Escapist Raven1U Creature — Bird Rogue
If Escapist Raven is reveled from your hand at any time by a source an opponent controls, you may put it onto the battlefield.
Flying, protection from black 1U : Return Escapist Raven to its owner's hand. No, don't go near that cage!
2/1
Lore Card
No, don't go near that cage! It hasn't eaten in ages. I've been trying to starve it into extinction! I've never seen such a resilient creature. It has to be the devil's work!
Ambient Purgatory Enchantment Land
You may have Ambient Purgatory enters the battlefield as a legendary Aura in addition to its other types enchanting target land.
As long as Ambient Purgatory is an aura, enchanted land has shroud. : Add C to your mana pool. Activate this ability only if an opponent has more life than you or controls more lands than you.
Do you have something against triggered abilities? Instead of the nightmare of timing that giving the player a choice that can only be made during the resolution of opponents abilities just let this raven have a triggered ability. Though I have to ask your intent. Opponent plays Thoughtsieze while this is in my hand. Do they have the option of discarding it before I can put it into play? Your intent will change how this is worded.
Ambient Purgatory. In what situations (that might actually occur) do you see playing this as not an aura? When giving a choice, if one choice is strictly worse. Then it's not really a choice.
Do you have something against triggered abilities? Instead of the nightmare of timing that giving the player a choice that can only be made during the resolution of opponents abilities just let this raven have a triggered ability. Though I have to ask your intent. Opponent plays Thoughtsieze while this is in my hand. Do they have the option of discarding it before I can put it into play? Your intent will change how this is worded.
Ambient Purgatory. In what situations (that might actually occur) do you see playing this as not an aura? When giving a choice, if one choice is strictly worse. Then it's not really a choice.
As per game rules he shouldn't be able to put the bird in the battefield before thoughtseize resolves so it will (Unless something better is in hand) most likely be discarded.
I believe the self bounce ability may need to cost a little more to balance everything else happening in the card tbh.
On the land:
There are very few ways to word this properly and you have to address that Auras chooses target in the stack which is impossible to do with a land, so the templating should be different, like this
When Ambient Purgatory enters the battlefield you may attach it to target land you control, if you do, it becomes an Aura with enchant land.
Enchanted land has shroud T: Add C.<<Put a less convoluted drawback if you want>>
It takes place as a state-based effect, on the "trigger" of being revealed from the hand. We do it this way because it provides more action-based context of composure, especially to emphasize a state-based effect (such as like Darksteel Colossus). It wouldn't matter otherwise in the event of discard, because if an opponent attempts to cast an instant discard over it, the ability would trigger again when the hand is technically revealed again.
Attempts to Trickbind the ability shouldn't matter for what it's doing. It's too narrow to matter, or worry about going out of the way to cover in ways that compromises the security of the color-hate effect. I can't imagine a player that would waste both spells like that. Players would just let it pass. That's literally some 0.00001% case scenario.
As for the land, if you have to ask, I guess you don't know. However, in the event you are running 18~20 lands it matters very much and is essential to the design for continuance.
It takes place as a state-based effect, on the "trigger" of being revealed from the hand. We do it this way because it provides more action-based context of composure, especially to emphasize a state-based effect (such as like Darksteel Colossus). It wouldn't matter otherwise in the event of discard, because if an opponent attempts to cast an instant discard over it, the ability would trigger again when the hand is technically revealed again.
Attempts to Trickbind the ability shouldn't matter for what it's doing. It's too narrow to matter, or worry about going out of the way to cover in ways that compromises the security of the color-hate effect. I can't imagine a player that would waste both spells like that. Players would just let it pass. That's literally some 0.00001% case scenario.
As for the land, if you have to ask, I guess you don't know. However, in the event you are running 18~20 lands it matters very much and is essential to the design for continuance.
They can force you to discard the card with the same ability that reveals it (Thoughtsieze in our example) becuase you cannot put this ability into the stack until that ability finishes resolving, by which time it may not be in your hand anymore.
On that note, Darksteel Colossus (the Shuffle effects I guess you are pointing out) is a Replacement Effect not a state-based effect, those work really, really different you know.
So it's a trigger but you prefer to be advant-garde as opposed to coherent. That's fine.
If you can't answer you obviously don't know. That's also fine. I assumed you had a half-baked idea of it being played in abstange way in an unlikely scenario. Glad to no not even you thought of one.
Fixing your cards they look like this.
Peekabird1U
Creature - Bird
Whenever Peekabird is revealed from your hand by an effect controlled by your opponent. You may put Peekabird onto the battlefield.
Flying, hexproof from black 1U: Return Peekabird to its owner's hand.
2/1
Delusions of Home
Enchantment Land - Aura
Enchant Land
Enchanted Land has hexproof. T: Add C. Activate this ability only if an opponent has more life than you or controls more lands than you.
While I don't think blue needs the effect, it's on an unassuming enough card to get a twisted Obstinate Baloth ability.
A Land that shields your other lands is interesting. There are many possible changes but I actually like this card as is. It would definitely find a home in some legacy decks that want to protect thier vulnerable/important Land base.
I know that it has a replacement effect, but nothing stops the development team from blending the line where necessary to provide new interactivity or provide essential securities. This is not an element of design—this is an element of development. Does everyone here not understand the difference between these two teams and their operating functions?
On another note, Protection explicitly is crucial to the design so that it may still penetrate defenses in cases of hostile creature domain—such as Vampire Nighthawk. It is an important security to the design and what it does as color-hate.
I know that it has a replacement effect, but nothing stops the development team from blending the line where necessary to provide new interactivity or provide essential securities. This is not an element of design—this is an element of development. Does everyone here not understand the difference between these two teams and their operating functions?
On another note, Protection explicitly is crucial to the design so that it may still penetrate defenses in cases of hostile creature domain—such as Vampire Nighthawk. It is an important security to the design and what it does as color-hate.
Cool you mentioned that, development would definetily send all the cards you make to the bin without blinking an eye. Just saying.
Also isn't a little too much elistism to think you or any of us really work in like WoTC to have those things into account? Dude this an internet forum not a serious job or something you get paid for...like saying...DO YOU HAVE a design team or R&D department working on your cards or something?
You card has enought protection as it is with the self bouncing, why does it need to also have protection from a Color Blue is not even enemy of, if fact Black and Blue are allied colors, they usually support each other rather than hosing themselves.
And Vampire Nighthawk is not a really good cards nowadays
Reap has some wording issues here combined with him not understanding the differences between replacement effects, triggered abilities and state based effects. Obstinate Baloth is probably the best baseline to use and a replacement for the reveal is the most workable way to keep the intent of dodging Thoughseize effects, and avoid repeated trigger from something like Telepathy
Escapist Raven 1U
Creature — Bird Rogue
If a spell or ability an opponent control would cause you to reveal CARDNAME from your hand, put it onto the battlefield instead.
Flying, protection from black
1U : Return Escapist Raven to its owner's hand.
2/1
That said, about all it really does is punish Thoughtsieze and also being pro-Black makes it a super niche sideboard card at best.
The land, setting aside how badly written it is, is just a bad concept. First, there is practically no utility in playing a colorless land to grant another of your lands shroud - any deck that wants to target your lands will just target one of your other lands instead. The fact that you chose to have the aura become Legendary for some reason makes it even worse because then you can only protect ever one land at a time even if you run multiples of the card.
Second, an aura that can still tap for mana (which is what your card does, though you may not have intended that - again, badly worded) is problematic because players typically will tap a permanent and its attached auras/equipment all together even though the attached permanents don't technically tap, making it hard to keep track of tap abilities on attached permanents.
Third, you made a land that doesn't even always produce mana, which makes it niche ability even more worthless.
For the land to work like you want it to, 5Colors gave you correct wording for the aura ability.
Ambient Purgatory
Enchantment Land
When CARDNAME enters the battlefield you may attach it to target land you control, if you do, it becomes a Legendary Aura with enchant land.
Enchanted land has shroud
T: Add C. Activate this ability only if an opponent has more life than you or controls more lands than you.
This is a good example to elaborate on the usage of the context that I've provided. Because when we use the word instead, it can suggest that the a person doesn't reveal their hand instead. We are back at square one. There's need to optimize the system now, and create more intuitive means to provide functionality with coherence. It's an answer to unknown problems even. It goes on to solve similar conflict in the future and provide instant functionality. The same logic explains the other blended hybrid abilities, which combine triggered, activated, and static operating functions. This goes on to provide functionality and design space into the future.
The repeatable trigger with the bounce ability off an opponent's Telepathy isn't an issue. It's still at a mana expensure. Mana expensure counter-balances repeatable effects. This is homeroom 101 stuff. And that's not considering the 0.0000001% case scenario either.
The repeatable trigger with the bounce ability off an opponent's Telepathy isn't an issue. It's still at a mana expensure. Mana expensure counter-balances repeatable effects. This is homeroom 101 stuff. And that's not considering the 0.0000001% case scenario either.
Allow me to educate you on the actual problem since you completely misunderstood what I was talking about.
Under your current wording of a sort of triggered ability, Telepathy creates an infinite loop until you decide to put the bird into play.
1. Your card is revealed by Telepathy.
2. The "trigger" goes on the stack.
3. You choose not to put the card into play.
4. Card is still in your hand and still revealed by telepathy. Return to step 2.
And the replacement effect wording works just fine, it has no interaction with other cards that would get revealed at the same time as the card with the ability. If a Progenitus and several other creatures get Wrathed, the Progenitus' shuffle effect doesn't have any bearing on whether or not the rest of the creatures go to the graveyard.
This was already discussed in another thread where I brought up the issue that this rule doesn't exist but should—to prevent infinite loops and sequences.
I believe this was in discussing the details for hammering out hybrid abilities, where I was placing a static ability on a trigger.
Public Mod Note
(rowanalpha):
This forum isn't for arguing about how you think the rules should change per your personal desires. Please refer to the pinned "Spirit of the Card Creation Forum" for more information.
This was already discussed in another thread where I brought up the issue that this rule doesn't exist but should—to prevent infinite loops and sequences.
I believe this was in discussing the details for hammering out hybrid abilities, where I was placing a static ability on a trigger.
The answer to questions about a card you create should be in the comprehensive rules (if they are within the current rules) or in the same post (if you are proposing a rules change).
Asking people to go search through your posting history every time you break the rules in the exact same way because you can’t be bothered to do some basic copying and pasting is not an option.
Creature — Bird Rogue
If Escapist Raven is reveled from your hand at any time by a source an opponent controls, you may put it onto the battlefield.
Flying, protection from black
1U : Return Escapist Raven to its owner's hand.
No, don't go near that cage!
2/1
Lore Card
No, don't go near that cage! It hasn't eaten in ages. I've been trying to starve it into extinction! I've never seen such a resilient creature. It has to be the devil's work!
Ambient Purgatory
Enchantment Land
You may have Ambient Purgatory enters the battlefield as a legendary Aura in addition to its other types enchanting target land.
As long as Ambient Purgatory is an aura, enchanted land has shroud.
Ambient Purgatory. In what situations (that might actually occur) do you see playing this as not an aura? When giving a choice, if one choice is strictly worse. Then it's not really a choice.
As per game rules he shouldn't be able to put the bird in the battefield before thoughtseize resolves so it will (Unless something better is in hand) most likely be discarded.
I believe the self bounce ability may need to cost a little more to balance everything else happening in the card tbh.
On the land:
There are very few ways to word this properly and you have to address that Auras chooses target in the stack which is impossible to do with a land, so the templating should be different, like this
Attempts to Trickbind the ability shouldn't matter for what it's doing. It's too narrow to matter, or worry about going out of the way to cover in ways that compromises the security of the color-hate effect. I can't imagine a player that would waste both spells like that. Players would just let it pass. That's literally some 0.00001% case scenario.
As for the land, if you have to ask, I guess you don't know. However, in the event you are running 18~20 lands it matters very much and is essential to the design for continuance.
They can force you to discard the card with the same ability that reveals it (Thoughtsieze in our example) becuase you cannot put this ability into the stack until that ability finishes resolving, by which time it may not be in your hand anymore.
On that note, Darksteel Colossus (the Shuffle effects I guess you are pointing out) is a Replacement Effect not a state-based effect, those work really, really different you know.
If you can't answer you obviously don't know. That's also fine. I assumed you had a half-baked idea of it being played in abstange way in an unlikely scenario. Glad to no not even you thought of one.
Fixing your cards they look like this.
Peekabird 1U
Creature - Bird
Whenever Peekabird is revealed from your hand by an effect controlled by your opponent. You may put Peekabird onto the battlefield.
Flying, hexproof from black
1U: Return Peekabird to its owner's hand.
2/1
Delusions of Home
Enchantment Land - Aura
Enchant Land
Enchanted Land has hexproof.
T: Add C. Activate this ability only if an opponent has more life than you or controls more lands than you.
While I don't think blue needs the effect, it's on an unassuming enough card to get a twisted Obstinate Baloth ability.
A Land that shields your other lands is interesting. There are many possible changes but I actually like this card as is. It would definitely find a home in some legacy decks that want to protect thier vulnerable/important Land base.
On another note, Protection explicitly is crucial to the design so that it may still penetrate defenses in cases of hostile creature domain—such as Vampire Nighthawk. It is an important security to the design and what it does as color-hate.
Cool you mentioned that, development would definetily send all the cards you make to the bin without blinking an eye. Just saying.
Also isn't a little too much elistism to think you or any of us really work in like WoTC to have those things into account? Dude this an internet forum not a serious job or something you get paid for...like saying...DO YOU HAVE a design team or R&D department working on your cards or something?
You card has enought protection as it is with the self bouncing, why does it need to also have protection from a Color Blue is not even enemy of, if fact Black and Blue are allied colors, they usually support each other rather than hosing themselves.
And Vampire Nighthawk is not a really good cards nowadays
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StaffEscapist Raven 1U
Creature — Bird Rogue
If a spell or ability an opponent control would cause you to reveal CARDNAME from your hand, put it onto the battlefield instead.
Flying, protection from black
1U : Return Escapist Raven to its owner's hand.
2/1
That said, about all it really does is punish Thoughtsieze and also being pro-Black makes it a super niche sideboard card at best.
The land, setting aside how badly written it is, is just a bad concept. First, there is practically no utility in playing a colorless land to grant another of your lands shroud - any deck that wants to target your lands will just target one of your other lands instead. The fact that you chose to have the aura become Legendary for some reason makes it even worse because then you can only protect ever one land at a time even if you run multiples of the card.
Second, an aura that can still tap for mana (which is what your card does, though you may not have intended that - again, badly worded) is problematic because players typically will tap a permanent and its attached auras/equipment all together even though the attached permanents don't technically tap, making it hard to keep track of tap abilities on attached permanents.
Third, you made a land that doesn't even always produce mana, which makes it niche ability even more worthless.
For the land to work like you want it to, 5Colors gave you correct wording for the aura ability.
Ambient Purgatory
Enchantment Land
When CARDNAME enters the battlefield you may attach it to target land you control, if you do, it becomes a Legendary Aura with enchant land.
Enchanted land has shroud
T: Add C. Activate this ability only if an opponent has more life than you or controls more lands than you.
Now it functions as intended, its just very bad.
The repeatable trigger with the bounce ability off an opponent's Telepathy isn't an issue. It's still at a mana expensure. Mana expensure counter-balances repeatable effects. This is homeroom 101 stuff. And that's not considering the 0.0000001% case scenario either.
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StaffAllow me to educate you on the actual problem since you completely misunderstood what I was talking about.
Under your current wording of a sort of triggered ability, Telepathy creates an infinite loop until you decide to put the bird into play.
1. Your card is revealed by Telepathy.
2. The "trigger" goes on the stack.
3. You choose not to put the card into play.
4. Card is still in your hand and still revealed by telepathy. Return to step 2.
And the replacement effect wording works just fine, it has no interaction with other cards that would get revealed at the same time as the card with the ability. If a Progenitus and several other creatures get Wrathed, the Progenitus' shuffle effect doesn't have any bearing on whether or not the rest of the creatures go to the graveyard.
I believe this was in discussing the details for hammering out hybrid abilities, where I was placing a static ability on a trigger.
The answer to questions about a card you create should be in the comprehensive rules (if they are within the current rules) or in the same post (if you are proposing a rules change).
Asking people to go search through your posting history every time you break the rules in the exact same way because you can’t be bothered to do some basic copying and pasting is not an option.
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Staff