The title pretty much describes it. I see lots of talk about reprinting modern staples in standard sets possibly being too unbalancing, but at hte same time re-printing certain cards in fixed pre-con decks would skew prices too much.
So, why is a modern "masters series" set not something that people are considering?
It seems like it would be the "ideal" solution to the whole dillema to me.
I think it is more likely that they will print a set that has no impact on Standard if they are going to make Modern staples, like having Modern Tournament Decks, similar to how they made the EDH decks. Basically giving people access to good cards for Modern that people play with while not effecting the standard meta.
I think it is more likely that they will print a set that has no impact on Standard if they are going to make Modern staples, like having Modern Tournament Decks, similar to how they made the EDH decks. Basically giving people access to good cards for Modern that people play with while not effecting the standard meta.
Because it would have an MSRP of $39.95 like the other special sets, however if they put only 1 Shockland in it, it would sell fast. Also imagine if a Goyf was in one of them, it's a $90 card. If you put one in one of the "decks', that deck would sell out in a heart beat, therefore raising the value of Goyf. Kind of counterproductive.
Because it would have an MSRP of $39.95 like the other special sets, however if they put only 1 Shockland in it, it would sell fast. Also imagine if a Goyf was in one of them, it's a $90 card. If you put one in one of the "decks', that deck would sell out in a heart beat, therefore raising the value of Goyf. Kind of counterproductive.
Huh?
Maybe I wasn't clear: You know how masters sets in online world work right? They are boosters. They have randomized old "classic" cards.
This would be the same, only with modern legal cards. It wouldn't affect standard since they wouldn't be standard legal. And it wouldn't cause people to buy up all of one part and leave the rest sitting there since the cards were random.
Because it would have an MSRP of $39.95 like the other special sets, however if they put only 1 Shockland in it, it would sell fast. Also imagine if a Goyf was in one of them, it's a $90 card. If you put one in one of the "decks', that deck would sell out in a heart beat, therefore raising the value of Goyf. Kind of counterproductive.
Pretty much this. I know for a fact that all of my "FLGS" would scalp the crap outta those, if they ever hit light of day. The only way to really make modern staples available to the masses is to do a massive reprint and distribute it through major chains. Like walmart and the Commander precons. My "FLGS" was like 'oh such good cards, money money money' and I was like 'wally world has it for msrp. so msrp or i'll just go there.' Nuff said.
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Current Capt. of Team "Ju"
I play this:
Standard:
Rotation is coming...
Modern: GGGSTOMPY
ZOO (Goyf-less)
Legacy:
Brewing
EDH:
Too many to name.
You want another Chronicles set. I'm sure WoTC said somewhere they considered Chronicles a complete failure and did not plan on doing it again. It horribly ruins the 2ndary market of the reprinted cards.
You want another Chronicles set. I'm sure WoTC said somewhere they considered Chronicles a complete failure and did not plan on doing it again. It horribly ruins the 2ndary market of the reprinted cards.
I want exactly the same thing as the masters edition sets online, but in paper form.
You want another Chronicles set. I'm sure WoTC said somewhere they considered Chronicles a complete failure and did not plan on doing it again. It horribly ruins the 2ndary market of the reprinted cards.
Ruins I don't think is the right word, it actually gets them more product to sell, because i don't know about you, but the thing keeping me from buying any cards for modern is the price tag. Sure, some prices will go down, because the demand is high and the supply is low, however, releasing a "Masters Set" means that the demand is still high, however, the supply is high as well.
They could make Modern masters boosters and charge $10 a pack and sell out in no time. I know alot of people are talking this will be the summer set for Gen-con instead of a vault set. Of course no one has any confirmation on it. Personally I think drafting them would be a blast. Kind of like cube drafting made by Wotc.
Not sure how the Masters packs work on MTGO, but do they have like 5 commons, 2 uncommons and 1 Rare?
If so, I see this working in paper.
There is still the fact you don't know what you are going to get.
There are modern staples that aren't super expensive.
They would sell like crazy, but not like suggested above.
Even better would be to sell these with strict MSRPs. You sell for the MSRP or you don't sell them.
The bugger would be the fact that shops would be greedmongers and crack packs. They would have to make this an "Unlimited" print run though. So much so that value would drop to the point shops would have to second thought opening every pack they get.
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Currently Playing: Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me! Legacy: RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R RGBelcherRG WSoldier StompyW BReanimatorB EDH: BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
Chronicles was the first attempt at reprinted some older cards players wanted (from Legends, Arabian Nights, Antiquities). However the set was white bordered and some of the art was changed and it was pretty much not liked as a whole. It did bring up the demand for the originals.
If WotC did this, they would probably make a 150 card set. Now out of that, there's only what 20 cards that is hard to get (shocks, Goyf, Bob, Vinny, Thoughtseize). Nothing else is valued over $18. So now you have 130 worthless cards most people already have. If they don't they could get it easily online.
I guarantee those people that are complaining about the prices of some cards would go out and buy 2 boxes ($190ish) to try and get some cards, when they could spend 190 on staples they want and have 2-3 viable decks.
If MTGO gets a reprint set then there better be one for people who play IRL. There's no situation where MTGO players should have access to cards that we don't.
He's suggesting a "Modern Master's Edition," which would be just like the Master's Editions on MTGO - ie. a set of various Modern cards, sold in booster packs. He is not suggesting giving MTGO players access to cards that paper players don't have (which, even if his suggestion were MTGO only, wouldn't happen since all the cards would already have paper versions).
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LordOfSecrets, you understand MODO doesn't have a reserve list right?
The only reason the masters editions exsist is because all the early sets were designed with no thought for a limited environment. They are hat makes it possible for players to get access to old cards online while still getting the play value of drafting the packs (the primary way packs are cracked online. Nobody opens boosters just to open them online).
Cherry picking the most powerful cards from the modern era sets and then packaging them into booster packs and selling them would create an outcry from the collector/lgs community unheard of. Huge inventories of modern staples would plummet in value overnight and I doubt the margins on the boosters sold would scarcely cover it. Since it would be an awkward set to draft (my goyf battles your goyf!) they would only be purchased for the singles. Not a great way to sustain a symbiotic relationship with your distribution channel.
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Thanks, I'll file that under **** I already know. What I'm saying is that if there is a reprint of anything, than it had better be reprinted on cardboard as well or cardboard only.
I don't think you quite understand. Masters edition sets needed to be created to introduce older cards onto MODO so they could create older format tournaments. Additionally, there is no reprint policy for MODO.
Cherry picking the most powerful cards from the modern era sets and then packaging them into booster packs and selling them would create an outcry from the collector/lgs community unheard of. Huge inventories of modern staples would plummet in value overnight and I doubt the margins on the boosters sold would scarcely cover it. Since it would be an awkward set to draft (my goyf battles your goyf!) they would only be purchased for the singles. Not a great way to sustain a symbiotic relationship with your distribution channel.
There is a point where the players of the game simply get to say: We don't care about collector's. And I feel like that line is at modern. I have goyfs, shocks, bobs, mutavaults etc. They could reprint all of those until they are in the quarter bin and I would be ecstatic. There is no reason for modern to be another "haves" versus "have nots" format.
Modern is an ETERNAL format people. ETERNAL formats are generally more expensive than T2/Extended. If you review the modern MODO dailies, you can see alot of people are only running 4-6 shocklands and the rest basics, fetches, and M12/INN lands. Outside of Goyf (which only Jund and Zoo have to play), it's not played in any other competetive decks. Bob is only played in Jund. Though I see Bob and Sorin 2.0 going into Soul Sisters. Other than that the format is relatively cheap. So fork over $150 on the 6 shocks and a few fetches you need and play the format. Hell UR Storm is really cheap compared to the top Standard Decks.
If you review the modern MODO dailies, you can see alot of people are only running 4-6 shocklands and the rest basics, fetches, and M12/INN lands. Outside of Goyf (which only Jund and Zoo have to play), it's not played in any other competetive decks. Bob is only played in Jund. Though I see Bob and Sorin 2.0 going into Soul Sisters. Other than that the format is relatively cheap. So fork over $150 on the 6 shocks and a few fetches you need and play the format. Hell UR Storm is really cheap compared to the top Standard Decks.
I don't want a reprint set so the cards will become cheaper, I want a reprint set because I like reprint sets. I want to be able to draft a "modern all stars" type set with my friends.
You want another Chronicles set. I'm sure WoTC said somewhere they considered Chronicles a complete failure and did not plan on doing it again. It horribly ruins the 2ndary market of the reprinted cards.
Chronicles ruined the value of underprinted cards that were unplayable in competitive Magic. Back then, flashy, but terrible cards like the elder dragons were worth something like $20 each. Sure, a few cards like City of Brass ended up seeing play eventually, but for the most part, the set was less than amazing. Now, if you reprint cards that see heavy tournament or casual play, the price will drop initially, but the market will likely soak up the surplus in a year or less. Comparing a Tarmogoyf reprint to Entomb would be reasonable. It's not going to drop and stay dead like, say, Vampiric Dragon or Scion of Darkness when they got reprinted in Archenemy.
Because it would have an MSRP of $39.95 like the other special sets, however if they put only 1 Shockland in it, it would sell fast. Also imagine if a Goyf was in one of them, it's a $90 card. If you put one in one of the "decks', that deck would sell out in a heart beat, therefore raising the value of Goyf. Kind of counterproductive.
If you put a card that sells for more than $40 in a precon that sells for $40 that would RAISE the price of the card?
What are you talking about? A card in a precon cannot possibly become more expensive than the precon itself. Your hypothetical situation would bring the price of goyf down to AT MOST $40.
If you put a card that sells for more than $40 in a precon that sells for $40 that would RAISE the price of the card?
What are you talking about? A card in a precon cannot possibly become more expensive than the precon itself. Your hypothetical situation would bring the price of goyf down to AT MOST $40.
Incorrect. If a Goyf is in a precon, how fast do you think that precon would sell out? Guess what, the precon is now on ebay reaching bids of $90-$100 just for the Goyf. The Goyfs will go up, as the demand for them would skyrocket. Supply and demand my good friend...supply and demand.
I don't think people realize that the sheer threat of modern reprints is what WOTC needs the most. They don't need to reprint every card so people can have dirt cheap modern decks. Collecting/value is a large part of what magic is all about. Destroying that is a mistake.
What the threat of reprints does is prevent mass hoarding. It also allows a support mechanism if duals etc get to $50+ levels. They don't need to make sure every card is below $20.
a targeted reprint of the shocklands and tarmogoyf would already make modern probably the cheapest format out there.
I actually think if they reprint every card, modern will have a lot of issues. The people who invested in it now would all see their collections drop drastically. This is not how you sustain a format of a ccg - by disillusioning your most ardent fan base.
I suspect, the majority of the reprint whiners haven't even tried to make any modern decks. Choose one without goyf. See how much it costs you. it's probably around the same price for a standard deck.
Anyone who doesnt think a reprint would lower the price of Modern staples wasnt watching when they reprinted baneslayer or the titans. Yeah, goyf may not be a $10 card, but it wouldnt be $100 anymore either. More supply, means less demand.
Those bringing up the collector angle, how many formats do you wish to ruin? These are pieces of cardboard. Not gold or some precious metal.
Modern is an ETERNAL format people.
Technically, no it is not. An eternal format encompasses all cards printed except the banned and/or restricted list of a format. Hence why Vintage and Legacy are both listed as etenal formats by Wotc and Modern is not.
So, why is a modern "masters series" set not something that people are considering?
It seems like it would be the "ideal" solution to the whole dillema to me.
MTGS egos at their finest.
Thoughts on proxies:
Thats what a modern masters set would be?
MTGS egos at their finest.
Thoughts on proxies:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
Huh?
Maybe I wasn't clear: You know how masters sets in online world work right? They are boosters. They have randomized old "classic" cards.
This would be the same, only with modern legal cards. It wouldn't affect standard since they wouldn't be standard legal. And it wouldn't cause people to buy up all of one part and leave the rest sitting there since the cards were random.
Pretty much this. I know for a fact that all of my "FLGS" would scalp the crap outta those, if they ever hit light of day. The only way to really make modern staples available to the masses is to do a massive reprint and distribute it through major chains. Like walmart and the Commander precons. My "FLGS" was like 'oh such good cards, money money money' and I was like 'wally world has it for msrp. so msrp or i'll just go there.' Nuff said.
Current Capt. of Team "Ju"
I play this:
Rotation is coming...
Modern: GGGSTOMPY
ZOO (Goyf-less)
Legacy:
Brewing
EDH:
Too many to name.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
I want exactly the same thing as the masters edition sets online, but in paper form.
Is that the same as Chronicles?
Ruins I don't think is the right word, it actually gets them more product to sell, because i don't know about you, but the thing keeping me from buying any cards for modern is the price tag. Sure, some prices will go down, because the demand is high and the supply is low, however, releasing a "Masters Set" means that the demand is still high, however, the supply is high as well.
MTGS egos at their finest.
Thoughts on proxies:
Current Capt. of Team "Ju"
I play this:
Rotation is coming...
Modern: GGGSTOMPY
ZOO (Goyf-less)
Legacy:
Brewing
EDH:
Too many to name.
If so, I see this working in paper.
There is still the fact you don't know what you are going to get.
There are modern staples that aren't super expensive.
They would sell like crazy, but not like suggested above.
Even better would be to sell these with strict MSRPs. You sell for the MSRP or you don't sell them.
The bugger would be the fact that shops would be greedmongers and crack packs. They would have to make this an "Unlimited" print run though. So much so that value would drop to the point shops would have to second thought opening every pack they get.
Currently Playing:
Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me!
Legacy:
RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R
RGBelcherRG
WSoldier StompyW
BReanimatorB
EDH:
BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB
BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
If WotC did this, they would probably make a 150 card set. Now out of that, there's only what 20 cards that is hard to get (shocks, Goyf, Bob, Vinny, Thoughtseize). Nothing else is valued over $18. So now you have 130 worthless cards most people already have. If they don't they could get it easily online.
I guarantee those people that are complaining about the prices of some cards would go out and buy 2 boxes ($190ish) to try and get some cards, when they could spend 190 on staples they want and have 2-3 viable decks.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
He's suggesting a "Modern Master's Edition," which would be just like the Master's Editions on MTGO - ie. a set of various Modern cards, sold in booster packs. He is not suggesting giving MTGO players access to cards that paper players don't have (which, even if his suggestion were MTGO only, wouldn't happen since all the cards would already have paper versions).
Top 8 of SCG Invitational, Las Vegas, NV, Dec 13-15, 2013
Top 8 of SCG Invitational, Somerset, NJ, Aug 28-30, 2015
Winner of SCG Worcester Team Sealed Open with Gerard Fabiano and Curtis Sheu, September 28, 2013
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The only reason the masters editions exsist is because all the early sets were designed with no thought for a limited environment. They are hat makes it possible for players to get access to old cards online while still getting the play value of drafting the packs (the primary way packs are cracked online. Nobody opens boosters just to open them online).
Tiamat, Chromatic Dragon RWUBG
Planeswalker - Tiamat
[+1] Sit on Nicol Bolas
[+0] Wait for him to beg for mercy, rule the multiverse.
[-7] Not necessary, she is the ultimate.
I don't think you quite understand. Masters edition sets needed to be created to introduce older cards onto MODO so they could create older format tournaments. Additionally, there is no reprint policy for MODO.
There is a point where the players of the game simply get to say: We don't care about collector's. And I feel like that line is at modern. I have goyfs, shocks, bobs, mutavaults etc. They could reprint all of those until they are in the quarter bin and I would be ecstatic. There is no reason for modern to be another "haves" versus "have nots" format.
Rules Advisor: 9/5/11
Old, sparsely updated because of above: Trade with me!
Weirdly, standard has been BAD since JTMS was banned, it hasn't been fun, nor healthy since.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
And yet thats not one of the defining features of eternal formats, nor am I sure why you want it to be.
I don't want a reprint set so the cards will become cheaper, I want a reprint set because I like reprint sets. I want to be able to draft a "modern all stars" type set with my friends.
I think it would be fun.
If you put a card that sells for more than $40 in a precon that sells for $40 that would RAISE the price of the card?
What are you talking about? A card in a precon cannot possibly become more expensive than the precon itself. Your hypothetical situation would bring the price of goyf down to AT MOST $40.
Incorrect. If a Goyf is in a precon, how fast do you think that precon would sell out? Guess what, the precon is now on ebay reaching bids of $90-$100 just for the Goyf. The Goyfs will go up, as the demand for them would skyrocket. Supply and demand my good friend...supply and demand.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
What the threat of reprints does is prevent mass hoarding. It also allows a support mechanism if duals etc get to $50+ levels. They don't need to make sure every card is below $20.
a targeted reprint of the shocklands and tarmogoyf would already make modern probably the cheapest format out there.
I actually think if they reprint every card, modern will have a lot of issues. The people who invested in it now would all see their collections drop drastically. This is not how you sustain a format of a ccg - by disillusioning your most ardent fan base.
I suspect, the majority of the reprint whiners haven't even tried to make any modern decks. Choose one without goyf. See how much it costs you. it's probably around the same price for a standard deck.
Those bringing up the collector angle, how many formats do you wish to ruin? These are pieces of cardboard. Not gold or some precious metal.
Technically, no it is not. An eternal format encompasses all cards printed except the banned and/or restricted list of a format. Hence why Vintage and Legacy are both listed as etenal formats by Wotc and Modern is not.