A thought to leave this thread on and I hope some really think about this, truly think about it, just let it sink in for a moment and don't worry about one-upping or whatever.
If you met someone who said he/she thinks the sky is red. You talk to them, they say the sky is red. Its their opinion based on observations they have made (correct or incorrect) over their lifetime. Their opinion, their belief is the sky is red in color. That is their opinion, flawed or not. They are entitled to that thought and their opinion is just as valid as anyone else's opinion on the subject. It hurts no one, it has no bearing on the wellness of anyone on the planet. Real truth/fact and opinion can be separate. You and I know the sky is blue (most of the time). That person's opinion isn't wrong. They have the facts wrong. A person having that opinion doesn't make something that is true, untrue. Their opinion is not an attack on the opinions of others or an attack on the reality of the situation or facts themselves.
I have been playing this game (with love for it) since 1994. I have played a multitude of different games with a multitude of different people from the time I could roll a dice back into the early 1970's. I have played with people of all ages, races, ethnicities, colors, creeds and sexual preferences. Those things have always been left aside at the table, they didn't matter. What mattered was the game and the interaction of people at that table. I am a better person for it and will continue my course. So when I say that I detect a hint of SJW creeping its way into the game I love the most and that I have seen evidence of it albeit subtle in Battlebond, I don't do it lightly. Again, this is my OPINION based on observations I have made. Shouting me down, calling me names, berating me, trying to invalidate my opinion, FALSELY QUOTING ME AND PUTTING WORDS INTO MY MOUTH doesn't change what I have observed (and others have seen it as well.) My opinion was asked, I gave it. If any would like to talk about it further we can do so by PM. I've been saying it, its unhealthy to dwell on something you can't make a change to.
Can we agree to disagree and move on? I hear many like this set, I hear many don't think its SJW leaning. Points taken. Best wishes, truly. I've got to let it go.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Is it just me or is Battlebond really just Unstable 2?
Unstable is a different beast than battlebond, but I tend to favor the set that lets someone play two headed giant or just a normal one vs one. That and as long as the packs are bought at 3-4 dollars, there's never a feel bad pack since each one has a borderless full art land or a foil token. It's a set about playing the game more than a set meant to be evaluated on a financial merit.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Finally, I'll say that I'm disappointed to hear that "SJW" ***** from you in the first place, as the pejorative itself typically denotes an unwillingness to have a true discussion.
I think just saying "SJW" is a bad way to convince anyone of anything. I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus. I'd also accuse Arena Rector of being extremely unpleasant to look at. But honestly, if you want to discuss about the 'why' of something being a pandering act by WOTC, you run the risk of getting infracted on this site. The art and flavor doesn't affect the card game, so it's not worth martyring yourself for that. It just means you have to have an artist paint on your Arena Rectors in exchange for cash.
I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus.
How does being a homunculus make you genderless? Magic homunculus seems to be a flesh and blood race in magic which means they reproduce somehow.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus.
How does being a homunculus make you genderless? Magic homunculus seems to be a flesh and blood race in magic which means they reproduce somehow.
Homonculi are artificially created beings, I would imagine the expectation is they don’t really reproduce, just are created when needed.
But I don’t see Zndr as being inconsistent. We don’t know the specifics on Zndr really at this point, or what homonculi are like.
I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus.
How does being a homunculus make you genderless? Magic homunculus seems to be a flesh and blood race in magic which means they reproduce somehow.
Homonculi are artificially created beings, I would imagine the expectation is they don’t really reproduce, just are created when needed.
But I don’t see Zndr as being inconsistent. We don’t know the specifics on Zndr really at this point, or what homonculi are like.
You know I thought there was something about Fblthp having a family but it was a line spoken from Azores bureaucrat about Fblthp depends allowed to petition a memorial tablet of him, so it might just be Azores law dribble.
We might learn more since the chances of getting Fblthp card is likely in the 3rd Ravnica set this year.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus.
How does being a homunculus make you genderless? Magic homunculus seems to be a flesh and blood race in magic which means they reproduce somehow.
On a one to three planes so far homunculus seem to be made, which is one reason to believe they are genderless, but on this plane they might be a normal race of being that can breed. Can't be sure either way unless otherwise said though.
Perhaps I put too much stock in D&D homunculi being similar to MTG ones. Could just be the name they decided to give a sparsely represented race of pygmy cyclops.
Perhaps I put too much stock in D&D homunculi being similar to MTG ones. Could just be the name they decided to give a sparsely represented race of pygmy cyclops.
That's alright, always remember that each plane may have a "normal" race that is different than what we are used to after years of seeing the usual version(s) of them.
I think my biggest issue with the set is that they threw all these reprints in there without re-flavoring any of them. It seems weird to have Amonkhet and Ravnica themed/flavor cards without changing them here. Why change doubling season and leave things like greater good and land tax untouched?
Conspiracy was similar in that some cards got new art, but other reprints kept off-plane art/flavor text. I'm not a big fan of the new Doubling Season art, but then again I only like the original.
Perhaps I put too much stock in D&D homunculi being similar to MTG ones. Could just be the name they decided to give a sparsely represented race of pygmy cyclops.
That's alright, always remember that each plane may have a "normal" race that is different than what we are used to after years of seeing the usual version(s) of them.
Goblins come to mind. Or even in this set we have a mono-White Elf. Ixalan has the Green Merfolk too. They still make sense, they’re just exploring different areas with them.
A homunculus is by definition made rather than born. The creation of a "person in a bottle" was a major goal of alchemists in the 16th century, which is what a homunculus refers to. However, this doesn't remove the concept of gender. Certainly, the alchemists of the time envisioned homunculus as a little man with all the man bits.
Of course MTG is its own thing, but if you're not grown in a lab, you're not really a homunculus.
Goblins come to mind. Or even in this set we have a mono-White Elf. Ixalan has the Green Merfolk too. They still make sense, they’re just exploring different areas with them.
We're not talking about mana here though, we're talking about what makes a homunculus a homunculus. There are certain traits that if you change require you to be called something else. Green Merfolk are still fishmen. White Elves are still long lived humans with pointy ears. They didn't change anything fundamental there. Somewhere down the line, the Homunculus's core traits shifted from being "manufactured little men" into "goblins/leprechauns with one eye instead of two." Magic's homunculus is either starkly different from the typical, or inconsistent with itself.
Goblins come to mind. Or even in this set we have a mono-White Elf. Ixalan has the Green Merfolk too. They still make sense, they’re just exploring different areas with them.
We're not talking about mana here though, we're talking about what makes a homunculus a homunculus. There are certain traits that if you change require you to be called something else. Green Merfolk are still fishmen. White Elves are still long lived humans with pointy ears. They didn't change anything fundamental there. Somewhere down the line, the Homunculus's core traits shifted from being "manufactured little men" into "goblins/leprechauns with one eye instead of two." Magic's homunculus is either starkly different from the typical, or inconsistent with itself.
Even if they’re created that doesn’t mean gender is inapplicable though, so WotC still isn’t being inconsistent.
Funny thing about Homunculus in MTG is that they seem to be the same on every plane (currently: Dominaria, Innistrad, Mirrodin, Ravnica, Fiora, and "Battlebond"). Goblins vary plane-to-plan from lil' green creatures to furry monkeys. Elves change in look, and merfolk change drastically too (some planes they have legs, others they don't. Sometimes they look like swamp creatures, other times they're pretty much human.). Yet the homunculus seems to always be depicted as a small creature with one giant eye (edit: I stand corrected, Court Homunculus breaks this mold, and is the only artifact homunculus). Gender can still be applied to artificial creatures. In most sci-fi, androids and replicants are usually designed with a specific gender in mind. Though they can't reproduce, they are usually still referred to by other characters with specific gender pronouns (this often allows writers to identify bigoted characters as the ones who ignore these pronouns and call all androids "it").
Given that homunculus do have genders, and basically look the same on every plane, I hope MTG decides to dive deeper into this homunculus lore in upcoming sets, as I think that's an area ripe for rich storytelling and world exploration. Is one planeswalker creating homunculus on every plane, hence the identical features? Have homunculus achieved reproductive capabilities and now live in individualized communities? Is there a plane where all homunculus originate? It's great food for thought!
I appreciate you all getting back on topic, but I'm going to ask that the term SJW to be removed from your vocabulary in this forum. The term SJW is just too loaded, the instant it's mentioned it derails a conversation. It's just not useful. From now on I'm going to assume that anyone using the term is deliberately trolling and will treat it accordingly.
Well, can’t quote you oddly CatParty, but I don’t think homonculi have been all that different because they’re kind of rare. That and Fblthp wound up super popular, which probably solidified the core look. They may mix up the core look in a future set but I think they’re too rare to really make too different.
I would agree with everyone that the art direction of the set is just all over the place. Outside of the arena itself, I have no idea what this plane looks like (outside of the lands), and there's just so many contrasting styles, and a lot of it looks amateurish. I guess they chose to do that to give it an air of "fun" and a cartoony hipsterish tournament vibe? Or maybe they had their main art team working on Dominaria // M2019 and tried out a newer team for this set. (That being said, I don't keep track of artists)
I think the reprints in this set (and some of the blue/white cards for EDH) are great-- though I do wonder (outside of Doubling Season, TNN, and Land Tax) how much these reprints will fall in pricing, as originally most of these cards were dollar cards just 5 years ago. Saying this as I usually pick up singles, so I'll probably have to wait 3 months before prices settle at their lowest.
If you met someone who said he/she thinks the sky is red. You talk to them, they say the sky is red. Its their opinion based on observations they have made (correct or incorrect) over their lifetime. Their opinion, their belief is the sky is red in color. That is their opinion, flawed or not. They are entitled to that thought and their opinion is just as valid as anyone else's opinion on the subject. It hurts no one, it has no bearing on the wellness of anyone on the planet. Real truth/fact and opinion can be separate. You and I know the sky is blue (most of the time). That person's opinion isn't wrong. They have the facts wrong. A person having that opinion doesn't make something that is true, untrue. Their opinion is not an attack on the opinions of others or an attack on the reality of the situation or facts themselves.
I have been playing this game (with love for it) since 1994. I have played a multitude of different games with a multitude of different people from the time I could roll a dice back into the early 1970's. I have played with people of all ages, races, ethnicities, colors, creeds and sexual preferences. Those things have always been left aside at the table, they didn't matter. What mattered was the game and the interaction of people at that table. I am a better person for it and will continue my course. So when I say that I detect a hint of SJW creeping its way into the game I love the most and that I have seen evidence of it albeit subtle in Battlebond, I don't do it lightly. Again, this is my OPINION based on observations I have made. Shouting me down, calling me names, berating me, trying to invalidate my opinion, FALSELY QUOTING ME AND PUTTING WORDS INTO MY MOUTH doesn't change what I have observed (and others have seen it as well.) My opinion was asked, I gave it. If any would like to talk about it further we can do so by PM. I've been saying it, its unhealthy to dwell on something you can't make a change to.
Can we agree to disagree and move on? I hear many like this set, I hear many don't think its SJW leaning. Points taken. Best wishes, truly. I've got to let it go.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Unstable is a different beast than battlebond, but I tend to favor the set that lets someone play two headed giant or just a normal one vs one. That and as long as the packs are bought at 3-4 dollars, there's never a feel bad pack since each one has a borderless full art land or a foil token. It's a set about playing the game more than a set meant to be evaluated on a financial merit.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think just saying "SJW" is a bad way to convince anyone of anything. I would, however, accuse WOTC of inconsistency. They made a big deal about the Aetherborn being genderless representations of non-binary identifying people, and that's okay, but Zndrsplt being female just makes no sense, being a homunculus. I'd also accuse Arena Rector of being extremely unpleasant to look at. But honestly, if you want to discuss about the 'why' of something being a pandering act by WOTC, you run the risk of getting infracted on this site. The art and flavor doesn't affect the card game, so it's not worth martyring yourself for that. It just means you have to have an artist paint on your Arena Rectors in exchange for cash.
How does being a homunculus make you genderless? Magic homunculus seems to be a flesh and blood race in magic which means they reproduce somehow.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Homonculi are artificially created beings, I would imagine the expectation is they don’t really reproduce, just are created when needed.
But I don’t see Zndr as being inconsistent. We don’t know the specifics on Zndr really at this point, or what homonculi are like.
You know I thought there was something about Fblthp having a family but it was a line spoken from Azores bureaucrat about Fblthp depends allowed to petition a memorial tablet of him, so it might just be Azores law dribble.
We might learn more since the chances of getting Fblthp card is likely in the 3rd Ravnica set this year.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
On a one to three planes so far homunculus seem to be made, which is one reason to believe they are genderless, but on this plane they might be a normal race of being that can breed. Can't be sure either way unless otherwise said though.
That's alright, always remember that each plane may have a "normal" race that is different than what we are used to after years of seeing the usual version(s) of them.
Conspiracy was similar in that some cards got new art, but other reprints kept off-plane art/flavor text. I'm not a big fan of the new Doubling Season art, but then again I only like the original.
Goblins come to mind. Or even in this set we have a mono-White Elf. Ixalan has the Green Merfolk too. They still make sense, they’re just exploring different areas with them.
Of course MTG is its own thing, but if you're not grown in a lab, you're not really a homunculus.
Low-power cube enthusiast!
My 1570 card cube (no longer updated)
My 415 Peasant+ Artifact and Enchantment Cube
Ever-Expanding "Just throw it in" cube.
We're not talking about mana here though, we're talking about what makes a homunculus a homunculus. There are certain traits that if you change require you to be called something else. Green Merfolk are still fishmen. White Elves are still long lived humans with pointy ears. They didn't change anything fundamental there. Somewhere down the line, the Homunculus's core traits shifted from being "manufactured little men" into "goblins/leprechauns with one eye instead of two." Magic's homunculus is either starkly different from the typical, or inconsistent with itself.
Even if they’re created that doesn’t mean gender is inapplicable though, so WotC still isn’t being inconsistent.
Given that homunculus do have genders, and basically look the same on every plane, I hope MTG decides to dive deeper into this homunculus lore in upcoming sets, as I think that's an area ripe for rich storytelling and world exploration. Is one planeswalker creating homunculus on every plane, hence the identical features? Have homunculus achieved reproductive capabilities and now live in individualized communities? Is there a plane where all homunculus originate? It's great food for thought!
GWUBRDraft my Old Border Nostalgia Cube! and/or The Little Pauper Cube That Could!RBUWG
Modern:WDeath & TaxesW | RUGRUG DelverRUG
Only the artdirection is a joke. The mechanics and the set itself are very good.
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.”
—Volrath
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/homunculus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/homunculus
Same. I wonder if it’ll be popular at my store.
I think we did a total of one draft for the first Conspiracy, none from the second and one unstable draft so casual drafts aren't huge
GWUBRDraft my Old Border Nostalgia Cube! and/or The Little Pauper Cube That Could!RBUWG
Modern:WDeath & TaxesW | RUGRUG DelverRUG
I think the reprints in this set (and some of the blue/white cards for EDH) are great-- though I do wonder (outside of Doubling Season, TNN, and Land Tax) how much these reprints will fall in pricing, as originally most of these cards were dollar cards just 5 years ago. Saying this as I usually pick up singles, so I'll probably have to wait 3 months before prices settle at their lowest.