I noticed while reading it, it says that promos will be given out in packs of four? I assume they mean like 4 card showdown packs. I am worried that means less promos given to each store as they aren't giving out promos but bunching them together in a pack.
I also noticed while reading it that slots 1&2 will be standard rare/mythic, slot 3 is a foil basic land and slot 4 is a chosen card in the same vein as fnm promos but they will have alternate frames. I did not read anything about alternate art, they did mention a curveball but that could mean anything and not alternate art.
I preferred it before where we got alternate art and they looked cool. Don't get me wrong full art Opt looks amazing but its murder counterpart is unwanted. I hopeful they will learn from Aether Revolt and make good fnm promos like fatal push.
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Oath of the Gatewatch in a nutshell;
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse
"Slot four is the promo slot. With each Standard-legal set there will be a selection of special, season-specific cards, just like FNM promos (although, for the first season, there will be five cards, up from the usual three). Most of the time, you can expect to see the alternate frame cards you're accustomed to. But again, here and there, we'll throw a curveball."
This is the paragraph in question. I agree it sounds like we'll be getting old-bordered versions of the normal art on the card. It doesn't say there won't ba alternate art, though, and maybe full-art qualifies as "alternate frame?"
Since the packs are replacing the FNM promo, does that mean stores will receive a one-fourth of the packs for the same number of cards as the FNM promo or the same number of packs resulting in four times the number of cards? The article makes it pretty clear the stores can do what they want with these packs so I can see a new level of sleaze where the store breaks the packs open and hands the individual cards out.
And 1 in 4 is an all foil pack? Yeah, I can see them being searched.
At least my LGS is honest but he's tiny. He hasn't even decided what kind of floor to install so we've been playing on bare concrete. He puts most of his money back into hosting games and merchandising.
Since the packs are replacing the FNM promo, does that mean stores will receive a one-fourth of the packs for the same number of cards as the FNM promo or the same number of packs resulting in four times the number of cards? The article makes it pretty clear the stores can do what they want with these packs so I can see a new level of sleaze where the store breaks the packs open and hands the individual cards out.
Why exactly would that be "sleaze"? I mean, it would suck in comparison to a store that just hands out the four-card packs, but if a store decides to extend their prize support, perhaps to run more events, what would be wrong about that? We still don't know exactly how this new system will work in terms of what a store gets compared to what they get now.
This is the paragraph in question. I agree it sounds like we'll be getting old-bordered versions of the normal art on the card. It doesn't say there won't ba alternate art, though, and maybe full-art qualifies as "alternate frame?"
I think that the "alternate frame" is just the current FNM frame with inverted color, centered text and watermark
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"The Wheel of Time turns, and Ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again"
This is the paragraph in question. I agree it sounds like we'll be getting old-bordered versions of the normal art on the card. It doesn't say there won't ba alternate art, though, and maybe full-art qualifies as "alternate frame?"
I think that the "alternate frame" is just the current FNM frame with inverted color, centered text and watermark
Really? I haven't done FNM in forever. That's lame.
This is accompanied by a change in how stores are ranked with WPN. It used to be they needed a number of unique players, now it's changing to be based around repeat regular players.
The promo packs are going to be different depending on the level of the store.
When we spoke to wizards they said that there are only 18 stores in the world that might qualify for the highest tier status.
This is accompanied by a change in how stores are ranked with WPN. It used to be they needed a number of unique players, now it's changing to be based around repeat regular players.
The promo packs are going to be different depending on the level of the store.
When we spoke to wizards they said that there are only 18 stores in the world that might qualify for the highest tier status.
Since the packs are replacing the FNM promo, does that mean stores will receive a one-fourth of the packs for the same number of cards as the FNM promo or the same number of packs resulting in four times the number of cards? The article makes it pretty clear the stores can do what they want with these packs so I can see a new level of sleaze where the store breaks the packs open and hands the individual cards out.
Why exactly would that be "sleaze"? I mean, it would suck in comparison to a store that just hands out the four-card packs, but if a store decides to extend their prize support, perhaps to run more events, what would be wrong about that? We still don't know exactly how this new system will work in terms of what a store gets compared to what they get now.
I agree. It is early. It largely depends on what's in the packs, and an individuals preferences. I'm not even sure if they're randomized.
What I have a problem here is is that I don't really see anything that discourages sleazy WPN members from siphoning off the prize packs. Basically, break the packs open, keep the good cards, hand out the jank.
Is every store going to do that? No, of course not.
This is accompanied by a change in how stores are ranked with WPN. It used to be they needed a number of unique players, now it's changing to be based around repeat regular players.
The promo packs are going to be different depending on the level of the store.
When we spoke to wizards they said that there are only 18 stores in the world that might qualify for the highest tier status.
Just 18? Wow. How big do you need to be, jeez.
Wait... 18? Highest old tier or the new Premium membership? At less than 5%. Even if it's just 1% of the WPN stores in existence, that works out to a paltry 1,800 stores. There's no way that's right.
To be clear: we'll still do promo cards. But they'll be in packs of four, giving players more cards, more variety, and better curation—all without sacrificing the uniqueness players expect from things like FNM and Open House promos. And one in four of the packs your LGS receives will have all-foil contents.
Here's the breakdown of the first run, for Core Set 2020:
Slot one is a promo-stamped rare or mythic rare from the most recent set. Could be any rare or mythic rare.
Slot two is a promo-stamped rare or mythic rare from a short, curated list. These will be from Standard-legal sets, and they'll be hand-selected by Magic's design studio. (These lists will be public.) You'll also see a curveball here and there—one such curveball will come with Core Set 2020. We'll show you when card previews start. You'll like it.
Slot three is a promo-stamped alternate-art basic land.
Slot four is the promo slot. With each Standard-legal set there will be a selection of special, season-specific cards, just like FNM promos (although, for the first season, there will be five cards, up from the usual three). Most of the time, you can expect to see the alternate frame cards you're accustomed to. But again, here and there, we'll throw a curveball.
Some promos will still be standalone cards. Buy-a-Box, for example, will continue to come with, well, buying a box.
stores are rated, and subsequently given some number of these event 'agnostic' promo packs based on tickets and engaged players.
tickets:
Tickets represent the total number of entries across all of a store's events. Any format. Commander, Modern, Ranked, Casual—everything counts. And it counts the same player multiple times. You join a midnight Prelease, that's a ticket. You come back for the 5 p.m. Prerelease on Saturday, that's another.
engaged players:
Engaged players are the best indicator of the quality of experience a store offers. It's our phrase for a player who joins six events in either Standard, Draft, or Sealed per year—so, once every two months.
there is no indication on how these are rated relative to one another. if i had to guess the addition of the 'engaged players' metric, aside from the obvious motivations (ie caring about current products and entry/level 1 mtg players), it will allow stores of different stripes to focus on different things while still maintaining obtainable rewards.
promo packs wont be limited to specific events like fnm or showdowns. just whatever works for the store. maybe a store has a 'monday night modern' or whatever that has a lot of traction in the local community, and now they can lean into that by offering promos.
i dont know how the packs themselves will turn out, especially with wizards throwing out these ambiguous 'curveballs'; however given the details the system looks like a genuine improvement and one of the better moves wizards has made in a while (a long while). in regards to stores doing shady or underhanded things with the packs, not much about the change influences anything since stores can abuse promos currently; and they will still be upheld by the same WPN standards going forward (ie reporting + consequences).
the only thing id worry about is stores figuring out how to transition. they are being given more agency, and it seems likely that some number of stores with less than savvy owners wont know what to do without being explicitly told. given that i wouldnt be surprised to hear of stores just chugging along like its business as usual and handing out promos for fnm.
edit: to speculate on what wizards might do with the 'standard-legal' slot and the 'curated list' slot. they may use the new system to get choice cards into circulation. high value reprints as promos might be too high of a hurdle to overcome, such as ramping up competition to uncomfortable levels or otherwise tempting the abuse those in this thread are worried about. however 'curated list' sounds similar to mtgo treasure chests, where its not a huge source of supply but the steady flow helps keeps prices manageable. perhaps wizards will indeed emulate mtgo treasure chests by having such a large list of possible inclusions that you cant reasonably expect to open any of the value cards. like imagine some really small chance to open a fetchland or whatever.
The damn promos where about the only reason I went for fnm. Good way to kill attendance at fnm.
so now that there will be more and more diverse promos you don't go anymore?
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Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
stores are getting more promos and are able to use them as they want. I really don't understand what are people complaining about.
This move has received universal praise everywhere, even from people that are know for not going soft with their complains.
I remember talking to the owner of my FLGS few months ago about promos and this is exactly what he was saying, that he wanted to be able to use the promos he was given for anything. now they can do it. for any event they put up they can give away promos and guess what? the more events they do, the more promos they'll get.
what's not to like?
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Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
Assuming they will occasionally have alternate art for these promos, I'm happy with the fact that they won't always be foil.
I would have loved for some promo cards to have a non-foil print run and that doesn't happen very often.
Unless I'm misreading it and the "promo slot" will always have a foil card in it.
Oh, Well... This will surely inflate the number of promo angels I have to get for my collection...
This is a bad idea. This will result in less promos for smaller stores that use those promos to draw people in. They can try to claim whatever they want. They have lowered prize support continually for tournaments. Resulting in the local stores having to provide all of the prize support. I'd be happy if I was wrong but I don't think I am. I'll have to ask how many promos my store is sent in a few months vs now.
smaller stores were already receiving fewer promos relatively. if its a matter of being worried about fewer promos across the board thanks to the switch to packs instead of cards; both big and small stores are affected relatively the same.
what does change with the update is the addition of a new metric to guide promo distribution aside from reported attendance: engaged player numbers. consider how stores can be classified right now:
-low attendance
-high attendance
then consider how stores can be classified moving forward:
-low attendance, low engagement
-low attendance, high engagement
-high attendance, low engagement
-high attendance, high engagement
granted its more of a spectrum rather than being clear cut like that, but in general the update opens a new opportunity for low attendance stores that wasnt previously there. therefore, if anything, they benefit.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
stores are getting more promos and are able to use them as they want. I really don't understand what are people complaining about.
This move has received universal praise everywhere, even from people that are know for not going soft with their complains.
I remember talking to the owner of my FLGS few months ago about promos and this is exactly what he was saying, that he wanted to be able to use the promos he was given for anything. now they can do it. for any event they put up they can give away promos and guess what? the more events they do, the more promos they'll get.
what's not to like?
Stores could hand out promos as they see anyway. Many stores in the UK already do, its just the showdown packs they could only hand out to standard players.
I am upset because we won't get alternate art for fnm promos anymore and they did not say they would give out the same number of packs as stores got promos. If you got 80 promos per month, there is no guarentee you will get 80 promo packs, for all you know you could get 20 which is still 80 foil cards in packs but still only 20 fnm promo cards.
I for one loved the alternate art for promos, such as Cloudpost, Fatal Push, Elvish Visionary or even Go for the Throat have amazing alternate art. The fact we don't get alternate art is depressing.
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Oath of the Gatewatch in a nutshell;
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse
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https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/introducing-new-wizards-play-network-2019-03-12
I noticed while reading it, it says that promos will be given out in packs of four? I assume they mean like 4 card showdown packs. I am worried that means less promos given to each store as they aren't giving out promos but bunching them together in a pack.
I also noticed while reading it that slots 1&2 will be standard rare/mythic, slot 3 is a foil basic land and slot 4 is a chosen card in the same vein as fnm promos but they will have alternate frames. I did not read anything about alternate art, they did mention a curveball but that could mean anything and not alternate art.
I preferred it before where we got alternate art and they looked cool. Don't get me wrong full art Opt looks amazing but its murder counterpart is unwanted. I hopeful they will learn from Aether Revolt and make good fnm promos like fatal push.
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse
This is the paragraph in question. I agree it sounds like we'll be getting old-bordered versions of the normal art on the card. It doesn't say there won't ba alternate art, though, and maybe full-art qualifies as "alternate frame?"
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
And 1 in 4 is an all foil pack? Yeah, I can see them being searched.
At least my LGS is honest but he's tiny. He hasn't even decided what kind of floor to install so we've been playing on bare concrete. He puts most of his money back into hosting games and merchandising.
Why exactly would that be "sleaze"? I mean, it would suck in comparison to a store that just hands out the four-card packs, but if a store decides to extend their prize support, perhaps to run more events, what would be wrong about that? We still don't know exactly how this new system will work in terms of what a store gets compared to what they get now.
I think that the "alternate frame" is just the current FNM frame with inverted color, centered text and watermark
Really? I haven't done FNM in forever. That's lame.
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
The promo packs are going to be different depending on the level of the store.
When we spoke to wizards they said that there are only 18 stores in the world that might qualify for the highest tier status.
3BB
Sorcery
You lose the game.
Just 18? Wow. How big do you need to be, jeez.
I agree. It is early. It largely depends on what's in the packs, and an individuals preferences. I'm not even sure if they're randomized.
What I have a problem here is is that I don't really see anything that discourages sleazy WPN members from siphoning off the prize packs. Basically, break the packs open, keep the good cards, hand out the jank.
Is every store going to do that? No, of course not.
Wait... 18? Highest old tier or the new Premium membership? At less than 5%. Even if it's just 1% of the WPN stores in existence, that works out to a paltry 1,800 stores. There's no way that's right.
stores are rated, and subsequently given some number of these event 'agnostic' promo packs based on tickets and engaged players.
tickets:
engaged players:
there is no indication on how these are rated relative to one another. if i had to guess the addition of the 'engaged players' metric, aside from the obvious motivations (ie caring about current products and entry/level 1 mtg players), it will allow stores of different stripes to focus on different things while still maintaining obtainable rewards.
promo packs wont be limited to specific events like fnm or showdowns. just whatever works for the store. maybe a store has a 'monday night modern' or whatever that has a lot of traction in the local community, and now they can lean into that by offering promos.
i dont know how the packs themselves will turn out, especially with wizards throwing out these ambiguous 'curveballs'; however given the details the system looks like a genuine improvement and one of the better moves wizards has made in a while (a long while). in regards to stores doing shady or underhanded things with the packs, not much about the change influences anything since stores can abuse promos currently; and they will still be upheld by the same WPN standards going forward (ie reporting + consequences).
the only thing id worry about is stores figuring out how to transition. they are being given more agency, and it seems likely that some number of stores with less than savvy owners wont know what to do without being explicitly told. given that i wouldnt be surprised to hear of stores just chugging along like its business as usual and handing out promos for fnm.
edit: to speculate on what wizards might do with the 'standard-legal' slot and the 'curated list' slot. they may use the new system to get choice cards into circulation. high value reprints as promos might be too high of a hurdle to overcome, such as ramping up competition to uncomfortable levels or otherwise tempting the abuse those in this thread are worried about. however 'curated list' sounds similar to mtgo treasure chests, where its not a huge source of supply but the steady flow helps keeps prices manageable. perhaps wizards will indeed emulate mtgo treasure chests by having such a large list of possible inclusions that you cant reasonably expect to open any of the value cards. like imagine some really small chance to open a fetchland or whatever.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)so now that there will be more and more diverse promos you don't go anymore?
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
Yea. But these probably won’t be “free”. It’s ok. Communities don’t need that kind of participant.
This move has received universal praise everywhere, even from people that are know for not going soft with their complains.
I remember talking to the owner of my FLGS few months ago about promos and this is exactly what he was saying, that he wanted to be able to use the promos he was given for anything. now they can do it. for any event they put up they can give away promos and guess what? the more events they do, the more promos they'll get.
what's not to like?
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
I would have loved for some promo cards to have a non-foil print run and that doesn't happen very often.
Unless I'm misreading it and the "promo slot" will always have a foil card in it.
Oh, Well... This will surely inflate the number of promo angels I have to get for my collection...
what does change with the update is the addition of a new metric to guide promo distribution aside from reported attendance: engaged player numbers. consider how stores can be classified right now:
-low attendance
-high attendance
then consider how stores can be classified moving forward:
-low attendance, low engagement
-low attendance, high engagement
-high attendance, low engagement
-high attendance, high engagement
granted its more of a spectrum rather than being clear cut like that, but in general the update opens a new opportunity for low attendance stores that wasnt previously there. therefore, if anything, they benefit.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Stores could hand out promos as they see anyway. Many stores in the UK already do, its just the showdown packs they could only hand out to standard players.
I am upset because we won't get alternate art for fnm promos anymore and they did not say they would give out the same number of packs as stores got promos. If you got 80 promos per month, there is no guarentee you will get 80 promo packs, for all you know you could get 20 which is still 80 foil cards in packs but still only 20 fnm promo cards.
I for one loved the alternate art for promos, such as Cloudpost, Fatal Push, Elvish Visionary or even Go for the Throat have amazing alternate art. The fact we don't get alternate art is depressing.
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse