ok i read the entire odyssey and onslaught cycles, missed out on the book of mirrodin cycle (but have skimmed when at b&n), and only got the first two kamigawa novels and ravnica one.
needless to say i got some questions:
1. ok so what was Memnarch's deal with wanting to become a planeswalker? was it because of that black stuff in the first chapter thingie (pdf at mtg.com)
2. if jeska was the onslaught planeswalker and glissa the mirrodin one who was the kamigawa one?
3. any theories on what the heck karn is doing with this little gang of planeswalkers hes collecting? is he planning something else with Yawgmoth?
4. this is the really random off topic question: didnt urza use the serra angel sanctuary as a power source or something? if ravnica is a planar hub could that explain the disappearance of the angels? cause that would be really cool if ravnica got affected by the war between Dominaria and Yawgmoth.
Ok. some really weird questions and some questions that everyone is probably saying "duh, you need help spiffy" but id like to know.
1. The oily stuff on Mirroden is not to be remembered. It was never written. You never read it. He wanted to be a Planeswalker because Karn was. Thought it would bring them closer.
2. Not every block needs a planeswalker. Its just a trend. The closest thing you could get on Kamigawa would be Myojin of Nights Reach. However, she just momentarily had the abilty to travel to distant planes.
3. Karn isn't collecting planeswalkers as far as I know. He picked up Jeska, because Karona visted him and he thought she was hot. He left Glissa, Slobad, and Geth to rot on Mirroden.
4. Urza did use Serra's Realm as it was collapsing to power the Weatherlight.
3. Karn isn't collecting planeswalkers as far as I know. He picked up Jeska, because Karona visted him and he thought she was hot. He left Glissa, Slobad, and Geth to rot on Mirroden.
ok ok
so karn just left them there to rot in Mirrodin? and was it ever explained how Kamigawa and Dominaria are linked?
The novel doesn't specify where he ends up at all, but I think that an 'ask wizards' asked whether there was an intentional link between Toshiro Umezawa and Tetsuo Umezawa. The answer was along the lines of 'It will be answered at the end of the Saviours book,', so I assume Toshiro was dropped on Dominaria.
You are 100% right. It was confirmed by Scott McGough himself:
so instead of toshiro being a descendant of tetsuo, tetsuo could be an ancestor of toshiro? if thats the case then ravnica could take place before during or after the phyrexian wars couldnt it?
im just thinking that these stories have got to have some linkage with whats gonna go on in dominaria in the next few blocks
so instead of toshiro being a descendant of tetsuo, tetsuo could be an ancestor of toshiro? if thats the case then ravnica could take place before during or after the phyrexian wars couldnt it?
The bolded sentence is a bit nonsense.
1) You are saying twice exactly the same and
2) You are completely wrong, just look at McG's reply.
I think that there is almost no way to determine the dating of Ravnica story...yet.
Edit: Toshi is an ancestor (like great-/insert as many "great" as you wish/-grandfather) of Tetsuo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott McGough I think I can speak with some authority here, so I'm happy to chime in.
The "queen" in question is the Madaran warrior queen who preceded Emperor Bolas. She got one brief mention in the Legends II cycle (because who wants to talk about the old queen when Nicol Bolas is in the mix?).
So Toshi arrives on Madara way in advance of NB taking over and way, way in advance of Tetsuo's birth.
Yeah that was incredibly vicious how they never once got back to the oily bit Will had set up.
And that explanation of why everyone was turning into artifacts partially now fits so much better. And itd have been a much more filled out plot if that was a part of it as well.
I think the overall thought is that Mirrodin was a pretty bad storyline block though. Legions-5th dawn was a long stretch of bad writing. Kamigawa block really saved the day and if my thought is correct, the good writing should be continued through Dissension (as Guildpact will no doubt be superb, it really comes down to how this block is wrapped up.)
Does anyone know about the new block? Returning to Dominaria yet or another plane? Its been forever since Dominaria, almost 3 years now. I really could go for one more new plane, I just can't think what's next! I mean the only thought I can think of would be a plane with many planets. That'd be cool, with maybe one planet being a sole color, like red with many different races representing it. Like a region of barbarian tribes, a region of goblin politicians, a region mountainrange version of a forest with a superload of beasts, perhaps dragon-folk? How'd that be?
I mean the only thought I can think of would be a plane with many planets.
Most natural planes have quadrillions of planets, but only one 'main' planet. Unless you mean a plane with multiple 'main' planets. Unfortunately, no one at Wizards knows the difference between a plane and a planet (Ravnica is described as a city-covered plane), so this is highly unlikely.
Does anyone know about the new block? Returning to Dominaria yet or another plane? Its been forever since Dominaria, almost 3 years now.
I am pretty sure that they are returning to Dominaria after Ravnica but I cant remember where I heard it. Biggest thing I want after Ravnica is some serious interplanar interactions. The Phyrexian war was sweet and stuff but couldnt they develop some other form of interplanar stuff?
If I could design something, I would go for a new planar portal on Dominaria that leads to another plane, lets call it 2PLANE. On Dominaria, a shock spell is a shock spell, but on 2PLANE, a shock spell is as devastating as an extreme thunderstorm with a vengeance. Its like the 2PLANE is a lot simpler magic than Dominaria and much easier to exploit. I think that would cause some cool interactions between Dominaria and another plane. It might even turn Dominaria into the invaders.
kind of went off topic, but thats just what I think they should do . . . more or less (I like the planet idee though)
Unfortunately, no one at Wizards knows the difference between a plane and a planet (Ravnica is described as a city-covered plane), so this is highly unlikely.
Wizards designed this *fictional* multiverse.
They developed the use of term "plane", in the meaning of "planet", mainly.
Saying that no one at Wizards knows the difference...and who should? You?
Wake up, man. This is their fictional world, their playground. You are constantly convincing everyone that you know their world better than they do.
Sorry to everyone who feel that I am constantly attacking Loot Niptil, but I really do not like his way of expressing.
The Mirrodin block was messed badly, amen to that. I am sure that Herndon was allowed to do the RAV writing also because of the salvation embodied by his 5th Dawn book.
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Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Wizards designed this *fictional* multiverse.
They developed the use of term "plane", in the meaning of "planet", mainly.
I was actually wondering about that. Ive been kinda confused about the whole description of the multiverse. In SCOURGE it sounded like the planes were threads or something throughout the blind eternities.
Planes are not planets. They are universes. Caranthir, explain how Pyrulea, Serra's Realm, and Kuberr's pocket plane (the one that was filled with gold coins) are planets.
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Quotes:
Wary must be he who steps yet closer To this treasury filled with things of fame Enter here and steal just one, And Cursed will be all of your name!
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YOU HEAR THAT, GUFF! THAT WAS THE FOURTH WALL YOU BROKE!THAT WAS THE MOST IMPORTANT WALL OF THEM ALL!
Planes are not planets. They are universes. Caranthir, explain how Pyrulea, Serra's Realm, and Kuberr's pocket plane (the one that was filled with gold coins) are planets.
Pyrulea: anytime heard of Dyson sphere?
Serra's Realm and Kuberr's pocket plane...they are kind of small universes, yes...but especially in Serra's Realm, it is a plane of the size of planet.
But my point is not to prove your theory wrong. My point is to persuade you that all your attempts to apply real cosmology to Magic Multiverse are doomed to failure.
I would gladly discuss with you at the field of REAL cosmology, for you are certainly skilled at this field.
But I cannot stand your "Wizards are band of stupids, they do not understand the world they created...behold my all-explaining theory of Multiverse, that will open your eyes forever!" You are a wannabe Einstein of a fictional uni/multi/verse.
Do me a favor...explain the Rathi overlay to me.
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Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
you can think of planes almost like this:
a plane is a reality, it is a world/universe/multiverse all in itself, and it has its own dimensional fabric. Planes walkers can traverse that fabric. My understanding of it is that its like the way the worlds work in the Golden Compass series. the barriers between dimensions can be broken and traversed (kami of nights reach). each plane can have as many worlds as it wants, the reason its classified as a plane is because its dimensional fabric is uniform.
hope this helps, didn't mean to sound like einstein caranthir
you can think of planes almost like this:
a plane is a reality, it is a world/universe/multiverse all in itself, and it has its own dimensional fabric. Planes walkers can traverse that fabric. My understanding of it is that its like the way the worlds work in the Golden Compass series. the barriers between dimensions can be broken and traversed (kami of nights reach). each plane can have as many worlds as it wants, the reason its classified as a plane is because its dimensional fabric is uniform.
hope this helps, didn't mean to sound like einstein caranthir
It is OK, comadore. The Einstein thing is related exclusively to the person of Loot Niptil and to these two discussions:
my question is when is the most probable timeperiod (timeline wise) for them to return to dominaria. It has been shown by Kamigawa that they dont mind going back in time, and they don't mind the future (mirroden sorta). i personally think that if they were to elaborate and write a consitant story following khamal it would be good, or any of the plainswalkers/avatars portraid in the rift during karona's vision. IF they somehow tied the storyline back to Urza, then they must really be building a large background for this new story.
Its not as much the "future" and "past" as it is the way the planes devolped... By the same token you could compare the way the Roman Empire devolped compared to the Aztecs. Mirrodin was much more devolped due to the resources it had while Kawagawa didnt
So where do you think Ravnica plays a role in the storyline? Maybe a planeswalker from an older book could show up in the city (probably Dissension)? Or does it take place post phyrexian war? hmmm...
I wanna say Ravnica is post apocalypse, maybe around a similar time to Mirroden. The exhistance of Vedalken suggests some form of migration from a uniform plane or world. The only reason i am hesitant about this is because of the exhistance of the viashino.
Mja, but Mirrodin also took place WAY after Kamigawa, chronologically speaking. Kamigawa took place before Legends II, which took place shorlty after the Ice & Flood Ages, in 3000-Something A.R. (I'm to lazy to check, but you can find a more acurate date in the Timeline-Thread. Check the [Info] sticky at the top of this page!).
Mirrodin, according to Ur-Golems Eye took place Millenea after Argentum as created, placing it in, at least, 6306, thus putting 3000 millenea between Mirrodin and Kamigawa, possibly multitudes of that.
TSM,
I'd intended the Legends II cycle to take place during or slightly prior to the Mirage War, which would put Legends II in the 4000s rather than the 3000s. Does it matter? I sort of hate having to keep a lot of dates straight because numbers tend to desert me when I need them most.
Now let me add, I think I've discussed this topic before and I may have been the source and/or confirmed the 3000 number. If that's the case, I apologize.
I just want to make sure that you've got a better source than me that says 3000-something, because I don't think that's where it actually is (and if so, show it to me so I can stop being wrong).
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Cheers,
McG
_______________________
"...if I woke up looking like that, I would just run towards the nearest living thing and kill it."
--Master Shake
So where do you think Ravnica plays a role in the storyline? Maybe a planeswalker from an older book could show up in the city (probably Dissension)? Or does it take place post phyrexian war? hmmm...
A role, yes, but not perhaps in the way you think. Personally--and this is from me, not necessarily the folks what own the MtG storyline--I don't think time always moves at the same rate on every plane. Make of that what you will. Where Ravnica fits in may or may not be completely clear by the time you finish Dissension. I hope to be able to speak more clearly about that in, oh, five or six months, but I can't promise it.
needless to say i got some questions:
1. ok so what was Memnarch's deal with wanting to become a planeswalker? was it because of that black stuff in the first chapter thingie (pdf at mtg.com)
2. if jeska was the onslaught planeswalker and glissa the mirrodin one who was the kamigawa one?
3. any theories on what the heck karn is doing with this little gang of planeswalkers hes collecting? is he planning something else with Yawgmoth?
4. this is the really random off topic question: didnt urza use the serra angel sanctuary as a power source or something? if ravnica is a planar hub could that explain the disappearance of the angels? cause that would be really cool if ravnica got affected by the war between Dominaria and Yawgmoth.
Ok. some really weird questions and some questions that everyone is probably saying "duh, you need help spiffy" but id like to know.
-spif
2. Not every block needs a planeswalker. Its just a trend. The closest thing you could get on Kamigawa would be Myojin of Nights Reach. However, she just momentarily had the abilty to travel to distant planes.
3. Karn isn't collecting planeswalkers as far as I know. He picked up Jeska, because Karona visted him and he thought she was hot. He left Glissa, Slobad, and Geth to rot on Mirroden.
4. Urza did use Serra's Realm as it was collapsing to power the Weatherlight.
ok ok
so karn just left them there to rot in Mirrodin? and was it ever explained how Kamigawa and Dominaria are linked?
-spif
You are 100% right. It was confirmed by Scott McGough himself:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=325247&postcount=73
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
im just thinking that these stories have got to have some linkage with whats gonna go on in dominaria in the next few blocks
The bolded sentence is a bit nonsense.
1) You are saying twice exactly the same and
2) You are completely wrong, just look at McG's reply.
I think that there is almost no way to determine the dating of Ravnica story...yet.
Edit: Toshi is an ancestor (like great-/insert as many "great" as you wish/-grandfather) of Tetsuo.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
oh yeah, sorry i got that really mixed up . . . it sounded right in my head:crazy:
what i meant to ask was wether tetsuo was a descendent of toshiro . . . it kind of made sense since they both have the same last name.
. . . is that confirmed or . . . am i just not getting something or other . . .
Originally Posted by Scott McGough
I think I can speak with some authority here, so I'm happy to chime in.
The "queen" in question is the Madaran warrior queen who preceded Emperor Bolas. She got one brief mention in the Legends II cycle (because who wants to talk about the old queen when Nicol Bolas is in the mix?).
So Toshi arrives on Madara way in advance of NB taking over and way, way in advance of Tetsuo's birth.
--McG
As you can see, Toshi is Tetsuo's ancestor.
And that explanation of why everyone was turning into artifacts partially now fits so much better. And itd have been a much more filled out plot if that was a part of it as well.
I think the overall thought is that Mirrodin was a pretty bad storyline block though. Legions-5th dawn was a long stretch of bad writing. Kamigawa block really saved the day and if my thought is correct, the good writing should be continued through Dissension (as Guildpact will no doubt be superb, it really comes down to how this block is wrapped up.)
Does anyone know about the new block? Returning to Dominaria yet or another plane? Its been forever since Dominaria, almost 3 years now. I really could go for one more new plane, I just can't think what's next! I mean the only thought I can think of would be a plane with many planets. That'd be cool, with maybe one planet being a sole color, like red with many different races representing it. Like a region of barbarian tribes, a region of goblin politicians, a region mountainrange version of a forest with a superload of beasts, perhaps dragon-folk? How'd that be?
To this treasury filled with things of fame
Enter here and steal just one,
And Cursed will be all of your name!
I am pretty sure that they are returning to Dominaria after Ravnica but I cant remember where I heard it. Biggest thing I want after Ravnica is some serious interplanar interactions. The Phyrexian war was sweet and stuff but couldnt they develop some other form of interplanar stuff?
If I could design something, I would go for a new planar portal on Dominaria that leads to another plane, lets call it 2PLANE. On Dominaria, a shock spell is a shock spell, but on 2PLANE, a shock spell is as devastating as an extreme thunderstorm with a vengeance. Its like the 2PLANE is a lot simpler magic than Dominaria and much easier to exploit. I think that would cause some cool interactions between Dominaria and another plane. It might even turn Dominaria into the invaders.
kind of went off topic, but thats just what I think they should do . . . more or less (I like the planet idee though)
Wizards designed this *fictional* multiverse.
They developed the use of term "plane", in the meaning of "planet", mainly.
Saying that no one at Wizards knows the difference...and who should? You?
Wake up, man. This is their fictional world, their playground. You are constantly convincing everyone that you know their world better than they do.
Sorry to everyone who feel that I am constantly attacking Loot Niptil, but I really do not like his way of expressing.
The Mirrodin block was messed badly, amen to that. I am sure that Herndon was allowed to do the RAV writing also because of the salvation embodied by his 5th Dawn book.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I was actually wondering about that. Ive been kinda confused about the whole description of the multiverse. In SCOURGE it sounded like the planes were threads or something throughout the blind eternities.
To this treasury filled with things of fame
Enter here and steal just one,
And Cursed will be all of your name!
Pyrulea: anytime heard of Dyson sphere?
Serra's Realm and Kuberr's pocket plane...they are kind of small universes, yes...but especially in Serra's Realm, it is a plane of the size of planet.
But my point is not to prove your theory wrong. My point is to persuade you that all your attempts to apply real cosmology to Magic Multiverse are doomed to failure.
I would gladly discuss with you at the field of REAL cosmology, for you are certainly skilled at this field.
But I cannot stand your "Wizards are band of stupids, they do not understand the world they created...behold my all-explaining theory of Multiverse, that will open your eyes forever!" You are a wannabe Einstein of a fictional uni/multi/verse.
Do me a favor...explain the Rathi overlay to me.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
a plane is a reality, it is a world/universe/multiverse all in itself, and it has its own dimensional fabric. Planes walkers can traverse that fabric. My understanding of it is that its like the way the worlds work in the Golden Compass series. the barriers between dimensions can be broken and traversed (kami of nights reach). each plane can have as many worlds as it wants, the reason its classified as a plane is because its dimensional fabric is uniform.
hope this helps, didn't mean to sound like einstein caranthir
www.bucultureshock.com
www.skidmarkpoetry.blogspot.com
It is OK, comadore. The Einstein thing is related exclusively to the person of Loot Niptil and to these two discussions:
Phyrexia.com, where Loot's theory was shattered by its members:
http://www.phyrexia.com/forum/messages/11/8048.html?1128156888
and here, where the people were not so harsh, but also did not approve it.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=13824
In fact, your opinion is very close to mine.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
www.bucultureshock.com
www.skidmarkpoetry.blogspot.com
www.bucultureshock.com
www.skidmarkpoetry.blogspot.com
Trade Thread
TSM,
I'd intended the Legends II cycle to take place during or slightly prior to the Mirage War, which would put Legends II in the 4000s rather than the 3000s. Does it matter? I sort of hate having to keep a lot of dates straight because numbers tend to desert me when I need them most.
Now let me add, I think I've discussed this topic before and I may have been the source and/or confirmed the 3000 number. If that's the case, I apologize.
I just want to make sure that you've got a better source than me that says 3000-something, because I don't think that's where it actually is (and if so, show it to me so I can stop being wrong).
McG
_______________________
"...if I woke up looking like that, I would just run towards the nearest living thing and kill it."
--Master Shake
A role, yes, but not perhaps in the way you think. Personally--and this is from me, not necessarily the folks what own the MtG storyline--I don't think time always moves at the same rate on every plane. Make of that what you will. Where Ravnica fits in may or may not be completely clear by the time you finish Dissension. I hope to be able to speak more clearly about that in, oh, five or six months, but I can't promise it.
CJH