Plants are 1/1 now? I guess 0/1 tokens are too complex for new players or something.
Man, some people are complaining for complaining's sake, aren't say.
When the plant tokens are made from 0/1 to 1/1 Wizards is "dumbing down the game".
If they would have been 1/1 originally and now 0/1 people would complain that Wizards is nerfing the powerlevel of the game.
Sigh.
No. I'm complaining about a lack of consistency in the world. Until they come out and say "plants are 1/1's because this reason" it seems inconsistent with what was previously established.
Be less dismissive next time k friend?
i'm guessing it's because the scions are 1/1, the pumped up the plants to compensate, Plants and spawn couldn't really attack into each other if you kept plants at 0/1 you could just swarm Scions in. Now at least you can trade. Also this pretty much confirms Avenger of Zendikar is out.
Plants are 1/1 now? I guess 0/1 tokens are too complex for new players or something.
Man, some people are complaining for complaining's sake, aren't say.
When the plant tokens are made from 0/1 to 1/1 Wizards is "dumbing down the game".
If they would have been 1/1 originally and now 0/1 people would complain that Wizards is nerfing the powerlevel of the game.
Sigh.
No. I'm complaining about a lack of consistency in the world. Until they come out and say "plants are 1/1's because this reason" it seems inconsistent with what was previously established.
Be less dismissive next time k friend?
I assume it's just for Limited so that the small tokens have some teeth, just like how the Eldrazi Spawn got upgraded to Eldrazi Scions. It's a bit of a change, but presumably it'll make things slightly more interesting.
Ulamog's Nullifier should have had ingest. All of the colored Eldrazi should have ingest. I don't know why it doesn't. He/she nullifies a spell, thus ingesting it. It's a lot of words to put on a card but they have done it before.
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Sooo a flying mystic snake with an extra point of toughness? Holy crap, I really, really hope cards like this can be played in standard. I have a feeling it will be sort of similar to mono blue devotion decks, in that you have to play kinda crappy enablers, but it will still be playable.
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Ulamog's Nullifier should have had ingest. All of the colored Eldrazi should have ingest. I don't know why? He nullifies a spell, thus ingesting its ability.
They probably didn't want multiple nullifiers to feed into each other. Either that or processor's don't ingest, they simply process.
I'm gonna go with Processors just process. Still though, would've made it considerably more playable.
Potentially more than just playable. Letting Processors ingest and thus fuel other Processors is a degree of combos-with-itself that WotC tends to avoid.
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Mystic Snake was a force in its day and still will occasionally pop up in the odd Modern deck. Nullifier has a less restrictive mana cost and better body. If its condition is easy enough to meet, it is going to be a terror during its Standard life and while I am not quite ready to call it a Modern staple, the possibility is definitely there.
I'm a fan of all of these cards. So am I the only one who wants to make a U/W Awaken control deck? The Awaken Cancel, the Awaken Wrath, this one. Add some Narset, some Jace, some Ojutai's Command, and other feel good stuff and you got a neat little set of cards. Not saying that there aren't better options out there. Running three colors to have better cards is probably stronger, but I kinda want to do it anyway.
The problem with Awaken is that it costs way too much. You'll essentially only ever get 1-2 uses of it per game, and you're banking on your land with no avoidance being able to close out the game post turn 7. Not only that, but if they kill those lands with removal spells like Roast, you start to fall behind the curve, which is the last thing you want as a control player. As a mechanic, it just doesn't feel good paying that much for sorcery speed control effects that don't allow you to respond to your opponent on their step, making for largely worse control cards because they can make a dude.
Also I don't think Rebound from Narset Transcendent really combos with awaken cards, as I believe you don't get to use the awaken ability a second time when those cards rebound.
Roil Spout might have been nerfed a bit because it's really nasty AGAINST Awaken. You get rid of opponent's animated land -- completely erasing the expensive effects of Awaken -- and destroy his next draw step at the same time. With Landfall, replaying that land might have a bit of utilitym but in Limited, opponent would still probably prefer a spell.
I'm cool with the plants being 1/1s. The land and everything is pretty "aggressive" in Zendikar at the moment so it makes sense if the plants are as well...
SkyBane: While you may be right, Awaken Control decks get to do what very few Control decks do: their answers can also be threats. Now, it's not 'control the board until I get my bomb in hand and enough mana to cast it', it's 'control the board until I can pay for Awaken costs and go to town'.
Also, while Narset may not combo with Awaken cards, Origins Jace most certainly does. It's the perfect 'play it early for spell, play it again later for Awaken' effect for his Snapcaster ability.
Considering the land focus, I think that Bant Awaken Control is going to be the ones to beat here.
SkyBane: While you may be right, Awaken Control decks get to do what very few Control decks do: their answers can also be threats. Now, it's not 'control the board until I get my bomb in hand and enough mana to cast it', it's 'control the board until I can pay for Awaken costs and go to town'.
Also, while Narset may not combo with Awaken cards, Origins Jace most certainly does. It's the perfect 'play it early for spell, play it again later for Awaken' effect for his Snapcaster ability.
Considering the land focus, I think that Bant Awaken Control is going to be the ones to beat here.
But their answers are sorcery speed and expensive, which is very problematic. Half of playing control is the power of having open mana and a hand full of cards on your opponents turn so they have to calculate the risk of dropping their stuff on curve. If you're tapping out on your turn to do basic things like removal and creating a dude, you may as well be playing midrange or the more midrange-y Abzan control that just needs to protect their big fatties.
Ultimately this type of deck will be absolutely reliant on recursion from Narset and Jace, because if you cast one of those sorcery speed removals/7 cost wrath to wipe the board and make a land dude, tapping out in the process, then they just untap and play Siege Rhino. You're left with well... now what? The deck will also be even more land critical than other control variants, as your land will necessarily need to be got in bunches and fetched for constantly, knowing that the opponent can simply Languish or base cast Ruinous Path to destroy your mana base, and those lands will be lost once they are dudes anyways because you will need them to swing. I just don't see the viability of an even slower control deck that wants to actively tap out to Stone Rain itself every time it needs to provide an answer, and only at sorcery speed.
Roil Spout might have been nerfed a bit because it's really nasty AGAINST Awaken. You get rid of opponent's animated land -- completely erasing the expensive effects of Awaken -- and destroy his next draw step at the same time. With Landfall, replaying that land might have a bit of utilitym but in Limited, opponent would still probably prefer a spell.
That is an excellent point. Removing a threat and ensuring that their next draw is a land is very strong, especially in limited. They wanted another non-black removal spell, but didn't want it to be too punishing against awaken, so they just made it weaker and added awaken to compensate.
SkyBane: While you may be right, Awaken Control decks get to do what very few Control decks do: their answers can also be threats. Now, it's not 'control the board until I get my bomb in hand and enough mana to cast it', it's 'control the board until I can pay for Awaken costs and go to town'.
Also, while Narset may not combo with Awaken cards, Origins Jace most certainly does. It's the perfect 'play it early for spell, play it again later for Awaken' effect for his Snapcaster ability.
Considering the land focus, I think that Bant Awaken Control is going to be the ones to beat here.
But their answers are sorcery speed and expensive, which is very problematic. Half of playing control is the power of having open mana and a hand full of cards on your opponents turn so they have to calculate the risk of dropping their stuff on curve. If you're tapping out on your turn to do basic things like removal and creating a dude, you may as well be playing midrange or the more midrange-y Abzan control that just needs to protect their big fatties.
Ultimately this type of deck will be absolutely reliant on recursion from Narset and Jace, because if you cast one of those sorcery speed removals/7 cost wrath to wipe the board and make a land dude, tapping out in the process, then they just untap and play Siege Rhino. You're left with well... now what? The deck will also be even more land critical than other control variants, as your land will necessarily need to be got in bunches and fetched for constantly, knowing that the opponent can simply Languish or base cast Ruinous Path to destroy your mana base, and those lands will be lost once they are dudes anyways because you will need them to swing. I just don't see the viability of an even slower control deck that wants to actively tap out to Stone Rain itself every time it needs to provide an answer, and only at sorcery speed.
Agreed. I dislike most of these awaken cards for constructed (specifically for control; midrange will probably love them). Some will still be run out of necessity (Ruinous Path), and the awaken/cancel is probably a fine Dissolve replacement.
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Standard: UR Blue-Red Control
Modern: UBR Grixis Control UWR Jeskai Control
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Also, Processor is a new creature type? Nice.
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StaffProcessors are Eldrazi that put cards an opponent's exile into their graveyard.
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Spoiler Editori'm guessing it's because the scions are 1/1, the pumped up the plants to compensate, Plants and spawn couldn't really attack into each other if you kept plants at 0/1 you could just swarm Scions in. Now at least you can trade. Also this pretty much confirms Avenger of Zendikar is out.
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StaffThey probably didn't want multiple nullifiers to feed into each other. Either that or processor's don't ingest, they simply process.
Potentially more than just playable. Letting Processors ingest and thus fuel other Processors is a degree of combos-with-itself that WotC tends to avoid.
The problem with Awaken is that it costs way too much. You'll essentially only ever get 1-2 uses of it per game, and you're banking on your land with no avoidance being able to close out the game post turn 7. Not only that, but if they kill those lands with removal spells like Roast, you start to fall behind the curve, which is the last thing you want as a control player. As a mechanic, it just doesn't feel good paying that much for sorcery speed control effects that don't allow you to respond to your opponent on their step, making for largely worse control cards because they can make a dude.
Also I don't think Rebound from Narset Transcendent really combos with awaken cards, as I believe you don't get to use the awaken ability a second time when those cards rebound.
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He replaces my zendikar incarnate slot in G/R Elementals standard deck I will build next season. Not to mention he becomes stupid with other Land rampers IE Animist's Awakening and Nissa's Renewal
RGWNaya BurnRGW+++RGWKiki ComboRGW
UGInfectUG+++++++++.++++++++UGMerfolkUG
GGNykthos WaveGG++++++++++GGStompyGG
BRVampiresBR+++++++.+++++++BRGoblinsBR
WGBogglesWG+++++++++++++CRSkred RedCR
UBRGDredgeUBRG++++++++++BB8 RackBB
URWJeskaiURW+++.++UBRGrixis DelverUBR
URStormUR++++++++UWGBant CompanyUWG
WUBRGHumansWUBRG+CCEldrazi TronCC
Well, if the spawn tokens grew up to become Scion, why couldn't the plants on Zendikar have thrived as well?
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Also, while Narset may not combo with Awaken cards, Origins Jace most certainly does. It's the perfect 'play it early for spell, play it again later for Awaken' effect for his Snapcaster ability.
Considering the land focus, I think that Bant Awaken Control is going to be the ones to beat here.
But their answers are sorcery speed and expensive, which is very problematic. Half of playing control is the power of having open mana and a hand full of cards on your opponents turn so they have to calculate the risk of dropping their stuff on curve. If you're tapping out on your turn to do basic things like removal and creating a dude, you may as well be playing midrange or the more midrange-y Abzan control that just needs to protect their big fatties.
Ultimately this type of deck will be absolutely reliant on recursion from Narset and Jace, because if you cast one of those sorcery speed removals/7 cost wrath to wipe the board and make a land dude, tapping out in the process, then they just untap and play Siege Rhino. You're left with well... now what? The deck will also be even more land critical than other control variants, as your land will necessarily need to be got in bunches and fetched for constantly, knowing that the opponent can simply Languish or base cast Ruinous Path to destroy your mana base, and those lands will be lost once they are dudes anyways because you will need them to swing. I just don't see the viability of an even slower control deck that wants to actively tap out to Stone Rain itself every time it needs to provide an answer, and only at sorcery speed.
That is an excellent point. Removing a threat and ensuring that their next draw is a land is very strong, especially in limited. They wanted another non-black removal spell, but didn't want it to be too punishing against awaken, so they just made it weaker and added awaken to compensate.
Agreed. I dislike most of these awaken cards for constructed (specifically for control; midrange will probably love them). Some will still be run out of necessity (Ruinous Path), and the awaken/cancel is probably a fine Dissolve replacement.
UR Blue-Red Control
Modern:
UBR Grixis Control
UWR Jeskai Control