(Color identity is an issue of commander and not a feature anymore, as basically all cards are better just for having more color identities, and its an artificial drawback on cards to not have extra colors, so it will forever be an issue with that rule in place. Much simpler, remove the color identity requirement and simply imply that players opt for a flavor, so the vampire deck has actual vampires and themes in it, as its much more about the tribal aspect than its color requirements)
Flavor only? There are a lot of decks built on mechanics that would disappear if we go "flavor only." Ever played against Kangee flying deck?
(Color identity is an issue of commander and not a feature anymore, as basically all cards are better just for having more color identities, and its an artificial drawback on cards to not have extra colors, so it will forever be an issue with that rule in place. Much simpler, remove the color identity requirement and simply imply that players opt for a flavor, so the vampire deck has actual vampires and themes in it, as its much more about the tribal aspect than its color requirements)
This is a stupid idea, color identity is one of the defining features of the format and not every commander play is a flavor person.
Instead of putting the card in the "draft" set, theres room in Set-Boosters for them to put all the Non-Limited cards in.
And if its specifically done for Commander, well, there are Commander products of each set, so put them there.
Plenty of options that would be fine and make basically anybody happy.
Already showed you an example were this didn't work.
Weirdly they made a good choice with Lynde, i think that many people were happy with her. But for the rest of the sets they seems scared to put actual commander cards in the commander slots and play extra safe.
Midnight Hunt was the first set to do this though, unless your talking about pre-cons?
It is weird that maro, the "resriction breeds creativity" guy, doesn't understand color identity and that wotc pushed so many 5c legends recently.
Pretty sure that was Gavin, he talked on how they wanted to have 5 color commanders that you didn't need WUBRG to play both for commander and so they could be playable in non-commander formats.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Pretty sure that was Gavin, he talked on how they wanted to have 5 color commanders that you didn't need WUBRG to play both for commander and so they could be playable in non-commander formats.
Nice to know that even the most commandery wotc employee can fail this bad, but maro too has problems with color identity, mainly related to how it works for hybrid cards.
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
Nice to know that even the most commandery wotc employee can fail this bad, but maro too has problems with color identity, mainly related to how it works for hybrid cards.
That hybrid cards should work in either or deck like other magic formats? Thats hardly something that just Maro and not sure why you even are bringing it up?
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
That hybrid cards should work in either or deck like other magic formats? Thats hardly something that just Maro and not sure why you even are bringing it up?
It's an "issue" that maro brings up often talking about commander and color identity
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
Pretty sure that was Gavin, he talked on how they wanted to have 5 color commanders that you didn't need WUBRG to play both for commander and so they could be playable in non-commander formats.
Nice to know that even the most commandery wotc employee can fail this bad, but maro too has problems with color identity, mainly related to how it works for hybrid cards.
What does this have to do with not understanding the format? Maro knows how hybrid works in commander and disagrees with the rule.
The way hybrid is treated in commander is a legacy from the fact that the colour identity rule predates hybrid cards, so when hybrid cards rolled around people didn't want to make an exception to such a fundamental rule for only a handful of cards featuring a mechanic nobody knew we would see again. That, plus people don't understand what hybrid is supposed to be. You see a ton of custom hybrid cards in custom card creation forums that are multi-colour cards with hybrid costs.
If you say Maro doesn't understand the commander format because of his opinions on hybrid, then to me it sounds more like you don't understand hybrid.
What does this have to do with not understanding the format? Maro knows how hybrid works in commander and disagrees with the rule.
If you say Maro doesn't understand the commander format because of his opinions on hybrid, then to me it sounds more like you don't understand hybrid.
Wow you sound so smart. Please tell me an actual "solution" for hybrid cards in commander. I bet it's gonna have ton of other (way worse and way bigger) consequences on deckbuilding. Like maro's proposals were.
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
What does this have to do with not understanding the format? Maro knows how hybrid works in commander and disagrees with the rule.
If you say Maro doesn't understand the commander format because of his opinions on hybrid, then to me it sounds more like you don't understand hybrid.
Wow you sound so smart. Please tell me an actual "solution" for hybrid cards in commander. I bet it's gonna have ton of other (way worse and way bigger) consequences on deckbuilding. Like maro's proposals were.
I get the feeling you're jsut gonna block off every suggestion no matter what it is because you already fundamentally disagree with the fact that hybrid is not functioning as intended in commander, but here we go:
My (in my opinion) least intrusive way to do it* would be to give hybrid mana symbols two possible states: One for each colour (and maybe a third for both, if we want to get super technical, because otherwise this would be weird for hybrid commanders but whatever)
So, each of Evershrike's mana symbols could count as either white or black (or white-black), meaning it has a colour identity of either white, black or white-black and as such can be played in any deck with a partial colour identity of white, black or white-black.
Flame Javelin would have a colour identity of either red or colourless.
Warden of the First Tree has a colour ideneity of either green-white, green-black or green-white-black.
Gruul Guildmage has a colour identity of multicolour red-green, because the activated abilities use "locked in" mana symbols.
Sounds relatively simple to me rules-wise without any edge-cases I could think off the top of my head. The only argument against this would be that it's not super-easy to explain to new players, but to be honest that's a problem with hybrid in general, not this specific rule. And this is not in itself an invalid argument, mind you, but I am of the opinion that the disadvantages of learning the rule outweigh the benefit it brings, so this is indeed a space where we can disagree on, but not that the rule "wouldn't work".
*Personally I'd rework how colour identity and restriction works in general, but commander players already refuse to play a mechanic as designed, so baby steps I suppose.
*Personally I'd rework how colour identity and restriction works in general, but commander players already refuse to play a mechanic as designed, so baby steps I suppose.
But why? First you propose a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way, then you say "nah, i'd rather screw over the whole rule if i could". It kinda shows that you have no idea about the consequences of your actions.
Exactly like maro did when he proposed the abolition of commander color identity back in one of his old articles.
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
*Personally I'd rework how colour identity and restriction works in general, but commander players already refuse to play a mechanic as designed, so baby steps I suppose.
But why? First you propose a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way, then you say "nah, i'd rather screw over the whole rule if i could". It kinda shows that you have no idea about the consequences of your actions.
Exactly like maro did when he proposed the abolition of commander color identity back in one of his old articles.
I said "rework" not "get rid of".
But that's besides the point. I'm taking your "you proposed a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way" and run with it.
But that's besides the point. I'm taking your "you proposed a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way" and run with it.
I still personally think that giving every white deck access to privileged position won't make the format better, but your suggestion was surely better than others i have seen.
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
We need a supportive Sultai (or Simic) sea monster general at this point. Releasing more 7 and 8 drop sea monsters is just causing them to compete with each other for room in the commander deck. We have some great 5, 6, 7, 8 and yes, even 10 and 12 mana options. It’s time now for smaller members and a competent general.
We need a supportive Sultai (or Simic) sea monster general at this point. Releasing more 7 and 8 drop sea monsters is just causing them to compete with each other for room in the commander deck. We have some great 5, 6, 7, 8 and yes, even 10 and 12 mana options. It’s time now for smaller members and a competent general.
Benthraxuss, Kraken Progeny UG
Legendary Creature -- Kraken
Serpents, Krakens, Whales, whatever that list is again spells can't be countered
We need a supportive Sultai (or Simic) sea monster general at this point. Releasing more 7 and 8 drop sea monsters is just causing them to compete with each other for room in the commander deck. We have some great 5, 6, 7, 8 and yes, even 10 and 12 mana options. It’s time now for smaller members and a competent general.
I thought random utility and ramp spells consisted the lower end of the sea monsters curve.
Sounds relatively simple to me rules-wise without any edge-cases I could think off the top of my head. The only argument against this would be that it's not super-easy to explain to new players
The real counter-argument is that it breaks the color's aestethic. EDH is first and foremost an aesthetic format. Why we must have exactly 100 cards in the deck and we're not allowed to have 101 or 112 or 150? Not because of balance or power level concern obviously since the more cards a deck has, the weaker and inconsistent is typically. it's simply because of aesthetics. The same aesthetic that manifest with elegance/simplicity that made RC to get rid of the "banned as commander" rule. The same aesthetic that allow Urborg to be played in all decks but not Noble Hierarch in all decks with green, because even if it tap for black mana, there are no physically black symbols that you see on the card. A format that cares of what players physically see on the cards, it's a format based on aesthetic. So the restrictions of the format are fundamentally aesthetic based and if you break them, you break and betray the spirit of the format.
We need a supportive Sultai (or Simic) sea monster general at this point. Releasing more 7 and 8 drop sea monsters is just causing them to compete with each other for room in the commander deck. We have some great 5, 6, 7, 8 and yes, even 10 and 12 mana options. It’s time now for smaller members and a competent general.
Benthraxuss, Kraken Progeny UG
Legendary Creature -- Kraken
Serpents, Krakens, Whales, whatever that list is again spells can't be countered
Stop Emailing Us - WOTC
0/4
That's some great flavour text
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This is a stupid idea, color identity is one of the defining features of the format and not every commander play is a flavor person.
Midnight Hunt was the first set to do this though, unless your talking about pre-cons?
Pretty sure that was Gavin, he talked on how they wanted to have 5 color commanders that you didn't need WUBRG to play both for commander and so they could be playable in non-commander formats.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Yeah mainly talking about precons. Full of safe and boring cards.
Nice to know that even the most commandery wotc employee can fail this bad, but maro too has problems with color identity, mainly related to how it works for hybrid cards.
That hybrid cards should work in either or deck like other magic formats? Thats hardly something that just Maro and not sure why you even are bringing it up?
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
It's an "issue" that maro brings up often talking about commander and color identity
What does this have to do with not understanding the format? Maro knows how hybrid works in commander and disagrees with the rule.
The way hybrid is treated in commander is a legacy from the fact that the colour identity rule predates hybrid cards, so when hybrid cards rolled around people didn't want to make an exception to such a fundamental rule for only a handful of cards featuring a mechanic nobody knew we would see again. That, plus people don't understand what hybrid is supposed to be. You see a ton of custom hybrid cards in custom card creation forums that are multi-colour cards with hybrid costs.
If you say Maro doesn't understand the commander format because of his opinions on hybrid, then to me it sounds more like you don't understand hybrid.
Wow you sound so smart. Please tell me an actual "solution" for hybrid cards in commander. I bet it's gonna have ton of other (way worse and way bigger) consequences on deckbuilding. Like maro's proposals were.
I get the feeling you're jsut gonna block off every suggestion no matter what it is because you already fundamentally disagree with the fact that hybrid is not functioning as intended in commander, but here we go:
My (in my opinion) least intrusive way to do it* would be to give hybrid mana symbols two possible states: One for each colour (and maybe a third for both, if we want to get super technical, because otherwise this would be weird for hybrid commanders but whatever)
So, each of Evershrike's mana symbols could count as either white or black (or white-black), meaning it has a colour identity of either white, black or white-black and as such can be played in any deck with a partial colour identity of white, black or white-black.
Flame Javelin would have a colour identity of either red or colourless.
Warden of the First Tree has a colour ideneity of either green-white, green-black or green-white-black.
Gruul Guildmage has a colour identity of multicolour red-green, because the activated abilities use "locked in" mana symbols.
Sounds relatively simple to me rules-wise without any edge-cases I could think off the top of my head. The only argument against this would be that it's not super-easy to explain to new players, but to be honest that's a problem with hybrid in general, not this specific rule. And this is not in itself an invalid argument, mind you, but I am of the opinion that the disadvantages of learning the rule outweigh the benefit it brings, so this is indeed a space where we can disagree on, but not that the rule "wouldn't work".
*Personally I'd rework how colour identity and restriction works in general, but commander players already refuse to play a mechanic as designed, so baby steps I suppose.
But why? First you propose a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way, then you say "nah, i'd rather screw over the whole rule if i could". It kinda shows that you have no idea about the consequences of your actions.
Exactly like maro did when he proposed the abolition of commander color identity back in one of his old articles.
I said "rework" not "get rid of".
But that's besides the point. I'm taking your "you proposed a simple solution that could probably work in a satisfying way" and run with it.
Hey, PHRASING!
I still personally think that giving every white deck access to privileged position won't make the format better, but your suggestion was surely better than others i have seen.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
Benthraxuss, Kraken Progeny UG
Legendary Creature -- Kraken
Serpents, Krakens, Whales, whatever that list is again spells can't be countered
Stop Emailing Us - WOTC
0/4
The real counter-argument is that it breaks the color's aestethic. EDH is first and foremost an aesthetic format. Why we must have exactly 100 cards in the deck and we're not allowed to have 101 or 112 or 150? Not because of balance or power level concern obviously since the more cards a deck has, the weaker and inconsistent is typically. it's simply because of aesthetics. The same aesthetic that manifest with elegance/simplicity that made RC to get rid of the "banned as commander" rule. The same aesthetic that allow Urborg to be played in all decks but not Noble Hierarch in all decks with green, because even if it tap for black mana, there are no physically black symbols that you see on the card. A format that cares of what players physically see on the cards, it's a format based on aesthetic. So the restrictions of the format are fundamentally aesthetic based and if you break them, you break and betray the spirit of the format.
That's some great flavour text