What makes this, for example, strictly better than this? I have never understood why the Lotus Petal was even printed if there are Mox cards which are essentially a less flexable version of it? Am I missing something?
Mox Pros:
Old and Rare, Valuable
Really Fast
Mox Cons:
Banned
Tap for only one color
Lotus Petal Pros:
Flexable
Not Banned/Restricted
Common, Cheap
Really fast
Lotus Petal Cons:
???
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My lame attempt at humor...
Why does everyone in Bant hate the Lord of Riots? 'Cause they're all, Rakdos-intolerant! Awwww, yeah...
One you have to look at the context of the set and when a card is printed. I was playing during Tempest and Lotus Petal was generally regarded as bad/useless.
It was *designed* that way b/c they couldn't/wouldn't repeat an actual Black Lotus... but wanted the feel so we got a 1/3 power Black Lotus (people also always get excited about Lotus or Mox just because of the mystique).
Clearly market value for what used to be a junk common indicates that it has certain select uses if you can recur/reuse it.
What makes this, for example, strictly better than this?
Petal sacs, emerald does not.
Emerald produces green. Petal produces any color. In vintage (the only format you can play both), emerald is better. This doesn't mean that petal is bad -- after all, it is also restricted. But not all restricted cards are equally powerfui.
I have never understood why the Lotus Petal was even printed if there are Mox cards which are essentially a less flexable version of it? Am I missing something?
Petal was standard legal. Emerald never was. Thus, if you played standard, you could not use emerald.
Today in legacy, petal is legal. Emerald is not.
Keep in mind that when wizards designs card, they design with standard and limited FIRST, and legacy/vintage LAST. What may be acceptable is the newer format may not be in the older and vice-versa. If that means printing cards that are weaker/stronger than before, so be it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
Even without the sac thing, they print cards that are notably worse than older cards all the time, for limited/standard balance, and other reasons. Lighting Bolt --> ShockCounterspell --> Cancel
There are a lot of cards in Alpha/Beta that don't fit with modern balance standards. Moxes were fair game when everyone essentially was playing limited, and you could only ever feasibly get like one of them. Now that everyone can consistantly have the max number of any given card, you can't balance like that.
It's only really busted in vintage because then you get 12 zero mana artifacts for combo if you unresrict it (5 moxen, mana crypt, 4 lotus petal, black lotus, lion's eye diamond.) Such a deck would have a very high turn 1 win rate. It isn't strictly worse due to sacking for any color of mana and yawg's will recurring it, however in general it is worse than moxen because moxen stick around forever short of something destroying them.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
I think Lotus Petal is too good in Legacy.. adds a mana of any colour, for free, with no card disadvantage, .. in a deck playing Sol Lands, if you cast Mox, or Petal, with a Sol land, and then Show And Tell, backed up by counterspells, you will win the game from that play right there if you put into play Griselbrand and draw your whole deck.. which has 3 more Lotus Petal in it to cast Children Of Korlis and whatever else.
I think Lotus Petal is too good in Legacy.. adds a mana of any colour, for free, with no card disadvantage, .. in a deck playing Sol Lands, if you cast Mox, or Petal, with a Sol land, and then Show And Tell, backed up by counterspells, you will win the game from that play right there if you put into play Griselbrand and draw your whole deck.. which has 3 more Lotus Petal in it to cast Children Of Korlis and whatever else.
Lotus Petal is totally broken .
I can't tell if this is serious or not... But this is the first time I've seen someone complain about Lotus Petal in Legacy. Normally everyone who gets mad at combo cry to get it's bigger brother banned.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from EX33396948 »
If your deck is 60 cards then you're playing with the best possible odds. 61? Probably won't alter your odds too much but we all know that 96% pure meth won't cut it next to Heisenberg's 99%.
Mox Pros:
Old and Rare, Valuable
Really Fast
Mox Cons:
Banned
Tap for only one color
Lotus Petal Pros:
Flexable
Not Banned/Restricted
Common, Cheap
Really fast
Lotus Petal Cons:
???
My lame attempt at humor...
Why does everyone in Bant hate the Lord of Riots? 'Cause they're all, Rakdos-intolerant! Awwww, yeah...
You tap land sac petal and cast this cool spell.
Me I use force of will now you wasted mana and sac the card gg
One you have to look at the context of the set and when a card is printed. I was playing during Tempest and Lotus Petal was generally regarded as bad/useless.
It was *designed* that way b/c they couldn't/wouldn't repeat an actual Black Lotus... but wanted the feel so we got a 1/3 power Black Lotus (people also always get excited about Lotus or Mox just because of the mystique).
Clearly market value for what used to be a junk common indicates that it has certain select uses if you can recur/reuse it.
Petal sacs, emerald does not.
Emerald produces green. Petal produces any color. In vintage (the only format you can play both), emerald is better. This doesn't mean that petal is bad -- after all, it is also restricted. But not all restricted cards are equally powerfui.
Petal was standard legal. Emerald never was. Thus, if you played standard, you could not use emerald.
Today in legacy, petal is legal. Emerald is not.
Keep in mind that when wizards designs card, they design with standard and limited FIRST, and legacy/vintage LAST. What may be acceptable is the newer format may not be in the older and vice-versa. If that means printing cards that are weaker/stronger than before, so be it.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
There are a lot of cards in Alpha/Beta that don't fit with modern balance standards. Moxes were fair game when everyone essentially was playing limited, and you could only ever feasibly get like one of them. Now that everyone can consistantly have the max number of any given card, you can't balance like that.
Currently Playing:
Retired
Lotus Petal is totally broken .
I can't tell if this is serious or not... But this is the first time I've seen someone complain about Lotus Petal in Legacy. Normally everyone who gets mad at combo cry to get it's bigger brother banned.
lol
[180 classic cube]