People screeching about these being mechanically exclusive need to chill the **** out. They're terrible. Let people play with their terrible fan cards in whatever format they're deemed to be legal in. They're not hurting you. If they accidentally make one that's good we can talk but until then relax.
Well they kinda started that with the My Little Pony special set, so this ought to come as no surprise. I don't know what they plan on doing with this moving forward but honestly it feels very...out of place. I hope their adventures into more "traditional" fantasy in the coming year will correct it but I'm not holding out hope.
'buster
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'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset. Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
For once I'm on board with the naysayers. I don't like where this is going. So far neither of the cards revealed are busted (though the Michone triggers me a little by calling her zombie tokens Walker tokens), but I don't like that we're getting mechanically unique cards exclusive to Secret Lair drops that are going to be a pain to print anywhere else. As long as they're just jank I'm not too worried, but the box toppers were supposed to be sub-par and look how Nexus of Fate turned out.
I'm not too worried about the whole immersion thing. But yeah, not a fan of Secret Laid exclusives. And the whole "we'll print similar" isn't all that reassuring, since if a card is good enough to warrant printing a replacement, that just means the people who bought the Secret Lair are going to have twice as many of the good card. I suspect this Walking Dead set is going to be jank at best, but I don't like the precedent it sets.
Wow... they are really crossing a line here... people always used altered cards, so crossover versions of cards are not a problem (as was mentioned above, Zilortha was already pushing that quite a bit, but still kind of acceptable).
But when doing pure crossover cards without a regular version anywhere, those HAVE to be silver bordered...
This how I feel, having different "skins" for cards imo was the perfect way to this for black border.
That said Maro has said they are willing to "reprint" any cards in the Walking Dead lair with a actual magic art and name ect. Though I wish they had just done that to begin with.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
People screeching about these being mechanically exclusive need to chill the **** out. They're terrible. Let people play with their terrible fan cards in whatever format they're deemed to be legal in. They're not hurting you. If they accidentally make one that's good we can talk but until then relax.
No, you don't wait until something is obviously broken to fix it. You fix it the first moment is a problem. Unique cards sold in a limited time window is definitely a problem. If they keep doing them they will mess up and make one or more that are format defining. We don't want them to do this so we speak up now about what a problem this is.
This is why I was against the Godzilla promos and the Forgotten Realms set, even when people were like "well it's OK because they're just official alters basically" or "well it's OK because it's close enough to Magic." Because accepting those things leads to **** like this.
Looking forward to the Nike product placement cards in Battlebond 2.
Kinda waiting for the announcement for the end of the game announcement, where they end the game itself and admit that they have just spent 2019 and 2020 to cash out... lol. What the hell is even happening to this game?
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LEGACY|UWStonebladeCOMMANDER|UBGThe Mimeoplsm Ooze & Aghhs!MODERN|UWAzorius Control THE JUICE[BOX]³ CUBE
Is this the first time they defined creating a token like "Walker" without explicitly specifying its characteristics or did we already cross that Rubicon?
Okay, let me sum this up from a well rounded perspective.
-- Secret Lair = Cool Concept, but it's a money grab. If you love it, buy it. If not, then don't.
-- I've watched the walking dead up until after the first season where Neegan did his thing (and he was a great character) and then I lost interest because the creators of the show appeared to just be milking it instead of trying to make a concise show with an endgame.
-- These cards are really cool. I love the idea of a black green card containing both equipment synergy with zombies? This is kind of a weird, entirely new synergy that somehow fits with early Michone, and its cool. Neegan also provides some really cool options into a rather weird color combination; with ramp, artifacts, and sacrifice being at the helm, all beside some flavorful reasoning to boot.
-- Huge mistake (or win? For wotc?) for us players who fancy edh and want to play these commanders and have to pay big money for them because they are in a tiny print run due to being secret lair. This is obviously a cash grab, and although MaRo stated they could reprint these within the magic universe, I don't see this happening anytime soon and thus imagine it will drive the market insane.
TLDR; I love the concept of flavorful new cards and it's cool they did a crossover. The cards are well designed and balanced. I think its bad that they are limited in supply, and its going to drive people wild.
People screeching about these being mechanically exclusive need to chill the **** out. They're terrible. Let people play with their terrible fan cards in whatever format they're deemed to be legal in. They're not hurting you. If they accidentally make one that's good we can talk but until then relax.
No, you don't wait until something is obviously broken to fix it. You fix it the first moment is a problem. Unique cards sold in a limited time window is definitely a problem. If they keep doing them they will mess up and make one or more that are format defining. We don't want them to do this so we speak up now about what a problem this is.
Amazingly put. More players need to understand this.
This rapid decent into crossover territory makes me very nervous. What's next? Lets make some marvel/DC Magic Cards? You know, just for every last person that want's one and has enough disposable income for it. It's now or never baby!
Quarterly profits and cross-pollenating to expand our fan base are WAY more important than integrity and longer term cohesive gameplay, dammit!
Honestly I would be more into crossover's into actual real Earth the way Portal Three kingdoms did with historical legendries and historically mythic events - and I'm hugely skeptical of that!
I think it's super kitschy and it makes me worry about magics future. I mean if it was just one or two things I'd role with it more - but entire sets being crossovers? Even if its a DnD Crossover... It makes me anxious. I'm by no means totally against secret layer - but I think providing access to overpriced good, but niche, card reprints with unique art is more the way to go.
Ok, lets take a step back everybody, sure this is new and scary, but rather than freak out and cause a panic like every other new, scary thing, we should try and put it into perspective. So, we've had exclusive cards in a bunch of preconstructed products over the years. We've had commander decks, planechase decks, planeswalker decks,theme boosters,global series gift box, Game Night, buy a box promos, and now this. So, out of all those cards, how many have actually become a problem? Nexus of Fate and True Name Nemesis. That's 2 cards out of hundreds so over 99% of the cards have been fine. Most of those cards were standard legal including the Nexus problem. So, assuming they continue making merely interesting legendary cards like they've been doing and not take risks with combo potential or print something crazy like 3 mana Progenitus, why is this anything more than an entertaining side novelty that you can choose to buy/play if you're a big fan of the niche product? The cards aren't terrible, but they aren't even close to legacy/vintage playable other than technically you could put them into a deck and it would be a legal deck. I mean really, we're going to get 20+ commander legends in precon products every year anyway and have gotten a bunch every single year from 2013 on and we did in 2011. 2012 had the planechase decks which also had exclusive commanders and the buy a box promos were almost all legendary multicolor cards. Ponies the Galloping was limited edition and you can still get it for under $100 and the 3 cards can be had for far less than tons of commander staples. I think the constructive thing, rather than whine about it is to insist that Wizards not push the cards super hard. I don't think they are likely to, though.
For once I agree with the whiners. Pay $50 now or you can never have a Negan Commander deck? What kind of business model is that?
Y'all act like the secondary market doesn't exist. Chill.
With all the FOMO surrounding these and speculators gobbling these up until they realize how mediocre they are to play, I can almost guarantee six months out singles will be $10 a pop on TCGPlayer. Nalathni Dragon was much more limited and it's ~$6 market value.
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EDH/Commander
(W/U)(W/U)Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage: The New da Vinci (historic control)
(W/B)(W/B)Teysa Karlov: Death Be Not Kind (aristocrats)
(R/G)(R/G)Hallar, the Firefletcher: Yavimaya Burning (kicker and counters)
(B/G)(G/U)Sidisi, Brood Tyrant: Queen of the Damned (dredge)
Maybe Build
(W/U)(U/B)Aminatou, the Fateshifter: And a Child Shall Lead Them (superfriends)
Interesting that they use gendered pronouns for Michonne. I thought they only did that with planeswalkers?
I guess it's to add to the immersion. It would read kinda weird to refer to Michonne as "it" in the card text.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
I was fine with random Comic Con promos being from Hasbro, they are collectibles and not really playable.
I was fine with MLP showing up as a fun random who cares and understood they only came about from Hasbro owning them, at the very least proceeds went to charity, and they are not usually playable. Me liking it probably had something to do with it too.
I was fine with Godzilla stuff popping up as they were just fancy alternate versions of real cards, and fit the theme of the set.
Now though I am feeling like the dam is about to burst. The possibilities for these crossover Secret Lairs spiked with something like the Walking Dead. Strixhaven could easily have Harry Potter (I would buy this and burn it cause Harry Potter is terrible), Kaldheim with God of War, D&D Core with tons of references to whichever world they chose (I forgot) and so on. Now maybe it's just me not liking the Walking Dead, mostly because I find zombies boring and played out, but when you combine the annoyance of Secret Lair with the crap like this it gets on my nerves.
Is this the end of the Magic? No, and I'm sure there will be more of these, but I already don't like Secret Lairs and to make them worse annoys me further.
this cards are meant for collectors... not for pro players. Cool cards for collectors in my opionion
Do not defend this bullshit. Always hiding behind collectors. Collectors' cards can have silver border or double names. This is scam to steal money from commander players.
How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
We've had commander decks, planechase decks, planeswalker decks,theme boosters,global series gift box, Game Night, buy a box promos, and now this.
Every exclusive card in commander decks, planechase decks, planeswalker decks, theme boosters and whatever can be reprinted. These ones can't.
Do you understand now?
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
This is garbage, Negan has a magic card but characters from mtg lore like Gix and Commodore Guf don't (as of yet), this still wouldn't be acceptable if Negan and Michone were mtg characters though, unique cards in a secret lair is a big yikes
God only knows what they will do in 2021, secret lair power rangers,secret lair transformers,secret lair GI Joe, thanks i hate it
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then don't make them legal in any format. at all.
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Staff'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
I'm not too worried about the whole immersion thing. But yeah, not a fan of Secret Laid exclusives. And the whole "we'll print similar" isn't all that reassuring, since if a card is good enough to warrant printing a replacement, that just means the people who bought the Secret Lair are going to have twice as many of the good card. I suspect this Walking Dead set is going to be jank at best, but I don't like the precedent it sets.
This how I feel, having different "skins" for cards imo was the perfect way to this for black border.
That said Maro has said they are willing to "reprint" any cards in the Walking Dead lair with a actual magic art and name ect. Though I wish they had just done that to begin with.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Barf.
By every metric, even MTG.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
This is why I was against the Godzilla promos and the Forgotten Realms set, even when people were like "well it's OK because they're just official alters basically" or "well it's OK because it's close enough to Magic." Because accepting those things leads to **** like this.
Looking forward to the Nike product placement cards in Battlebond 2.
THE JUICE[BOX]³ CUBE
https://twitter.com/SheldonMenery/status/1310725509857370112?s=20
Sheldon and the RC committe Are listening to us, taking notes and weighing options Basicly they are discussing TWD cards
and they will have something to say and will definatly be before the secret lair drops
in other words This looks like a sign TWD cards will probably be considered silver bordered In commander format
i totally with lookingupanddown these should have Ben upcoming cards in commander legends so they Are just the Godzilla treatment
-- Secret Lair = Cool Concept, but it's a money grab. If you love it, buy it. If not, then don't.
-- I've watched the walking dead up until after the first season where Neegan did his thing (and he was a great character) and then I lost interest because the creators of the show appeared to just be milking it instead of trying to make a concise show with an endgame.
-- These cards are really cool. I love the idea of a black green card containing both equipment synergy with zombies? This is kind of a weird, entirely new synergy that somehow fits with early Michone, and its cool. Neegan also provides some really cool options into a rather weird color combination; with ramp, artifacts, and sacrifice being at the helm, all beside some flavorful reasoning to boot.
-- Huge mistake (or win? For wotc?) for us players who fancy edh and want to play these commanders and have to pay big money for them because they are in a tiny print run due to being secret lair. This is obviously a cash grab, and although MaRo stated they could reprint these within the magic universe, I don't see this happening anytime soon and thus imagine it will drive the market insane.
TLDR; I love the concept of flavorful new cards and it's cool they did a crossover. The cards are well designed and balanced. I think its bad that they are limited in supply, and its going to drive people wild.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
Amazingly put. More players need to understand this.
Quarterly profits and cross-pollenating to expand our fan base are WAY more important than integrity and longer term cohesive gameplay, dammit!
Honestly I would be more into crossover's into actual real Earth the way Portal Three kingdoms did with historical legendries and historically mythic events - and I'm hugely skeptical of that!
I think it's super kitschy and it makes me worry about magics future. I mean if it was just one or two things I'd role with it more - but entire sets being crossovers? Even if its a DnD Crossover... It makes me anxious. I'm by no means totally against secret layer - but I think providing access to overpriced good, but niche, card reprints with unique art is more the way to go.
Just my opinion.
Y'all act like the secondary market doesn't exist. Chill.
With all the FOMO surrounding these and speculators gobbling these up until they realize how mediocre they are to play, I can almost guarantee six months out singles will be $10 a pop on TCGPlayer. Nalathni Dragon was much more limited and it's ~$6 market value.
- (W/U)(W/U) Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage: The New da Vinci (historic control)
- (W/B)(W/B) Teysa Karlov: Death Be Not Kind (aristocrats)
- (R/G)(R/G) Hallar, the Firefletcher: Yavimaya Burning (kicker and counters)
- (B/G)(G/U) Sidisi, Brood Tyrant: Queen of the Damned (dredge)
Maybe BuildI guess it's to add to the immersion. It would read kinda weird to refer to Michonne as "it" in the card text.
I was fine with random Comic Con promos being from Hasbro, they are collectibles and not really playable.
I was fine with MLP showing up as a fun random who cares and understood they only came about from Hasbro owning them, at the very least proceeds went to charity, and they are not usually playable. Me liking it probably had something to do with it too.
I was fine with Godzilla stuff popping up as they were just fancy alternate versions of real cards, and fit the theme of the set.
Now though I am feeling like the dam is about to burst. The possibilities for these crossover Secret Lairs spiked with something like the Walking Dead. Strixhaven could easily have Harry Potter (I would buy this and burn it cause Harry Potter is terrible), Kaldheim with God of War, D&D Core with tons of references to whichever world they chose (I forgot) and so on. Now maybe it's just me not liking the Walking Dead, mostly because I find zombies boring and played out, but when you combine the annoyance of Secret Lair with the crap like this it gets on my nerves.
Is this the end of the Magic? No, and I'm sure there will be more of these, but I already don't like Secret Lairs and to make them worse annoys me further.
Do not defend this bullshit. Always hiding behind collectors. Collectors' cards can have silver border or double names. This is scam to steal money from commander players.
Every exclusive card in commander decks, planechase decks, planeswalker decks, theme boosters and whatever can be reprinted. These ones can't.
Do you understand now?
God only knows what they will do in 2021, secret lair power rangers,secret lair transformers,secret lair GI Joe, thanks i hate it