@ThyLordQ, yep, we've gotten some elf precons in the not too distant past, but it's been AGES since we had actual interesting elves in a plane. As I said in another thread, Ravnica and Kaladesh elves are pretty much the same and as boring as can be, while there are no elves in Ixalan, no elves in Amonkhet, no elves in Innistrad, no elves in Theros, barely any elves in Eldraine, no elves in Ikoria... I always roll my eyes when people say "elves AGAIN??? Ugh, we're so saturated of them!" If you actually were a fan of elves, you'd know the last time we got actual interesting elves was Lorwyn, 13 years ago.
While I understand the sentiment of your post, I do not feel that the gatekeeping language is helpful. I feel that the mindset of excluding others based on harmless opinions only breeds hostility.
I personally find the lore of the elves of Eldraine and Kaladesh intriguing, even if we did not see much of them mechanically.
I also feel it is a bit more understandable that the initial tribal antagonists of a tribe focused plane would receive more visibility and focus on and off cards than a plane with a different theme might.
But those are just my feelings. As I said at the beginning, I understand your feelings on the matter.
(And to clarify, I also understand that the "you" in the end of your post is rhetorical, I did not make this response in the belief I was being called out in some capacity.)
In reference to the actual decks, I wonder if there is going to be a distinction between Light Elves and Dark Elves. Could this plane give us a BGW legend for Elf Commander?
@ThyLordQ, yep, we've gotten some elf precons in the not too distant past, but it's been AGES since we had actual interesting elves in a plane. As I said in another thread, Ravnica and Kaladesh elves are pretty much the same and as boring as can be, while there are no elves in Ixalan, no elves in Amonkhet, no elves in Innistrad, no elves in Theros, barely any elves in Eldraine, no elves in Ikoria... I always roll my eyes when people say "elves AGAIN??? Ugh, we're so saturated of them!" If you actually were a fan of elves, you'd know the last time we got actual interesting elves was Lorwyn, 13 years ago.
While I understand the sentiment of your post, I do not feel that the gatekeeping language is helpful. I feel that the mindset of excluding others based on harmless opinions only breeds hostility.
I personally find the lore of the elves of Eldraine and Kaladesh intriguing, even if we did not see much of them mechanically.
I also feel it is a bit more understandable that the initial tribal antagonists of a tribe focused plane would receive more visibility and focus on and off cards than a plane with a different theme might.
But those are just my feelings. As I said at the beginning, I understand your feelings on the matter.
(And to clarify, I also understand that the "you" in the end of your post is rhetorical, I did not make this response in the belief I was being called out in some capacity.)
In reference to the actual decks, I wonder if there is going to be a distinction between Light Elves and Dark Elves. Could this plane give us a BGW legend for Elf Commander?
I sincerely apologize that I was hostile in that post. I do get fairly passionate when it comes to the pointy-eared, and the wonderful but wasted art on the Lathril box made me momentarily upset (though it still really disappoints me). And yes, as you suppose, I only @'d you to make a point based on your comment, but not really directed at you as much as whoever that opinion can be applied to. I don't spend enough time on here to think I know your actual opinion on fantasy races. With that said, and as much as I loved Eldraine mostly for the fairy tale flavor, I'm hyped for the fact that for the first time in ages we seem to be getting a new take on elves with some heavy tribal element. A true return to Lorwyn (or a remaster treatment as they seem to be doing with Time Spiral next year) is still top of my list for MTG wishes, though.
I think I've learned to treat Magic cards like baseball cards: keep 'em in a binder in numerical order, don't play with 'em, try to finish the set and just keep my head down.
I sincerely apologize that I was hostile in that post. I do get fairly passionate when it comes to the pointy-eared, and the wonderful but wasted art on the Lathril box made me momentarily upset (though it still really disappoints me). And yes, as you suppose, I only @'d you to make a point based on your comment, but not really directed at you as much as whoever that opinion can be applied to. I don't spend enough time on here to think I know your actual opinion on fantasy races. With that said, and as much as I loved Eldraine mostly for the fairy tale flavor, I'm hyped for the fact that for the first time in ages we seem to be getting a new take on elves with some heavy tribal element. A true return to Lorwyn (or a remaster treatment as they seem to be doing with Time Spiral next year) is still top of my list for MTG wishes, though.
I appreciate the apology, despite the hostility being general, rather than directed at any specific person. Thank you. Passion is a double-edged sword, and I believe we all understand that. And I do not really spend a lot of time on the forums either, so it is understandable. For what it is worth, I find fantasy races and their variants fascinating, and enjoy reading about them and the worlds they inhabit, even if sometimes the answer is "they are not much different from what you've seen before." Simply placing them in an interesting setting and seeing how that affects things is enough for me.
I too am hype about new elves with a tribal component. We got a nice snippet of it with Commander Legends, but I believe the main goal of that was to encourage people to purchase more Kaldheim when it was released.
On a similar topic, I realized in the midst of writing this that they might have made the elves blue to avoid any potential trouble with the perception of "Dark Elves," which seems like a good move, and has the bonus of making them appear different from the Drow that will no doubt show up in the Forgotten Realms set. (Additionally, it appears that the photos have been taken down from the website. Someone must be in trouble.)
I'm no expert but according to Wikipedia, Krampus is more of an Alpine thing, plus countries to the east and southeast of that. No mention of Scandinavia.
I grew up somewhat northwest of that area and never had any Krampus traditions in my life. We had Knecht Ruprecht.
I think Tibalt fits a Norse block well, especially if the metal theme is explored, due to the overtly Satanic nature of so much Nordic black metal.
Tibalt of the Dark Throne
That would probably make the association pretty clear! If the metal connection IS part of the idea behind including Tibalt (I'll note that similarity to Loki also seems like a possibility), references like that would be pretty interesting.
I have fond memories of being made fun of and then getting in a lot of trouble at school for playing this game on the basis of witchcraft and paganism. I'd be happy to see the modern heavy music aesthetic sneak in here and there. Strikes me as a nice callback, at least on a personal level.
And I'm lowkey excited for any outrage from the snowflake types. A black planeswalker *and* satanic imagery? oh man.
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I have fond memories of being made fun of and then getting in a lot of trouble at school for playing this game on the basis of witchcraft and paganism. I'd be happy to see the modern heavy music aesthetic sneak in here and there. Strikes me as a nice callback, at least on a personal level.
And I'm lowkey excited for any outrage from the snowflake types. A black planeswalker *and* satanic imagery? oh man.
You haven't lived until you experience shade playing with a pre-4th EditionUnholy Strength in a Catholic school's games club
'buster
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'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
I'm no expert but according to Wikipedia, Krampus is more of an Alpine thing, plus countries to the east and southeast of that. No mention of Scandinavia.
I grew up somewhat northwest of that area and never had any Krampus traditions in my life. We had Knecht Ruprecht.
This is correct but there is also a similar thing in Nordic countries. I know there is something similar to it in Scandinavian countries as well but in Finland, specifically, there is the idea of the 'nuuttipukki' which is a similarly fiendish creature with a connection to Santa. The movie 'Rare Exports' has some relevant concept art.
While I understand the sentiment of your post, I do not feel that the gatekeeping language is helpful. I feel that the mindset of excluding others based on harmless opinions only breeds hostility.
I personally find the lore of the elves of Eldraine and Kaladesh intriguing, even if we did not see much of them mechanically.
I also feel it is a bit more understandable that the initial tribal antagonists of a tribe focused plane would receive more visibility and focus on and off cards than a plane with a different theme might.
But those are just my feelings. As I said at the beginning, I understand your feelings on the matter.
(And to clarify, I also understand that the "you" in the end of your post is rhetorical, I did not make this response in the belief I was being called out in some capacity.)
In reference to the actual decks, I wonder if there is going to be a distinction between Light Elves and Dark Elves. Could this plane give us a BGW legend for Elf Commander?
As for why Tibalt, Krampus or Loki.
I sincerely apologize that I was hostile in that post. I do get fairly passionate when it comes to the pointy-eared, and the wonderful but wasted art on the Lathril box made me momentarily upset (though it still really disappoints me). And yes, as you suppose, I only @'d you to make a point based on your comment, but not really directed at you as much as whoever that opinion can be applied to. I don't spend enough time on here to think I know your actual opinion on fantasy races. With that said, and as much as I loved Eldraine mostly for the fairy tale flavor, I'm hyped for the fact that for the first time in ages we seem to be getting a new take on elves with some heavy tribal element. A true return to Lorwyn (or a remaster treatment as they seem to be doing with Time Spiral next year) is still top of my list for MTG wishes, though.
I appreciate the apology, despite the hostility being general, rather than directed at any specific person. Thank you. Passion is a double-edged sword, and I believe we all understand that. And I do not really spend a lot of time on the forums either, so it is understandable. For what it is worth, I find fantasy races and their variants fascinating, and enjoy reading about them and the worlds they inhabit, even if sometimes the answer is "they are not much different from what you've seen before." Simply placing them in an interesting setting and seeing how that affects things is enough for me.
I too am hype about new elves with a tribal component. We got a nice snippet of it with Commander Legends, but I believe the main goal of that was to encourage people to purchase more Kaldheim when it was released.
On a similar topic, I realized in the midst of writing this that they might have made the elves blue to avoid any potential trouble with the perception of "Dark Elves," which seems like a good move, and has the bonus of making them appear different from the Drow that will no doubt show up in the Forgotten Realms set. (Additionally, it appears that the photos have been taken down from the website. Someone must be in trouble.)
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
KRAMPUS !
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
I grew up somewhat northwest of that area and never had any Krampus traditions in my life. We had Knecht Ruprecht.
That would probably make the association pretty clear! If the metal connection IS part of the idea behind including Tibalt (I'll note that similarity to Loki also seems like a possibility), references like that would be pretty interesting.
And I'm lowkey excited for any outrage from the snowflake types. A black planeswalker *and* satanic imagery? oh man.
The only snowflakes I care about are those in mana symbols. This could be confirmation that Kaldheim is a snow-related set.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
You haven't lived until you experience shade playing with a pre-4th Edition Unholy Strength in a Catholic school's games club
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
This is correct but there is also a similar thing in Nordic countries. I know there is something similar to it in Scandinavian countries as well but in Finland, specifically, there is the idea of the 'nuuttipukki' which is a similarly fiendish creature with a connection to Santa. The movie 'Rare Exports' has some relevant concept art.
they better pray that wotc doesn’t sue them