I was JUST coming here to pist this... That is one spicy piece of hate - for tron, for storm, for zero-cost stuff, for artifacts... Yeesh.
Doesn't actually stop storm, as the copies aren't cast. Is good against cascade though.
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
Yeah, i realized my possible error regarding storm right after hitting post, go me.
And its my understanding that a lot of tron lists do have the ability to produce colored mana, but its still another hoop to make them junp through along the way.
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
I think you are right which means this basically reads as "pay 1 more for Karn". So, sure, it slows Karn down by a turn but doesn't really slow down Ugin. Maybe it slows the deck down because they have to find colored mana? It still seems like it has the real potential to be a bust just like all the other Tron hate they have tried to print in the past.
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
I think you are right which means this basically reads as "pay 1 more for Karn". So, sure, it slows Karn down by a turn but doesn't really slow down Ugin. Maybe it slows the deck down because they have to find colored mana? It still seems like it has the real potential to be a bust just like all the other Tron hate they have tried to print in the past.
I feel like it wasn't printed specifically as tron hate so much as free spell hate, like for pitch spells and cascade, but it offers some splash hate against stuff like tron and some artifact strategies.
It notably hits the new evoke Unmask creature as well, and there's likely more power in that cycle that we haven't seen yet too.
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
I think you are right which means this basically reads as "pay 1 more for Karn". So, sure, it slows Karn down by a turn but doesn't really slow down Ugin. Maybe it slows the deck down because they have to find colored mana? It still seems like it has the real potential to be a bust just like all the other Tron hate they have tried to print in the past.
Eldrazi Tron has absolutely no maindeck ability to produce coloured mana. Oh man, now it hates a lot of decks' guts and curses every Karn, the Great Creator deck (ironically including the mirror - whoever Karns this with a board advantage wins).
it now just occurred to me that phyrexian mana and cascadeis hit too and Do i even need to mention it nutters force of will and fierce guardianship
i feel like one day i will ram into this with my Kozilek deck part of me is thrilled that mox opal is in the deck. but i need a source that turns my mana into having a colored source
How many Tron hate pieces have wee gotten over the past year and a half?
No kidding. Im wondering if they're eventually just going to bite the bullet and either ban Tron or start printing competitive land destruction again.
Tron's been getting so much hate over the past few years, and yet it's still here. It's the splash damage these cards keep causing that worry me. In this case, it's free spells (good, they need nerfing) and colorless decks (not good, especially for EDH, unless they're Vintage Shops. they deserve that).
Well this only makes green tron to wait 1 more turn soo they pay a green for big karn and others. Damping sphere looks way more scary as a counter to non eldrazi tron decks
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
I think you are right which means this basically reads as "pay 1 more for Karn". So, sure, it slows Karn down by a turn but doesn't really slow down Ugin. Maybe it slows the deck down because they have to find colored mana? It still seems like it has the real potential to be a bust just like all the other Tron hate they have tried to print in the past.
I feel like it wasn't printed specifically as tron hate so much as free spell hate, like for pitch spells and cascade, but it offers some splash hate against stuff like tron and some artifact strategies.
It notably hits the new evoke Unmask creature as well, and there's likely more power in that cycle that we haven't seen yet too.
It's probably not very good against specifically Grief though, given they will cast it before you get this down, and if it bothers them that much can just take it.
Void Mirror hates on a lot of stuff, but almost nothing thats relevant in modern.
Countering 0 mana spells and "free" spells is the name of the game.
It hates on quite a lot floating about Modern, the question is does it hose anything to warrant the sideboard slots. Eldrazi Tron gets absolutely hosed by this in its current configuration, but will just move towards more Cavern of Souls, Urborg, something if this starts appearing in sideboards. It's less good against Tron that tends to be able to produce coloured mana, and these tend to get covered by same sideboard slots. There's lots of random things this hits, things like Summoner's Pact, Bring to Light, but are any of them significant enough to warrant the sideboard slots as hate against those decks as it doesn't totally hose the decks those cards are in.
Also suspect this hoses a lot in the set. The evoke cycle get hit by it, even if it doesn't seem particularly great against Grief, the suspend cycle gets hit by it. There's meant to be Shardless Agent, and generally spells encouraging Cascade/As Foretold style decks, which this hoses.
Void Mirror is colorless, so any deck can use it. It is also an artifact, and there are many cards that can fetch artifacts. Either this card will have a home or become another bulk rare.
Tested some Modern Green Tron vs. Eldrazi Tron games, both with Void Mirror in the Karn, the Great Creator wishboard (Eldrazi Tron maindecks 1 Cavern of Souls and 1 Swamp). As expected, Green Tron generally recovered faster from the Void Mirror landing than Eldrazi Tron did, and Void Mirror was significantly more likely to lock Eldrazi Tron out.
With that being said, Green Tron being plausibly able to Karn-board Void Mirror is a bit of a yikes moment.
Void Mirror is the new CotV...finally, a good boost to Unspoiler decks in Vintage.
It is also a good countermeasure to Force of Will and other pitch cards.
Oh man... If Void Mirror kills Tron then I'm out of anything other than Commander. Honestly, don't want to sound like a pessimist, but I'll probably be out of magic for good if my favourite deck is killed.
This was exactly the kind of card I didn't want to see in this set. As if there isn't enough Tron hate out there. Artifact themed decks had a hard enough time as it was too.
Oh man... If Void Mirror kills Tron then I'm out of anything other than Commander. Honestly, don't want to sound like a pessimist, but I'll probably be out of magic for good if my favourite deck is killed.
This was exactly the kind of card I didn't want to see in this set. As if there isn't enough Tron hate out there. Artifact themed decks had a hard enough time as it was too.
Simply play more colored lands.
Nobody will play this card maindeck unless the metagame is completely insane ... and if in doubt this really just makes you 1 turn slower at max, if you need a colored land to completely bypass it with tron.
hard time to see how this "hard-counters" tron decks, unless you completely ignore its existence if its a known sideboard card they might bring in.
Funny call back to Bottle Gnomes a little better since you can make a temporary buff then sac it.
holy cow that is probably the Biggest tron hate to date even gives it to the 0 spells
This doesn't hate storm, though, right? The copies arent technically cast.
Doesn't actually stop storm, as the copies aren't cast. Is good against cascade though.
I wonder how good this will actually be against Urzatron. I'm not super up-to-date on lists, but don't most have ability to generate colored mana?
Yeah, i realized my possible error regarding storm right after hitting post, go me.
And its my understanding that a lot of tron lists do have the ability to produce colored mana, but its still another hoop to make them junp through along the way.
I feel like it wasn't printed specifically as tron hate so much as free spell hate, like for pitch spells and cascade, but it offers some splash hate against stuff like tron and some artifact strategies.
It notably hits the new evoke Unmask creature as well, and there's likely more power in that cycle that we haven't seen yet too.
Eldrazi Tron has absolutely no maindeck ability to produce coloured mana. Oh man, now it hates a lot of decks' guts and curses every Karn, the Great Creator deck (ironically including the mirror - whoever Karns this with a board advantage wins).
It's quite possible that it shifts to maindecking Talisman of Progress, a Swamp for otherwise no good reason, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth (and Cabal Coffers?) for otherwise no good reason, Caves of Koilos for otherwise no good reason, Letter of Acceptance, Indatha Crystal, or Prophetic Prism. Actually, with Urza's Saga backup, the Swamp, Caves of Koilos, or Urborg, ToY might be the cleanest solution.
...So now Green Tron goes hard-on mana denial mode to deny Eldrazi Tron any ability to use coloured mana. Yeah, Eldrazi Tron is screwed.
Ironically, Void Mirror does not play nice with Blood Moon.
No kidding. Im wondering if they're eventually just going to bite the bullet and either ban Tron or start printing competitive land destruction again.
it now just occurred to me that phyrexian mana and cascadeis hit too and Do i even need to mention it nutters force of will and fierce guardianship
i feel like one day i will ram into this with my Kozilek deck part of me is thrilled that mox opal is in the deck. but i need a source that turns my mana into having a colored source
and HOLY **** another way to do the next to impossible escape Knowledge Pool lock and even worse....Possibility Storm you just stasis the board with that same with Ritual of Subdual and pale moon
yep it trys to cast the cascaded spell without paying its mana thus no colored mana so countered
It's probably not very good against specifically Grief though, given they will cast it before you get this down, and if it bothers them that much can just take it.
Countering 0 mana spells and "free" spells is the name of the game.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
It hates on quite a lot floating about Modern, the question is does it hose anything to warrant the sideboard slots. Eldrazi Tron gets absolutely hosed by this in its current configuration, but will just move towards more Cavern of Souls, Urborg, something if this starts appearing in sideboards. It's less good against Tron that tends to be able to produce coloured mana, and these tend to get covered by same sideboard slots. There's lots of random things this hits, things like Summoner's Pact, Bring to Light, but are any of them significant enough to warrant the sideboard slots as hate against those decks as it doesn't totally hose the decks those cards are in.
Also suspect this hoses a lot in the set. The evoke cycle get hit by it, even if it doesn't seem particularly great against Grief, the suspend cycle gets hit by it. There's meant to be Shardless Agent, and generally spells encouraging Cascade/As Foretold style decks, which this hoses.
Void Mirror is colorless, so any deck can use it. It is also an artifact, and there are many cards that can fetch artifacts. Either this card will have a home or become another bulk rare.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
Shine on, you crazy diamond
With that being said, Green Tron being plausibly able to Karn-board Void Mirror is a bit of a yikes moment.
It is also a good countermeasure to Force of Will and other pitch cards.
==> a gem of this set.
This was exactly the kind of card I didn't want to see in this set. As if there isn't enough Tron hate out there. Artifact themed decks had a hard enough time as it was too.
Simply play more colored lands.
Nobody will play this card maindeck unless the metagame is completely insane ... and if in doubt this really just makes you 1 turn slower at max, if you need a colored land to completely bypass it with tron.
hard time to see how this "hard-counters" tron decks, unless you completely ignore its existence if its a known sideboard card they might bring in.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮