For Lists, Click Here EDH: GW: Selvala, Let us help YOU. UB: Mirko Vosk, when outmatched cheat BW: Vish Kal, The Arbiter of Reanimation UG: Prime Speaker Zegana, the science of sorcery RB: Malfegor, Traitor's Haven UW: Daxos, Control-Fort-Tron BG: Pharika, Goddess of Stax RW: Gisela, Boros Control RG: Ruric Thar, a Primal Surge deck RU: Niv-Mizzet the Firemind, Spellslinger?!?! B:(Pauper) Mikaeus the Unhallowed R: Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient: The Power of Engineering
I want to know if she enters as a creature/ enchantment is she both things at the same time ? I want to know if she still triggers evolve upon entering play,
I'm SO SICK of the "too strong for Standard" argument. It's the new "Dies to removal". We can have a two mana 4/4 with a zillion abilities, but we can't just have Accumulated Knowledge. Makes sense.
So when Thassa is cast from your hand and your blue devotion is less than 5, is it not a creature spell at that point? Can this spell be countered with Essence Scatter? It feels like a similar confusion with that new Archon card with the Bestow mechanic.
I don't understand how a "god" can be 5/5, meanwhile there are baloths and sea serpents that can't be destroyed by Thassa. I mean, the number is so low and arbitrary, why not make it 4/4 for 2 CMC? Or even 3/3 for 1 CMC? At this point, definitely a flavor-fail.
Originally Posted by Master Moja View Post
Here's a few questions I have about Thassa:
Let's say Thassa is in the graveyard. Can I use Reanimate (I know it's not standard legal but I just needed a reanimator spell to make my point) to summon her to the battlefield? I know if my devotion is less that five I won't have her as a creature, but can I use a target creature spell on her if she's dead and my devotion is less than five?
So when Thassa is cast from your hand and your blue devotion is less than 5, is it not a creature spell at that point? Can this spell be countered with Essence Scatter? It feels like a similar confusion with that new Archon card with the Bestow mechanic.
Going one step further...
Is that line of text not 'applicable' if Thassa is in the graveyard, or hand, then?
For instance...Reanimate targets Thassa, she begins to enter the battlefield - is the devotion count checked at this point?
Or is devotion count always checked, no matter what zone Thassa is in?
So if I meet the devotion count is she now a creature while in my hand, and a target for Thoughtseize? Or perhaps I do not meet devotion and she is instead a target for Duress? Or is she a qualified target for both, regardless of devotion count while in someone's hand (or even library)?
So when Thassa is cast from your hand and your blue devotion is less than 5, is it not a creature spell at that point? Can this spell be countered with Essence Scatter? It feels like a similar confusion with that new Archon card with the Bestow mechanic.
maybe i'm wrong here but I think its a creature spell and then state-based effects make it not a creature when it enters the battlefield.
I don't understand how a "god" can be 5/5, meanwhile there are baloths and sea serpents that can't be destroyed by Thassa. I mean, the number is so low and arbitrary, why not make it 4/4 for 2 CMC? Or even 3/3 for 1 CMC? At this point, definitely a flavor-fail.
I'm definitely not a fan, I might sit out Theros.
Really? You're gunna sit out a set because one out of 200+ cards doesn't satisfy you flavor wise. Have fun with that.
Sure, let's have giant gods. Because we all know Enchantments are known for being large in size and NOT ethereal. Oh, they aren't know for that? Guess that explains the lack in size.
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EDH: URJhoira of the GhituUR(Under con.) BMaralen of the MornsongB UBLazav, Dimir MastermindUB Standard: UMono U DevotionU Casual: GPrimordial Hydra JankinessG
I want to know if she enters as a creature/ enchantment is she both things at the same time ? I want to know if she still triggers evolve upon entering play,
She would not trigger evolve, as she is not a creature when evolve triggers.
Devotion is only checked when the card is on the battlefield.
I have some difficulty with this...considering it says on the card:
"As long as your devotion to blue is less than five, Thassa isn’t a creature."
Going one step further...
Is that line of text not 'applicable' if Thassa is in the graveyard, or hand, then?
For instance...Reanimate targets Thassa, she begins to enter the battlefield - is the devotion count checked at this point?
Or is it always devotion count checked, no matter what zone Thassa is in? I believe this was also referenced earlier when asking if it EtB as a creature or enchantment based on the devotion count as she enters.
So if I also meet the devotion count is she now a creature while in my hand, and a target for Thoughtseize? Or perhaps I do not meet devotion and she is instead a target for Duress? Or is she a qualified target for both, regardless of devotion count while in someone's hand (or even library)?
Yeah that is essentially the same question and confusion that I have. Since the type is creature and enchantment printed on the card but a continuous effect on the card that modifies its type, it is very confusing.
EDIT: LKratos just made an earlier post that makes sense. That effect is only checked when the permanent is on the battlefield, so in separate zones the card types are checked normally with what is printed on the card.
Yeah that is essentially the same question and confusion that I have. Since the type is creature and enchantment printed on the card but a continuous effect on the card that modifies its type, it is very confusing.
Robin Thicke must've helped design this set..
BLURRRRRED LIIIIIIIINES....
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Really? You're gunna sit out a set because one out of 200+ cards doesn't satisfy you flavor wise. Have fun with that.
Sure, let's have giant gods. Because we all know Enchantments are known for being large in size and NOT ethereal. Oh, they aren't know for that? Guess that explains the lack in size.
Did you see the art? They looked much bigger to me. Regardless of size, and even if Thassa was human-sized, the name "god" denotes power outside anything mortals can even comprehend. I understand there have to be mechanical concessions to flavor, sure, but the first time I see a Creature - God in this game it should be a little more powerful than 5/5.
Heck, Caravan Escort can level up to that power/toughness combo. Would 6/6 have killed them when developing this?
PS: I might not sit it out but this card is a definite "meh" for me. My inner Timmy is not squealing at this.
I have some difficulty with this...considering it says on the card:
"As long as your devotion to blue is less than five, Thassa isn’t a creature."
Going one step further...
Is that line of text not 'applicable' if Thassa is in the graveyard, or hand, then?
No. Unless the card explicitly says that text like that applies in your hand, in the graveyard, etc., it only applies when the card is on the battlefield. Just because you have a crypt ghast in your hand doesn't mean you can tap swamps for extra mana, it doesn't apply unless the card is in play. Same here.
No. Unless the card explicitly says that text like that applies in your hand, in the graveyard, etc., it only applies when the card is on the battlefield. Just because you have a crypt ghast in your hand doesn't mean you can tap swamps for extra mana, it doesn't apply unless the card is in play. Same here.
Right..
So she is both types in all zones, except when on the battlefield and devotion count is checked (where she is either an enchantment, or both)?
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I hate you Cz (ノಥ益ಥ)ノ ┻━┻ . Ok. let's all calm down and take a deep breath. ┬─┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ). Better?
No. Unless the card explicitly says that text like that applies in your hand, in the graveyard, etc., it only applies when the card is on the battlefield. Just because you have a crypt ghast in your hand doesn't mean you can tap swamps for extra mana, it doesn't apply unless the card is in play. Same here.
Characteristic-defining abilities (such as ones that define power and toughness, like Lhurgoyf) work in all zones even without text that explicitly says so. The question is whether or not this ability is considered to be characteristic-defining or not. I'm not sure which it is. Erring on the side of simplicity, I'm assuming it's not, so the printed card types would be correct in other zones, but I don't have the templating and rules knowledge to be 100 sure.
Yes, Aphemia, since it is both an Enchantment and a Creature, as it has both types. The only time the devotion ability matters is when it is on the battlefield, as it is a static ability.
EDIT: Luminum_can, I can only assume the "Thassa is not a creature" only works when it's in play, as devotion only counts the number of mana costs in permanents you control. Thassa herself, on the card, is explicitly a creature and enchantment for all purposes due to how subtypes work; I could be wrong though.
You mean expansions, not blocks right?
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
For Lists, Click Here
EDH:
GW: Selvala, Let us help YOU.
UB: Mirko Vosk, when outmatched cheat
BW: Vish Kal, The Arbiter of Reanimation
UG: Prime Speaker Zegana, the science of sorcery
RB: Malfegor, Traitor's Haven
UW: Daxos, Control-Fort-Tron
BG: Pharika, Goddess of Stax
RW: Gisela, Boros Control
RG: Ruric Thar, a Primal Surge deck
RU: Niv-Mizzet the Firemind, Spellslinger?!?!
B:(Pauper) Mikaeus the Unhallowed
R: Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient: The Power of Engineering
Yeah that Replenish will be so sick in EDH after this block. Now fingers crossed for that bant Enchantress-commander in the precons this winter.
I'm definitely not a fan, I might sit out Theros.
I have some difficulty with this...considering it says on the card:
"As long as your devotion to blue is less than five, Thassa isn’t a creature."
Going one step further...
Is that line of text not 'applicable' if Thassa is in the graveyard, or hand, then?
For instance...Reanimate targets Thassa, she begins to enter the battlefield - is the devotion count checked at this point?
Or is devotion count always checked, no matter what zone Thassa is in?
So if I meet the devotion count is she now a creature while in my hand, and a target for Thoughtseize? Or perhaps I do not meet devotion and she is instead a target for Duress? Or is she a qualified target for both, regardless of devotion count while in someone's hand (or even library)?
Mind = Blown
D:
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Misbehavin':
*Still love ya TK-421 haha Respect! \m/
maybe i'm wrong here but I think its a creature spell and then state-based effects make it not a creature when it enters the battlefield.
Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
Really? You're gunna sit out a set because one out of 200+ cards doesn't satisfy you flavor wise. Have fun with that.
Sure, let's have giant gods. Because we all know Enchantments are known for being large in size and NOT ethereal. Oh, they aren't know for that? Guess that explains the lack in size.
URJhoira of the GhituUR(Under con.)
BMaralen of the MornsongB
UBLazav, Dimir MastermindUB
Standard:
UMono U DevotionU
Casual:
GPrimordial Hydra JankinessG
- L
"The problem isn't when Scissors says Rock is overpowered, it's when Paper says it is."
-Mark Rosewater
She would not trigger evolve, as she is not a creature when evolve triggers.
Devotion is only checked when the card is on the battlefield.
Bestow, I have no idea how that works with Negate/Essence Scatter, their tweets are making it a rules nightmare.
Yeah that is essentially the same question and confusion that I have. Since the type is creature and enchantment printed on the card but a continuous effect on the card that modifies its type, it is very confusing.
EDIT: LKratos just made an earlier post that makes sense. That effect is only checked when the permanent is on the battlefield, so in separate zones the card types are checked normally with what is printed on the card.
Robin Thicke must've helped design this set..
BLURRRRRED LIIIIIIIINES....
Did you see the art? They looked much bigger to me. Regardless of size, and even if Thassa was human-sized, the name "god" denotes power outside anything mortals can even comprehend. I understand there have to be mechanical concessions to flavor, sure, but the first time I see a Creature - God in this game it should be a little more powerful than 5/5.
Heck, Caravan Escort can level up to that power/toughness combo. Would 6/6 have killed them when developing this?
PS: I might not sit it out but this card is a definite "meh" for me. My inner Timmy is not squealing at this.
Actually I believe it is the opposite, but cannot be a valid target for Duress.
No. Unless the card explicitly says that text like that applies in your hand, in the graveyard, etc., it only applies when the card is on the battlefield. Just because you have a crypt ghast in your hand doesn't mean you can tap swamps for extra mana, it doesn't apply unless the card is in play. Same here.
Right..
So she is both types in all zones, except when on the battlefield and devotion count is checked (where she is either an enchantment, or both)?
Yes, I believe this is exactly correct.
Characteristic-defining abilities (such as ones that define power and toughness, like Lhurgoyf) work in all zones even without text that explicitly says so. The question is whether or not this ability is considered to be characteristic-defining or not. I'm not sure which it is. Erring on the side of simplicity, I'm assuming it's not, so the printed card types would be correct in other zones, but I don't have the templating and rules knowledge to be 100 sure.
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
EDIT: Luminum_can, I can only assume the "Thassa is not a creature" only works when it's in play, as devotion only counts the number of mana costs in permanents you control. Thassa herself, on the card, is explicitly a creature and enchantment for all purposes due to how subtypes work; I could be wrong though.
Also I strongly suspect something that removes the indestructibility of God cards.
Hero's Quest (or some specific heroic quest:P)
Legendary Enchantment
God [or even all cards] cards lose indestructible.
Hero cards get blah blah.
By virtue of the whole "indestructible is a keyword" I bet highly on something like this.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall