Maybe that is gonna change, so that things that are not creatures can be given a creature type. That way tribal decks can benefit more from having non-creature permanents that still fit in the theme?
Life from the limb + hivestone + Poison Sliver
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Here's Jonny
a piece of my soul, through poetic sows.
The tides of fate procreate disaster
and awakens thy master
the gates explode and the seals anulled
between the dust lyes a fold
of unimaginal minds untold
i duress in death's caress
where the unknow take hold
Through a portal of the past
I regress past a river blazing cold
Funny how everyone is excited about seeing poison counters coming back, and I'm excited about seeing a 1-mana sliver in the same color as Gemhide Sliver.
This sliver finally makes a 2-3 color sliver zoo deck something worth considering in block, as you can drop early guys, mana fix and accelerate, make them grow and give them haste with relative ease. Throw in a few fatties like Bonesplitter and/or Pulmonic and you're all set for hot slivery action...
...and if all else fails, I suppose you can always kill them with 10 poison counters... =)
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People hiss and grunt at Mark Rosewater for the state of the game. Few realize, though, that it is Aaron Forsythe who is directly responsible of the current state of affairs due to negligence as head of Magic R&D and a completely skewed view of the game as a whole.
So next time you want to make an avvy with Rosewater pissing on something, take a deep breath and consider pasting Forsythe's face there instead...
Assuming you mean Life and Limb, that might be an interesting combo, with all my lands now attacking for poison counters. Not very competitive, but lots of fun.
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
Sweet finally a green sliver that only costs G. Now my slivers can hit the ground faster, and with a lower average cost. And they can be much scarier. Luckily it says combat damage or the Psionic Slivers would mean victory!
If you could kill them with poison counters from psionic sliver, you could just kill them with damage form him too. This sliver would not make psionic sliver better or worst if it did not say combat damage
Assuming no life gain.
What does this have to do with noncreature Slivers?
It's useful to point out where you think the person made the error. In this case, the lands are being made into creatures before they are made into slivers, so LAZ may be mistaken with his noncreature sliver quote. However, again, providing information on why you think someone is mistaken is always more helpful in forums than simply posting that you believe there is a problem with someones post.
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
If you could kill them with poison counters from psionic sliver, you could just kill them with damage form him too. This sliver would not make psionic sliver better or worst if it did not say combat damage
Assuming no life gain.
stop assuming NO life gain when there is so much life gain foo
turn lands into saprolings then turn those saprolings into slivers then give slivers poisonous ftw
martyr of what now?
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Here's Jonny
a piece of my soul, through poetic sows.
The tides of fate procreate disaster
and awakens thy master
the gates explode and the seals anulled
between the dust lyes a fold
of unimaginal minds untold
i duress in death's caress
where the unknow take hold
Through a portal of the past
I regress past a river blazing cold
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
Doesnt this card means 2 (maybe 3) things:
1: We are getting poison back
2: Its timeshifted from the future, so we are getting slivers in the future too(!!!)
(3: we are getting poison in the future)
I beleive those are in reverse order of assumption. Most likely, we are getting poison in the future. Second to that, we are probably getting slivers in the future (how could wizards drop such a popular creature type). More poison in Future Sight is certainly possible, but by no means required. Future-shifting an ability doesn't imply that it will be a staple ability in the set (I believe).
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
As for the grammar discussion, a Sliver granting "poisonous" does sound awkward, but an otherwise vanilla creature that would have "Poison 1" written on it makes little sense. "Poisonous 1" sounds better.
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Thanks to blurrycloud, who by the way, is a redonculous artist.
Now imagine what'd happen if you drop 2-3 of these guys at once. Every one of your creatures that hits is now putting a bunch of counters on them. In fact, if you could find a way to get 3 out and a shadow sliver, the game's pretty much over
yeah, just what I was thinking,
turn 1, forest+Virulent Sliver.
turn 2: forest+ 2 Virulent slivers, swing for 1dmg+3 poison counters
turn 3: forest(or not)+last virulent sliver, or not, and swing for 9(or 12 given you had another V-sliver) poison countres, game over. lets see, we did a total of 4 damage and won the game? not bad imo.
But on another note...poisons are not virulent, so maybe they should call it them "plague counters" which effectivly do the same thing. Venomous Sliver would deal poison, Virulent sliver would deal in disease right?
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I'm sure this has probably already been said in the 8+ pages of posts I'm too lazy to read, but the vast majority of the time your opponent gets hit by slivers ten times, he'll be long dead from damage. The poison ability only becomes really relevant if there are other ways your opponent might be accruing counters (dual lands that give you poison counters maybe? Poison counter on upkeep creatures? Who knows...). As is, someone pointed out that he's a one mana sliver, which is quite relevant in terms of crazy acceleration wih gemhide/firewake. However, I'm not sure I see a dedicated sliver rush deck being able to battle through damnation. Maybe with wild pair???
Poison's relevance to the opponents life total HAS been discussed thoroughly, and the conclusion is that poison counters are effective against life gain, and when the counters are delivered in quantities greater than 1. Also, you mentioned poison counters being a cost of certain items (as upkeep and such). I really like that idea. Hopefully we can see it in FS.
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
I don't think its been mentioned, but an influx of poisonous creatures would fit perfectly in the future they are presenting to be "Aztec" in nature. Cool.
there making a set with an aztec theme? when was this said?
Am I the only one who thinks the name of the mechanic is retarded? Poisonous means toxic when ingested. The real name they were thinking of is venomous.
yeah i know ... "venomous X" does not have combat damage clause
The problem with a poison is that (assuming no life gain) it is strictly worst then just doing 2 points of damage.
If this sliver said "all slivers get +1/+0" it would be better.
The only time giving someone a poison counter is better than just doing 2 points of damage to them is when they are gaining tons of life.
I mean i know that the poison is in addition to the damage, but unless the slivers are all doing less then 2 points of damage there going to die from damage before they die from poison (or at the same time of they do no take damage from any other sources)
Again all statements above are made assuming no life gain. (which is a safe assumption in most games.)
how is it strickly worse. its like damage that can not be healed (out side of leeches).
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Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
stop assuming NO life gain when there is so much life gain foo
turn lands into saprolings then turn those saprolings into slivers then give slivers poisonous ftw
martyr of what now?
Most decks (<50%) Do not have white in them, which means that they most likely do not have anyway of gaining life.
I stand by my statement that:
one poison< two damage
And that this sliver is strictly worst then one that would give all slivers +1/+0 (though such a sliver would be under costed for G)
I like this sliver not for its ability but because its a one drop green sliver, which i feel will make sliver decks better. There need to be more one drop slivers in T2 for slivers to see play.
man aztec theme set would be almost as cool as an egyptian themed set .... *gives up hopes*
Well, there was Arabian Nights.
Anyway, wow, this card is very exciting. I've been pulling for poison to make a comeback since Swamp Mosquito was timeshifted, and wow, I'm so glad it's back, and keyworded no less. I only hope there's enough of it that it can make a good deck without the deck being made for us.
Edit: Although it's a bit disappointing that it's combat damage only. I was looking forward to Fire Whip antics.
The poison mosquito is unchanged, even with the new Poisonous keyword. It did not have the ability that poisonous described, and so its ability will not be replaced by poisonous. Thus, it is the same card now, as it was before FS, and, as such, can be used the same way.
Yeah, because it doesn't deal combat damage.
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No seriously, stop whining about the Futureshift frames.
There are threads in New Card Discussion for that.
'OMGSSs teh FrAme SUXXX' posts are spam, and a waste of posts here.
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if the unmorphed version of the Enchantment that is spoiled becomes a Sliver with for example Unnatural Selection, and you then morph it it would be a "Enchantment - Sliver" and that isn't a "Sliver creature". So maybe thats why there is new templating.
This could be the reason, although its nothing new, since we've had enchantments become creatures and vice versa. (see Stinging Licid)
Oh? I untap with my Djinn in play? Then I'll cast High Tide 5 times, let the copies resolve, cast Remand 3 times, the first and second targetting the original High Tide, and the third targetting the first Remand. After the stack empties, I'll cast a Turnabout with 1 replicate, and triple-remand again. Net Effect: Draw 4 cards, Islands all produce 4 extra blue, lands untapped. Repeat until I draw Vision Charm and proceed to deck several hundred players.
People for some reason give the Poison mechanic a lot of credit as being a viable win condition. It's completely useless with slivers. If you're playing a Sliver deck and your opponent isn't dead after 10[!] instances of combat damage from slivers, then your sliver deck needs work, or you're playing against lifegain.dec. Yeah, with at least two of these guys in play you can set the clock to fewer turns. But even then, why wouldn't you want to play with beefier slivers and win with fat?
In order for the Poison mechanic to TRULY take off and be viable, even in casual, is if it's only put on agressive 1 CC weenies. Why? Because anything bigger and you might as well be beating down with fat. But if a poison critter is granted anything beyond maybe 2, it's kinda broken. In order to make it not-broken, the ability will need to be put on small bodies with high casting costs. And then it's probably have some form of evasion in order to make it even just a little bit more attractive.
We're talking maybe a :2mana::symg::symg: for a 1/1 with poisonous 2 and forestwalk.
I don't know.....I just don't understand what the big deal with poison is.
That being said:
It's cool to see another futureshifted card. I'm skeptical on the creation of poisonous though. I say this because they can be VERY open ended with the whole 'you'll see cards printed from future sets!', and we won't see poisonous for several years because R&D doesn't really want poison back. Time will tell. Just don't be surprised if 4 years down the line there's someone saying 'wait a second......we saw Poison in Future Sight but haven't since!'.
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Life from the limb + hivestone + Poison Sliver
a piece of my soul, through poetic sows.
The tides of fate procreate disaster
and awakens thy master
the gates explode and the seals anulled
between the dust lyes a fold
of unimaginal minds untold
i duress in death's caress
where the unknow take hold
Through a portal of the past
I regress past a river blazing cold
This sliver finally makes a 2-3 color sliver zoo deck something worth considering in block, as you can drop early guys, mana fix and accelerate, make them grow and give them haste with relative ease. Throw in a few fatties like Bonesplitter and/or Pulmonic and you're all set for hot slivery action...
...and if all else fails, I suppose you can always kill them with 10 poison counters... =)
So next time you want to make an avvy with Rosewater pissing on something, take a deep breath and consider pasting Forsythe's face there instead...
First off, Life from the limb is not a card. You are combining Life from the Loam and Life and Limb.
Assuming you mean Life and Limb, that might be an interesting combo, with all my lands now attacking for poison counters. Not very competitive, but lots of fun.
If you could kill them with poison counters from psionic sliver, you could just kill them with damage form him too. This sliver would not make psionic sliver better or worst if it did not say combat damage
Assuming no life gain.
What does this have to do with noncreature Slivers?
It's useful to point out where you think the person made the error. In this case, the lands are being made into creatures before they are made into slivers, so LAZ may be mistaken with his noncreature sliver quote. However, again, providing information on why you think someone is mistaken is always more helpful in forums than simply posting that you believe there is a problem with someones post.
stop assuming NO life gain when there is so much life gain foo
turn lands into saprolings then turn those saprolings into slivers then give slivers poisonous ftw
martyr of what now?
a piece of my soul, through poetic sows.
The tides of fate procreate disaster
and awakens thy master
the gates explode and the seals anulled
between the dust lyes a fold
of unimaginal minds untold
i duress in death's caress
where the unknow take hold
Through a portal of the past
I regress past a river blazing cold
Martyr of Poison FTW!!
I beleive those are in reverse order of assumption. Most likely, we are getting poison in the future. Second to that, we are probably getting slivers in the future (how could wizards drop such a popular creature type). More poison in Future Sight is certainly possible, but by no means required. Future-shifting an ability doesn't imply that it will be a staple ability in the set (I believe).
Thanks to blurrycloud, who by the way, is a redonculous artist.
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I can't believe it's not butter!
yeah, just what I was thinking,
turn 1, forest+Virulent Sliver.
turn 2: forest+ 2 Virulent slivers, swing for 1dmg+3 poison counters
turn 3: forest(or not)+last virulent sliver, or not, and swing for 9(or 12 given you had another V-sliver) poison countres, game over. lets see, we did a total of 4 damage and won the game? not bad imo.
But on another note...poisons are not virulent, so maybe they should call it them "plague counters" which effectivly do the same thing. Venomous Sliver would deal poison, Virulent sliver would deal in disease right?
WAnglesW
WUBRGThe BroodGRBUW
WUGAllymillGUW
Poison's relevance to the opponents life total HAS been discussed thoroughly, and the conclusion is that poison counters are effective against life gain, and when the counters are delivered in quantities greater than 1. Also, you mentioned poison counters being a cost of certain items (as upkeep and such). I really like that idea. Hopefully we can see it in FS.
there making a set with an aztec theme? when was this said?
yeah i know ... "venomous X" does not have combat damage clause
how is it strickly worse. its like damage that can not be healed (out side of leeches).
This hasn't been confirmed. It is strictly limited to the hopes of a select few.
EDIT: By the way, you mean "they're", not "there". /grammarchecker
man aztec theme set would be almost as cool as an egyptian themed set .... *gives up hopes*
Again... as i said in my post... assuming no life gain, which is a safe assumption in most game you will play (life gain=healing)
Most decks (<50%) Do not have white in them, which means that they most likely do not have anyway of gaining life.
I stand by my statement that:
one poison< two damage
And that this sliver is strictly worst then one that would give all slivers +1/+0 (though such a sliver would be under costed for G)
I like this sliver not for its ability but because its a one drop green sliver, which i feel will make sliver decks better. There need to be more one drop slivers in T2 for slivers to see play.
An Egyptian theme. Boy, that would be a pyramid scheme on Wizard's part.
Owner of IcyGeek.com
Slivers rarely see play for some reason in standard.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=8810959#post8810959
Well, there was Arabian Nights.
Anyway, wow, this card is very exciting. I've been pulling for poison to make a comeback since Swamp Mosquito was timeshifted, and wow, I'm so glad it's back, and keyworded no less. I only hope there's enough of it that it can make a good deck without the deck being made for us.
Edit: Although it's a bit disappointing that it's combat damage only. I was looking forward to Fire Whip antics.
Yeah, because it doesn't deal combat damage.
There are threads in New Card Discussion for that.
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This could be the reason, although its nothing new, since we've had enchantments become creatures and vice versa. (see Stinging Licid)
In order for the Poison mechanic to TRULY take off and be viable, even in casual, is if it's only put on agressive 1 CC weenies. Why? Because anything bigger and you might as well be beating down with fat. But if a poison critter is granted anything beyond maybe 2, it's kinda broken. In order to make it not-broken, the ability will need to be put on small bodies with high casting costs. And then it's probably have some form of evasion in order to make it even just a little bit more attractive.
We're talking maybe a :2mana::symg::symg: for a 1/1 with poisonous 2 and forestwalk.
I don't know.....I just don't understand what the big deal with poison is.
That being said:
It's cool to see another futureshifted card. I'm skeptical on the creation of poisonous though. I say this because they can be VERY open ended with the whole 'you'll see cards printed from future sets!', and we won't see poisonous for several years because R&D doesn't really want poison back. Time will tell. Just don't be surprised if 4 years down the line there's someone saying 'wait a second......we saw Poison in Future Sight but haven't since!'.
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Now the next question is, are the timeshifted cards guaranteed to see print, or just areas they could go in the future?