Like most men my in my late teens I visit Pornographic Websites, and look at Pornographic Materials. I am legally allowed to, and it satisfies me when I can't see my girlfriend. I've told her this a few times, and have never hidden it.
She recently told me it upsets her alot. I feel bad that it upsets her, but I don't feel like I'm doing anything wrong.
First of all, did she say why it makes her upset? There a big difference between "I'm insecure and you looking at Jugz makes me like you don't want me." and "I am morally opposed to porn and I think you looking at Jugz is sinful." when it comes to potential advice.
In general, I'd kindly tell her to stick it. In a nice way. It's not really any of her business that you look at porn.
There's an older thread along similar lines where you might find some advice.
You know, my ex told me the same thing, and I said the same thing as you. You could always say you stopped and keep doing what you're doing, and she wouldn't know the difference. Or, you could try explaining it to her that its better than you going out and cheating on her with some other girl. Other than that, I'm really not sure. Since you don't find it as a big deal, I would probably just tell her that you stopped than if you need it, go look at it.
I think the best thing to do is find out why it bothers her so much. Perhaps she's insecure about you looking at other females. This could be b/c she's unsure about her figure and/or she feels that you could stop finding her attractive because of it.
Best thing to do is be completely honest with her about why you look at it. (This is all in my humble opinion.) If she feels that strongly against it, you can honor her wishes and stop looking at it, or as stated above, tell her you've stopped and keep doing it (I don't recommand this option).
or as stated above, tell her you've stopped and keep doing it (I don't recommand this option).
Neither do I. For one, it doesn't really solve the problem, it just creates a potential new one (what if she finds out).
If you don't feel there's anything wrong with looking at porn and you don't see any reason to stop, you don't have to stop looking at it if/when she asks you to. But if you're aren't going to stop, tell her as much. You're not really helping her by lying, you only make it look as if you think it's bad enough to hide.
You don't have to hide the fact that you look at porn...just put it somewhere she won't ever find it.
Like, in the KITCHEN.
Ouch.
Somebody get the ointment, that was a major burn.
(And somebody get some wine to go with that Cheese.)
Anyway.
I had a girlfriend for a while who was disgusted at the idea of porn. That didn't stop me from looking at it, especially not after all those long nights of cockteasery (you hear me, Patricia*!?!). She never found out in the fifteen months we were together.
I guess if you've already told her, that goes out the window, though. As mikey said, there's a big difference between, "Porn makes me insecure," and, "Porn is sinful." Which one is she?
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* Names changed to protect the innocentguilty possibly-restraining-order-filing.
I believe that it is wrong while in a relationship, but not necessarily out of it. It's like being unfaithful to your partner. I'm pretty sure your girl would object to you going to a strip club. Is that unreasonable? What if the chick was showing you the goods on a webcam? Now what if she just took a picture and sent it to you? This is the same thing.
Gimme a minute of your time and try putting yourself in her shoes. Rather, picture a girl in your past that you've kind of idolized in a manner.. or even a model or actress that you find attractive. Got it? Okay, now imagine you're going out with that model or actress or hot chick. Yeah, goin' to parties, whatever, making out, having sex, sure. Imagine the sentimental stuff though too. Going out to eat, playing video games together, teaching her Magic even, giving her flowers, maybe even getting engaged. Imagine being in love, if you can. Have you got it? Well now imagine that girl does all those things but masturbates to pictures of other guys, fantasizes about them, downloads more and more pictures and videos of them, and watches them while you're away. How does it feel to you?
Note that the term and condition "while you're away" also feels a lot like "behind your back."
It makes women feel insecure about themselves, it makes them feel like they're not enough, like they don't look good enough, and they don't do enough for you. This is especially due to the fact that the features of porn stars are usually.. over the top. Huge boobs, ass, generally perfect bodies. So they see this as not only going to another person for satisfaction, one who is superior to them physically.
It's also a lot like checking out girls while you're with them. Would you like it if your girlfriend checked out jocks or gangsters or punks while you were right there with her, trying to get her attention, her approval?
I know, I'm all over the place with this post, but I hope I got through to you a bit.
But part of it also has to do with whether or not you can stop. If you can, you should do it. It's like your girlfriend asking "Please put the seat down after you're done going to the bathroom." Sure, it's not as easy as it would be if you just left it up, but if it makes her happy with you, why fuss? But if you can't.. Well, it's been psychologically determined (I could reference if I could Google it..) that certain personalities are more susceptible to pornography than others. I realized that I am one of those personalities, resulting not only in a difficulty in succeeding in the fight against pornography, but if you do look at pornography, you'll notice that the things you look at are getting worse and worse and worse. Are you that type of person? Have you noticed that you want more and more graphic pornography over the years? If so, well, it's a long road ahead. At least psychological studies have indicated this.
I believe that it is wrong while in a relationship, but not necessarily out of it. It's like being unfaithful to your partner.
I've never understood this viewpoint. I guess it makes sense if you believe that your eyes, ears, hands, body, heart and thoughts are for your partner and your partner only. But I think that viewpoint is unreasonably, borderline unnatural and puts far too much emphasis on a romantic ideal that I'm not too sure can even exist in reality.
I'm pretty sure your girl would object to you going to a strip club. Is that unreasonable?
I think it is, yes.
What if the chick was showing you the goods on a webcam? Now what if she just took a picture and sent it to you? This is the same thing
I'm not so sure it is. The thing about porn and strippers is that they're largely impersonal while a girl doing her thing on a webcam for you or giving you photos of herself very much is personal. I think you'd be hard-pressed to defend impersonal, non-physical acts like watching porn and/or strippers as cheating. Though while the webcam and personal photos may not be physical cheating, either, they do represent emotional infidelity.
Gimme a minute of your time and try putting yourself in her shoes. Rather, picture a girl in your past that you've kind of idolized in a manner.. or even a model or actress that you find attractive. Got it? Okay, now imagine you're going out with that model or actress or hot chick. Yeah, goin' to parties, whatever, making out, having sex, sure. Imagine the sentimental stuff though too. Going out to eat, playing video games together, teaching her Magic even, giving her flowers, maybe even getting engaged. Imagine being in love, if you can. Have you got it? Well now imagine that girl does all those things but masturbates to pictures of other guys, fantasizes about them, downloads more and more pictures and videos of them, and watches them while you're away. How does it feel to you?
Pretty meh, actually. I don't require that a partner's every sexual thought or fantasy be about me. I'd honestly be a bit worried if they were. I'd be kinda happy that she is capable of taking care of herself while I'm not around, though. Good on her.
Note that the term and condition "while you're away" also feels a lot like "behind your back."
Unless she's totally open about it. Even if she's not, I still wouldn't see it as some sort of ghastly betrayal. I'd be concerned that she felt it was something she needed to keep from me, but that's about it.
It makes women feel insecure about themselves, it makes them feel like they're not enough, like they don't look good enough, and they don't do enough for you.
Women who feel this way need to deal with their insecurities, not make those around them cater to their neuroses. It really doesn't help anything. In most cases, a guy looking at porn has nothing to do with his partner not being enough. Though I readily admit that there certainly are cases where this is the case (and in such situations, the woman has every cause to feel insecure and angry).
This is especially due to the fact that the features of porn stars are usually.. over the top. Huge boobs, ass, generally perfect bodies. So they see this as not only going to another person for satisfaction, one who is superior to them physically.
Again, see above re: women's insecurities.
It's also a lot like checking out girls while you're with them. Would you like it if your girlfriend checked out jocks or gangsters or punks while you were right there with her, trying to get her attention, her approval?
I probably wouldn't be falling over myself to get my partner's attention or approval (and people who should probably shouldn't). And it's a pretty tacky thing to do with your partner right there, but otherwise I don't really have an issue with a partner of mine checking out other people.
It's like your girlfriend asking "Please put the seat down after you're done going to the bathroom."
Looking at porn sure is just like a lot of other things, huh?
Sure, it's not as easy as it would be if you just left it up, but if it makes her happy with you, why fuss?
There's a difference between making your partner happy at no unacceptable cost to yourself and giving something up you don't feel you should have to just to cater to them. Plus, I'm not such a big fan of people trying to get me to change my ways to better suit themselves. I'm willing to make some compromises, but that only extends so far.
A good idea is probably to have a talk with her, ask her what her specific feelings are about it, so on. If you don't understand her problem, ask her. If you don't feel it's something you really need to stop doing, tell her about that.
Compromise is a part of relationships with others, so it's possible that this is something that would be best to compromise about, if it ends up helping things. However, sometimes changing your behaviors for others really isn't compromise, so ask yourself if it's really helping or harming your relationship with her. Kinda depends on your situation.
I won't ask you unnecessarily personal questions, but if you feel that you can only get aroused enough to masturbate or release sexual tensions by looking at pornography, it's possible that you're using it too much anyway. I wouldn't know for you in particular, but it's just something to think about.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
IMO the one forms with the person they love an EMOTIONAL bond. The emotions one has for the other are what create the relationship beyond sex, and is what consitutes I believe the base of trust and understanding.
However, watching porn creates no Emotional bond, it is simply the fulfilling of a fantasy, not a betrayal of your emotions towards another person. I feel, that porn does not constitute any form of betrayal towards the one you're with since there Is nothing being tond to the bond between you.
If your girlfriend is annoyed by porn, then it is because she is afraid of the bond between you. She feels insecure because she fears that bond might be shared with your fantasy. It is simply a question of explaining the fact that porn does nothing to the emotions you have for her and is simply a sort of fantasy.
If she feels betrayed because u seem to not want to "fantasize" on her, u have to explain that porn is a way of imagining things that you wouldn't actually want to do with a person IRL, at least, not the way they do it in porn.
I think Yersinia hit the nail on the head, it honestly depends on which you value more.
She doesn't have any right to stop you, but then you don't have any right to expect her to put up with it.
Yep.
Quote from "Belgareth" »
You may sayto yourself in your head that "it satisfies you when she's not there" but she would likely say why can't you just think of her.
Well, not so much. Porn exists because for many it's better, more vivid than the imagination. So I suppose get her to record some porn with you and watch that, and then she can make this argument
Really though, thinking about other people is a healthy thing. To the OP, I pretty much refuse to believe she wouldn't have thought about people who weren't you in a sexual way before. So that's something to consider. Is it the vividness of porn she objects to, or is porn just the victim of her not liking the fact you might find another attractive?
Quote from "Balgareth" »
As yersinia (and others) have said , it will likely be that she isn't fufiling your expectations, and she will feel inadequate for you.
Umm, no. People don't look at porn because their partner isn't fulfilling their expectations. It's not a 'necessary sexual release' either, because quite frankly a guy can survive ages without orgasming. For real.
No, porn is almost always about variety, about mixing up sexual encounters.
Quote from "Belgareth" »
The only thing you need to find out is if Your expectations are too high , or wether she needs to adress your desires more.
Anyone who calls porn a mere sexual relief is lying to themselves. This could only apply if it was a specific fantasy you sought in porn that she didn't provide.
This is not a situation of "who is to blame here?".
Quote from "Belgareth" »
On an unrelated note, I found it interesting from a psychological note that you put " I am legally allowed to" as this would seem like you are trying to rationalise with your self that you are not "evil" by doing what your doing.
Well, yeah. Porn is seen as a guilty pleasure by almost everyone who indulges, even those who are "OK with it" will feel a twinge.
Quote from "Belgareth" »
You seem like a nice guy and I doubt you would still be doing it if you knew the true level of pain most girls go through , trying to be these perfect male fantasies. So I suggest you talk to her not in a "it's my life and i'll do what i want " way like some people have suggested. Instead be calm and reassuring and make her feel special to you .
That is if you want to keep her , of course.
That pain is the fault of those girls pandering to the media. There's no such thing as the perfect woman or perfect male fantasy, hell guys are supposedly biologically programmed to seek out several partners, and how's that gel with a concept of perfection? It doesn't.
The suggestion that looking up porn is a problem here is also grossly incorrect. Porn is the expression of a desire, not a desire in itself. Even if you don't look up porn, you're still going to be fantasising about similar things - porn is just a means of visualising those things.
Are you really arguing "you wouldn't think about people other than your partner if you truly knew the amount of pain girls went through to become perfect male fantasies"?
I agree you shouldn't talk to her as if she cannot or shouldn't try to change you - compromise is necessary for any serious relationship. But this isn't a "who is to blame?" scenario like Belgareth suggests. It's entirely possible to have a girl feeling special whilst using pornogrpahy in a relationship.
Well, yeah. Porn is seen as a guilty pleasure by almost everyone who indulges, even those who are "OK with it" will feel a twinge.
Societal mores can be a *****.
Rather than a long PBPA, I'm just going to skip right to the meat of it:
@ Some Peoples, your expectations for any relationship are ridiculously high and romantic. I imagine when you get married (assuming you aren't already or ever will), you'll be one of those couples having sex maybe once every few months.... when they're in their late 20's. That might float your boat, but the rest of us choose to fess up to being *gasp* human.
ButteBlues, I don't see your problem with Turbovolver's comments. I found them to be very realistic. He's claiming that thinking about other people in sexual fantasies while in a relationship is normal. How is that overly romantic or demanding?
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
But my views are unchanged, and my basic point is that if you can stop, I would do so as a courtesy to your partner. You can even use it as some weight for her to stop some things or to do some things, because it's not an easy thing to do.
thinking about other people in sexual fantasies while in a relationship is normal.
I also think that while this is true, looking at other people naked is probably too far. Different people in different relationships have different boundaries, and in this relationship, this man's girlfriend's boundary is set at pornography. If he can comply to these boundaries, then I believe that if he has any serious interest in maintaining a relationship with this girl then he should attempt do so. If he cannot, refuses to attempt to, or has no serious interest in maintaining the relationship, then by all means, don't.
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Getting the last word does not mean that you win the argument.
But my views are unchanged, and my basic point is that if you can stop, I would do so as a courtesy to your partner. You can even use it as some weight for her to stop some things or to do some things, because it's not an easy thing to do.
I would never try and manipulate the situation in a way to benifit myself. She is upset, and as her boyfriend I want to do what I can to help. Calling out her faults certainly isn't going to help. She doesn't do anything that upsets me that she doesn't do for a good reason. Otherwise she wouldn't do it.
I have offered her to make a video, take pictures with mixed results. She says that it would be better than looking at porn, but said that she feels uncomfortable having her naked form for anyone to see, if for instance they got lost or something.
Trust me its not "fulfilling a sexual fantasy", its preventing myself from looking like an idiot before I head out. Its not like I wake up in the morning, ah time for porn. Its a once in a while thing, when my girlfriend isn't home, and I need to..relieve the situation.
If I'm lying to myself, I guess I'm really good at it.
ButteBlues, I don't see your problem with Turbovolver's comments. I found them to be very realistic. He's claiming that thinking about other people in sexual fantasies while in a relationship is normal. How is that overly romantic or demanding?
Typo'd the name. Was referring to some of the other posts.
I believe that it is wrong while in a relationship, but not necessarily out of it. It's like being unfaithful to your partner. I'm pretty sure your girl would object to you going to a strip club. Is that unreasonable? What if the chick was showing you the goods on a webcam? Now what if she just took a picture and sent it to you? This is the same thing.
There's a big difference: interaction.
In my opinion (and in my girlfriend's, thankfully), interaction is what characterizes cheating. If you're just watching a movie or looking at a website to get some solo action going while she's not near for a duo, I really see nothing wrong with that.
First of all:
Man! I really had no idea threads like this one existed in here...
Second:
For my personal opinion, I'm against porn. It's cheating. Even if there is no interaction, in your heart ( hold the laughs now ) you imagine it and than, just by looking, you cheated. I believe in chastity, not because sex is a sin. That's a lie. It's not a sin. Sex is something good, but very powerfull and sacred. You gotta respect that, cause it can bring people to life! And the fealing is also very powerfull. If you use it wrong, you'll become a slave to it. My tip would be never get access to it in a relationship. Save yourself to your girl, and it would be even better if it was your legaly-married wife. But that's just me and my oppinion, and you got your freewill to do as you wish.
And last, but not least:
Dá-lhe Bahia! Dá-lhe Brasil! hehehhe ( Sry guys that don't speak portuguese... )
Personally, I feel that humans are in a degree born into promiscuity. It is only a strict social code that have restrained men from all their "temptations". I would go further into this but this is not the thread for such discussion.
Addressing the porn issue, what DevouringZombie did was stupid and smart all at the same time. I don't think any guy should ever tell their g/f that they watch porn but if they found out somehow without the b/f telling them, the situation would be much worse. Most guys would prefer to keep this secret hidden and not have their g/f openly confront them.
I feel that Zombie's g/f does have a right to feel upset. None of you have the right to tell her to 'shut up'. Zombie has obviously hurt her dignity. Pornography in a relation should be a mutual agreement. If it seriously bothers her, she has the right to walk away. I have serious doubts for people who tell Zombie to continue and keep it secret. Such is the same as fraud.
What he needs to do is ask himself whether he intends to ever marry his g/f. If no, then tell her to deal with it or offer to break up. It is unfair for Zombie to have a girlfriend just for the sake of having a girlfriend. If yes, Zombie should stop looking at porn. Men can sexually relieve themselves without looking at explicit images.
Men can sexually relieve themselves without looking at explicit images.
And how is that different from porn? If you're conjuring up the images in your mind, aren't you going to be more connected to them than to the images in porn?
Seems silly to get all worked up about something like this. Especially if he's not some porn conneissuer(sic?) with 50 gigs of it on his hard drive. People let sex complicate relationships too much.
I've never understood this viewpoint. I guess it makes sense if you believe that your eyes, ears, hands, body, heart and thoughts are for your partner and your partner only. But I think that viewpoint is unreasonably, borderline unnatural and puts far too much emphasis on a romantic ideal that I'm not too sure can even exist in reality.
I don't know where you're from, {mikeyG}, or what you're thinking, but all I have to say is, God frowns on wherever you got your morals.
Honestly, I'm a completely hopeless romantic. I have actually had rough patches before where I start thinking about some girl while I'm dating another because of my own high-strung ideals. I like to pretend it's not a high-maintenance thing, and in truth it really isn't because I don't require my girlfriend to adhere to any kind of standard. But I still overromanticize a lot of things in relationships.
At the same time, I'm human. I am a man, and I am bound by the biological requirements of being a man. There is a tension here between my ideological and biological selves, but there comes a time when it really doesn't matter, and I go to fulfill my biological needs. Some of you may frown upon that, but let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
I've gone for over a year not even having a single dirty thought because I had a crush on a girl. Not a relationship, mind you, a crush. Determination FTW. Still, that was a harsh time, mainly due to all the drama of Trying-It-The-Girls'-Way (now known as the ****-That-**** Method). Nothing's ever easy.
Where am I going with all this? While it's all nice and good to be idealistic on the Internet where no one knows your dirty secrets, don't pretend you're a ideal person because we know you aren't.
DevouringZombie, honestly, I think the best idea is to quit if you can. Not only will it make her feel better, but she'll be really happy you did it for her. Not so much that you're trying to conform to her, just a positive, relationship-building kind of thing. Hopefully, it'll all work out for the best in the end.
As I see it, this is the same as any other point people can disagree on. Some people see it as a rather normal thing, others find it immoral. Within your relationship you need to define what is and is not okay. There are a couple of ways it works out.
If you feel strongly that watching porn is what you enjoy doing, and your partner feels just as strongly that you shouldn't be watching it, or vice versa, then you need to decide with your partner if it's something the relationship can live with, or if it's something that it can't and you need to break up.
If you feel strongly that it's fine, and your partner is a little irked, or vice versa, then you talk it through and either show your partner why it's fine, or compromise.
If you know that your partner is more important to you than is pornography, or the other way around, then you stop or break it up accordingly.
Basically, you set your priorities, talk it all through with your partner, evaluate and set up the rules of your relationship. It's the same with probably minor issues like difference in music and movie tastes as it is with possibly major issues like pornography and drugs.
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
Quite frankly, I'm not against porn. I'm against it when I don't know about it and have to bring it to his attention. Luckily, I don't have this problem.
At anyrate.
Porn, honestly is a touchy subject for (generalization ahead) a lot of girls (end generalization). Mainly due to (I THINK) that women see images of how they should be rather than how they actually are. Which, saddens me since I'm comfortable with my body and everything, but I mean that doeesn't really mean that I want to change every little (or large) thing to be a mini Pam Anderson In Training.
The media can really kiss my butt when it comes to images. I am how I am really.
(To now actually adress the issue)
Perhaps talking it out with her, offer to let her watch while you look at porn, just to give her an idea of what you do while she's not there. That way hopefully she can feel better about it.
But other than that, I don't think there's much else for you to do to try to change her mind, if she's opposed to it, she's opposed to it. It's one of those things that it's hard to change people's minds on.
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She recently told me it upsets her alot. I feel bad that it upsets her, but I don't feel like I'm doing anything wrong.
Tips?
In general, I'd kindly tell her to stick it. In a nice way. It's not really any of her business that you look at porn.
There's an older thread along similar lines where you might find some advice.
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Best thing to do is be completely honest with her about why you look at it. (This is all in my humble opinion.) If she feels that strongly against it, you can honor her wishes and stop looking at it, or as stated above, tell her you've stopped and keep doing it (I don't recommand this option).
Neither do I. For one, it doesn't really solve the problem, it just creates a potential new one (what if she finds out).
If you don't feel there's anything wrong with looking at porn and you don't see any reason to stop, you don't have to stop looking at it if/when she asks you to. But if you're aren't going to stop, tell her as much. You're not really helping her by lying, you only make it look as if you think it's bad enough to hide.
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Katingal: Plane of Chains
Like, in the KITCHEN.
Ouch.
Somebody get the ointment, that was a major burn.
(And somebody get some wine to go with that Cheese.)
Anyway.
I had a girlfriend for a while who was disgusted at the idea of porn. That didn't stop me from looking at it, especially not after all those long nights of cockteasery (you hear me, Patricia*!?!). She never found out in the fifteen months we were together.
I guess if you've already told her, that goes out the window, though. As mikey said, there's a big difference between, "Porn makes me insecure," and, "Porn is sinful." Which one is she?
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* Names changed to protect the
innocentguiltypossibly-restraining-order-filing.I'm a very honest person, I'm open, Its not like I'm doing something wrong
I believe that it is wrong while in a relationship, but not necessarily out of it. It's like being unfaithful to your partner. I'm pretty sure your girl would object to you going to a strip club. Is that unreasonable? What if the chick was showing you the goods on a webcam? Now what if she just took a picture and sent it to you? This is the same thing.
Gimme a minute of your time and try putting yourself in her shoes. Rather, picture a girl in your past that you've kind of idolized in a manner.. or even a model or actress that you find attractive. Got it? Okay, now imagine you're going out with that model or actress or hot chick. Yeah, goin' to parties, whatever, making out, having sex, sure. Imagine the sentimental stuff though too. Going out to eat, playing video games together, teaching her Magic even, giving her flowers, maybe even getting engaged. Imagine being in love, if you can. Have you got it? Well now imagine that girl does all those things but masturbates to pictures of other guys, fantasizes about them, downloads more and more pictures and videos of them, and watches them while you're away. How does it feel to you?
Note that the term and condition "while you're away" also feels a lot like "behind your back."
It makes women feel insecure about themselves, it makes them feel like they're not enough, like they don't look good enough, and they don't do enough for you. This is especially due to the fact that the features of porn stars are usually.. over the top. Huge boobs, ass, generally perfect bodies. So they see this as not only going to another person for satisfaction, one who is superior to them physically.
It's also a lot like checking out girls while you're with them. Would you like it if your girlfriend checked out jocks or gangsters or punks while you were right there with her, trying to get her attention, her approval?
I know, I'm all over the place with this post, but I hope I got through to you a bit.
But part of it also has to do with whether or not you can stop. If you can, you should do it. It's like your girlfriend asking "Please put the seat down after you're done going to the bathroom." Sure, it's not as easy as it would be if you just left it up, but if it makes her happy with you, why fuss? But if you can't.. Well, it's been psychologically determined (I could reference if I could Google it..) that certain personalities are more susceptible to pornography than others. I realized that I am one of those personalities, resulting not only in a difficulty in succeeding in the fight against pornography, but if you do look at pornography, you'll notice that the things you look at are getting worse and worse and worse. Are you that type of person? Have you noticed that you want more and more graphic pornography over the years? If so, well, it's a long road ahead. At least psychological studies have indicated this.
I've never understood this viewpoint. I guess it makes sense if you believe that your eyes, ears, hands, body, heart and thoughts are for your partner and your partner only. But I think that viewpoint is unreasonably, borderline unnatural and puts far too much emphasis on a romantic ideal that I'm not too sure can even exist in reality.
I think it is, yes.
I'm not so sure it is. The thing about porn and strippers is that they're largely impersonal while a girl doing her thing on a webcam for you or giving you photos of herself very much is personal. I think you'd be hard-pressed to defend impersonal, non-physical acts like watching porn and/or strippers as cheating. Though while the webcam and personal photos may not be physical cheating, either, they do represent emotional infidelity.
Pretty meh, actually. I don't require that a partner's every sexual thought or fantasy be about me. I'd honestly be a bit worried if they were. I'd be kinda happy that she is capable of taking care of herself while I'm not around, though. Good on her.
Unless she's totally open about it. Even if she's not, I still wouldn't see it as some sort of ghastly betrayal. I'd be concerned that she felt it was something she needed to keep from me, but that's about it.
Women who feel this way need to deal with their insecurities, not make those around them cater to their neuroses. It really doesn't help anything. In most cases, a guy looking at porn has nothing to do with his partner not being enough. Though I readily admit that there certainly are cases where this is the case (and in such situations, the woman has every cause to feel insecure and angry).
Again, see above re: women's insecurities.
I probably wouldn't be falling over myself to get my partner's attention or approval (and people who should probably shouldn't). And it's a pretty tacky thing to do with your partner right there, but otherwise I don't really have an issue with a partner of mine checking out other people.
Looking at porn sure is just like a lot of other things, huh?
There's a difference between making your partner happy at no unacceptable cost to yourself and giving something up you don't feel you should have to just to cater to them. Plus, I'm not such a big fan of people trying to get me to change my ways to better suit themselves. I'm willing to make some compromises, but that only extends so far.
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Compromise is a part of relationships with others, so it's possible that this is something that would be best to compromise about, if it ends up helping things. However, sometimes changing your behaviors for others really isn't compromise, so ask yourself if it's really helping or harming your relationship with her. Kinda depends on your situation.
I won't ask you unnecessarily personal questions, but if you feel that you can only get aroused enough to masturbate or release sexual tensions by looking at pornography, it's possible that you're using it too much anyway. I wouldn't know for you in particular, but it's just something to think about.
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However, watching porn creates no Emotional bond, it is simply the fulfilling of a fantasy, not a betrayal of your emotions towards another person. I feel, that porn does not constitute any form of betrayal towards the one you're with since there Is nothing being tond to the bond between you.
If your girlfriend is annoyed by porn, then it is because she is afraid of the bond between you. She feels insecure because she fears that bond might be shared with your fantasy. It is simply a question of explaining the fact that porn does nothing to the emotions you have for her and is simply a sort of fantasy.
If she feels betrayed because u seem to not want to "fantasize" on her, u have to explain that porn is a way of imagining things that you wouldn't actually want to do with a person IRL, at least, not the way they do it in porn.
Yep.
Well, not so much. Porn exists because for many it's better, more vivid than the imagination. So I suppose get her to record some porn with you and watch that, and then she can make this argument
Really though, thinking about other people is a healthy thing. To the OP, I pretty much refuse to believe she wouldn't have thought about people who weren't you in a sexual way before. So that's something to consider. Is it the vividness of porn she objects to, or is porn just the victim of her not liking the fact you might find another attractive?
Umm, no. People don't look at porn because their partner isn't fulfilling their expectations. It's not a 'necessary sexual release' either, because quite frankly a guy can survive ages without orgasming. For real.
No, porn is almost always about variety, about mixing up sexual encounters.
Anyone who calls porn a mere sexual relief is lying to themselves. This could only apply if it was a specific fantasy you sought in porn that she didn't provide.
This is not a situation of "who is to blame here?".
Well, yeah. Porn is seen as a guilty pleasure by almost everyone who indulges, even those who are "OK with it" will feel a twinge.
That pain is the fault of those girls pandering to the media. There's no such thing as the perfect woman or perfect male fantasy, hell guys are supposedly biologically programmed to seek out several partners, and how's that gel with a concept of perfection? It doesn't.
The suggestion that looking up porn is a problem here is also grossly incorrect. Porn is the expression of a desire, not a desire in itself. Even if you don't look up porn, you're still going to be fantasising about similar things - porn is just a means of visualising those things.
Are you really arguing "you wouldn't think about people other than your partner if you truly knew the amount of pain girls went through to become perfect male fantasies"?
I agree you shouldn't talk to her as if she cannot or shouldn't try to change you - compromise is necessary for any serious relationship. But this isn't a "who is to blame?" scenario like Belgareth suggests. It's entirely possible to have a girl feeling special whilst using pornogrpahy in a relationship.
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Rather than a long PBPA, I'm just going to skip right to the meat of it:
@ Some Peoples, your expectations for any relationship are ridiculously high and romantic. I imagine when you get married (assuming you aren't already or ever will), you'll be one of those couples having sex maybe once every few months.... when they're in their late 20's. That might float your boat, but the rest of us choose to fess up to being *gasp* human.
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
Gaymers | Magic Coffeehouse | Little Jar of Mamelon | Natural 20
But my views are unchanged, and my basic point is that if you can stop, I would do so as a courtesy to your partner. You can even use it as some weight for her to stop some things or to do some things, because it's not an easy thing to do.
I also think that while this is true, looking at other people naked is probably too far. Different people in different relationships have different boundaries, and in this relationship, this man's girlfriend's boundary is set at pornography. If he can comply to these boundaries, then I believe that if he has any serious interest in maintaining a relationship with this girl then he should attempt do so. If he cannot, refuses to attempt to, or has no serious interest in maintaining the relationship, then by all means, don't.
I would never try and manipulate the situation in a way to benifit myself. She is upset, and as her boyfriend I want to do what I can to help. Calling out her faults certainly isn't going to help. She doesn't do anything that upsets me that she doesn't do for a good reason. Otherwise she wouldn't do it.
I have offered her to make a video, take pictures with mixed results. She says that it would be better than looking at porn, but said that she feels uncomfortable having her naked form for anyone to see, if for instance they got lost or something.
Trust me its not "fulfilling a sexual fantasy", its preventing myself from looking like an idiot before I head out. Its not like I wake up in the morning, ah time for porn. Its a once in a while thing, when my girlfriend isn't home, and I need to..relieve the situation.
If I'm lying to myself, I guess I'm really good at it.
Typo'd the name. Was referring to some of the other posts.
[KalmWave] [Last.FM]
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In my opinion (and in my girlfriend's, thankfully), interaction is what characterizes cheating. If you're just watching a movie or looking at a website to get some solo action going while she's not near for a duo, I really see nothing wrong with that.
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Man! I really had no idea threads like this one existed in here...
Second:
For my personal opinion, I'm against porn. It's cheating. Even if there is no interaction, in your heart ( hold the laughs now ) you imagine it and than, just by looking, you cheated. I believe in chastity, not because sex is a sin. That's a lie. It's not a sin. Sex is something good, but very powerfull and sacred. You gotta respect that, cause it can bring people to life! And the fealing is also very powerfull. If you use it wrong, you'll become a slave to it. My tip would be never get access to it in a relationship. Save yourself to your girl, and it would be even better if it was your legaly-married wife.
But that's just me and my oppinion, and you got your freewill to do as you wish.
And last, but not least:
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Addressing the porn issue, what DevouringZombie did was stupid and smart all at the same time. I don't think any guy should ever tell their g/f that they watch porn but if they found out somehow without the b/f telling them, the situation would be much worse. Most guys would prefer to keep this secret hidden and not have their g/f openly confront them.
I feel that Zombie's g/f does have a right to feel upset. None of you have the right to tell her to 'shut up'. Zombie has obviously hurt her dignity. Pornography in a relation should be a mutual agreement. If it seriously bothers her, she has the right to walk away. I have serious doubts for people who tell Zombie to continue and keep it secret. Such is the same as fraud.
What he needs to do is ask himself whether he intends to ever marry his g/f. If no, then tell her to deal with it or offer to break up. It is unfair for Zombie to have a girlfriend just for the sake of having a girlfriend. If yes, Zombie should stop looking at porn. Men can sexually relieve themselves without looking at explicit images.
And how is that different from porn? If you're conjuring up the images in your mind, aren't you going to be more connected to them than to the images in porn?
Seems silly to get all worked up about something like this. Especially if he's not some porn conneissuer(sic?) with 50 gigs of it on his hard drive. People let sex complicate relationships too much.
I don't know where you're from, {mikeyG}, or what you're thinking, but all I have to say is, God frowns on wherever you got your morals.
Honestly, I'm a completely hopeless romantic. I have actually had rough patches before where I start thinking about some girl while I'm dating another because of my own high-strung ideals. I like to pretend it's not a high-maintenance thing, and in truth it really isn't because I don't require my girlfriend to adhere to any kind of standard. But I still overromanticize a lot of things in relationships.
At the same time, I'm human. I am a man, and I am bound by the biological requirements of being a man. There is a tension here between my ideological and biological selves, but there comes a time when it really doesn't matter, and I go to fulfill my biological needs. Some of you may frown upon that, but let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
I've gone for over a year not even having a single dirty thought because I had a crush on a girl. Not a relationship, mind you, a crush. Determination FTW. Still, that was a harsh time, mainly due to all the drama of Trying-It-The-Girls'-Way (now known as the ****-That-**** Method). Nothing's ever easy.
Where am I going with all this? While it's all nice and good to be idealistic on the Internet where no one knows your dirty secrets, don't pretend you're a ideal person because we know you aren't.
DevouringZombie, honestly, I think the best idea is to quit if you can. Not only will it make her feel better, but she'll be really happy you did it for her. Not so much that you're trying to conform to her, just a positive, relationship-building kind of thing. Hopefully, it'll all work out for the best in the end.
If you feel strongly that watching porn is what you enjoy doing, and your partner feels just as strongly that you shouldn't be watching it, or vice versa, then you need to decide with your partner if it's something the relationship can live with, or if it's something that it can't and you need to break up.
If you feel strongly that it's fine, and your partner is a little irked, or vice versa, then you talk it through and either show your partner why it's fine, or compromise.
If you know that your partner is more important to you than is pornography, or the other way around, then you stop or break it up accordingly.
Basically, you set your priorities, talk it all through with your partner, evaluate and set up the rules of your relationship. It's the same with probably minor issues like difference in music and movie tastes as it is with possibly major issues like pornography and drugs.
At anyrate.
Porn, honestly is a touchy subject for (generalization ahead) a lot of girls (end generalization). Mainly due to (I THINK) that women see images of how they should be rather than how they actually are. Which, saddens me since I'm comfortable with my body and everything, but I mean that doeesn't really mean that I want to change every little (or large) thing to be a mini Pam Anderson In Training.
The media can really kiss my butt when it comes to images. I am how I am really.
(To now actually adress the issue)
Perhaps talking it out with her, offer to let her watch while you look at porn, just to give her an idea of what you do while she's not there. That way hopefully she can feel better about it.
But other than that, I don't think there's much else for you to do to try to change her mind, if she's opposed to it, she's opposed to it. It's one of those things that it's hard to change people's minds on.
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