It's sad to see another promo go. Gateway promos have sucked for a while now, but that was probably to make room for Game Day promos to be good. It's hard to believe only one common or unc is good from each set, though.
The promo cards contained within the Gateway Kits were never very good.
Yeah, because no one ever played : Gather the Townsfolk, Path to Exile, Shrine of Burning Rage, Signal Pest, Vampire Nighthawk, Vault Skirge, Sprouting Thrinax, Mogg Fanatic, or Boggart Ram-Gang competitively.
Gateway promos were pretty hit or miss, but it doesn't make it a bad promotion. It seems like the negatively vocal minority is winning out. Everything that's being taken away was getting met with increasing apathy, until it goes away.
Promo cards, even bad ones, attract people to the stores. I know a LOT of player will be pissed. It's a nice way to thank them for playing, even if they go 0-3 they have a chance, at least in my LGS, to get a promo card they can trade for other stuff.
These bloody suits are going to keep taking things away until players revolt and stop supporting the product. I see similarities to DLC in the video game world. It's all an experiment to see how many ways they can milk their customers before it starts to hurt their bottom line. Well, that's the business.
So instead of crappy promo cards, we get window clings? Sure.
So do stores actually have to pay for these? Seems like it's just some marketing materials.
And if these kits are supposed to last a year, what do they do when future sets haven't been revealed yet? Or are the set-specific thingies separate?
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Level 2 Judge
Currently playing:
Standard: Superfriends!
Legacy: Nic Fit / Pod
Pauper: Delvar; Tron; Flicker Stuff
Commander: Riku ("Some weird doubple spell thing happened"); Keranos ("I did a Gatherer search for 'random' and 'flip a coin.'"); Superfriends!
I'm going on record right now and stating that before the end of 2012 we will see foil dual lands in booster packs (The real, Alpha dual lands). You can quote me on that.
Nothing in this game is degenerate or completely dominant. They haven't banned anything in standard in a long, long time. Hell they should have banned affinity right away, but they didn't until boxed sales collapsed too. Hasbro had to come in and fire people.
I'll enjoy watching all the whiners eat crow monday.
The gateway promo cards were crap. Who cares if they are gone? The additional marketing materials will be BETTER for small stores because it helps them attract more people to the store.
How does a window cling in your window next to all the other window clings attract new customers into your store? Small hobby shops are small and out of the way. If you don't know it exists, the window cling does nothing to help that problem.
I can't say I've ever gotten a gateway promo. But if I knew there were free cards to be had, I'd make every effort to FIND those small stores, which will bring more business.
If this keeps up I'm going to start playing Legacy and stop purchasing Wizards product, this has gone too far for my taste and I'm going to start voting with my wallet.
I wrote to Bill Stark after reading the article asking if Wizards was in fact slowly discontinuing free promos, or if something was going to replace Gateway promos. By my count we've gone in 3 years from 49 different promos annually to 35.
Here is a surprisingly prompt reply from Bill:
Thanks for taking the time to write. Like you, I’m also a long-time Magic player (Fallen Empires was my first expansion, sometime back around 1995). I’m going to respond to your email, but I have to be up front with you: I can’t comment on Wizards business strategies, which are some of the things you asked about. However, I can say this: Magic and Organized Play programs are created by people who are passionate about Magic. We’re Magic players, people who have been to, run, judged, and organized events for years. The success of the game drives each move we make, and that’s why we decided it was time to introduce the Trade Marketing Kit. After analyzing the Gateway Kit we realized it wasn’t living up to its intended purpose. We truly believe the Trade Marketing Kit will shore up some of its weaknesses, and will provide tools retailers can use to better succeed with their businesses. Their success is very important to us; when retailers succeed, Wizards succeeds because they are our partners in the gaming world. And when we succeed together, we better serve your needs as a player.
I can’t speak to some of the specifics you asked about in your email, but I can assure you this: we created the Trade Marketing Kit to better serve retailers and players, and we truly believe it will.
Thanks for taking the time to write, and feel free to ask if you have any more questions.
Regards,
Bill
I'm not surprised he can't divulge WotC's business plans, but I am a little irked that the end of the reply was 8 sentences sentences of marketing fluff. Any he never even used the word "promo" once either.
Nobody is going to quit the game over this. Maybe some people did over MPR (Yeah I miss Foil Cryptic Commands and Damnation). Losing Mythic Pre-releases kinda sucked as the replacements are bad and have influenced my decisions there. Gateway is just the next thing to go and doesn't really matter since it hasn't been good in a while. It's just sad because Wizards is probably moving towards a system where you shouldn't expect to get anything awesome for free. They can and probably will get away from it which frankly is disappointing. I just hope they don't take away Judge Rewards because those guys deserve that as a reward for the tremendous effort they put in to support the community.
ITT: People raging over Wizards deciding to cancel FREE product.
Never change mtgsalv, never change.
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Originally Posted by Massive Marc
You know back in the old days, when there wasn't EDH, these "griefer" cards in decks were the norm. If you played a Winter Orb when you're opponents were tapped out, it was a good play. Now, you get people tell you they wanna punch you ? It's really sad how carebare this format is, to the point that some loser has to rip up your cards.
It's a shame Wizards is stopping this after MPR stopped =(.
But as a collector I can be relieved to say: No more Gateway promo's to keep track of =).
Still... it's a shame. I can't possibly imagine how a stores promotional material can be any better than giving away promo's.
ITT: People raging over Wizards deciding to cancel FREE product.
Never change mtgsalv, never change.
It wasn't even a good free product, but a lot of people myself included find getting promo cards to be fun. Believe it or not, it influences me going into the store and playing too. Sometimes the store isn't doing an FNM format I like (modern, two headed giant, commander, etc) but I'll throw a deck together and show up anyways because I don't want to miss out on the promo opportunity since I enjoy collecting them.
ITT: People raging over Wizards deciding to cancel FREE product.
Never change mtgsalv, never change.
And those who don't understand simple marketing, never change, never change.
If you go to the store and hold your hand out and say "Give me my free WPN promo" - do they give you one?
If you have to buy packs, pay an entry fee or exchange something besides your time to acquire a 'promo' card - then it isn't free. Its supplemental marketing in the form of incentives or prizes.
Wizards has fostered and nurtured this culture themselves - they have no one to blame but themselves when it upsets people. Many were happy buying product and sitting around the kitchen table playing cards. Thing is WotC knows people sitting at home trading their small supply of cards doesn't sell many packs. So they have progressively shoveled the notion that you should be rewarded just for participating in events sanctioned by them! Yay - so you've successfully dragged a large percentage of the kitchen table gamers into a store! Now, yank that rug out from under them and say "so you were having 'fun' anyway right? no need to keep feeding you those promos we enticed you out of the house with" Expect backlash and anger. It's normal humanity.
As a collector I agree with Koruam - the WPN cards were a pain to track down and keep up with anyway. But I can see why a lot of folks are miffed over losing them.
They should intro something like Kool-Aid or Marlboro points on each package. Then you can trade in Points for Promos. That was always fun collecting them and getting bonus stuff
The thing is, is that Wizards does not owe the fanbase anything.
Wizards is a corperation, they have no obligation for you to continue to get the promos you want.
To get upset over not getting a certain kind of promo anymore is just childish.
If I give you 5 dollars every week, and then suddenly I decide I don't want to give you 5 dollars anymore, to you have any right whatsoever to be upset at me?
Again Wizards doesn't owe us anything.
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Originally Posted by Massive Marc
You know back in the old days, when there wasn't EDH, these "griefer" cards in decks were the norm. If you played a Winter Orb when you're opponents were tapped out, it was a good play. Now, you get people tell you they wanna punch you ? It's really sad how carebare this format is, to the point that some loser has to rip up your cards.
The thing is, is that Wizards does not owe the fanbase anything.
Wizards is a corperation, they have no obligation for you to continue to get the promos you want.
To get upset over not getting a certain kind of promo anymore is just childish.
If I give you 5 dollars every week, and then suddenly I decide I don't want to give you 5 dollars anymore, to you have any right whatsoever to be upset at me?
Again Wizards doesn't owe us anything.
So with your logic you are saying if we the players lose interest in buying MTG because there are less and less reasons to be excited about spending money on their products, they can still exist as a company even though they make no money?
I agree that Wizards doesn't owe anyone anything. No dispute there.
Yuor analogy is flawed though.
If you give me a two dollar bill that I can't seem to find anywhere else each week for coming by your house to play video games with you which you charge me $5 for the privledge. I rationalize that hey - really thats only $3 I'm paying to play his PS3 and I dont have one of my own - I own a 360 - so thats worth it. Plus the real draw is I collect those cool $2 bills. Now, this goes on for a couple YEARS and we both like our little agreement - you're banking $3 a week and I am happily playing your video games. Then you just tell me, "oh, no more $2 bills man. Sorry. I don't owe you anything. I'd still like you to come give me $5 a week and play with my PS3 though!"
While I technichally would have no 'right' to be angry - neither of us said this arrangement would go on forever - but it was something I grew to like doing and found the value not just in the PS3 but the promotional $2 you were giving me also. So now, I have to choose either to stop coming over or eat it on the new deal and lose the percieved value of the $2 bill. That decision is part of the disappointment and anger that himan minds figure the habitual relationship would continue forever.
Its not being childish - people who have real jobs go through this kind of stuff everyday. At my work we get free sodas - all the time, 24x7. As well as bottled water. One year, we went through one of those 'green initiative' nonsensical things and they decided to take away the bottled water due to all the waste it produces and replace it with a fancy smancy water filter dispenser thing and everyone got free water bottles to re-use. You would have seen the outrage over the change as "just childish" - but it was a normal reaction to change. (I didn't much care)
Now whining about it on a forum where many users share their disappointment (and others like yourself obviously dont) is a way for them to cope with that change and hope that something better will come along. If MPR taught us anything - it wont.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
"Can you apply the penal code to demons?"
Yeah, because no one ever played : Gather the Townsfolk, Path to Exile, Shrine of Burning Rage, Signal Pest, Vampire Nighthawk, Vault Skirge, Sprouting Thrinax, Mogg Fanatic, or Boggart Ram-Gang competitively.
Gateway promos were pretty hit or miss, but it doesn't make it a bad promotion. It seems like the negatively vocal minority is winning out. Everything that's being taken away was getting met with increasing apathy, until it goes away.
I'm still waiting for my "replacement" for MPR.
Promo cards, even bad ones, attract people to the stores. I know a LOT of player will be pissed. It's a nice way to thank them for playing, even if they go 0-3 they have a chance, at least in my LGS, to get a promo card they can trade for other stuff.
Seriously WOTC makes the worst decisions ever.
These guys aren't satisfied with doing business the way you've described - they are primarily concerned with maximizing revenue/profit.
Edited quoted text for clarity.
meat's Trade Corner
So do stores actually have to pay for these? Seems like it's just some marketing materials.
And if these kits are supposed to last a year, what do they do when future sets haven't been revealed yet? Or are the set-specific thingies separate?
Currently playing:
Standard: Superfriends!
Legacy: Nic Fit / Pod
Pauper: Delvar; Tron; Flicker Stuff
Commander: Riku ("Some weird doubple spell thing happened"); Keranos ("I did a Gatherer search for 'random' and 'flip a coin.'"); Superfriends!
for shame.
Who's eating crow?
How does a window cling in your window next to all the other window clings attract new customers into your store? Small hobby shops are small and out of the way. If you don't know it exists, the window cling does nothing to help that problem.
I can't say I've ever gotten a gateway promo. But if I knew there were free cards to be had, I'd make every effort to FIND those small stores, which will bring more business.
EDH is a CASUAL format. Get with the program, or GTFO.
Problem is my only constructive criticism would be that she should retire immediately.
WotC is very lucky that their product is so addictive, because their customer service is shamefully bad.
Here is a surprisingly prompt reply from Bill:
Thanks for taking the time to write. Like you, I’m also a long-time Magic player (Fallen Empires was my first expansion, sometime back around 1995). I’m going to respond to your email, but I have to be up front with you: I can’t comment on Wizards business strategies, which are some of the things you asked about. However, I can say this: Magic and Organized Play programs are created by people who are passionate about Magic. We’re Magic players, people who have been to, run, judged, and organized events for years. The success of the game drives each move we make, and that’s why we decided it was time to introduce the Trade Marketing Kit. After analyzing the Gateway Kit we realized it wasn’t living up to its intended purpose. We truly believe the Trade Marketing Kit will shore up some of its weaknesses, and will provide tools retailers can use to better succeed with their businesses. Their success is very important to us; when retailers succeed, Wizards succeeds because they are our partners in the gaming world. And when we succeed together, we better serve your needs as a player.
I can’t speak to some of the specifics you asked about in your email, but I can assure you this: we created the Trade Marketing Kit to better serve retailers and players, and we truly believe it will.
Thanks for taking the time to write, and feel free to ask if you have any more questions.
Regards,
Bill
I'm not surprised he can't divulge WotC's business plans, but I am a little irked that the end of the reply was 8 sentences sentences of marketing fluff. Any he never even used the word "promo" once either.
So, take it for what you will.
Never change mtgsalv, never change.
You know back in the old days, when there wasn't EDH, these "griefer" cards in decks were the norm. If you played a Winter Orb when you're opponents were tapped out, it was a good play. Now, you get people tell you they wanna punch you ? It's really sad how carebare this format is, to the point that some loser has to rip up your cards.
But as a collector I can be relieved to say: No more Gateway promo's to keep track of =).
Still... it's a shame. I can't possibly imagine how a stores promotional material can be any better than giving away promo's.
It wasn't even a good free product, but a lot of people myself included find getting promo cards to be fun. Believe it or not, it influences me going into the store and playing too. Sometimes the store isn't doing an FNM format I like (modern, two headed giant, commander, etc) but I'll throw a deck together and show up anyways because I don't want to miss out on the promo opportunity since I enjoy collecting them.
And those who don't understand simple marketing, never change, never change.
If you go to the store and hold your hand out and say "Give me my free WPN promo" - do they give you one?
If you have to buy packs, pay an entry fee or exchange something besides your time to acquire a 'promo' card - then it isn't free. Its supplemental marketing in the form of incentives or prizes.
Wizards has fostered and nurtured this culture themselves - they have no one to blame but themselves when it upsets people. Many were happy buying product and sitting around the kitchen table playing cards. Thing is WotC knows people sitting at home trading their small supply of cards doesn't sell many packs. So they have progressively shoveled the notion that you should be rewarded just for participating in events sanctioned by them! Yay - so you've successfully dragged a large percentage of the kitchen table gamers into a store! Now, yank that rug out from under them and say "so you were having 'fun' anyway right? no need to keep feeding you those promos we enticed you out of the house with" Expect backlash and anger. It's normal humanity.
As a collector I agree with Koruam - the WPN cards were a pain to track down and keep up with anyway. But I can see why a lot of folks are miffed over losing them.
LISTEN TO MAH SONGZ!
@BillyTheFridge
Wizards is a corperation, they have no obligation for you to continue to get the promos you want.
To get upset over not getting a certain kind of promo anymore is just childish.
If I give you 5 dollars every week, and then suddenly I decide I don't want to give you 5 dollars anymore, to you have any right whatsoever to be upset at me?
Again Wizards doesn't owe us anything.
You know back in the old days, when there wasn't EDH, these "griefer" cards in decks were the norm. If you played a Winter Orb when you're opponents were tapped out, it was a good play. Now, you get people tell you they wanna punch you ? It's really sad how carebare this format is, to the point that some loser has to rip up your cards.
So with your logic you are saying if we the players lose interest in buying MTG because there are less and less reasons to be excited about spending money on their products, they can still exist as a company even though they make no money?
What is this new kit?
Yuor analogy is flawed though.
If you give me a two dollar bill that I can't seem to find anywhere else each week for coming by your house to play video games with you which you charge me $5 for the privledge. I rationalize that hey - really thats only $3 I'm paying to play his PS3 and I dont have one of my own - I own a 360 - so thats worth it. Plus the real draw is I collect those cool $2 bills. Now, this goes on for a couple YEARS and we both like our little agreement - you're banking $3 a week and I am happily playing your video games. Then you just tell me, "oh, no more $2 bills man. Sorry. I don't owe you anything. I'd still like you to come give me $5 a week and play with my PS3 though!"
While I technichally would have no 'right' to be angry - neither of us said this arrangement would go on forever - but it was something I grew to like doing and found the value not just in the PS3 but the promotional $2 you were giving me also. So now, I have to choose either to stop coming over or eat it on the new deal and lose the percieved value of the $2 bill. That decision is part of the disappointment and anger that himan minds figure the habitual relationship would continue forever.
Its not being childish - people who have real jobs go through this kind of stuff everyday. At my work we get free sodas - all the time, 24x7. As well as bottled water. One year, we went through one of those 'green initiative' nonsensical things and they decided to take away the bottled water due to all the waste it produces and replace it with a fancy smancy water filter dispenser thing and everyone got free water bottles to re-use. You would have seen the outrage over the change as "just childish" - but it was a normal reaction to change. (I didn't much care)
Now whining about it on a forum where many users share their disappointment (and others like yourself obviously dont) is a way for them to cope with that change and hope that something better will come along. If MPR taught us anything - it wont.