Also, I don’t know every art for every card but this is the only card I can think of that has gone through a gender swap - what are the others out there that have done this?
elvish ranger is a famous example because the original female art is very sexualized. elvish piper, elvish champion, gaea's herald, honored hierarch (i'm just looking through green creatures alphabetically). the reality is that it happens all the time and nobody really notices or comments. the card auramancer originally had some great guay art featuring a female wizard but more recent art depicts the character as male. i feel like i see it pretty often.
Also, I don’t know every art for every card but this is the only card I can think of that has gone through a gender swap - what are the others out there that have done this?
elvish ranger is a famous example because the original female art is very sexualized. elvish piper, elvish champion, gaea's herald, honored hierarch (i'm just looking through green creatures alphabetically). the reality is that it happens all the time and nobody really notices or comments. the card auramancer originally had some great guay art featuring a female wizard but more recent art depicts the character as male. i feel like i see it pretty often.
Ah, thank you - I appreciate the enlightenment! I'm clearly one of those people that never noticed it. Probably just because of those cards you listed, this is the only one that I actually play with lol!
Huntmaster's new art really demonstrates my views about card art and it's relationship to world building and non-legendary creatures in Magic and why ultimately the gender of a creature doesn't matter and should change without issue, I really really dig it.
I've always liked thinking of the art on non-legendary creatures as being just a single example of what that kind of creature could be in a broader sense, but never necessarily the creature depicted in the image. A Huntmaster of the Fells isn't THAT guy in that card image, a Huntmaster of the Fells is an archetype that expresses itself on the plane of Innistrad and happens over and over again throughout the population. Of course the art will have to be a depiction of a single person, because it would be way too difficult to make every card have a unique image. The art is just a starting point for the player's imagination to extrapolate what that creature is and does in that world, using not only the art but the flavor text and what the card actually does to assemble a complete creature that tells you something about the world. I LOVE it when new art for an existing card uses this approach and chooses to depict a different individual but still the same idea and role. Of course this Huntmaster isn't the same one as the original, the original was just some arbitrary individual version of a Huntmaster which exists in a society with a whole bunch of other Huntmasters traipsing around with different hairs and genders and qualities that really have nothing to do with being a Huntmaster and ultimately wouldn't result in a functionally different card. Dude on the original card wasn't a particularly important one to begin with, otherwise he'd be legendary and his name would be like Carl and you'd only get to play one of him on a battlefield at a time. This new art gives us more information about what this kind of creature can be in Innistrad and personally makes my imagination feel good and stuff.
By contrast the new art for Delver is amazing, but doesn't really tell us anything new about the creature and it's role in the plane. I feel like it's pretty safe to assume this is the actual same dude from the original card, unless he's from some Innistrad version of Buddhist Monks or something where everyone fashions themselves in a really specific way for spiritual reasons. With this new art we still only get a single example of what a Delver of Secrets can be and look like, when presumably it's a thing that just exists and has the potential to happen over and over again, resulting in 8 Delver board-states being possible. This feels a little like one artist saying "I could do that better" or something. Or who knows, maybe a card that iconic came with a Wizards mandate saying it has to be samesies.
Huntmaster's new art really demonstrates my views about card art and it's relationship to world building and non-legendary creatures in Magic and why ultimately the gender of a creature doesn't matter and should change without issue, I really really dig it.
I've always liked thinking of the art on non-legendary creatures as being just a single example of what that kind of creature could be in a broader sense, but never necessarily the creature depicted in the image. A Huntmaster of the Fells isn't THAT guy in that card image, a Huntmaster of the Fells is an archetype that expresses itself on the plane of Innistrad and happens over and over again throughout the population. Of course the art will have to be a depiction of a single person, because it would be way too difficult to make every card have a unique image. The art is just a starting point for the player's imagination to extrapolate what that creature is and does in that world, using not only the art but the flavor text and what the card actually does to assemble a complete creature that tells you something about the world. I LOVE it when new art for an existing card uses this approach and chooses to depict a different individual but still the same idea and role. Of course this Huntmaster isn't the same one as the original, the original was just some arbitrary individual version of a Huntmaster which exists in a society with a whole bunch of other Huntmasters traipsing around with different hairs and genders and qualities that really have nothing to do with being a Huntmaster and ultimately wouldn't result in a functionally different card. Dude on the original card wasn't a particularly important one to begin with, otherwise he'd be legendary and his name would be like Carl and you'd only get to play one of him on a battlefield at a time. This new art gives us more information about what this kind of creature can be in Innistrad and personally makes my imagination feel good and stuff.
By contrast the new art for Delver is amazing, but doesn't really tell us anything new about the creature and it's role in the plane. I feel like it's pretty safe to assume this is the actual same dude from the original card, unless he's from some Innistrad version of Buddhist Monks or something where everyone fashions themselves in a really specific way for spiritual reasons. With this new art we still only get a single example of what a Delver of Secrets can be and look like, when presumably it's a thing that just exists and has the potential to happen over and over again, resulting in 8 Delver board-states being possible. This feels a little like one artist saying "I could do that better" or something. Or who knows, maybe a card that iconic came with a Wizards mandate saying it has to be samesies.
I like your perspective. I have two takeaways from your post.
1. From this point forward, whenever I play my Huntmaster of the Fells (male) in a game I will refer to him as Carl; because that's hilarious to me. "I summon...CARL OF THE FELLS!"
2. I really enjoy playing Elder Scrolls Online. A lot of the characters I make are inspired by MTG creatures. I made a werewolf character loosely designed on the art from Huntmaster of the Fells. He is a big, burley, Nord rocking the beard, wields axes and uses the Fighter's Guild crossbow abilities. So, I completely agree with you on using the art as a jumping off point to allow your imagination to determine who this character actually is and having more source material with new perspectives is always welcome. Also, I now wish that I named that ESO character Carl....
Huntmaster's new art really demonstrates my views about card art and it's relationship to world building and non-legendary creatures in Magic and why ultimately the gender of a creature doesn't matter and should change without issue, I really really dig it.
I've always liked thinking of the art on non-legendary creatures as being just a single example of what that kind of creature could be in a broader sense, but never necessarily the creature depicted in the image. A Huntmaster of the Fells isn't THAT guy in that card image, a Huntmaster of the Fells is an archetype that expresses itself on the plane of Innistrad and happens over and over again throughout the population. Of course the art will have to be a depiction of a single person, because it would be way too difficult to make every card have a unique image. The art is just a starting point for the player's imagination to extrapolate what that creature is and does in that world, using not only the art but the flavor text and what the card actually does to assemble a complete creature that tells you something about the world. I LOVE it when new art for an existing card uses this approach and chooses to depict a different individual but still the same idea and role. Of course this Huntmaster isn't the same one as the original, the original was just some arbitrary individual version of a Huntmaster which exists in a society with a whole bunch of other Huntmasters traipsing around with different hairs and genders and qualities that really have nothing to do with being a Huntmaster and ultimately wouldn't result in a functionally different card. Dude on the original card wasn't a particularly important one to begin with, otherwise he'd be legendary and his name would be like Carl and you'd only get to play one of him on a battlefield at a time. This new art gives us more information about what this kind of creature can be in Innistrad and personally makes my imagination feel good and stuff.
By contrast the new art for Delver is amazing, but doesn't really tell us anything new about the creature and it's role in the plane. I feel like it's pretty safe to assume this is the actual same dude from the original card, unless he's from some Innistrad version of Buddhist Monks or something where everyone fashions themselves in a really specific way for spiritual reasons. With this new art we still only get a single example of what a Delver of Secrets can be and look like, when presumably it's a thing that just exists and has the potential to happen over and over again, resulting in 8 Delver board-states being possible. This feels a little like one artist saying "I could do that better" or something. Or who knows, maybe a card that iconic came with a Wizards mandate saying it has to be samesies.
I like your perspective. I have two takeaways from your post.
1. From this point forward, whenever I play my Huntmaster of the Fells (male) in a game I will refer to him as Carl; because that's hilarious to me. "I summon...CARL OF THE FELLS!"
That's all I really wanted, to make CARL OF THE FELLS a thing.
If no jace, don’t worry... within 2 years we should get a modern masters with hin as the main seller (*with colected company too)
The thing is that putting double faced cards is a huge logistic commitment. They will do it at some point, but there needs to be a lot of DFC stuff to reprint to make it worthwhile, which will probably be a while... any by then, Jace could be a $70+ card. This is why I was so sure that Jace would be in this set, it would be the one place they could print him without doing a Masters set with DFCs. In fact, I honestly thought this was what drove them to do FTV: Transform in the first place.
All this, of course, is coming from the guy who stubbornly swore that they'd NEVER reprint the Zen fetches in a MM set, so... yeah, what do I know.
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When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Honestly, I think the magic community as a whole is in a constant state of unease thanks to how reprints are handled and the constant worry of spiking costs on cards. Its not that we want Jace in the from the vaults because he is necessarily the best fit: we want him there to justify a monetary value prospect.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
So why is this pre-ordering for 60 usd? The MSRP is 35 dollars from what I can tell.
Because MSRP on these products is less of a guideline than on any other product. These are still LGS gift products, essentially, and thus are set for the store to make more profit than usual.
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Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I think Jace is in here, as much as I resent it due to recently trading for a foil. Still, it's a foil of the original, and not FTV foiling, so still worth it. But yeah, I think all Origin 5 are in here. They just chose one PW to represent the others I imagine. I wouldn't count him out. I can't think of many DFC to anticipate. Thing in the Ice perhaps?
Liliana was also used the super early preview card for magic origins.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
I fully expect to see the Origins 5 among the 15 in here, if only because they'll be the only non-Innistrad cards in the package. Much as I would love to see some Ixalan DFCs, that set is far too recent to make the cut.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
We'll see what they have in the FTV once the spoilers are out for it in a couple of days. I wouldn't be surprised if they only included two of the flip walkers and maybe saved some for masters 25. If they are doing two masters sets a year now then they will be trying to space out the high value cards and put the bulk of anything above 15 usd into those sets if they are old enough. That's why I don't think Jace is in the set.
Also, if anyone wants to get one be sure to check if your LGS has a list or takes pre-orders as you probably can get the product for around MSRP that way.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I'm probably in the minority here for this, but I'd like to see at least one of those Kamigawa flip cards get some justice complete with two frames of artwork.
I'm probably in the minority here for this, but I'd like to see at least one of those Kamigawa flip cards get some justice complete with two frames of artwork.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I believe Wizards confirmed only true double sided cards are in the set. They could probably print new versions of the kamigawa cards that are flip versions later on, though. It really wouldn't be that hard to do and I think people would like the standardization.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I always look into pre-orders for these before the full list is out and it is always well above msrp, $50 or $60 dollars easy. But once the list comes out, the numbers are crunched, the formats the cards legal in are considered, and interest of the included special d20 is noted. I always look back on the ones I did not buy and feel good about not buying. Yes they had cool cards, but most of the really cool stuff isn't legal or highly improbable for me to use.
~~
Wizards agrees to promote a sale on buying 3 standard-legal boosters, and everyone flips out. "Support your LGS, Can't play magic at walmart!"
Wizards lets LGS double or triple the MSRP of a very limited product with only reprints that appear to be only for collectors and fans well established in the game, everyone expects this and encourages it. "Stores should get to make extra money."
Stores should also be able to price match the 3pack deal if they really don't want me to buy from walmart.
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Wanted -Zombie Foils and older expensive Zombie stuff. High Priority- Beta Z Master/ Int. Collector's Edition.
Thankfully, other than Arguel's Blood Fast, WotC did seem to focus on the DFCs that had a high price (or were in danger of spiking were they not reprinted here), rather than just reprinting a few chase cards, and filling the rest with a random hodgepodge, like they usually do.
I'm pretty sure it was Maro that said they were trying to incorporate more females in artwork to balance the genders on cards. Most artwork in the past has featured males. That's why there's been this large influx of female images the last couple years.
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
elvish ranger is a famous example because the original female art is very sexualized. elvish piper, elvish champion, gaea's herald, honored hierarch (i'm just looking through green creatures alphabetically). the reality is that it happens all the time and nobody really notices or comments. the card auramancer originally had some great guay art featuring a female wizard but more recent art depicts the character as male. i feel like i see it pretty often.
Ah, thank you - I appreciate the enlightenment! I'm clearly one of those people that never noticed it. Probably just because of those cards you listed, this is the only one that I actually play with lol!
I've always liked thinking of the art on non-legendary creatures as being just a single example of what that kind of creature could be in a broader sense, but never necessarily the creature depicted in the image. A Huntmaster of the Fells isn't THAT guy in that card image, a Huntmaster of the Fells is an archetype that expresses itself on the plane of Innistrad and happens over and over again throughout the population. Of course the art will have to be a depiction of a single person, because it would be way too difficult to make every card have a unique image. The art is just a starting point for the player's imagination to extrapolate what that creature is and does in that world, using not only the art but the flavor text and what the card actually does to assemble a complete creature that tells you something about the world. I LOVE it when new art for an existing card uses this approach and chooses to depict a different individual but still the same idea and role. Of course this Huntmaster isn't the same one as the original, the original was just some arbitrary individual version of a Huntmaster which exists in a society with a whole bunch of other Huntmasters traipsing around with different hairs and genders and qualities that really have nothing to do with being a Huntmaster and ultimately wouldn't result in a functionally different card. Dude on the original card wasn't a particularly important one to begin with, otherwise he'd be legendary and his name would be like Carl and you'd only get to play one of him on a battlefield at a time. This new art gives us more information about what this kind of creature can be in Innistrad and personally makes my imagination feel good and stuff.
By contrast the new art for Delver is amazing, but doesn't really tell us anything new about the creature and it's role in the plane. I feel like it's pretty safe to assume this is the actual same dude from the original card, unless he's from some Innistrad version of Buddhist Monks or something where everyone fashions themselves in a really specific way for spiritual reasons. With this new art we still only get a single example of what a Delver of Secrets can be and look like, when presumably it's a thing that just exists and has the potential to happen over and over again, resulting in 8 Delver board-states being possible. This feels a little like one artist saying "I could do that better" or something. Or who knows, maybe a card that iconic came with a Wizards mandate saying it has to be samesies.
I like your perspective. I have two takeaways from your post.
1. From this point forward, whenever I play my Huntmaster of the Fells (male) in a game I will refer to him as Carl; because that's hilarious to me. "I summon...CARL OF THE FELLS!"
2. I really enjoy playing Elder Scrolls Online. A lot of the characters I make are inspired by MTG creatures. I made a werewolf character loosely designed on the art from Huntmaster of the Fells. He is a big, burley, Nord rocking the beard, wields axes and uses the Fighter's Guild crossbow abilities. So, I completely agree with you on using the art as a jumping off point to allow your imagination to determine who this character actually is and having more source material with new perspectives is always welcome. Also, I now wish that I named that ESO character Carl....
That's all I really wanted, to make CARL OF THE FELLS a thing.
All this, of course, is coming from the guy who stubbornly swore that they'd NEVER reprint the Zen fetches in a MM set, so... yeah, what do I know.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Because MSRP on these products is less of a guideline than on any other product. These are still LGS gift products, essentially, and thus are set for the store to make more profit than usual.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
You're not wrong, but that seems like the type of card that would get displayed front and center if it were here.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Also, if anyone wants to get one be sure to check if your LGS has a list or takes pre-orders as you probably can get the product for around MSRP that way.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I believe Wizards confirmed only true double sided cards are in the set. They could probably print new versions of the kamigawa cards that are flip versions later on, though. It really wouldn't be that hard to do and I think people would like the standardization.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
~~
Wizards agrees to promote a sale on buying 3 standard-legal boosters, and everyone flips out. "Support your LGS, Can't play magic at walmart!"
Wizards lets LGS double or triple the MSRP of a very limited product with only reprints that appear to be only for collectors and fans well established in the game, everyone expects this and encourages it. "Stores should get to make extra money."
Stores should also be able to price match the 3pack deal if they really don't want me to buy from walmart.
Selling some cards I don't want.
Generally less than tcg mid.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/see-cards-vault-transform-2017-11-06
Garruk Relentless: $5.28
Archangel Avacyn: $4.24
Liliana: 9.24
Nissa: 6.78
Kytheon: 4.24
Chandra: 3.01
Jace: 23.70
Arguel's Blood Fast: 1.00
Arlinn Kord: 3.84
Huntmaster of the Fells: 9.30
Delver of Secrets: 1.49
Elbrus: 4.00
Bloodline Keeper: 15.00
Gisela: 6.78
Bruna 0.96
Total: Just over $100 at the moment.
Here is hoping there will be one at the local store for a decent price.
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
And of all the XLN transform cards they could have put in... they put in what is probably the worst.
Man, that slot could have been Legion's Landing or Growing Rites of Itlimoc (or Primal Amulet, or Thaumatic Compass, or...)
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