Titaniablood Successor1 Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
Whenever another Elf or Elemental creature you control with converted mana cost 3 or less dies or is exiled, you may have Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except it retains its name, types, and ward ability. Together, together we will be reborn!
1/1
I had the feeling that I was being beckoned towards Elves with the Escapism card. However, that effect with elves would be incrediblytoxic. Something for Elves could fare far better, and be more attuned as a resource elves would want and need (such as another elf creature). This here is presented as a prime example.
So I wanted to drop this original version below to serve as a great example of what is possible with hybrid abilities that normally you couldn't do as an activated ability because of the mass complications. Typically, there would be the potential for endless activation abuse when priority passes back to the player after initial activation. But this way, via Special Action designation, the entire ability has to resolve as one chain on the trigger before priority passes back to the player. The utility capabilities is unparalleled. Dynamic. Unique. Interactive. Breakthrough to the new era of Magic.
Titaniablood Successor1 Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
At any time you could cast an instant, you may put an Elf or Elemental creature card you own from your graveyard or exile with converted mana cost 3 or less on the top of your library. If you do, Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except it retains its name, types, and ward ability.
Hello. What's the creature's power and toughness? Also I think it's actually stronger with just one 'together' in the flavour text.
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"Did you think to kill me? There's no flesh and blood within this cloak to kill. There is only an idea. Ideas are bulletproof." - V, V for Vendetta. Alan Moore
So you want the whole game to run at speed spell 5/interrupt speed, becuase **** balance and stuff?
Anyways here we go:
- Cloning is not a mono green ability Kinda don't make sense as an hydrid card (It totally does as a simic/sultai card though)
- 2 Mana Clone with upside is kinda too strong even if it is conditional clone.
- God please I assume this is a 0/1, 1/1 as base power and toughness becuase otherwise it doesn't make sense at that cost and with upside
- What is the point of this retaining its name and types (AS in what do you need it for)? Also I assume that once it clones something it can't keep further cloning other stuff so its ok, from the abilities you just retain the ward only not the cloning part.
Anyways, not much to say here. This kind of designs are kinda becoming repetitive tbf you just made a weird clone in your other post.
Ah yes the original version was broken as ****, lucky you decided to drop it in favor of the other at least.
First, yes, you forgot P/T, but this should pretty much only be a 1/1 or 0/1 when it hasn't cloned anything
Its undercosted mostly because it has ward once it clones, but only probably by 1, and making it U/G means it can't go in most tribal Elf commander decks. The trigger means you have to find a way to get your other creature out first, so there's not too much issue balance wise there and it does some amusing things with Evoke
Text wise, the only thing is "retain its ward ability" isn't proper wording because it doesn't properly define the ability, and implies that it could also add ward abilities granted by equipment, static abilities and the like. However, the text fix is very minor.
Titaniablood Successor 1 G/U mana
Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
Whenever another Elf or Elemental creature you control dies or is exiled, you may have Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except its name is Titaniablood Successor, it is an Elf Elemental, and it has Ward 2
I noticed I forgot something else. It was only supposed to be 3 or less, because it was levied that going into the 4 range becomes toxic.
The identifier of "its" should actually cover that by standards of language. Whose ward ability? Its own ward ability. What is its specific Ward ability? It's ward 2. If it pointed to another creature's ability, such as "target creature's bushido ability" I don't think it would be ambiguous as to what that means inherently. You will look to what's printed on the card. But could question if points have been added to its base ability—does it reference the new or current form. Current copy rules, relative to this, say those additional values aren't copied unless explicitly specified. So that would likely just carry over, would it not?
If you created a green elf clone, I don't think that would be out of the box. It would likely just get raves because tribal designations provide excellent tracing securities for color blending. Do they not?
We can't discuss the Special Action designation for hybrid abilities like this, but there is certainly a trick to it.
For reference, it could also say, once per turn; as I believe I've generally composed such things as this in the past.
You know what, it’s about time that I just create a boiler plate message that I can more or less copy to all of your threads.
1. If you want to make changes to the rules, please do so for mechanical reasons. If a similar ability isn’t being used because it doesn’t “flow” or “lacks adherence to sound principles”, or you feel a card deserves “allowance for flavor” or the like, you are a not a great designer. If a card does not look right or is too wordy when fully written out, simply abandon the card.
2. Assume that your card will be used by idiots without the comprehensive rules with them. If someone with a basic grasp of the rules who reads the card is still confused and would need to read additional rulings to navigate core functions of your cards, you are a bad designer.
3. the color pie is a good thing and should be upheld, not seen as a norm that you should be making every sort of exception to. As an extension of this, hybrid mana means that either color could get an effect, not that one color could get it but you want the other color to get it.
4. interaction between cards and giving a card weaknesses where other cards can respond to it is a GOOD thing. Abusing special actions, hybrid abilities, deus ex abilities, and protective abilities on all of your cards so their function can’t be interfered with is a sign of a bad designer, even if one or two cards with protection may be okay in a vacuum.
5. What sees play is dependent on the actual metagame. Making a card for a specific combo with two obscure old cards that wouldn’t be too fast or reliable compared with what people actually play is not powerful.
Does that cover everything, guys?
Edit: surprisingly, all of those points fit in here. Hybrid ability that reduces interaction and doesn’t work within the rules on a clone that can be cast in mono green whose text was edited specifically for imagined interactions with a single card.
I noticed I forgot something else. It was only supposed to be 3 or less, because it was levied that going into the 4 range becomes toxic.
You made the card worse. A 2 mana value card that copies another 2 mana card and adds ward is too strong. Increasing that to 3 mana value pushes over the top.
The identifier of "its" should actually cover that by standards of language. Whose ward ability? Its own ward ability. What is its specific Ward ability? It's ward 2. If it pointed to another creature's ability, such as "target creature's bushido ability" I don't think it would be ambiguous as to what that means inherently. You will look to what's printed on the card. But could question if points have been added to its base ability—does it reference the new or current form. Current copy rules, relative to this, say those additional values aren't copied unless explicitly specified. So that would likely just carry over, would it not?
There is a correct way to template clone effects that carry over, replace or add to the copiable values of the card being copied. This isn't something that depends on feelings or aesthetic. There is a right way to do it and you have done it the wrong way. In fact, the word "retains" does not appear in any rules text in all of Magic (it appears twice in reminder text)
If you created a green elf clone, I don't think that would be out of the box. It would likely just get raves because tribal designations provide excellent tracing securities for color blending. Do they not?
Yeah, its not really a color problem. The limitiations on what it can copy and how are enough to fit the very limited space that green has done cloning in the past. The only issue is that the Elf decks that want this effect are Mono-green or Green/Black commanders and this being green/blue prevents it from being used in those decks due to color identity.
We can't discuss the Special Action designation for hybrid abilities like this, but there is certainly a trick to it.
There's no special action on the card you actually put up, so this is a non-issue.
For reference, it could also say, once per turn; as I believe I've generally composed such things as this in the past.
Since the copy won't have the original card text, this is not an issue.
All very well said, Rosy. Can we please add 'cards that add more mana than they cost are 99 times out of 100 going to be too strong.' and maybe 'fateseal is a boring ability that makes games unfun'?
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People don't want to see excuses. They want to see results.
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Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
Whenever another Elf or Elemental creature you control with converted mana cost 3 or less dies or is exiled, you may have Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except it retains its name, types, and ward ability.
Together, together we will be reborn!
1/1
I had the feeling that I was being beckoned towards Elves with the Escapism card. However, that effect with elves would be incredibly toxic. Something for Elves could fare far better, and be more attuned as a resource elves would want and need (such as another elf creature). This here is presented as a prime example.
Titaniablood Successor 1
Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
At any time you could cast an instant, you may put an Elf or Elemental creature card you own from your graveyard or exile with converted mana cost 3 or less on the top of your library. If you do, Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except it retains its name, types, and ward ability.
Anyways here we go:
- Cloning is not a mono green ability Kinda don't make sense as an hydrid card (It totally does as a simic/sultai card though)
- 2 Mana Clone with upside is kinda too strong even if it is conditional clone.
- God please I assume this is a 0/1, 1/1 as base power and toughness becuase otherwise it doesn't make sense at that cost and with upside
- What is the point of this retaining its name and types (AS in what do you need it for)? Also I assume that once it clones something it can't keep further cloning other stuff so its ok, from the abilities you just retain the ward only not the cloning part.
Anyways, not much to say here. This kind of designs are kinda becoming repetitive tbf you just made a weird clone in your other post.
Ah yes the original version was broken as ****, lucky you decided to drop it in favor of the other at least.
Its undercosted mostly because it has ward once it clones, but only probably by 1, and making it U/G means it can't go in most tribal Elf commander decks. The trigger means you have to find a way to get your other creature out first, so there's not too much issue balance wise there and it does some amusing things with Evoke
Text wise, the only thing is "retain its ward ability" isn't proper wording because it doesn't properly define the ability, and implies that it could also add ward abilities granted by equipment, static abilities and the like. However, the text fix is very minor.
Titaniablood Successor 1 G/U mana
Creature — Elf Elemental
Ward 2
Whenever another Elf or Elemental creature you control dies or is exiled, you may have Titaniablood Successor becomes a copy of that creature, except its name is Titaniablood Successor, it is an Elf Elemental, and it has Ward 2
Edit: further corrected wording
The identifier of "its" should actually cover that by standards of language. Whose ward ability? Its own ward ability. What is its specific Ward ability? It's ward 2. If it pointed to another creature's ability, such as "target creature's bushido ability" I don't think it would be ambiguous as to what that means inherently. You will look to what's printed on the card. But could question if points have been added to its base ability—does it reference the new or current form. Current copy rules, relative to this, say those additional values aren't copied unless explicitly specified. So that would likely just carry over, would it not?
If you created a green elf clone, I don't think that would be out of the box. It would likely just get raves because tribal designations provide excellent tracing securities for color blending. Do they not?
We can't discuss the Special Action designation for hybrid abilities like this, but there is certainly a trick to it.
For reference, it could also say, once per turn; as I believe I've generally composed such things as this in the past.
1. If you want to make changes to the rules, please do so for mechanical reasons. If a similar ability isn’t being used because it doesn’t “flow” or “lacks adherence to sound principles”, or you feel a card deserves “allowance for flavor” or the like, you are a not a great designer. If a card does not look right or is too wordy when fully written out, simply abandon the card.
2. Assume that your card will be used by idiots without the comprehensive rules with them. If someone with a basic grasp of the rules who reads the card is still confused and would need to read additional rulings to navigate core functions of your cards, you are a bad designer.
3. the color pie is a good thing and should be upheld, not seen as a norm that you should be making every sort of exception to. As an extension of this, hybrid mana means that either color could get an effect, not that one color could get it but you want the other color to get it.
4. interaction between cards and giving a card weaknesses where other cards can respond to it is a GOOD thing. Abusing special actions, hybrid abilities, deus ex abilities, and protective abilities on all of your cards so their function can’t be interfered with is a sign of a bad designer, even if one or two cards with protection may be okay in a vacuum.
5. What sees play is dependent on the actual metagame. Making a card for a specific combo with two obscure old cards that wouldn’t be too fast or reliable compared with what people actually play is not powerful.
Does that cover everything, guys?
Edit: surprisingly, all of those points fit in here. Hybrid ability that reduces interaction and doesn’t work within the rules on a clone that can be cast in mono green whose text was edited specifically for imagined interactions with a single card.
There is a correct way to template clone effects that carry over, replace or add to the copiable values of the card being copied. This isn't something that depends on feelings or aesthetic. There is a right way to do it and you have done it the wrong way. In fact, the word "retains" does not appear in any rules text in all of Magic (it appears twice in reminder text)
Yeah, its not really a color problem. The limitiations on what it can copy and how are enough to fit the very limited space that green has done cloning in the past. The only issue is that the Elf decks that want this effect are Mono-green or Green/Black commanders and this being green/blue prevents it from being used in those decks due to color identity.
There's no special action on the card you actually put up, so this is a non-issue.
Since the copy won't have the original card text, this is not an issue.
All very well said, Rosy. Can we please add 'cards that add more mana than they cost are 99 times out of 100 going to be too strong.' and maybe 'fateseal is a boring ability that makes games unfun'?
If it was Ephemerate + ward 2 (for 2) no one would say that.
My card Survive Predation only regenerated with this and everyone said it should cost 2.
Let's get our story straight.
And let's not be like Mark Rosewater and say that something is bad design because we lack the talent to work with it.
Such as banding and Enforcer.
Talk is cheap. Do something.
People don't want to see excuses. They want to see results.