Whoah, I just realized Vraska's a hybrid PW! Odd though that her starting loyalty and ability cost means she'll just sit around after a couple uses, but I suppose that's so her triggered ability can still be useful. And hey, there's proliferate to give her more loyalty.
So, does this mean Dovin, Domri, Kaya, and Ral will also be hybrid uncommons? It would make sense that Bolas' PW agents are the uncommons who just go down in loyalty. They've been used and betrayed, of course their loyalty is slipping away. If I were to hazard a guess at a possible hybrid cycle:
(W/U) Dovin (U/B) Ashiok (B/R) Tibalt (R/G) Domri (G/W) Vivien (W/B) Kaya (U/R) Ral (B/G) Vraska (R/W) Samut (G/U) Kiora
Though if Vraska indicates a "keywords matter" theme among the hybrid PWs, then Sorin would be more fitting for "lifelink matters" than Kaya and Angrath would fit Menace better than Tibalt.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Whoah, I just realized Vraska's a hybrid PW! Odd though that her starting loyalty and ability cost means she'll just sit around after a couple uses, but I suppose that's so her triggered ability can still be useful. And hey, there's proliferate to give her more loyalty.
So, does this mean Dovin, Domri, Kaya, and Ral will also be hybrid uncommons?
Hybrid walkers are also super helpful for limited so you can play as many as possible. Especially prerelease/sealed where you'll have at least 6 of them.
So could the artwork from this thread potentially be for the Elder Spell?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I collect Legendary cards, Planeswalkers, and Sagas.
Current count of different Legends: 1314
Current count of different Planeswalkers: 213
Current count of different Sagas: 44
I do like the Tezzeret and will need to add it to my Artifact EDH that already has a lot of Tezzerets in it. The other cards seem okay, other than cast proliferate already on a 3 cost seems real good for an uncommon.
Well, the 4 CMC multi-colored exiling sweeper is interesting, but too narrow to see even SB application.
Flux channeler super-proliferate within a deck filled with cantrips and red rituals could create something. Like a weird storm-like deck. (For example off shrine of burning rage)
invade the city looks like a potential card for yet another UR cantrippy / ritual deck. Make only on big guy seems not powerful enough though.
emergence zone being a land quicken is interesting. It does not give a card but does not really costs a slot in the deck.
Tezzet is too constly at 6 CMC, but affinity for artifact... have they not learned anything??? Oh, and its +2 can deal tons of damage in the same deck.
All in all, the first preview are interesting, to say the least.
So could the artwork from this thread potentially be for the Elder Spell?
I think it's the swirly black hole-thing behind Bolas in the trailer (seeing as that one Eternal channeled Dacks' planeswalker spark towards it). I hope it's a bit more interesting as a card than being another alt-win condition (probably related in some way to planeswalkers), but I must admit, it's the most likely possibility.
I like what they did with planeswalkers this set, and I think people are undervaluing Vraska bit. For an uncommon she is pretty powerful.
Not that much a fan of Amass, but I like the flavor behind it and I can see why they didn't go the fabricate route with it. Still, it's one of those mechanics that will need quite a lot of support to have any impact beyond limited (and even there it will probably lead to some feel-bad moments when the carefully grown army tokens bite the dust because of some removal spell). Not a fan, but also not hating it, and the flavor pushes my opinion on it into "mildly amused indifference"
-territory.
Oh how much I love that proliferate finally returns! Definitely my favorite mechanic of the Scars of Mirrodin-block and obvious choice for this set (and that's not a bad thing). I feel like that uncommon is really strong, bordering on broken in Commander.
I also really love the general feel and art of the set, so all in all a pretty positive first impression and really looking forward for more!
Ajani is very close to Goldmane's Powalevel. Which is a good sign.
Lilianas' triggered ability looks great. Though her other ones not so much.
Hopefuly Gideon has the same card-structure as she.
How do you find my Gideon ?
GIDEON, AVATAR OF COURAGE
6 mana, 8 Loyality
- All damage dealt to you, or another Planeswalker you control, is dealt to Gideon instead.
+2 Until your next turn, if Gideon takes damage, he deals 3 damage to the sources' controller & you draw a card.
0 Until end of turn Gideon becomes an 8/8 Human, Soulja with Indestructible & Protection from the color of your choice. Prevent all damage that would be dealt to him.
-7 Target opponent sacrifices from among his permanents so many cards, that he has equally many permanents of all card-types as you.
Yeah Amass can't be parasitic because it's self contained.
By that logic, energy wasn't parasitic because (with only one or two exceptions) all of the energy cards gave you the energy you needed to use them. Sure, Amass isn't terribly parasitic. For example, the 3/2 for 4 that gives you a 2/2 when it dies works regardless of where you play it. But to really use the mechanic the way it's intended rather than a glorified "create an x/x zombie token" you have to play it within the set. It's certainly more parasitic than proliferate but less so than energy, since it would interact with some older cards.
Will we be getting Army as a creature type? It´s weird that non of the spoiled cards is an army creature
I doubt we'll get any 'army' creatures in the set. If we did, Amass would put counters there rather than a zombie token, which seems to be the intent of the mechanic. Though I guess they could make one if they really wanted you to be able to boost it with Amass. A flying Army creature would be really good for draft. Assuming they don't do something weird with Army though, it'll be a creature type so Changelings or other cards that mess with creature types will interact with it.
-Tezz looks cool; kinda generic good artifact stuff, but the +2's really good in a dedicated deck.
-Vraska: I don't care if she's less powerful. Something nobody's mentioned so far: the art here is so cool. God, that's awesome. Fun uncommon, too.
-V's Finisher: Seen it already. Kinda narrow, a fine common. meh
-Ajani: Yeah, weird art and effect, but very generically powerful without feeling generic himself, so I'll take it. -2's great, effect is good, that's enough.
-Ignite the Beacon: Wait, so is Ajani dying? Nooo! Ajani was supposed to return to Theros, we've been waiting on that story for so long!
-Interplanar Beacon: Meh, superfriends enabler, that's all.
-Emergence Zone: Wait this is really good tho. Nice!
-No Escape: Decent common honestly
-Flux Channeler: Yes this is broken, why do you ask? I actually wonder if we'll see this in a new Modern Infect deck -- they play so many cheap pump spells already, this provides an alt-win that doesn't rely on combat. They're probably way too fast for that, though. In any case, this is weird 'cause I thought speculation mainly pointed to Mirrodin fairly soon after RtRtRavnica, and I'd be very surprised if they do Mirrodin without infect and proliferate -- and that would to me make it weird to put proliferate in another nearby set.
-Herald of the Dreadhorde: Since this is the first amass card on this list: I love amass! I think this mechanic is super cool. Also, this card on its own seems fun in limited and maybe even alright in some sort of Aristocrats style deck.
-Invade the City: Standard Izzet fare, but actually I can see it being pretty powerful -- it'd be easy in a Drakes deck to make this a 3/3 T3 or 4/4-5/5 T4, and it gets better as the game goes on.
-Dreadhorde Invasion: It's nothing close to a Bitterblossom. In a more dedicated amass deck -- or, even better, an Aristocrats deck that can use the tokens -- it can be a decent card, and it seems fun to play with.
-Widespread Brutality: This is a great example of the cool things amass can do. Quite powerful -- I don't know how, but I bet it'll get played in Standard somehow.
-Liliana: Yes this is sick. Yes I want this for my Sidisi edh deck. Otherwise, though, just a good top-end threat that deals with anything your opponent has left to attack it and then makes blockers/attackers.
-Ravnica at War: I wish there weren't so many exile cards in general, much less wraths, but this is narrow enough that I hope not to see much of it. Good effect and well-costed, just a personal taste for how exile ought to be used.
I'll also just mention the other cards we've seen so far:
-Ob Nixilis: This is a great uncommon. Kinda weird on an empty board, but big card advantage for your expendable cards, removal (however painful) for their threats, and some minor ping damage.
-Ob Nixilis's Cruelty: Jeez, that's a common?
-Tibalt: This is so cool. Very excited. This is pretty much a perfect Tibalt card. My sole complaint was I was hoping Tibalt would be the first one-mana planeswalker, but this is pretty cool too. Also, is it just me, or are getting rid of these planeswalkers through combat going to be very annoying if they don't use their minus abilities?
-Tibalt's thingbobber: Weird having a normal uncommon alongside all the planeswalkers. Meh.
-Time Wipe: This is awesome, and a good wrath effect. We may never again have Wrath of God in Standard, but I'm actually pretty happy with the 5-mana wipes and 4-mana conditional wipes that we've been getting -- I think it's been leading to more interesting designs.
Very excited for this set!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"It is better for all the world if, instead of waiting to execute degenerate offspring for crime or to let them starve for their imbecility, society can prevent those who are manifestly unfit from continuing their kind. The principle that sustains compulsory vaccination is broad enough to cover cutting the Fallopian tubes... Three generations of imbeciles are enough."
--Buck v Bell, 1927. This case, regarding the compulsory sterilization of inmates at mental institutions, has -- somehow -- never been overturned. Just a wee PSA for ya.
Seeing planeswalkers such as Vraska downgraded to UC, I wonder which ones (apart from the Gatewatch and Bolas) will be printed on R and MR. UC walkers are kind of okay, but the relation to some of the characters makes it difficult to digest the weaker cards (I don't mind Tibalt and Ob that much, but Vraska? c'mon). So far, the set seems interesting enough, but I'm waiting for the bombs.
You choose any number of permanents and/or players with counters on them, then give each another counter of a kind already there.
It's a kind, as in one of them. Should not matter all that often, but if you have a creature with i.e. a divinity counter and some +1/+1 counters, you now can (or rather have to) increment both, while with the old wording you had to choose.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
You choose any number of permanents and/or players with counters on them, then give each another counter of a kind already there.
It's a kind, as in one of them. Should not matter all that often, but if you have a creature with i.e. a divinity counter and some +1/+1 counters, you now can (or rather have to) increment both, while with the old wording you had to choose.
And they said I was a fool to combine +1/+1 counters with +2/+2 counters! Look who's laughing now!
The panel stream itself was a disaster, the countdown timer would repeatedly reach 20 seconds and then be reset to six minutes
After over 12 minutes of delays, the panel started with the War of the Spark trailer... but the stream had no sound.
And then the panelists didn't know that the stream was working again so they were stalling for time on stream by talking with Brad Nelson about the Mythic Invitational
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
The panel stream itself was a disaster, the countdown timer would repeatedly reach 20 seconds and then be reset to six minutes
After over 12 minutes of delays, the panel started with the War of the Spark trailer... but the stream had no sound.
And then the panelists didn't know that the stream was working again so they were stalling for time on stream by talking with Brad Nelson about the Mythic Invitational
Lol, so i guess it´s not worth it, seeing the livestream?
Lol, so i guess it´s not worth it, seeing the livestream?
This sounds like sarcasm
But nah, I should have just read all of the spoilers from the safety of this thread at my leisure, instead of staying up until past 8 AM to watch the panel when I had to get up for work in 5 hours
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
So, does this mean Dovin, Domri, Kaya, and Ral will also be hybrid uncommons? It would make sense that Bolas' PW agents are the uncommons who just go down in loyalty. They've been used and betrayed, of course their loyalty is slipping away. If I were to hazard a guess at a possible hybrid cycle:
(W/U) Dovin
(U/B) Ashiok
(B/R) Tibalt
(R/G) Domri
(G/W) Vivien
(W/B) Kaya
(U/R) Ral
(B/G) Vraska
(R/W) Samut
(G/U) Kiora
Though if Vraska indicates a "keywords matter" theme among the hybrid PWs, then Sorin would be more fitting for "lifelink matters" than Kaya and Angrath would fit Menace better than Tibalt.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Hybrid walkers are also super helpful for limited so you can play as many as possible. Especially prerelease/sealed where you'll have at least 6 of them.
Did anyone had the chance to take a closer look at the basic lands? Couldn't find them on here
Current count of different Legends: 1314
Current count of different Planeswalkers: 213
Current count of different Sagas: 44
Above all else, I'm a Vorthos.
They are the panarama of the city
http://mythicspoiler.com/newspoilers.html
Well, the 4 CMC multi-colored exiling sweeper is interesting, but too narrow to see even SB application.
Flux channeler super-proliferate within a deck filled with cantrips and red rituals could create something. Like a weird storm-like deck. (For example off shrine of burning rage)
invade the city looks like a potential card for yet another UR cantrippy / ritual deck. Make only on big guy seems not powerful enough though.
emergence zone being a land quicken is interesting. It does not give a card but does not really costs a slot in the deck.
Tezzet is too constly at 6 CMC, but affinity for artifact... have they not learned anything??? Oh, and its +2 can deal tons of damage in the same deck.
All in all, the first preview are interesting, to say the least.
I think it's the swirly black hole-thing behind Bolas in the trailer (seeing as that one Eternal channeled Dacks' planeswalker spark towards it). I hope it's a bit more interesting as a card than being another alt-win condition (probably related in some way to planeswalkers), but I must admit, it's the most likely possibility.
I like what they did with planeswalkers this set, and I think people are undervaluing Vraska bit. For an uncommon she is pretty powerful.
Not that much a fan of Amass, but I like the flavor behind it and I can see why they didn't go the fabricate route with it. Still, it's one of those mechanics that will need quite a lot of support to have any impact beyond limited (and even there it will probably lead to some feel-bad moments when the carefully grown army tokens bite the dust because of some removal spell). Not a fan, but also not hating it, and the flavor pushes my opinion on it into "mildly amused indifference"
-territory.
Oh how much I love that proliferate finally returns! Definitely my favorite mechanic of the Scars of Mirrodin-block and obvious choice for this set (and that's not a bad thing). I feel like that uncommon is really strong, bordering on broken in Commander.
I also really love the general feel and art of the set, so all in all a pretty positive first impression and really looking forward for more!
YOU AREN'T THE ONLY ONE!
Yay looks like my assumption in the potential preview cards (the one with the Paradise Druid) was right.
I can somehow feel that a UB Tezzeret Treasures deck might be a thing. Might want to load up on Revel in Riches!
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
Lilianas' triggered ability looks great. Though her other ones not so much.
Hopefuly Gideon has the same card-structure as she.
How do you find my Gideon ?
GIDEON, AVATAR OF COURAGE
6 mana, 8 Loyality
- All damage dealt to you, or another Planeswalker you control, is dealt to Gideon instead.
+2 Until your next turn, if Gideon takes damage, he deals 3 damage to the sources' controller & you draw a card.
0 Until end of turn Gideon becomes an 8/8 Human, Soulja with Indestructible & Protection from the color of your choice. Prevent all damage that would be dealt to him.
-7 Target opponent sacrifices from among his permanents so many cards, that he has equally many permanents of all card-types as you.
By that logic, energy wasn't parasitic because (with only one or two exceptions) all of the energy cards gave you the energy you needed to use them. Sure, Amass isn't terribly parasitic. For example, the 3/2 for 4 that gives you a 2/2 when it dies works regardless of where you play it. But to really use the mechanic the way it's intended rather than a glorified "create an x/x zombie token" you have to play it within the set. It's certainly more parasitic than proliferate but less so than energy, since it would interact with some older cards.
I doubt we'll get any 'army' creatures in the set. If we did, Amass would put counters there rather than a zombie token, which seems to be the intent of the mechanic. Though I guess they could make one if they really wanted you to be able to boost it with Amass. A flying Army creature would be really good for draft. Assuming they don't do something weird with Army though, it'll be a creature type so Changelings or other cards that mess with creature types will interact with it.
Now I gotta make the agonizing decision of what, if anything, I should cut from my Varina EDH to make room for Liliana and/or Dreadhorde Invasion.
I think they did learn. Specifically, that big, expensive cards that grant affinity aren't a problem.
It's like the saproling creature type; only shows up on tokens (and changelings).
-Tezz looks cool; kinda generic good artifact stuff, but the +2's really good in a dedicated deck.
-Vraska: I don't care if she's less powerful. Something nobody's mentioned so far: the art here is so cool. God, that's awesome. Fun uncommon, too.
-V's Finisher: Seen it already. Kinda narrow, a fine common. meh
-Ajani: Yeah, weird art and effect, but very generically powerful without feeling generic himself, so I'll take it. -2's great, effect is good, that's enough.
-Ignite the Beacon: Wait, so is Ajani dying? Nooo! Ajani was supposed to return to Theros, we've been waiting on that story for so long!
-Interplanar Beacon: Meh, superfriends enabler, that's all.
-Emergence Zone: Wait this is really good tho. Nice!
-No Escape: Decent common honestly
-Flux Channeler: Yes this is broken, why do you ask? I actually wonder if we'll see this in a new Modern Infect deck -- they play so many cheap pump spells already, this provides an alt-win that doesn't rely on combat. They're probably way too fast for that, though. In any case, this is weird 'cause I thought speculation mainly pointed to Mirrodin fairly soon after RtRtRavnica, and I'd be very surprised if they do Mirrodin without infect and proliferate -- and that would to me make it weird to put proliferate in another nearby set.
-Herald of the Dreadhorde: Since this is the first amass card on this list: I love amass! I think this mechanic is super cool. Also, this card on its own seems fun in limited and maybe even alright in some sort of Aristocrats style deck.
-Invade the City: Standard Izzet fare, but actually I can see it being pretty powerful -- it'd be easy in a Drakes deck to make this a 3/3 T3 or 4/4-5/5 T4, and it gets better as the game goes on.
-Dreadhorde Invasion: It's nothing close to a Bitterblossom. In a more dedicated amass deck -- or, even better, an Aristocrats deck that can use the tokens -- it can be a decent card, and it seems fun to play with.
-Widespread Brutality: This is a great example of the cool things amass can do. Quite powerful -- I don't know how, but I bet it'll get played in Standard somehow.
-Liliana: Yes this is sick. Yes I want this for my Sidisi edh deck. Otherwise, though, just a good top-end threat that deals with anything your opponent has left to attack it and then makes blockers/attackers.
-Ravnica at War: I wish there weren't so many exile cards in general, much less wraths, but this is narrow enough that I hope not to see much of it. Good effect and well-costed, just a personal taste for how exile ought to be used.
I'll also just mention the other cards we've seen so far:
-Ob Nixilis: This is a great uncommon. Kinda weird on an empty board, but big card advantage for your expendable cards, removal (however painful) for their threats, and some minor ping damage.
-Ob Nixilis's Cruelty: Jeez, that's a common?
-Tibalt: This is so cool. Very excited. This is pretty much a perfect Tibalt card. My sole complaint was I was hoping Tibalt would be the first one-mana planeswalker, but this is pretty cool too. Also, is it just me, or are getting rid of these planeswalkers through combat going to be very annoying if they don't use their minus abilities?
-Tibalt's thingbobber: Weird having a normal uncommon alongside all the planeswalkers. Meh.
-Time Wipe: This is awesome, and a good wrath effect. We may never again have Wrath of God in Standard, but I'm actually pretty happy with the 5-mana wipes and 4-mana conditional wipes that we've been getting -- I think it's been leading to more interesting designs.
Very excited for this set!
--Buck v Bell, 1927. This case, regarding the compulsory sterilization of inmates at mental institutions, has -- somehow -- never been overturned. Just a wee PSA for ya.
Old wording:
You choose any number of permanents and/or players with counters on them, then give each another counter of a kind already there.
New wording:
Choose any number of permanents and/or players, then give each another counter of each kind already there.
I'm not seeing the difference in functionality here.
The first time, if you have two different counters on a player or creature, you choose one to add another:
e.g. A Player with 1 experience counter and 1 poison counter can choose to proliferate the experience counter or the poison counter.
New wording, choosing the player results in adding both an experience counter AND a poison counter.
W(W/U)U Ephara - Flash & Taxes W(W/U)U || B(B/G)G Meren - Circle of Life B(B/G)G
RGW Marath - Ever shifting Wilds RGW || (U/R)C(W/B) Breya - Artificial Dominion (U/R)C(W/B)
UBR Becket Brass - take what you can, give nothing back UBR
Hope each color pair gets at least one.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
After over 12 minutes of delays, the panel started with the War of the Spark trailer... but the stream had no sound.
And then the panelists didn't know that the stream was working again so they were stalling for time on stream by talking with Brad Nelson about the Mythic Invitational
Lol, so i guess it´s not worth it, seeing the livestream?
"Exile ALL multicolored permanents"
C Long Live Eldrazi C
All lands are colorless by default, so no
This sounds like sarcasm
But nah, I should have just read all of the spoilers from the safety of this thread at my leisure, instead of staying up until past 8 AM to watch the panel when I had to get up for work in 5 hours
Not sure this is what you requested, but I stitched together the artwork from the PAX panel basic lands. You can take a closer look on it.