For those of you who don't mind, here's my issue; for some weeks (if not months) now, I have been (what appears to be) depressed. I know that I'm 16, and that I'm going through emotional things right now, but it seems pretty serious. I mean, it's not like I have anything to compare it to, I've just never felt like this before.
I tend to over-analyze things as it is, and when I get upset about something, I just can't help but hate myself even more because I feel like I have no right to be upset or depressed. I'm pretty well off, at least I know I'll never have to worry about losing my house or anything dramatic like that. Why can't I be happy with what I have?
For instance, yesterday I had a problem with my mom. I had been doing homework the entire day (literally it ended up being from 8AM until 9PM), and she told me to go to the gym (yeah, both of us have weight problems). I explained to her that I could already tell I would be doing homework until God knows when, and she just said fine and she told me to do whatever I wanted, and that she didn't care anymore. This seriously bothered me. I used to be able to shrug these things off before, but this time I felt miserable. The worse part was that I had no reason, I just sat down amidst all of my papers in total silence, feeling almost completely numb, ready to break down at any minute. It was like I couldn't handle anything negative at all.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that recently, everything has been negative to me. Any happiness I've felt seems to just be a distraction from reality, which seems to be synonymous with misery. I feel like life has no point, like I'm waiting for each day and every thing I do to just be over with. I just feel like I don't know what to do, like there's something I'm not understanding, something I desperately need to be happy. I feel like my life is flying past me at full speed, opportunities smacking me in the face and flying by, and I just can't reach out and get them. I feel like I'm just tolerating life, like I'm literally living with nothing to live for, life I'm just living for the sole purpose of dying someday.
I guess I'm coming here mostly because I don't know what to do. I can't talk to my mother. I mean I've tried, but all that does is make her upset, which in turn makes me even more miserable. I've talked to my dad about this, but he was no help at all. He basically advocates living life from one happy moment to the next, and that is a "Been There, Tried That" for me already. I need some guidance, I feel like I'm at the end of the road, and I really haven't a clue where to go now.
It's hard to say what would work for you, and I'm sorry the answers aren't always clear. The best thing you could do is visit a psychiatrist or psychologist who would know far more about this than any of us would. They would likely want to prescribe medication, and unless you have significant reason not to, I'd suggest you take it.
But in case you can't do that, and I couldn't when I went through it around the same age as you, I'll relate my own experience. Mine was similar to yours, though I knew why it was I couldn't experience happiness, or at least there was a cause. I was prone to strong emotional episodes, but on the whole I was in a state of apathy.
It went on for four months, but Christmas came around, my family went to Disneyland, and I became positively obsessed with Disneyland. It was the sole source of happiness in my life, and I latched onto it. Probably not the healthiest thing in the world, but there it is. After about a year of that, I phased back into normality.
There's more to the story, but I'll refrain from those details unless you'd like to hear them, as it ends with going to see a psychologist.
From that experience, what I can tell you is that you need to break the line of thought when it comes. Challenge your sad thoughts with happy ones, or sad points of view with happier ones. Recognize depressed thought as depressed, and know that it's not the only possible one, not the correct one. It's difficult, but important. Depressed thinking is a cycle that feeds itself, but if you can break the loop you can usually work your way out of it. See if a solid, trustworthy friend can help you with it, or see about making a friend like that.
Other than that, all I can think of is that you should work on seeing a doctor. If you can't drive, take the bus, or ask someone you trust to help you out. I went to a teacher I could trust and she helped me enormously.
I hope I've been of some help.
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
Having a goal to be happy is a bad goal. You need to have a goal that will make you happy. Also as effiment as it sounds, you shouldn't be afriad to tell your mother, that what she said hurt your feelings and that my responcibiles may see not much to you but they are a lot for me and school is very importain.
It's fairly simple. Go see a psychiatrist/psychotherapist. It's what they're there for.
You might also want to know that people with depression often get spontaneous remission. What that means is if you wait long enough, the depression will go away. But I still recommend a therapist.
The problem is, I'm 16. I can't exactly go to a psychiatrist without my parents doing all of the paperwork and (at least until June) driving me there themselves. And that kinda ties into the whole thing about not knowing how to approach my parents. My dad hates doctors, especially psychologists/psychiatrists, and my mom would end up having issues as well if her son has to go to a psychiatrist at 16 years old (that's how she'd look at it)....
How do I ask them?
@Zith: Thanks, you were very helpful. I agreed with everything except this:
Quote from Zith »
They would likely want to prescribe medication, and unless you have significant reason not to, I'd suggest you take it.
My gut/knee-jerk reaction is to say absolutely not. I guess it's because I want to find out a way to be permanently happy, really happy, not just in a fake, artificially-induced state of happiness. I don't know though, maybe artificial happiness is better than real misery.....
The problem is, I'm 16. I can't exactly go to a psychiatrist without my parents doing all of the paperwork and (at least until June) driving me there themselves. And that kinda ties into the whole thing about not knowing how to approach my parents. My dad hates doctors, especially psychologists/psychiatrists, and my mom would end up having issues as well if her son has to go to a psychiatrist at 16 years old (that's how she'd look at it)....
How do I ask them?
This is about you, not them, and it's not selfish at all for you to say so. Make sure they're aware of that.
My parents basically forced me into counseling for children of divorced parents, and that's one thing they emphasized - that if you're having problems, it's about you, not about what they think about your problems.
@Zith: Thanks, you were very helpful. I agreed with everything except this:
<insert comment about meds>
My gut/knee-jerk reaction is to say absolutely not. I guess it's because I want to find out a way to be permanently happy, really happy, not just in a fake, artificially-induced state of happiness. I don't know though, maybe artificial happiness is better than real misery.....
All throughout high school, I was one of those angsty kids (that's probably why they forced counseling on me). My dad disagreed sharply with the so-called necessity of medication. And even though I still feel the effects of depression, I turned out somewhat alright without popping anything.
That isn't for everyone, though. I'm not saying I'm Superman or something, but it was really hard for me to cope, and now I'm suffering the consequences of dealing with it cold-turkey. You're sixteen. You're about to make a lot of choices that will affect how your life turns out. Sometimes you've got to prioritize, and you can only have so much on your plate at once. I'm in community college now instead of an actual four-year institution, and I've got to fight my way into a bachelor's degree program.
As I've never taken medication, I can't give you first-hand advice in that respect, but I can tell you it's hard to go clean through it all. At the same time, though, I'm living proof that it's possible to do it.
It's all a matter of whether or not you're willing to fight for your life.
It's fairly simple. Go see a psychiatrist/psychotherapist. It's what they're there for.
You might also want to know that people with depression often get spontaneous remission. What that means is if you wait long enough, the depression will go away. But I still recommend a therapist.
K, I'ma preface this very LONG post with a caveat. I'm not a practicing physician and you have to take this with your own judgement. I have, however, dealt with recurring depressions and seen family members do the same.
For the average person, going to see a therapist is a great leap of faith. It comes with a stigma, even if nobody else knows, you know. As for waiting for depression to lift on its own, sometimes it does, but can you really afford to wait while the rest of your life goes into limbo, the things you've worked hard to accomplish falling apart before your eyes while you wait, and wait, and wait for your spirit to come back?
It's no surprise your mom seems to have trouble communicating with you. People around a depressed person often can't figure out what is wrong and only perceive the withdrawn and moody part, not the sadness and helplessness. You seem to them to be not listening on purpose. It's no fun to be around someone who's depressed, and it makes them short with you. It's their perception, and it colors their response to you. It's wrong, and unfair, but perceptions are hard to change.
Add to that a natural reluctance to believe that depression is real, that it is common, and that it can affect you or someone in your family. Denial keeps a lot of chronically depressed people from ever feeling okay again.
Go find someone you trust not to talk down to you or talk at you or break your confidence. A minister, a nurse, a doctor, or a very good friend in the community who's seen a little of the world and had some hard knocks himself. Tell him or her about it exactly the way you've told us. Be brief and to the point. You want help, maybe not from them, but could they help you find a source of help they trust?
You have to decide when and how you wish to reveal your inquiry into this to your parents. I'll assume because of your age, you don't have the money or liberty to seek your own counseling or treatment. It's one of the hardest things to do, tell your parents you have an emotional problem. It is important to frame the question correctly, not just saying "I think" or "I am" but "I talked with _______ and we seem to agree I feel this way" . Set up a quiet relaxed time and place to do this. Guaranteed, if you throw this out there while you are in an argument it will be taken poorly. A calm, quiet setting will help you say what you need to say clearly, and help the other person listen better and with an open mind.
Ultimately you do need to find out what is making you depressed. Depression itself is frequently an end result of something else: chronic stress, social isolation, low self-esteem, and hormonal changes. It could even be something physical, like low or high thyroid, or sleep apnea.
A good start would be to get a comprehensive medical history and physical. You can't fix what you can't see. By far most depression is due to psychosocial causes, but it is frequently a symptom in common with a lot of medical ailments which are easily missed.
Work with your doctor to determine what you are willing to try for this. Depression almost always seems to be the final common pathway for many different processes: it is a failure to adapt, a helplessness in the face of something implacable and inexorable in your life. Whether it's chronic anxiety and stress, chronic social maladjustment, physical or psychological abuse, social isolation, physical disability or ailments, or a significant undiagnosed learning disability which has you on the ropes, it's the end of your reserve, but potentially the beginning of a new approach to life.
Until you find the root causes of your depression it's helpful to try talking about your feelings, getting in touch with your perceptions and judgments, and sometimes taking medicine to stabilize your mood, and help you tone down the self-directed negative thoughts and reactions that depressed people seem to be stuck in. Depression is the essence of chronicity, takes awhile for you to get that way and so it won't disappear overnight. It may take weeks, months, or years of hammering away at your life to shape things up. You may find yourself discovering new strengths and susceptibilities you never knew you had; and the insight and empathy to know not only how other people feel about you when you were depressed, but how others look, feel, and think when they're depressed too.
So please look into it, at least you've made the first step and recognized you are in a serious rut and need a hand out of it. Many many many are the people who have never even gotten that far, have lived in misery or died never even knowing how low they'd lain and that the problem was indeed a valid one.
Feuerdrache + SDA: Thanks, I appreciate your responses.
Quote from SDA »
Ultimately you do need to find out what is making you depressed. Depression itself is frequently an end result of something else: chronic stress, social isolation, low self-esteem, and hormonal changes.
If you dad has problems with doctors, tell him that while you're sorry that he has a disturst for them, you don't, and that you feel you could benefit by visiting one.
As for your mom, explain to her how you've been feeling, and that you feel extremely hurt when dealt with negativity, and ask her to try to go along with that and to make an effort to avoid saying things she now knows will hurt you.
A doctor is good to talk to, but a close friend or family member is also invaluable. You need somebody you can completely trust to explain the situation to without worrying about judgment, so think if you know anybody like that. The best thing to do is confide your problems with somebody. By releasing your negativity, you can easily take a more positive outlook on things. I had depression a few years back myself, and it worked wonders for me.
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"If the world should blow itself up, the last audible voice would be that of an expert saying it can't be done." - Sir Peter Ustinov
Why not try talking to a school counselor rather than a psychologist. They are there for reasons other than just helping you work out your schedule for next year. It would also be a very simple step that wouldn't involve your parents.
My gut instinct is that you just have a case of being 16 years old. You get up, you go to school, you come home, you mess around all day, you go to bed. The school year doesn't progress any faster; it just ticks along at its own pace and you can't do a lot to speed it up. I remember when I was younger being relatively bored with things and just not thrilled. Your life just doesn't seem to really be going anywhere and the little things can be frustrating/aggravating. Additionally, I gather from your avatar that you're probably not religious; I can honestly say that it doesn't help one's morale. I don't say that to imply that you SHOULD be religious, as that is your own choice; it's just that I know from personal experience wanting to believe in something but not being able to can be trying.
So, if nothing else, I suggest talking to a school counselor, as I think a psychiatrist is a little too far right now.
Why not try talking to a school counselor rather than a psychologist. They are there for reasons other than just helping you work out your schedule for next year. It would also be a very simple step that wouldn't involve your parents.
I was gonna suggest the exact same thing when I first started reading the thread, and I'm a little surprised no one else did before. They are trained to help with these kinds of things, and it comes up a lot more than some people would like to believe. I couple of my friends have had troubles with it in the past, and a fair number of them have regular appointments to help with it.
And the whole family thing, I'm huge with the whole openess thing, and if they are vehemently opposed to it, that's horribly selfish of them. But if you really feel you can't talk to them, again, the guidance counsellors at your school might be able to help with that even, by either help you find a way to tell them, or maybe organizing something through the school to get to a professional of the subject.
And on the subject of drugs, I understand the fear of them, sticking strange chemicals in you can be a little wierd, and I try to avoid them unless I really need them, but I also recognize that they are well designed and do what they promise. They also aren't going to make you happy all the time, they'll balance things out so you can deal with things yourself
Why were you doing homework for that long anyway? Doing the same thing like that for a long time is bad for you.
Also what kind of stuff do you eat and drink?
Another suggestion- start reading some philosophy. Do some preliminarly looks and see if some kind of philosophy appeals to you, and then start to read it, and think about it. I felt like you sometimes when I was young, though not all the time. But I hardly ever did once one of my teachers got me onto existentialism, which I really enjoyed learning about. I wouldn't recommend existentialism in particular to most people (for most people it could do more harm then good ;)) but a lot of philosophy is very positive and can help you have a better outlook on life... a clearer lens to view it through, to be overly cliche.
In reply to your comments about antidepressants, they don't make you artificially happy. Their real purpose is helping you break out of depressed thought and letting you think clearly. Many people say they do nothing for them, and it's because they feel the medication will solve all their problems without any effort on their part. At least, this is my experience.
I'm currently on antidepressants, and I don't walk around with a doofy smile on my face and artificial happiness all around me. What I can do is think about my problem without feeling it's hopeless, and that's something I couldn't do before the medication.
A school counselor is an excellent choice that should be very accessible. Also, psychiatrists and psychologists can be visited without your folks finding out if you can get to them. You must specifically permit them to notify anyone of the visit. The same is true for school counselors, by the way - unless I'm very wrong.
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
Dark Knight, Im gonna copy SnoopDoggAtog when I say that these arent from a real psychiatrist, but rather my personal experiences with depression. Also, SDA, if you said anything that Im saying, please pardon me. I have a problem reading super-long posts.
Basically, Dark Knight, you're 16...I remember 16...problems galore...HS sucked, working, which sucked, tons of HW, which also sucked, and it went from one problem to another, to another...then I met a girl I really liked, and already had a self-esteem issue, so I lied to her about myself, which triggered a big lying compulsion that Im finally over (Im 21 now). The trick to getting through depression is to find an escape. I found my escape in Douglas Adams' "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy." What a great series...philosophical, hilarious, and a perfect escape...read 3 chapters a night, and see how much better you feel...Any book whose introduction concludes with instructions on How To Leave The Planet gets an A+ in my book...dont let the problems get to you...besides, after realizing that you sound like a human version of Marvin the Paranoid Android, you learn that you BETTER bust out of this soon...Marvin's great, but did anyone else want to choke him to death?
The problem with teenagers and young adults these days is that computers, TV, video games have made us all lazy. hell, Im on the comp now, and class starts in 20 minutes, and I have a 45 minute bus ride up there...plus Im still not showered...worked all night last night...slept all morning. Find an escape that you enjoy...go to the gym, find a friend and go...talk to a girl you like in school to go with you...doesnt have to be anything more than gym sessions, but if so, you have the gym to thank for giving you time to get to know her. Maybe even some romance in the works, but that cant be rushed.
But seriously, just relax...antidepressants are not the answer, and as per my own personal experiences, because I felt the same way, dont go talking to a psychiatrist, or even a school counselor. Find a friend. I once told a counselor that I was thinking of changing schools to a place that doesnt depress me, and she took it as I was gonna kill myself, and takes me to the hospital, where they keep me in a psych ward for a few days...not worth it, sorry!! I dont trust counselors because they dont know me. My friends do. My friends know what I need...Your friends know what you need. Go out, enjoy, and pull your best friend aside and ask for help with whatever's troubling you...
You should probably got to the fitness centre or do any other sports/hobby instead of sitting at your desk learning the whole day!
No wonder that you're depressed I'd freak out after 13 h :ositting in my room and learning.
Although i won't go into why i disagree with just shrugging it off as a emo period, I will agree with exercise and staying active and involved in things that matter to you, they will help you keep your wits and perspective, and help take your mind off the things that bug you.
Exercise releases endorphins and improves blood flow to your brain. That can help ease depression and help you sleep better. It doesn't have to be marathons or weight lifting just enough to make you feel your circulation pick up and your body warm. Run the engine, flush the system a little every day.
@Girlfriends: IMO it's hard to get out there and put your best foot forward dating if you feel crummy. Be friendly, meet new people of both sexes, but don't push yourself to some ideal of getting and keeping a romantic confidante. It's a double danger when you're feeling low, to have high expectations and be hurt easily, and to be overly needy or emotionally numbed towards the other person. These types of relationships don't often last long so give yourself time to recover and heal your situation before taking on the goal of finding a girlfriend.
If you already have one, be honest with her that you're having a rough time right now and gauge her understanding of this. She could be a great source of moral support for you whatever you're going through.
@ orion: Escape is only a temporary aid to numb the pain. Ultimately you have to examine your life and face your problems in order to get out of a rut and stay out of it in the future. It takes work and time, but it's worth it. Whatever way you choose to face your situation, good luck to you.
yes, but in my experiences, an escape works in the sense that it takes your mind off your problems enough that you can examine your life without bringing back the emptiness that you feel with depression
I agree with SnoopDoggAtog, except to say that an escape which makes you happy can have real benefit. You have to face your troubles, but doing so with an element of fun to your life is easier than without it. Just don't get too wrapped up in it - which is to say, it's not really an escape, just putting fun in your life.
Exercize, good eating and good sleeping habits go a very long ways when battling depression. McDonald's is not a good plan just now, and getting 8-10 hours of sleep every night is more important than getting all your homework done.
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
Exercize, good eating and good sleeping habits go a very long ways when battling depression. McDonald's is not a good plan just now, and getting 8-10 hours of sleep every night is more important than getting all your homework done.
This is all totally true. Also sunlight is importaint to get. Yeah I know it sounds stupid but it is.
why would you be stuck working on homework for that long? i have 4 AP classes and am doing a sport and i still don't have that much work. maybe you procrastinate really badly. if academics is too much for you, take easier classes next year. it's not smart to get depressed and have your grades decline.
personally, my advice is not to take antidepressants (statistics have shown that they do no help. this is as ppl think, now i'm so depressed i even have to take antidepressants and just get more depressed). the way to fix everything is to just stop caring about others anymore. i know it's sad but it's the best way to deal with things. when you don't care if your mother dies tommorrow anymore, you will have a lot less stress.
also, don't take it out omn yourself. i know that this isn't always appropriate but if you're on the verge of suicide, i'm sure that person doesn't that you're blaming doesn't mind that you're taking it out on them if it is keeping you from klling yourself. this is how i look at it. think in the lines of this... "i'm so small. i'm so pathetic. what can i do? it's not like i could of done anything about it... if so and so have been more considerate, none of this would of happened." this mentality has gotten me through life ever since 8th grade.
If he can tick one more condition that he hasnt mentioned yet he may be clinically depressed.
Mkay, I'll look at it.
Major Depressive Episode
A. Five (or more) of the following symptoms have been present during the same 2-week period and represent a change from previous functioning; at least one of the symptoms is either (1) depressed mood or (2) loss of interest or pleasure.
two week period met Yep, I agree with this one. Note: Do note include symptoms that are clearly due to a general medical condition, or mood-incongruent delusions or hallucinations.
(1) depressed mood most of the day, nearly every day, as indicated by either subjective report (e.g., feels sad or empty) or observation made by others (e.g., appears tearful). Note: In children and adolescents, can be irritable mood. condition seems met to me Tick
(2) markedly diminished interest or pleasure in all, or almost all, activities most of the day, nearly every day (as indicated by either subjective account or observation made by others) correct me if i'm wrong Tick
(3) significant weight loss when not dieting or weight gain (e.g., a change of more than 5% of body weight in a month), or decrease or increase in appetite nearly every day. Note: In children, consider failure to make expected weight gains.Yeah, I wish.
(4) insomnia or hypersomnia nearly every day
(5) psychomotor agitation or retardation nearly every day (observable by others, not merely subjective feelings of restlessness or being slowed down)
(6) fatigue or loss of energy nearly every day To a ridiculous degree. I can sleep for 10 to 12 hours and still feel tired the whole day.
(7) feelings of worthlessness or excessive or inappropriate guilt (which may be delusional) nearly every day (not merely self-reproach or guilt about being sick)
(8) diminished ability to think or concentrate, or indecisiveness, nearly every day (either by subjective account or as observed by others) as seen in Tick
(9) recurrent thoughts of death Tick
(not just fear of dying), recurrent suicidal ideation without a specific plan, or a suicide attempt or a specific plan for committing suicide
Tick on that bold part. I've thought about suicide, but every time I do I just basically call myself a coward and that I would never actually do it and I just get more upset.
B. The symptoms do not meet criteria for a Mixed Episode.
C. The symptoms cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. Maybe. I've become a lot less social recently, to the extent that I really don't to much more than eat, sleep, go to school, and do homework. I still play poker with some friends every Friday night, but even that's becoming less frequent.
D. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication) or a general medical condition (e.g., hypothyroidism). Tick. No, I'm not on crack, cocaine, or pot and the like.
E. The symptoms are not better accounted for by Bereavement, i.e., after the loss of a loved one, the symptoms persist for longer than 2 months or are characterized by marked functional impairment, morbid preoccupation with worthlessness, suicidal ideation, psychotic symptoms, or psychomotor retardation.
EDIT:
why would you be stuck working on homework for that long? i have 4 AP classes and am doing a sport and i still don't have that much work. maybe you procrastinate really badly. if academics is too much for you, take easier classes next year. it's not smart to get depressed and have your grades decline.
That was one unlucky crunch for me. We had been out of town that weekend, and I had one day to write three papers, read a hundred pages or so out of a book, and do two projects. And yes, it took me longer than I should have, mostly because I was quite exhausted. Being exhausted and doing those things don't exactly match up well.
when you don't care if your mother dies tommorrow anymore, you will have a lot less stress.
My mother and I are joined at the hip. That could never happen. Ever.
I know that sounds weird after saying that I can't talk to her about this, but that's alot of the reason why I can't; I know her so well that I know it would kill her to know I'm like this.
You need a girlfriend....this is the best remedy
:/ I had a girlfriend. Turns out I'm not so good at that stuff. I didn't even really get attached to her at all. When we broke up, it wa sort of emotion-neutral. I guess I'm not cut out for that kind of relationship, not yet at least.
DK_307, let me say this...do NOT go see a school counselor now...from experience, you tell them you've had suicidal thoughts, they'll send you straight to the ward. Post a blog, one where your real name will be anonymous. You'll be shocked by how much it helps, really!! E-mail friends your problems, hell, you want my E-mail? I've found that to get out of my funks, I like listening to and helping with other people's [EMAIL="problems.Orion81785@mycingular.blackberry.net"]problems. Orion81785@mycingular.blackberry.net[/EMAIL]. LMK whats going on
personally, my advice is not to take antidepressants (statistics have shown that they do no help. this is as ppl think, now i'm so depressed i even have to take antidepressants and just get more depressed).
Ok, source please. No, magazines, newspapers, and self-help books do not count. I want peer-reviewed papers. Unless your personal experience = "statistics" and trumps decades of research and mountains of papers, I call BS.
Morwen and Dark_night:
Stop reading DSM and trying to see if you can diagnose clinical depression. This is like reading about geometry and then making blueprints for a suspension bridge. While its ok to read about it, you might get the wrong idea from it, or worse, try to self-cure yourself.
Yes depression is over-diagnosed. This does not make counselers and psychiatrist morons. As Morwen pointed out, if they've had _any_ sort of training, they won't be "sending you to the wards". Dark_knight, go see the one in your school at least.
SnoopDogAtog has made very good points, and should be listened to.
Read this carefully: I never questioned your advice for him to seek help. This is absolutely correct.
I'm just telling you that DSM is not for either of you because it is potential misinformation, as well as a leading one. When a person reads about those symptoms there is a real possibility of a person trying to "find" such symptoms in his life -- something dark_knight has already done in his previous post. When he does decide to seek help, the history he will give to a doctor will already be tainted with what he's read in DSM and what he might think he has.
psychologist cures ppl by talking to them. a phychiatrist is a man who can only help a patient by prescribing medication. he is usually the one who regulates intake. i believe psychiatrists are quite redundant. if the medicine is going to cure a person, what do we need the person in between for? but psychiatrists have grown in popularity in recent years as they are much cheaper than psychologists. after all, they need much less schooling. plus we can add in the fact that they don't really do anything.
@ mondu
why are you being so critical towards everyone? this isn't the dabate forum. i thought water cooler talk was just for loose, casual chat. even in the debate forum, i think posters take everything too seriously. i mean, come on!
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For those of you who don't mind, here's my issue; for some weeks (if not months) now, I have been (what appears to be) depressed. I know that I'm 16, and that I'm going through emotional things right now, but it seems pretty serious. I mean, it's not like I have anything to compare it to, I've just never felt like this before.
I tend to over-analyze things as it is, and when I get upset about something, I just can't help but hate myself even more because I feel like I have no right to be upset or depressed. I'm pretty well off, at least I know I'll never have to worry about losing my house or anything dramatic like that. Why can't I be happy with what I have?
For instance, yesterday I had a problem with my mom. I had been doing homework the entire day (literally it ended up being from 8AM until 9PM), and she told me to go to the gym (yeah, both of us have weight problems). I explained to her that I could already tell I would be doing homework until God knows when, and she just said fine and she told me to do whatever I wanted, and that she didn't care anymore. This seriously bothered me. I used to be able to shrug these things off before, but this time I felt miserable. The worse part was that I had no reason, I just sat down amidst all of my papers in total silence, feeling almost completely numb, ready to break down at any minute. It was like I couldn't handle anything negative at all.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that recently, everything has been negative to me. Any happiness I've felt seems to just be a distraction from reality, which seems to be synonymous with misery. I feel like life has no point, like I'm waiting for each day and every thing I do to just be over with. I just feel like I don't know what to do, like there's something I'm not understanding, something I desperately need to be happy. I feel like my life is flying past me at full speed, opportunities smacking me in the face and flying by, and I just can't reach out and get them. I feel like I'm just tolerating life, like I'm literally living with nothing to live for, life I'm just living for the sole purpose of dying someday.
I guess I'm coming here mostly because I don't know what to do. I can't talk to my mother. I mean I've tried, but all that does is make her upset, which in turn makes me even more miserable. I've talked to my dad about this, but he was no help at all. He basically advocates living life from one happy moment to the next, and that is a "Been There, Tried That" for me already. I need some guidance, I feel like I'm at the end of the road, and I really haven't a clue where to go now.
Thanks to the [Æther] shop for the sig!
But in case you can't do that, and I couldn't when I went through it around the same age as you, I'll relate my own experience. Mine was similar to yours, though I knew why it was I couldn't experience happiness, or at least there was a cause. I was prone to strong emotional episodes, but on the whole I was in a state of apathy.
It went on for four months, but Christmas came around, my family went to Disneyland, and I became positively obsessed with Disneyland. It was the sole source of happiness in my life, and I latched onto it. Probably not the healthiest thing in the world, but there it is. After about a year of that, I phased back into normality.
There's more to the story, but I'll refrain from those details unless you'd like to hear them, as it ends with going to see a psychologist.
From that experience, what I can tell you is that you need to break the line of thought when it comes. Challenge your sad thoughts with happy ones, or sad points of view with happier ones. Recognize depressed thought as depressed, and know that it's not the only possible one, not the correct one. It's difficult, but important. Depressed thinking is a cycle that feeds itself, but if you can break the loop you can usually work your way out of it. See if a solid, trustworthy friend can help you with it, or see about making a friend like that.
Other than that, all I can think of is that you should work on seeing a doctor. If you can't drive, take the bus, or ask someone you trust to help you out. I went to a teacher I could trust and she helped me enormously.
I hope I've been of some help.
How do I ask them?
@Zith: Thanks, you were very helpful. I agreed with everything except this:
My gut/knee-jerk reaction is to say absolutely not. I guess it's because I want to find out a way to be permanently happy, really happy, not just in a fake, artificially-induced state of happiness. I don't know though, maybe artificial happiness is better than real misery.....
Thanks to the [Æther] shop for the sig!
This is about you, not them, and it's not selfish at all for you to say so. Make sure they're aware of that.
My parents basically forced me into counseling for children of divorced parents, and that's one thing they emphasized - that if you're having problems, it's about you, not about what they think about your problems.
All throughout high school, I was one of those angsty kids (that's probably why they forced counseling on me). My dad disagreed sharply with the so-called necessity of medication. And even though I still feel the effects of depression, I turned out somewhat alright without popping anything.
That isn't for everyone, though. I'm not saying I'm Superman or something, but it was really hard for me to cope, and now I'm suffering the consequences of dealing with it cold-turkey. You're sixteen. You're about to make a lot of choices that will affect how your life turns out. Sometimes you've got to prioritize, and you can only have so much on your plate at once. I'm in community college now instead of an actual four-year institution, and I've got to fight my way into a bachelor's degree program.
As I've never taken medication, I can't give you first-hand advice in that respect, but I can tell you it's hard to go clean through it all. At the same time, though, I'm living proof that it's possible to do it.
It's all a matter of whether or not you're willing to fight for your life.
K, I'ma preface this very LONG post with a caveat. I'm not a practicing physician and you have to take this with your own judgement. I have, however, dealt with recurring depressions and seen family members do the same.
For the average person, going to see a therapist is a great leap of faith. It comes with a stigma, even if nobody else knows, you know. As for waiting for depression to lift on its own, sometimes it does, but can you really afford to wait while the rest of your life goes into limbo, the things you've worked hard to accomplish falling apart before your eyes while you wait, and wait, and wait for your spirit to come back?
It's no surprise your mom seems to have trouble communicating with you. People around a depressed person often can't figure out what is wrong and only perceive the withdrawn and moody part, not the sadness and helplessness. You seem to them to be not listening on purpose. It's no fun to be around someone who's depressed, and it makes them short with you. It's their perception, and it colors their response to you. It's wrong, and unfair, but perceptions are hard to change.
Add to that a natural reluctance to believe that depression is real, that it is common, and that it can affect you or someone in your family. Denial keeps a lot of chronically depressed people from ever feeling okay again.
Go find someone you trust not to talk down to you or talk at you or break your confidence. A minister, a nurse, a doctor, or a very good friend in the community who's seen a little of the world and had some hard knocks himself. Tell him or her about it exactly the way you've told us. Be brief and to the point. You want help, maybe not from them, but could they help you find a source of help they trust?
You have to decide when and how you wish to reveal your inquiry into this to your parents. I'll assume because of your age, you don't have the money or liberty to seek your own counseling or treatment. It's one of the hardest things to do, tell your parents you have an emotional problem. It is important to frame the question correctly, not just saying "I think" or "I am" but "I talked with _______ and we seem to agree I feel this way" . Set up a quiet relaxed time and place to do this. Guaranteed, if you throw this out there while you are in an argument it will be taken poorly. A calm, quiet setting will help you say what you need to say clearly, and help the other person listen better and with an open mind.
Ultimately you do need to find out what is making you depressed. Depression itself is frequently an end result of something else: chronic stress, social isolation, low self-esteem, and hormonal changes. It could even be something physical, like low or high thyroid, or sleep apnea.
A good start would be to get a comprehensive medical history and physical. You can't fix what you can't see. By far most depression is due to psychosocial causes, but it is frequently a symptom in common with a lot of medical ailments which are easily missed.
Work with your doctor to determine what you are willing to try for this. Depression almost always seems to be the final common pathway for many different processes: it is a failure to adapt, a helplessness in the face of something implacable and inexorable in your life. Whether it's chronic anxiety and stress, chronic social maladjustment, physical or psychological abuse, social isolation, physical disability or ailments, or a significant undiagnosed learning disability which has you on the ropes, it's the end of your reserve, but potentially the beginning of a new approach to life.
Until you find the root causes of your depression it's helpful to try talking about your feelings, getting in touch with your perceptions and judgments, and sometimes taking medicine to stabilize your mood, and help you tone down the self-directed negative thoughts and reactions that depressed people seem to be stuck in. Depression is the essence of chronicity, takes awhile for you to get that way and so it won't disappear overnight. It may take weeks, months, or years of hammering away at your life to shape things up. You may find yourself discovering new strengths and susceptibilities you never knew you had; and the insight and empathy to know not only how other people feel about you when you were depressed, but how others look, feel, and think when they're depressed too.
So please look into it, at least you've made the first step and recognized you are in a serious rut and need a hand out of it. Many many many are the people who have never even gotten that far, have lived in misery or died never even knowing how low they'd lain and that the problem was indeed a valid one.
Um, E), all of the above?
Thanks to the [Æther] shop for the sig!
As for your mom, explain to her how you've been feeling, and that you feel extremely hurt when dealt with negativity, and ask her to try to go along with that and to make an effort to avoid saying things she now knows will hurt you.
A doctor is good to talk to, but a close friend or family member is also invaluable. You need somebody you can completely trust to explain the situation to without worrying about judgment, so think if you know anybody like that. The best thing to do is confide your problems with somebody. By releasing your negativity, you can easily take a more positive outlook on things. I had depression a few years back myself, and it worked wonders for me.
Why not try talking to a school counselor rather than a psychologist. They are there for reasons other than just helping you work out your schedule for next year. It would also be a very simple step that wouldn't involve your parents.
My gut instinct is that you just have a case of being 16 years old. You get up, you go to school, you come home, you mess around all day, you go to bed. The school year doesn't progress any faster; it just ticks along at its own pace and you can't do a lot to speed it up. I remember when I was younger being relatively bored with things and just not thrilled. Your life just doesn't seem to really be going anywhere and the little things can be frustrating/aggravating. Additionally, I gather from your avatar that you're probably not religious; I can honestly say that it doesn't help one's morale. I don't say that to imply that you SHOULD be religious, as that is your own choice; it's just that I know from personal experience wanting to believe in something but not being able to can be trying.
So, if nothing else, I suggest talking to a school counselor, as I think a psychiatrist is a little too far right now.
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I was gonna suggest the exact same thing when I first started reading the thread, and I'm a little surprised no one else did before. They are trained to help with these kinds of things, and it comes up a lot more than some people would like to believe. I couple of my friends have had troubles with it in the past, and a fair number of them have regular appointments to help with it.
And the whole family thing, I'm huge with the whole openess thing, and if they are vehemently opposed to it, that's horribly selfish of them. But if you really feel you can't talk to them, again, the guidance counsellors at your school might be able to help with that even, by either help you find a way to tell them, or maybe organizing something through the school to get to a professional of the subject.
And on the subject of drugs, I understand the fear of them, sticking strange chemicals in you can be a little wierd, and I try to avoid them unless I really need them, but I also recognize that they are well designed and do what they promise. They also aren't going to make you happy all the time, they'll balance things out so you can deal with things yourself
Also what kind of stuff do you eat and drink?
I'm currently on antidepressants, and I don't walk around with a doofy smile on my face and artificial happiness all around me. What I can do is think about my problem without feeling it's hopeless, and that's something I couldn't do before the medication.
A school counselor is an excellent choice that should be very accessible. Also, psychiatrists and psychologists can be visited without your folks finding out if you can get to them. You must specifically permit them to notify anyone of the visit. The same is true for school counselors, by the way - unless I'm very wrong.
Basically, Dark Knight, you're 16...I remember 16...problems galore...HS sucked, working, which sucked, tons of HW, which also sucked, and it went from one problem to another, to another...then I met a girl I really liked, and already had a self-esteem issue, so I lied to her about myself, which triggered a big lying compulsion that Im finally over (Im 21 now). The trick to getting through depression is to find an escape. I found my escape in Douglas Adams' "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy." What a great series...philosophical, hilarious, and a perfect escape...read 3 chapters a night, and see how much better you feel...Any book whose introduction concludes with instructions on How To Leave The Planet gets an A+ in my book...dont let the problems get to you...besides, after realizing that you sound like a human version of Marvin the Paranoid Android, you learn that you BETTER bust out of this soon...Marvin's great, but did anyone else want to choke him to death?
The problem with teenagers and young adults these days is that computers, TV, video games have made us all lazy. hell, Im on the comp now, and class starts in 20 minutes, and I have a 45 minute bus ride up there...plus Im still not showered...worked all night last night...slept all morning. Find an escape that you enjoy...go to the gym, find a friend and go...talk to a girl you like in school to go with you...doesnt have to be anything more than gym sessions, but if so, you have the gym to thank for giving you time to get to know her. Maybe even some romance in the works, but that cant be rushed.
But seriously, just relax...antidepressants are not the answer, and as per my own personal experiences, because I felt the same way, dont go talking to a psychiatrist, or even a school counselor. Find a friend. I once told a counselor that I was thinking of changing schools to a place that doesnt depress me, and she took it as I was gonna kill myself, and takes me to the hospital, where they keep me in a psych ward for a few days...not worth it, sorry!! I dont trust counselors because they dont know me. My friends do. My friends know what I need...Your friends know what you need. Go out, enjoy, and pull your best friend aside and ask for help with whatever's troubling you...
Exercise releases endorphins and improves blood flow to your brain. That can help ease depression and help you sleep better. It doesn't have to be marathons or weight lifting just enough to make you feel your circulation pick up and your body warm. Run the engine, flush the system a little every day.
@Girlfriends: IMO it's hard to get out there and put your best foot forward dating if you feel crummy. Be friendly, meet new people of both sexes, but don't push yourself to some ideal of getting and keeping a romantic confidante. It's a double danger when you're feeling low, to have high expectations and be hurt easily, and to be overly needy or emotionally numbed towards the other person. These types of relationships don't often last long so give yourself time to recover and heal your situation before taking on the goal of finding a girlfriend.
If you already have one, be honest with her that you're having a rough time right now and gauge her understanding of this. She could be a great source of moral support for you whatever you're going through.
@ orion: Escape is only a temporary aid to numb the pain. Ultimately you have to examine your life and face your problems in order to get out of a rut and stay out of it in the future. It takes work and time, but it's worth it. Whatever way you choose to face your situation, good luck to you.
Exercize, good eating and good sleeping habits go a very long ways when battling depression. McDonald's is not a good plan just now, and getting 8-10 hours of sleep every night is more important than getting all your homework done.
This is all totally true. Also sunlight is importaint to get. Yeah I know it sounds stupid but it is.
personally, my advice is not to take antidepressants (statistics have shown that they do no help. this is as ppl think, now i'm so depressed i even have to take antidepressants and just get more depressed). the way to fix everything is to just stop caring about others anymore. i know it's sad but it's the best way to deal with things. when you don't care if your mother dies tommorrow anymore, you will have a lot less stress.
also, don't take it out omn yourself. i know that this isn't always appropriate but if you're on the verge of suicide, i'm sure that person doesn't that you're blaming doesn't mind that you're taking it out on them if it is keeping you from klling yourself. this is how i look at it. think in the lines of this... "i'm so small. i'm so pathetic. what can i do? it's not like i could of done anything about it... if so and so have been more considerate, none of this would of happened." this mentality has gotten me through life ever since 8th grade.
Mkay, I'll look at it.
Major Depressive Episode
two week period met Yep, I agree with this one.
Note: Do note include symptoms that are clearly due to a general medical condition, or mood-incongruent delusions or hallucinations.
(not just fear of dying), recurrent suicidal ideation without a specific plan, or a suicide attempt or a specific plan for committing suicide
Tick on that bold part. I've thought about suicide, but every time I do I just basically call myself a coward and that I would never actually do it and I just get more upset.
EDIT: That was one unlucky crunch for me. We had been out of town that weekend, and I had one day to write three papers, read a hundred pages or so out of a book, and do two projects. And yes, it took me longer than I should have, mostly because I was quite exhausted. Being exhausted and doing those things don't exactly match up well.
My mother and I are joined at the hip. That could never happen. Ever.
I know that sounds weird after saying that I can't talk to her about this, but that's alot of the reason why I can't; I know her so well that I know it would kill her to know I'm like this.
:/ I had a girlfriend. Turns out I'm not so good at that stuff. I didn't even really get attached to her at all. When we broke up, it wa sort of emotion-neutral. I guess I'm not cut out for that kind of relationship, not yet at least.
Thanks to the [Æther] shop for the sig!
Ok, source please. No, magazines, newspapers, and self-help books do not count. I want peer-reviewed papers. Unless your personal experience = "statistics" and trumps decades of research and mountains of papers, I call BS.
Morwen and Dark_night:
Stop reading DSM and trying to see if you can diagnose clinical depression. This is like reading about geometry and then making blueprints for a suspension bridge. While its ok to read about it, you might get the wrong idea from it, or worse, try to self-cure yourself.
Yes depression is over-diagnosed. This does not make counselers and psychiatrist morons. As Morwen pointed out, if they've had _any_ sort of training, they won't be "sending you to the wards". Dark_knight, go see the one in your school at least.
SnoopDogAtog has made very good points, and should be listened to.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
I'm just telling you that DSM is not for either of you because it is potential misinformation, as well as a leading one. When a person reads about those symptoms there is a real possibility of a person trying to "find" such symptoms in his life -- something dark_knight has already done in his previous post. When he does decide to seek help, the history he will give to a doctor will already be tainted with what he's read in DSM and what he might think he has.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
@ mondu
why are you being so critical towards everyone? this isn't the dabate forum. i thought water cooler talk was just for loose, casual chat. even in the debate forum, i think posters take everything too seriously. i mean, come on!