I like to imagine that they're just celebrating the toppling of the statue while the real Bolas is bewildered at these idiots but relatively ok and still gathering sparks for the elder spell.
I don't mean to sound rude, but even the war on mirrodin/new phyrexia has more tension than this, and that is still an ongoing war for the Mirrans and Phyrexians. That Koth of the Hammer and Melira, Sylvok Outcast are still fighting for their world for the past eight years of our real time. That there has been no resolution to this conflict. That the only advancement in that story is Karn's plan to take the sylex, the equivalent of a nuclear weapon, and blow up the world.
That while the War for the Spark looked very "doom and gloom" at first and that Bolas would give them a run for their money, it doesn't seem they went fully with the potential weight of it and actually pulled their punches. While there are deaths of named characters or a character losing their spark, Bolas appears like a novice in taking over another plane. Its meant to be a large finale that was built up for over thirteen years of our real world time, since the beginning of Time Spiral story, yet it comes across more hollowly. That of those who died, two had it coming, while the third was just the equivalent of kicking the dog.
I don't mean to sound rude, but even the war on mirrodin/new phyrexia has more tension than this, and that is still an ongoing war for the Mirrans and Phyrexians. That Koth of the Hammer and Melira, Sylvok Outcast are still fighting for their world for the past eight years of our real time. That there has been no resolution to this conflict. That the only advancement in that story is Karn's plan to take the sylex, the equivalent of a nuclear weapon, and blow up the world.
That while the War for the Spark looked very "doom and gloom" at first and that Bolas would give them a run for their money, it doesn't seem they went fully with the potential weight of it and actually pulled their punches. While there are deaths of named characters or a character losing their spark, Bolas appears like a novice in taking over another plane. Its meant to be a large finale that was built up for over thirteen years of our real world time, since the beginning of Time Spiral story, yet it comes across more hollowly. That of those who died, two had it coming, while the third was just the equivalent of kicking the dog.
The Ree in your screen name should be in capital letters.
I don't mean to sound rude, but even the war on mirrodin/new phyrexia has more tension than this, and that is still an ongoing war for the Mirrans and Phyrexians. That Koth of the Hammer and Melira, Sylvok Outcast are still fighting for their world for the past eight years of our real time. That there has been no resolution to this conflict. That the only advancement in that story is Karn's plan to take the sylex, the equivalent of a nuclear weapon, and blow up the world.
That while the War for the Spark looked very "doom and gloom" at first and that Bolas would give them a run for their money, it doesn't seem they went fully with the potential weight of it and actually pulled their punches. While there are deaths of named characters or a character losing their spark, Bolas appears like a novice in taking over another plane. Its meant to be a large finale that was built up for over thirteen years of our real world time, since the beginning of Time Spiral story, yet it comes across more hollowly. That of those who died, two had it coming, while the third was just the equivalent of kicking the dog.
The Ree in your screen name should be in capital letters.
I don't want to waste my time on a story with a downer ending where the good guys I've been rooting for end up losing. And I flat out reject stories that confuse "realism" with "pessimism", where the downer ending is supposed to represent some fatalistic philosophy about life. It's bad enough that real life has been disappointing and depressing, I will NOT waste my time on disappointing and depressing fiction. If the bad guy ends up winning, what's even the point of caring? What's even the point of reading the damn fiction in the first place!? Amonkhet felt like a waste of time. Shadows Over Innistrad felt like a waste of time. Scars of Mirrodin felt like a waste of time. Kaladesh, Ixalan, and Dominaria didn't feel like a waste of time.
So yeah, pardon me if I celebrate with the Ravnicans here. Down with Bolas and good riddance. At least in fiction world, dictators and tyrants get the death and defeat they deserve.
Yes, you. You is not everybody else.
I'm most of the time with the villain side, and you know why? Exactly because in fiction they lose 99% of time, and I'm ******* sick of such predictable plots were the "Happy ending" is always a given. Because a winning villain is "unpopular", doesn't sell well.
Well, guess what. I enjoy villains, I enjoy intelligent villains and I strongly believe that well-written villains deserve the victory because they know their *****, opposed to boring, predictable, shallow and flat heroes that "always win in the end" only because is popular and people like the good guys wins.
It's since the bible that "good always triumph over evil". I'm really tired of this, and excuse me if I like well-written stories exactly because they are realistic, deep and adherent to the real world dynamics, and not just the same "and everyone lived happily ever after" over and over.
At least in Apocalypse the main character and hero died forever with the villain. Those were great stories, that ones that you truly remember and mess up with you!
This war it's a total joke compared to that. Or even to what happened in Time Spiral.
The truth is that the writers are playing safe with their characters now. And that's why the story feels flat, boring and horribly predictable overall.And that's bad writing in my book.
Well, that would imply that Bolas is a well written villain which he is not. He is barely above mustache twirling at this point. You see there are great places of art and literature where you can find a well written villain you you are rooting for... But we are not doing The Usual Suspects here.
Magics story line has to be more akin to a telenovela. And this is not meant as an insult, but more of an observation since it has to use similar story structures. A perpetual continuation of the story, where the next season is approved already and will have the same cast. This also means that you simply can't kill off popular characters (well, at least not the super popular ones). Jace and Chandra are the main protagonists of MTG. Not because they are the most interesting, but because the audience as a whole likes them the most... And you can't kill these guys and you can't make them look bad, because they need to be alive and cherished for the sets you want to release next year. And the year after this, and the year after this...
Magic never had consistently good story telling far from it. It is simply another layer of entertainment, added to the card game. If you expect revolutionary story telling, you are expecting too much.
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Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
Why are people already moaning about this - "Oh, that was too easy," "Oh, the heroes should have paid a price," "Oh, that was such a painless victory"? You know all this already? I didn't realize we had so many sibyls and clairvoyants on these forums! Truly gifted, this community!
Have you read the novel? Have you seen the last week of previews, when the darkest hours of the war are supposed to play out? This card tells us nothing, absolutely nothing about costs paid or losses suffered, who survives or perishes. All we have is a snapshot of Ravnica's "Endor Celebration" scene. Looks like the good guys win, shocking absolutely no one. The actual surprises should be upcoming.
Give it a couple weeks. Then, once the book is out and the last cards have been spoiled, and all the details are known, then complain with impunity if you so choose. Until then, we simply don't have enough details about the ending to form hard opinions - unless you're really that eager to whine.
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"I'd rather die speaking the truth than live a lie." --Gix, to Yawgmoth (pre-Phyrexia)
Why are people already moaning about this - "Oh, that was too easy," "Oh, the heroes should have paid a price," "Oh, that was such a painless victory"? You know all this already? I didn't realize we had so many sibyls and clairvoyants on these forums! Truly gifted, this community!
Have you read the novel? Have you seen the last week of previews, when the darkest hours of the war are supposed to play out? This card tells us nothing, absolutely nothing about costs paid or losses suffered, who survives or perishes. All we have is a snapshot of Ravnica's "Endor Celebration" scene. Looks like the good guys win, shocking absolutely no one. The actual surprises should be upcoming.
Give it a couple weeks. Then, once the book is out and the last cards have been spoiled, and all the details are known, then complain with impunity if you so choose. Until then, we simply don't have enough details about the ending to form hard opinions - unless you're really that eager to whine.
Yes Goryo, we seen the spark notes (pun intended) equivalent of the book and how it plays out. We know what was gained and what was lost and who actually did what.
Spaniard I know you want to help with your leaks, but you're killing the buzz.
Still though, this a thousand times.
Edit: Actually, let me be more vehement: After all the effort and preparation the creative team went through to prep this story and deliver it to us, rolling out a specially-planned spoiler season and going the extra mile to try and make War of the Spark a unique experience, leaks like this--especially story spotlights--are particularly uncool.
Ditto for whoever the hell it was who leaked Nicol Bolas. We're not grateful, you're not helping, and all you're really doing is cheapening the experience.
Get over yourself. This isn't about you.
I'm trying to understand your vehement anger, but I just don't get it. Being 100% serious. Help me understand why you didn't simply close the thread when it was an untranslated card clearly from an unofficial source? I'm not being sarcastic or confrontational, but I'm having a hard time seeing this as a logically valid stance. I mean, what about those who appreciate the leaks? Those who want to get the information first? Are their desires ignored because it could, possibly, inconvenience you? Yet no one is trying to tell you how to enjoy the spoilers and which information to consume. Nobody is taking you by the hand and forcing you to read the leaks. Why then do you feel entitled to limit the information others want? It seems, frankly, nonsensical. You don't speak for the masses anymore than the next poster in this thread. Why would you think otherwise? Are you working under the misconception that the other forum users aren't entitled to their opinions? Once again, I'm simply baffled.
So be it: Let’s entertain the notion that the body count is low. Personally, I would prefer the cost of victory to be steep, given the stakes (and because the cast is so large I think it needs a culling) but that’s not always necessary to tell a good story. Off the top of my head, Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, and Avatar: The Last Airbender are all fantastic examples of well-told fantasy stories with grand, ambitious finales in which the heroes suffered minimal to no lasting casualties.
How many heroes died in the entire original Star Wars Trilogy? Just Obi Wan… in the very first movie. In Return of the Jedi, victory over the Empire was purchased cheap, by the blood of offscreen Bothans (and not nearly enough Ewoks). Yet it still managed to have, by and large, an emotionally satisfying finale. Yet if you had been spoiled beforehand with the knowledge "None of the Rebels die! Han Solo gets saved, Vader turns good, the Empire goes down, and everyone feels great at the end!" Well... that's true. But if you dismissed it then as trite without experiencing it yourself, you would be cheating both yourself and the story.
Again, how many named heroes died in Return of the King? Exactly Theoden, and that wasn’t even in the last battle. Literally everyone else comes out okay at the end. Frodo loses a finger.
So while I hope to see Gideon and Liliana both go out nobly, it’s not impossible to tell a good story in which they both come out of this alive. It’s not the ending I want to read, of course, but I’ll reserve all judgments until I read the novel for myself and see how it ends.
Though I don’t always like the way Magic’s story goes (I was amazed and upset at how mishandled Rivals of Ixalan was, and I still haven’t forgiven it), the creative team put a lot of effort and energy into this finale and went the extra mile to bring Magic fans a new experience. I intend to give then an open mind until I have experienced the entire story firsthand, as intended. They have made a true effort to step up their game, and I plan to repay them accordingly.
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"I'd rather die speaking the truth than live a lie." --Gix, to Yawgmoth (pre-Phyrexia)
Spaniard I know you want to help with your leaks, but you're killing the buzz.
Still though, this a thousand times.
Edit: Actually, let me be more vehement: After all the effort and preparation the creative team went through to prep this story and deliver it to us, rolling out a specially-planned spoiler season and going the extra mile to try and make War of the Spark a unique experience, leaks like this--especially story spotlights--are particularly uncool.
Ditto for whoever the hell it was who leaked Nicol Bolas. We're not grateful, you're not helping, and all you're really doing is cheapening the experience.
Get over yourself. This isn't about you.
I'm trying to understand your vehement anger, but I just don't get it. Being 100% serious. Help me understand why you didn't simply close the thread when it was an untranslated card clearly from an unofficial source? I'm not being sarcastic or confrontational, but I'm having a hard time seeing this as a logically valid stance. I mean, what about those who appreciate the leaks? Those who want to get the information first? Are their desires ignored because it could, possibly, inconvenience you? Yet no one is trying to tell you how to enjoy the spoilers and which information to consume. Nobody is taking you by the hand and forcing you to read the leaks. Why then do you feel entitled to limit the information others want? It seems, frankly, nonsensical. You don't speak for the masses anymore than the next poster in this thread. Why would you think otherwise? Are you working under the misconception that the other forum users aren't entitled to their opinions? Once again, I'm simply baffled.
I am not attacking you or anyone who looks at these leaks—once the information is out there, it’s public and that’s that. I am attacking the people who think it's fine to leak to begin with. That is entitlement; to think that just because you have access to certain information, that you own it and can dispose of it as you wish, even if it’s someone else’s intellectual property and you are acting in direct opposition to the content creator's wishes.
Your hands are clean and you are not the problem. Even if this was marked as a leak (which it wasn't), I would not fault you or anyone else for clicking to see it, as that would be both unfair and hypocritical. This is a game of knowledge and strategy, and in some circles it gets very competitive; you should have access to the exact same public knowledge as the rest of the community.
The issue is the people who leak such information in the first place. That's where my ire is directed.
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"I'd rather die speaking the truth than live a lie." --Gix, to Yawgmoth (pre-Phyrexia)
Yeah, still not really getting the complaints at all. If the book leaks are accurate (and honestly I'm not sure they are when they basically came from out of nowhere and no way to verify them) it doesn't mean the victory has no cost. If you came into this story expecting them to kill all the cast of current walkers then... I don't know, that's just really on you and your expectations, not on Wizards. They haven't been opaque in the story they're telling.
And I don't really agree that Invasion or the like is "better" than this, by a long shot. It just sounds like an attempt to be grim and gritty which comes off really childish and immature, much like Warhammer.
I don't want to waste my time on a story with a downer ending where the good guys I've been rooting for end up losing. And I flat out reject stories that confuse "realism" with "pessimism", where the downer ending is supposed to represent some fatalistic philosophy about life. It's bad enough that real life has been disappointing and depressing, I will NOT waste my time on disappointing and depressing fiction. If the bad guy ends up winning, what's even the point of caring? What's even the point of reading the damn fiction in the first place!? Amonkhet felt like a waste of time. Shadows Over Innistrad felt like a waste of time. Scars of Mirrodin felt like a waste of time. Kaladesh, Ixalan, and Dominaria didn't feel like a waste of time.
So yeah, pardon me if I celebrate with the Ravnicans here. Down with Bolas and good riddance. At least in fiction world, dictators and tyrants get the death and defeat they deserve.
Story-wise Kaladesh was the biggest waste of time in recent Magic history. And Amonkhet was my absolute favourite block (story wise and flavour wise) in a long while. (Then again I'm a sucker for tragic stories, sue me.) Don't confuse your personal opinions with what is objectively good storytelling.
The issue isn't about confusing realism with pessimism (nice strawman by the way). The issue is that Bolas is a villain who is incredibly old, has subjugated countless of worlds and is repeatedly presented as "smarter than anyone can imagine, even us writers lol". If he falls to anything short of an equal in terms of power, intelligence or foresight (like, say, Ugin) then his entire character is incredibly cheapened. And THAT is a legitimate issue. Bolas winning may not be on the table, but if it's easy enough that a bunch of "average mages" (which is what planeswalkers are nowadays) can defeat him with few losses, then the entire Bolas arc was a "waste of time", because we were told things for years that are demonstratably untrue.
I mean, that just kind of cements Bolas as being a really bad villain writing-wise then, not sure why you'd go out of your way to defend bad writing. Bolas loses because he's not actually the smartest, most powerful Planeswalker that has ever lived, and because of his own mortal flaws is a lot more interesting to me than Bolas losing because Ugin comes in to save the day. No one is perfect, certainly not Bolas.
The last time I remember it got this heated on the story was when chandra and nissa performed the equivalent of a channelfireball on ulamog and kozilek. Which was also framed as a war between the inhabitants and an alien, off-world, threat.
The victory, while grandiose in presentation, it doesn't sit sell with the audience and that the audience might feel the experience was cheapened. Its understandable. The eldrazi and nicol bolas share in common they are meant to be so powerful and beyond mortal comprehension, that winning against such threats should feel nearly impossible. But when not handled with careful writing, such characters act as a trap for writers, which they sprung with nicol bolas.
With nicol bolas, the expectation is that he has his initial plan with an untold amount of backup plans meant to secure his victory at any cost. When that illusion becomes broken, that is when the audience feels wronged. That the expectation is when you have exhausted all of his backup plans, he is truly vulnerable. If he didn't plan for Liliana to turn on him even though contract bound to him, that is a crack in his illusion.
It is not about the audience simply wanting one side to win, its the journey to that victory.
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Sorceress Queen (Pauper EDH), Zahid (Brawl), Tron (Pauper), Selesnya Slivers (Peasant), Blue Tempo (Standard)
I mean, that just kind of cements Bolas as being a really bad villain writing-wise then, not sure why you'd go out of your way to defend bad writing. Bolas loses because he's not actually the smartest, most powerful Planeswalker that has ever lived, and because of his own mortal flaws is a lot more interesting to me than Bolas losing because Ugin comes in to save the day. No one is perfect, certainly not Bolas.
The issue is that if you build up your villain to be all those things, then a simple defeat isn't going to cut it. That's like having some eldritch monstrosities that lay waste to entire worlds being defeated by the power of friendship, oh wait. The issue isn't that Bolas loses, but how.
If some people are fine with such a resolution, okay I guess? But they shouldn't act as if everyone should be fine with it too, after such a long buildup. It's like not delivering on a promise.
I agree with you by the way that Bolas is not a good villain, in large parts because he can't be reasonably defeated without some deus ex. But that's neither here nor there. Wizards decided to go with Bolas and decided to go with an arc culminating in his defeat. If they then chicken out of seeing it through, then why even have a villain in the first place? Manite was talking about wastes of time, but I see nothing as more of a waste of time in a story than being told outside the story at the conclusion of the story that everything we were told before is neither true nor relevant.
I mean, to the best of my knowledge Wizards has not said "Bolas can only be defeated by Ugin", so it's kind of silly to act like that is an issue. As I said, Bolas getting taken down because of his own personality flaws and because he's not omnipotent (literally the entire plot is happening because of that) seems totally fine. Which... you know, is what happens. The guy overestimated himself and is incredibly arrogant, and for all his power that's what defeats him. Trying to make Ugin the only one who can beat him would be justifying Bolas' inflated sense of self worth, and nothing in the story has indicated that Bolas is as good as he thinks he is. He's incredibly powerful/intelligent, but that still has a limit.
And I'm not saying people need to like it, I'm simply saying it's not inconsistent with the story up to this point. And that from a meta standpoint expecting anything other than him losing is just... silly.
I mean, to the best of my knowledge Wizards has not said "Bolas can only be defeated by Ugin", so it's kind of silly to act like that is an issue. As I said, Bolas getting taken down because of his own personality flaws and because he's not omnipotent (literally the entire plot is happening because of that) seems totally fine. Which... you know, is what happens. The guy overestimated himself and is incredibly arrogant, and for all his power that's what defeats him. Trying to make Ugin the only one who can beat him would be justifying Bolas' inflated sense of self worth, and nothing in the story has indicated that Bolas is as good as he thinks he is. He's incredibly powerful/intelligent, but that still has a limit.
And I'm not saying people need to like it, I'm simply saying it's not inconsistent with the story up to this point. And that from a meta standpoint expecting anything other than him losing is just... silly.
Also note that even if he doesn't show up on Ravinca at all, Ugin has already defeated Bolas. Jace showing up on Ixalan to turn Vraska into a secret weapon was Ugin's doing all along, he's at least as good manipulator as Bolas. What remains to be seen is how the pawns (or, from our perspective, heroes) act out Ugin's plan.
I mean, to the best of my knowledge Wizards has not said "Bolas can only be defeated by Ugin".
Would you be surprised if I told you that is the actually how that goes?
Given that I've seen the book spoilers you're welcome to feel that's how it goes. If those turn out to be accurate is another matter. But I didn't interpret it as "Ugin goes toe to toe with Bolas in a shonen-esque fight" which seems to be what people think is the only way Bolas can lose.
I mean, to the best of my knowledge Wizards has not said "Bolas can only be defeated by Ugin".
Would you be surprised if I told you that is the actually how that goes?
Given that I've seen the book spoilers you're welcome to feel that's how it goes. If those turn out to be accurate is another matter. But I didn't interpret it as "Ugin goes toe to toe with Bolas in a shonen-esque fight" which seems to be what people think is the only way Bolas can lose.
Less anime fight, more two chessmasters out-thinking each other.
I mean, people are already saying that isn't happening so clearly they are expecting shonen fight. If it's meant to be a chess thing then nothing says that the Gatewatch aren't Ugin's "pawns" in this instance.
I don't want to waste my time on a story with a downer ending where the good guys I've been rooting for end up losing. And I flat out reject stories that confuse "realism" with "pessimism", where the downer ending is supposed to represent some fatalistic philosophy about life. It's bad enough that real life has been disappointing and depressing, I will NOT waste my time on disappointing and depressing fiction.
And if the good guys always win, then where is the tension?
Personally I think the more interesting direction is not letting the bad guy win sometimes, but rather doing away with clear delineations between good and evil. Give me some (early) Song of Ice and Fire over Lord of the Rings any day. When no one is going to be the obvious winner, there's tension. There's room to experience more emotions than increasingly-numb satisfaction at another victory to vindicate my personal perspective. In the real world, heroes aren't flawless, villains aren't pure evil, and no one has all the answers. Fiction, in its best forms, channels that complexity to make us care.
On the other hand, it's a card game. If the plot sucks but we get some Feather-caliber cards out of the deal, then I can deal with some trite storytelling.
That while the War for the Spark looked very "doom and gloom" at first and that Bolas would give them a run for their money, it doesn't seem they went fully with the potential weight of it and actually pulled their punches. While there are deaths of named characters or a character losing their spark, Bolas appears like a novice in taking over another plane. Its meant to be a large finale that was built up for over thirteen years of our real world time, since the beginning of Time Spiral story, yet it comes across more hollowly. That of those who died, two had it coming, while the third was just the equivalent of kicking the dog.
Many thanks to DNC at Heroes of the Plane Studios
Well, that would imply that Bolas is a well written villain which he is not. He is barely above mustache twirling at this point. You see there are great places of art and literature where you can find a well written villain you you are rooting for... But we are not doing The Usual Suspects here.
Magics story line has to be more akin to a telenovela. And this is not meant as an insult, but more of an observation since it has to use similar story structures. A perpetual continuation of the story, where the next season is approved already and will have the same cast. This also means that you simply can't kill off popular characters (well, at least not the super popular ones). Jace and Chandra are the main protagonists of MTG. Not because they are the most interesting, but because the audience as a whole likes them the most... And you can't kill these guys and you can't make them look bad, because they need to be alive and cherished for the sets you want to release next year. And the year after this, and the year after this...
Magic never had consistently good story telling far from it. It is simply another layer of entertainment, added to the card game. If you expect revolutionary story telling, you are expecting too much.
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
Why are people already moaning about this - "Oh, that was too easy," "Oh, the heroes should have paid a price," "Oh, that was such a painless victory"? You know all this already? I didn't realize we had so many sibyls and clairvoyants on these forums! Truly gifted, this community!
Have you read the novel? Have you seen the last week of previews, when the darkest hours of the war are supposed to play out? This card tells us nothing, absolutely nothing about costs paid or losses suffered, who survives or perishes. All we have is a snapshot of Ravnica's "Endor Celebration" scene. Looks like the good guys win, shocking absolutely no one. The actual surprises should be upcoming.
Give it a couple weeks. Then, once the book is out and the last cards have been spoiled, and all the details are known, then complain with impunity if you so choose. Until then, we simply don't have enough details about the ending to form hard opinions - unless you're really that eager to whine.
Spirits
Except the Phyrexians
I'm trying to understand your vehement anger, but I just don't get it. Being 100% serious. Help me understand why you didn't simply close the thread when it was an untranslated card clearly from an unofficial source? I'm not being sarcastic or confrontational, but I'm having a hard time seeing this as a logically valid stance. I mean, what about those who appreciate the leaks? Those who want to get the information first? Are their desires ignored because it could, possibly, inconvenience you? Yet no one is trying to tell you how to enjoy the spoilers and which information to consume. Nobody is taking you by the hand and forcing you to read the leaks. Why then do you feel entitled to limit the information others want? It seems, frankly, nonsensical. You don't speak for the masses anymore than the next poster in this thread. Why would you think otherwise? Are you working under the misconception that the other forum users aren't entitled to their opinions? Once again, I'm simply baffled.
How many heroes died in the entire original Star Wars Trilogy? Just Obi Wan… in the very first movie. In Return of the Jedi, victory over the Empire was purchased cheap, by the blood of offscreen Bothans (and not nearly enough Ewoks). Yet it still managed to have, by and large, an emotionally satisfying finale. Yet if you had been spoiled beforehand with the knowledge "None of the Rebels die! Han Solo gets saved, Vader turns good, the Empire goes down, and everyone feels great at the end!" Well... that's true. But if you dismissed it then as trite without experiencing it yourself, you would be cheating both yourself and the story.
Again, how many named heroes died in Return of the King? Exactly Theoden, and that wasn’t even in the last battle. Literally everyone else comes out okay at the end. Frodo loses a finger.
So while I hope to see Gideon and Liliana both go out nobly, it’s not impossible to tell a good story in which they both come out of this alive. It’s not the ending I want to read, of course, but I’ll reserve all judgments until I read the novel for myself and see how it ends.
Though I don’t always like the way Magic’s story goes (I was amazed and upset at how mishandled Rivals of Ixalan was, and I still haven’t forgiven it), the creative team put a lot of effort and energy into this finale and went the extra mile to bring Magic fans a new experience. I intend to give then an open mind until I have experienced the entire story firsthand, as intended. They have made a true effort to step up their game, and I plan to repay them accordingly.
I am not attacking you or anyone who looks at these leaks—once the information is out there, it’s public and that’s that. I am attacking the people who think it's fine to leak to begin with. That is entitlement; to think that just because you have access to certain information, that you own it and can dispose of it as you wish, even if it’s someone else’s intellectual property and you are acting in direct opposition to the content creator's wishes.
Your hands are clean and you are not the problem. Even if this was marked as a leak (which it wasn't), I would not fault you or anyone else for clicking to see it, as that would be both unfair and hypocritical. This is a game of knowledge and strategy, and in some circles it gets very competitive; you should have access to the exact same public knowledge as the rest of the community.
The issue is the people who leak such information in the first place. That's where my ire is directed.
And I don't really agree that Invasion or the like is "better" than this, by a long shot. It just sounds like an attempt to be grim and gritty which comes off really childish and immature, much like Warhammer.
Story-wise Kaladesh was the biggest waste of time in recent Magic history. And Amonkhet was my absolute favourite block (story wise and flavour wise) in a long while. (Then again I'm a sucker for tragic stories, sue me.) Don't confuse your personal opinions with what is objectively good storytelling.
The issue isn't about confusing realism with pessimism (nice strawman by the way). The issue is that Bolas is a villain who is incredibly old, has subjugated countless of worlds and is repeatedly presented as "smarter than anyone can imagine, even us writers lol". If he falls to anything short of an equal in terms of power, intelligence or foresight (like, say, Ugin) then his entire character is incredibly cheapened. And THAT is a legitimate issue. Bolas winning may not be on the table, but if it's easy enough that a bunch of "average mages" (which is what planeswalkers are nowadays) can defeat him with few losses, then the entire Bolas arc was a "waste of time", because we were told things for years that are demonstratably untrue.
The victory, while grandiose in presentation, it doesn't sit sell with the audience and that the audience might feel the experience was cheapened. Its understandable. The eldrazi and nicol bolas share in common they are meant to be so powerful and beyond mortal comprehension, that winning against such threats should feel nearly impossible. But when not handled with careful writing, such characters act as a trap for writers, which they sprung with nicol bolas.
With nicol bolas, the expectation is that he has his initial plan with an untold amount of backup plans meant to secure his victory at any cost. When that illusion becomes broken, that is when the audience feels wronged. That the expectation is when you have exhausted all of his backup plans, he is truly vulnerable. If he didn't plan for Liliana to turn on him even though contract bound to him, that is a crack in his illusion.
It is not about the audience simply wanting one side to win, its the journey to that victory.
Sorceress Queen (Pauper EDH), Zahid (Brawl), Tron (Pauper), Selesnya Slivers (Peasant), Blue Tempo (Standard)
The issue is that if you build up your villain to be all those things, then a simple defeat isn't going to cut it. That's like having some eldritch monstrosities that lay waste to entire worlds being defeated by the power of friendship, oh wait. The issue isn't that Bolas loses, but how.
If some people are fine with such a resolution, okay I guess? But they shouldn't act as if everyone should be fine with it too, after such a long buildup. It's like not delivering on a promise.
I agree with you by the way that Bolas is not a good villain, in large parts because he can't be reasonably defeated without some deus ex. But that's neither here nor there. Wizards decided to go with Bolas and decided to go with an arc culminating in his defeat. If they then chicken out of seeing it through, then why even have a villain in the first place? Manite was talking about wastes of time, but I see nothing as more of a waste of time in a story than being told outside the story at the conclusion of the story that everything we were told before is neither true nor relevant.
And I'm not saying people need to like it, I'm simply saying it's not inconsistent with the story up to this point. And that from a meta standpoint expecting anything other than him losing is just... silly.
Also note that even if he doesn't show up on Ravinca at all, Ugin has already defeated Bolas. Jace showing up on Ixalan to turn Vraska into a secret weapon was Ugin's doing all along, he's at least as good manipulator as Bolas. What remains to be seen is how the pawns (or, from our perspective, heroes) act out Ugin's plan.
Given that I've seen the book spoilers you're welcome to feel that's how it goes. If those turn out to be accurate is another matter. But I didn't interpret it as "Ugin goes toe to toe with Bolas in a shonen-esque fight" which seems to be what people think is the only way Bolas can lose.
Personally I think the more interesting direction is not letting the bad guy win sometimes, but rather doing away with clear delineations between good and evil. Give me some (early) Song of Ice and Fire over Lord of the Rings any day. When no one is going to be the obvious winner, there's tension. There's room to experience more emotions than increasingly-numb satisfaction at another victory to vindicate my personal perspective. In the real world, heroes aren't flawless, villains aren't pure evil, and no one has all the answers. Fiction, in its best forms, channels that complexity to make us care.
On the other hand, it's a card game. If the plot sucks but we get some Feather-caliber cards out of the deal, then I can deal with some trite storytelling.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6