What if Ugin and Azor are the same being? That would explain the winged creature references in the story, and would give us more justification for returning to Ravnica
You'd think so since he founded the blue and white guild, but anything's possible.
In other news, we now know what The Immortal Sun looks like, and it hoses planeswalker loyalty abilities, which (in addition to the pattern on its facade) basically confirms that it's what's fueling the planeswalker trap:
Anyone who tells me that artwork doesn't confirm Azor's involvement in any capacity at this point is nuts.
Nuts, I say!
I'm really trying to see the similarities everyone else seems to see. But the Immortal Sun and the Azoruis symbol look as different as possible while both being triangles.
Anyone who tells me that artwork doesn't confirm Azor's involvement in any capacity at this point is nuts.
Nuts, I say!
I'm really trying to see the similarities everyone else seems to see. But the Immortal Sun and the Azoruis symbol look as different as possible while both being triangles.
+1, i can't tell if i'm trying too hard not to see this being Azor, or if the folks around here are trying too hard to see Azor as the creator of the Immortal Sun.
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Art student, EDH lover and a strong believer that Delver has the best design in all of MTG.
Anyone who tells me that artwork doesn't confirm Azor's involvement in any capacity at this point is nuts.
Nuts, I say!
I'm really trying to see the similarities everyone else seems to see. But the Immortal Sun and the Azoruis symbol look as different as possible while both being triangles.
+1, i can't tell if i'm trying too hard not to see this being Azor, or if the folks around here are trying too hard to see Azor as the creator of the Immortal Sun.
It's a triangle with two concentric circles, one fully inside the triangle and the other cutting across the triangle's sides. The Azorius symbol is a triangle with multiple concentric circles crammed inside it.
To me, the two patterns are similar enough that it wouldn't be a huge stretch if the same person came up with them. At the same time, they're different enough that it could be a coincidence.
Also, you have admitted previously that you really really wanted it to not be Azor because you don't want Ravnica to overtake Ixalan's story, so there is an element of bias involved.
It's a triangle with two concentric circles, one fully inside the triangle and the other cutting across the triangle's sides. The Azorius symbol is a triangle with multiple concentric circles crammed inside it.
To me, the two patterns are similar enough that it wouldn't be a huge stretch if the same person came up with them. At the same time, they're different enough that it could be a coincidence.
Circle Triangle Circle is a radically different pattern compared to Triangle circle circle circle. If the similarities is only that both patterns use circles and triangles then I see the similarities you see but draw a completely different conclusion.
It's a triangle with two concentric circles, one fully inside the triangle and the other cutting across the triangle's sides. The Azorius symbol is a triangle with multiple concentric circles crammed inside it.
To me, the two patterns are similar enough that it wouldn't be a huge stretch if the same person came up with them. At the same time, they're different enough that it could be a coincidence.
Circle Triangle Circle is a radically different pattern compared to Triangle circle circle circle. If the similarities is only that both patterns use circles and triangles then I see the similarities you see but draw a completely different conclusion.
I think we should just wait at this point. We'll see if Team Azor, Team Ugin or Team None of the Above will win out.
I think we should just wait at this point. We'll see if Team Azor, Team Ugin or Team None of the Above will win out.
What about Team "Team Azor and Ugin"? The Last Guardian does imply more than one.
Tetzimoc might answer what the figure on Bishop's Soldier's Pommel is.
If the Immortal Sun is behind the 'Azor' sphinx, it's got to be HUGE.
It's also spewing the exact same kind of green vapor that Ugin does.
Also, along the center line you can see what appears to be Ugin horns at the top, and an 'upside-down V' that could be a symbol for Azor (a triangle and an A all at once).
It would be amazing if you guys were right about Azor being involved, but wrong about the sphinx being Azor.
Anyway, you guys are really looking forward to Azor, me personally i want to see Elenda and Dominaria, if they want to fill us with Ravnica and Ravnician(?) characters after that, fine by me.
After studying it some more, it looks a lot like the Azorius symbol. It’s a triangle with multiple circles inside of it. That being said, it doesn’t 100% conform that it’s Azor.
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The shape of the sun doesn't appear, to me at least, to confirm anything more than Ixalan's Binding does. It's just a mechanized version of the same pattern. I will remain sceptical.
Also if Tetzimoc implies that were getting a full cycle of monocolored dino lenegends thats both cool and unfortunate. Cool because more badass dinos but unfortunate because I doubt they'd do that and then a five color one too. Meaning dino tribal can't encompass all the dinos.
The shape of the sun doesn't appear, to me at least, to confirm anything more than Ixalan's Binding does. It's just a mechanized version of the same pattern. I will remain sceptical.
Also if Tetzimoc implies that were getting a full cycle of monocolored dino lenegends thats both cool and unfortunate. Cool because more badass dinos but unfortunate because I doubt they'd do that and then a five color one too. Meaning dino tribal can't encompass all the dinos.
Gotta start setting up a bunch of tribes so they can halfarse another tribal themed commander set in a few years.
Anyone who tells me that artwork doesn't confirm Azor's involvement in any capacity at this point is nuts.
Nuts, I say!
I'm really trying to see the similarities everyone else seems to see. But the Immortal Sun and the Azoruis symbol look as different as possible while both being triangles.
"It's not going to be Emrakul. The corruption of Innistrad is probably the Phyrexians." -Some couple months ago.
At any rate, it's either Azor or creative made a mistake. You can't feature a symbol, that is this close to an existing symbol associated with a character we have not met yet but was still important to the story, that itself is associated with a character that is purposefully left mysterious.
Reality does these things, but stories shouldn't, especially one that is as compact as Magic's story. Curveballs are fine, but at this point it'd be straight-up misleading.
There, I said it. If my 'theory' is not true, it's actually creative's fault.
As an aside I'm currently not counting out an Azor/Ugin partnership, but Azor is a given at this point.
Anyone who tells me that artwork doesn't confirm Azor's involvement in any capacity at this point is nuts.
Nuts, I say!
I'm really trying to see the similarities everyone else seems to see. But the Immortal Sun and the Azoruis symbol look as different as possible while both being triangles.
"It's not going to be Emrakul. The corruption of Innistrad is probably the Phyrexians." -Some couple months ago.
At any rate, it's either Azor or creative made a mistake. You can't feature a symbol, that is this close to an existing symbol associated with a character we have not met yet but was still important to the story, that itself is associated with a character that is purposefully left mysterious.
Reality does these things, but stories shouldn't, especially one that is as compact as Magic's story. Curveballs are fine, but at this point it'd be straight-up misleading.
There, I said it. If my 'theory' is not true, it's actually creative's fault.
As an aside I'm currently not counting out an Azor/Ugin partnership, but Azor is a given at this point.
I've honestly got to agree with this. They could have made the Sun/Binding ANY SHAPE THEY WANTED but they specifically chose one that was overtly similar to that of a known Guild who's founder is strongly hinted at being a planeswalker.
It being a coincidence is hard to swallow. It being a deliberate red harring also makes little sense to me, because this sets people up to expect an appearance by a specific character, and those people will be disappointed. If Azor isn't involved, there's no reason to hint that he is (when he actually isn't) when they could have simply left it nebulous.
The immortal sun certainly seems similar to the Azorius symbol, but there are a few differences between the two.
1. Both have iterations with 3 concentric circles and a triangle, but all the circles are entirely within the triangle on the Azorius symbol while only the innermost circle of the immortal sun lies fully within it's triangle.
2. The circles on the immortal sun are broken and have branches between and off of them, while the circles on the Azorius symbol are either unbroken bands or are replaced with a spiral-like 'maze' in a single circle around the center.
3. The center of the Azorius symbol is consistently a solid circle of one material (or the absence of a material), while the immortal sun has a center with a mixed composition (an irregularly shaped glowing bit and some metal bits crossing over it).
4. The circles of the Azorius symbol are covered in or composed entirely of runes, while the immortal sun's are just bands of metal.
5. The points of the triangle on the Azorius symbol are always equal in size and shape to one another, while the immortal sun's are not (owing to the irregularities on it's 'circles').
They are similar enough that I wouldn't be surprised if Azor was involved, but not so similar that I would be disappointed if Azor were not.
"It's not going to be Emrakul. The corruption of Innistrad is probably the Phyrexians." -Some couple months ago.
I hate having to constantly point this out, but once again.
The people who were saying it wasn't Emrakul were saying it because every bit of evidence pointed towards Emrakul, and when something is signaled that hard in a "mystery" it should be all rights a complete Red Herring. The only reason anyone thought it wasn't Emrakul was because of WOTC's absolutely atrocious writing during that block.
One question, do we know how old the Immortal Sun actually is ? i mean, we know it was taken to ixalan (continent) around 8 centuries ago,but do we know how long ago it was created?
Also, it would be pretty interesting if the Immortal Sun was similiar to the Mirari, in the sense it was created for a harmless purpose and ended up causing many conflicts.
We have no idea what the Sun actually is. With the card being spoiled/leaked/stolen by ninjas and appearing on the internet we basically have confirmation that it is the source of the Binding. It seems to at least be a gigantic source of energy regardless of affecting Planeswalkers as it has a myriad of effects that grant "power" with reduction of spell costs, card drawing and pumping.
I am not particularly sure we will get an answer, I am not sure it would matter at this point. I am curious as to what exactly Nicol Bolas plans to do with the thing as the Planeswalking Hax seems to be inherent to it so unless he is using it for the Planar Bridge and the two things don't manage to cancel each other out in some way it seems that even moving the thing would be a gigantic pain in the rear end.
I am not particularly sure we will get an answer, I am not sure it would matter at this point. I am curious as to what exactly Nicol Bolas plans to do with the thing as the Planeswalking Hax seems to be inherent to it so unless he is using it for the Planar Bridge and the two things don't manage to cancel each other out in some way it seems that even moving the thing would be a gigantic pain in the rear end.
What if he plans to use The Immortal Sun to trap select planeswalkers on a certain plane (after luring them in with something) so that they don't interfere with his schemes, and then uses the Planar Bridge on a different plane to carry out some kind of invasion, with no pesky walkers to intervene? Probably the biggest snag here would be how he would prevent the walkers he traps from getting at and destroying the Sun.
Alternatively, as someone here had theorized, maybe The Sun is just a really great power source (its three extra abilities seem to imply that to me), so maybe Bolas will use it to power his Planar Bridge. The original Planar Bridge needed a huge amount of aether after all.
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You'd think so since he founded the blue and white guild, but anything's possible.
In other news, we now know what The Immortal Sun looks like, and it hoses planeswalker loyalty abilities, which (in addition to the pattern on its facade) basically confirms that it's what's fueling the planeswalker trap:
Nuts, I say!
If it's Azor, Ral just needs to be the agent Bolas sends to get the Sun, and Ixalan will be a Ravnica walker-fest.
Plot twist Azor is Rakdos colors.
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+1, i can't tell if i'm trying too hard not to see this being Azor, or if the folks around here are trying too hard to see Azor as the creator of the Immortal Sun.
Art student, EDH lover and a strong believer that Delver has the best design in all of MTG.
It's a triangle with two concentric circles, one fully inside the triangle and the other cutting across the triangle's sides. The Azorius symbol is a triangle with multiple concentric circles crammed inside it.
To me, the two patterns are similar enough that it wouldn't be a huge stretch if the same person came up with them. At the same time, they're different enough that it could be a coincidence.
Also, you have admitted previously that you really really wanted it to not be Azor because you don't want Ravnica to overtake Ixalan's story, so there is an element of bias involved.
I think we should just wait at this point. We'll see if Team Azor, Team Ugin or Team None of the Above will win out.
Tetzimoc might answer what the figure on Bishop's Soldier's Pommel is.
If the Immortal Sun is behind the 'Azor' sphinx, it's got to be HUGE.
It's also spewing the exact same kind of green vapor that Ugin does.
Also, along the center line you can see what appears to be Ugin horns at the top, and an 'upside-down V' that could be a symbol for Azor (a triangle and an A all at once).
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Anyway, you guys are really looking forward to Azor, me personally i want to see Elenda and Dominaria, if they want to fill us with Ravnica and Ravnician(?) characters after that, fine by me.
Art student, EDH lover and a strong believer that Delver has the best design in all of MTG.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Also if Tetzimoc implies that were getting a full cycle of monocolored dino lenegends thats both cool and unfortunate. Cool because more badass dinos but unfortunate because I doubt they'd do that and then a five color one too. Meaning dino tribal can't encompass all the dinos.
Gotta start setting up a bunch of tribes so they can halfarse another tribal themed commander set in a few years.
Dragons of Legend, Lead by Scion of the UR-Dragon
The Gitrog Monster
Gonti, Lord of Luxury
Shogun Saskia
Hive World
Atraxa hates fun
Abzan
"It's not going to be Emrakul. The corruption of Innistrad is probably the Phyrexians." -Some couple months ago.
At any rate, it's either Azor or creative made a mistake. You can't feature a symbol, that is this close to an existing symbol associated with a character we have not met yet but was still important to the story, that itself is associated with a character that is purposefully left mysterious.
Reality does these things, but stories shouldn't, especially one that is as compact as Magic's story. Curveballs are fine, but at this point it'd be straight-up misleading.
There, I said it. If my 'theory' is not true, it's actually creative's fault.
As an aside I'm currently not counting out an Azor/Ugin partnership, but Azor is a given at this point.
I've honestly got to agree with this. They could have made the Sun/Binding ANY SHAPE THEY WANTED but they specifically chose one that was overtly similar to that of a known Guild who's founder is strongly hinted at being a planeswalker.
It being a coincidence is hard to swallow. It being a deliberate red harring also makes little sense to me, because this sets people up to expect an appearance by a specific character, and those people will be disappointed. If Azor isn't involved, there's no reason to hint that he is (when he actually isn't) when they could have simply left it nebulous.
1. Both have iterations with 3 concentric circles and a triangle, but all the circles are entirely within the triangle on the Azorius symbol while only the innermost circle of the immortal sun lies fully within it's triangle.
2. The circles on the immortal sun are broken and have branches between and off of them, while the circles on the Azorius symbol are either unbroken bands or are replaced with a spiral-like 'maze' in a single circle around the center.
3. The center of the Azorius symbol is consistently a solid circle of one material (or the absence of a material), while the immortal sun has a center with a mixed composition (an irregularly shaped glowing bit and some metal bits crossing over it).
4. The circles of the Azorius symbol are covered in or composed entirely of runes, while the immortal sun's are just bands of metal.
5. The points of the triangle on the Azorius symbol are always equal in size and shape to one another, while the immortal sun's are not (owing to the irregularities on it's 'circles').
They are similar enough that I wouldn't be surprised if Azor was involved, but not so similar that I would be disappointed if Azor were not.
I hate having to constantly point this out, but once again.
The people who were saying it wasn't Emrakul were saying it because every bit of evidence pointed towards Emrakul, and when something is signaled that hard in a "mystery" it should be all rights a complete Red Herring. The only reason anyone thought it wasn't Emrakul was because of WOTC's absolutely atrocious writing during that block.
Dragons of Legend, Lead by Scion of the UR-Dragon
The Gitrog Monster
Gonti, Lord of Luxury
Shogun Saskia
Hive World
Atraxa hates fun
Abzan
Also, it would be pretty interesting if the Immortal Sun was similiar to the Mirari, in the sense it was created for a harmless purpose and ended up causing many conflicts.
Art student, EDH lover and a strong believer that Delver has the best design in all of MTG.
I am not particularly sure we will get an answer, I am not sure it would matter at this point. I am curious as to what exactly Nicol Bolas plans to do with the thing as the Planeswalking Hax seems to be inherent to it so unless he is using it for the Planar Bridge and the two things don't manage to cancel each other out in some way it seems that even moving the thing would be a gigantic pain in the rear end.
Dragons of Legend, Lead by Scion of the UR-Dragon
The Gitrog Monster
Gonti, Lord of Luxury
Shogun Saskia
Hive World
Atraxa hates fun
Abzan
What if he plans to use The Immortal Sun to trap select planeswalkers on a certain plane (after luring them in with something) so that they don't interfere with his schemes, and then uses the Planar Bridge on a different plane to carry out some kind of invasion, with no pesky walkers to intervene? Probably the biggest snag here would be how he would prevent the walkers he traps from getting at and destroying the Sun.
Alternatively, as someone here had theorized, maybe The Sun is just a really great power source (its three extra abilities seem to imply that to me), so maybe Bolas will use it to power his Planar Bridge. The original Planar Bridge needed a huge amount of aether after all.