I don't understand the theme of this ongoing complaint about white cards. Do you also get annoyed when green gets large creatures or blue gets a set mechanic based draw spell?
No, because Green and Blue have other tools to play with instead of large creatures and drawing cards. The issue isn't that gaining life and making tokens is boring, it's that it seems to be the only two things White is consistently doing nowadays.
I'm just going to snip down here because you just listed a whole bunch of cards that are explicitly and overtly about large creatures. That isn't "card draw" that's "put a big creature on the field." Green only has big creatures. "planeswalker removal" there is just a big creature. Come on now.
I'm just going to snip down here because you just listed a whole bunch of cards that are explicitly and overtly about large creatures. That isn't "card draw" that's "put a big creature on the field." Green only has big creatures. "planeswalker removal" there is just a big creature. Come on now.
First off, if you think Questing Beast is the extent of Planeswalker removal Green has, youarehorriblymistakenbuddy.
Second, putting the secondary, in-Green effect in a creature doesn't suddenly makes it fine because it's a big creature, just like putting Sphinx's Revelation in mono-White will never happen if your justification is "it's just a big lifegain spell". If all this wasn't part of Green's color pie, it would be a color pie violation like any other effect.
I'm just going to snip down here because you just listed a whole bunch of cards that are explicitly and overtly about large creatures. That isn't "card draw" that's "put a big creature on the field." Green only has big creatures. "planeswalker removal" there is just a big creature. Come on now.
First off, if you think Questing Beast is the extent of Planeswalker removal Green has, youarehorriblymistakenbuddy.
Second, putting the secondary, in-Green effect in a creature doesn't suddenly makes it fine because it's a big creature, just like putting Sphinx's Revelation in mono-White will never happen if your justification is "it's just a big lifegain spell". If all this wasn't part of Green's color pie, it would be a color pie violation like any other effect.
They haven't done "destroy non-creature permanent" in years, but again that's also got the word "creature" written into it. Nowadays you're going to see any planeswalker tech either attached to a creature or like vivien, arkbow ranger a rabid bite type effect. Green's ability to do anything even a little bit out of its pie is dependent on you having a big creature. We never get stuff like this anymore. Even land ramping has lost a lot of lustre in the last decade or so. Elfball isn't a thing anymore. It's all craterhoof behemoths now.
My point isn't that they do non-green things on creatures, it's that all the non-green things you cite are centered around or on creatures. You can do direct damage so long as it's coming from a creature. You can gain life or draw cards based on how many creatures you have or how powerful your creatures are. You can card select as long as it's for a creature. You can counter spells that target your creatures.
Nowadays you're going to see any planeswalker tech either attached to a creature or like vivien, arkbow ranger a rabid bite type effect. Green's ability to do anything even a little bit out of its pie is dependent on you having a big creature.
...so? Damage is still removal. Removal with a requirement is still removal. And speaking of Black, yeah restrictions have always been part of Black's color pie too. Black can't draw cards either, unless it involves life loss or creatures dying. This is not bad design, it's what differentiates Black and Green - the colors that are secondary in this effect - to Blue, the color primary on this effect.
Now for White? White can do three things based off gaining life - make dudes bigger, make tiny dudes or Dawn of Hope, a card specifically designed very recently to address this issue. In fact, if you look at the Theros spoiler right now, you'll find exactly two cards that don't fall into the "gain life/make tiny dudes/make dudes stronger/removal" spectrum: Archon of Falling Stars, a card that plays off the set's main theme but not to the same extent of Green and Idyllic Tutor, a reprint from more than ten years ago. Nobody would complain if White could do fun, non-primary White things by using the lifegain or the go-wide strategy, but the problem is White has almost nothing it can do outside of its non-primary spectrum in the first place, so it often doesn't.
Pity the Archon's Constellation ability is not "may", makes it harder to use with Enchanted Evening. You'd have to bounce or sacrifice it to stop from creating an infinite loop.
Once again you've quoted two cards that are pretty clearly about creatures, a weird modern-only card they just made to be cute about storm, and a seven mana utility spell that's 3/4 creature options. That isn't exactly unyaro bee sting here.
Even land ramping has lost a lot of lustre in the last decade or so. Elfball isn't a thing anymore.
I don't understand the theme of this ongoing complaint about white cards. Do you also get annoyed when green gets large creatures or blue gets a set mechanic based draw spell?
No, because Green and Blue have other tools to play with instead of large creatures and drawing cards. The issue isn't that gaining life and making tokens is boring, it's that it seems to be the only two things White is consistently doing nowadays.
White? Not only it gained very little, but it lost a lot over the years. White is supposed to be able to answer everything, except Armageddon effects fell out of favor and now White has very little to answer lands. White is supposed to be able to slow down the game, except taxing effects like Suppression Field were deemed too oppressive and unfun, now White gets much weaker variants like Tithe Taker. White was supposed to have a monopoly over powerful symmetrical effects like Balance or Wraths, except breaking the symmetry on these is too easy, so now they got neutered too and, oh, also, other colors now get to get slightly less efficientboard wipes too. Basically, White's color pie was kind of a mess, so once WotC moved away from these effects that promoted bad gameplay, what was left was a *****ty version of Green - and that's not just me saying, MaRo pretty much acknowledged as such. Lifegain, token production, empowering creatures, protection, removal and, well, that's kind of it.
Well green is gonna get ridiculous in Ikoria since we are getting behemoths/kaijus the ramp cards are probably gonna be obnoxious heck it might pop up in all colors
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Neat.
Shielded By Faith works with Siona, Captain of the Pyleas. Anax works with Gift of Immortality
I'm just going to snip down here because you just listed a whole bunch of cards that are explicitly and overtly about large creatures. That isn't "card draw" that's "put a big creature on the field." Green only has big creatures. "planeswalker removal" there is just a big creature. Come on now.
Second, putting the secondary, in-Green effect in a creature doesn't suddenly makes it fine because it's a big creature, just like putting Sphinx's Revelation in mono-White will never happen if your justification is "it's just a big lifegain spell". If all this wasn't part of Green's color pie, it would be a color pie violation like any other effect.
They haven't done "destroy non-creature permanent" in years, but again that's also got the word "creature" written into it. Nowadays you're going to see any planeswalker tech either attached to a creature or like vivien, arkbow ranger a rabid bite type effect. Green's ability to do anything even a little bit out of its pie is dependent on you having a big creature. We never get stuff like this anymore. Even land ramping has lost a lot of lustre in the last decade or so. Elfball isn't a thing anymore. It's all craterhoof behemoths now.
My point isn't that they do non-green things on creatures, it's that all the non-green things you cite are centered around or on creatures. You can do direct damage so long as it's coming from a creature. You can gain life or draw cards based on how many creatures you have or how powerful your creatures are. You can card select as long as it's for a creature. You can counter spells that target your creatures.
Now for White? White can do three things based off gaining life - make dudes bigger, make tiny dudes or Dawn of Hope, a card specifically designed very recently to address this issue. In fact, if you look at the Theros spoiler right now, you'll find exactly two cards that don't fall into the "gain life/make tiny dudes/make dudes stronger/removal" spectrum: Archon of Falling Stars, a card that plays off the set's main theme but not to the same extent of Green and Idyllic Tutor, a reprint from more than ten years ago. Nobody would complain if White could do fun, non-primary White things by using the lifegain or the go-wide strategy, but the problem is White has almost nothing it can do outside of its non-primary spectrum in the first place, so it often doesn't.
You sure about that?
Elfball was a thing literally last format. Try again.
Once again you've quoted two cards that are pretty clearly about creatures, a weird modern-only card they just made to be cute about storm, and a seven mana utility spell that's 3/4 creature options. That isn't exactly unyaro bee sting here.
Yeah you're right everyone was out there playing elves instead of merfolk, silly me.
Well green is gonna get ridiculous in Ikoria since we are getting behemoths/kaijus the ramp cards are probably gonna be obnoxious heck it might pop up in all colors