So, this may not even be baseless speculation so much as it is wishful thinking, but is there any reason to hope that the Zendikar fetchlands will return in Origins? Or, do we have any idea what sort of dual lands will come forward in the set?
My reason for asking this is that I'm building a Temur Control deck, and it'd be awesome not to have to buy Polluted Delta for it.
Thanks for indulging my fantasies. I look forward to hearing your thoughts.
It is likely that there will be some sort of land cycle that taps for more than one color just because essentially every core set ever has come with a land cycle. Dragons of Tarkir also did not contain a land cycle so its unlikely that this two set rotation we are moving in wont include some sort of fixing lands in each pair of sets. Considering DTK didn't have one its likely that we will get something. The probability of a land cycle of some sort in origins is high just based on the precedent we have set across prior core sets.
That said, good decks tend to have more than one kind of fixing to them. Even if origins does come with some fix its also likely that you will want more than 4 lands that fix in your deck.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Why would anyone think the Zendikar fetches would return in Origins? The very next set is the return to Zendikar.... I just don't see the logic at all.
Anyways, my guess is for the ally pain lands since they pair with DtK better and haven't been reprinted in 8 years.
If I were to toss out a random guess on what lands might be reprinted, I would probably guess allied color Mirrodon 3 or less lands (Razorverge Thicket cycle).
I say that because the last core set added extra enemy colored lands to the format and so my thought is that they will balance the lands temporarily with an allied cycle of lands. As for why the morrodon 3 or less lands, its just a wild stab in the dark but scry lands are heavily favored towards control and slower midrange tactics so the 3 or less lands would be useful for some faster decks to have. Its a really random guess though to be honest. With probably getting the other half of fetchlands next block, doing a 5 land cycle will unbalance the lands one way or another moving forward.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
They should just print a cycle like this:
<some name for a R/G land>
Legendary Land T: Add R or G to your mana pool.
Some people have complained about this idea before, but here is my take on these lands.
1. They can't be fetched, so they have no effect on Vintage or Legacy.
2. They see some play in Modern, but not overwhelmingly since, again, they can't be fetched. They might replace filter/check lands here, but see #5.
3. They are good in Standard for their run.
4. I'm not even sure you'd want to play a full set of 4 since you risk drawing multiples in your opening hand and that's not a good thing.
5. Obviously desirable for EDH.
There almost has to be some sort of land cycle in Origins.
Now that the new Standard rotation cycle is ever closer to us, you have to look at what will be available when it finally happens.
When Battle for Zendikar hits, Theros Born of the Gods, Journey Into Nyx and M15 rotate out and the new Standard rotation starts.
- Khans of Tarkir and Fate Reforged will be considered "One Block"
- Dragons of Tarkir and Origins will be considered "One Block"
- With that said, you'll have fetches from KTK for the KTK/FRF block, some sort of 5 land cycle in Origins for the DTK/Ori block, and the presumed other fetchlands in the BFZ and whatever set that comes after that to complete that two set block.
Add them all up, and we'll have 15 dual lands to choose from at any one point in time regardless of what rotates out, my estimation. I think we'll see either fetches or the enemy manlands in the BFZ block, but not both.
I hope they print Legendary Dual Lands with no other drawback as a way to circumvent the Reserve List.
Seriously, just stuff like:
Karakas West
Legendary Plains Island
Tap: U or W
Urborg East
Legendary Swamp Island
Tap: U or B
That would be so awesome. More dual lands for Legacy players, and the set would sell like absolute hotcakes. You could put garbage in the set at every slot except those duals and it would still sell out like crazy.
That would be sweet if they made legendary dual lands, I am sure someone would hate this idea and say that they are too powerful for standard. If they printed these lands with fetch's standard might actually become a format that is not a giant turd sack. I still would not play the format because every other format is just more fun and better in every way.
Scry is evergreen now...anyone considering the possibility that they just reprint the 10 temples?
As much as I would absolutely love the reprinting of the Temples, I think we are due for some difficult to use mana fixing.
I think Pain lands are in the right area. Easy to use, but can cost you the game. I have been looking at the possible reprint cycles for awhile now and think the Odyssey cycle (Sungrass Prairie) would be a cool choice. They differ in flexibility from the Shadowmoor/Eventide filters (Cascade Bluffs/Fire-Lit Thicket) in a couple interesting ways. They are also $1-$3 each right now. But... Ugh , WotC will probably completely forget the Odyssey Lands and reprint the Shadowmoor/Eventide filters to keep the game simpler. And those are $10-$20 each.
I don't think WotC will even reprint any filter cycle in Origins anyway, it's just what I would like to see.
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The Legendary Dual lands that some people are talking about would not be very helpful on their own. They need fetch lands to matter because no one will want to play more than 1 in any deck. Esper Dragons for awhile talked about running 2 Urborg and it was a minor uproar for a page or something, it centered around what was essentially "you'll draw both and feel dumb". My interpretation of Dual lands is that they are to promote the use of multi colored decks in a thought provoking way (hence drawbacks). Legendary status doesn't really do that, it just makes for some feel bad when you draw a second copy. It makes people not want to include a second copy, then it's just one land in your deck. It makes little difference on its own.
However, I will concede that having fetch lands right now makes the "Plains/Island" et al matter in a big way. Additionally, these lands will hit all other formats as a one of because they are awesome fetch targets. I'm not up to code on Legacy decks, but Modern would auto replace a basic or shock with the corresponding one of these.
I assume that these will not be printed because of Fetch Lands. With them they are really powerful, and without them they are negligible.
When ~is to put in a graveyard from play add UG (or similar) to your mana pool
;-) If you want to have the Legendary aspect be interesting.
Since this is the last core set ever - I'm predicting some really amazing new dual lands to go out with a bang. I will be highly surprised if they aren't at least partial land types like:
~
Land - Forest (Tap: G to your mana pool)
Tap: add U to your mana pool, ~ deals 1 damage to you.
When ~is to put in a graveyard from play add UG (or similar) to your mana pool
;-) If you want to have the Legendary aspect be interesting.
Since this is the last core set ever - I'm predicting some really amazing new dual lands to go out with a bang. I will be highly surprised if they aren't at least partial land types like:
~
Land - Forest (Tap: G to your mana pool)
Tap: add U to your mana pool, ~ deals 1 damage to you.
That first example would be really cool with Crucible of Worlds *wishful thinking*
They should just print a cycle like this:
<some name for a R/G land>
Legendary Land T: Add R or G to your mana pool.
Some people have complained about this idea before, but here is my take on these lands.
1. They can't be fetched, so they have no effect on Vintage or Legacy.
2. They see some play in Modern, but not overwhelmingly since, again, they can't be fetched. They might replace filter/check lands here, but see #5.
3. They are good in Standard for their run.
4. I'm not even sure you'd want to play a full set of 4 since you risk drawing multiples in your opening hand and that's not a good thing.
5. Obviously desirable for EDH.
I absolutely deplore the idea of dual lands that are legendary for no reason other than to be cheap ABURland imitations for Modern. How do you make a land that literally does nothing more than a Coastal Tower and yet is somehow noteworthy? And if you wouldn't want to run 4 copies of a Dual in any format where it is legal to do so, it probably isn't a good choice for a mana base in that format, which runs completely contradictory to the purpose of a dual in the first place.
Legendary lands need to do something that feels legendary. Have them turn into creatures, tutor up specific cards, do something that makes them stand out from the crowd. Guild homes from Ravnica would be a good choice for legendary duals; they not only tap for either of their guild's colors, they do something big and important for their guild.
At any rate, if any format would be a proper place for legendary duals, it would probably be in a commander product.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I think that ability would be worded as "As long as you control 4 Plains and 4 Islands, ~ is a 4/4 Bird creature with flying and first strike." Which honestly doesn't look quite as good as regular temporary manlands since they're better at dodging removal, plus temporary manlands are less confusing. Manlands are probably one of the better ways to do legendary lands.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
My reason for asking this is that I'm building a Temur Control deck, and it'd be awesome not to have to buy Polluted Delta for it.
Thanks for indulging my fantasies. I look forward to hearing your thoughts.
That said, good decks tend to have more than one kind of fixing to them. Even if origins does come with some fix its also likely that you will want more than 4 lands that fix in your deck.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Anyways, my guess is for the ally pain lands since they pair with DtK better and haven't been reprinted in 8 years.
I say that because the last core set added extra enemy colored lands to the format and so my thought is that they will balance the lands temporarily with an allied cycle of lands. As for why the morrodon 3 or less lands, its just a wild stab in the dark but scry lands are heavily favored towards control and slower midrange tactics so the 3 or less lands would be useful for some faster decks to have. Its a really random guess though to be honest. With probably getting the other half of fetchlands next block, doing a 5 land cycle will unbalance the lands one way or another moving forward.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
<some name for a R/G land>
Legendary Land
T: Add R or G to your mana pool.
Some people have complained about this idea before, but here is my take on these lands.
1. They can't be fetched, so they have no effect on Vintage or Legacy.
2. They see some play in Modern, but not overwhelmingly since, again, they can't be fetched. They might replace filter/check lands here, but see #5.
3. They are good in Standard for their run.
4. I'm not even sure you'd want to play a full set of 4 since you risk drawing multiples in your opening hand and that's not a good thing.
5. Obviously desirable for EDH.
Now that the new Standard rotation cycle is ever closer to us, you have to look at what will be available when it finally happens.
When Battle for Zendikar hits, Theros Born of the Gods, Journey Into Nyx and M15 rotate out and the new Standard rotation starts.
- Khans of Tarkir and Fate Reforged will be considered "One Block"
- Dragons of Tarkir and Origins will be considered "One Block"
- With that said, you'll have fetches from KTK for the KTK/FRF block, some sort of 5 land cycle in Origins for the DTK/Ori block, and the presumed other fetchlands in the BFZ and whatever set that comes after that to complete that two set block.
Add them all up, and we'll have 15 dual lands to choose from at any one point in time regardless of what rotates out, my estimation. I think we'll see either fetches or the enemy manlands in the BFZ block, but not both.
Seriously, just stuff like:
Karakas West
Legendary Plains Island
Tap: U or W
Urborg East
Legendary Swamp Island
Tap: U or B
That would be so awesome. More dual lands for Legacy players, and the set would sell like absolute hotcakes. You could put garbage in the set at every slot except those duals and it would still sell out like crazy.
As much as I would absolutely love the reprinting of the Temples, I think we are due for some difficult to use mana fixing.
I think Pain lands are in the right area. Easy to use, but can cost you the game. I have been looking at the possible reprint cycles for awhile now and think the Odyssey cycle (Sungrass Prairie) would be a cool choice. They differ in flexibility from the Shadowmoor/Eventide filters (Cascade Bluffs/Fire-Lit Thicket) in a couple interesting ways. They are also $1-$3 each right now. But... Ugh , WotC will probably completely forget the Odyssey Lands and reprint the Shadowmoor/Eventide filters to keep the game simpler. And those are $10-$20 each.
I don't think WotC will even reprint any filter cycle in Origins anyway, it's just what I would like to see.
______________
The Legendary Dual lands that some people are talking about would not be very helpful on their own. They need fetch lands to matter because no one will want to play more than 1 in any deck. Esper Dragons for awhile talked about running 2 Urborg and it was a minor uproar for a page or something, it centered around what was essentially "you'll draw both and feel dumb". My interpretation of Dual lands is that they are to promote the use of multi colored decks in a thought provoking way (hence drawbacks). Legendary status doesn't really do that, it just makes for some feel bad when you draw a second copy. It makes people not want to include a second copy, then it's just one land in your deck. It makes little difference on its own.
However, I will concede that having fetch lands right now makes the "Plains/Island" et al matter in a big way. Additionally, these lands will hit all other formats as a one of because they are awesome fetch targets. I'm not up to code on Legacy decks, but Modern would auto replace a basic or shock with the corresponding one of these.
I assume that these will not be printed because of Fetch Lands. With them they are really powerful, and without them they are negligible.
"Reveal a Dragon"
When ~is to put in a graveyard from play add UG (or similar) to your mana pool
;-) If you want to have the Legendary aspect be interesting.
Since this is the last core set ever - I'm predicting some really amazing new dual lands to go out with a bang. I will be highly surprised if they aren't at least partial land types like:
~
Land - Forest
(Tap: G to your mana pool)
Tap: add U to your mana pool, ~ deals 1 damage to you.
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
That first example would be really cool with Crucible of Worlds *wishful thinking*
This would be awesome with landfall and Life from the Loam.
Legendary lands need to do something that feels legendary. Have them turn into creatures, tutor up specific cards, do something that makes them stand out from the crowd. Guild homes from Ravnica would be a good choice for legendary duals; they not only tap for either of their guild's colors, they do something big and important for their guild.
At any rate, if any format would be a proper place for legendary duals, it would probably be in a commander product.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Isle of the Hawk's Nest
Legendary Land - Island Plains
Add or to your mana pool.
If you control 4 Islands and 4 Plains ~ becomes a 4/4 Bird creature with Flying and First Strike.
I don't think something like that would be op
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Suntouched Coasts
Legndary Land - Island
~ enters the battlefield tapped
Tap: Add one W to your mana pool.
2WU: ~ becomes a 3/3 elemental creature with vigilance until end of turn.