Pretty sweet on-curve place to be at in UWx control, probably better than what Elspeth, Sun's Champion offered last season.
Jamming this on-curve against, say, Abzan-anything gets two bodies, one of which can eat a Rhino, and five life, all for six mana. That's a fantastic stabilizing play. Plus, if she and her buddy survive, this represents a pretty solid clock in the air.
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Formerly Angrypossum over at the now-defunct WotC forums.
You know what? I don't mind that Linvala isn't super pushed. This is about the power level I'd prefer for Mythics to be at. Big and bomby but conditional so it's not a 4-of constructed level. Now, her design could have been peppered a bit more, but as far as power level is concerned, I prefer her the way she is.
Yeah, medium mythics, good rares, excellent uncommons are the ideal.
Confusing card, timely reinforcements are supposed to be "timely". At 6 mana the deck you want this for will already kill you.... Atarka Red. If you already survived to 6 mana your probably going to win the game already....
Confusing card, timely reinforcements are supposed to be "timely". At 6 mana the deck you want this for will already kill you.... Atarka Red. If you already survived to 6 mana your probably going to win the game already....
Doesn't sound like you are confused at all. It's not confusing nearly as much as it's not good.
I feel like the big issue with people in this thread, is that they're evaluating this based on how it looks on paper. I feel like the effect of this is big and splashy enough, that fulfills the criteria of how a mythic should play out. It's not like mythics need to all have weird effects that we don't see often, hell, look at the dragonlords, they're all pretty similar.
As far as her constructed playability goes, assuming you can trigger her final ability, she looks a lot like broodmate, or thragtusk. She can really take over the game, and acts as a powerful finisher to top it off. I'm slightly worried about whether there's a home for her that doesn't just want to play a wrath of some sort, but I think that she definitely has plenty of potential to be a big exciting card that people can play both competitively and casually.
In particular, I like the idea of playing her in maybe some kind of GW midrange, with Gideon and Nissa to force your oppponent into committing more onto the board, which you can punish with Linvala or Wraths. Or, of course, you could put her in a more pure controlling shell.
I don't think a lot of people have problem with this card power level or evaluation with its playability, but more about how boring this card is compared to past rares and even uncommon cards.
As a mythic legendary angel, I think they could do way better than this. I'd expect something splashy or unique like original Linvala or Avacyn as a mythic angel. Not something that is less exciting than past mythic non-legendary angels that didn't see much play, but at least it would exciting angel aficionado.
Yes, but that being the case, it is therefor silly to point out that a card that is not actually *good* in the format *can* be played. If we are evaluating a card in terms of the EDH format, it is pretty easy to say this card is quite poor, low on uspide/abuse-potential, not a threatening body or ability, and on top of that, it fills a a premium mana slot. This card is garbage for an EDH environment in which players are trying to win, and if you are proposing its use for a niche scenario, please let us know the scenario.
His reply was not wrong or out of line, I'm sorry if you are offended, but if you make a comment you should be prepared to either a) defend it or b) not care if someone analyzes it. The analysis that it is a garbage EDH card is seemingly correct.
The thing is, "boring" is a really weird term. After all, we have tonnes of mythics that have weird and unusual effects, but noone plays them because they're god awful, and the effects don't actually play that well in the first place. In contrast, players do often like powerful cards that have a big effect on the board, and for the constructed players, that's even better if the card is actually playable!
My point is that the card may look like a mishmash of a few cards on paper, but when you actually play with it, it has it's own feel to it, and does a lot of satisfying things in it's own way.
Moreover, there are indeed a lot of people saying that the card is pretty bad.
I also think it might look okay in a Reanimator shell. You could toolbox this card there if you're on something like that.
I like the art... but it doesn't look at all like Linvala? I also think it's sad that a returning "personality" card doesn't feel at all like the same "person". My bet is they developed the card, and stapled her name on it at the end.
All that said, the card is powerful, and could fit right into s couple of yet to emerge decks. Perhaps even slotted as a two of directly into an existing Esper shell. Lastly I can see it being used as the higher end of an anti Aggro/Token side board package.
I can't help wishing this was a 4/4, or created a knight, for 5 mana. Would've been great with Bring to Light...
And the award of wasted awesome art on a bad card goes to... Livala!
She is really boring for a mythic. I prefer the mythics when they're powerful (and i'm not even talking about an competitive standpoint) and splashy, not a boring Timely Reinforcements with legs (and wings).
If she was intended to be efficient, she should cost less, even if it had a smaller body. At cmc5 4/4 she would still be boring, but would be efficient enough to see some play.
If she had Ojutai's Hexproof or even an activated ability to blink herself then she would be powerful but fine in standard. I mean in limited of course she's a stabilizer but standard as is? Nope.
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"The essence of every world, every spell and every thought is power. Nothing else matters, because nothing else exists."
It's like a 6-mana legendary conditional Thragtusk. I don't know if that's good enough or not. Granted, they aren't really conditions in the deck that would play it.
Standard Control doesn't want this, unless the meta switches to a really bizarre place after rotation. For now, no one wants to tap out for a 5/5 flier that doesn't have hexproof when there are plenty of better options scattered throughout Khans/Fate, Dragons/Origins, and BfZ/Oath itself.
As for EDH fodder... just no. There are better angels, there are better things to flicker, there are better reanimation targets, there are better things to do for six mana. Yeah, almost anything can be played in EDH, but if this is in your 99 you are either on a very strict budget or just aren't paying a lot of attention to your card choices. Even casual EDH is a pretty high-powered format, and even if you meet the conditions you're still just tacking on a token and five life to a medium-sized body, which is rather ineffective in most games.
I don't wanna mislead wizards, but if they are gonna do boring mythics across the board and make commons, uncommons and rares great I welcome this change. I don't want any freaking corporate magic company to overprice an item just because it's a mythic.
Report them in your surveys, and keep telling MaRo this is definitely ok!
You guys are all bad at magic. "Only a 3/3" "Doesn't have hexproof" "Can't blink itself" "Doesn't have lifelink" Seriously?
This is 8 power of flying, in two bodies, (doesn't trade with Doom Blade) that gains five life immediately. Those conditions are not conditions in any deck that slots Linvala in the their deck - if your opponent is playing a deck slower than mono red and faster than you, this card is good. If its not turned on against those decks you're probably already winning. You don't have to go through hoops to play this card, you don't have to build your deck in a specific way, generally decks that are able to play white six drops are going to get into places where they are down on board and life a lot, and this card stabilizes the board, pushes you out of reach and clocks your opponent very quickly. Its not a Siege Rhino standard all star but its an excellent role player.
There actually very few cards that are 5/6 mana and stabilize the board. Ojutai's really not spectacular if your opponent has a decent board presence, and Silumgar is only good if it survives a turn, both of which this card excels at which is this card's niche.
Also, anything is good in EDH, don't pretend otherwise. That format's a joke.
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I mean in Control decks, Foul-Tongue Invocation is gaining them 4 life almost 2-3 times a game. I mean I'm sure in Shadows of Innistrad, a similar thing will happen like it did with Angel of Serenity. Some reviving stuff reminiscent of Unburial Rites and blinking will be on the Innistrad block so we will see.
In my opinion, Mythics should have some off-the-wall abilities but they don't have to be Dig Through Time powerful. Lifelink on this card would be absurd. Regular hexproof would be absurd (which is why I said Ojutai's hexproof). The preserver sounds like she wants to preserve those who serve and believe in her so self-blinking would fall under that flavor at a high activated ability cost. By the time you are playing her, its not timely enough. That's all. She's white's Sphinx of the Last Word.
Jamming this on-curve against, say, Abzan-anything gets two bodies, one of which can eat a Rhino, and five life, all for six mana. That's a fantastic stabilizing play. Plus, if she and her buddy survive, this represents a pretty solid clock in the air.
Yeah, medium mythics, good rares, excellent uncommons are the ideal.
UR Blue-Red Control
Modern:
UBR Grixis Control
UWR Jeskai Control
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
As far as her constructed playability goes, assuming you can trigger her final ability, she looks a lot like broodmate, or thragtusk. She can really take over the game, and acts as a powerful finisher to top it off. I'm slightly worried about whether there's a home for her that doesn't just want to play a wrath of some sort, but I think that she definitely has plenty of potential to be a big exciting card that people can play both competitively and casually.
In particular, I like the idea of playing her in maybe some kind of GW midrange, with Gideon and Nissa to force your oppponent into committing more onto the board, which you can punish with Linvala or Wraths. Or, of course, you could put her in a more pure controlling shell.
As a mythic legendary angel, I think they could do way better than this. I'd expect something splashy or unique like original Linvala or Avacyn as a mythic angel. Not something that is less exciting than past mythic non-legendary angels that didn't see much play, but at least it would exciting angel aficionado.
I am not a big fan of $40-$75 4 ofs in Standard or Modern.
Yes, but that being the case, it is therefor silly to point out that a card that is not actually *good* in the format *can* be played. If we are evaluating a card in terms of the EDH format, it is pretty easy to say this card is quite poor, low on uspide/abuse-potential, not a threatening body or ability, and on top of that, it fills a a premium mana slot. This card is garbage for an EDH environment in which players are trying to win, and if you are proposing its use for a niche scenario, please let us know the scenario.
His reply was not wrong or out of line, I'm sorry if you are offended, but if you make a comment you should be prepared to either a) defend it or b) not care if someone analyzes it. The analysis that it is a garbage EDH card is seemingly correct.
[EDH] Rafiq of the Many
[EDH]Chainer, Dementia Master
[EDH] Maelstrom Wanderer
My point is that the card may look like a mishmash of a few cards on paper, but when you actually play with it, it has it's own feel to it, and does a lot of satisfying things in it's own way.
Moreover, there are indeed a lot of people saying that the card is pretty bad.
It's useful with some mass P/T boosting in play for her and the token.
I also think it might look okay in a Reanimator shell. You could toolbox this card there if you're on something like that.
I like the art... but it doesn't look at all like Linvala? I also think it's sad that a returning "personality" card doesn't feel at all like the same "person". My bet is they developed the card, and stapled her name on it at the end.
All that said, the card is powerful, and could fit right into s couple of yet to emerge decks. Perhaps even slotted as a two of directly into an existing Esper shell. Lastly I can see it being used as the higher end of an anti Aggro/Token side board package.
I can't help wishing this was a 4/4, or created a knight, for 5 mana. Would've been great with Bring to Light...
She is really boring for a mythic. I prefer the mythics when they're powerful (and i'm not even talking about an competitive standpoint) and splashy, not a boring Timely Reinforcements with legs (and wings).
If she was intended to be efficient, she should cost less, even if it had a smaller body. At cmc5 4/4 she would still be boring, but would be efficient enough to see some play.
At 6cc I'd rather just play Dragonlord Dromoka
As for EDH fodder... just no. There are better angels, there are better things to flicker, there are better reanimation targets, there are better things to do for six mana. Yeah, almost anything can be played in EDH, but if this is in your 99 you are either on a very strict budget or just aren't paying a lot of attention to your card choices. Even casual EDH is a pretty high-powered format, and even if you meet the conditions you're still just tacking on a token and five life to a medium-sized body, which is rather ineffective in most games.
Report them in your surveys, and keep telling MaRo this is definitely ok!
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
This is 8 power of flying, in two bodies, (doesn't trade with Doom Blade) that gains five life immediately. Those conditions are not conditions in any deck that slots Linvala in the their deck - if your opponent is playing a deck slower than mono red and faster than you, this card is good. If its not turned on against those decks you're probably already winning. You don't have to go through hoops to play this card, you don't have to build your deck in a specific way, generally decks that are able to play white six drops are going to get into places where they are down on board and life a lot, and this card stabilizes the board, pushes you out of reach and clocks your opponent very quickly. Its not a Siege Rhino standard all star but its an excellent role player.
There actually very few cards that are 5/6 mana and stabilize the board. Ojutai's really not spectacular if your opponent has a decent board presence, and Silumgar is only good if it survives a turn, both of which this card excels at which is this card's niche.
Also, anything is good in EDH, don't pretend otherwise. That format's a joke.
This Linvala and the old one serve different purposes.
RBUGrixis ControlUBR
GUSimic MerfolkUG
WUUW ControlUW
RBUGrixis ControlUBR
BUUB MillUB
Colorless Eldrazi Tron
WRBurnRW
GUSimic MerfolkUG
UMono U TurnsU
WGGenesis Wave EnchantressGW
In my opinion, Mythics should have some off-the-wall abilities but they don't have to be Dig Through Time powerful. Lifelink on this card would be absurd. Regular hexproof would be absurd (which is why I said Ojutai's hexproof). The preserver sounds like she wants to preserve those who serve and believe in her so self-blinking would fall under that flavor at a high activated ability cost. By the time you are playing her, its not timely enough. That's all. She's white's Sphinx of the Last Word.