Unstable Identity1 Instant
Target creature, artifact, or land becomes a copy of another target permanent of the same type until end of turn. "I was me—but now he's gone."
"Lost in delusion—this token to the pantheon."
"What this place has become—is a ghost among the higher echelon."
Isochron Crystal Ball0 Artifact
Imprint — When Isochron Crystal Ball enters the battlefield, you may exile an instant card with a converted mana cost 2 or less from your hand imprinted on this card. 3, Sacrifice Isochron Crystal Ball: You may cast the imprinted card without paying its mana cost. If the imprinted card would be put into your graveyard when it resolves, shuffle it into your library instead. "It beholds a strong vision the weak will only deny."
To enable a split pair between Isochron Scepter. Not unique, I'm sure the concept has been pondered over many times. I believe this is the healthiest form. Everything's here for a perfect match. Wording composure updated for coherence. The concept is a throwback to when Dio smashes the crystal ball in Rock N Roll Children.
I was thinking to allow it to grab an instant from outside the game instead.
Unstable identity is by far your mother competent design yet. Its so elegant and functional that I had to check to see if it existed already. The only problem with it is as a removal spell when alongside a legend. Though such functionality may be dismissed as a nessecary feature to keep wordiness down.
Isochron Crystal Ball is a functional yet bad design. It doesn't do anything that you would want done. It takes a spell from your hand, makes it immune to discard but susceptible to artifact distraction and increases its cost by making it generic. Fortunately there is a simple elegant fix that doesn't break it. Instead of shuffling the imprinted card into your library. Add it to you hand. Now you have a slow preemptive copy spell.
Fortunately there is a simple elegant fix that doesn't break it. Instead of shuffling the imprinted card into your library. Add it to you hand. Now you have a slow preemptive copy spell.
Demonic Attorney I don't agree. It would be vulgar then, and detract too strongly from the aspect of challenge. It is already giving you an additional copy of a spell in your deck. This is times 4 when you're running a playset. It is effectively, through awkward dynamics of physics, giving you an indirect split, by means of extension; and this by means of time-lapse benefit. It is a tremendous rare—if not a mythic—just as it is.
Fortunately there is a simple elegant fix that doesn't break it. Instead of shuffling the imprinted card into your library. Add it to you hand. Now you have a slow preemptive copy spell.
Demonic Attorney I don't agree. It would be vulgar then, and detract too strongly from the aspect of challenge. It is already giving you an additional copy of a spell in your deck. This is times 4 when you're running a playset. It is effectively, through awkward dynamics of physics, giving you an indirect split, by means of extension; and this by means of time-lapse benefit. It is a tremendous rare—if not a mythic—just as it is.
Yes, it does all that. However, all that, is in fact not very good. In fact, it is quite bad. To the point that not even casual players who play the format of "cards I own" would want this. Its card disadvantage for minimal if not nonexistent value.
What <3 mana card is worth playing this? If it wasn't limited by mana value and costed X to activate i could see a variety of not very good but interesting uses. But being so limited, it's just a bad card.
Still—I can't say any of that is valid. You're not explaining how either. How is it disadvantage? You're ace'ing discard. You're extending an additional copy of a spell to your arsenal. That's both advantage and clearly existent value.
However, I have returned the shuffle clause to the first version, updated, so that if Isochron Crystal Ball would be destroyed, the imprinted card is not lost.
Still—I can't say any of that is valid. You're not explaining how either. How is it disadvantage? You're ace'ing discard. You're extending an additional copy of a spell to your arsenal. That's both advantage and clearly existent value.
However, I have returned the shuffle clause to the first version, updated, so that if Isochron Crystal Ball would be destroyed, the imprinted card is not lost.
This was originally intended.
Alright, I always assumed you didn't understand how the game worked but never imagined you would be open to learning how it worked and the basic terminology used in it. So this orb is card disadvantage. This isn't a subjective point; it is irrefutable fact. Let me explain. Card advantage is at its simplest the number of cards you have in your hand and the number of permanents you have on the battlefield. It gets a lot more complicated when you delve into specifics but that isn't important here.
A card like opt is card neutral because it cost you a card but added a card to your hand. The card Divination is +1 card advantage because it cost you a card and drew you 2 cards. This is the basics of card advantage. It doesn't have anything to do with power level or card selection.
A card like faithless looting is card disadvantage. It costs you a card from your hand to draw 2 and discard 2. You are down a card from hand. Card disadvantage. Even when flashed back it is only card neutral. No card from hand was spent and you drew 2 and discarded 2.
Isochron Scepter is a card with a lot of potential. When you play it, it is card disadvantage because it has you exile a card from your hand. So it starts at a -1 card advantage. Each time you activate it you get a theoretical +1 card advantage. Even if the opponent removes it, it usually costs them a card to remove it, which is why the scepter is only a -1 when played.
Your orb doesn't have any of the advantage of the scepter. When you play your orb you are down a card just like the scepter meaning you are at -1. When you activate the orb you sacrifice it meaning you go down another -1. However, you get to cast the spell so you get +1. -2 and +1 result in a -1. Your orb has created card disadvantage. While the scepter stays on the field so it doesn't cause the second -1 and just keeps giving +1 every time you activate it.
So why does anyone play cards that are card disadvantage? Because of the other benefits. Usually mana advantage and/or card selection. Your orb provides neither. If you wish to learn more I don't mind explaining every term used in magic to help make you a better designer.
I will just quickly add that cards in library aren't considered card advantage. It's specifically about cards in hand. Cards returning to library is generally considered a very marginal benefit because the vast majority of games end before most of the library is drawn. So reshuffles are considered to be almost irrelevant because they so rarely matter.
Edit: I think that Unstable Identity should probably be a mono blue card. I don't love the idea of it as a mono red card which the hybrid mana forces me to consider.
Obviously there are other issues with your Crystal Ball just being a bad card, but your updated wording makes it so the card doesn't function at all. You have now changed it so that when the Scepter leaves you shuffle the card in. Well, the Crystal Ball leaves when you activate the ability and it leaves during activation. Which means the ability to shuffle in the card applies at that time (it should be a trigger but that is irrelevant now). Since the card is shuffled away as soon as you activate it, it is no longer in exile for you to cast it. You need to come up with a different wording to handle both situations.
Obviously there are other issues with your Crystal Ball just being a bad card, but your updated wording makes it so the card doesn't function at all. You have now changed it so that when the Scepter leaves you shuffle the card in. Well, the Crystal Ball leaves when you activate the ability and it leaves during activation. Which means the ability to shuffle in the card applies at that time (it should be a trigger but that is irrelevant now). Since the card is shuffled away as soon as you activate it, it is no longer in exile for you to cast it. You need to come up with a different wording to handle both situations.
You choose how the effects go on the stack, yes?
You're going to say state-based effect that doesn't use the stack?
The point is—the effect is activated and the imprinted card goes on the stack, when the state-based effect kicks in, the spell is already on the stack. It can't continue until the spell leaves the stack.
Obviously there are other issues with your Crystal Ball just being a bad card, but your updated wording makes it so the card doesn't function at all. You have now changed it so that when the Scepter leaves you shuffle the card in. Well, the Crystal Ball leaves when you activate the ability and it leaves during activation. Which means the ability to shuffle in the card applies at that time (it should be a trigger but that is irrelevant now). Since the card is shuffled away as soon as you activate it, it is no longer in exile for you to cast it. You need to come up with a different wording to handle both situations.
You choose how the effects go on the stack, yes?
You're going to say state-based effect that doesn't use the stack?
The point is—the effect is activated and the imprinted card goes on the stack, when the state-based effect kicks in, the spell is already on the stack. It can't continue until the spell leaves the stack.
While you didn't ask for this one consider it a freebie.
When you announce a spell or ability that spell or ability goes on the stack. Then you pay costs. At this point state based actions occur allowing triggers onto the stack.
Your orb has sacrifice as part of its cost. So you declare its ability. This is its ability that says cast the card, not the imprinted card. It goes on stack. You pay its cost. Now trigger from orb to shuffle goes on stack. Long story short the card is always in the deck when you go to cast it.
A reasonable fix thst also addresses the card disadvantage problem. Remove all the text besides the imprint ability. Add two abilities. First, When ~ leaves the battlefield cast the imprinted card. f that card would be put into the graveyard shuffle it into its owner's library. Second, "3,T: Sacrifice ~." This is now a strange yet reasonable card.
It is a spell on the stack—referenced only as a card again—after it leaves the stack and would go into the graveyard as a card again.
Step 1: I pay the cost for the ability. Sacrificing the artifact is part of the cost. Note that paying a cost does not use the stack (If someone bounces their elf to activate wirewood symbiote, you cannot kill the bounced creature in response). There is precedence for this ruling.
Step 2: Because the card went to the graveyard as part of the cost the second ability goes on the stack. you do not choose the order as they do not actually happen simultaneously. Activating the first ability triggers the second, which resolves first, shuffling the card into your deck. If you need an example, look at yavimaya elder. When you sacrifice the elder for the second ability, you always get the death trigger first. There is precedence for this specific ruling.
Step 3: Because the original ability tries to cast the spell rather than casting a copy (in which case I believe the rules would allow it to use last available information), the game looks for the spell exiled by this card... and fails to find it because it is already back in your library. Note that a card no longer in exile is no longer imprinted on the card. If you use pull from eternity on a card exiled by Isochron Scepter, you can't copy that spell any more. There is precedence for this specific ruling.
When you have priority, you can arrange the stack (and distribute damage) so long as they are simultaneous instances.
Yes?
You are incorrect. The triggered and activated abilities are not simultaneous.
You announce that you are activating the ability before you pay the costs. This is a strange and rarely relevant rule that allowed the krark-clan ironworks deck to work and that allowed you cast a spell from your hand using lion’s eye diamond before it received errata (the card was on the stack before you activate the diamond and discard your hand)
Because you technically activate the ability before you pay the cost and sac the card, the triggered ability comes up afterwards and resolves first.
Again, Yavimaya Elder is a perfect example of how this this ruling has existed for many years. When you activate the elder, you do not choose whether you draw or search first. You always search first.
For it to trigger, the imprinted card is already on the stack as spell, yes?
Simultaneously, the Isochron Crystal Ball is on its way to the graveyard. Yes?
Again, incorrect. This is a rules issue that a lot of people (even practiced designers) get wrong, though, so I can't blame you for missing it.
Let's say that the card was as you originally printed it, back when it worked.
Step 1: I activate Crystal Ball with counterspell imprinted. You might think that the ability on the stack right now is "counter target spell" but the actual ability on the stack is still "You may cast the card imprinted on this card".
Step 2: The ability resolves... meaning that the game checks what was imprinted on the crystal ball. THEN AND ONLY THEN does the game puts that spell on the stack if it is still exiled and imprinted. In other words, the imprinted spell only ever goes on the stack after the activated ability resolves rather than the activated ability being the copied spell.
What happens right now:
Step 1: I announce that I am activating the crystal ball, paying the costs and sacrificing the ball. Before the ball even hits the graveyard, the "You may cast the card imprinted on this card" is technically on the stack.
Step 2: Because the ball hit the graveyard, the triggered ability comes into play. Because this happened with the activated ability on the stack, this ability will resolve first.
Step 3: The triggered ability resolves and the imprinted card is shuffled into your library. It is no longer imprinted.
Step 4: The activated ability finally resolves! You may cast the card imprinted on this card. The game checks only at this point in time what is imprinted on it... and finds nothing.
Step 5: Nothing happens.
What would fix this card:
Honestly, the fact that this card sacrifices itself means that you can tap into the wellspring of "last known information". If you cast a "copy" of the imprinted spell, the game only needs to check what was imprinted on the staff when it was last existent, meaning that the original being shuffled into the library shouldn't obstruct this card (though I might be wrong on this point. I welcome any judges to speak to the contrary as, again, this is fairly high-level rules lawyering). The only problem right now is that your crystal ball is trying to cast the original physical card after it has been put elsewhere.
For it to trigger, the imprinted card is already on the stack as spell, yes?
Almost. The activated ability is what puts the spell on the stack. So when you activate it the ability to put the spell on the stack goes onto the stack, but as RosyDumplings has been explaining the triggered ability resolves first and shuffles in while the activated ability is still on the stack.
Activating the ability doesn't put the ability on the stack immeadiately. It creates an activated ability that will then cast the spell, putting it onto the stack.
Edit: too slow. Also can I ask why unstable identity is hybrid red and blue?
I also want to take a moment to acknowledge that this sort of arcane rules-lawyering is NOT a "pretty" or "elegant" part of MTG. While some rules gurus love weird corner cases involving Panglacial Wurm and the like, Wizards is smart enough to try to keep this high-level play out of most constructed formats and specifically banned Krark-Clan Ironworks in modern because the games running it forced players to become familiar with counterintuitive rules.
Given these counterintuitive rulings, I can almost understand if your first instinct is to simply "make rulings" to address corner cases.
With that said, there is a genuine difficulty with accretion. When you print 1,000+ new cards each year like Wizards, making a concise and elegant ruleset is virtually impossible. You are either going to have lots of cards working in a "relatively" straightforward manner with ugly corner cases or you forcefully smooth those corner cases with card-specific rulings... which would cause the rules to balloon as more and more cards being printed forces more and more corner cases to be smoothed.
It has been the MO of WotC to avoid smoothing out cards but to avoid designs that make those ugly corner cases visible. While this decision cuts off a bit of design space at the margins, it has been working fairly well so far and this is the assumption that 99% of posters make when approaching how cards dealing with weird rules should be handled.
Nevermind the technicalities. I just rolled it back, this preserves more aspect of challenge anyways.
It is hybrid for flexability, in that other colors are able to diversify their structure without having to include off colors.
For example, Red White can run this without Blue. Green Blue can run this without Red. This is great for play value.
That's why I was raising the question though. It can be run in decks without blue but I'd argue this effect is pretty much explicitly blue, and it feels strange seeing it on a card that can be mono red.
Are you arguing that the effect should be available to red or that having hybrid blue justifies the card? I really like the design fwiw, I just think it should be a mono blue card.
Silly thought real quick regarding the activation, what if you flipped the ability so that casting a copy of the imprinted card was the activation to sacrifice the orb? That fixes the problem of the imprint check, and gives the card a bit more power if you were to regenerate the artifact as a response and blink it later. Think of it as a entomb and unmarked grave scenario. Isochron is strictly better, but this can still net value. The power on this card though comes from 3 generic mana to activate any two cost spell, and in a tron style deck, getting three colorless on turn one is easier than getting out two of a specific color mana. And, it serves as a free spell regardless, because you get it back into your library.
Okay so saying the effect should be red got it. I'm not fully in agreement that becoming a copy is the red sort of chaos. Red's copying is usually in temporary token form. Kiki-Jiki, Mirror breaker or felhide spiritbinder. But in doing a quick search I saw that WotC disagrees with me in the form of Tilonalli's Skinshifter so I stand corrected. Seems fine as hybrid after all which was really my only hang up with the card.
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Instant
Target creature, artifact, or land becomes a copy of another target permanent of the same type until end of turn.
"I was me—but now he's gone."
"Lost in delusion—this token to the pantheon."
"What this place has become—is a ghost among the higher echelon."
Isochron Crystal Ball 0
Artifact
Imprint — When Isochron Crystal Ball enters the battlefield, you may exile an instant card with a converted mana cost 2 or less from your hand imprinted on this card.
3, Sacrifice Isochron Crystal Ball: You may cast the imprinted card without paying its mana cost. If the imprinted card would be put into your graveyard when it resolves, shuffle it into your library instead.
"It beholds a strong vision the weak will only deny."
To enable a split pair between Isochron Scepter. Not unique, I'm sure the concept has been pondered over many times. I believe this is the healthiest form. Everything's here for a perfect match. Wording composure updated for coherence. The concept is a throwback to when Dio smashes the crystal ball in Rock N Roll Children.
I was thinking to allow it to grab an instant from outside the game instead.
Isochron Crystal Ball is a functional yet bad design. It doesn't do anything that you would want done. It takes a spell from your hand, makes it immune to discard but susceptible to artifact distraction and increases its cost by making it generic. Fortunately there is a simple elegant fix that doesn't break it. Instead of shuffling the imprinted card into your library. Add it to you hand. Now you have a slow preemptive copy spell.
Demonic Attorney I don't agree. It would be vulgar then, and detract too strongly from the aspect of challenge. It is already giving you an additional copy of a spell in your deck. This is times 4 when you're running a playset. It is effectively, through awkward dynamics of physics, giving you an indirect split, by means of extension; and this by means of time-lapse benefit. It is a tremendous rare—if not a mythic—just as it is.
What <3 mana card is worth playing this? If it wasn't limited by mana value and costed X to activate i could see a variety of not very good but interesting uses. But being so limited, it's just a bad card.
However, I have returned the shuffle clause to the first version, updated, so that if Isochron Crystal Ball would be destroyed, the imprinted card is not lost.
This was originally intended.
A card like opt is card neutral because it cost you a card but added a card to your hand. The card Divination is +1 card advantage because it cost you a card and drew you 2 cards. This is the basics of card advantage. It doesn't have anything to do with power level or card selection.
A card like faithless looting is card disadvantage. It costs you a card from your hand to draw 2 and discard 2. You are down a card from hand. Card disadvantage. Even when flashed back it is only card neutral. No card from hand was spent and you drew 2 and discarded 2.
Isochron Scepter is a card with a lot of potential. When you play it, it is card disadvantage because it has you exile a card from your hand. So it starts at a -1 card advantage. Each time you activate it you get a theoretical +1 card advantage. Even if the opponent removes it, it usually costs them a card to remove it, which is why the scepter is only a -1 when played.
Your orb doesn't have any of the advantage of the scepter. When you play your orb you are down a card just like the scepter meaning you are at -1. When you activate the orb you sacrifice it meaning you go down another -1. However, you get to cast the spell so you get +1. -2 and +1 result in a -1. Your orb has created card disadvantage. While the scepter stays on the field so it doesn't cause the second -1 and just keeps giving +1 every time you activate it.
So why does anyone play cards that are card disadvantage? Because of the other benefits. Usually mana advantage and/or card selection. Your orb provides neither. If you wish to learn more I don't mind explaining every term used in magic to help make you a better designer.
Edit: I think that Unstable Identity should probably be a mono blue card. I don't love the idea of it as a mono red card which the hybrid mana forces me to consider.
You choose how the effects go on the stack, yes?
You're going to say state-based effect that doesn't use the stack?
The point is—the effect is activated and the imprinted card goes on the stack, when the state-based effect kicks in, the spell is already on the stack. It can't continue until the spell leaves the stack.
When you announce a spell or ability that spell or ability goes on the stack. Then you pay costs. At this point state based actions occur allowing triggers onto the stack.
Your orb has sacrifice as part of its cost. So you declare its ability. This is its ability that says cast the card, not the imprinted card. It goes on stack. You pay its cost. Now trigger from orb to shuffle goes on stack. Long story short the card is always in the deck when you go to cast it.
A reasonable fix thst also addresses the card disadvantage problem. Remove all the text besides the imprint ability. Add two abilities. First, When ~ leaves the battlefield cast the imprinted card. f that card would be put into the graveyard shuffle it into its owner's library. Second, "3,T: Sacrifice ~." This is now a strange yet reasonable card.
Step 1: I pay the cost for the ability. Sacrificing the artifact is part of the cost. Note that paying a cost does not use the stack (If someone bounces their elf to activate wirewood symbiote, you cannot kill the bounced creature in response). There is precedence for this ruling.
Step 2: Because the card went to the graveyard as part of the cost the second ability goes on the stack. you do not choose the order as they do not actually happen simultaneously. Activating the first ability triggers the second, which resolves first, shuffling the card into your deck. If you need an example, look at yavimaya elder. When you sacrifice the elder for the second ability, you always get the death trigger first. There is precedence for this specific ruling.
Step 3: Because the original ability tries to cast the spell rather than casting a copy (in which case I believe the rules would allow it to use last available information), the game looks for the spell exiled by this card... and fails to find it because it is already back in your library. Note that a card no longer in exile is no longer imprinted on the card. If you use pull from eternity on a card exiled by Isochron Scepter, you can't copy that spell any more. There is precedence for this specific ruling.
This is simply the rules of the game.
Yes?
You are incorrect. The triggered and activated abilities are not simultaneous.
You announce that you are activating the ability before you pay the costs. This is a strange and rarely relevant rule that allowed the krark-clan ironworks deck to work and that allowed you cast a spell from your hand using lion’s eye diamond before it received errata (the card was on the stack before you activate the diamond and discard your hand)
Because you technically activate the ability before you pay the cost and sac the card, the triggered ability comes up afterwards and resolves first.
Again, Yavimaya Elder is a perfect example of how this this ruling has existed for many years. When you activate the elder, you do not choose whether you draw or search first. You always search first.
Those are the rules.
Simultaneously, the Isochron Crystal Ball is on its way to the graveyard. Yes?
Again, incorrect. This is a rules issue that a lot of people (even practiced designers) get wrong, though, so I can't blame you for missing it.
Let's say that the card was as you originally printed it, back when it worked.
Step 1: I activate Crystal Ball with counterspell imprinted. You might think that the ability on the stack right now is "counter target spell" but the actual ability on the stack is still "You may cast the card imprinted on this card".
Step 2: The ability resolves... meaning that the game checks what was imprinted on the crystal ball. THEN AND ONLY THEN does the game puts that spell on the stack if it is still exiled and imprinted.
In other words, the imprinted spell only ever goes on the stack after the activated ability resolves rather than the activated ability being the copied spell.
What happens right now:
Step 1: I announce that I am activating the crystal ball, paying the costs and sacrificing the ball. Before the ball even hits the graveyard, the "You may cast the card imprinted on this card" is technically on the stack.
Step 2: Because the ball hit the graveyard, the triggered ability comes into play. Because this happened with the activated ability on the stack, this ability will resolve first.
Step 3: The triggered ability resolves and the imprinted card is shuffled into your library. It is no longer imprinted.
Step 4: The activated ability finally resolves! You may cast the card imprinted on this card. The game checks only at this point in time what is imprinted on it... and finds nothing.
Step 5: Nothing happens.
What would fix this card:
Honestly, the fact that this card sacrifices itself means that you can tap into the wellspring of "last known information". If you cast a "copy" of the imprinted spell, the game only needs to check what was imprinted on the staff when it was last existent, meaning that the original being shuffled into the library shouldn't obstruct this card (though I might be wrong on this point. I welcome any judges to speak to the contrary as, again, this is fairly high-level rules lawyering). The only problem right now is that your crystal ball is trying to cast the original physical card after it has been put elsewhere.
Almost. The activated ability is what puts the spell on the stack. So when you activate it the ability to put the spell on the stack goes onto the stack, but as RosyDumplings has been explaining the triggered ability resolves first and shuffles in while the activated ability is still on the stack.
Activating the ability doesn't put the ability on the stack immeadiately. It creates an activated ability that will then cast the spell, putting it onto the stack.
Edit: too slow. Also can I ask why unstable identity is hybrid red and blue?
Given these counterintuitive rulings, I can almost understand if your first instinct is to simply "make rulings" to address corner cases.
With that said, there is a genuine difficulty with accretion. When you print 1,000+ new cards each year like Wizards, making a concise and elegant ruleset is virtually impossible. You are either going to have lots of cards working in a "relatively" straightforward manner with ugly corner cases or you forcefully smooth those corner cases with card-specific rulings... which would cause the rules to balloon as more and more cards being printed forces more and more corner cases to be smoothed.
It has been the MO of WotC to avoid smoothing out cards but to avoid designs that make those ugly corner cases visible. While this decision cuts off a bit of design space at the margins, it has been working fairly well so far and this is the assumption that 99% of posters make when approaching how cards dealing with weird rules should be handled.
It is hybrid for flexability, in that other colors are able to diversify their structure without having to include off colors.
For example, Red White can run this without Blue. Green Blue can run this without Red. This is great for play value.
That's why I was raising the question though. It can be run in decks without blue but I'd argue this effect is pretty much explicitly blue, and it feels strange seeing it on a card that can be mono red.
Are you arguing that the effect should be available to red or that having hybrid blue justifies the card? I really like the design fwiw, I just think it should be a mono blue card.
I think we'll just keep it as it is.