With so many lingering souls in the format, that might be a valid swap. Hosing snappy on the side is always nice. In refrence to ash zealot. Deathrite shaman on the other hand is hawt. I think Dumping Vexing devil from my list for lavamancer is where I want to start.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
A few days ago this burn deck took down a Daily. Result needs to be replicated more, but still food for thought as a list to look at.
RE: Ash Zealot: I think that dependent on meta it may be boardable, like in Legacy, but it doesn't replace Hellspark IMO.
I love my Hellspark Elementals, and it would definitely be a tough call switching them out for the Zealots. You make a valid point.
Thanks for the list!
Edit: And also, that Boros list in there looks awesome too! Somebody brought back Stormblood Berserker, which I like. I've always been a huge supporter of that card - it's the original Pyreheart Wolf. It fits well in that build.
It might be the case that you need to add a sacred foundary to the mana base that you have enchatnment hate against leylines in SB games and omiting Grim Lavamancer is suspect, but off the top of my head, this is what I came up with Khaos. Personally, I don't think you need Bob, but to each his own.
It seems like a reasonable place to start. However, with Spike, VD, and Bump, you are really losing out on flexibility. I've always found such arrangements to be...frustrating.
That could be a personal taste thing though--I like having the option to shoot creatures.
As for enchantment issues, I'd skip splashing a third color until you know that you have to, based on your local meta. I mean, off the top of my head, I'm not sure any widely played enchantments that specifically hate on us. I am open to being wrong on this though.
Blood Moon! Excellent, Aesnath. I knew there was a card I was needing to get for my eventual Modern deck.
And Jund seems very vulnerable to Blood Moon. I like this.
Edit:
Hmm...I like this, but I would definitely play fetches so I think I'd probably take out VD for Lavamancer.
What do you think about playing Ash Zealot over Hellspark Elemental?
Yeah, I've been considering MD Magus of the Moon to troll the crap out of the manabases in the format. He's not fast and he is easier to remove, but at least I can swing when needed.
I actually think that Ash Zealot may be a better play than elemental if the prevalence of Deathrite Shaman is to be believed. I mean, Shaman is probably KoS anyway, but if it gets to activate and kill a hellspark unearth, that would really suck.
Deathrite also makes me less happy with a proliferation of fetches, simply because we may be helping the shaman player out.
Holy smokes, if Modern ever takes off in my area, I'll be running some Lavamancer Deathrite shenanigans. My obsession with that value elf knows no limit.
See, what was I just saying?
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LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
Man, this may sound like a dumb question, but how bad would the Blood Moons mess up our game plan with this deck? Obviously it will hurt our opponent more than us. Are there correct times to play it, and correct times to not play it?
Man, this may sound like a dumb question, but how bad would the Blood Moons mess up our game plan with this deck? Obviously it will hurt our opponent more than us. Are there correct times to play it, and correct times to not play it?
More often then not, You'll end up siding out some of your black cards when you bring in moon and against certain decks, moon is an autowin anyways. Like, against tron, I'd side out confidants/searing blazes for moon, smash, and 2 charms.
Basically, sideboarding correctly takes away most of the akwardness you'd otherwise face.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
Man, this may sound like a dumb question, but how bad would the Blood Moons mess up our game plan with this deck? Obviously it will hurt our opponent more than us. Are there correct times to play it, and correct times to not play it?
I've never really tried to run moon in a multicolored deck. I'd imagine you might side it in for one of the black cards, to minimize the issues you'll have. Theoretically, if one could fetch a basic swamp, you'd want that before you dropped the moon, to keep Bob and Bump live.
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Burn's great strength is consistency and you don't want to significantly dilute that trait.
Hear, hear! That is a fact. And one that is easy to forget when getting greedy during deckbuilding.
I do love the idea of splashing black so I can play Bob. He fits in the Sligh shell AND nets me more burn. If that is my only black card in the deck, would it make sense to take him out when boarding in the Blood Moons?
Deathrite Shaman seems so good to play as Lavamancer 5-8, and can even give you extra mana to get ahead of people. Obviously the SB is just generic, you have a sweeper, artifact hate, a blood moon effect and 3 more spots for something else (red leyline?).
"Dark Burn" aka r/b burn just seems SO fast, especially when you get turn 1 GG. Almost every deck will deal at least 2 damage to itself (fetch or shock), and 18 damage works out perfectly to 6 spells, as every spell is 3 damage. If someone fetch + shocks and you get 1 hit with GG, its now 5 spells.
HSE slot could also be whatever 2-drop you prefer/want: HSE, Bob or Ash Zealot.
I know this deck is totally janky guys, but the cards I ordered haven't arrived on time! FML and win anyway!!
Anyways. It did surprisingly awesome until my match up in Round 4 against UW Flash.
I feel like the only reason I lost that round was because I drew three lands two games. I kept hands with 2 lands. . . yeah, maybe a bad choice. But my spells all costed 2 save one. So I don't think it was a mistake sometimes that's just how it goes. I did mull to 4 game 1. . . Anyway, here is the short of it.
(Sorry this report will be short and sweet; beer.)
R1 Esper Control
Game 1. I keep a nut draw and it's game over in just a few turns. I don't see much of his deck and decide not to side anything. Everything is going according to plan. (1-0)
Game 2. I keep a hand of 3 Cackler 1 Pillar 1 Spear 2 Mountain. I draw into Zealot and eventually a Hound. Turns out he drew lands and Ultimate price. I didn't play the Zealot not wanting to over extend. 3 Cacklers FTW. Forget about it. (2-0)
(1-0)
R2 Izzet Shenanigans
Game 1. Gotta hand it to this dude. He always does well with his rouge decks. This one was straight play the whole deck on turn 3 or 4 with Past in Flames, Electromancer, those red mana generator spells, Desperate Ravings, Reforge the Soul. . . and all sorts of janky stuff. But his entire gameplan is flashback. Ash Zealoted his self to death mwhaha. I dropped her on my T2 and his T3 he burned himself to three, realized he couldn't win, so finished his self off.
Game 2. I T2 Zealot again and this time stomp him to nothing. (2-0)
R3 Bant Control
Game 1. This game lasted forever. And by that I mean maybe 12 minutes. I got stuck on land and so did homeboy. His deck was kind of crap, I was surprised to be playing it at 2-0. Either way he plays Chalice of life . . . weird, but he plays two of them. Saves him about 3 or 4 turns. Finally I draw into some beats with all the mana to play them, and he keeps topdecking land.
Game 2. My land is stuck to 3 for a couple turns. But I made do, Killed him quick.
(MD Thunderbolt was baller this round.) (2-0)
(3-0)
R4. UW Flash.
Game one. Mull 4
UGH I pulled out the win but whatever. THUNDERBOLT rocked this match up, I would've been dead much sooner without it. He had answers the whole round though. Drawing this and Detentioning that and pretty much making me wish I had more mana. Had I not been mana screwed it might've gone my way, but it would've been hard. As he sided in counters like mad.
How the heck do you change your sig? I just want to include the Clan. I can't figure it out, maybe it'll come to me in a dream tonight. Unless one of you guys tells me before then, but it may still come to me in a dream I guess.
Sorry to be late to the party guys...working nights can be a rub sometimes.
I do herby confirm my unequivocal intent to associate with this band of fire-blooded, Sterno-drinking, flamethrower-brandishing red mages. May the Fires of Salvation never die!
Thanks Ham, but it came to me in a dream first. However, I never would've believed the dream if it wasn't backed up by the link which you posted. Thanks.
Deathrite Shaman seems so good to play as Lavamancer 5-8, and can even give you extra mana to get ahead of people. Obviously the SB is just generic, you have a sweeper, artifact hate, a blood moon effect and 3 more spots for something else (red leyline?).
I'm not so sure about the merits of running the 8ish lavamancers. Although lavamancers are clearly awesome, they tend to be less so in multiples, in my experience. Moreover, they are actually slow and highly vulnerable to removal.
As for the leyline, really it's either that or Stigma Lasher, but neither is ideal.
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Combat math here is just nuts. I love Conscripts - well, I started with only them in my 5CMC slot. And well, synergy between him, Hellrider and Pyreheart Wolf is just incredible.
4 Conscripts looks like a huge pain in the ass to play against. I vote you play this list and let us know how it goes.
Updated the member list - I went ahead a confirmed Z since he changed his CP to reflect his Clan affiliation.
Also, I'd like to throw Dromar's name out there for Council - he's pretty OG himself and one of the better players on the forum.
Fires of Salvation is now an approved MTGO clan!! Im online now if people want to submit and get approved! Otherwise drop me a buddy request and I'll invite ya.
Excellent! I don't do MtGO or I'd join up (no time and don't really need another pit to throw money into), but that will be an extremely useful tool to have when we get the FoS R&D team going.
redthirst is redthirst, fifth Horseman of the Apocalypse. He was the leader of the Fires of Salvation, the only clan I'm aware of to get modded off the forums so hard they made their own forums.
Degenerate? Sure. Loudmouth? You bet. Law abiding? No ****ing way.
As for EDH, I'll have to try out that Norin deck, especially since I sometimes like to waste my time fooling around with a modern Norin deck! Currently I've only tried a Jor Kadeen deck which is great in games with 4+ players.
I got 2-2 on a daily standard today at my LGS. Lost the two games to Jund lists and I can really say this time it's due to sheer bad/luck.
Match 2, Round 2 - I lost because of mulling down to 4. My 4-card hand isn't even legit. I basically gave the game to my opponent because I kept getting 1-land hands that are not relevant (twice I had 1-land Hellion).
Match 4, Round 3 - After getting my opponent down to 8, he plays three consecutive Thragtusks and I exhausted my removal.
There really are those days. On the other hand. Two 2-0's against Naya and GW Aggro. Not bad!
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I am passionate, yet I am logical. The fire within me burns, but I am also patient to a point. I am with the Fires of Salvation
redthirst is redthirst, fifth Horseman of the Apocalypse. He was the leader of the Fires of Salvation, the only clan I'm aware of to get modded off the forums so hard they made their own forums.
Degenerate? Sure. Loudmouth? You bet. Law abiding? No ****ing way.
Watch my Twitch.tv stream.
Take the Ham Challenge.
I love my Hellspark Elementals, and it would definitely be a tough call switching them out for the Zealots. You make a valid point.
Thanks for the list!
Edit: And also, that Boros list in there looks awesome too! Somebody brought back Stormblood Berserker, which I like. I've always been a huge supporter of that card - it's the original Pyreheart Wolf. It fits well in that build.
It seems like a reasonable place to start. However, with Spike, VD, and Bump, you are really losing out on flexibility. I've always found such arrangements to be...frustrating.
That could be a personal taste thing though--I like having the option to shoot creatures.
As for enchantment issues, I'd skip splashing a third color until you know that you have to, based on your local meta. I mean, off the top of my head, I'm not sure any widely played enchantments that specifically hate on us. I am open to being wrong on this though.
Yeah, I've been considering MD Magus of the Moon to troll the crap out of the manabases in the format. He's not fast and he is easier to remove, but at least I can swing when needed.
I actually think that Ash Zealot may be a better play than elemental if the prevalence of Deathrite Shaman is to be believed. I mean, Shaman is probably KoS anyway, but if it gets to activate and kill a hellspark unearth, that would really suck.
Deathrite also makes me less happy with a proliferation of fetches, simply because we may be helping the shaman player out.
See, what was I just saying?
4 Dark Confidant
4 Hellspark Elemental
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Searing Blaze
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Bump in the Night
3 Shard Volley
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Arid Mesa
7 Mountain
1 Blood Crypt
1 Sacred Foundary
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Ronom Unicorn
1 Kami of Ancient Law
1 Keening Apparition
4 Rakdos Charm
3 Smash to Smitherines
2 Combust
3 Blood Moon
Fleshed Out.
Cockatrice: lorddax MWS: lorddax MODO: lorddax
==Decks==
Standard - R Slighred
Modern - Seeking red list
Legacy - RBurning Red || BGContamination Pox
EDH - BRThe Wort Conspiracy
Man, this may sound like a dumb question, but how bad would the Blood Moons mess up our game plan with this deck? Obviously it will hurt our opponent more than us. Are there correct times to play it, and correct times to not play it?
More often then not, You'll end up siding out some of your black cards when you bring in moon and against certain decks, moon is an autowin anyways. Like, against tron, I'd side out confidants/searing blazes for moon, smash, and 2 charms.
Basically, sideboarding correctly takes away most of the akwardness you'd otherwise face.
I've never really tried to run moon in a multicolored deck. I'd imagine you might side it in for one of the black cards, to minimize the issues you'll have. Theoretically, if one could fetch a basic swamp, you'd want that before you dropped the moon, to keep Bob and Bump live.
Hear, hear! That is a fact. And one that is easy to forget when getting greedy during deckbuilding.
I do love the idea of splashing black so I can play Bob. He fits in the Sligh shell AND nets me more burn. If that is my only black card in the deck, would it make sense to take him out when boarding in the Blood Moons?
Edit: @Aesnath, yeah that makes sense.
4 Goblin Guide
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Hellspark Elemental
Spells - 23
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bump in the Night
4 Searing Blaze
3 Shard Volley
1 Blood Crypt
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
7 Mountain
3 Blood Moon
3 Smash to Smithereens
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 enchantment hate bear
1 enchantment hate bear
1 enchantment hate bear
3 ?
Deathrite Shaman seems so good to play as Lavamancer 5-8, and can even give you extra mana to get ahead of people. Obviously the SB is just generic, you have a sweeper, artifact hate, a blood moon effect and 3 more spots for something else (red leyline?).
"Dark Burn" aka r/b burn just seems SO fast, especially when you get turn 1 GG. Almost every deck will deal at least 2 damage to itself (fetch or shock), and 18 damage works out perfectly to 6 spells, as every spell is 3 damage. If someone fetch + shocks and you get 1 hit with GG, its now 5 spells.
HSE slot could also be whatever 2-drop you prefer/want: HSE, Bob or Ash Zealot.
WBG Karador GBW
R Daretti R
RG Omnath GR
WRG Modern Burn GRW
WB Modern Tokens BW
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Curse PremiumWell I guess it is time to start building for January.
Cockatrice: lorddax MWS: lorddax MODO: lorddax
==Decks==
Standard - R Slighred
Modern - Seeking red list
Legacy - RBurning Red || BGContamination Pox
EDH - BRThe Wort Conspiracy
In other news, tonight i went 3-1 at my local standard night.
2 Hellion Crucible
4 Rakdos Cackler
2 Stromkirk Noble
4 Ash Zealot
4 Gore-House Chainwalker
1 Pyreheart Wolf
1 Hound of Grislebrand
4 Hellrider
2 Thundermaw Hellkite
4 Searing Spear
2 Brimstone Volley
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Thunderbolt
2 Thunderbolt
2 Annihilating Fire
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Pithing Needle
2 Flames of the Firebrand
2 Traitorous Blood
1 Devil's Play
I know this deck is totally janky guys, but the cards I ordered haven't arrived on time! FML and win anyway!!
Anyways. It did surprisingly awesome until my match up in Round 4 against UW Flash.
I feel like the only reason I lost that round was because I drew three lands two games. I kept hands with 2 lands. . . yeah, maybe a bad choice. But my spells all costed 2 save one. So I don't think it was a mistake sometimes that's just how it goes. I did mull to 4 game 1. . . Anyway, here is the short of it.
(Sorry this report will be short and sweet; beer.)
R1 Esper Control
Game 1. I keep a nut draw and it's game over in just a few turns. I don't see much of his deck and decide not to side anything. Everything is going according to plan. (1-0)
Game 2. I keep a hand of 3 Cackler 1 Pillar 1 Spear 2 Mountain. I draw into Zealot and eventually a Hound. Turns out he drew lands and Ultimate price. I didn't play the Zealot not wanting to over extend. 3 Cacklers FTW. Forget about it. (2-0)
(1-0)
R2 Izzet Shenanigans
Game 1. Gotta hand it to this dude. He always does well with his rouge decks. This one was straight play the whole deck on turn 3 or 4 with Past in Flames, Electromancer, those red mana generator spells, Desperate Ravings, Reforge the Soul. . . and all sorts of janky stuff. But his entire gameplan is flashback. Ash Zealoted his self to death mwhaha. I dropped her on my T2 and his T3 he burned himself to three, realized he couldn't win, so finished his self off.
Game 2. I T2 Zealot again and this time stomp him to nothing. (2-0)
R3 Bant Control
Game 1. This game lasted forever. And by that I mean maybe 12 minutes. I got stuck on land and so did homeboy. His deck was kind of crap, I was surprised to be playing it at 2-0. Either way he plays Chalice of life . . . weird, but he plays two of them. Saves him about 3 or 4 turns. Finally I draw into some beats with all the mana to play them, and he keeps topdecking land.
Game 2. My land is stuck to 3 for a couple turns. But I made do, Killed him quick.
(MD Thunderbolt was baller this round.) (2-0)
(3-0)
R4. UW Flash.
Game one. Mull 4
UGH I pulled out the win but whatever. THUNDERBOLT rocked this match up, I would've been dead much sooner without it. He had answers the whole round though. Drawing this and Detentioning that and pretty much making me wish I had more mana. Had I not been mana screwed it might've gone my way, but it would've been hard. As he sided in counters like mad.
(1-2)
(3-1)
Why did you play Confusion in the Ranks ?! and Hunted Dragon ?! It's so CONFUSING!
Why did you play Confusion in the Ranks ?! and Hunted Dragon ?! It's so CONFUSING!
Watch my Twitch.tv stream.
Take the Ham Challenge.
My posts have the power of invisiblity and only a few people can read it!
I do herby confirm my unequivocal intent to associate with this band of fire-blooded, Sterno-drinking, flamethrower-brandishing red mages. May the Fires of Salvation never die!
Why did you play Confusion in the Ranks ?! and Hunted Dragon ?! It's so CONFUSING!
I'm not so sure about the merits of running the 8ish lavamancers. Although lavamancers are clearly awesome, they tend to be less so in multiples, in my experience. Moreover, they are actually slow and highly vulnerable to removal.
As for the leyline, really it's either that or Stigma Lasher, but neither is ideal.
4 Conscripts looks like a huge pain in the ass to play against. I vote you play this list and let us know how it goes.
Updated the member list - I went ahead a confirmed Z since he changed his CP to reflect his Clan affiliation.
Also, I'd like to throw Dromar's name out there for Council - he's pretty OG himself and one of the better players on the forum.
Excellent! I don't do MtGO or I'd join up (no time and don't really need another pit to throw money into), but that will be an extremely useful tool to have when we get the FoS R&D team going.
—Jaya Ballard, task mage
Congrats on getting this done, Red!
As for EDH, I'll have to try out that Norin deck, especially since I sometimes like to waste my time fooling around with a modern Norin deck! Currently I've only tried a Jor Kadeen deck which is great in games with 4+ players.
Match 2, Round 2 - I lost because of mulling down to 4. My 4-card hand isn't even legit. I basically gave the game to my opponent because I kept getting 1-land hands that are not relevant (twice I had 1-land Hellion).
Match 4, Round 3 - After getting my opponent down to 8, he plays three consecutive Thragtusks and I exhausted my removal.
There really are those days. On the other hand. Two 2-0's against Naya and GW Aggro. Not bad!
My posts have the power of invisiblity and only a few people can read it!
Lose your good MUs, spank your bad ones...
Don't you just hate that?
—Jaya Ballard, task mage
My posts have the power of invisiblity and only a few people can read it!