesn't listen to customers? What they don't do is adapt every idea that customers have. No business does. Because customers just know what they want, they don't know what's good for business.
Their actions in the past have made it pretty clear they do listen to feedback.
Homelands is a horrible example when trying to show "power creep", seeing as how it's probably the most underpowered set of all time. And I wouldn't say it's all cards, just creatures. Creatures were woefully underpowered for a long time, to the point they weren't even worth using. In a game where the focus was combat between creatures.
I don't see how stronger creatures ruins the game. If anything, everyone's playing with the same card pool.
Know what format Mental Misstep didn't get banned in? Standard. It was a perfectly fine, fair card there.
Standard is the format they care most about. That doesn't mean they don't care about Legacy, but it does mean that if a card is problematic in that format but okay in Standard, Standard is going to get priority. It's a lot easier to manage a card pool of a few thousand than a card pool of over 10,000. And they do occasionally design a few cards for Legacy. I think Mental Misstep was one of them. Oops.
Totally agree. Taking away that silly Damage on the Stack change was the best thing they ever made. Don't know why they ever changed the rules to allow it. They should undo all the rules changes they've made, that way, when you play your Legendary creature, nobody else can play theirs until yours dies.
Get over it. The rules change, and despite knee-jerk reactions, they tend to change for the better. Rules that don't make the game better get changed again (like damage on the stack - you are aware that was a rules change, right?). And you seem to also think "strategy" and "complexity" are the same. Tapping your lands the right way isn't a strategy, it's the basics of the rules. Unsummoning your creature with damage on the stack isn't a strategic decision, it's the only correct one. Choosing between doing damage or saving your creature, THAT is a strategic decision. And really, the most absurd thing you can do under the new rules is use a PW, play a PW, then use the new PW. Good play, but not exactly gamebreaking.
4. Catering to New Players[/quote]Why shouldn't they make the game more accessible for new players? New players are the lifeblood of the game. Older players just complain about how creatures are now part of a game that features creature combat heavily, and do what they can to resist change. Things change. The game changes. And as one of those "old-school" players who absolutely hated what the game was and absolutely loves what it became, it's changed for the better.
The only thing I have to say about the whole "internet" section is "So?". The good is awesome and the bad sucks, but there's not a whole lot that can be done about it.
Anyways, I do have one question - if Wizards is killing the game, why is it more popular than it has ever been, even during the initial CCG rush? I'm not sure that making decisions that push sales and player base is killing the game.
Hoi, hoi, u embleer hrair
M'saion ulé hraka vair.
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But they haven't. If your argument of creature power creep is by comparing current creatures to serra angel, then why can't we compare current non-creature spells to stuff like necropotence?
Relative to old times, its not power creep so much as power shift.
I mean, look at some of these points. Netdecking? Seriously? This is killing magic? Or cards being worth money is killing magic?
I guess you would be happy if all the cards would be from Fallen Empires and Homelands and be worth what those cards are huh?
Netdecking is just the refining of an original deck over and over again to get the optimal build. Why not play a good version of a deck if you are trying to win?
I could go on, but it would just be a waste of breathe I think...
BTW, my conclusion was that neither are killing the game as a singleton, they both have a huge role to play in it. So how was that different than what i stated?
netdecking is copying an original idea, winning with it, and claiming you're the best. Many of the players on here (standard exclusive players) netdeck till their eyes bleed and think they are the end all be all of magic. Thats the problem. The skill level has dropped in standard and a little bit in modern.
so THIS is what people are grasping from what i wrote? That MTG is bigger than ever? I didnt deny that it wasnt huge at all. Its the most selling CCG of all time. Simple and period.
What i stated was, was that the aspects that are going into the GAME are killing the GAME.
For instance, Final Fantasy has been around since NES. After 7, the game was garbage. Is that an opinion? Yeah it is, but as an opinion, a lot of people agree that after FF7, the game turned to ****. Is it still the biggest RPG still running today? Yessir, but it doesnt mean that the games released arnt garbage.
I don't mean to be rude, but once again I find that an incredibly biased view. It's clear you've already made up your mind without considering the other side of the argument.
If everyone has access to the best deck, then shouldn't skill level be the next most important determinant?
this is true, that skill should be the next factor. I never said it wasnt. Please read my netdecking part again pls.
thats what i said. But when the decks run themselves, its hard to "not win". Only in a mirror will it come down to skill, and then on top of that, its "who draws this first" or "who plays that first".
Creatures are better, not every card. Consider that the best counterspell in Standard is Dissipate. That card is terrible compared to Counterspell, and that's not even getting into Mana Drain or Force of Will.
Also, homelands was regarded by everyone at the time as a terrible set (at the very least in terms of power level). Consider Arabian Nights: many creatures in that set are quite reasonable even by modern standards, the best of which being Kird Ape.
There are 59 cards on the legacy banlist. Out of those, do you know how many were first printed in a modern border? 2: Skullclamp and Mental Misstep. The 57 other cards on the list are just as completely busted, but they are all much older.
If anything, recent sets have provided interesting changes to legacy without being borken. Abrupt decay, Deathrite Shaman, Snapcaster Mage and Lilliana of the Veil are all huge players in the legacy metagame right now, and they're all powerful cards without being broken.
Mana burn matter in almost no circumstances except ones created by card designed to take advantage of it (consider piracy). It did not alter any strategy, ever.
As for Damage on the stack, yes, it altred how some cards were played, but in almost every circumstance the choice of what to do considering damage on the stack was obvious. Take sacrificing a Mogg Fanatic, for instance. Chump, damage on the stack, in response sac it. Wow, that was hard.
It's not because a rule is counterintuitive that it adds any amount of strategy to the game, it just makes the learning curve harder; this is not a good thing.
Besides, as was said earlier in the thread, DotS was itself an invention.
Actually, basically no creature is truly affected by this. Sure, now your Vendillion Clique can act as just a bad discard spell if you need it to, but the cards that are actually affected by this are mana sources ( Gaea's Cradle, Mox Opal).
I'll remind you that legendary rules already changed once, back before Kamigawa Block. It did not kill the game.
Yes. A completely different game where you cast spells using mana of 5 different colors, generally produced from lands, and there are artifacts and enchantments and creatures that attack and block and...
Hmm.
Ford Better bring back the Model T! That was plenty good for my Great-Grandparents, why'd they ever change it?
Ah yes, the old "If you don't agree with me you're a moron" chestnut. Powerful creatures does not mean they're easy to play. Consider Snapcaster Mage and Deathrite Shaman.
Also... Combat tricks in eternal formats? What? Which ones? I can't name a single combat trick played in legacy or vintage. And I'm pretty sure this has been true since the inception of legacy, and has been true in vintage much longer.
Paying 20$ for a pack of MM is moronic. That said, opening a pack hoping for value is the very essence of the game. It has always been a TCG, which necessitates packs of random cards, with better and worse ones. Sure, it used to be chase cards were Shivan Dragon... But in that same set existed the moxen, Black Lotus, and Time Walk. If that's not a lottery ticket I don't know what is.
♫Video killed the Radio Star...♫
It's like you assume playing smart is someone everything does (or can do). If it was so easy, we wouldn't keep seeing the same players over and over making money at Grand Prix and Pro Tours.
If everyone has access to the same cards, thne everyone is on an equal footing. It stands to reason that if you voluntarily try to avoid every card people see as powerful, your deck is not going to do well. This does not make you a unique snowflake that deserves to win, it merely makes you a player using a suboptimal deck.
Bull****. Standard is incredibly diverse at the moment. 3 flavours of Aristocrats, 3 flavours of UWx control, Jund Midrange, Jund Aggro, Junk reanimator, Naya Blitz, Naya Midrange, RG aggro, 4C Reanimator (Frites), Bant Auras. These are all decks that have performed well over the past 8-9 months; this is incredibly diverse. Which deck you choose, and the specific card choices within those decks, are incredibly metagame-dependent decisions, and there is a lot of skill both in choosing a deck and adapting it to the field.
There are also a lot of rogue decks that can perform admirably at an FNM level that aren't quite good enough for the bigtime, but are still good decks.
I'd also like to say that "netdecking" is really nothing new. It's been going on for years... and the game is more popular then ever. Netdecking is not killing the game.
. Again, this has been happening forever. Power has been worth ridiculous amounts of money ever since people realized that MTG wasn't going away.
Also, I'm plenty able to support my gaming through a 11.50$/hr job. Sure, I can't just buy Shardless BUG in legacy, but I own a cheap legacy deck (Burn) and a few modern decks (Burn, UR Storm, most of UWR midrange/control), as well as a few standard decks. Most of all, though, If I want to play a deck, I can just borrow cards from friends.
That's not how it works. it's all about supply and demand. If lots of people want to buy the same card, then the card of the price rises, regardless of whether or not people are talking about the card. Voice is a good card (lots of demand) in a bad set (little offer, because cracking packs for card won't get you value).
You are begging the question. Youa re assuming the game is dying, and the looking at why this is true. Yet MTG is not dying. It is more popular then ever. Hell, you posted this as 4500 people are playing MTG in Vegas. Biggest Magic event ever, by far. Where is the evidence Magic is suffering?
Closing this thread before it derails into flaming and trolling the OP.
(Also known as Xenphire)