5 phoenix33 – Black Lotus / Foil / Indentured Djinn / Nether Spirit / Tundra Reminds me why Magus deserves its ban. Surprisingly (to me), this deck won a lot of games by racing. Incidentally, Tundra over Island cost you two points (5-7), and your spot as the sole winner of the round.
Five Card Blind (5CB) is a weekly Magic tournament, run entirely within this forum. To compete, players submit five-card decks which are played against each other. Scoring assumes optimal play, without randomness or concealed information.
1.2. Players' decks contain exactly five cards, which begin the game in hand. Players do not mulligan or sideboard.
1.3. Players' libraries begin the game empty. A player does not lose the game as a result of being unable to draw a card.
1.4. A random effect produces the result that least benefits the owner of the source of the effect.
2. Tournament Rules
2.1. Players submit their decks to the 5CB moderator (Mogg).
2.1a. The moderator acknowledges submissions and informs players of mistakes in a timely manner.
2.1b. A player may submit multiple decks, but only the most recent is counted.
2.1c. If a player's final deck is illegal, the moderator replaces cards in the deck with Library of Alexandria until the deck is made legal. Replacements are made such that the revised deck functions as closely as possible to the original.
2.2. A player may not submit a deck that can – against any deck – win the game or force more than one card in an opponent's hand to change zones before an opponent's second turn.
For example, Cabal Therapy + Swamp x4 is illegal because an opponent's deck may have duplicates of a card, but Cabal Therapy + Subterranean Hangar x4 is legal because Cabal Therapy can't be played until the third turn.
2.3. A deck may include any number of any card legal in Vintage (Type 1), with the exception of the following banned cards:
2.4. Each player plays one match, consisting of two games, against each other player. Each player is the starting player once per match. Results assume optimal play and perfect information.
2.4a. If no player can win, the game is a draw.
2.4b. A player that can't win or draw plays to extend the game.
2.5. Points determine tournament standings. Players are ranked, first to last, in order of decreasing number of points.
2.5a. For each match, a player earns 3 points per game win and 1 point per drawn game. However, a player that wins one game and loses the other earns only 2 points.
2.5b. A table of match results is posted each round. Its rows represent players and its columns represent opponents. Match results reflect the combined result of both games played in a match; 3 is a game win, 1 a drawn game, and 0 a game loss. A player's points are listed at the end of his or her row.
2.6. In rounds of twenty or more players, players are divided randomly into equally-sized heats of n players, where n is the number of players divided by ten (rounded down).
For example, twenty-five players are divided into heats of twelve and thirteen.
2.6a. A player only plays against players in his heat.
2.6b. The top four players of each heat advance to the finals, where they play again (with the same decks).
2.6c. Tiebreakers for heats are as follows: number of matches in which a player wins both games, number of game wins, points scored against higher-scoring decks. If a tie is unresolved, both tied decks advance.
2.7. The player with the most points over the course of a month becomes the Player of the Month.
2.7a. A month includes all rounds for which decks are due during that month.
2.7b. In rounds of fewer than twenty players, only the points of the top eight players are counted.
2.7c. Tiebreakers for top eight are as follows: number of matches in which a player wins both games, number of game wins, points scored against higher-scoring decks. If a tie is unresolved, both tied decks are counted.
2.7d. If heats are used, only points earned in the finals are counted.
Deck Submission Deadline:
Friday, July 24th, 2:00 pm PST.
Please use this thread to discuss any aspect of 5CB. Also, consider a subscription to 5CB. Subscribed players who have not already submitted a deck receive a reminder PM about two days before deadline. PM me to subscribe.
Good advice on the alternate card choice mogg. I had actually dimissed progenitus/darksteel because I can fly over them for damage, and save myself with the mirror. But it is a better card, in case simic sky swallower or similar comes.
By the way, why am I listed twice in the leaderboard?
Good advice on the alternate card choice mogg. I had actually dimissed progenitus/darksteel because I can fly over them for damage, and save myself with the mirror. But it is a better card, in case simic sky swallower or similar comes.
By the way, why am I listed twice in the leaderboard?
When I calculate POTM, I copy the list from the previous week and add in the scores from the new round. Apparently, I added you for 50 last week without noticing you already had 13. It's fixed now, and your score considerably improves when you're only one player.
Interesting lesson in metagaming here. I specifically choose something that beats Ajani and end up being the only deck that beats Ajani, still losing the round to it!
the three poll questions
I see only one. What am I missing?
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Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
Q2: D, simply because I like the contrast between week one's secret tech and week two's metagaming. Q3: B, because if a format's broken then bannings are important.
And whilst I'm talking about polls, my answer to question one depends a bit on how dynamic the normal format is. Across the last year or so it's been quite dynamic, but the more it stagnates the less of it I want to see, generally.
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Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
Regarding your comment for my deck I don't see how l0put manages to win.
Regardless of going 1st or second I must get at least 2 turns (otherwise deck violates the rules).
Turn 1. Factory, Sol Ring (tap for mana), Reactor
Turn 2. Use factory to play bridge, and use sol ring for digger.
Since cards in hand is zero, he can't attack, and therefore can't win in any way i can see.
8 Halinn – Aura of Silence / Black Lotus / City of Traitors / Kodama of the North Tree / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play, I go swamp, thoughtseize lotus.
He goes City, Digger.
I go Factory, beckon lotus.
He can never play kodama, and thus can never damage me ever or destroy my token or my factory. I eventually swing for the win.
Personman on the draw, he drops kodama immediately (or later, it doesn't matter). Whenever he does, I immediately beckon lotus. If he does it right away, he gets in two swings with kodama, putting me at 8, but then I can double block and pump factory to trade, puting me at 6 and making the game a draw.
Should be 1-0-1 Personman instead of 2-0 Halinn.
---
vs. dethwing (12):
12 dethwing – City of Traitors / Isochron Scepter / Lightning Helix / Powder Keg / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize lightning helix
He goes city, digger
I beckon helix. His win condition is gone. He can Powder Keg all my guys, so i can't win either, but it should be a draw.
Personman on the draw: I obviously lose.
Should be 1-0-1 dethwing, not 2-0 dethwing
----
vs. bman65 (16):
16 bman65 – Darksteel Reactor / Ensnaring Bridge / Mishra's Workshop / Sol Ring / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play:
Thoughtseize sol ring
He plays workshop, digger
Beckon sol ring
Now he can never play darksteel reactor, and ensnaring bridge can't stop my beckon token, so I win.
Personman on the draw: I obviously lose.
Should be 1-1, not 2-0 bman65
---
vs. IOput (19):
19 lOput – Anurid Scavenger / Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Empty the Warrens / Eternal Witness
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize a lotus.
He goes lotus, witness for lotus, lotus, scavenger
I beckon a lotus and drop factory.
He can't play empty anymore, so it's down to scavenger and witness on his side and factory and the beckon token on my side.
He swings with both and i go to 13.
I do nothing, but can now pump factory.
He sacs a lotus for nothing to keep scavenger around.
If he attacks with just scavenger, i block with factory and pump to trade. From then on I get in with the token and can always block witness. If he attacks with just witness i block-pump, get in with the token, he recurs witness for nothing, repeat. If he attacks with both I block-pump to kill scavenger and block with the token to kill witness and then it's a draw.
Personman on the draw: I lose SO HARD.
Should be 1-0-1 IOput instead of 2-0 IOput
----
That's all the matches I have time to examine right now, but it looks like there's a general trend of you not noticing that I could thoughtseize+beckon a lotus or other nonland mana source, so I wouldn't be surprised if some of my other matches are wrong too.
Anyway, thanks so much for doing the analysis, this is a lot of fun, and I expect I'll be sticking around.
EDIT: Poll questions 2 & 3:
Question 2: E. Always. I like the idea of watching a mini-metagame evolve quickly.
Question 3: B. Mostly. Minor changes to fix really, really broken things are fine, but letting the players evolve their own solutions to apparent brokenness first round is an even better solution, so I would like to see only very conservative changes in week 2 of a special week.
2 D, I don't like absolutes but I would say Almost Always should be two in a row, just leaving room for a format that might be beyond repair in the 2nd week.
3 B, minor changes or bans may be needed to make some formats playable.
I voted for 3/4, I enjoy the creativity of the Special weeks and rapid changing of the Meta to Normal weeks where the format is so tight now it leaves little room for innovation.
Should a special format run for two weeks at a time?
A. Never.
B. Rarely.
C. Occasionally.
D. Usually.
E. Always.
E. Although I like blind guessing at a metagame, 5CB is all about the metagame. Giving a chance to both blind guess the first week and react the second week is key to the format.
Poll 3:
If a special format runs two weeks, should the second week be exactly the same or mostly the same?
A. Exactly the same.
B. Mostly the same.
A. Exactly the same. If there is a degenerate deck that is very hard to metagame against (like the meddling mage decks in infinate cards) then banning a card or two can be appropriate. Otherwise there should be no changes.
There are no cards in M10 which look good for regular 5CB to me, but there's bound to be some interesting special round stuff in there. For example, I bet there's something interesting you can do with Hive Mind in Backbuild!
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Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize. Let's say he foils it:
He gets Spirit. If he plays djinn, i snuff it out and that breaks spirit recursion so he doesn't.
I play factory and beckon foil.
He swings in for 2 and i go to 16 (or 12 from snuff out if he played djinn)
I swing in for 1.
He can never attack again because factory can block+pump, and i beat for 1 every turn til he's dead.
Now let's say he doesn't foil it:
I hit foil. Now everything is exactly the same except he doesn't get spirit for free. he can play it off lotus, which is fine, but i still win for the reasons stated above.
Personman on the draw:
He plays djinn, nether spirit, or does nothing.
If he doesn't do anything, it's as if i'm on the play, which i win.
If he plays djinn, I thoughtseize either hitting foil or getting foiled and then snuff out djinn. In either case, he doesn't even ever get nether spirit, since lotus is gone and djinn is in his graveyard.
If he plays nether spirit, i play thoughtseize, he can pitch djinn to foil, but then i beckon something besides djinn, and again it's exactly the same.
I would not mind little changes like bannings in the second week. Also, little changes can help to fix any inheritant problems that get realized a little late. For those reasons, I picked B. For the most part, I would like them more or less identical, though changing it up to keep it interesting would be fun.
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Thanks for updating, Mogg! I can't believe I tied for first in my first 5CB game ever.
I just noticed also that math_geek appears to be tied with Niv for 8th at 54 points, yet only Niv got potm points. Is there some kind of tiebreaker that gets used in cases like that, or should there be 9 people in the top 8 this round?
"2.7c. Tiebreakers for top eight are as follows: number of matches in which a player wins both games, number of game wins, points scored against higher-scoring decks. If a tie is unresolved, both tied decks are counted."
I didn't know how to setup multiple polls, so please answer the last two questions either in the thread or via pm. I'll tally the results next week.
Poll 2:
Should a special format run for two weeks at a time?
A. Never.
B. Rarely.
C. Occasionally.
D. Usually.
E. Always.
Poll 3:
If a special format runs two weeks, should the second week be exactly the same or mostly the same?
A. Exactly the same.
B. Mostly the same.
Results
1 Mogg – Ajani Vengeant / Black Lotus / Chain of Vapor / Daze / Tundra
I still hate Planeswalkers and believe they shouldn't have been printed. That said, I like Ajani because it wins.
2 jordman – Arcane Denial / Daze / Mox Sapphire / Treetop Village / Tropical Island
The classic combo of counterspell that needs land and threat that taps lands main phase sets up a lot of draws.
3 Niv – Black Lotus / Channel / Darksteel Colossus / Decree of Silence / Lich's Mirror
In this deck, Phantom Warrior is likely better than Darksteel Colossus, and a threat that actually supplements your lock is even better.
4 FuriouslySleepingIdea – Angel of Despair / Black Lotus / Channel / Decree of Silence / Lich's Mirror
Though probably never relevant, Rishadan Brigand might be better than Angel, as a way to deal with untargettables (Progenitus, for example).
5 phoenix33 – Black Lotus / Foil / Indentured Djinn / Nether Spirit / Tundra
Reminds me why Magus deserves its ban. Surprisingly (to me), this deck won a lot of games by racing. Incidentally, Tundra over Island cost you two points (5-7), and your spot as the sole winner of the round.
6 Magus819 – Boseiju, Who Shelters All / Chain of Vapor / Flash / Island / Woodfall Primus
Since Chain of Vapor is only marginally effective following Primus, I wonder whether Disperse would be better – to use Boseiju (and avoid reciprocated Chains).
7 Some One – Dust Bowl / Mishra's Factory / Snuff Out / The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale / Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
The relative destructibility of Factory versus Dark Depths this round was a large factor. I still wonder which is the more consistent threat.
8 Halinn – Aura of Silence / Black Lotus / City of Traitors / Kodama of the North Tree / Soldevi Digger
Aura isn't quite what it once was. Your inability to do much of note on the draw was significant.
9 Personman – Beckon Apparition / Mishra's Factory / Snuff Out / Swamp / Thoughtseize
That two matches came down to a 1/1 flier was amusing, but there might be a more versatile card for that slot.
10 bateleur – Aura of Silence / Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Empty the Warrens / Yawgmoth's Will
Worked quite well, but I miss the ability to reliably beat single counters.
11 joedredd – Force Spike / Gemstone Caverns / Keldon Megaliths / Mishra's Factory / Volcanic Island
Compared with Foil, Force Spike leaves something to be desired.
12 dethwing – City of Traitors / Isochron Scepter / Lightning Helix / Powder Keg / Soldevi Digger
Being excessively slow was the main flaw. But Digger is still capable of making slow decks win.
13 Ram-Gang – Eureka / Havenwood Battleground / Havenwood Battleground / Illusions of Grandeur / Sky Swallower
Unfortunately, there were quite a lot of people who could respond to Illusions' trigger – making it leave play – and you could often play only an 8/8. Crystal Vein as the second land would give much-needed acceleration.
14 ced395 – Black Lotus / Master of the Wild Hunt / Path to Exile / Scrubland / Thoughtseize
You scored points equal to the number of the round in which Chimpanzee won with the first version of this deck. If only he played more recently.
15 math_geek – Chalice of the Void / Eater of Days / Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai / Mishra's Workshop / Smokestack
It's still solid, but suffers more from being somewhat slow than it did in its first round.
16 bman65 – Darksteel Reactor / Ensnaring Bridge / Mishra's Workshop / Sol Ring / Soldevi Digger
I was amused that lOput beat you, despite having no disruption; The hand empties leisurely. EDIT: I was also amused that my comment led to a correction, invalidating the original comment.
17 Farik – Ajani Vengeant / Black Lotus / Chain of Vapor / Daze / Tundra
See #1.
18 Madmanquail – Black Lotus / Mishra's Factory / Molten Slagheap / Nether Void / Ravenous Baboons
Void and Baboons complement each other nicely.
19 lOput – Anurid Scavenger / Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Empty the Warrens / Eternal Witness
Will would adequately accommodate Thougtseize-thrashing; I'm not sure why so much redundancy is necessary.
Results
X| 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
1| X 4 3 3 4 6 6 3 3 0 4 6 6 4 4 6 2 3 3 | 64
2| 1 X 3 3 0 0 0 1 0 1 1 1 6 1 0 3 1 0 1 | 20
3| 3 3 X 3 0 6 6 3 3 3 0 6 6 3 3 4 3 3 6 | 54
4| 3 3 3 X 0 6 6 3 3 3 0 6 6 3 3 6 3 3 6 | 56
5| 1 6 6 6 X 3 0 6 0 6 6 3 6 0 0 6 1 6 3 | 62
6| 0 6 0 0 3 X 2 2 0 0 6 6 6 1 1 2 0 0 0 | 34
7| 0 6 0 0 6 2 X 2 0 2 6 2 0 6 2 0 0 2 2 | 38
8| 3 4 3 3 0 2 2 X 1 3 6 6 2 3 3 6 3 3 3 | 46
9| 3 6 3 3 6 6 6 4 X 3 6 1 6 6 3 3 3 3 1 | 64
0| 6 4 3 3 0 6 2 3 3 X 0 6 6 3 3 6 6 3 6 | 62
1| 1 4 6 6 0 0 0 0 0 6 X 0 6 0 0 6 1 0 0 | 36
2| 0 4 0 0 3 0 2 0 4 0 6 X 0 6 1 6 0 0 6 | 37
3| 0 0 0 0 0 0 6 2 0 0 0 6 X 0 3 6 0 0 3 | 24
4| 1 4 3 3 6 4 0 3 0 3 6 0 6 X 3 0 1 3 3 | 42
5| 1 6 3 3 6 4 2 3 3 3 6 4 3 3 X 6 1 3 3 | 54
6| 0 3 1 0 0 2 6 0 3 0 0 0 0 6 0 X 0 0 6 | 25
7| 2 4 3 3 4 6 6 3 3 0 4 6 6 4 4 6 X 3 3 | 64
8| 3 6 3 3 0 6 2 3 3 3 6 6 6 3 3 6 3 X 3 | 58
9| 3 4 0 0 3 6 2 3 4 0 6 0 3 3 3 0 3 3 X | 38
1 Farik (17): 64
1 Mogg (1): 64
1 Personman (9): 64
4 bateleur (10): 62
4 phoenix33 (5): 62
6 Madmanquail (18): 58
7 FuriouslySleepingIdea (4): 56
8 Niv (3): 54
Farik, Mogg, and Personman win 5CB #90.
POTM Standings
1 bateleur: 162
2 Farik: 146
2 Madmanquail: 146
4 Mogg: 132
5 FuriouslySleepingIdea: 119
6 dethwing: 82
6 lOput: 82
8 math_geek: 66
9 Personman: 64
10 phoenix33: 62
11 Niv: 54
12 ced395: 20
13 WhammWhamme: 20
14 jordman: 16
0. Overview
Five Card Blind (5CB) is a weekly Magic tournament, run entirely within this forum. To compete, players submit five-card decks which are played against each other. Scoring assumes optimal play, without randomness or concealed information.
1. Game Rules
1.1. Except for the changes described in these rules, games follow the Magic: The Gathering Comprehensive Rules.
1.2. Players' decks contain exactly five cards, which begin the game in hand. Players do not mulligan or sideboard.
1.3. Players' libraries begin the game empty. A player does not lose the game as a result of being unable to draw a card.
1.4. A random effect produces the result that least benefits the owner of the source of the effect.
2. Tournament Rules
2.1. Players submit their decks to the 5CB moderator (Mogg).
2.2. A player may not submit a deck that can – against any deck – win the game or force more than one card in an opponent's hand to change zones before an opponent's second turn.
2.3. A deck may include any number of any card legal in Vintage (Type 1), with the exception of the following banned cards:
2.4. Each player plays one match, consisting of two games, against each other player. Each player is the starting player once per match. Results assume optimal play and perfect information.
2.5. Points determine tournament standings. Players are ranked, first to last, in order of decreasing number of points.
2.6. In rounds of twenty or more players, players are divided randomly into equally-sized heats of n players, where n is the number of players divided by ten (rounded down).
2.7. The player with the most points over the course of a month becomes the Player of the Month.
Season 1
March 2005
Round 1 r_x, Greebo, zorbop
Round 2 Ankh-Morpokian
Round 3 Greebo
Round 4 Chimpanzee
POTM: Greebo
April 2005
Round 5 help im a bug, Draco9_1_1 (Only Creatures)
Round 6 Greebo (Only Creatures)
Round 7 spuzzem king
Round 8 bateleur
POTM: spuzzem king
May 2005
Round 9 Feyd_Ruin (Only Multicolor)
Round 10 jcsuperstar (Only Multicolor)
Round 11 Lone Warrior
Round 12 Wanderer359
POTM: WhammWhamme
June 2005
Round 13 Silver Seraph, Greebo (Titania's Song)
Round 14 WhammWhamme (Titania's Song)
Round 15 Tahn (Artist Tribute)
Round 16 Lone Warrior (Artist Tribute)
POTM: bateleur, Greebo
July 2005
Round 17 Shadowlord
Round 18 bateleur
Round 19 Shadowlord (Pay 19: Add 1)
Round 20 Greebo (Pay 19: Add 1)
POTM: Shadowlord
August 2005
Round 21 Greebo
Round 22 Greebo
Round 23 spuzzem king (One-Million Life)
Round 24 WhammWhamme (One-Million Life)
POTM: Greebo
September 2005
Round 25 Chimpanzee, Shadowlord
Round 26 dasheiff
Round 27 Chimpanzee (Orrery)
Round 28 Halinn (Orrery)
POTM: jcsuperstar
October 2005
Round 29 Beaker
Round 30 Feuerdrache, Wanderer359
Round 31 r_x (Dream Halls)
Round 32 Puzzle (Dream Halls)
POTM: Chimpanzee
November 2005
Round 33 bateleur
Round 34 Shadowlord
Round 35 jcsuperstar (Backbuild)
Round 36 jcsuperstar (Backbuild)
POTM: bateleur
December 2005
Round 37 bateleur
Round 38 Wanderer359
Round 39 WhammWhamme (Ban a Card)
Round 40 dasheiff, Lone Warrior (Ban a Card)
POTM: Beaker
January 2006
Round 41 Lone Warrior
Round 42 Silver Seraph
Round 43 Trojan (1984)
Round 44 Beaker (1984)
POTM: Lone Warrior
February 2006
Round 45 bateleur
Round 46 Halinn
Round 47 bateleur (7 Life)
Round 48 Chimpanzee (7 Life)
POTM: bateleur
March 2006
Round 49 armlx
Round 50 bateleur
Round 51 armlx (Leyline)
Round 52 Chimpanzee, Greebo (Leyline)
POTM: armlx
April 2006
Round 53 jcsuperstar
Round 54 armlx
Round 55 bateleur (Epic)
Round 56 Xyre (Epic)
POTM: jcsuperstar
May 2006
Round 57 jcsuperstar
Round 58 Pingele_Pats (Banathon)
Round 59 Amadi (Banathon)
Round 60 Solitaire (Banathon)
POTM: Pingele_Pats
June 2006
Round 61 Farik (One-Million Life)
Round 62 Wrath_of_Dog, zu_Faul (Leyline)
Round 63 Beaker (7 Life)
POTM: silicon
July 2006
Round 64 Pingele_Pats (Multi-Set)
Round 65 WhammWhamme, zu_Faul (Extended)
POTM: None
September 2007
Round 1 (Introduction)
Round 2 andelijah
POTM: None
October 2007
Round 3 Mogg
Round 4 Chimpanzee (Lorwyn)
Round 5 Meat Popsicle (Repeat Letters)
Round 6 Mogg (10 Life)
POTM: Mogg
November 2007
Round 7 Death_By_Beebles
Round 8 jcsuperstar (Mindslaver)
Round 9 Mogg (Thanksgiving Special)
Round 10 Mogg (Thanksgiving Special, Part Two)
POTM: Mogg
December 2007
Round 11 carrion pigeons
Round 12 Mogg (Later Alphabet)
Round 13 Mogg (Backbuild)
Round 14 Xyre (Backbuild)
POTM: Mogg
January 2008
Round 15 armlx
Round 16 Chimpanzee (Auras)
Round 17 Mogg (Doubling Season)
Round 18 carrion pigeons, Chimpanzee (Doubling Season)
Round 19 WhammWhamme (31 Bans)
POTM: Mogg
February 2008
Round 20 Chimpanzee
Round 21 Mogg (Combat)
Round 22 Mogg (Combat)
Round 23 Knowledge
POTM: Mogg
March 2008
Round 24 Mogg (Consecutive Names)
Round 25 Chimpanzee (Consecutive Names)
Round 26 The Mad Tapper
Round 27 The Mad Tapper
POTM: The Mad Tapper
April 2008
Round 28 The Mad Tapper (DC5)
Round 29 jcsuperstar (DC5)
Round 30 jcsuperstar (< 20)
Round 31 bateleur
POTM: bateleur
May 2008
Round 32 WhammWhamme (Leyline)
Round 33 Silver Seraph (Mana Market)
Round 34 bateleur (Helm of Awakening and Mirari)
Round 35 Alfred (Pre-entered Decks)
POTM: bateleur
June 2008
Round 36 bateleur
Round 37 WhammWhamme (Favorite Colors)
Round 38 YuanTi (Lotus)
Round 39 Mogg (Mogg Week)
POTM: WhammWhamme
July 2008
Round 40 bateleur (Mulligans)
Round 41 Mogg
Round 42 Chimpanzee
Round 43 ced395 (Even)
POTM: Mogg
August 2008
Round 44 WhammWhamme (Odd)
Round 45 Farik (No Bans)
Round 46 Mogg
POTM: Error1
September 2008
Round 47 ghweiss (Low-Scoring)
Round 48 theeguy (Backbuild, Part Two)
Round 49 Mogg
Round 50 Mogg (50 Life)
Round 51 Error1 (Landline)
POTM: Mogg
October 2008
Round 52 Shogun17 (Exploration)
Round 53 MT_Gunn (Multicolor Discount)
Round 54 Silkenfist (2-2)
Round 55 bateleur, WhammWhamme
POTM: Error1
November 2008
Round 56 Error1 (Colorless Creatures)
Round 57 Knowledge, Silkenfist (Legendary Creatures)
POTM: None
December 2008
Round 58 (Introduction)
Round 59 Halinn
Round 60 Halinn
Round 61 ced395 (Christmas Special)
Round 62 MyNameIsFourteen (New Year's Special)
POTM: None
January 2009
Round 63 Mogg
Round 64 Mogg (Nemesis)
Round 65 MyNameIsFourteen (Nemesis)
Round 66 Mogg
POTM: Mogg
February 2009
Round 67 Chimpanzee
Round 68 MyNameIsFourteen (Lovely Letters)
Round 69 Naphtali (Lovely Letters, Part 2)
Round 70 bateleur
POTM: bateleur
March 2009
Round 71 ced395, Chimpanzee
Round 72 ced395 (Activated)
Round 73 WhammWhamme (Activated)
Round 74 bateleur
POTM: Chimpanzee
April 2009
Round 75 Xyre
Round 76 Mogg, ngollon (Landline-Orrery)
Round 77 Mogg (Landline-Orrery)
Round 78 Mogg
POTM: Mogg
May 2009
Round 79 bateleur
Round 80 ced395 (Upwelling)
Round 81 Mogg (Upwelling)
Round 82 Halinn
Round 83 r_x_
New Player Round math_geek
POTM: Mogg
June 2009
Round 84 Kekekekeke (Block Party)
Round 85 FuriouslySleepingIdea (Block Party)
Round 86 Mogg
Round 87 Farik
POTM: Mogg
July 2009
Round 88 bateleur, dethwing (Infinite Cards)
Round 89 Farik, lOput (Infinite Cards)
Round 90 Farik, Mogg, Personman
Wins Per Player
Rounds
Mogg: 24
bateleur: 17
Chimpanzee: 12
WhammWhamme: 10
Greebo: 8
jcsuperstar: 8
ced395: 5
Farik: 5
Halinn: 5
armlx: 4
Lone Warrior: 4
Shadowlord: 4
Beaker: 3
MyNameIsFourteen: 3
r_x_: 3
Silver Seraph: 3
The Mad Tapper: 3
Wanderer359: 3
Xyre: 3
carrion pigeons: 2
dasheiff: 2
Error1: 2
help im a bug: 1
Knowledge: 2
Pingele_Pats: 2
Silkenfist: 2
spuzzem king: 2
zu_Faul: 2
Alfred: 1
Amadi: 1
andelijah: 1
Ankh-Morpokian: 1
Death By Beebles: 1
dethwing: 1
Draco9_1_1: 1
Feuerdrache: 1
Feyd_Ruin: 1
FuriouslySleepingIdea: 1
ghweiss: 1
Kekekekeke: 1
lOput: 1
Meat Popsicle: 1
MT Gunn: 1
Naphtali: 1
ngollon: 1
Personman: 1
Puzzle: 1
Shogun17: 1
Solitaire: 1
Tahn: 1
theeguy: 1
Trojan: 1
Wrath_of_Dog: 1
YuanTi: 1
zorbop: 1
POTM
Mogg: 11
bateleur: 6
Greebo: 3
Chimpanzee: 2
Error1: 2
jcsuperstar: 2
WhammWhamme: 2
armlx: 1
Beaker: 1
Lone Warrior: 1
Pingele_Pats: 1
Shadowlord: 1
silicon: 1
spuzzem king: 1
The Mad Tapper: 1
Dom Camus
Five Card Blind
Nick Chandler-Klein:
Three Card Blind: A Whole Different Format (Part 1)
Three Card Blind: A Whole Different Format (Part 2)
Three Card Blind: A Whole Different Format (Part 3)
Alex Hoffman:
Going Blind: A First Look at Lands
Going Blind: A Non-Basic Approach
Going Blind: Metagaming – Being Overly Analytical
Going Blind: Metagaming #2 – All Decked Out
Going Blind: XCB Metagaming – A Prolonged Conclusion
Deck Submission Deadline:
Friday, July 24th, 2:00 pm PST.
Please use this thread to discuss any aspect of 5CB. Also, consider a subscription to 5CB. Subscribed players who have not already submitted a deck receive a reminder PM about two days before deadline. PM me to subscribe.
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
By the way, why am I listed twice in the leaderboard?
When I calculate POTM, I copy the list from the previous week and add in the scores from the new round. Apparently, I added you for 50 last week without noticing you already had 13. It's fixed now, and your score considerably improves when you're only one player.
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
I see only one. What am I missing?
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
Q3: B, because if a format's broken then bannings are important.
And whilst I'm talking about polls, my answer to question one depends a bit on how dynamic the normal format is. Across the last year or so it's been quite dynamic, but the more it stagnates the less of it I want to see, generally.
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
Should a special format run for two weeks at a time?
A. Never.
B. Rarely.
C. Occasionally.
D. Usually.
E. Always.
Poll 3:
If a special format runs two weeks, should the second week be exactly the same or mostly the same?
A. Exactly the same. (exception=bannings)
B. Mostly the same.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Poll 3:B
Regarding your comment for my deck I don't see how l0put manages to win.
Regardless of going 1st or second I must get at least 2 turns (otherwise deck violates the rules).
Turn 1. Factory, Sol Ring (tap for mana), Reactor
Turn 2. Use factory to play bridge, and use sol ring for digger.
Since cards in hand is zero, he can't attack, and therefore can't win in any way i can see.
Personman (9) Against Halinn (8):
9 Personman – Beckon Apparition / Mishra's Factory / Snuff Out / Swamp / Thoughtseize
8 Halinn – Aura of Silence / Black Lotus / City of Traitors / Kodama of the North Tree / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play, I go swamp, thoughtseize lotus.
He goes City, Digger.
I go Factory, beckon lotus.
He can never play kodama, and thus can never damage me ever or destroy my token or my factory. I eventually swing for the win.
Personman on the draw, he drops kodama immediately (or later, it doesn't matter). Whenever he does, I immediately beckon lotus. If he does it right away, he gets in two swings with kodama, putting me at 8, but then I can double block and pump factory to trade, puting me at 6 and making the game a draw.
Should be 1-0-1 Personman instead of 2-0 Halinn.
---
vs. dethwing (12):
12 dethwing – City of Traitors / Isochron Scepter / Lightning Helix / Powder Keg / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize lightning helix
He goes city, digger
I beckon helix. His win condition is gone. He can Powder Keg all my guys, so i can't win either, but it should be a draw.
Personman on the draw: I obviously lose.
Should be 1-0-1 dethwing, not 2-0 dethwing
----
vs. bman65 (16):
16 bman65 – Darksteel Reactor / Ensnaring Bridge / Mishra's Workshop / Sol Ring / Soldevi Digger
Personman on the play:
Thoughtseize sol ring
He plays workshop, digger
Beckon sol ring
Now he can never play darksteel reactor, and ensnaring bridge can't stop my beckon token, so I win.
Personman on the draw: I obviously lose.
Should be 1-1, not 2-0 bman65
---
vs. IOput (19):
19 lOput – Anurid Scavenger / Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Empty the Warrens / Eternal Witness
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize a lotus.
He goes lotus, witness for lotus, lotus, scavenger
I beckon a lotus and drop factory.
He can't play empty anymore, so it's down to scavenger and witness on his side and factory and the beckon token on my side.
He swings with both and i go to 13.
I do nothing, but can now pump factory.
He sacs a lotus for nothing to keep scavenger around.
If he attacks with just scavenger, i block with factory and pump to trade. From then on I get in with the token and can always block witness. If he attacks with just witness i block-pump, get in with the token, he recurs witness for nothing, repeat. If he attacks with both I block-pump to kill scavenger and block with the token to kill witness and then it's a draw.
Personman on the draw: I lose SO HARD.
Should be 1-0-1 IOput instead of 2-0 IOput
----
That's all the matches I have time to examine right now, but it looks like there's a general trend of you not noticing that I could thoughtseize+beckon a lotus or other nonland mana source, so I wouldn't be surprised if some of my other matches are wrong too.
Anyway, thanks so much for doing the analysis, this is a lot of fun, and I expect I'll be sticking around.
EDIT: Poll questions 2 & 3:
Question 2: E. Always. I like the idea of watching a mini-metagame evolve quickly.
Question 3: B. Mostly. Minor changes to fix really, really broken things are fine, but letting the players evolve their own solutions to apparent brokenness first round is an even better solution, so I would like to see only very conservative changes in week 2 of a special week.
3 B, minor changes or bans may be needed to make some formats playable.
I voted for 3/4, I enjoy the creativity of the Special weeks and rapid changing of the Meta to Normal weeks where the format is so tight now it leaves little room for innovation.
Should a special format run for two weeks at a time?
A. Never.
B. Rarely.
C. Occasionally.
D. Usually.
E. Always.
E. Although I like blind guessing at a metagame, 5CB is all about the metagame. Giving a chance to both blind guess the first week and react the second week is key to the format.
Poll 3:
If a special format runs two weeks, should the second week be exactly the same or mostly the same?
A. Exactly the same.
B. Mostly the same.
A. Exactly the same. If there is a degenerate deck that is very hard to metagame against (like the meddling mage decks in infinate cards) then banning a card or two can be appropriate. Otherwise there should be no changes.
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
I don't know what the tiebreaker is, but I have more 6s and less 2s
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
Personman vs. phoenix33
9 Personman – Beckon Apparition / Mishra's Factory / Snuff Out / Swamp / Thoughtseize
5 phoenix33 – Black Lotus / Foil / Indentured Djinn / Nether Spirit / Tundra
Personman on the play:
I thoughtseize. Let's say he foils it:
He gets Spirit. If he plays djinn, i snuff it out and that breaks spirit recursion so he doesn't.
I play factory and beckon foil.
He swings in for 2 and i go to 16 (or 12 from snuff out if he played djinn)
I swing in for 1.
He can never attack again because factory can block+pump, and i beat for 1 every turn til he's dead.
Now let's say he doesn't foil it:
I hit foil. Now everything is exactly the same except he doesn't get spirit for free. he can play it off lotus, which is fine, but i still win for the reasons stated above.
Personman on the draw:
He plays djinn, nether spirit, or does nothing.
If he doesn't do anything, it's as if i'm on the play, which i win.
If he plays djinn, I thoughtseize either hitting foil or getting foiled and then snuff out djinn. In either case, he doesn't even ever get nether spirit, since lotus is gone and djinn is in his graveyard.
If he plays nether spirit, i play thoughtseize, he can pitch djinn to foil, but then i beckon something besides djinn, and again it's exactly the same.
Should be 2-0 Personman instead of 0-0-2.
E. Usually they should be two in a row
B. Mostly the Same
I would not mind little changes like bannings in the second week. Also, little changes can help to fix any inheritant problems that get realized a little late. For those reasons, I picked B. For the most part, I would like them more or less identical, though changing it up to keep it interesting would be fun.
I just noticed also that math_geek appears to be tied with Niv for 8th at 54 points, yet only Niv got potm points. Is there some kind of tiebreaker that gets used in cases like that, or should there be 9 people in the top 8 this round?
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy