Chandra is kind of nasty I have play tested it and it consistantly flips on turn 4 for rdw meaning an opponent takes 5 damage. It almost protects itself too with the red creatures you drop.
T2 Generator Servant, T3 Hasty Chandra swings, with 1R open for a red spell to untap and ping. Well at least that works for 3 months haha
But a T3 flipped Chandra would do some work...
T1 Swiftspear, down to 19,
T2 Servant, down to 18.
T3 Chandra swing with swift, use open mana for a lightning strike, ping with Chandra, then +1 on flip. Down to 10 life.
T3 down to 10 seems pretty good, specially with a 5 loyalty pingwalker at your side.
The name on the creature side shouldn't butt up against the mana cost like that; they'd change the name or reduce the size of the type a bit to get some space in there.
The activated ability is also templated wrong; they don't use a legendary creature's full name more than once in the rules text of a card. The second mention should just say "Chandra deals 1 damage..." at the start.
Copyright is definitely 2014 on the creature side as well.
The name on the creature side shouldn't butt up against the mana cost like that; they'd change the name or reduce the size of the type a bit to get some space in there.
The activated ability is also templated wrong; they don't use a legendary creature's full name more than once in the rules text of a card. The second mention should just say "Chandra deals 1 damage..." at the start.
Copyright is definitely 2014 on the creature side as well.
But isn't that the key think about all Chandra's Galerion
Well that's true.
To be the fair though they broke the cycle with Chandra, Pyromaster but it looks like that was short-lived.
They did. Altough they turned her into a Control Planeswalker. Because in all honesty, that could have been a bunch of abilities on any U Planeswalker. In fact it's UR if we look deep into those abilities. This is neither here not there but I can see only mediocre Chandra's. Which is why am/was such a fan of Koth of the Hammer. That guy is Red.
In my opinion still a better direction than "Burn this, burn that, burn everything"
Jace and Chandra both have to have their "creature ability" work in order to transform in a manner similar to the "Ordeal" series of Theros.
With Jace, that isn't so big a deal - but with Chandra, it makes her harder to transform from the likes of creature combat.
Honestly all she actually needs is any instant that will give her first strike, then on either attack or block you can just ping between the First Strike and normal damage steps and voila.
Combat tricks are rarely playable in constructed outside of decks that synergize with them (Infect, Boss Sligh, Hexproof, Heroics) and spells that have different modes (Boros Charm, Jeskai Charm, Valorous Stance). I don't think Chandra fits with combat trick loaded decks since those decks want their bodies to be cheap and/or to have abilities that play naturally with that playstyle (protection, double strike, hexproof, lifelink). Chandra plays better in decks that just play cheap red spells that are good on their own, like burn decks or a traditional RDW. Atarka's Command is probably the best trick Chandra would want to play with, and that's because all of its abilities are relevant to Chandra.
True, however I wasn't speaking of Standard specifically. There are at least a few other formats where she could find a home. I'm honestly looking at her for Tiny Leaders moreso than Standard.
But isn't that the key think about all Chandra's Galerion
Well that's true.
To be the fair though they broke the cycle with Chandra, Pyromaster but it looks like that was short-lived.
They did. Altough they turned her into a Control Planeswalker. Because in all honesty, that could have been a bunch of abilities on any U Planeswalker. In fact it's UR if we look deep into those abilities. This is neither here not there but I can see only mediocre Chandra's. Which is why am/was such a fan of Koth of the Hammer. That guy is Red.
In my opinion still a better direction than "Burn this, burn that, burn everything"
My personal favorite among the Mono R 'Walkers is actually Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker. Pretty neat little suite of abilities on him.
As for Pyromaster, she's not really a control card. I tried her in a control deck, and honestly while her 0 does generate card advantage, it doesn't do so in a way that synergizes with control decks, since it's use-or-lose. If it worked more like Commune with Lava, I might agree with you. The decks I've found her most at home in were aggro decks with her at the top of the curve. Actually as luck would have it I had an Izzet aggro deck toward the end of RTR/Theros standard. Honestly where Chandra shone brightest in all the different ways I tried to use her was abusing the "target creature can't block" clause of her +1, which I think people really undervalue. That I was also chipping away at their life in the process was just gravy, and having the option to 0 her got me out of a tight spot or two, but just being able to push damage through against creatures that normally stonewall an aggressive deck really gets there.
That being said, this is the first time they've tried Shock, or at least a pseudo Shock, as opposed to a simple ping as a + loyalty ability. Given that it costs no further resources to use once Chandra's flipped, that's likely going to make a huge difference as far as her damage output goes. They're probably taking a bit of a risk with that, so they didn't want to make her abilities too diverse for fear of her being too strong at 3 mana. Part of the reason Tibalt ended up so weak, after all, was the fact that a two mana 'walker had never been tried before, but putting him anywhere near the power level of any Planeswalker that had come before would probably have been disastrous. Maybe not JTMS levels of disastrous, but still a level that they'd want to avoid. Or that's my take on it, anyway.
But isn't that the key think about all Chandra's Galerion
Well that's true.
To be the fair though they broke the cycle with Chandra, Pyromaster but it looks like that was short-lived.
She isn't bad, (in fact she is about as good as an aggro deck could get from a planeswalker), she is just really boring.
Burn, untap, burn, untap, burn, flip, then be able to burn players, burn creatures, or burn players more. However, considering this is supposed to show when she was younger, and that the flipwalkers are pretty different from regular ones, this is hopefully NOT indicative of the direction of her future cards. Getting one boring, though strong, walker is okay when we are getting five new ones and they are all very different from all previous walkers. (Simply being a flip card makes her as interesting as several other past walkers who were quite similar to each other)
I'm baffled that this is apparently real. Her abilities look like some playtesting placeholder for "generic red planeswalker". All the other planeswalkers are able to flip just from playing a normal game of magic with them on the battlefield but Chandra can only flip if you intentionally adjust your gameplan specifically for her. And the payoff is what, a shock engine? They couldnt even make her creature ability at least the same as Prodigal Pyromancer? At least all the other planeswalkers have creature sides that are decent but Chandra's isnt.
I cant really see a Burn deck wanting to play her since she's so low impact. If I was making a burn deck and someone forced me to run a Grey Ogre variant I'd rather just morph an Atarka Efreet.
Also what's up with how Liliana had an additional effect when she flipped (namely making a 2/2 zombie) but none of these SDCC ones do?
Yeah it's not absurdly hard but she is asking you to jump through more hoops than any of the other ones are. Jace and Nissa arent asking you to give up any cards that you might not otherwise and even if you give up a creature you wouldnt otherwise have to make Liliana flip she at least gives you a 2/2 zombie. With Chandra it can be a bit awkward because she can make you choose between casting something like Thunderbreak Regent on T4 or toss out two Wild Slashes that you might rather have held onto.
Its just such a weird design. The red decks that can easily flip her are aggro ones that plan on casting multiple spells per turn but those decks also really do not want a 2/2 for 3cmc that has no immediate impact on the board. If she had haste I think she'd be fine without being overpowered since a 2/2 haste for 3 mana isnt even close to exciting but at least she can still do something.
Another weird thing about her design is how in order to reach her ultimate Chandra will have needed to deal at least 9 damage to your opponent (3 from enabling her to flip and 6 from using her +1 three times). Then her ultimate deals 6 immediately and 3 more on their upkeep. I get that most planeswalker ultimates should typically come with a "well I'm probably going to win since this gives me an overwhelming advantage" feel to them but this just seems like strange overkill. Maybe it was made with EDH in mind but even if Chandra has been the only thing damaging your opponent they'll be at 2 barring things like life gain or redirecting damage to enemy walkers. If her +1 could hit creatures that'd be one thing since if she ults in a grindy matchup where she's doing removal and the opponent might not be that low yet but it just strikes me as weirdly linear.
Yeah it's not absurdly hard but she is asking you to jump through more hoops than any of the other ones are. Jace and Nissa arent asking you to give up any cards that you might not otherwise and even if you give up a creature you wouldnt otherwise have to make Liliana flip she at least gives you a 2/2 zombie. With Chandra it can be a bit awkward because she can make you choose between casting something like Thunderbreak Regent on T4 or toss out two Wild Slashes that you might rather have held onto.
Its just such a weird design. The red decks that can easily flip her are aggro ones that plan on casting multiple spells per turn but those decks also really do not want a 2/2 for 3cmc that has no immediate impact on the board. If she had haste I think she'd be fine without being overpowered since a 2/2 haste for 3 mana isnt even close to exciting but at least she can still do something.
Another weird thing about her design is how in order to reach her ultimate Chandra will have needed to deal at least 9 damage to your opponent (3 from enabling her to flip and 6 from using her +1 three times). Then her ultimate deals 6 immediately and 3 more on their upkeep. I get that most planeswalker ultimates should typically come with a "well I'm probably going to win since this gives me an overwhelming advantage" feel to them but this just seems like strange overkill. Maybe it was made with EDH in mind but even if Chandra has been the only thing damaging your opponent they'll be at 2 barring things like life gain or redirecting damage to enemy walkers. If her +1 could hit creatures that'd be one thing since if she ults in a grindy matchup where she's doing removal and the opponent might not be that low yet but it just strikes me as weirdly linear.
I misread that bit, too, but all three damage required to make her flip doesn't have to be to the opponent. At least two of it can be to a creature. So really it's anywhere between 13-15 damage, not counting the emblem, if you ultimate her as soon as possible, which still trumps any past Chandra's damage output when you think about it. That also means you can actually afford to point more removal at opposing creatures without having to worry about being able to finish off your opponent.
when she flips will she still add 2 to the devotion ?
No. Flipped cards have mana cost 0
I remember that during insistrad standard there was a card destroying creatures of mana cost x or less and set at 0 was killing all the flipped cards
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Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
when she flips will she still add 2 to the devotion ?
No. Flipped cards have mana cost 0
I remember that during insistrad standard there was a card destroying creatures of mana cost x or less and set at 0 was killing all the flipped cards
You're talking about Ratchet Bomb. Fun little sideboard card, back in the time. Also deals greatly with these PW's.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
But isn't that the key think about all Chandra's Galerion
Well that's true.
To be the fair though they broke the cycle with Chandra, Pyromaster but it looks like that was short-lived.
They did. Altough they turned her into a Control Planeswalker. Because in all honesty, that could have been a bunch of abilities on any U Planeswalker. In fact it's UR if we look deep into those abilities. This is neither here not there but I can see only mediocre Chandra's. Which is why am/was such a fan of Koth of the Hammer. That guy is Red.
In my opinion still a better direction than "Burn this, burn that, burn everything"
Absolutely, granted they shown us they can do the job with Koth of the Hammer but needed 4 tries with Chandra, which are 5 now.
That's what happens when Chandra's theme song is "Ring of Fire" and her core abilities are just straight burning things. We don't know much of Koth's themes outside of his one card, but he seems more like a geomancer than anything else what with his mountain manipulation.
Except for the fact that, like Moonmist, this will kill your PWs. It would need to be something like
3U
Instant
Exile target creature you control, then return it to the battlefield flipped
But that wouldn't work because if you target a non DF card then what happens?
Well, talking about Standard, I really think this Chandra will be strong.
She is not hard to flip, you can easely do this at turn 4 and you turn her doing lots of damage.
The best part is that you don't even need to fight with her to flip. Wild Slash will be a nice card to this.
I'll get my sets of Wild Slash, Monastery Swiftspear and Chandras before it becomes too expensive.
Agreed, I think in both Tiny Leaders and Standard she will be pretty decent and easy to flip. Especially in standard, she is screaming to be in an Izzet Counter-Burn deck.
Slightly heavier in blue, especially counters, just a few red spells, Monastery Swiftspear, Mindswipe, Roast. Blue will give enough protection for her, red can be used for creature removal since she can finish on her own.
Except for the fact that, like Moonmist, this will kill your PWs. It would need to be something like
3U
Instant
Exile target creature you control, then return it to the battlefield flipped
But that wouldn't work because if you target a non DF card then what happens?
How would that Moonmist variant kill your 'Walkers?
How would that Moonmist variant kill your 'Walkers?
If you directly transform one of the 'Walkers, there's no effect that puts Loyalty counters on them. So they would immediately go to the graveyard. That's why they first exile to transform, so that they get loyalty counters when they come into play as a Planeswalker. Actually, I'd venture to say they used that templating instead of putting counters on transformation in order to avoid the interaction with effects like Moonmist.
Ok, for everyone still yelling about the 1st side and the date being 2014, they're most likely playtest cards.
They could've start development of Origins in late 2014, so when the made a playtest version of the first side of Chandra the date was in 2014.
When they made the 2nd side, it was most like;y 2015, hence the different dates.
CASE CLOSED
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Decks:
Modern RGWBU Amulet Bloom G Infect
Screw other formats.
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T2 Generator Servant, T3 Hasty Chandra swings, with 1R open for a red spell to untap and ping. Well at least that works for 3 months haha
But a T3 flipped Chandra would do some work...
T1 Swiftspear, down to 19,
T2 Servant, down to 18.
T3 Chandra swing with swift, use open mana for a lightning strike, ping with Chandra, then +1 on flip. Down to 10 life.
T3 down to 10 seems pretty good, specially with a 5 loyalty pingwalker at your side.
Christmas land is fun.
It's funny how "obviously" fake that people thought it was at first
Can't blame people for it. Her design is not exactly great
Well that's true.
To be the fair though they broke the cycle with Chandra, Pyromaster but it looks like that was short-lived.
In my opinion still a better direction than "Burn this, burn that, burn everything"
True, however I wasn't speaking of Standard specifically. There are at least a few other formats where she could find a home. I'm honestly looking at her for Tiny Leaders moreso than Standard.
My personal favorite among the Mono R 'Walkers is actually Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker. Pretty neat little suite of abilities on him.
As for Pyromaster, she's not really a control card. I tried her in a control deck, and honestly while her 0 does generate card advantage, it doesn't do so in a way that synergizes with control decks, since it's use-or-lose. If it worked more like Commune with Lava, I might agree with you. The decks I've found her most at home in were aggro decks with her at the top of the curve. Actually as luck would have it I had an Izzet aggro deck toward the end of RTR/Theros standard. Honestly where Chandra shone brightest in all the different ways I tried to use her was abusing the "target creature can't block" clause of her +1, which I think people really undervalue. That I was also chipping away at their life in the process was just gravy, and having the option to 0 her got me out of a tight spot or two, but just being able to push damage through against creatures that normally stonewall an aggressive deck really gets there.
That being said, this is the first time they've tried Shock, or at least a pseudo Shock, as opposed to a simple ping as a + loyalty ability. Given that it costs no further resources to use once Chandra's flipped, that's likely going to make a huge difference as far as her damage output goes. They're probably taking a bit of a risk with that, so they didn't want to make her abilities too diverse for fear of her being too strong at 3 mana. Part of the reason Tibalt ended up so weak, after all, was the fact that a two mana 'walker had never been tried before, but putting him anywhere near the power level of any Planeswalker that had come before would probably have been disastrous. Maybe not JTMS levels of disastrous, but still a level that they'd want to avoid. Or that's my take on it, anyway.
She isn't bad, (in fact she is about as good as an aggro deck could get from a planeswalker), she is just really boring.
Burn, untap, burn, untap, burn, flip, then be able to burn players, burn creatures, or burn players more. However, considering this is supposed to show when she was younger, and that the flipwalkers are pretty different from regular ones, this is hopefully NOT indicative of the direction of her future cards. Getting one boring, though strong, walker is okay when we are getting five new ones and they are all very different from all previous walkers. (Simply being a flip card makes her as interesting as several other past walkers who were quite similar to each other)
I cant really see a Burn deck wanting to play her since she's so low impact. If I was making a burn deck and someone forced me to run a Grey Ogre variant I'd rather just morph an Atarka Efreet.
Also what's up with how Liliana had an additional effect when she flipped (namely making a 2/2 zombie) but none of these SDCC ones do?
Its just such a weird design. The red decks that can easily flip her are aggro ones that plan on casting multiple spells per turn but those decks also really do not want a 2/2 for 3cmc that has no immediate impact on the board. If she had haste I think she'd be fine without being overpowered since a 2/2 haste for 3 mana isnt even close to exciting but at least she can still do something.
Another weird thing about her design is how in order to reach her ultimate Chandra will have needed to deal at least 9 damage to your opponent (3 from enabling her to flip and 6 from using her +1 three times). Then her ultimate deals 6 immediately and 3 more on their upkeep. I get that most planeswalker ultimates should typically come with a "well I'm probably going to win since this gives me an overwhelming advantage" feel to them but this just seems like strange overkill. Maybe it was made with EDH in mind but even if Chandra has been the only thing damaging your opponent they'll be at 2 barring things like life gain or redirecting damage to enemy walkers. If her +1 could hit creatures that'd be one thing since if she ults in a grindy matchup where she's doing removal and the opponent might not be that low yet but it just strikes me as weirdly linear.
I misread that bit, too, but all three damage required to make her flip doesn't have to be to the opponent. At least two of it can be to a creature. So really it's anywhere between 13-15 damage, not counting the emblem, if you ultimate her as soon as possible, which still trumps any past Chandra's damage output when you think about it. That also means you can actually afford to point more removal at opposing creatures without having to worry about being able to finish off your opponent.
No. Flipped cards have mana cost 0
I remember that during insistrad standard there was a card destroying creatures of mana cost x or less and set at 0 was killing all the flipped cards
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
You're talking about Ratchet Bomb. Fun little sideboard card, back in the time. Also deals greatly with these PW's.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
That's what happens when Chandra's theme song is "Ring of Fire" and her core abilities are just straight burning things. We don't know much of Koth's themes outside of his one card, but he seems more like a geomancer than anything else what with his mountain manipulation.
Incredible Experience, 1W
Instant
Prevent all damage that would be dealt to target permanent. If that permanent is a creature, transform it .
Not sure about the color or cost, but something that doubles as planeswalker protection and a way to transform them.
3U
Instant
Exile target creature you control, then return it to the battlefield flipped
But that wouldn't work because if you target a non DF card then what happens?
She is not hard to flip, you can easely do this at turn 4 and you turn her doing lots of damage.
The best part is that you don't even need to fight with her to flip. Wild Slash will be a nice card to this.
I'll get my sets of Wild Slash, Monastery Swiftspear and Chandras before it becomes too expensive.
Slightly heavier in blue, especially counters, just a few red spells, Monastery Swiftspear, Mindswipe, Roast. Blue will give enough protection for her, red can be used for creature removal since she can finish on her own.
How would that Moonmist variant kill your 'Walkers?
If you directly transform one of the 'Walkers, there's no effect that puts Loyalty counters on them. So they would immediately go to the graveyard. That's why they first exile to transform, so that they get loyalty counters when they come into play as a Planeswalker. Actually, I'd venture to say they used that templating instead of putting counters on transformation in order to avoid the interaction with effects like Moonmist.
They could've start development of Origins in late 2014, so when the made a playtest version of the first side of Chandra the date was in 2014.
When they made the 2nd side, it was most like;y 2015, hence the different dates.
CASE CLOSED
Decks:
Modern
RGWBU Amulet Bloom
G Infect
Screw other formats.