What is Vial Affinity? Vial Affinity is Legacy's version of Affinity, it is an aggro/combo deck that gets it's power from all the synergistic cards that it plays allowing for fast kills with the various artifacts and artifact creatures it employs. Cards were banned in it's days of Standard play due to it's power, other anti-synergistic cards were added crippling the decks overall capabilities. Just as of late Affinity has seen a surge in play due to a new addition to the deck in the form of Master of Etherium, and it not being hated out as much because people just don't expect to see it anymore.
If you are interested in making a tournament deck out of this be warned, our combo match up is horrible. If you see a lot of combo in your meta or expect to see an abundance of it where your planning on playing, do not bring Affinity. We normally cannot race the speed of combo. The quickest we can combo/kill is 3rd turn. ANT, TES, Dredge, Belcher, Elfball, can all combo/kill on 1st or 2nd turn and we have no way to stop this maindeck. SB we have options but after losing game 1 you better draw the nuts or scoop. The best meta situation for this deck is Aggro/Heavy Control. We can simply play through control, Vial laughs at it, and we will always have more and bigger creatures than them. Aggro we normally always push through unless they gain a strong foothold then we can have problems but, with Cranial Plating/Arcbound Ravager tricks we can usually prevail.
The latest take on Vial Affinity has not seen play in a large number of 30+ player tournaments. Mainly due to combo and the players fear of crapping out early playing Affinity but also, people have not picked up the power of Master quite yet, for he can reign over Dreadnought's. This deck is played a lot though by people who are new to Legacy and usually in smaller tournaments. Every once in a while we'll see a gem take 1st or 2nd in a large field and it gives us all a little hope for this deck. Here is my take on the latest Affinity tek and some other proven builds.
Ornithopter- This guy gets the deck rolling. A free 0/2 flying Cranial Plating and Modular counter target that adds to the affinity count and can be saced to Arcbound Ravager is amazing! This guy wins games.
Frogmite- Alomst always a 2/2 for 0 mana, rarely will you have to pay to drop him but if you do it's usually 1-2 mana, adds to affinity count and can be saced to Ravager.
Myr Enforcer- Any artifact you dropped makes this guy 1 cheaper. A 4/4 for 0 mana is amazing. More often than not though you will have to pay 2-3 mana to drop him, but still a 4/4 for that cheap is worth the investment. Adds to affinity and can be saced to Ravager.
Arcbound Worker- Often a overlooked and underrated card. He may be a 1/1 on the board but through Ravager and Modular he's basically a 2/2 for 1 mana. He can get some quick damage in early and block beaters willingly. Adds to affinity early on but we normally lose them later in the game due to blocking or sacing.
Arcbound Ravager- One of the MVP's of this deck (the deck is half named after him). With Vial his 2cc is nothing and without it... it's 2 mana. This guy can get big FAST. The ability to sac our board before a board sweeper resolves to pump Ravager or sacing all with a Disciple of the vault on board ftw is great. Is an immediate threat when it resolves, adds to affinity, and can be saced to itself. Watch out for Stifle effects when sacing as you can lose your board for nothing.
Master of Etherium- For such a long time artifacts have needed a Lord and we finally got one. I only play him through Vial to make sure he hits the board, I have hardcast him though and his 3cc is not too bad for this deck. Often hits the board from anywhere between a 4/4 to 6/6 for 3 mana or free through Vial, gives all your artifact creatures +1/+1 and is a walking Cranial Plating (Thank you Wizards!). This guy towers over Phyrexian Dreadnought's, Terravore's, and Goyf's mean nothing to him. He's an auto 4 of in any build.
Disciple of the Vault- Disciple + Ravager = gg, most of the time. Once you get your oppenents life low enough and you have enough artifacts in play to to sac equaling up to their life total you win (example: they have 12 life, if you have 12 artifacts in play you can sac 12 artifacts and they will lose 12 life). NEVER run an affinity build without Disciple + Ravager combo... EVER. He makes a great Springleaf Drum or Plating target, and can just get a little damage through time to time.
Aether Vial- One of my favorite cards in this deck. Dropping this 1st turn unasnwered can win games by itself. The raw power of dropping free threats every turn that your oppoenent can't counter is sick. It's one of the reasons why our control match up is as good as it is. It's a mana producer and affinity helper all for 1 mana, extras can be saced to Ravager.
Springleaf Drum- The next best thing to Vial. Mana producer/color fixer, adds to affinity, makes a turn 1 Thopter a Birds of Paradise with haste for 0 mana. Really does allow for some sick turn 1 plays.
Chromatic Star- The next best thing to Drum. This is more mana fixer + draw than it is a mana producer. Adds to affinity early on and an easy sac to ravager for draw late game. Nice when you have no Thoughtcast and need to draw.
Cranial Plating- Another MVP of the deck, auto 4 of, and a card you love to see in multiples. Makes any creature as strong as M.o.E. basically. Your most common target for this is Thopter so you can fly in ftw. Also is just great to equip for blocking purposes to take out huge creatures. It's 2nd ability does not come in as handy as it used to but still wins games, moving it to an unblocked creature before damage goes on the stack.
Thoughtcast- At the moment is our best drawing card we have, it's 2/3 an Ancestral Recall. We empty our hand so fast and with it's synergy for the deck it's a deffinent inclusion. I have dropped the number down to 3 in my build for 2 reasons: 1. Playing Thoughtcast 3rd turn looking for more threats and drawing into 1-2 more Thoughtcast - it defeats the purpose of using it in the first place to not draw 2 threats, 2. Just drawing 2 or more in your opening hand makes you mulligan - we need to spend turns playing threats and not "trying" to draw them out of the deck.
Seat of the Synod, Vault of Whispers, Tree of Tales- Color of course but, these are Artifact lands. For each Art. land you have in play, your affinity spells cost 1 mana less to play, and you can use the land for mana as well basically netting you 2 mana for the 1 land. So they play a very important role for the deck. Also they are fuel to make M.o.E. bigger, each land you play gives him +1/+1.
Darksteel Citadel- 1. It's an artifact land. 2. It's Indestructible. People please watch out for Wasteland. Against one of my control decks, if you play anything but a Citadel turn 1, it's getting hit with Wasteland my first turn. This land can screw with gameplans and throw people off who are using LD tactics and will most likely SB them out game 2 due to thought of them being dead again. Even though it doesn't produce color it's indestructability makes up for it when you face a Pernicious Deed, or Landstill with Crucible of Worlds and Wasteland in play.
Glimmervoid- Color fixer.... that's about it. Do not not play more than 2 of these (3 is pushing the limit). In multiples they are bad, only giving us 1 mana, dropping it and a *1cc artifact* 1st turn then we lose said artifact = we lose Void. We have other options of color fixing in this deck so do not go overboard on these, artifact lands are needed more.
City of Brass- Another color fixer and the other option to Void. It still only gives us 1 mana but stays in play even when no artifacts are. The only real question you need to ask is, do you care about your life total? The cost of 1 life for 1 color you need is really not that bad but can get expensive if you are getting pinged by some creature.
Chalice of the Void- One of our main cards against combo. It does create some anti-synergy to the deck but what it does for us against combo is worth it considering what we would take out for it. Often dropped @ 0 or @ 1 both numbers hurt almost any combo deck like ANT or Elfball. Also stops Cashseize/Duress/Brainstorm, Nimble Mongoose, etc.
Ethersworn Canonist- Another option to combo. It can be dropped 2nd turn against combo practically crushing their ability to combo off 2nd turn and on(hopefully), giving us a window to strike ftw.
Tormod's Crypt- If you don't have Dredge in your meta (or any deck that doesn't abuse the graveyard somehow), you are one lucky dog, for the rest of us there's Crypt. I greatly prefer Crytp to Relic of Progenitus. Mana cost is a real big issue here. Some will say,"But it only cost one and you get to draw.". We draw cards aleady from Thoughtcast, and as for synergy towards the deck the 0cc Crypt does the job better crippling gy based decks for free. It also helps out agianst Threshold decks and most decks using Tarmogoyf.
Pithing Needle- GREAT against Wasteland, Mishra's Factory, Scepter, Belcher, Deed, Explosives, any Planeswalker, etc.. It shuts down quite a few cards that hate us out but it also slows us down a little, but the advantage we gain in shutting down some of there play tactics is a huge help.
Duress/Thoughtseize- Is an option for combo and control decks. It does the job but not as good as it used to, imo, it has pretty much been replaced by Chalice but still a very solid option to use.
Cabal Therapy- Another useful discard. If you know what your playing against you have a clue of what to name, if you missed with it just sac a Worker move a counter and name the card you know is in there hand.
Smother- Great card for Nought, Goyf, Serra Avenger, Werebear, a good chunk of Slivers, etc.. But it's really not needed because our creatures can get huge and block or overwhelm most of it all.
Swords to Plowshares- Great creature removal because we don't really care about their life total since our creatures can get big, just keep swinging, and sac to make them lose life. But then it's also not really needed for the exact same reasons because we can usually hold off most big creatures.
Thorn of Amethyst- Another option that combo and control really hate. It's downside is the 2cc and it makes our stuff more expensive as well like 1U for Thoughtcast or 3cc for Plating.
Umezawa's Jitte- Not a replacement for Plating but can be a good card none the less. Equip it to a Thopter with a modular counter on it or anything you can hit them with. It's also really not needed because Plating is just plain better.
Engineered Plague- Great against Tribal decks (elfes, goblins, kithkin, etc.) but has seen a little less play as of late due to Lords and us upgrading our creature base with M.o.E. and filling out to 4 Enforcer.
Shrapnel Blast- I miss playing this card but is no longer really any good but, it still can see play in a few builds specifically designed to run it but, too many times has it sat in my hand doing nothing and I wished it was a creature. It's not an artifact, forces us to sac artifacts, no longer follows the color of the deck. Playable yes and will do 5 damage sure but, another beater is just so much better.
Soul's Fire/Fling/Berserk- Same as above but worse. Playing a threat just to sac it is not a good idea and goes against what the deck is trying to do.
Somber Hoverguard- True with proper affinity he's free but for what he is he's expensive and not an artifact.
Blue Elemental Blast/Red Elemental Blast- Though they do serve a purpose and can be helpful in some situations, I would rather drop another threat and have them worrying about me instead of holding mana back or using it for something besides a threat.
Stifle- Read above. We can not not play cards that put us in the role of playing control. We are Aggro/Combo.
Atog- Is not a substitute for Ravager, not even close. Is off color for the direction the deck is taking, is not an artifact.
Tarmogoyf- In most builds he can hit the board as a 4/5-6/7 and color fits but, is not an artifact, and most of our other creatures get bigger than Goyf as it stands now, so he is really not needed.
Dark Confidant- 1 question. Do you know what it's like to draw an Enforcer/Thoughtcast with Bob? Answer. It's painfull. And when the games over you'll take them out, trust me.
Salvage Titan- A 6/4 for free is not bad at all but, when you think about the meta you are using 4 cards (Titan and the 3 artifacts you sac) wich can easily be countered (Force of Will + fodder for it) and it counts as a huge card disadvantage for you. Usually netting you a 4/2 card loss in their favor. Even if it hits the board and it gets destroyed that can often be a 4/1 disadvantage in their favor.
Etherium Sculptor- This guy does way too little way too late for his 2cc. Maybe in some casual builds but for a competitive deck it only slows us down.
Meddling Mage- Love the card but not an artifact, slightly off color, and we never want to attack with it wich defeats the purpose of aggro.
Epochrasite- Too expensive for what he is, takes too long for him to reach his potential and is not always guaranteed to do so.
Goblin Welder- Is not an artifact, has summoning sickness so his ability can't be used right away, and has requirements for the ability to be used, also off color.
Blinkmoth Nexus- Really is a great card and a personal decision wether or not to run them. Nexus has many uses. Acts as a Thopter so Plating tricks and Modular counters can work the same way. But lately it seems like it's just not as good as it used to be and we usually do fine with Thopter or Worker slipping in with Plating.
These are just some typical plays you'll see and kind of how to deal with them. I know there are more but these are just some examples of how the deck works.
E1. Turn 1: Drop artifact land and play Springleaf Drum, then play Ornithopter, tap Drum to tap Thopter for 1 mana of any color to play Aether Vial (4 artifacts), play Frogmite (5 artifacts).
Turn 2: Vial set @ 1, drop artifact land (6 artifacts). Tap Vial to drop Arcbound Worker (7 artifacts). Pay 2 for Plating (8 artifacts). Tap drum to tap either Thopter or Frogmite to equip Plating to the other one and swing for 8-10.
Turn 3: Vial set @ 2, drop art land if possible (8-9 arts), Tap Vial to drop Ravager (9-10 arts), tap land or drum to tap Ravager for B and play DotV, swing and sac ftw.
E2. Turn 1: Drop artifact land and play Springleaf Drum, then play Ornithopter (that's 3 arts). Tap the Drum to tap Thopter for 1 moac to pay for a 1cc Frogmite (4 arts). Then proceed to play any other Frogmite's you have in your hand for free (4-5 arts).
Turn 2: Drop artifact land (5-6 arts), tap drum to tap Thopter for 1 moac and tap land to pay 1-2 mana for a Myr Enforcer (6-7 arts) or, tap Frogmite with Drum and land to drop Plating (6-7 arts) and use your extra land to equip it to Thopter or Frogmite and Swing to do 6-9 damage.
Turn3: Drop artifact land if possible (6-8 arts), 2 for Ravager (7-9 arts) and 1 for DotV or 3 for M.o.E (7-9 arts). Either swing and sac ftw or swing and kill on turn 4.
E3. Turn 1: Drop art land and play Aether Vial (2 arts), play Thopter (3 arts).
Turn 2: Vial set @ 1, drop art land (4 arts), drop any Frog's you have (5-6 arts), tap Vial to drop Worker (6-7 arts), play Enforcer for 0-1 mana (7-8 arts), pay 2 for Plating or wait unil 3rd turn for that and play Thoughtcast instead.
Turn 3: Vial set @ 2, drop art land (8-9 arts), pay 2 for Plating (9-10 arts), pay 1 to equip to creature you think or you know can get through, tap Vial to drop Ravager (10-11 arts), swing.
Turn 4: Vial set @ 3, Drop art land if possible (10-12 arts), tap Vial to drop M.o.E. (11-13 arts), pay 1 for Thoughtcast now if you did not on 2nd, you have 2-3 mana left to play anything you can or drew, then swing usually ftw.
Our typical game plan is to bury the board in creatures, beat face, and usually sac to Ravager ftw. These are just some typical MU's you'll see and sort of how to deal with them and what to watch out for.
Good - Threshold Variants - Pre board - We have them outclassed creature wise. Drop a Vial and get it to stick. With Vial and playing threats from our hand they normally can not keep up with the amount of stuff that we drop. Some builds can slow you down a little with Swords, Fire/Ice, I've even seen Deed MB, but just keep swinging.
Post board - They "can" bring in Grip's, Smash to Smithereens, Shattering Spree, it can get a little rough but stick to the gameplan, drop threats and keep swinging. If your board gets wiped it can be hard to recoup, Nimble Mongoose and Goyf can keep your creature base widdled down unless you topdeck an M.o.E.. Bring in Needle's Wasteland/Fetch and Crypt to make them lose Threshold and cripple Goyf's.
Very Poor - ANT Ad Naseum Tendrils - Pre board - All combo matches are a race for us. Do whatever you can to establish some damage early on so when they play Ad Naseum they will hopefully kill themselves or they will realize they can't combo so they scoop.
Post board - Same exact gameplan but now you have Chalice and some builds Canonist. Chalice @ 0 is really hindering to their gameplan also Canonist can keep them from comboing. Still really hard MU.
Somewhat Good - Dreadstill Variants - Pre board - It all really depends on the draw and if we get a Vial to stick. If they Stifle/Nought 2nd turn it's probably over but with a M.o.E. and some artifacts on board we can survive 1 swing from Nought and then hold it off building our board and eventually overpowering them. Standstill, Counterbalance are both bad for them pre board against us.
Post board - We bring in Grip for Nought/Crucible and Needle for Wasteland, Top, Factory. They can bring in Grip/Ancient Grudge for our artifacts, REB's for M.o.E./Thoughtcast, Pyroclasm/Firespout can wreck our smaller creatures before M.o.E. hits, and some builds pack Blood Moon/Magus of the Moon wich really doesn't hurt us but can slow us down a little sometimes.
Very Poor - TES variants - Pre board - It's real bad for us, they can practically play any hand and win before we drop M.o.E., and we have no way to stop this MB. Fast damage and Disciple + Ravager is about our best bet.
Post board - Gets even worse. A lot of builds bring in Shattering Spree, and that can be gg for us in some situations. Chalice @ 0 or @ 1, even Canonist can help out but... wow, this is just a bad match up.
Somewhat Good - CounterSliver variants - Pre board - Depends on draw and Vial resolving because they ARE getting a Vial resolved against us. Play dummy spells to pull counters out of their hand, so rush them but don't overextend. Swords will slow us down, but we should be able to drop more threats than they can deal with.
Post board - Depends on draw and Vial resolving again. They bring in Harmonic Sliver wich is terible for us and possibly Grip some builds Needle. We bring in Grip and Needle as well but they usually have more answers to our threats(Harmonic Sliver) so it can be a beating.
Poor/Somewhat Good - Stax variants - Pre board - If they don't drop Chalice @ 1 or Trinisphere their 1st turn it can be game over for them. Once we get a Vial or Drum established we have mana past lands, Chalice @ 1 after that is kind of pointless, and if it was Vial we established both those cards no longer matter to us anymore really. If either of those cards hits the board before we can get Vial/Drum online it's going to be a rough game. Armageddon we can really do nothing about and Magus of the Tabernacle, Moat, and Humility destroy us.
Post board - Doesn't get any better really. Same gameplan but now we have Grip, Crypt for Crucible + Wastelnd, and Needle for Wasteland/Mishra's Factory/Ghost Quarter to help out. Stick to the same gameplan with a few added answers and you should get the win but, it's still an uphill battle.
Good/Somewhat Poor - Mono Red Burn - Pre board - Race this match up. They can kill you just as fast as you can kill them but, they really don't care what you play wich can give us a slight edge. There's nothing we can do but take the burn and swing. They will ping you with 3 damage for 1 mana spells until they can Fireblast+Fork ftw.
Somewhat Poor/Good - Dragon Stompy - Pre board - Same as Stax pretty much, Chalice and 3Sphere own us unless we can get established before they hit the board. We outclass them creature wise, so beat face with what you got.
Post board - We get Grips, Needle, and possibly Canonist. They get Spree, Pyrokinesis, and some builds Needle. Just stick to the gameplan of swinging and destroying their locking artifacts to win here.
Good/Somewhat Poor - Goblins - Pre board - This is almost a mirror match and the outcome really depends on the draw. Turn 1 Goblin Lackey can hurt unless you drop a Worker or Thopter to block it. Wasteland can really hurt us early on unless we get Vial/Drum/Citadel established. Our creatures outclass theirs so keep swinging to win this match, if you let them establish a board on you, it could be all over.
Post board - Same exact gameplan. We get Grip for Vial, they get Tin Street Hooligan, Naturalize, Grip, and Red Elemental Blast. But we still outclass their creatures so as long as we can stay established through disruption, you should win this match.
Good - Goyf Sligh - Pre board - We majorly outclass them creature wise but they can still kill us with burn (Fireblast+Fork), if some early creature damage slips through. Stick to what you know and race ftw.
Post board - Same deal... race ftw. They side in Grip, possibly Ancient Grudge, and watch out for Price of Progress as it can destroy you with no Ravager on board. The best we can really get is Chalice @ 1 to stop most of their early beaters or @ 2 to stop some creatures or burn, and Needle to stop Figure of Destiny, Grim Lavamancer, Mogg Fanatic.
Somewhat Good/Poor - Landstill variants - Pre board - Deed, Moat, Humility, Crucible + Wasteland lock, slow us down a lot and can often make us scoop. Remembe to sac Deed/Wasteland target to Ravager. Do as much damage as you can before they lock you or sweep the board. If they can't sweep your board on or before 4th turn we can usually pull out a win here.
Post board - They can get Meddling Mage, Energy Flux, Grip, Engineered Explosives, Elspeth, Knight Errant, even Thoughtseize. Grip saves our butt against Moat/Humility/Deed/Flux/E.E., and Needle locks Elspeth/Deed/E.E./Wasteland/Factory. Negate their efforts and beat face. You won't last long under a Flux unless yo have multiple DotV's in play, this can make Flux their own worst enemy. Do not let Elspeth's ultimate ability resolve or even get to that point, if it resolves we are pretty much done unless we can slip Thopter with Plating through.
If you feel their is something I missed or something you believe needs to be added please let me know.
I like this OP better than the other one, but still needs a lot of work... Most notably in the match-ups, where you mention cards which aren't played in certain decks (e.g. MD Deed and SB Shattering Spree in Thresh, Fork in Goyf Sligh).
First thing I see that is wrong with this primer, is of the sample deck lists where it is possible, they should all be from tournaments that are over 30+ people. If this is not possible then it is fine. However I am 90% sure that with the Affinity deck type being as popular as it is, that this should be relatively easy to accomplish.
I like this OP better than the other one, but still needs a lot of work... Most notably in the match-ups, where you mention cards which aren't played in certain decks (e.g. MD Deed and SB Shattering Spree in Thresh, Fork in Goyf Sligh).
The reason I mention these cards is because they do see play in those builds, not as highly as you think, but I have seen them played in certain builds. So I included them so people will watch out for them just in case. Instead of going through and explaining the several different builds of the same deck pretty much I just tried to explain the decks group as a whole.
First thing I see that is wrong with this primer, is of the sample deck lists where it is possible, they should all be from tournaments that are over 30+ people. If this is not possible then it is fine. However I am 90% sure that with the Affinity deck type being as popular as it is, that this should be relatively easy to accomplish.
And those are just a few of the issues without even getting into the match up analysis that I see with your primer.
I could go and try to find some more but, I used the ones that were relatively high ranking. Most other tournaments where there was 30+ people Affinity did not place high enough, imo, for that build to be included or considered competitive. The build you mentioned was posted after I was done with that section or it would have been added.
Yes, those cards still see play but are not the best options for the deck anymore. They are not artifacts, force us to sacrifice artifacts wich kills the synergy of the deck (ie, M.o.E., Plating, affinity count) for usually a sub-par amount of damage that can easily be achieved if not surpassed by another artifact beater.
I originally did do %'s in the MU section but figured I get hecklers who would say they are incorrect are false results so I removed them. Instead of explaining the various different builds of 1 deck I just explained the variants of that build. So when I say Threshold variants I'm talking about UG, UGr, UGw, Ubg, etc..
If you have any suggestions to help my terrible thread that is 100x better than the one stickied now, I'm all ears.
If you have any suggestions to help my terrible thread that is 100x better than the one stickied now, I'm all ears.
Did I say your thread was terrible? No I did not... I said it could use improvement... just like all of our threads. that is all I said.
If you have %'s then I would use them, especially if you can back them up with match up results.
As for the tournament result decks, I would use ones that have placed high in tournaments that are 30+ person tournaments, even if that lowers the count of decks you have for sample, as opposed to using versions that do not place highly in tournaments.
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Did I say your thread was terrible? No I did not... I said it could use improvement... just like all of our threads. that is all I said.
If you have %'s then I would use them, especially if you can back them up with match up results.
As for the tournament result decks, I would use ones that have placed high in tournaments that are 30+ person tournaments, even if that lowers the count of decks you have for sample, as opposed to using versions that do not place highly in tournaments.
Ok slick, calm down. It's not perfect I know, I'll be updating it daily. After what 4eak posted idk know if anyone can make a better one than that. At this point in time I would prefer not to use %'s. No matter what % I put it's really not the right one because all games differ, and I've had it come into question before elsewhere so, if everyone really wants me to I will but until then I will refrain from using any. I went back and looked again. Those are the only decks that are either close to 30 or + that have done well. The most recent version of this deck hasn't seen play in a 30+ tourney or been reported in yet I guess. 30+ player tourneys in my area are almost unheard of, max we get to is around 23-24 and I normally take Dreadstill to a tourney that size. All the decks posted have top 4'd but one and he got 6th.
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Bunny says so!
This is my build, I play it weekly in a meta consisting of Thresh,MBA,Angelstompy,and other random things. My sideboard really does me no good, it consists of Krosan Grip,red elemental blast,and cabal therapie. I was wondering if there is any good affinity tech I could use to give me more of an edge. Also another question. What makes springleaf drum so good, I see it played all the time and I've tested it myself and cant see what's so special about it.
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Thanks Mr.Stuff from High~Light Studios for the Sig
This is my build, I play it weekly in a meta consisting of Thresh,MBA,Angelstompy,and other random things. My sideboard really does me no good, it consists of Krosan Grip,red elemental blast,and cabal therapie. I was wondering if there is any good affinity tech I could use to give me more of an edge. Also another question. What makes springleaf drum so good, I see it played all the time and I've tested it myself and cant see what's so special about it.
I see that you also play 3x Thoughtcast, glad to see I'm not the only one. How does Swords work for you main? I think it would kind of slow you down not dropping a threat and since our creatures can deal with most other big creatures except like Tombstalker wich we can hold off. Check out the SB options section of the OP for tech for your meta. Chalice @ 1 seems good against MBA, Crypt is alright against Thresh, I don't play much against Angelstompy but our bigger creatures shouldn't have a problem.
Springleaf Drum is amazing. A great turn 1 play is: Ciradel, Drum, Thopter, tap drum to tap thopter, and drop Frogmite. It's a mana producer and color fixer so you won't have to run 4x Void MB, adds to afinity, and can be saced to Ravager when useless.
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I see that you also play 3x Thoughtcast, glad to see I'm not the only one. How does Swords work for you main? I think it would kind of slow you down not dropping a threat and since our creatures can deal with most other big creatures except like Tombstalker wich we can hold off. Check out the SB options section of the OP for tech for your meta. Chalice @ 1 seems good against MBA, Crypt is alright against Thresh, I don't play much against Angelstompy but our bigger creatures shouldn't have a problem.
Springleaf Drum is amazing. A great turn 1 play is: Ciradel, Drum, Thopter, tap drum to tap thopter, and drop Frogmite. It's a mana producer and color fixer so you won't have to run 4x Void MB, adds to afinity, and can be saced to Ravager when useless.
Well its a meta call for me tbh.I'd prefer Path to Exile in my main but after about 10 packs of conflux I havent got one. But so far I really like Swords in my main it takes out Tombstalker,Exalted Angel,and what ever fatty I'd rather not deal with. It's good main deck removal in my opinion because due to my personal play style I found myself over extending way to much with fling.
Drum seems good on paper to me but in my play testing I've found I dont use it enough past turn one for it to be worth much, but that's just me.
I got to work on my sb I need to pick up Chalice, and maybe a playset of cannonists. Thanks for your help
IMO, you play too much lands. Cutting enforcers... I'm going to quote someone who has far more knowledge about the deck then I do
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4eak
Myr Enforcer—He is a fattie in Legacy and an aggro-control slayer. He is a clock, and he becomes castable generally on 3rd turn. He is a threat that the opponent cannot ignore. Myr Enforcer is to the 3rd turn as what Frogmite is to the 2nd turn. Enforcer comes into play earlier than a 4/4 creature should, and this is exactly the sort of tempo advantage that an aggro deck seeks.
He is a free 4/4 body that is easy to drop in a 45-50 artifact count deck.
He punishes anyone who is chump blocking MoE/Cranial/Ravager.
He is pure aggro, and that is what Vial Affinity is all about.
He is your necessary pressure when you don't have MoE/Cranial/Ravager.
He becomes better in multiples (a fact which many have forgotten)
I am amazed at the number of people that opt not to run him. He is an great drop 3rd turn or 10th turn, and multiples are certainly a good thing. When you find yourself in board positions that do not seek to sac out to ravager, and you don’t have MoE, Enforcer is the largest and often most relevant creature on the board. Enforcer can be seen as a stabilizing aggro card in this deck, allowing affinity to reach critical mass.
At any point you would cast this card, he is mana-efficient. A turn 2, 3, or 4 enforcer will often win games. Think of Enforcer as being similar to Arrogant Wurm in UG madness, only better--He is cheap fat that furthers the very game plan that an aggro deck like Vial Affinity is trying to play.
That's just it really, all this effort to get a high artifact count and you drop one of your strongest creatures. The thing with enforcer, he'll always be a relevant threat, a 4/4 body is strong in legacy and improves aggro matchups by a lot. You have Angelstompy and MBA in your meta.
Also missing Vial in your list.. which should improve your thresh MU.
Oh wow, I do play vials I just didnt type it out how foolish of me. I'm going to edit my post right now. Enforcer is a body, I've been trying to make more room for him. The only reson I play that much land is because I dont play drum. But I'm going to cut a couple of lands and put enforcers in there place to see how they work out.
And this is just a far off question.
I understand it wouldnt be competitive enough to actually play. But has anyone ever considered Mishra, Artifacer Prodigy to play?
I would go for your build -2 Void -1 Den +2 Drum +1 Enforcer. There is other obvious changes I wold make but for your play style and your meta I think that will help you out. Also P.t.E. is no better than StP, imo, in Legacy we can not afford to give our opponents a free land drop, we don't really care about giving them life so StP would be the better option if going down that route.
I would go for your build -2 Void -1 Den +2 Drum +1 Enforcer. There is other obvious changes I wold make but for your play style and your meta I think that will help you out. Also P.t.E. is no better than StP, imo, in Legacy we can not afford to give our opponents a free land drop, we don't really care about giving them life so StP would be the better option if going down that route.
Yeah Enforcer is a house, I havent updated my list in a while because I havent been playing it enough. But I'm going to do alot of testing in the next 3 or 4 days and I'll see how it works out. I appreciate the help thank you very much.
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Also another question. What makes springleaf drum so good, I see it played all the time and I've tested it myself and cant see what's so special about it.
Turn 1 looks something like the following with Springleaf Drum:
Play a Artifact Land, play an Ornithopter, play a Spring Leaf Drum, have 3 Artifacts on the field, tap the Ornithopter and Spring Leaf Drum to produce any color mana, and play a Frogmite for a single mana...
Total 4 Artifacts in play, second turn looks something like this:
Play another Artifact Land, Total 5 Artifacts in play, tap one of the Artifact Lands, and the Ornithopter and Spring Leaf Drum to play a Myr Enforcer for 2 mana... suddenly you have a 2/2 and a 4/4 on the field on turn 2...
Sure, that opening hand kind of requires a god-hand but that is the kind of thing you can do with Spring Leaf Drum...
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
That's my problem it doesnt do much good past turn one or a god hand in my opinion, so I'm not that sold on it. Sure it's sacable to ravanger and sure it will colorfix but I just feel theres more threats I could be playing. But I am going to give it a second go
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That's my problem it doesnt do much good past turn one or a god hand in my opinion, so I'm not that sold on it. Sure it's sacable to ravanger and sure it will colorfix but I just feel theres more threats I could be playing. But I am going to give it a second go
the other advantage to the card, is that it allows you to continue playing even after having all of your lands destroyed via a Powder Keg set at Zero, or some similar effect, as this card essentially produces mana of any color so long as you have a creature in play, and in theory all you need is one mana to continue to play this deck.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
Thank you Dalkon. Rocket: you could also SB the StP's and add the 4th Enforcer, a 3rd Drum, and maybe another Thoughtcast or the 4th Drum. StP, imo, is not needed main because our creatures can usually overpower most others, it's a meta decision, and that way you can run more threats
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the other advantage to the card, is that it allows you to continue playing even after having all of your lands destroyed via a Powder Keg set at Zero, or some similar effect, as this card essentially produces mana of any color so long as you have a creature in play, and in theory all you need is one mana to continue to play this deck.
That's a very good point, and considering I've run into deed and ee countless times I'm going to give it a shot. I was just going on what I thought would be a meta call but these are all really good points. I appreciate everyones help thank yous
I dislike the 2x Fling, maybe +2 Vial instead. I think REB in the SB might have been a meta decision but, it really isn't needed against control if your running 4x Vial. Innocent Blood is an interesting choice. The Duress + Therapy I thought was nice but I think Grip might have been better there. But 3rd out of 35 is a pretty good showing.
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Imo, -1 Citadel, -1 Void, +2 Tree of Tales. You are going to need to make sure you can get that G exactly when you need it for Grip especially running 4x SB. Sure we have Drum and Void but those can only go so far.
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Is this deck a good metagame call for Chicago? I'm thinking a lot of people are going to be playing The Fear and this deck seems to rollover to Pernicious Deed. Against a deck playing 4 Intuitions to go get it and enough spells to buy the time pull it off, this seems like a bad choice.
Heck, even Zoo with Kataki in the sideboard makes this deck cry. The prevalence of Dreadstill in the format today forces decks playing green to run Krosan Grip.
I will consider this deck if others' experience seem to suggest it's good.
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I'm not 100% sure but I do not believe this to be a good call for GP. I believe a high showing of Combo (ANT/TES) will rear it's ugly head and we simply don't have a good enough MU against them to make it 15+ rounds. But you could also not face combo until real late or at all and maybe still top 8 or something with a real fine tuned build and surprise everyone.
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Went 3-1 today with the build I posted today so I'm pleased to say the least.
I was only able to pull out 1 cannonist because they werent able to be lent to me.
1st round I played a VialRats deck that wanted to rip apart the hand.
Sadly my hand was gone turn 2 and replenished with thoughtcast shortly after.
I beat fact and gg both games. Made no changes out of the board. (2-0)
Round 2 was tough I was playing MBA first games he's on the play and I get DarkRit + Thoughtsieze+Hymn and he hit 3 really good cards. Then I got beat down with a Hippie and it just ripped w/e little I had left in my hand apart. 2nd game I SB in 4 swords but after a turn one worker the same thing happened. My hand got ripped apart my worker got edicted and it was just bad (0-2)
Round 3 I played goblins but I was distracted because I kept getting textmessages so I made alot of play mistakes. Had the win 2 times in first game and second game but prolonged myself 2 turns both times. StP was the MVP killing lackeys and piledrivers. (2-1)
Round 4: I played BUtog game one I had a trading war with tog I had ravanger up to about a 7/7 and he found a diabolic edict off a brainstorm and it made me go but Diciple did alot of good that game took him down to 14 and then 3 turns later I had double master beating in. Game 2 I won through a Hyurkuls Recall. (2-0)
Considering I only had 1 cannonist I'm pleased with the results today.
Also I'm so glad I put Enforcer back in the deck he's such a house it's ridonc.
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Congrats. What did you side out for StP in the Goblin MU, and would have needed them if you wasn't text messaging, lol? Also, since you were short on E-canon, what did you throw in it's place?
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If you are interested in making a tournament deck out of this be warned, our combo match up is horrible. If you see a lot of combo in your meta or expect to see an abundance of it where your planning on playing, do not bring Affinity. We normally cannot race the speed of combo. The quickest we can combo/kill is 3rd turn. ANT, TES, Dredge, Belcher, Elfball, can all combo/kill on 1st or 2nd turn and we have no way to stop this maindeck. SB we have options but after losing game 1 you better draw the nuts or scoop. The best meta situation for this deck is Aggro/Heavy Control. We can simply play through control, Vial laughs at it, and we will always have more and bigger creatures than them. Aggro we normally always push through unless they gain a strong foothold then we can have problems but, with Cranial Plating/Arcbound Ravager tricks we can usually prevail.
The latest take on Vial Affinity has not seen play in a large number of 30+ player tournaments. Mainly due to combo and the players fear of crapping out early playing Affinity but also, people have not picked up the power of Master quite yet, for he can reign over Dreadnought's. This deck is played a lot though by people who are new to Legacy and usually in smaller tournaments. Every once in a while we'll see a gem take 1st or 2nd in a large field and it gives us all a little hope for this deck. Here is my take on the latest Affinity tek and some other proven builds.
4x Frogmite
4x Myr Enforcer
4x Arcbound Worker
4x Arcbound Ravager
4x Master of Etherium
4x Disciple of the Vault
4x Aether Vial
4x Springleaf Drum
4x Cranial Plating
3x Thoughtcast
4x Vault of Whispers
4x Darksteel Citadel
2x Tree of Tales
2x Glimmervoid
1x City of Brass
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Krosan Grip
4x Pithing Needle
3x Tormod's Crypt
4x Frogmite
4x Myr Enforcer
4x Arcbound Worker
4x Arcbound Ravager
4x Disciple of the Vault
3x Master of Etherium
1x Tarmogoyf
2x Aether Vial
4x Springleaf Drum
4x Cranial Plating
4x Thoughtcast
2x City of Brass
1x Darksteel Citadel
4x Seat of the Synod
4x Tree of Tales
4x Vault of Whispers
3x Krosan Grip
2x Cabal Therapy
4x Duress
2x Pithing Needle
4x Relic of Progenitus
4x Frogmite
2x Myr Enforcer
4x Arcbound Worker
4x Arcbound Ravager
3x Master of Etherium
4x Disciple of the Vault
4x Aether Vial
4x Springleaf Drum
3x Cranial Plating
3x Cabal Therapy
4x Thoughtcast
4x Darksteel Citadel
3x Glimmervoid
4x Seat of the Synod
4x Vault of Whispers
3x Krosan Grip
3x Smother
1x Cabal Therapy
3x Pithing Needle
3x Tormod's Crypt
2x Umezawa's Jitte
Ornithopter- This guy gets the deck rolling. A free 0/2 flying Cranial Plating and Modular counter target that adds to the affinity count and can be saced to Arcbound Ravager is amazing! This guy wins games.
Frogmite- Alomst always a 2/2 for 0 mana, rarely will you have to pay to drop him but if you do it's usually 1-2 mana, adds to affinity count and can be saced to Ravager.
Myr Enforcer- Any artifact you dropped makes this guy 1 cheaper. A 4/4 for 0 mana is amazing. More often than not though you will have to pay 2-3 mana to drop him, but still a 4/4 for that cheap is worth the investment. Adds to affinity and can be saced to Ravager.
Arcbound Worker- Often a overlooked and underrated card. He may be a 1/1 on the board but through Ravager and Modular he's basically a 2/2 for 1 mana. He can get some quick damage in early and block beaters willingly. Adds to affinity early on but we normally lose them later in the game due to blocking or sacing.
Arcbound Ravager- One of the MVP's of this deck (the deck is half named after him). With Vial his 2cc is nothing and without it... it's 2 mana. This guy can get big FAST. The ability to sac our board before a board sweeper resolves to pump Ravager or sacing all with a Disciple of the vault on board ftw is great. Is an immediate threat when it resolves, adds to affinity, and can be saced to itself. Watch out for Stifle effects when sacing as you can lose your board for nothing.
Master of Etherium- For such a long time artifacts have needed a Lord and we finally got one. I only play him through Vial to make sure he hits the board, I have hardcast him though and his 3cc is not too bad for this deck. Often hits the board from anywhere between a 4/4 to 6/6 for 3 mana or free through Vial, gives all your artifact creatures +1/+1 and is a walking Cranial Plating (Thank you Wizards!). This guy towers over Phyrexian Dreadnought's, Terravore's, and Goyf's mean nothing to him. He's an auto 4 of in any build.
Disciple of the Vault- Disciple + Ravager = gg, most of the time. Once you get your oppenents life low enough and you have enough artifacts in play to to sac equaling up to their life total you win (example: they have 12 life, if you have 12 artifacts in play you can sac 12 artifacts and they will lose 12 life). NEVER run an affinity build without Disciple + Ravager combo... EVER. He makes a great Springleaf Drum or Plating target, and can just get a little damage through time to time.
Aether Vial- One of my favorite cards in this deck. Dropping this 1st turn unasnwered can win games by itself. The raw power of dropping free threats every turn that your oppoenent can't counter is sick. It's one of the reasons why our control match up is as good as it is. It's a mana producer and affinity helper all for 1 mana, extras can be saced to Ravager.
Springleaf Drum- The next best thing to Vial. Mana producer/color fixer, adds to affinity, makes a turn 1 Thopter a Birds of Paradise with haste for 0 mana. Really does allow for some sick turn 1 plays.
Chromatic Star- The next best thing to Drum. This is more mana fixer + draw than it is a mana producer. Adds to affinity early on and an easy sac to ravager for draw late game. Nice when you have no Thoughtcast and need to draw.
Cranial Plating- Another MVP of the deck, auto 4 of, and a card you love to see in multiples. Makes any creature as strong as M.o.E. basically. Your most common target for this is Thopter so you can fly in ftw. Also is just great to equip for blocking purposes to take out huge creatures. It's 2nd ability does not come in as handy as it used to but still wins games, moving it to an unblocked creature before damage goes on the stack.
Thoughtcast- At the moment is our best drawing card we have, it's 2/3 an Ancestral Recall. We empty our hand so fast and with it's synergy for the deck it's a deffinent inclusion. I have dropped the number down to 3 in my build for 2 reasons: 1. Playing Thoughtcast 3rd turn looking for more threats and drawing into 1-2 more Thoughtcast - it defeats the purpose of using it in the first place to not draw 2 threats, 2. Just drawing 2 or more in your opening hand makes you mulligan - we need to spend turns playing threats and not "trying" to draw them out of the deck.
Seat of the Synod, Vault of Whispers, Tree of Tales- Color of course but, these are Artifact lands. For each Art. land you have in play, your affinity spells cost 1 mana less to play, and you can use the land for mana as well basically netting you 2 mana for the 1 land. So they play a very important role for the deck. Also they are fuel to make M.o.E. bigger, each land you play gives him +1/+1.
Darksteel Citadel- 1. It's an artifact land. 2. It's Indestructible. People please watch out for Wasteland. Against one of my control decks, if you play anything but a Citadel turn 1, it's getting hit with Wasteland my first turn. This land can screw with gameplans and throw people off who are using LD tactics and will most likely SB them out game 2 due to thought of them being dead again. Even though it doesn't produce color it's indestructability makes up for it when you face a Pernicious Deed, or Landstill with Crucible of Worlds and Wasteland in play.
Glimmervoid- Color fixer.... that's about it. Do not not play more than 2 of these (3 is pushing the limit). In multiples they are bad, only giving us 1 mana, dropping it and a *1cc artifact* 1st turn then we lose said artifact = we lose Void. We have other options of color fixing in this deck so do not go overboard on these, artifact lands are needed more.
City of Brass- Another color fixer and the other option to Void. It still only gives us 1 mana but stays in play even when no artifacts are. The only real question you need to ask is, do you care about your life total? The cost of 1 life for 1 color you need is really not that bad but can get expensive if you are getting pinged by some creature.
Chalice of the Void- One of our main cards against combo. It does create some anti-synergy to the deck but what it does for us against combo is worth it considering what we would take out for it. Often dropped @ 0 or @ 1 both numbers hurt almost any combo deck like ANT or Elfball. Also stops Cashseize/Duress/Brainstorm, Nimble Mongoose, etc.
Krosan Grip- Destroys Phyrexian Dreadnought, Counterbalance, Sensei's Divining Top, Umezawa's Jitte, Moat, Humility, Chalice of the Void, Trinisphere, Crucible of Worlds, Isochron Scepter, Goblin Charbelcher, Engineered Explosives, all cards we hate.
Ethersworn Canonist- Another option to combo. It can be dropped 2nd turn against combo practically crushing their ability to combo off 2nd turn and on(hopefully), giving us a window to strike ftw.
Tormod's Crypt- If you don't have Dredge in your meta (or any deck that doesn't abuse the graveyard somehow), you are one lucky dog, for the rest of us there's Crypt. I greatly prefer Crytp to Relic of Progenitus. Mana cost is a real big issue here. Some will say,"But it only cost one and you get to draw.". We draw cards aleady from Thoughtcast, and as for synergy towards the deck the 0cc Crypt does the job better crippling gy based decks for free. It also helps out agianst Threshold decks and most decks using Tarmogoyf.
Pithing Needle- GREAT against Wasteland, Mishra's Factory, Scepter, Belcher, Deed, Explosives, any Planeswalker, etc.. It shuts down quite a few cards that hate us out but it also slows us down a little, but the advantage we gain in shutting down some of there play tactics is a huge help.
Duress/Thoughtseize- Is an option for combo and control decks. It does the job but not as good as it used to, imo, it has pretty much been replaced by Chalice but still a very solid option to use.
Cabal Therapy- Another useful discard. If you know what your playing against you have a clue of what to name, if you missed with it just sac a Worker move a counter and name the card you know is in there hand.
Smother- Great card for Nought, Goyf, Serra Avenger, Werebear, a good chunk of Slivers, etc.. But it's really not needed because our creatures can get huge and block or overwhelm most of it all.
Swords to Plowshares- Great creature removal because we don't really care about their life total since our creatures can get big, just keep swinging, and sac to make them lose life. But then it's also not really needed for the exact same reasons because we can usually hold off most big creatures.
Thorn of Amethyst- Another option that combo and control really hate. It's downside is the 2cc and it makes our stuff more expensive as well like 1U for Thoughtcast or 3cc for Plating.
Umezawa's Jitte- Not a replacement for Plating but can be a good card none the less. Equip it to a Thopter with a modular counter on it or anything you can hit them with. It's also really not needed because Plating is just plain better.
Engineered Plague- Great against Tribal decks (elfes, goblins, kithkin, etc.) but has seen a little less play as of late due to Lords and us upgrading our creature base with M.o.E. and filling out to 4 Enforcer.
Shrapnel Blast- I miss playing this card but is no longer really any good but, it still can see play in a few builds specifically designed to run it but, too many times has it sat in my hand doing nothing and I wished it was a creature. It's not an artifact, forces us to sac artifacts, no longer follows the color of the deck. Playable yes and will do 5 damage sure but, another beater is just so much better.
Soul's Fire/Fling/Berserk- Same as above but worse. Playing a threat just to sac it is not a good idea and goes against what the deck is trying to do.
Somber Hoverguard- True with proper affinity he's free but for what he is he's expensive and not an artifact.
Blue Elemental Blast/Red Elemental Blast- Though they do serve a purpose and can be helpful in some situations, I would rather drop another threat and have them worrying about me instead of holding mana back or using it for something besides a threat.
Stifle- Read above. We can not not play cards that put us in the role of playing control. We are Aggro/Combo.
Atog- Is not a substitute for Ravager, not even close. Is off color for the direction the deck is taking, is not an artifact.
Tarmogoyf- In most builds he can hit the board as a 4/5-6/7 and color fits but, is not an artifact, and most of our other creatures get bigger than Goyf as it stands now, so he is really not needed.
Dark Confidant- 1 question. Do you know what it's like to draw an Enforcer/Thoughtcast with Bob? Answer. It's painfull. And when the games over you'll take them out, trust me.
Salvage Titan- A 6/4 for free is not bad at all but, when you think about the meta you are using 4 cards (Titan and the 3 artifacts you sac) wich can easily be countered (Force of Will + fodder for it) and it counts as a huge card disadvantage for you. Usually netting you a 4/2 card loss in their favor. Even if it hits the board and it gets destroyed that can often be a 4/1 disadvantage in their favor.
Etherium Sculptor- This guy does way too little way too late for his 2cc. Maybe in some casual builds but for a competitive deck it only slows us down.
Skill Borrower- Terrible, enough said.
Meddling Mage- Love the card but not an artifact, slightly off color, and we never want to attack with it wich defeats the purpose of aggro.
Epochrasite- Too expensive for what he is, takes too long for him to reach his potential and is not always guaranteed to do so.
Goblin Welder- Is not an artifact, has summoning sickness so his ability can't be used right away, and has requirements for the ability to be used, also off color.
Blinkmoth Nexus- Really is a great card and a personal decision wether or not to run them. Nexus has many uses. Acts as a Thopter so Plating tricks and Modular counters can work the same way. But lately it seems like it's just not as good as it used to be and we usually do fine with Thopter or Worker slipping in with Plating.
These are just some typical plays you'll see and kind of how to deal with them. I know there are more but these are just some examples of how the deck works.
E1. Turn 1: Drop artifact land and play Springleaf Drum, then play Ornithopter, tap Drum to tap Thopter for 1 mana of any color to play Aether Vial (4 artifacts), play Frogmite (5 artifacts).
Turn 2: Vial set @ 1, drop artifact land (6 artifacts). Tap Vial to drop Arcbound Worker (7 artifacts). Pay 2 for Plating (8 artifacts). Tap drum to tap either Thopter or Frogmite to equip Plating to the other one and swing for 8-10.
Turn 3: Vial set @ 2, drop art land if possible (8-9 arts), Tap Vial to drop Ravager (9-10 arts), tap land or drum to tap Ravager for B and play DotV, swing and sac ftw.
E2. Turn 1: Drop artifact land and play Springleaf Drum, then play Ornithopter (that's 3 arts). Tap the Drum to tap Thopter for 1 moac to pay for a 1cc Frogmite (4 arts). Then proceed to play any other Frogmite's you have in your hand for free (4-5 arts).
Turn 2: Drop artifact land (5-6 arts), tap drum to tap Thopter for 1 moac and tap land to pay 1-2 mana for a Myr Enforcer (6-7 arts) or, tap Frogmite with Drum and land to drop Plating (6-7 arts) and use your extra land to equip it to Thopter or Frogmite and Swing to do 6-9 damage.
Turn3: Drop artifact land if possible (6-8 arts), 2 for Ravager (7-9 arts) and 1 for DotV or 3 for M.o.E (7-9 arts). Either swing and sac ftw or swing and kill on turn 4.
E3. Turn 1: Drop art land and play Aether Vial (2 arts), play Thopter (3 arts).
Turn 2: Vial set @ 1, drop art land (4 arts), drop any Frog's you have (5-6 arts), tap Vial to drop Worker (6-7 arts), play Enforcer for 0-1 mana (7-8 arts), pay 2 for Plating or wait unil 3rd turn for that and play Thoughtcast instead.
Turn 3: Vial set @ 2, drop art land (8-9 arts), pay 2 for Plating (9-10 arts), pay 1 to equip to creature you think or you know can get through, tap Vial to drop Ravager (10-11 arts), swing.
Turn 4: Vial set @ 3, Drop art land if possible (10-12 arts), tap Vial to drop M.o.E. (11-13 arts), pay 1 for Thoughtcast now if you did not on 2nd, you have 2-3 mana left to play anything you can or drew, then swing usually ftw.
Our typical game plan is to bury the board in creatures, beat face, and usually sac to Ravager ftw. These are just some typical MU's you'll see and sort of how to deal with them and what to watch out for.
Good - Threshold Variants - Pre board - We have them outclassed creature wise. Drop a Vial and get it to stick. With Vial and playing threats from our hand they normally can not keep up with the amount of stuff that we drop. Some builds can slow you down a little with Swords, Fire/Ice, I've even seen Deed MB, but just keep swinging.
Post board - They "can" bring in Grip's, Smash to Smithereens, Shattering Spree, it can get a little rough but stick to the gameplan, drop threats and keep swinging. If your board gets wiped it can be hard to recoup, Nimble Mongoose and Goyf can keep your creature base widdled down unless you topdeck an M.o.E.. Bring in Needle's Wasteland/Fetch and Crypt to make them lose Threshold and cripple Goyf's.
Very Poor - ANT Ad Naseum Tendrils - Pre board - All combo matches are a race for us. Do whatever you can to establish some damage early on so when they play Ad Naseum they will hopefully kill themselves or they will realize they can't combo so they scoop.
Post board - Same exact gameplan but now you have Chalice and some builds Canonist. Chalice @ 0 is really hindering to their gameplan also Canonist can keep them from comboing. Still really hard MU.
Somewhat Good - Dreadstill Variants - Pre board - It all really depends on the draw and if we get a Vial to stick. If they Stifle/Nought 2nd turn it's probably over but with a M.o.E. and some artifacts on board we can survive 1 swing from Nought and then hold it off building our board and eventually overpowering them. Standstill, Counterbalance are both bad for them pre board against us.
Post board - We bring in Grip for Nought/Crucible and Needle for Wasteland, Top, Factory. They can bring in Grip/Ancient Grudge for our artifacts, REB's for M.o.E./Thoughtcast, Pyroclasm/Firespout can wreck our smaller creatures before M.o.E. hits, and some builds pack Blood Moon/Magus of the Moon wich really doesn't hurt us but can slow us down a little sometimes.
Very Poor - TES variants - Pre board - It's real bad for us, they can practically play any hand and win before we drop M.o.E., and we have no way to stop this MB. Fast damage and Disciple + Ravager is about our best bet.
Post board - Gets even worse. A lot of builds bring in Shattering Spree, and that can be gg for us in some situations. Chalice @ 0 or @ 1, even Canonist can help out but... wow, this is just a bad match up.
Somewhat Good - CounterSliver variants - Pre board - Depends on draw and Vial resolving because they ARE getting a Vial resolved against us. Play dummy spells to pull counters out of their hand, so rush them but don't overextend. Swords will slow us down, but we should be able to drop more threats than they can deal with.
Post board - Depends on draw and Vial resolving again. They bring in Harmonic Sliver wich is terible for us and possibly Grip some builds Needle. We bring in Grip and Needle as well but they usually have more answers to our threats(Harmonic Sliver) so it can be a beating.
Poor/Somewhat Good - Stax variants - Pre board - If they don't drop Chalice @ 1 or Trinisphere their 1st turn it can be game over for them. Once we get a Vial or Drum established we have mana past lands, Chalice @ 1 after that is kind of pointless, and if it was Vial we established both those cards no longer matter to us anymore really. If either of those cards hits the board before we can get Vial/Drum online it's going to be a rough game. Armageddon we can really do nothing about and Magus of the Tabernacle, Moat, and Humility destroy us.
Post board - Doesn't get any better really. Same gameplan but now we have Grip, Crypt for Crucible + Wastelnd, and Needle for Wasteland/Mishra's Factory/Ghost Quarter to help out. Stick to the same gameplan with a few added answers and you should get the win but, it's still an uphill battle.
Good/Somewhat Poor - Mono Red Burn - Pre board - Race this match up. They can kill you just as fast as you can kill them but, they really don't care what you play wich can give us a slight edge. There's nothing we can do but take the burn and swing. They will ping you with 3 damage for 1 mana spells until they can Fireblast+Fork ftw.
Post board - They get Price of Progress, Smash to Smithereens, some splash G just for Grip. We get, Chalice @ 1 or 2 is not bad once we have Vial established, Canonist eats burn spells, and Needle for Seal of Fire, Mogg Fanatic, Wasteland/Wooded Foothills/Bloodstained Mire. They are all easily destroyed but can slow them down giving us enough time to beat face.
Somewhat Poor/Good - Dragon Stompy - Pre board - Same as Stax pretty much, Chalice and 3Sphere own us unless we can get established before they hit the board. We outclass them creature wise, so beat face with what you got.
Post board - We get Grips, Needle, and possibly Canonist. They get Spree, Pyrokinesis, and some builds Needle. Just stick to the gameplan of swinging and destroying their locking artifacts to win here.
Good/Somewhat Poor - Goblins - Pre board - This is almost a mirror match and the outcome really depends on the draw. Turn 1 Goblin Lackey can hurt unless you drop a Worker or Thopter to block it. Wasteland can really hurt us early on unless we get Vial/Drum/Citadel established. Our creatures outclass theirs so keep swinging to win this match, if you let them establish a board on you, it could be all over.
Post board - Same exact gameplan. We get Grip for Vial, they get Tin Street Hooligan, Naturalize, Grip, and Red Elemental Blast. But we still outclass their creatures so as long as we can stay established through disruption, you should win this match.
Good - Goyf Sligh - Pre board - We majorly outclass them creature wise but they can still kill us with burn (Fireblast+Fork), if some early creature damage slips through. Stick to what you know and race ftw.
Post board - Same deal... race ftw. They side in Grip, possibly Ancient Grudge, and watch out for Price of Progress as it can destroy you with no Ravager on board. The best we can really get is Chalice @ 1 to stop most of their early beaters or @ 2 to stop some creatures or burn, and Needle to stop Figure of Destiny, Grim Lavamancer, Mogg Fanatic.
Somewhat Good/Poor - Landstill variants - Pre board - Deed, Moat, Humility, Crucible + Wasteland lock, slow us down a lot and can often make us scoop. Remembe to sac Deed/Wasteland target to Ravager. Do as much damage as you can before they lock you or sweep the board. If they can't sweep your board on or before 4th turn we can usually pull out a win here.
Post board - They can get Meddling Mage, Energy Flux, Grip, Engineered Explosives, Elspeth, Knight Errant, even Thoughtseize. Grip saves our butt against Moat/Humility/Deed/Flux/E.E., and Needle locks Elspeth/Deed/E.E./Wasteland/Factory. Negate their efforts and beat face. You won't last long under a Flux unless yo have multiple DotV's in play, this can make Flux their own worst enemy. Do not let Elspeth's ultimate ability resolve or even get to that point, if it resolves we are pretty much done unless we can slip Thopter with Plating through.
If you feel their is something I missed or something you believe needs to be added please let me know.
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Another thing I noticed, is that Soul's Fire, Shrapnel Blast, and Fling are all still being played in numerous builds.
This build which placed second in a relatively large (52 person) tournament in fact ran both shrapnel blast and fling:
http://www.deckcheck.net/deck.php?id=23259
And those are just a few of the issues without even getting into the match up analysis that I see with your primer.
The reason I mention these cards is because they do see play in those builds, not as highly as you think, but I have seen them played in certain builds. So I included them so people will watch out for them just in case. Instead of going through and explaining the several different builds of the same deck pretty much I just tried to explain the decks group as a whole.
I could go and try to find some more but, I used the ones that were relatively high ranking. Most other tournaments where there was 30+ people Affinity did not place high enough, imo, for that build to be included or considered competitive. The build you mentioned was posted after I was done with that section or it would have been added.
Yes, those cards still see play but are not the best options for the deck anymore. They are not artifacts, force us to sacrifice artifacts wich kills the synergy of the deck (ie, M.o.E., Plating, affinity count) for usually a sub-par amount of damage that can easily be achieved if not surpassed by another artifact beater.
I originally did do %'s in the MU section but figured I get hecklers who would say they are incorrect are false results so I removed them. Instead of explaining the various different builds of 1 deck I just explained the variants of that build. So when I say Threshold variants I'm talking about UG, UGr, UGw, Ubg, etc..
If you have any suggestions to help my terrible thread that is 100x better than the one stickied now, I'm all ears.
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Did I say your thread was terrible? No I did not... I said it could use improvement... just like all of our threads. that is all I said.
If you have %'s then I would use them, especially if you can back them up with match up results.
As for the tournament result decks, I would use ones that have placed high in tournaments that are 30+ person tournaments, even if that lowers the count of decks you have for sample, as opposed to using versions that do not place highly in tournaments.
Ok slick, calm down. It's not perfect I know, I'll be updating it daily. After what 4eak posted idk know if anyone can make a better one than that. At this point in time I would prefer not to use %'s. No matter what % I put it's really not the right one because all games differ, and I've had it come into question before elsewhere so, if everyone really wants me to I will but until then I will refrain from using any. I went back and looked again. Those are the only decks that are either close to 30 or + that have done well. The most recent version of this deck hasn't seen play in a 30+ tourney or been reported in yet I guess. 30+ player tourneys in my area are almost unheard of, max we get to is around 23-24 and I normally take Dreadstill to a tourney that size. All the decks posted have top 4'd but one and he got 6th.
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4 [MR] Seat of the Synod
4 [MR] Glimmervoid
4 [MR] Ancient Den
4 [DS] Darksteel Citadel
4 [MR] Vault of Whispers
4 [DS] Arcbound Ravager
4 [DS] Arcbound Worker
4 [MR] Disciple of the Vault
4 [ALA] Master of Etherium
4 [MR] Frogmite
4 [R] Ornithopter
3 [MR]Thoughtcast
4 [FD] Cranial Plating
4 [DS] AEther Vial
This is my build, I play it weekly in a meta consisting of Thresh,MBA,Angelstompy,and other random things. My sideboard really does me no good, it consists of Krosan Grip,red elemental blast,and cabal therapie. I was wondering if there is any good affinity tech I could use to give me more of an edge. Also another question. What makes springleaf drum so good, I see it played all the time and I've tested it myself and cant see what's so special about it.
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I see that you also play 3x Thoughtcast, glad to see I'm not the only one. How does Swords work for you main? I think it would kind of slow you down not dropping a threat and since our creatures can deal with most other big creatures except like Tombstalker wich we can hold off. Check out the SB options section of the OP for tech for your meta. Chalice @ 1 seems good against MBA, Crypt is alright against Thresh, I don't play much against Angelstompy but our bigger creatures shouldn't have a problem.
Springleaf Drum is amazing. A great turn 1 play is: Ciradel, Drum, Thopter, tap drum to tap thopter, and drop Frogmite. It's a mana producer and color fixer so you won't have to run 4x Void MB, adds to afinity, and can be saced to Ravager when useless.
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Well its a meta call for me tbh.I'd prefer Path to Exile in my main but after about 10 packs of conflux I havent got one. But so far I really like Swords in my main it takes out Tombstalker,Exalted Angel,and what ever fatty I'd rather not deal with. It's good main deck removal in my opinion because due to my personal play style I found myself over extending way to much with fling.
Drum seems good on paper to me but in my play testing I've found I dont use it enough past turn one for it to be worth much, but that's just me.
I got to work on my sb I need to pick up Chalice, and maybe a playset of cannonists. Thanks for your help
Oh wow, I do play vials I just didnt type it out how foolish of me. I'm going to edit my post right now. Enforcer is a body, I've been trying to make more room for him. The only reson I play that much land is because I dont play drum. But I'm going to cut a couple of lands and put enforcers in there place to see how they work out.
And this is just a far off question.
I understand it wouldnt be competitive enough to actually play. But has anyone ever considered Mishra, Artifacer Prodigy to play?
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Yeah Enforcer is a house, I havent updated my list in a while because I havent been playing it enough. But I'm going to do alot of testing in the next 3 or 4 days and I'll see how it works out. I appreciate the help thank you very much.
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Turn 1 looks something like the following with Springleaf Drum:
Play a Artifact Land, play an Ornithopter, play a Spring Leaf Drum, have 3 Artifacts on the field, tap the Ornithopter and Spring Leaf Drum to produce any color mana, and play a Frogmite for a single mana...
Total 4 Artifacts in play, second turn looks something like this:
Play another Artifact Land, Total 5 Artifacts in play, tap one of the Artifact Lands, and the Ornithopter and Spring Leaf Drum to play a Myr Enforcer for 2 mana... suddenly you have a 2/2 and a 4/4 on the field on turn 2...
Sure, that opening hand kind of requires a god-hand but that is the kind of thing you can do with Spring Leaf Drum...
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the other advantage to the card, is that it allows you to continue playing even after having all of your lands destroyed via a Powder Keg set at Zero, or some similar effect, as this card essentially produces mana of any color so long as you have a creature in play, and in theory all you need is one mana to continue to play this deck.
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That's a very good point, and considering I've run into deed and ee countless times I'm going to give it a shot. I was just going on what I thought would be a meta call but these are all really good points. I appreciate everyones help thank yous
I'm going to give this list a run
3 Glimmervoid
3 Ancient Den
4 Darksteel Citadel
4 Vault of whispers
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Arcbound Worker
4 Disciple of the Vault
4 Master of Etherium
4 Frogmite
4 Ornithopter
4 Thoughtcast
4 Cranial Plating
4 AEther Vial
3 Krosan Grip
3 tormods crypt
3 Engineered Plague
3 Swords to Plowshares
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OP updated.
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I dislike the 2x Fling, maybe +2 Vial instead. I think REB in the SB might have been a meta decision but, it really isn't needed against control if your running 4x Vial. Innocent Blood is an interesting choice. The Duress + Therapy I thought was nice but I think Grip might have been better there. But 3rd out of 35 is a pretty good showing.
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Not sure of the meta but I'm going to post results later.
3 Glimmervoid
3 Ancient Den
4 Darksteel Citadel
4 Vault of whispers
3 Myr Enforcer
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Arcbound Worker
4 Disciple of the Vault
4 Master of Etherium
4 Frogmite
4 Ornithopter
3 Springleaf Drum
4 Thoughtcast
4 Cranial Plating
4 AEther Vial
4 Krosan Grip
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Swords to plowshares
3 Ethersworn cannonist
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Imo, -1 Citadel, -1 Void, +2 Tree of Tales. You are going to need to make sure you can get that G exactly when you need it for Grip especially running 4x SB. Sure we have Drum and Void but those can only go so far.
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Heck, even Zoo with Kataki in the sideboard makes this deck cry. The prevalence of Dreadstill in the format today forces decks playing green to run Krosan Grip.
I will consider this deck if others' experience seem to suggest it's good.
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I was only able to pull out 1 cannonist because they werent able to be lent to me.
1st round I played a VialRats deck that wanted to rip apart the hand.
Sadly my hand was gone turn 2 and replenished with thoughtcast shortly after.
I beat fact and gg both games. Made no changes out of the board. (2-0)
Round 2 was tough I was playing MBA first games he's on the play and I get DarkRit + Thoughtsieze+Hymn and he hit 3 really good cards. Then I got beat down with a Hippie and it just ripped w/e little I had left in my hand apart. 2nd game I SB in 4 swords but after a turn one worker the same thing happened. My hand got ripped apart my worker got edicted and it was just bad (0-2)
Round 3 I played goblins but I was distracted because I kept getting textmessages so I made alot of play mistakes. Had the win 2 times in first game and second game but prolonged myself 2 turns both times. StP was the MVP killing lackeys and piledrivers. (2-1)
Round 4: I played BUtog game one I had a trading war with tog I had ravanger up to about a 7/7 and he found a diabolic edict off a brainstorm and it made me go but Diciple did alot of good that game took him down to 14 and then 3 turns later I had double master beating in. Game 2 I won through a Hyurkuls Recall. (2-0)
Considering I only had 1 cannonist I'm pleased with the results today.
Also I'm so glad I put Enforcer back in the deck he's such a house it's ridonc.
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