There'll probably be another fighting style mechanic (Bushido in Champions, Ninjutsu in Betrayers, Jujitsu for Saviours?). Usually the third set counteracts the themes of the previous two sets so we should expect something that gives the finger to spirits and arcane-based spells.
'buster
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
If you were paying attention Jedit I was referring to how the third set counteracts the consecutive flow of the block. Not the fighting style. There very well be a fighting style that counteracts spirits (like an anti-spirit motif...a pseudo-wicca-based style perhaps with magickal foundations?) Think about it.
'buster
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
I want to jump in this for a quick moment. Kamigawa also features Yamabushi, warriors skilled in fighting off the Kami. All Yamabushi related cards remove creatures from the game, thus counter-acting the Soulshift mechanic of the Kami's.
I want to jump in this for a quick moment. Kamigawa also features Yamabushi, warriors skilled in fighting off the Kami. All Yamabushi related cards remove creatures from the game, thus counter-acting the Soulshift mechanic of the Kami's.
Yeah but there's also a small handful of those cards spread out in two sets. So, in using that as a base, Saviours will be chalk-full of Yamabushi-style cards to help go more mainstream in Spirithate. But let's take a look at other sets for examples of what I'm talking about. Take Fifth Dawn for instance. Mirrodin and Darksteel didn't care what colours you played with. As long as you played artifacts, they didn't care really. But Fifth Dawn had cards that did care, and thus had effects that made you use all colours in order to use them. Since Mirrodin/Darksteel cared more for colourless, Fifth Dawn took it from the other end and made the colours matter, even though it had the same (roughly) number of artifacts in it.
I want to see more interaction with soulshift that actually makes it playable. Soulshift was a lame idea that could have gone much further than it does. Return to hand? Fshaw. If it saw the spirits go directly to play or reduce their costs to play them after they're returned to hand, that would have been waaaaaayyy better, and thus Soulshift would basically become the new Rebels. But I guess WotC saw that as a possible threat and made Soulshift the way it is now.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
But Fifth Dawn had cards that did care, and thus had effects that made you use all colours in order to use them. Since Mirrodin/Darksteel cared more for colourless, Fifth Dawn took it from the other end and made the colours matter, even though it had the same (roughly) number of artifacts in it.
By that logic then Scourge should have rewarded players for using cards with small casting costs. It didn't. It rewarded you for using large casting cost spells.
By that logic then Scourge should have rewarded players for using cards with small casting costs. It didn't. It rewarded you for using large casting cost spells.
Onslaught and Legions dealt with creatures that you could get around their bit costs by implementing an alternative cost (morph). the relative size of casting costs in those two sets were relatively small compared to those in Scourge. If you look closely, Scourge rewards players for actually PLAYING high-cmc cards by giving decent intrinsic rewards. Where Ons/Legi didn't really care about casting costs (because you had Morph to get around that, plus there were a lot of "small" casting costs [below 5]) as they seemed to worry about quantity than quality. If you had five elves, six goblins, and three slivers, yay...good for you :dance2:. But Scourge looked at that and said, "Bah, you pansies don't know power. Here's power! RARRRRGGGHHH! *summons a ****load of dragons" And there were plenty of spells to reward you for being able to have those giant-ass creatures/permanents out.
Apocalypse went with enemy colours over the allieds of Invasion and Planeshift. Odyssey and torment worried about getting cards into the graveyard. Judgement tried to get them OUT of the graveyard (opposite of threshold). See what I'm getting at?
It seems to me like Betrayers had a lot of cards that mess with your opponent, whether it be some kind of hate or tapping creatures or bouncing or discard, etc. Basically, betrayers seems to reward aggresive play. (for example, Ninjas) Perhaps Saviours is a set that encourages a more defensive style of play with cards that protect your side of the board?
Sorry, forgot: With what Flamebuster's getting at, I think he may be right :The third set usually contradicts what the Majority of cards in the first and second sets did.
We should get rebels back. tecknically, the humans are rebelling.
OR is it the Kami? Creature-Rebel Spirit fighting for the humans?
+X/+X where X is the number of humans you comtrol?
So far the "theme" tends to be centric around that of the spirits (heavy-based in both sets so far), and legendary/arcane stuff. I'd expect something to hose people for playing spirit/arcane spells. Spiritbane as opposed to Spiritcraft.
(shrug) I dunno. I'll just stand over there and do a jig. :dance2::dance2:
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
More or less, but along those lines. Maybe direct graveyard removal a la Planar Void? Or less emphasis on spirits and more on "mortal" creature types. I'm assuming the Saviours part indicates that the Kamis are "receding" and therefore no longer pose a threat because something/one was able to subside their threats.
wheee *still doing a jig* :dance2:
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
Lets see, cards for Betrayers...well, here's my thought for Terashi
Terashi, Radiance of the Sun - 4WWW
Legendary Creature - Spirit
Flying, Protection from all colours.
Whenever you play a spirit or arcane spell, you may search your library for any card with terashi in its name and play it without playing its mana cost, shuffle your library.
4/4
Choryo, The Flowing River - 1UU
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Tap: Return target creature to its owners hand.
0/2
Michiko, Herald of Unity - 2WW
Legendary Creature - Human
Prevent all damage dealt to and by Michiko.
Whenever a spirit is destroyed, search your graveyard for a non spirit and put it into your hand.
Whenever a non spirit is destroyed, Search your graveyard for a spirit and put it into your hand.
Choryo, The Flowing River - 1UU
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Tap: Return target creature to its owners hand.
0/2
sorry to interrupt but.. if you want to see choryu you better start clasifying him as a "spirit" (or an artifact? lol) and not exactly legendary
btw.. i think.. no matter how much i hate the idea.. that wizards will leave without cards creatures like moshi.. the all consuming oni of chaos.. and terashii.. just cause wizards always ruins the fun
not to mention smaller characters like pearl ear or sharp ear..
or maybe they'll print only one of them.. cause
Cok: konda & takeno
Bok: toshi & hidetsugu
Sok: Michiko & perhaps either mochi or pearl ear cause are the closest to her story wise.. one her tutor the other "needs" her
or maybe a second O-kagachi spell or the new Takeno??
(the second O-kagachi spell i say is regarding the effect of the great old serpent after the battle in eiganjo)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"It is just that we should be grateful, not only to those with whose views we may agree, but also to those who have expressed more superficial views; for these also contributed something, by developing before us the powers of thought." ~Aristotle
-somehow depict the ghost soldiers (the descriptions remind me plenty of scourge's daru soldiers)
-they show at least terashii (it's a long shot but i keep my hopes somewhat high) or mochi.. cause they're leaving out many other stronger ones like the all consuming oni of chaos and the great old serpent..
if they succeed in the second part.. making them useful and not weaklings or ridiculously overpriced.. i'll be happy regardless the quality of everything else on the set
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"It is just that we should be grateful, not only to those with whose views we may agree, but also to those who have expressed more superficial views; for these also contributed something, by developing before us the powers of thought." ~Aristotle
Although I would like to see some more monks and such I have a feeling it wont be anything new. I think the title like Betrayers, seems more to fit the story and the book. If you read the book you can see what I mean.
Color-changing flippers.........seems like a good idea.
I haven't read either one of the books, so I'm only basing this off of the sets.
With a good number the cards in the block feature removing cards from the library from the game, is it possible that we could get a reprint of Jester's Cap with a different name?
The other thing I've noticed is that in both sets we have gotten a older global-effect artifact on a creature....
Horn of Greed-guy
:2mana::symg::symg:
Legendary Creature - Human Monk
2/3
Whenever a player plays a land, they may draw a card.
-or-
Crumbling Sanctuary-with legs
:4mana::symu::symu:
Legendary Creature - Spirit
3/4
For each 1 damage that would be dealt to a player, that player removes the top card of their library from the game instead.
.....or if Wizards had some cojones they could reprint Ivory Tower, Black Vise, or Zuran Orb on a stick instead. I know I'm dreaming there, but still it doesn't hurt to hope.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Former Member but Friend 4Ever of the Random Bull***** Society
Former Chairman of Iron Chef Salvation
They seem to be taking "basic" artifacts and converting them to creatures. By basic I mean artifacts found in Alpha/Beta/Unlimited. What they may do next is use Dingus Egg (they are on a land theme here it seems) and put a set of appendages underneath it and call it a day.
YEhaw.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
flamebuster: I thought about Dingus Egg, but I didn't think they would have that particular effect twice in Standard as the egg still appears in the base set.....but you may be right. I didn't see the land thing.
SIDE NOTE: I know it won't happen, but the return of Shadow would be sweeeeeeeet. Come on, it would be perfect for Saviors Ninjas or why not.......Spirits?
What I think is hilarious is that Skullcage from 5D is totally the inverse of both Black Vise and The Rack. I'm sure a lot of you also caught that, but seen as how they're part of the discussion I felt I'd bring it up......
I'm not so certain they'd give Dingus Egg the breath of life seen as how it's still around and well in 8th. So far the trend has been that Old-Timey artifacts that haven't seen the light of day since Alpha/Beta/Revised are getting appendages. Well, at least some life, I can't see Hokori with legs or arms.....
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Waiting patiently for MTGO Leagues to become a priority again. It's been 4 years :sick:.
Drop by my Helpdesk if you have any questions/concerns on the Limited forum.
Excited for M13 Limited? What do you think the format will look like? Head over to the limited forum and let us know what you think.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
Yeah but there's also a small handful of those cards spread out in two sets. So, in using that as a base, Saviours will be chalk-full of Yamabushi-style cards to help go more mainstream in Spirithate. But let's take a look at other sets for examples of what I'm talking about. Take Fifth Dawn for instance. Mirrodin and Darksteel didn't care what colours you played with. As long as you played artifacts, they didn't care really. But Fifth Dawn had cards that did care, and thus had effects that made you use all colours in order to use them. Since Mirrodin/Darksteel cared more for colourless, Fifth Dawn took it from the other end and made the colours matter, even though it had the same (roughly) number of artifacts in it.
I want to see more interaction with soulshift that actually makes it playable. Soulshift was a lame idea that could have gone much further than it does. Return to hand? Fshaw. If it saw the spirits go directly to play or reduce their costs to play them after they're returned to hand, that would have been waaaaaayyy better, and thus Soulshift would basically become the new Rebels. But I guess WotC saw that as a possible threat and made Soulshift the way it is now.
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
By that logic then Scourge should have rewarded players for using cards with small casting costs. It didn't. It rewarded you for using large casting cost spells.
Onslaught and Legions dealt with creatures that you could get around their bit costs by implementing an alternative cost (morph). the relative size of casting costs in those two sets were relatively small compared to those in Scourge. If you look closely, Scourge rewards players for actually PLAYING high-cmc cards by giving decent intrinsic rewards. Where Ons/Legi didn't really care about casting costs (because you had Morph to get around that, plus there were a lot of "small" casting costs [below 5]) as they seemed to worry about quantity than quality. If you had five elves, six goblins, and three slivers, yay...good for you :dance2:. But Scourge looked at that and said, "Bah, you pansies don't know power. Here's power! RARRRRGGGHHH! *summons a ****load of dragons" And there were plenty of spells to reward you for being able to have those giant-ass creatures/permanents out.
Apocalypse went with enemy colours over the allieds of Invasion and Planeshift. Odyssey and torment worried about getting cards into the graveyard. Judgement tried to get them OUT of the graveyard (opposite of threshold). See what I'm getting at?
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
I guess maybe they won't try to go against themes. As said, a flavor block is harder to counteract than a mechanic block. Horay for flavor blocks!
Yodafan: Official pro of one of Magic’s most casual formats.
OR is it the Kami? Creature-Rebel Spirit fighting for the humans?
+X/+X where X is the number of humans you comtrol?
by Rugjunkie
Current decks: type 2 mill-a-tron
(shrug) I dunno. I'll just stand over there and do a jig. :dance2::dance2:
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
wheee *still doing a jig* :dance2:
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
Terashi, Radiance of the Sun - 4WWW
Legendary Creature - Spirit
Flying, Protection from all colours.
Whenever you play a spirit or arcane spell, you may search your library for any card with terashi in its name and play it without playing its mana cost, shuffle your library.
4/4
Choryo, The Flowing River - 1UU
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Tap: Return target creature to its owners hand.
0/2
Michiko, Herald of Unity - 2WW
Legendary Creature - Human
Prevent all damage dealt to and by Michiko.
Whenever a spirit is destroyed, search your graveyard for a non spirit and put it into your hand.
Whenever a non spirit is destroyed, Search your graveyard for a spirit and put it into your hand.
0/2
Well, thats a lil speculation I guess...
sorry to interrupt but.. if you want to see choryu you better start clasifying him as a "spirit" (or an artifact? lol) and not exactly legendary
btw.. i think.. no matter how much i hate the idea.. that wizards will leave without cards creatures like moshi.. the all consuming oni of chaos.. and terashii.. just cause wizards always ruins the fun
not to mention smaller characters like pearl ear or sharp ear..
or maybe they'll print only one of them.. cause
Cok: konda & takeno
Bok: toshi & hidetsugu
Sok: Michiko & perhaps either mochi or pearl ear cause are the closest to her story wise.. one her tutor the other "needs" her
or maybe a second O-kagachi spell or the new Takeno??
(the second O-kagachi spell i say is regarding the effect of the great old serpent after the battle in eiganjo)
~Aristotle
-somehow depict the ghost soldiers (the descriptions remind me plenty of scourge's daru soldiers)
-they show at least terashii (it's a long shot but i keep my hopes somewhat high) or mochi.. cause they're leaving out many other stronger ones like the all consuming oni of chaos and the great old serpent..
if they succeed in the second part.. making them useful and not weaklings or ridiculously overpriced.. i'll be happy regardless the quality of everything else on the set
~Aristotle
I haven't read either one of the books, so I'm only basing this off of the sets.
With a good number the cards in the block feature removing cards from the library from the game, is it possible that we could get a reprint of Jester's Cap with a different name?
The other thing I've noticed is that in both sets we have gotten a older global-effect artifact on a creature....
Champions gave us Ankh of Mishra on Zo-Zu the Punisher
Betrayers gave us Winter Orb on Hokori, Dust Drinker
How sweet would it be if Saviors gave us Horn of Greed on a stick, or maybe Crumbling Sanctuary?
Horn of Greed-guy
:2mana::symg::symg:
Legendary Creature - Human Monk
2/3
Whenever a player plays a land, they may draw a card.
-or-
Crumbling Sanctuary-with legs
:4mana::symu::symu:
Legendary Creature - Spirit
3/4
For each 1 damage that would be dealt to a player, that player removes the top card of their library from the game instead.
.....or if Wizards had some cojones they could reprint Ivory Tower, Black Vise, or Zuran Orb on a stick instead. I know I'm dreaming there, but still it doesn't hurt to hope.
Former Member but Friend 4Ever of the Random Bull***** Society
Former Chairman of Iron Chef Salvation
YEhaw.
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
flamebuster: I thought about Dingus Egg, but I didn't think they would have that particular effect twice in Standard as the egg still appears in the base set.....but you may be right. I didn't see the land thing.
SIDE NOTE: I know it won't happen, but the return of Shadow would be sweeeeeeeet. Come on, it would be perfect for Saviors Ninjas or why not.......Spirits?
Former Member but Friend 4Ever of the Random Bull***** Society
Former Chairman of Iron Chef Salvation
I'm not so certain they'd give Dingus Egg the breath of life seen as how it's still around and well in 8th. So far the trend has been that Old-Timey artifacts that haven't seen the light of day since Alpha/Beta/Revised are getting appendages. Well, at least some life, I can't see Hokori with legs or arms.....
Drop by my Helpdesk if you have any questions/concerns on the Limited forum.
Excited for M13 Limited? What do you think the format will look like? Head over to the limited forum and let us know what you think.