I don't know about everyone else, but I often wax poetic about my introduction to magic in middle school/high school. I was utterly clueless and my deck was terrible, but it was a ton of fun. When I discovered that Avatar of Woe was a card - and managed to trade for one - I just about cacked my pants. I was always discovering cool new "gems", and took a real pride in the cards I managed to acquire, even if, with hindsight, they were mediocre at best.
Nowadays I've got thousands of dollars worth of cards and I'm familiar with just about every playable card ever printed. But I don't really feel the same way about my underground sea or mana crypts that I used to about my avatar of woe. You can't un-bite the apple, I guess.
But damned if I don't want to try.
The biggest problem with "maturing" in magic (and life, monetarily speaking) is that acquiring cards becomes a LOT easier. I used to agonize for days over whether to spend $5 on that vampiric dragon...these days I'll buy a mana drain on a whim. While that's obviously a fantastic thing for my decks' power level, it doesn't really make me nearly as excited as that vampiric dragon did. Likewise, being aware of every playable makes looking at cards while deckbuilding (EDH, mostly) more of a boring chore than the exciting treasure-trove of possibility that it used to be.
So I've been trying to figure out a way to craft a format that limits power level to make the unplayable playable, and the decks more personalized.
Yes, yes, I know, that's EDH, but while I love EDH, it's still got a few problems. For one, although netdecking isn't nearly as ubiquitous as it is in standard, there's still plenty of common decks that follow the same archetype - all the azami and azusa decks I've seen are mostly the same, and that's just at "A". For second, it's still a constructed format, which means that most well-made decks will start with a decklist, then get all the cards, maybe making minor tweaks. There's rarely much joy of adding a new sweet bomb. For a third, although it allows for older, more expensive stuff than standard or modern, all that stuff is still (mostly) just as easy to buy off the internet, so it's not really hard to acquire, just more expensive. The format needs to make the cards in your deck be fairly unique and acquired in more difficult/lucky ways, so you feel like you've really got something special when you windmill slam that avatar of woe.
Yes, yes, I know, that's limited, but while I love limited, you only get the excitement of having that hypersonic dragon or whatever for the duration of the event, then it's just another junk rare in the binder. Plus, within a month or so, most of the power levels are pretty well known and the pool isn't especially large. It was always more fun to play avatar of woe when people had to read it and go "holy crap, that's a thing?" then when you play your pack rat and the other guy goes "uuggh, that douchebag again? Scoop."
So I want a format that takes the best parts of EDH, limited, and playing avatar of woe on my unsuspecting classmates.
What follows is my random brainstorms. Optional reading.
At first I thought - well, what about a budget format? Something like $50 to make a deck, go? Which is a cool idea, but it's got a few problems. If you follow the "what you paid is what it's worth" model, then people who bought cards at the opportune time (i.e. got their tarmo's when they were a dollar because everyone saw "goyf" and figured it sucked) a huge advantage. It also makes it a lot harder to prove - sure, I TOTALLY got this tarmo for a dollar as a preorder, I didn't just buy it yesterday for $80. Not to mention sort-of-lying like selling each other dual lands for a penny or whatever. On the other hand, if you're going by current price, it means you've constantly got to check that your deck hasn't gotten too expensive for the format. Either way sort of sucks.
Of course, you could do a pauper/peasant format, but there are stupidly overpowered uncommons like sol ring, and then you're blocking a lot of fun strategies that revolve around junk rares, which tend to be more funky and interesting than workaday commons/uncommons. Plus there's no more reason to take pride in your deck than with any other constructed format - maybe less since most of the cards are cheaper.
I think making acquisition more difficult is the key, but I'm having a hard time thinking of a good way to do that. I sort of like the idea that you have to trade for your deck - i.e. you start with 5 shocklands, trade until you have a deck - but then it's still impossible to stop lying and fake-trading as far as i can imagine. Maybe if it was well-organized and when you joined, you got specially-marked cards that could only be traded for other specially-marked cards? Of course people could still have friends join and then quit and donate all their specially-marked cards though. Or rip off little kids. Or buy/trade non-marked cards for marked cards.
Obviously playing in a tightly-knit group bound by the honor system fixes a ton of problems with all these ideas, but it also makes it a lot more difficult to grow and play elsewhere. I like to be able to play wherever I go.
Anyway, those are just some starting points.
-make card acquisition more difficult
-limit availability
-lower power level
-encourage trading
Try Cube Draft/Sealed. It's Limited, but you can keep coming back to it again and again.
Cube Limited is the same as normal Limited Draft/Sealed... except instead of opening product, you're pulling "packs" out of a set box of cards. For bonus points, whoever creates the Cube can define the format, by deciding what cards go in. Pauper Cube is very different from, say, a Cube that includes Power 9.
When you're done with the game/tournament, you put all the cards back into the Cube.
You can't really rule 'omg guys no super expensive/overpowered cards allowed!' into a format.
Just find likeminded players and play cool decks you like.
That's an ok sentiment, but definitions of casual vary wildly. I've had people say their unsleeved pile 'o cards that people threw away after the last draft is casual. I've had people say their turn 3 combo elves is casual. Also, either way, there's no pride of ownership.
Also the people I play with changes pretty regularly.
Try Cube Draft/Sealed. It's Limited, but you can keep coming back to it again and again.
Cube Limited is the same as normal Limited Draft/Sealed... except instead of opening product, you're pulling "packs" out of a set box of cards. For bonus points, whoever creates the Cube can define the format, by deciding what cards go in. Pauper Cube is very different from, say, a Cube that includes Power 9.
When you're done with the game/tournament, you put all the cards back into the Cube.
I'm aware of what a cube draft is. I'm sort of trying (and failing) to come up with a new format, I already know just about every existing one.
Although creating a cube sounds sort of fun, playing someone else's has never really appealed to me though. And I think it loses the fun of it being YOUR avatar of woe when someone else drafts it against you. The pride of ownership seems at least as low, if not lower, than EDH. The pride of deck construction, moreso.
Me and my friends invented a casual format where we put all our dime rares in one deck and we all draw from it and share a graveyard, only one of a card is in the deck. each player draws one card at the beginning of the game. there's no mana costs but each player can only cast one spell per turn. It's a lot more fun then it sounds but it's definately casual and fun and we do have an avatar of woe in it.
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Level 1 Judge.
Currently playing
Competitive. Modern:UWRSplinter TwinUWR
EDH: URMelek, Izzet ParagonUR BWGGhave, Guuru of sporesBWG
Yes, yes, I know, that's EDH, but while I love EDH, it's still got a few problems. For one, although netdecking isn't nearly as ubiquitous as it is in standard, there's still plenty of common decks that follow the same archetype - all the azami and azusa decks I've seen are mostly the same, and that's just at "A". For second, it's still a constructed format, which means that most well-made decks will start with a decklist, then get all the cards, maybe making minor tweaks. There's rarely much joy of adding a new sweet bomb.
I run Azusa and one may argue its a "typical" build with Avenger of Zendikar, Genesis Wave, Eldrazi, etc but i still feel like its my personalized deck. There will always be the best cards with high cmcs that ramp decks will run. But thered still tweeks and changes where i can still consider this deck mine.
But the main part i disagree with is rarely adding a new sweet bomb
Every set thats come put ever since ive played edh, ive made pretty sweet changes. My larest example is from RTR. Worldspine Wurm. Its a 15/15 is that not sweet!?. The set before, i saw Boundless Realms before the PT banning and happily slammed it into my deck. Plus Avatar of Woe is a beast in EDH.
Although creating a cube sounds sort of fun, playing someone else's has never really appealed to me though. And I think it loses the fun of it being YOUR avatar of woe when someone else drafts it against you. The pride of ownership seems at least as low, if not lower, than EDH. The pride of deck construction, moreso.
Dude, are you playing for fun, or to show off your cards? Cube is by far the best way to play casual magic with friends so that each person is on an even footing. It's fun and addictive to draft packs full of all your favourite cards. If you own a cube, you also get to show off your cards and have a lot of pride in it too, so I wouldn't be worried about that.
I run Azusa and one may argue its a "typical" build with Avenger of Zendikar, Genesis Wave, Eldrazi, etc but i still feel like its my personalized deck. There will always be the best cards with high cmcs that ramp decks will run. But thered still tweeks and changes where i can still consider this deck mine.
But the main part i disagree with is rarely adding a new sweet bomb
Every set thats come put ever since ive played edh, ive made pretty sweet changes. My larest example is from RTR. Worldspine Wurm. Its a 15/15 is that not sweet!?. The set before, i saw Boundless Realms before the PT banning and happily slammed it into my deck. Plus Avatar of Woe is a beast in EDH.
But how did you acquire said worldspine wurm or boundless realms? Probably you saw it in the spoiler, and either bought it, opened it, or traded for it, and either way it cost you next to nothing. At least, that's how I acquire all the updates to my EDH decks.
Yawn.
I remember hearing about avatar of woe, and the kid who had it told me he'd bring it to trade but kept forgetting. When he finally brought it in, I was tense as hell hoping he'd find something he'd trade it for, and when it was finally mine I was ecstatic. It was MINE, man, finally MINE!!!!
I want that sort of pride of ownership again. Is it possible? Probably not, but I think it's worth brainstorming about.
Cube is great, though I'll tell you I never netdecked EDH and no one I know has. Just depends on your playgroup I suppose.
I don't ask people usually, but who really cares if you netdecked your azusa deck or not? It's gonna turn out basically the same as everyone else's plus or minus a few cards anyway.
Don't get me wrong, I've got decks that I think are fairly unique, but it still lacks the pride of ownership thing mentioned before. My manabase might be sublime in my Glissa deck, but it was still just a bunch of junk I picked up on ebay. There wasn't any real struggle to acquire it.
Dude, are you playing for fun, or to show off your cards? Cube is by far the best way to play casual magic with friends so that each person is on an even footing. It's fun and addictive to draft packs full of all your favourite cards. If you own a cube, you also get to show off your cards and have a lot of pride in it too, so I wouldn't be worried about that.
Obviously I'm never going to "show off" an avatar of woe ever again, it's like $2. Not really a showcase card.
I would like to be excited to play it again, though, and other silly cards like it. Mostly I'd like acquiring them to mean something.
Don't get me wrong, I like limited formats, but they're just not scratching the itch that I'm talking about here.
You just explained my entire magic experience in a nutshell, and I've only been playing for about a year. In standard, pre-rotation, I started out playing mono G. I remember buying a Vorapede for $5 and being extremely excited to play with it and etc. Now I have built essentially every competitive deck (aside from control, I hate control), price never being an issue and the game just doesn't feel the same to me. Luckily, I can still test the waters in different formats.
60 card minimum, one of each card only except basics. However there is a 7-point list of cards, from which you can only play a total of 7 points (eg Black Lotus is 4, Moxes are 3 points, so you could use a mox and a lotus, but no other pointed cards eg Enlightened Tutor, Worldly tutor are both a point etc).
It's casual in the sense that its not a wizards supported format. Not so casual when there's power nine cards for prizes in the big tournaments.
It's a relatively young format in that optimum decklists haven't been found for the most part (except for Zoo and Ux control which tend to dominate), so deck building is fun cause you can't really net deck. So the joy comes from honing in on a strategy and finding cards that work.
If that floats you boat lmk and ill pm you some details.
Although creating a cube sounds sort of fun, playing someone else's has never really appealed to me though. And I think it loses the fun of it being YOUR avatar of woe when someone else drafts it against you. The pride of ownership seems at least as low, if not lower, than EDH. The pride of deck construction, moreso.
Dude, I am seldom more proud of the cards in my Pauper Cube than when I see one of the kids at my FLGS draft some sweet deck with them and proceed to kick some other kid's butt with it. Or my butt, for that matter. It's also pretty cool when the veteran players try it out and see just how dirty and gritty and VICIOUS a Limited match played with nothing but all-star commons can be. Hearing people say things like "Holy sh*t, pauper drafting is way crazier than I thought it would be" just makes my day. I am more proud of my Cube than of any deck I have ever built. It has been, and continues to be, a labor of love for me to share with my friends.
But if Cube's really not your thing (seriously though, try drafting from one if you've never done so before), then the next best thing that I would recommend is rounding up your mates for League play at your LGS. I played the Innistrad League back when I had more of a disposable income and it was a blast. If doing the sanctioned League isn't your thing -- maybe you don't like the no-trade restriction on your sealed League pool -- then start up your own variation on League where trading the cards in your League pool for cards in other people's League pools is allowed. You can use checklists to keep track of everybody's card pool, and appoint a League Coordinator to approve and record all trades.
At first I thought - well, what about a budget format? Something like $50 to make a deck, go? Which is a cool idea, but it's got a few problems. If you follow the "what you paid is what it's worth" model, then people who bought cards at the opportune time (i.e. got their tarmo's when they were a dollar because everyone saw "goyf" and figured it sucked) a huge advantage. It also makes it a lot harder to prove - sure, I TOTALLY got this tarmo for a dollar as a preorder, I didn't just buy it yesterday for $80. Not to mention sort-of-lying like selling each other dual lands for a penny or whatever. On the other hand, if you're going by current price, it means you've constantly got to check that your deck hasn't gotten too expensive for the format. Either way sort of sucks.
IMHO this is the best way to create a casual format, if you use current prices and choose an appropriate deck max (I would say start at $30 and increase if that's too restrictive) it allows people to build their decks with cards they consider fun (which isn't the same for everyone) without putting anyone at an advantage or disadvantage due to budget.
With regards to card values, the best way to do this is for everyone to agree on a deck building app or website (I personally use Decked Builder but there are plenty of others) that can price out a deck. After the list is created it literally takes a second to verify that the list is within budget and if it is not it's up to you and your group what action to take. It's really a non-issue if you're using a program to do the heavy lifting.
I personally would like to see tournaments utilizing this style of play and I personally enjoyed designing decks to fit within budget constraints.
60 card minimum, one of each card only except basics. However there is a 7-point list of cards, from which you can only play a total of 7 points (eg Black Lotus is 4, Moxes are 3 points, so you could use a mox and a lotus, but no other pointed cards eg Enlightened Tutor, Worldly tutor are both a point etc).
It's casual in the sense that its not a wizards supported format. Not so casual when there's power nine cards for prizes in the big tournaments.
It's a relatively young format in that optimum decklists haven't been found for the most part (except for Zoo and Ux control which tend to dominate), so deck building is fun cause you can't really net deck. So the joy comes from honing in on a strategy and finding cards that work.
If that floats you boat lmk and ill pm you some details.
Aus Highlander is very fun. I recomend it.
If you want to make getting cards harder impose an only foriegn/foil rule.
I can feel your sentiment. When I got my first avatar of woe I was bewitched!
Id say just go ahead and experiment with new rule and get a friend to try it with you then tweak it to ensure consistency.
Speaking of new format:
idk if this has been tried before (probably) something called singlestar or SS. The idea comes from planeswalker chars in the magic storyline. Chandra always have some burning with her and jace always have some manipulation etc. Hence as planeswalker ourselves we should have some trademark action that we always have that is readily available.
The deck is 60 cards min with normal regulation (4 of, enforce banlist, etc)
-before beginning the game, each players reveal and set aside 3 different cards from their deck into an out of game zone called "special" face up
-you may cast the cards from "special" as if it is in your hand but effect(s) that manipulate your hand do not manipulate "special"
-you may only cast one card from "special" per turn
-first card casted from "special" cost 1 less
-second card casted from "special" cost 2 less
-final card casted from "special cost 4 less
-you may not cast the cards from "special" in the first two turns of your game.
-cast the cards from "special" only as sorcery
-if a card from "special" is succesfully casted it will be placed in where it should be upon resolution normally (sorcery/instant in gy, land/creature in battlefield etc)
A casual format's limit is only ever the people playing it. It doesn't matter what your deckbuilding rules are, if you have the 'wrong' types of people in your group, you're not going to have fun playing janky Avatar of Woe decks. Like, I can play the jankiest EDH deck because my friends and I are high school students with no income that basically get cards by cracking them at prereleases, and by buying the occasional booster. The only cards we bought were the original Commander pack decks, and a few 20c commons.
I also don't think you should do crazy restricted deckbuilding formats. Just like trying to staple downsides onto overpowered cards, it's not going to solve any problems and you might end up having less fun because you can't do everything you want to and your opponent won't either.
Cube might work though.
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You got 99 attackers but I'm blocking with 1.
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Alright, I have a weird idea about all of this--Have each member of your playgroup go to somewhere like SCG and order some arbitrary number of bulk rares (random assortment), bulk commons, and bulk uncommons. Everyone open them at the same time and record them. That is the pool of cards for your meta. You can only use cards in the pool, but can trade with others (for cards in the pool) to get new stuff.
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Sig by Dark Night Cavalier at Heroes of the Plane Studios!
Alright, I have a weird idea about all of this--Have each member of your playgroup go to somewhere like SCG and order some arbitrary number of bulk rares (random assortment), bulk commons, and bulk uncommons. Everyone open them at the same time and record them. That is the pool of cards for your meta. You can only use cards in the pool, but can trade with others (for cards in the pool) to get new stuff.
This is a good idea.
Or, if you want that pride of ownership feeling, make a cube of all foils (or all foreign foils) or something. That's the only way you're going to get those "hard to get" sentiments anymore. Once budget isn't an issue, magic cards aren't that hard to acquire unless they're actually rare.
On another note, this may be the only thread I've seen in a while where someone is complaining about HAVING money to play magic...
But how did you acquire said worldspine wurm or boundless realms? Probably you saw it in the spoiler, and either bought it, opened it, or traded for it, and either way it cost you next to nothing. At least, that's how I acquire all the updates to my EDH decks.
Yawn.
I remember hearing about avatar of woe, and the kid who had it told me he'd bring it to trade but kept forgetting. When he finally brought it in, I was tense as hell hoping he'd find something he'd trade it for, and when it was finally mine I was ecstatic. It was MINE, man, finally MINE!!!!
I want that sort of pride of ownership again. Is it possible? Probably not, but I think it's worth brainstorming about.
It sounds to me like your problem has absolutely nothing to do with the formats. Your problem is that you're no longer a poor student who has difficulty obtaining cards.
If that's your biggest concern, you're leading a good life.
The only way you are going to achieve that feeling again is to acquire progressively more expensive cards. Negotiate to buy/trade for a beta Black Lotus and see if it doesn't give you the same feeling.
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There are 10 types of people in this world, those that understand binary and those that don't.
A couple of friends of mine from my FNM group came up with this game. It's actually pretty fun. Now they created it while at a tourny a few months back and were just using the commons and uncommons from RTR so it has a limited flavor but you can use anything from any time. Granted, some things don't work as well(landfall for example) but the rules are still being refined. If you've got a large collection of commons and uncommons just sitting around, throw them together!
Below is the entire post explaining Dueces Wild:
So over the weekend in Atlanta, XXXX and I developed a new casual limited format that is super fun. We are calling it Deuces Wild or DW for short. The rules are as followed:
1) A DW deck must consist of at least 60 cards. A deck may not contain any basic lands or Rare/Mythic cards.
2) Both players share and draw from the same library and share a graveyard
3) Both players start the game with 20 life and 7 cards
4) Win/Lose conditions are the same as normal. If a player's life total reaches zero or less, or if they are unable to draw a card from their library, they lose the game.
5) All spells and activated abilities are free to cast. If the casting cost of a spell or activated ability requires paying X mana, then X is 1 when put on the stack.
6) Each player is limited to performing 2 of 5 unique "actions" on each turn. These actions can only be performed once each turn, but may be performed in any order. These actions are as follows:
* Draw a card
* Cycle a card
* Cast a spell
* Activate an ability
* Declare attackers
7) On an opponents turn, a player may only cast a spell or activate an ability, and only once for each such action. Timing restrictions apply. A player cannot draw or cycle a card as an action on their opponents turn.
8) Declaring blockers is not considered an action and doesn't count towards the 2 action per turn limit.
9) If a player chooses not to draw a card on his turn, then the draw step does not occur. For example, if your opponent casts Fatigue , and you decide to cast a spell and attack on your turn, then you still have not skipped your draw step. Then next time you would attempt to draw a card, you would have to use an action for the turn and not draw a card.
10) If a player chooses not to attack on their turn, then the combat phase/declare attackers step does not occur.
11) Entering the beginning of combat step does not count as using the Declare attackers action. So if you enter combat, and your opponent decides to Twiddle one of your creatures so that it may not attack, you may choose not to declare attackers. If you choose not to declare attackers, then you still have 2 actions left (unless you have performed an action prior to entering combat); however, any effects that cause you to skip your combat phase only occur if you use your Declare attackers action.
12) Each player is considered to be controlling a <basic land type> if they control a permanent of that color. For example, if a player controls a Goblin Arsonist , then that player cannot block a creature with mountainwalk because they control a mountain. If that player's Goblin Arsonist leaves the battlefield, then they are no longer considered to be controlling a mountain and may block any creatures with mountainwalk.
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"When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." Frederic Bastiat
Alright, I have a weird idea about all of this--Have each member of your playgroup go to somewhere like SCG and order some arbitrary number of bulk rares (random assortment), bulk commons, and bulk uncommons. Everyone open them at the same time and record them. That is the pool of cards for your meta. You can only use cards in the pool, but can trade with others (for cards in the pool) to get new stuff.
This might be the best idea I've heard so far. Downside is that it's not very portable, though.
It sounds to me like your problem has absolutely nothing to do with the formats. Your problem is that you're no longer a poor student who has difficulty obtaining cards.
If that's your biggest concern, you're leading a good life.
No argument there. But it doesn't make me any less nostalgic.
The only way you are going to achieve that feeling again is to acquire progressively more expensive cards. Negotiate to buy/trade for a beta Black Lotus and see if it doesn't give you the same feeling.
I probably could go buy one if I wanted to, but I can't actually play it anywhere so I don't see the point. It's not a card I think is interesting anyway. I never played THAT long ago so I have no nostalgia for that card.
Me and my friends invented a casual format where we put all our dime rares in one deck and we all draw from it and share a graveyard, only one of a card is in the deck. each player draws one card at the beginning of the game. there's no mana costs but each player can only cast one spell per turn. It's a lot more fun then it sounds but it's definately casual and fun and we do have an avatar of woe in it.
THIS absolutely. This is in fact how my wife and I played when we first started playing Magic when we had only one precon (she has since quit and I've got sucked into this. Ironically she was doing it to draw me away from my previous hobby, which weren't as expensive as this one). We had one deck and we play from the same deck. We play by normal Magic rules otherwise.
It is almostly playing mirror, except some of the key card could be missing from the deck(in your opponents hand or her future draws), and you can in some decks manupulate your opponents draws, you can create some really funny situations play this way. This way of playing is very much fun no matter what deck at what power-level you choose to play, you both are on equal ground.
BTW: This could be more fun if you use dredge or reanimator as the deck of choice. Do not use deck with Sensei's Divining Top in it.
Nowadays I've got thousands of dollars worth of cards and I'm familiar with just about every playable card ever printed. But I don't really feel the same way about my underground sea or mana crypts that I used to about my avatar of woe. You can't un-bite the apple, I guess.
But damned if I don't want to try.
The biggest problem with "maturing" in magic (and life, monetarily speaking) is that acquiring cards becomes a LOT easier. I used to agonize for days over whether to spend $5 on that vampiric dragon...these days I'll buy a mana drain on a whim. While that's obviously a fantastic thing for my decks' power level, it doesn't really make me nearly as excited as that vampiric dragon did. Likewise, being aware of every playable makes looking at cards while deckbuilding (EDH, mostly) more of a boring chore than the exciting treasure-trove of possibility that it used to be.
So I've been trying to figure out a way to craft a format that limits power level to make the unplayable playable, and the decks more personalized.
Yes, yes, I know, that's EDH, but while I love EDH, it's still got a few problems. For one, although netdecking isn't nearly as ubiquitous as it is in standard, there's still plenty of common decks that follow the same archetype - all the azami and azusa decks I've seen are mostly the same, and that's just at "A". For second, it's still a constructed format, which means that most well-made decks will start with a decklist, then get all the cards, maybe making minor tweaks. There's rarely much joy of adding a new sweet bomb. For a third, although it allows for older, more expensive stuff than standard or modern, all that stuff is still (mostly) just as easy to buy off the internet, so it's not really hard to acquire, just more expensive. The format needs to make the cards in your deck be fairly unique and acquired in more difficult/lucky ways, so you feel like you've really got something special when you windmill slam that avatar of woe.
Yes, yes, I know, that's limited, but while I love limited, you only get the excitement of having that hypersonic dragon or whatever for the duration of the event, then it's just another junk rare in the binder. Plus, within a month or so, most of the power levels are pretty well known and the pool isn't especially large. It was always more fun to play avatar of woe when people had to read it and go "holy crap, that's a thing?" then when you play your pack rat and the other guy goes "uuggh, that douchebag again? Scoop."
So I want a format that takes the best parts of EDH, limited, and playing avatar of woe on my unsuspecting classmates.
What follows is my random brainstorms. Optional reading.
Of course, you could do a pauper/peasant format, but there are stupidly overpowered uncommons like sol ring, and then you're blocking a lot of fun strategies that revolve around junk rares, which tend to be more funky and interesting than workaday commons/uncommons. Plus there's no more reason to take pride in your deck than with any other constructed format - maybe less since most of the cards are cheaper.
I think making acquisition more difficult is the key, but I'm having a hard time thinking of a good way to do that. I sort of like the idea that you have to trade for your deck - i.e. you start with 5 shocklands, trade until you have a deck - but then it's still impossible to stop lying and fake-trading as far as i can imagine. Maybe if it was well-organized and when you joined, you got specially-marked cards that could only be traded for other specially-marked cards? Of course people could still have friends join and then quit and donate all their specially-marked cards though. Or rip off little kids. Or buy/trade non-marked cards for marked cards.
Obviously playing in a tightly-knit group bound by the honor system fixes a ton of problems with all these ideas, but it also makes it a lot more difficult to grow and play elsewhere. I like to be able to play wherever I go.
Anyway, those are just some starting points.
-make card acquisition more difficult
-limit availability
-lower power level
-encourage trading
I think those are some of they key goals.
I'm done talking now.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Cube Limited is the same as normal Limited Draft/Sealed... except instead of opening product, you're pulling "packs" out of a set box of cards. For bonus points, whoever creates the Cube can define the format, by deciding what cards go in. Pauper Cube is very different from, say, a Cube that includes Power 9.
When you're done with the game/tournament, you put all the cards back into the Cube.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
You can't really rule 'omg guys no super expensive/overpowered cards allowed!' into a format.
Just find likeminded players and play cool decks you like.
peasantcube.blogspot.com
That's an ok sentiment, but definitions of casual vary wildly. I've had people say their unsleeved pile 'o cards that people threw away after the last draft is casual. I've had people say their turn 3 combo elves is casual. Also, either way, there's no pride of ownership.
Also the people I play with changes pretty regularly.
I'm aware of what a cube draft is. I'm sort of trying (and failing) to come up with a new format, I already know just about every existing one.
Although creating a cube sounds sort of fun, playing someone else's has never really appealed to me though. And I think it loses the fun of it being YOUR avatar of woe when someone else drafts it against you. The pride of ownership seems at least as low, if not lower, than EDH. The pride of deck construction, moreso.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Currently playing
Modern:UWRSplinter TwinUWR
EDH:
URMelek, Izzet ParagonUR
BWGGhave, Guuru of sporesBWG
Good thing I have book burning.
I run Azusa and one may argue its a "typical" build with Avenger of Zendikar, Genesis Wave, Eldrazi, etc but i still feel like its my personalized deck. There will always be the best cards with high cmcs that ramp decks will run. But thered still tweeks and changes where i can still consider this deck mine.
But the main part i disagree with is rarely adding a new sweet bomb
Every set thats come put ever since ive played edh, ive made pretty sweet changes. My larest example is from RTR. Worldspine Wurm. Its a 15/15 is that not sweet!?. The set before, i saw Boundless Realms before the PT banning and happily slammed it into my deck. Plus Avatar of Woe is a beast in EDH.
Dude, are you playing for fun, or to show off your cards? Cube is by far the best way to play casual magic with friends so that each person is on an even footing. It's fun and addictive to draft packs full of all your favourite cards. If you own a cube, you also get to show off your cards and have a lot of pride in it too, so I wouldn't be worried about that.
Juju Alters - Altered MTG Cards
But how did you acquire said worldspine wurm or boundless realms? Probably you saw it in the spoiler, and either bought it, opened it, or traded for it, and either way it cost you next to nothing. At least, that's how I acquire all the updates to my EDH decks.
Yawn.
I remember hearing about avatar of woe, and the kid who had it told me he'd bring it to trade but kept forgetting. When he finally brought it in, I was tense as hell hoping he'd find something he'd trade it for, and when it was finally mine I was ecstatic. It was MINE, man, finally MINE!!!!
I want that sort of pride of ownership again. Is it possible? Probably not, but I think it's worth brainstorming about.
I don't ask people usually, but who really cares if you netdecked your azusa deck or not? It's gonna turn out basically the same as everyone else's plus or minus a few cards anyway.
Don't get me wrong, I've got decks that I think are fairly unique, but it still lacks the pride of ownership thing mentioned before. My manabase might be sublime in my Glissa deck, but it was still just a bunch of junk I picked up on ebay. There wasn't any real struggle to acquire it.
Obviously I'm never going to "show off" an avatar of woe ever again, it's like $2. Not really a showcase card.
I would like to be excited to play it again, though, and other silly cards like it. Mostly I'd like acquiring them to mean something.
Don't get me wrong, I like limited formats, but they're just not scratching the itch that I'm talking about here.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I wish more people played Pauper online.
60 card minimum, one of each card only except basics. However there is a 7-point list of cards, from which you can only play a total of 7 points (eg Black Lotus is 4, Moxes are 3 points, so you could use a mox and a lotus, but no other pointed cards eg Enlightened Tutor, Worldly tutor are both a point etc).
It's casual in the sense that its not a wizards supported format. Not so casual when there's power nine cards for prizes in the big tournaments.
It's a relatively young format in that optimum decklists haven't been found for the most part (except for Zoo and Ux control which tend to dominate), so deck building is fun cause you can't really net deck. So the joy comes from honing in on a strategy and finding cards that work.
If that floats you boat lmk and ill pm you some details.
Dude, I am seldom more proud of the cards in my Pauper Cube than when I see one of the kids at my FLGS draft some sweet deck with them and proceed to kick some other kid's butt with it. Or my butt, for that matter. It's also pretty cool when the veteran players try it out and see just how dirty and gritty and VICIOUS a Limited match played with nothing but all-star commons can be. Hearing people say things like "Holy sh*t, pauper drafting is way crazier than I thought it would be" just makes my day. I am more proud of my Cube than of any deck I have ever built. It has been, and continues to be, a labor of love for me to share with my friends.
But if Cube's really not your thing (seriously though, try drafting from one if you've never done so before), then the next best thing that I would recommend is rounding up your mates for League play at your LGS. I played the Innistrad League back when I had more of a disposable income and it was a blast. If doing the sanctioned League isn't your thing -- maybe you don't like the no-trade restriction on your sealed League pool -- then start up your own variation on League where trading the cards in your League pool for cards in other people's League pools is allowed. You can use checklists to keep track of everybody's card pool, and appoint a League Coordinator to approve and record all trades.
IMHO this is the best way to create a casual format, if you use current prices and choose an appropriate deck max (I would say start at $30 and increase if that's too restrictive) it allows people to build their decks with cards they consider fun (which isn't the same for everyone) without putting anyone at an advantage or disadvantage due to budget.
With regards to card values, the best way to do this is for everyone to agree on a deck building app or website (I personally use Decked Builder but there are plenty of others) that can price out a deck. After the list is created it literally takes a second to verify that the list is within budget and if it is not it's up to you and your group what action to take. It's really a non-issue if you're using a program to do the heavy lifting.
I personally would like to see tournaments utilizing this style of play and I personally enjoyed designing decks to fit within budget constraints.
Aus Highlander is very fun. I recomend it.
If you want to make getting cards harder impose an only foriegn/foil rule.
Id say just go ahead and experiment with new rule and get a friend to try it with you then tweak it to ensure consistency.
Speaking of new format:
The deck is 60 cards min with normal regulation (4 of, enforce banlist, etc)
-before beginning the game, each players reveal and set aside 3 different cards from their deck into an out of game zone called "special" face up
-you may cast the cards from "special" as if it is in your hand but effect(s) that manipulate your hand do not manipulate "special"
-you may only cast one card from "special" per turn
-first card casted from "special" cost 1 less
-second card casted from "special" cost 2 less
-final card casted from "special cost 4 less
-you may not cast the cards from "special" in the first two turns of your game.
-cast the cards from "special" only as sorcery
-if a card from "special" is succesfully casted it will be placed in where it should be upon resolution normally (sorcery/instant in gy, land/creature in battlefield etc)
good luck and tell us how it goes.
I also don't think you should do crazy restricted deckbuilding formats. Just like trying to staple downsides onto overpowered cards, it's not going to solve any problems and you might end up having less fun because you can't do everything you want to and your opponent won't either.
Cube might work though.
You got 99 attackers but I'm blocking with 1.
The Winner is Judge | 7
This Winner is Also Judge | 6
Club Flamingo | Lots
Or cube.
peasantcube.blogspot.com
This is a good idea.
Or, if you want that pride of ownership feeling, make a cube of all foils (or all foreign foils) or something. That's the only way you're going to get those "hard to get" sentiments anymore. Once budget isn't an issue, magic cards aren't that hard to acquire unless they're actually rare.
On another note, this may be the only thread I've seen in a while where someone is complaining about HAVING money to play magic...
If that's your biggest concern, you're leading a good life.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
Tiamat, Chromatic Dragon RWUBG
Planeswalker - Tiamat
[+1] Sit on Nicol Bolas
[+0] Wait for him to beg for mercy, rule the multiverse.
[-7] Not necessary, she is the ultimate.
This might be the best idea I've heard so far. Downside is that it's not very portable, though.
No argument there. But it doesn't make me any less nostalgic.
I probably could go buy one if I wanted to, but I can't actually play it anywhere so I don't see the point. It's not a card I think is interesting anyway. I never played THAT long ago so I have no nostalgia for that card.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
THIS absolutely. This is in fact how my wife and I played when we first started playing Magic when we had only one precon (she has since quit and I've got sucked into this. Ironically she was doing it to draw me away from my previous hobby, which weren't as expensive as this one). We had one deck and we play from the same deck. We play by normal Magic rules otherwise.
It is almostly playing mirror, except some of the key card could be missing from the deck(in your opponents hand or her future draws), and you can in some decks manupulate your opponents draws, you can create some really funny situations play this way. This way of playing is very much fun no matter what deck at what power-level you choose to play, you both are on equal ground.
BTW: This could be more fun if you use dredge or reanimator as the deck of choice. Do not use deck with Sensei's Divining Top in it.
Legacy:
UR UR Delver
UBR Ad Nauseam Tendril
W Death & Tax
Modern deck:
UW UW control (with Spreading Seas and Wall of Omens)
BRG Vengevine!