I was playing in a minor legacy tournament, a few years back, and I remember forgetting to pay for my opponent's The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale before I drew my card, resulting in my creatures getting destroyed
My question is: If I proceed past the tabernacle trigger without paying mana, Is it assumed that I've chosen to sacrifice my creatures?
Does my opponent have to remind me of the tabernacle?
Now, this is an event that happened over two years ago, probably 3, so I'd appreciate a ruling that would have applied to 3 years ago. I know that the trigger rules have changed since then.
I don't know the rules 3 years ago but currently, at Competitive REL, a triggered ability's controller is the one required to remember it. While you aren't responsible for the Tabernacle you are responsible for the triggered ability it gives your creatures. Your opponent is not currently required to remind you but if you miss it they may choose to put the ability on the stack.
I'm still a little shaky on my MIPG stuff, but I believe this is what occurs in competitive REL:
You would recieve a warning for gameplay error - missed trigger. Since it is optional that you pay the 2, it is assumed you didn't and your creatures will be sacrificed. This occurs without using the stack. Your opponent will also recieve a warning for gameplay error - failure to maintain the game state since he let you miss it.
If it's regular REL, the easiest thing to do would be to put the triggered ability on the stack immediately, or undo your draw and go back to the upkeep when it was supposed to happen. Neither player would recieve a penalty.
Depending on when this was caught, it's going to be different. If as soon as you drew a card your opponent called a judge, you are going to resolve the default option and sacrifice all your creatures, then you would get a warning for Missed Trigger. If it was later in the turn, your opponent would also get one for Failure to Maintain Game State.
Under the current policy, you will get a warning for Missed Trigger, then you will sacrifice all your creatures - EDIT: your opponent gets some input on the timing of how this happens. Here's the relevant sections from the IPG:
The controller of a missed triggered ability receives a Warning only if the triggered ability is usually considered
detrimental for the controlling player.
...
If the triggered ability specifies a default action associated with a choice made by the controller (usually "If you
don't ..." or "... unless"), resolve it choosing the default option. If the triggered ability is a delayed triggered ability
that changes the zone of an object, resolve it. For these two types of abilities, the opponent chooses whether to
resolve the ability the next time a player would get priority or when a player would get priority at the start of the
next phase. These abilities do not expire and should be remedied no matter how much time has passed since they
should have triggered.
...the pinnacle of military deployment approaches the formless. If it is formless, then even the deepest spy cannot discern it or the wise make plans against it.
-- Sun Tzu, The Art Of War
This is similar to Dark Confident: your opponent owns BoB and has 1 life. His upkeep happens and he forgets the trigger. This is a benefitial trigger to you (hopefully) and you could choose to rewind to make the trigger happen (said in teh quotes)
Since it is optional that you pay the 2, it is assumed you didn't and your creatures will be sacrificed. This occurs without using the stack. Your opponent will also recieve a warning for gameplay error - failure to maintain the game state since he let you miss it.
Two things. First, it does use the stack, but the default action (sac your dudes) is locked in. We put the trigger on the stack, and when it resolves, the default actions is used.
Second, we never issue Failure to Maintain Game State (FTMGS) to a player who didn't control a missed trigger under the current policies.
This is similar to Dark Confident: your opponent owns BoB and has 1 life. His upkeep happens and he forgets the trigger. This is a benefitial trigger to you (hopefully) and you could choose to rewind to make the trigger happen (said in teh quotes)
"And you could choose to have the trigger put onto the stack if caught within a turn" - fixed that for you. We don't rewind for missed triggers, we just put them on the stack (in the appropriate place or on the bottom).
The player not responsible for the missed trigger NEVER gets a warning for FTMGS under the current rules.
I know. The OP was asking how it would have been ruled at the time (which would have been warnings for both in that case) - my post is split into two sections for this reason.
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...the pinnacle of military deployment approaches the formless. If it is formless, then even the deepest spy cannot discern it or the wise make plans against it.
-- Sun Tzu, The Art Of War
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My question is: If I proceed past the tabernacle trigger without paying mana, Is it assumed that I've chosen to sacrifice my creatures?
Does my opponent have to remind me of the tabernacle?
Now, this is an event that happened over two years ago, probably 3, so I'd appreciate a ruling that would have applied to 3 years ago. I know that the trigger rules have changed since then.
Rulings that apply to today are welcome too.
You would recieve a warning for gameplay error - missed trigger. Since it is optional that you pay the 2, it is assumed you didn't and your creatures will be sacrificed. This occurs without using the stack. Your opponent will also recieve a warning for gameplay error - failure to maintain the game state since he let you miss it.
If it's regular REL, the easiest thing to do would be to put the triggered ability on the stack immediately, or undo your draw and go back to the upkeep when it was supposed to happen. Neither player would recieve a penalty.
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Depending on when this was caught, it's going to be different. If as soon as you drew a card your opponent called a judge, you are going to resolve the default option and sacrifice all your creatures, then you would get a warning for Missed Trigger. If it was later in the turn, your opponent would also get one for Failure to Maintain Game State.
Under the current policy, you will get a warning for Missed Trigger, then you will sacrifice all your creatures - EDIT: your opponent gets some input on the timing of how this happens. Here's the relevant sections from the IPG:
-- Sun Tzu, The Art Of War
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Only EDH:
Sigarda, Host of Herons: Enchantress' Enchantments
Jenara, Asura of War: ETB Value Town
Purphoros, God of the Forge: Global Punishment
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Ghave, Guru of Spores: Dies_to_Doom_Blade's stax list
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Two things. First, it does use the stack, but the default action (sac your dudes) is locked in. We put the trigger on the stack, and when it resolves, the default actions is used.
Second, we never issue Failure to Maintain Game State (FTMGS) to a player who didn't control a missed trigger under the current policies.
The player not responsible for the missed trigger NEVER gets a warning for FTMGS under the current rules.
"And you could choose to have the trigger put onto the stack if caught within a turn" - fixed that for you. We don't rewind for missed triggers, we just put them on the stack (in the appropriate place or on the bottom).
I know. The OP was asking how it would have been ruled at the time (which would have been warnings for both in that case) - my post is split into two sections for this reason.
-- Sun Tzu, The Art Of War