EDIT: I realize the formatting of this post is messed up. It happened when the website migrated. I've tried fixing the bold tags but even when I use and it doesn't render properly. If someone knows how to fix it, lemme know.
I recently put up a thread with directions to my MSE forum post on how to make custom color frames in MSE. I started on that project to support my development of a yellow color in Magic. Some people showed interest in the yellow color itself, so I thought I'd put up a thread dedicated to that, separately from the thread on custom frames.
Here I reproduce the relevant material from the other thread, edited for clarity. We can continue the discussion here if anyone is interested!
===Description of the color yellow===
MY ORIGINAL DESCRIPTION
Yellow is its own color, just like the other five. Deserts tap for yellow mana, or "Y". The power of the desert comes from the surprisingly resourceful creatures that live there, and from the raw age of the desert sand itself. No land was always a desert. The lingering power of ancient seas and vast forests, now withered into wasteland, mingles with the power of the yellow sand.
Here's my version of a WotC color summary for yellow:
Deserts provide yellow mana. Yellow mana is the magical essence of the timeless sands and the curiously resourceful and resilient creatures who live there. Yellow magic is about patience, endurance, and value found in unexpected places. Where others see barren land, a yellow mage sees untapped potential.
Resilience, patience, respect for the undervalued are the virtues of a yellow mage.
Yellow mages' actions are rarely overt in nature. They create dangerous situations for which they and creatures of the desert are better prepared than their rivals. They instill doubt into the minds of their enemies and undermine their resources. At their best, yellow mages are reliable, penetrating, and respectful. At their worst they are introverted and impotent.
Examples of yellow spells include prolonged drought, devastating sand storms, and the summoning of bursts of insight following long meditation.
Yellow creatures wait to strike until they have an advantage. Weak at first, a yellow creature will attack when the enemy is lost in the desert or suffering prolonged dehydration; situations to which yellow creatures are accustomed. Yellow magic also commands the allegiance of ancient, powerful desert beings such as stone colossi and great sand worms, but only in the right conditions.
The basic idea is that yellow is a color that gains the advantage by tailoring favorable conditions. For example, a yellow creature might have a power bonus and first strike as long as an opponent controls a desert. Yellow also then has the means to turn an opponent's land into a desert, but usually at a cost of time. Time, in fact, is a frequent resource and cost for yellow magic. For example, see the instant Long Meditation in the card catalog below.
What does the color care about? What is its end goal?
Other colors want to save the world, or rule it, or comprehend it. Yellow sees these goals as based on a fundamental delusion: in order to do any of these things, you have to exist first, but the other colors have failed to prioritize this. Yellow has learned the lesson of the vast, empty desert: survival is its own ideal. The fear of death fills every living thing when oblivion stares it in the face, but Yellow sees it far off in the distance as clearly as it does up close.
What means does the color use to achieve these ends?
Yellow's exaltation of trash into treasure extends to means as well as ends. Planning to live forever, Yellow sees in everything the moment when it might be most ideally suited for that end. Yellow is never flashy, but expends the bare minimum necessary to accomplish its task. It is only profligate with time, which, if spent correctly, is infinite.
What does the color care about? What does the color represent?
Yellow represents patience, caution, thrift, pragmatism, efficiency, cowardice, accumulation and depletion, resourcefulness, desperation, erosion, willingness to endure humiliation, sacrifice of pleasure, preservation, survival, tinkering, preparation, catastrophe, hard-won lessons, hoarding, the right tool for the job.
What does the color despise? What negatively drives the color?
More than any other color, Yellow is negatively driven, by its fear. In everything, Yellow sees a potential disaster.
Why does the color like its allies and hate its enemies?
Yellow appreciate's Black's resourcefulness and willingness to do anything for Number One; but cannot understand its concern with positional status or willingness to let go of its most precious and limited resource.
Yellow appreciates Blue's ability to plan for the long term, and to see the hidden potential in things; but cannot understand its remove from practical concerns in favor of an abstract theoretical realm.
Yellow appreciates White's patience and defensive posture; but cannot understand why it would lay down its life for others.
Yellow appreciates the ability to enjoy "mere life" along with Green, and envies the bountiful life that springs forth from it; but hold's Green's inability to see things for any use other than their "natural" one in contempt. Green and Yellow also believe that the best lessons are taught from long experience, and by the corpses of those who failed to learn them.
More than any other color, Yellow cannot understand Red, which it sees as reckless, if not simply insane.
What is the color’s greatest strength and biggest weakness?
Yellow's greatest strengths are its patience and efficiency. Given time to search for the perfect tool, it will win every battle.
Yellow's greatest weakness is its miserliness. It never expends more of its precious resources than it has to, holding onto useless trinkets long after they are needed, because "they'll come in handy sometime," and delays solving a problem now because it foresees a more efficient solution in the future. Black is greedy, but invests its treasure and enjoys it; Yellow buries its gold beneath the sands, and walks in rags. Nor does Yellow understand the advantages of walking in finery instead of rags. Yellow spends more time setting things up for the perfect opportunity than any other color, but frequently misses opportunities for that very reason.
===Can and Cannot===
Yellow can
Bind resources
Recover artifacts and lands from the graveyard, usually to the library but sometimes to the hand, and rarely to the field.
Modal life gain.
Mill
Yellow cannot
Directly destroy creatures.
Counter spells
===Mechanics===
Erode: (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. For each damage it would deal to a player, he or she removes the top two cards of his or her library and puts them into his or her graveyard instead.)
Sandwrought X: You may sacrifice X sand permanents rather than pay this card's mana cost.
===Tribes===
Scarab, Scorpion (maybe just "insect")
Lizard
Snake
Wurm
Horse
Camel
Djinn
Golem (with "Colossus" names)
===Card catalogue===
I'll put cards here and update as more become available (ie. as I decide they're good enough to show)
Draining Elemental YYY
Creature - Elemental (R)
At the beginning of your upkeep, put a +1/+1 counter on ~. Then each player with life total less than the number of +1/+1 counters on ~ loses the game.
1/1
Forgotten Guardian 3YY
Creature - Sand Golem
[I]It wanders the desert, searching for what it was meant to protect.[/I]
3/4
Glintshell Scarab 1Y
Creature - Insect (C)
Flying
Whenever ~ comes into play, leaves play, attacks, or blocks, target player puts the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
[I]All who have pursued it recall the piercing glint of sun from its golden shell. All who have pursued it have gone mad.[/I]
Hamada Mime Y
Creature - Sand Mime
Desertwalk.
Protection from Yellow.
1/1
Rasaha Camel Y
Creature - Camel
Prevent all noncombat damage that would be dealt to ~.
[I]"Their world is a harsh one, yet they prevail, so must we." -Alia, Nomad Captain[/I]
1/1
Sand Sage 1YY
Creature - Human Mystic (R)
At the end of your turn, if you have no cards in hand, draw a card.
1/1
Shah's Assassin 2YY
Creature - Human Assassin (U)
Whenever ~ would deal damage to a player you may sacrifice ~. If you do, double the damage dealt.
2/2
Stalking Buzzard 1Y
Creature - Bird (C)
Flying
Whenever a creature dies you may gain 1 life.
[I]Why do they call it a wasteland? Nothing is wasted by the resourceful creatures of the Enud-Sabah.[/I]
1/1
Sunsoaked Stretch 1Y
Creature - Wall
Defender, Reach
Damage dealt to ~ is dealt to all players instead.
0/2
Wall of Cacti 2Y
Creature - Plant
Defender, persist.
When ~ enters the battlefield, if you have 10 or less life, draw a card.
1/2
Weathered Wayfarer Y
Creature - Human Nomad
[I]I have learned to survive the desert, and that provides me a liveliness no man can can strip from me.[/I]
1/2
Sorcery
Attrition 2Y
Sorcery (C)
Target player sacrifices a permanent.
Cartographic Expedition
Sorcery (C)
Suspend 3 - 1Y
Search your library for up to two basic lands and put them into your hand. Shuffle your library.
Creeping Sands 1YY
Sorcery (U)
Replace target land with target desert you control. If that land was under another player's control, that play now gains control of the desert.
Expanding Boarders 2Y
Sorcery
As an additional cost to play ~ sacrifice a land. Search your library for up to three deserts, reveal them, and put them into your hand. Shuffle your library.
Illusory Ideal 2Y
Sorcery (C)
Put target enchantment on top of its owner's library.
Draw a card.
[I]The mirage is the first lesson of the desert, and the cruelest. Those with room on their backs for hopes but not waterskins are soon unburdened of both.[/I]
Parch the Throats 1Y
Sorcery (C)
During each player's next untap step, that player's creatures do not untap.
Parch the Trenches 1Y
Sorcery (U)
During each player's next untap step, that player's lands do not untap.
Re-Exist 3Y
Sorcery (C)
Until end of turn, any creature that would go to its owner's graveyard instead goes to the top of its owner's library.
Revealed Worth 1Y
Sorcery (C)
Sacrifice an artifact. Then search your library for another artifact with casting cost 1 greater than the one you sacrificed, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Shuffle your library.
[I]Look beyond this object's coarse trappings and envision what it is yet to become.[/I]
Sand Storm 1Y
Sorcery (U)
For each creature ~ deals 2 damage to that creature unless its controller pays 1 life.
Unburied Treasure 2 Y
Sorcery
Return target artifact card from a graveyard to the battlefield under your control.
Enchantments
Altered Domain 3YY
Enchantment
When ~ enters the battlefield gain control of up to 2 target lands target opponent controls, then that opponent gains control of that many deserts you control.
Cross the Nefud 2YY
Enchantment (U)
Vanishing 2
When ~ comes into play tap any number of untapped creatures you control. They do not untap during their controller's untap step.
When the last time counter is removed from ~, untap all creatures tapped by ~. They are unblockable this turn.
Curiosity Shop 2Y
Enchantment (R)
1Y: All players place a card from their hand face down under Curiosity Shop.
2: Take a random card from under Curiosity Shop and put it into your hand. Any player may play this ability.
If Curiosity Shop leaves play exile all cards underneath it.
Desolation 2Y
Enchantment (U)
Upkeep: Y
During each player's upkeep that player sacrifices a land.
Endless Conversation 2YY
Enchantment (R)
Vanishing 3
Players skip their draw steps.
Discard a card: Add a time counter to ~.
Energy Deprivation Y
Enchantment -Aura (C)
Enchant nonland permanent.
Enchanted permanent has "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice this permanent unless you pay 1."
Four-and-Forty Years of Exile 3Y
Enchantment - Curse
Enchant Player
Vanishing 10
At the beginning of ~'s controller's upkeep, that player loses one life.
When there are no more time counters on ~, enchanted player loses 20 life.
Lost 1Y
Enchantment - Aura
Flash
Enchant creature that entered the battlefield this turn.
Enchanted creature does not untap during its controller's untap step.
Patient Study 1Y
Enchantment (C)
Vanishing 1
When the last time counter is removed from ~ draw 2 cards.
[I]Above all else the <tribe> value time, and the insight found therein.
Sand Box2Y
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant land you control
When this enters the battlefield, exile the top 3 cards of your library face-down underneath the enchanted land.
{3}, {T}: Look at the cards underneath enchanted land. Put one of them into your hand and return the rest face-down underneath the land.
Thirst Y
Enchantment - Aura
Enchanted creature has "At the beginning of your end step put a -1/-1 counter on ~."
Tooth of Time Y
Enchantment
At the beginning of your upkeep sacrifice ~ and put target artifact on the bottom of its owner's library.
Treachery (v2) 3Y
Enchantment (U)
When ~ comes into play search target opponent's library for a creature card and exile it face down. You may look at it at any time. Whenever a creature attacks you may reveal the exiled card and sacrifice ~. If you do, gain control of target creature with the same name as the exiled card.
(This has too much rules text. Help?)
Water Shortage 2YY
Enchantment(U)
When ~ comes into play put a water counter on each creature. During each player's upkeep, that player removes a water counter from a creature he or she controls.
Creatures without water counters do not untap during their controller's untap step.
When there are no water counters in play, sacrifice ~.
(This card has already been discussed in another thread. I only posted it here to indicate the flavor of yellow)
Instants
Consolidated Resources 1Y
Instant (R)
Play ~ only during your upkeep.
End the turn. After your next turn, take an additional turn.
Long Meditation 2YY
Instant (U)
End the turn. Play this ability only during your upkeep.
At the beginning of your next upkeep, draw three cards.
Persist Y
Instant
Target creature is indestructible this turn.
[I]"There is no world beyond, no mercy for the perished. Stand firm and fight another day or return to the soil your ancestors rose from!" -Ikari battle hymn[/I]
Stifling Heat Y
Instant (U)
Attacking creatures get -2/-0 until end of turn.
[I]The city walls of Soara are supposed to fend off sand storms, not armies. The great desert is enough to keep outsiders away.[/I]
Artifacts
Big Constructed Colossus Thingy 4Y
Artifact Creature - Colossus
Protection from red
[I]The king asked Watto to build a statue worthy of the great desert colossi. Watto took the king's request to heart.[/I]
2/5
Djinn's Forgotten Lamp 3Y
Artifact (R)
T: If there is a memory counter on you, remove it, exile Djinn's Forgotten Lamp, and put a 6/6 flying yellow Djinn creature into play under your control. Otherwise, put a memory counter on you and shuffle Djinn's Forgotten Lamp into your library.
Land
Desert's Edge
Legendary Land
T: Add Y to your mana pool. Desert’s Edge deals 1 damage to you.
1 Y, T: Put target sand card from your graveyard on top of your library.
[I]"There is nothing in the desert. What do you think lies at its edge?"[/I]
Dune Sea
Land (C)
T: Put a sand counter on ~. You lose 1 life.
T, Remove X sand counters from ~: add Y to your mana pool for each sand counter removed.
Sun's Anvil
Land
~ comes into play tapped.
T: Add Y to your mana pool.
Whenever a creature attacks, its controller loses 1 life.
[I]"This is the Sun's Anvil. It is the worst place in Creation."[/I]
===Relevant discussion from the card frame thread===
It seems yellow would ally itself with blue. Stalling for time, and being patient, yellow could be the perfect color for mill strategies.
And some stall cards, I'm going to use yugioh examples cause I was watching it today, you could use something inspired by "swords of revealing light" to prevent attacks for a couple turns, and "lifeforce sword" to prevent spells from being played for a certain time too.
After seeing your description of yellow, it makes me wonder why people are clamoring for purple, because it's quite clear that yellow is where it's at.
@l1loneviet1l
I originally conceived of yellow as sitting between blue and white, but as my yellow card set evolved I realized that it really exists outside of the usual pie configuration. Allying with blue could lead to interesting flavor though... I'll have to give this more thought.
I like the idea of "not attacking" cards but we have to make sure we don't step on white's toes too much. I definitely like the idea of a "no spells for <some amount of time>" spell. I will design something along these lines immediately-ish.
As for scorpions: done. My first yellow creature ever was a scorpion.
@Bob Arctor
First off, thanks. You really can't say anything nicer to someone who's trying to create something
I always thought Cave would be a better fit for a purple basic land than City. The art that other amateur designers use for City are always sort of otherworldly and ominous, and don't fit in with a generally natural setting.
One thing to consider as well: there are many desert-themed cards spread all throughout Magic's history. This might help with some mechanic and flavor ideas. I think Mirage and Visions would have some awesome stuff ripe for reappropriating.
The cards look great too, by the way. I'd love to see more. I'm on my smart phone now but when I get home I'll jump on the computer and give you some more feedback.
Just because you mention it nowhere: You are aware of the existing orange mana? Yes/No/Maybe? Since - well - it's Desert mana. And it's a little more established. Just in case you actually see someone use it or having used it.
I consider your version of Treachery (surprise, btw, the name is taken) not any better an execution than the average terrible purple design. I'd like it if you had put enough thought into it to realize it with well-tested tools: Search an opponents library for a card and exile it face down for a similar effect (I'd opt for taking control here - dealing damage once is not "treacherous" enough IMO).
I'd comment on Water Shortage, but I did already extensively...
Good to see your yellow project get its own thread away from the custom MSE thread.
From the flavor color summary, it lists yellow mages as "rarely overt in nature. They create dangerous situations for which they and creatures of the desert are better prepared than their rivals." I'm trying to think of some mechanics that could duplicate this flavor-wise but I'm drawing a blank right now. Preparation to me denotes card draw in some form or fashion, or possibly a variation on morph. Obviously we'd want to use something new, as opposed to re-appropriating older keywords. Of course, it's at the end of a work-day as well, so I'm having a hard time thinking of something, but I'll let it swill around in my head tomorrow and see if I can come up with something.
"Examples of yellow spells include prolonged drought, devastating sand storms, and the summoning of bursts of insight following long meditation."
As far as older, desert-themed cards that might make the jump (flavor-wise but different name, obviously) Desert Twister seems like an obvious candidate. The name would have to be changed but nothing else captures the flavor of the desert like that card. It's an odd fit for green, as it was designed near the beginning of MTG, and would make sense making the jump to yellow.
What about tribes? Off the top of my head, these could work: Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels, Elephants, Giants, Sand Wurms and Colossi as you stated... Not sure what else. I might have to study up on some desert-type lore. Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels and Elephants don't exactly see a ton of cards nowadays, so switching them to yellow would have a minimal impact. Meanwhile, Giants have been printed in every color, so that's an easy inclusion. Sand Wurms and Colossi would be new as well, so that would be easy. On the plus side: when Colossus/Colossi gets added as a new subtype, a bunch of existing Colossi (in name) would make the jump to the new creature type. Kinda like what happened with Ebon Praetor once the New Phyrexia Praetors were printed.
Last note: there needs to be a functional reprint of Desert Nomads, but this time in yellow. Perhaps Desert Wanderers?
Treachery[quote] 3Y
Enchantment (U)
When ~ comes into play search target opponent's library for a creature card and exile it. Whenever a creature attacks you may reveal the exiled card and sacrifice ~. If you do, gain control of target creature with the same name as the exiled card.
When ~ leaves play shuffle the exiled card into its owner's library.
(This has too much rules text. Help?)
Rarr. You're not going to like this then: it needs at least a few more words.
"... and exile it face down. You may look at it at any time. Whenever... "
I think the last clause, the return to library clause, can be removed.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
Good to see your yellow project get its own thread away from the custom MSE thread.
Agreed.
From the flavor color summary, it lists yellow mages as "rarely overt in nature. They create dangerous situations for which they and creatures of the desert are better prepared than their rivals." I'm trying to think of some mechanics that could duplicate this flavor-wise but I'm drawing a blank right now. Preparation to me denotes card draw in some form or fashion, or possibly a variation on morph. Obviously we'd want to use something new, as opposed to re-appropriating older keywords. Of course, it's at the end of a work-day as well, so I'm having a hard time thinking of something, but I'll let it swill around in my head tomorrow and see if I can come up with something.
I don't know about something new. Here is something old: Desert Mime
Creature - Sand Mime
Protection from red
1/1
+ Earthquake
You would colorshift the idea and extrapolate from it, but I always considered it neat and it fits the bolded part.
"Examples of yellow spells include prolonged drought, devastating sand storms, and the summoning of bursts of insight following long meditation."
As far as older, desert-themed cards that might make the jump (flavor-wise but different name, obviously) Desert Twister seems like an obvious candidate. The name would have to be changed but nothing else captures the flavor of the desert like that card. It's an odd fit for green, as it was designed near the beginning of MTG, and would make sense making the jump to yellow.
Basically go to magiccards.info and use the search terms "Desert", "Sand" and "Dune" and you get a basic idea of what is resonant with the people.
I think expanding on the "time" theme metaphorically connected to "sand" could be nice. I don't suggest copying blue's theme, but maybe streamlining mechanics touched upon by Time Spiral.
Even if it's just something as simple as "~ enters the battlefield tapped." to show the slow eventuality of the creatures. (BTW: I'm not sold on vanishing as an evergreen mechanic despite this. Just for context.)
What about tribes? Off the top of my head, these could work: Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels, Elephants, Giants, Sand Wurms and Colossi as you stated... Not sure what else. I might have to study up on some desert-type lore. Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels and Elephants don't exactly see a ton of cards nowadays, so switching them to yellow would have a minimal impact. Meanwhile, Giants have been printed in every color, so that's an easy inclusion. Sand Wurms and Colossi would be new as well, so that would be easy. On the plus side: when Colossus/Colossi gets added as a new subtype, a bunch of existing Colossi (in name) would make the jump to the new creature type. Kinda like what happened with Ebon Praetor once the New Phyrexia Praetors were printed.
There are several not yet mentioned easy outs: I'm sure you can imagine some desert Birds (Vulture), hound (Jackal) and Insects (Scarab, Antlion); Hyena and Lizard/Viashino as well. Mythical creatures I could envision are Rocs (Birds as well, obv). Desert could pick up on some old creature types that have fallen from grace: Orc or Cockatrice perhaps?
The class type Nomad comes to mind, but classes are usually quite spreadable.
There is some difficulty not to step on white's toes too much - thinking of Savannah Lions here.
I hope you separated Sand and Wurm. I don't think introducing Sandwurm in addition to Wurm would be the proper choice - colors can share creature types. And Sand is just nice and wacky and can be the "yellow" Saproling.
Colossi up to now are Golem, Giant or Beast. There is really no definition of the term that I can think of that would convince me to add the type rather than use the existing types. With Giants already suggested for "yellow" Colossus sounds just so... redundant.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
As SecretInfiltrator and Bob Arctor have already implicitly suggested, our first goal should be to figure out what mechanics are consistent with the advertised flavor. Basically, "what can yellow do and not do?"
Here are things yellow cannot do
Bounce other people's permanents (This is blue's ability)
Counter spells (again, leave it to blue)
Cause opponents to discard. Causing everyone to discard might be ok, eg. "Mind Drought" or something.
Outright removal of enchantments (white and green have dibs on this)
Outright removal of creatures (Black and red. See below)
Outright removal of artifacts (Green, red, white. See below)
Here are things yellow can do
Life gain, but not as much as white. Normally done as sorcery with the amount of gain tied to eg. number of deserts in play.
Land destruction (keep to a minimum, people don't like it)
Land transformation. This is an important aspect of yellow.
Card draw. Always with time cost, ie. suspended spells.
Some kind of undermining of opponent's permanents. So far, I've been doing this by putting sand counters on things and allowing other abilities to interact with sand counters. I'll put some examples in the card catalog.
Modal artifact destruction. Still working on this one.
Attrition style creature effects. See Water Shortage in the catalog above.
Protection. Again I really don't want to steal white's thunder too much here, but I think it's appropriate. I also think this should possibly be modal, ie. "...has protection from red as long as you control a mountain."
As an example of the importance of time for yellow, let me present...
Djinn's Forgotten Lamp 3Y
Artifact (R)
T: If there is a memory counter on you, remove it, exile Djinn's Forgotten Lamp, and put a 6/6 flying yellow Djinn creature into play under your control. Otherwise, put a memory counter on you and shuffle Djinn's Forgotten Lamp into your library.
I would appreciate help developing this mechanic.
Other notes
SecretInfiltrator, I like the idea of creatures coming into play tapped. It fits the flavor. I also like Bob Arctor's idea of a morph-like mechanic. Unfortunately, I really don't like morph itself. Perhaps we can work with this...
In the realm of tribes I have the following so far: scarab, lizard, colossus (probably should just be golem), scorpion, camel and horse (possibly using mount), wurm, djinn, snake.
For classes I have assassin, nomad, pirate (yep!), merchant, dancer, philosopher.
I'm glad that someone brought up the idea of "sand". Sand is a subtype that can appear on any creature that is "of the desert." For example we have Shai-Hulud which is a "Creature - Sand Wurm". Sand does two things:
Acts as a global interaction mechanism for yellow creatures. For example, "~ gets +1/+1 for each sand permanent in play."
Mediates the "sandwrought" ability. To explain,
Sandwrought 5 (Instead of paying this spell's casting cost you may instead sacrifice a total of 5 sand permanents and deserts)
This is very much like "modular" but I'm hoping it will actually be useful and fun. It's also very much in the flavor, methinks.
EDIT: @Rising_Star, if you look at the custom card frame thread you can see what I have for the mana symbol. I like your idea of an hourglass. I worry that an hourglass mana symbol would lock yellow into the time theme more than I actually want, pushing other themes out of the way. However, the idea is so compelling that I'm going to draft something.
I get what you mean, but if you think about it, White mana and spells don't always have all that much to do with the sun, and for that matter neither do red cards all relate to fire.
Yeah, it's true. I was just thinking about white's symbol and the more I do the less I like it :\
As for red, meh, it's ok. It does fit the fire/earth/water theme with blue and green.
More on topic, do you have a symbol for an hourglass? If not I'll make one this evening and try it out.
With respect to creature types and flavor in general, I think it's important not to tie things to a particular cultural milieu. When you do Arabian Nights II: Infiniter you want to have just as many Near Eastern tropes to hand out to the other colors, and when you do anything else you want to have things for Yellow. If Innistrad or Lorwyn or Kamigawa or Ice Age were made with Yellow in them, how would you represent it?
Yellow seems skewed towards a style of play that Wizards has noticed most people don't particularly enjoy. What diversity of strategies are within it? How do you make its core style more interactive and exciting to play against?
BRAINSTORMING:
I'll just claim the time theme and make some suggestions: "Yellow" can remove anything over time. "Yellow" has the power to erode.
Tooth of Time
Enchantment
At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice ~ and destroy target artifact.
The idea here would be that in the actual game play this could also serve as a deterrent when there is no artifact in play.
I personally are a strong believer that each color should be able to negatively interact with each permanent type - the way this works out could be anything for all I care.
What about an old abandoned mechanic blue had: Resource binding.
Energy Deprivation
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant nonland permanent
Enchanted permanent has "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice this permanent unless you pay :1mana:."
Those cards tend to benefit the long term and give a sense of patience that I read into the proposed color.
BTW: I'd see life loss in "yellow" before I'd see life gain (not that I wouldn't think both together would be a viable new idea).
What about taking the white 'symmetric' effect further but into another direction: Rather than trying to be 'fair' in symmetry "yellow" would create a global hardship with an understanding that the resilient one deserves to win. In general "yellow" wouldn't destroy everything, but always with a restriction - a reference value of "fitness" to borrow a term from natural selection. Solar Tide's two modes would be "yellow" mechanics under this idea.
REGARDING A SYMBOL:
I always thought a fairly abstract rendition of a hill would work well for desert mana - it could represent a dune or just a small pile of sand depending on the context.
Alternatively the desert twister is fairly easy to visualize and quite different from what other colors get. Similar thematically would be a dust cloud.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
Thinking out loud, and probably not adding anything of substance:
What does the color care about? What is its end goal?
Other colors want to save the world, or rule it, or comprehend it. Yellow sees these goals as based on a fundamental delusion: in order to do any of these things, you have to exist first, but the other colors have failed to prioritize this. Yellow has learned the lesson of the vast, empty desert: survival is its own ideal. The fear of death fills every living thing when oblivion stares it in the face, but Yellow sees it far off in the distance as clearly as it does up close.
What means does the color use to achieve these ends?
Yellow's exaltation of trash into treasure extends to means as well as ends. Planning to live forever, Yellow sees in everything the moment when it might be most ideally suited for that end. Yellow is never flashy, but expends the bare minimum necessary to accomplish its task. It is only profligate with time, which, if spent correctly, is infinite.
What does the color care about? What does the color represent?
Yellow represents patience, caution, thrift, pragmatism, efficiency, cowardice, accumulation and depletion, resourcefulness, desperation, erosion, willingness to endure humiliation, sacrifice of pleasure, preservation, survival, tinkering, preparation, catastrophe, hard-won lessons, hoarding, the right tool for the job.
What does the color despise? What negatively drives the color?
More than any other color, Yellow is negatively driven, by its fear. In everything, Yellow sees a potential disaster.
Why does the color like its allies and hate its enemies?
Yellow appreciate's Black's resourcefulness and willingness to do anything for Number One; but cannot understand its concern with positional status or willingness to let go of its most precious and limited resource.
Yellow appreciates Blue's ability to plan for the long term, and to see the hidden potential in things; but cannot understand its remove from practical concerns in favor of an abstract theoretical realm.
Yellow appreciates White's patience and defensive posture; but cannot understand why it would lay down its life for others.
Yellow appreciates the ability to enjoy "mere life" along with Green, and envies the bountiful life that springs forth from it; but hold's Green's inability to see things for any use other than their "natural" one in contempt. Green and Yellow also believe that the best lessons are taught from long experience, and by the corpses of those who failed to learn them.
More than any other color, Yellow cannot understand Red, which it sees as reckless, if not simply insane.
What is the color’s greatest strength and biggest weakness?
Yellow's greatest strengths are its patience and efficiency. Given time to search for the perfect tool, it will win every battle.
Yellow's greatest weakness is its miserliness. It never expends more of its precious resources than it has to, holding onto useless trinkets long after they are needed, because "they'll come in handy sometime," and delays solving a problem now because it foresees a more efficient solution in the future. Black is greedy, but invests its treasure and enjoys it; Yellow buries its gold beneath the sands, and walks in rags. Nor does Yellow understand the advantages of walking in finery instead of rags. Yellow spends more time setting things up for the perfect opportunity than any other color, but frequently misses opportunities for that very reason.
Yellow can remove enchantments with its wearying cynicism, but is loathe to destroy artifacts, which might be put to some use eventually. Land and creature destruction proceed according to conditions or attrition.
Yellow can deal out -1/-1 counters. Between this and storing resources, evergreen Proliferate in Yellow might make some sense, although anti-Proliferate "feels" more right.
Yellow creatures are at least secondary in: Wither, Provoke, Vigilance, Reach, Regenerate. Priests of Norns plays very much like a Yellow creature.
More than any other color, Yellow will hide it's treasures in trap-filled dungeons; its access to Instant speed comes mostly in Zendikar-style Traps. As Blue counters spells, Yellow counters actions with Traps.
Yellow can recover lands and artifacts from the graveyard, especially to the top of it's library.
Yellow prefers to shuffle things into libraries to destroying or exiling them. It can manipulate libraries on par with Green and mill on par with Blue and Black, though its Milling tends to be symmetrical.
Yellow likes to discard lands as a resource. It can search for lands but not get them into play faster.
Yellow can return its own permanents to hand.
Yellow can prevent loss of life, but never gain life.
I'm not quite sure where I'm going with this. More serious thoughts later, maybe.
Dune Scourer
Creature - Human Wizard
Erode (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. For each damage it would deal to a player, he or she removes the top two cards of his or her library and puts them into his or her graveyard instead.)
During your upkeep, ~ deals 1 damage to you.
Sacrifice ~: Put target artifact card or land card from your graveyard on top of its owner's library.
0/1
Sunsoaked Stretch
Creature - Wall
Defender, Reach
Damage dealt to ~ is dealt to all players instead.
0/2
Wall of Cacti
Creature - Plant Wall
Defender, Persist
When ~ enters the battlefield, if you have 10 or less life, draw a card.
0/2
Illusory Ideal
Sorcery
Put target Enchantment on top of its owner's library.
Draw a card. The mirage is the first lesson of the desert, and the cruelest. Those with room on their backs for hopes but not waterskins soon find themselves unburdened of both.
Priests of Zorn
Creature - Human Cleric
Vigilance, Erode (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. For each damage it would deal to a player, he or she removes the top two cards of his or her library and puts them into his or her graveyard instead.) They ride into the fertile lands each moon, preaching the hard demands of hard gods, and returning in time for the rain dance. The easy faith weakens with each visit.
1/4
Desertification
Sorcery
As an additional cost to play ~, sacrifice a land. Search your library for up to three Deserts and put them into your hand, then shuffle your library.
Hot, Thirsty, and Delirious
Sorcery
Put a -1/-1 counter on each of three target creatures.
Unburied Treasure
Sorcery
Return target artifact card from a graveyard to the battlefield.
@Compleated Phelddragrif
Your description of yellow is more than perfect, it's beautiful. You've expressed what I want yellow to be better than my original post. I really hope everyone reads Compleated Phelddagrif's post as they think about yellow. At least read this part:
Other colors want to save the world, or rule it, or comprehend it. Yellow sees these goals as based on a fundamental delusion: in order to do any of these things, you have to exist first, but the other colors have failed to prioritize this. Yellow has learned the lesson of the vast, empty desert: survival is its own ideal. The fear of death fills every living thing when oblivion stares it in the face, but Yellow sees it far off in the distance as clearly as it does up close.
As for the cards:
I'll be honest, I hate mill. However, I think that's because it's always so darn boring an not effective. If we do this right we might be able to make it work, and it's a great fit to the time/endurance theme.
Dune Scourer looks ok.
Sunsoaked Stretch is very interesting. I like it, but it might be too powerful. Also, what's the flavor?
Wall of Cacti is awesome. This is super flavorful.
Illusory Ideal: Yes!
Priests of Zorn: I really really like the flavor text.
Desertification: I have a card very similar to this. I will post it soon.
Hot, Thirsty, and Delirious Might be too overt and directed perhaps for yellow. This is almost black, which is ok because black and yellow are probably buddies. Can we tweak it?
Unburied Treasure: I like it, but needs a clause saying who gets control of the artifact.
What about an old abandoned mechanic blue had: Resource binding.
Energy Deprivation
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant nonland permanent
Enchanted permanent has "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice this permanent unless you pay :1mana:."
Yes. I quite like this. Resource binding is probably a good idea but I want to make sure not to cross with blue too much. I'd also like to find a way to merge this with the "attrition" and "better suited for hardship" ideas.
I always thought a fairly abstract rendition of a hill would work well for desert mana...
A nondescript hill just really doesn't look very compelling. I actually tried something like that in my first go-round. I welcome people to post mana symbol ideas. Honestly though, I kind of like the one I've got now. I've attached it to the post.
EDIT:
I've added a blank card frame to the original post so everyone can see what it looks like
I don't get this. Should it be "At the beginning of your upkeep you may sacrifice ~ and destroy target artifact?
That is a valid option.
Yes. I quite like this. Resource binding is probably a good idea but I want to make sure not to cross with blue too much. I'd also like to find a way to merge this with the "attrition" and "better suited for hardship" ideas.
Well - blue doesn't get this any more than it gets Prodigal Sorcerer. So it wouldn't cross. An option that comes to ming is obviously another cost like life, but I don't see a reason to close the door to a mana cost.
If anything this is close to white taxing.
A nondescript hill just really doesn't look very compelling. I actually tried something like that in my first go-round. I welcome people to post mana symbol ideas. Honestly though, I kind of like the one I've got now. I've attached it to the post.
You need to add surface structure to make sure it looks like a hill of sand rather than a blot. The most likely mistake to make with a hill is to make an outline but miss that the blue mana symbol already has a light reflection implied.
I have something in mind, but currently not the means to sketch it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
I love the erode mechanic. Much better than infect.
Someone should just make an entirely new color pie that features purple, yellow, and whatever other colors you want to complete it with. It could be for a crazy new planar chaos type set, and in the final block the original 5 colors meet the new 5. Hilarity ensues.
Hey guys, just for funzies I dorked around with making yellow hybrid cards. I thought they look pretty neat so I figured I'd post one. Also using the new mana symbol.
Take a look at the card catalog in the OP while you're here. Any more ideas on mechanics or manifestations of the ones we've already discussed would be great! ^^
Agreed that the second hourglass is better, although I think I like the more abstract Time Spiral logo even more. Regardless of the specifics, an hourglass hits more buttons (sand, time, depletion,) is more immediately recognizable, and more "universal" than any of the options listed thus far. Win for the hourglass.
Additional top-of-head thoughts:
elemental associations: sand, salt, stone, the surface of the ocean, stars and twilight, dryness, radiation, lack of air, permafrost, glare
physically "feels like" in play: putting things on top of or shuffling them into libraries, tapping, removing counters, "you have X turns until," "draw, go"
other categories you could put here: creature types, professions, political ideologies, mental disorders, hypothetical Ravnica guilds
I think you guys are starting off in the wrong direction. Specifically, its all these keywords and action abilities and trying to tie together a theme. Really, what you guys should be doing imo, is just putting together some more 'vanilla' cards that could be used as a core to show us exactly what yellow is all about. Erode, sandwrought and all those counter based cards look like something out of an expansion set. I think it would be much better to first look at what yellow would do in a core set.
"Some of the other guys dared me to go out, but I knew it weren't no ordinary giant giga-blasting blaze of unending flames that would scorch the whole world."
—Norin the Wary
I recently put up a thread with directions to my MSE forum post on how to make custom color frames in MSE. I started on that project to support my development of a yellow color in Magic. Some people showed interest in the yellow color itself, so I thought I'd put up a thread dedicated to that, separately from the thread on custom frames.
Here I reproduce the relevant material from the other thread, edited for clarity. We can continue the discussion here if anyone is interested!
===Description of the color yellow===
MY ORIGINAL DESCRIPTION
Yellow is its own color, just like the other five. Deserts tap for yellow mana, or "Y". The power of the desert comes from the surprisingly resourceful creatures that live there, and from the raw age of the desert sand itself. No land was always a desert. The lingering power of ancient seas and vast forests, now withered into wasteland, mingles with the power of the yellow sand.
Here's my version of a WotC color summary for yellow:
Deserts provide yellow mana. Yellow mana is the magical essence of the timeless sands and the curiously resourceful and resilient creatures who live there. Yellow magic is about patience, endurance, and value found in unexpected places. Where others see barren land, a yellow mage sees untapped potential.
Resilience, patience, respect for the undervalued are the virtues of a yellow mage.
Yellow mages' actions are rarely overt in nature. They create dangerous situations for which they and creatures of the desert are better prepared than their rivals. They instill doubt into the minds of their enemies and undermine their resources. At their best, yellow mages are reliable, penetrating, and respectful. At their worst they are introverted and impotent.
Examples of yellow spells include prolonged drought, devastating sand storms, and the summoning of bursts of insight following long meditation.
Yellow creatures wait to strike until they have an advantage. Weak at first, a yellow creature will attack when the enemy is lost in the desert or suffering prolonged dehydration; situations to which yellow creatures are accustomed. Yellow magic also commands the allegiance of ancient, powerful desert beings such as stone colossi and great sand worms, but only in the right conditions.
FROM COMPLEATED PHELDDAGRIF
===Can and Cannot===
Yellow can
===Card catalogue===
I'll put cards here and update as more become available (ie. as I decide they're good enough to show)
Creatures
Canyon Guardian 1YY
Creature - Colossus/Giant? (U)
~ enters the battlefield tapped.
3/5
Colossus Of Kressa 5YYY
Creature - Sand Golem (R)
Sandwrought 5
Sacrifice a desert: ~ is indestructible until the end of turn.
5/7
Desert Dromidary 2Y
Creature - Camel (C)
Vigilance
1/4
Draining Elemental YYY
Creature - Elemental (R)
At the beginning of your upkeep, put a +1/+1 counter on ~. Then each player with life total less than the number of +1/+1 counters on ~ loses the game.
1/1
Dune Stinger 1Y
Creature - Scorpion (C)
Deathtouch
1/2
Forgotten Guardian 3YY
Creature - Sand Golem
[I]It wanders the desert, searching for what it was meant to protect.[/I]
3/4
Glintshell Scarab 1Y
Creature - Insect (C)
Flying
Whenever ~ comes into play, leaves play, attacks, or blocks, target player puts the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
[I]All who have pursued it recall the piercing glint of sun from its golden shell. All who have pursued it have gone mad.[/I]
Hamada Mime Y
Creature - Sand Mime
Desertwalk.
Protection from Yellow.
1/1
Rasaha Camel Y
Creature - Camel
Prevent all noncombat damage that would be dealt to ~.
[I]"Their world is a harsh one, yet they prevail, so must we." -Alia, Nomad Captain[/I]
1/1
Sand Sage 1YY
Creature - Human Mystic (R)
At the end of your turn, if you have no cards in hand, draw a card.
1/1
Shah's Assassin 2YY
Creature - Human Assassin (U)
Whenever ~ would deal damage to a player you may sacrifice ~. If you do, double the damage dealt.
2/2
Stalking Buzzard 1Y
Creature - Bird (C)
Flying
Whenever a creature dies you may gain 1 life.
[I]Why do they call it a wasteland? Nothing is wasted by the resourceful creatures of the Enud-Sabah.[/I]
1/1
Sunsoaked Stretch 1Y
Creature - Wall
Defender, Reach
Damage dealt to ~ is dealt to all players instead.
0/2
Wall of Cacti 2Y
Creature - Plant
Defender, persist.
When ~ enters the battlefield, if you have 10 or less life, draw a card.
1/2
Weathered Wayfarer Y
Creature - Human Nomad
[I]I have learned to survive the desert, and that provides me a liveliness no man can can strip from me.[/I]
1/2
Sorcery
Attrition 2Y
Sorcery (C)
Target player sacrifices a permanent.
Cartographic Expedition
Sorcery (C)
Suspend 3 - 1Y
Search your library for up to two basic lands and put them into your hand. Shuffle your library.
Creeping Sands 1YY
Sorcery (U)
Replace target land with target desert you control. If that land was under another player's control, that play now gains control of the desert.
Desert Twister 4YY
Sorcery (U)
Destroy target permanent.
Expanding Boarders 2Y
Sorcery
As an additional cost to play ~ sacrifice a land. Search your library for up to three deserts, reveal them, and put them into your hand. Shuffle your library.
Illusory Ideal 2Y
Sorcery (C)
Put target enchantment on top of its owner's library.
Draw a card.
[I]The mirage is the first lesson of the desert, and the cruelest. Those with room on their backs for hopes but not waterskins are soon unburdened of both.[/I]
Parch the Throats 1Y
Sorcery (C)
During each player's next untap step, that player's creatures do not untap.
Parch the Trenches 1Y
Sorcery (U)
During each player's next untap step, that player's lands do not untap.
Re-Exist 3Y
Sorcery (C)
Until end of turn, any creature that would go to its owner's graveyard instead goes to the top of its owner's library.
Revealed Worth 1Y
Sorcery (C)
Sacrifice an artifact. Then search your library for another artifact with casting cost 1 greater than the one you sacrificed, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Shuffle your library.
[I]Look beyond this object's coarse trappings and envision what it is yet to become.[/I]
Sand Storm 1Y
Sorcery (U)
For each creature ~ deals 2 damage to that creature unless its controller pays 1 life.
Unburied Treasure 2 Y
Sorcery
Return target artifact card from a graveyard to the battlefield under your control.
Enchantments
Altered Domain 3YY
Enchantment
When ~ enters the battlefield gain control of up to 2 target lands target opponent controls, then that opponent gains control of that many deserts you control.
Cross the Nefud 2YY
Enchantment (U)
Vanishing 2
When ~ comes into play tap any number of untapped creatures you control. They do not untap during their controller's untap step.
When the last time counter is removed from ~, untap all creatures tapped by ~. They are unblockable this turn.
Curiosity Shop 2Y
Enchantment (R)
1Y: All players place a card from their hand face down under Curiosity Shop.
2: Take a random card from under Curiosity Shop and put it into your hand. Any player may play this ability.
If Curiosity Shop leaves play exile all cards underneath it.
Desolation 2Y
Enchantment (U)
Upkeep: Y
During each player's upkeep that player sacrifices a land.
Endless Conversation 2YY
Enchantment (R)
Vanishing 3
Players skip their draw steps.
Discard a card: Add a time counter to ~.
Energy Deprivation Y
Enchantment -Aura (C)
Enchant nonland permanent.
Enchanted permanent has "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice this permanent unless you pay 1."
Four-and-Forty Years of Exile 3Y
Enchantment - Curse
Enchant Player
Vanishing 10
At the beginning of ~'s controller's upkeep, that player loses one life.
When there are no more time counters on ~, enchanted player loses 20 life.
Lost 1Y
Enchantment - Aura
Flash
Enchant creature that entered the battlefield this turn.
Enchanted creature does not untap during its controller's untap step.
Patient Study 1Y
Enchantment (C)
Vanishing 1
When the last time counter is removed from ~ draw 2 cards.
[I]Above all else the <tribe> value time, and the insight found therein.
Sand Box 2Y
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant land you control
When this enters the battlefield, exile the top 3 cards of your library face-down underneath the enchanted land.
{3}, {T}: Look at the cards underneath enchanted land. Put one of them into your hand and return the rest face-down underneath the land.
Thirst Y
Enchantment - Aura
Enchanted creature has "At the beginning of your end step put a -1/-1 counter on ~."
Tooth of Time Y
Enchantment
At the beginning of your upkeep sacrifice ~ and put target artifact on the bottom of its owner's library.
Treachery (v2) 3Y
Enchantment (U)
When ~ comes into play search target opponent's library for a creature card and exile it face down. You may look at it at any time. Whenever a creature attacks you may reveal the exiled card and sacrifice ~. If you do, gain control of target creature with the same name as the exiled card.
(This has too much rules text. Help?)
Water Shortage 2YY
Enchantment(U)
When ~ comes into play put a water counter on each creature. During each player's upkeep, that player removes a water counter from a creature he or she controls.
Creatures without water counters do not untap during their controller's untap step.
When there are no water counters in play, sacrifice ~.
(This card has already been discussed in another thread. I only posted it here to indicate the flavor of yellow)
Instants
Consolidated Resources 1Y
Instant (R)
Play ~ only during your upkeep.
End the turn. After your next turn, take an additional turn.
Long Meditation 2YY
Instant (U)
End the turn. Play this ability only during your upkeep.
At the beginning of your next upkeep, draw three cards.
Persist Y
Instant
Target creature is indestructible this turn.
[I]"There is no world beyond, no mercy for the perished. Stand firm and fight another day or return to the soil your ancestors rose from!" -Ikari battle hymn[/I]
Stifling Heat Y
Instant (U)
Attacking creatures get -2/-0 until end of turn.
[I]The city walls of Soara are supposed to fend off sand storms, not armies. The great desert is enough to keep outsiders away.[/I]
Artifacts
Big Constructed Colossus Thingy 4Y
Artifact Creature - Colossus
Protection from red
[I]The king asked Watto to build a statue worthy of the great desert colossi. Watto took the king's request to heart.[/I]
2/5
Djinn's Forgotten Lamp 3Y
Artifact (R)
T: If there is a memory counter on you, remove it, exile Djinn's Forgotten Lamp, and put a 6/6 flying yellow Djinn creature into play under your control. Otherwise, put a memory counter on you and shuffle Djinn's Forgotten Lamp into your library.
Land
Desert's Edge
Legendary Land
T: Add Y to your mana pool. Desert’s Edge deals 1 damage to you.
1 Y, T: Put target sand card from your graveyard on top of your library.
[I]"There is nothing in the desert. What do you think lies at its edge?"[/I]
Dune Sea
Land (C)
T: Put a sand counter on ~. You lose 1 life.
T, Remove X sand counters from ~: add Y to your mana pool for each sand counter removed.
Sun's Anvil
Land
~ comes into play tapped.
T: Add Y to your mana pool.
Whenever a creature attacks, its controller loses 1 life.
[I]"This is the Sun's Anvil. It is the worst place in Creation."[/I]
===Relevant discussion from the card frame thread===
Tutorials
From the flavor color summary, it lists yellow mages as "rarely overt in nature. They create dangerous situations for which they and creatures of the desert are better prepared than their rivals." I'm trying to think of some mechanics that could duplicate this flavor-wise but I'm drawing a blank right now. Preparation to me denotes card draw in some form or fashion, or possibly a variation on morph. Obviously we'd want to use something new, as opposed to re-appropriating older keywords. Of course, it's at the end of a work-day as well, so I'm having a hard time thinking of something, but I'll let it swill around in my head tomorrow and see if I can come up with something.
"Examples of yellow spells include prolonged drought, devastating sand storms, and the summoning of bursts of insight following long meditation."
As far as older, desert-themed cards that might make the jump (flavor-wise but different name, obviously) Desert Twister seems like an obvious candidate. The name would have to be changed but nothing else captures the flavor of the desert like that card. It's an odd fit for green, as it was designed near the beginning of MTG, and would make sense making the jump to yellow.
What about tribes? Off the top of my head, these could work: Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels, Elephants, Giants, Sand Wurms and Colossi as you stated... Not sure what else. I might have to study up on some desert-type lore. Djinn, Snakes, Scorpions, Camels and Elephants don't exactly see a ton of cards nowadays, so switching them to yellow would have a minimal impact. Meanwhile, Giants have been printed in every color, so that's an easy inclusion. Sand Wurms and Colossi would be new as well, so that would be easy. On the plus side: when Colossus/Colossi gets added as a new subtype, a bunch of existing Colossi (in name) would make the jump to the new creature type.
Last note: there needs to be a functional reprint of Desert Nomads, but this time in yellow. Perhaps Desert Wanderers?
"... and exile it face down. You may look at it at any time. Whenever... "
I think the last clause, the return to library clause, can be removed.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
Agreed.
I don't know about something new. Here is something old:
Desert Mime
Creature - Sand Mime
Protection from red
1/1
+ Earthquake
You would colorshift the idea and extrapolate from it, but I always considered it neat and it fits the bolded part.
Basically go to magiccards.info and use the search terms "Desert", "Sand" and "Dune" and you get a basic idea of what is resonant with the people.
I think expanding on the "time" theme metaphorically connected to "sand" could be nice. I don't suggest copying blue's theme, but maybe streamlining mechanics touched upon by Time Spiral.
Even if it's just something as simple as "~ enters the battlefield tapped." to show the slow eventuality of the creatures.
(BTW: I'm not sold on vanishing as an evergreen mechanic despite this. Just for context.)
There are several not yet mentioned easy outs: I'm sure you can imagine some desert Birds (Vulture), hound (Jackal) and Insects (Scarab, Antlion); Hyena and Lizard/Viashino as well. Mythical creatures I could envision are Rocs (Birds as well, obv). Desert could pick up on some old creature types that have fallen from grace: Orc or Cockatrice perhaps?
The class type Nomad comes to mind, but classes are usually quite spreadable.
There is some difficulty not to step on white's toes too much - thinking of Savannah Lions here.
I hope you separated Sand and Wurm. I don't think introducing Sandwurm in addition to Wurm would be the proper choice - colors can share creature types. And Sand is just nice and wacky and can be the "yellow" Saproling.
Colossi up to now are Golem, Giant or Beast. There is really no definition of the term that I can think of that would convince me to add the type rather than use the existing types. With Giants already suggested for "yellow" Colossus sounds just so... redundant.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
As SecretInfiltrator and Bob Arctor have already implicitly suggested, our first goal should be to figure out what mechanics are consistent with the advertised flavor. Basically, "what can yellow do and not do?"
Here are things yellow cannot do
Here are things yellow can do
As an example of the importance of time for yellow, let me present...
Djinn's Forgotten Lamp 3Y
Artifact (R)
T: If there is a memory counter on you, remove it, exile Djinn's Forgotten Lamp, and put a 6/6 flying yellow Djinn creature into play under your control. Otherwise, put a memory counter on you and shuffle Djinn's Forgotten Lamp into your library.
I would appreciate help developing this mechanic.
Other notes
SecretInfiltrator, I like the idea of creatures coming into play tapped. It fits the flavor. I also like Bob Arctor's idea of a morph-like mechanic. Unfortunately, I really don't like morph itself. Perhaps we can work with this...
In the realm of tribes I have the following so far: scarab, lizard, colossus (probably should just be golem), scorpion, camel and horse (possibly using mount), wurm, djinn, snake.
For classes I have assassin, nomad, pirate (yep!), merchant, dancer, philosopher.
I'm glad that someone brought up the idea of "sand". Sand is a subtype that can appear on any creature that is "of the desert." For example we have Shai-Hulud which is a "Creature - Sand Wurm". Sand does two things:
This is very much like "modular" but I'm hoping it will actually be useful and fun. It's also very much in the flavor, methinks.
EDIT: @Rising_Star, if you look at the custom card frame thread you can see what I have for the mana symbol. I like your idea of an hourglass. I worry that an hourglass mana symbol would lock yellow into the time theme more than I actually want, pushing other themes out of the way. However, the idea is so compelling that I'm going to draft something.
Tutorials
Yeah, it's true. I was just thinking about white's symbol and the more I do the less I like it :\
As for red, meh, it's ok. It does fit the fire/earth/water theme with blue and green.
More on topic, do you have a symbol for an hourglass? If not I'll make one this evening and try it out.
Tutorials
Yellow seems skewed towards a style of play that Wizards has noticed most people don't particularly enjoy. What diversity of strategies are within it? How do you make its core style more interactive and exciting to play against?
I'll just claim the time theme and make some suggestions: "Yellow" can remove anything over time. "Yellow" has the power to erode.
Enchantment
At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice ~ and destroy target artifact.
I personally are a strong believer that each color should be able to negatively interact with each permanent type - the way this works out could be anything for all I care.
What about an old abandoned mechanic blue had: Resource binding.
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant nonland permanent
Enchanted permanent has "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice this permanent unless you pay :1mana:."
BTW: I'd see life loss in "yellow" before I'd see life gain (not that I wouldn't think both together would be a viable new idea).
What about taking the white 'symmetric' effect further but into another direction: Rather than trying to be 'fair' in symmetry "yellow" would create a global hardship with an understanding that the resilient one deserves to win. In general "yellow" wouldn't destroy everything, but always with a restriction - a reference value of "fitness" to borrow a term from natural selection.
Solar Tide's two modes would be "yellow" mechanics under this idea.
REGARDING A SYMBOL:
I always thought a fairly abstract rendition of a hill would work well for desert mana - it could represent a dune or just a small pile of sand depending on the context.
Alternatively the desert twister is fairly easy to visualize and quite different from what other colors get. Similar thematically would be a dust cloud.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
What does the color care about? What is its end goal?
Other colors want to save the world, or rule it, or comprehend it. Yellow sees these goals as based on a fundamental delusion: in order to do any of these things, you have to exist first, but the other colors have failed to prioritize this. Yellow has learned the lesson of the vast, empty desert: survival is its own ideal. The fear of death fills every living thing when oblivion stares it in the face, but Yellow sees it far off in the distance as clearly as it does up close.
What means does the color use to achieve these ends?
Yellow's exaltation of trash into treasure extends to means as well as ends. Planning to live forever, Yellow sees in everything the moment when it might be most ideally suited for that end. Yellow is never flashy, but expends the bare minimum necessary to accomplish its task. It is only profligate with time, which, if spent correctly, is infinite.
What does the color care about? What does the color represent?
Yellow represents patience, caution, thrift, pragmatism, efficiency, cowardice, accumulation and depletion, resourcefulness, desperation, erosion, willingness to endure humiliation, sacrifice of pleasure, preservation, survival, tinkering, preparation, catastrophe, hard-won lessons, hoarding, the right tool for the job.
What does the color despise? What negatively drives the color?
More than any other color, Yellow is negatively driven, by its fear. In everything, Yellow sees a potential disaster.
Why does the color like its allies and hate its enemies?
Yellow appreciate's Black's resourcefulness and willingness to do anything for Number One; but cannot understand its concern with positional status or willingness to let go of its most precious and limited resource.
Yellow appreciates Blue's ability to plan for the long term, and to see the hidden potential in things; but cannot understand its remove from practical concerns in favor of an abstract theoretical realm.
Yellow appreciates White's patience and defensive posture; but cannot understand why it would lay down its life for others.
Yellow appreciates the ability to enjoy "mere life" along with Green, and envies the bountiful life that springs forth from it; but hold's Green's inability to see things for any use other than their "natural" one in contempt. Green and Yellow also believe that the best lessons are taught from long experience, and by the corpses of those who failed to learn them.
More than any other color, Yellow cannot understand Red, which it sees as reckless, if not simply insane.
What is the color’s greatest strength and biggest weakness?
Yellow's greatest strengths are its patience and efficiency. Given time to search for the perfect tool, it will win every battle.
Yellow's greatest weakness is its miserliness. It never expends more of its precious resources than it has to, holding onto useless trinkets long after they are needed, because "they'll come in handy sometime," and delays solving a problem now because it foresees a more efficient solution in the future. Black is greedy, but invests its treasure and enjoys it; Yellow buries its gold beneath the sands, and walks in rags. Nor does Yellow understand the advantages of walking in finery instead of rags. Yellow spends more time setting things up for the perfect opportunity than any other color, but frequently misses opportunities for that very reason.
Dune Scourer
Creature - Human Wizard
Erode (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. For each damage it would deal to a player, he or she removes the top two cards of his or her library and puts them into his or her graveyard instead.)
During your upkeep, ~ deals 1 damage to you.
Sacrifice ~: Put target artifact card or land card from your graveyard on top of its owner's library.
0/1
Sunsoaked Stretch
Creature - Wall
Defender, Reach
Damage dealt to ~ is dealt to all players instead.
0/2
Wall of Cacti
Creature - Plant Wall
Defender, Persist
When ~ enters the battlefield, if you have 10 or less life, draw a card.
0/2
Illusory Ideal
Sorcery
Put target Enchantment on top of its owner's library.
Draw a card.
The mirage is the first lesson of the desert, and the cruelest. Those with room on their backs for hopes but not waterskins soon find themselves unburdened of both.
Priests of Zorn
Creature - Human Cleric
Vigilance, Erode (This creature deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters. For each damage it would deal to a player, he or she removes the top two cards of his or her library and puts them into his or her graveyard instead.)
They ride into the fertile lands each moon, preaching the hard demands of hard gods, and returning in time for the rain dance. The easy faith weakens with each visit.
1/4
Desertification
Sorcery
As an additional cost to play ~, sacrifice a land. Search your library for up to three Deserts and put them into your hand, then shuffle your library.
Hot, Thirsty, and Delirious
Sorcery
Put a -1/-1 counter on each of three target creatures.
Unburied Treasure
Sorcery
Return target artifact card from a graveyard to the battlefield.
Your description of yellow is more than perfect, it's beautiful. You've expressed what I want yellow to be better than my original post. I really hope everyone reads Compleated Phelddagrif's post as they think about yellow. At least read this part:
As for the cards:
I'll be honest, I hate mill. However, I think that's because it's always so darn boring an not effective. If we do this right we might be able to make it work, and it's a great fit to the time/endurance theme.
Dune Scourer looks ok.
Sunsoaked Stretch is very interesting. I like it, but it might be too powerful. Also, what's the flavor?
Wall of Cacti is awesome. This is super flavorful.
Illusory Ideal: Yes!
Priests of Zorn: I really really like the flavor text.
Desertification: I have a card very similar to this. I will post it soon.
Hot, Thirsty, and Delirious Might be too overt and directed perhaps for yellow. This is almost black, which is ok because black and yellow are probably buddies. Can we tweak it?
Unburied Treasure: I like it, but needs a clause saying who gets control of the artifact.
I don't get this. Should it be "At the beginning of your upkeep you may sacrifice ~ and destroy target artifact?
Yes. I quite like this. Resource binding is probably a good idea but I want to make sure not to cross with blue too much. I'd also like to find a way to merge this with the "attrition" and "better suited for hardship" ideas.
A nondescript hill just really doesn't look very compelling. I actually tried something like that in my first go-round. I welcome people to post mana symbol ideas. Honestly though, I kind of like the one I've got now. I've attached it to the post.
EDIT:
I've added a blank card frame to the original post so everyone can see what it looks like
Tutorials
That is a valid option.
Well - blue doesn't get this any more than it gets Prodigal Sorcerer. So it wouldn't cross. An option that comes to ming is obviously another cost like life, but I don't see a reason to close the door to a mana cost.
If anything this is close to white taxing.
You need to add surface structure to make sure it looks like a hill of sand rather than a blot. The most likely mistake to make with a hill is to make an outline but miss that the blue mana symbol already has a light reflection implied.
I have something in mind, but currently not the means to sketch it.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
Yeah, you're right. Ok, let's adopt this then. Yellow can bind resources (mana).
Should I collect these "yellow can ..." and "yellow cannot ..." into the original post to keep track?
Tutorials
Someone should just make an entirely new color pie that features purple, yellow, and whatever other colors you want to complete it with. It could be for a crazy new planar chaos type set, and in the final block the original 5 colors meet the new 5. Hilarity ensues.
Thanks for all the enthusiasm guys! This is so much fun.
Tutorials
Lyzolda, the Blood Witch | Maga, Traitor to Mortals | Mayael the Anima | Rafiq of the Many | Rhys the Redeemed
Sasaya, Oorochi Ascendant | Sygg, River Cutthroat | Thada Adel, Acquisitor | Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
(attached)
EDIT: Added a slightly different version
Tutorials
Take a look at the card catalog in the OP while you're here. Any more ideas on mechanics or manifestations of the ones we've already discussed would be great! ^^
Tutorials
Desert Island
Land - desert island (r)
Desert needs Abu duals, right?
Lyzolda, the Blood Witch | Maga, Traitor to Mortals | Mayael the Anima | Rafiq of the Many | Rhys the Redeemed
Sasaya, Oorochi Ascendant | Sygg, River Cutthroat | Thada Adel, Acquisitor | Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Additional top-of-head thoughts:
Cockatrice Username: seriph0
Desert forests are going to feel a little conflicted, if you ask me
Karador EDH
Comments on decks welcome: http://tappedout.net/users/AradonTemplar/
Currently developing Set 1 of 3, 'Shadow': http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=436885