MD: Sexual life can indeed become quite interesting if both like porn But yeah just remember that while may sound interesting to watch porn with her, just leave that thing alone. Its not the same and doesnt work very well
mamelon: In general you should give up things if the other partner asks for it and has a sound reasoning for it, especially if its something that isnt actually in some way important or for some reason nessecerry. For example I would have no problem with giving up eating oranges or similar, but get me to quite magic/d&d or to stop eating lasagna, then hell no.
There is a fine line between accepting each others requests and accepting the other person for who they are. That line needs to be fully respected as its important to be able to be yourself in a relationship.
edit: Zyrakris: Do you really think its right for someone to set rules on others in relationships? If you dont think porn is bad then she shouldnt make you dont watch it and if you do think its bad then you should quit on your own accord not because she says so.
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I agree, except for one part. If I'm committed with someone, I will still find others attractive yes, but that is no reason to sometimes break down and cheat on my partner. If it comes to that point that I'm tempted so much by another person, I would need to re think just how much I care about the person I'm with. There is no good reason to cheat, and personally, I feel the whole 'I'm only human' excuse is kind of lame.
I think you misunderstood me. I love my girlfriend very much, never cheated on her and don't plan to. But still, I can't deny there are extremely unlikely situations where I might just lose my mind make a mistake - I'm not perfect. I don't condone cheating and wouldn't by any means forgive her if she cheated on me, but I understand that, while very unlikely, it can happen. To not acknowledge this is to be naive.
i don't watch porn, and i think (not to offend someone) that part of a relationship is to understand your partner and accept him/her the way he/she really is
so, if you watch porn, and your girlfriend knows, maybe she ought to accept you as you are, and maybe she can attempt to change you, but IMO part of a relationship is accepting your couple as he/she is
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random, useless knowledge:
if we could line up every person that lives in china, and try to reach the last one walking, we would never be able to do it, because of it's demographic growth would get bigger and bigger and we could not be able to reach the end
Because she asked. I have no problems with porn, as long as no one or no animals is/are getting hurt involuntarily, no children are involved, and all people are able to consent.
Okay, this is much clearer. Thanks.
I see your point. See, I believe it's more important for people to learn to accept each other in relationships first, then they can talk about what they each need/want from each other and go from there. If either of them are to change, it's not because he said or she said, but because it's something that one or both of them want to do.
Change doesn't happen easily, it doesn't happen reluctantly, and you can't change another person. The person cannot even change herself/himself. Not by will alone. Many things are involved in change. It is as a teacher once said, "The mind can choose to start many things but it cannot choose to end them."
I don't think it's quite fair to say that you must always try to do as a lover asks, but I do see your point. It's good to try and accomodate each other in a relationship. After all, you are in it together. However, it's more than just hurtful for one member to say "You need to change."
I guess my attitude toward health and morality is a bit radical. I feel this way: acceptance first, then if changes is necessary, then change will come. It can come with work or without, it depends, but force of will alone usually isn't enough.
I'm rambling. Bleh.
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
Yeah, I agree with all of your sentiments on this, but I believe that if I had chosen to, I could set rules on her as well. But as I stated in my first post, I'm a very laidback, casual person. I don't set rules upon her because nothing she does really bothers me that much.
............ yeah, I think you missed a point along the way. Her setting rules isn't questionable because you can't or won't, it's questionable because setting rules like that for your partner is questionable in itself. It doesn't matter if she's doing it to you, you're doing it to her or you both do it to each other, it's just not cool in the first place.
............ yeah, I think you missed a point along the way. Her setting rules isn't questionable because you can't or won't, it's questionable because setting rules like that for your partner is questionable in itself. It doesn't matter if she's doing it to you, you're doing it to her or you both do it to each other, it's just not cool in the first place.
I think views like this are taken too far to extremes. I mean you'd probably impose the condition "no cheating" on your partners, wouldn't you? Where do you draw the line between which rules are fair enough and which ones are too controlling?
EDIT: What if it came out your girlfriend was looking at child porn or something else you found disturbing? A lot of people here are saying you cant tell her to stop. =/
I think views like this are taken too far to extremes. I mean you'd probably impose the condition "no cheating" on your partners, wouldn't you? Where do you draw the line between which rules are fair enough and which ones are too controlling?
There's a difference between mutually imposed conditions for the relationship and one party attempting to unilaterally impose conditions upon the other party. Deciding to be an exclusive relationship is an agreement both parties must come to together, one party deciding the other must obey a rule of their choosing is something else entirely. And I think the difference would be obvious. A condition both parties agree upon versus a condition one party tries to impose on the other.
Which isn't to say that there aren't relationships where one party doesn't try to impose a "no cheating" rule upon the other party who doesn't agree. That happens all the time. I just don't view it very favorably. Conditions and compromises both parties are agreeing to and satisfied with are fair, but become unfair when one party doesn't agree and isn't satisfied but the other tries to impose anyway.
Conditions and compromises are expected in any relationship, but there's a right way and a wrong way to approach them.
EDIT: What if it came out your girlfriend was looking at child porn or something else you found disturbing? A lot of people here are saying you cant tell her to stop. =/
Personally, I wouldn't try to stop her. I'd just leave her. And not in the "stop or I'll leave" way, I'd just leave. I'm not a fan of misrepresentation, especially when it involves criminal behaviour. That's just not the kind of person I'd want to be tied to.
EDIT: What if it came out your girlfriend was looking at child porn or something else you found disturbing? A lot of people here are saying you cant tell her to stop. =/
That's not just disturbing, that's a crime. I wouldn't stand by anyone who knowlingly committed a crime, save self-defence or other extreme circumstances.
As to other disturbing stuff, like sex with animals, no, I wouldn't try to stop her.
What about a situation in which your partner is looking at porn, posting their profile on porn sites that advertise for partners, and showing themselves to others via webcam?
Then you catch them at it, and they swear not to do it again.
Not too long afterwards, you discover that they have not stopped.
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avatar of kokpshu: thats something I would define as cheating. If there were some special circumstances I might give them the second chance in the first place but if they did it again then I would leave them. not really any other option.
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What about a situation in which your partner is looking at porn, posting their profile on porn sites that advertise for partners, and showing themselves to others via webcam?
Then you catch them at it, and they swear not to do it again.
Not too long afterwards, you discover that they have not stopped.
What now??
Time to give them the boot!
edit: I have read some of this thread and while that doesn't mean ALL of it, I'll chime in on topic.
Sex involves several phases of arousal, and this arousal triggers the release of rewarding neurotransmitters even before consummation. Looking at porn is like taking a hit of crack. It makes you feel alive, energized, motivated, and invigorated. If you are like most people, you will continue to come back for this high, again and again, until something more energizing/motivating/invigorating comes along. A substantial advance in your career, or a real girlfriend with the "goods", say.
If this doesn't happen, or if you don't set limits early on about what settings/how often you look at porn, you will develop a dependence on this as a way to release and motivation. If you're an internet loner or a shut-in, or have preexisting depression or substance abuse problems, you're really at risk. Yes, you can become addicted to porn. And it's just as hard to break, even though it's a "natural" high. What's unnatural about it is it derails your social life and you need more and more explicit sexual content, more adrenaline, etc. to get the same high, so normal relationships and daily life don't "do it" for you, which drives you back to the computer.
If you can't break the cycle, get help. I'd imagine that now that gamblers have their own support groups, porn addiction should, too. It may be as simple as getting rid of your computer. Or not!
What about a situation in which your partner is looking at porn, posting their profile on porn sites that advertise for partners, and showing themselves to others via webcam?
Then you catch them at it, and they swear not to do it again.
Not too long afterwards, you discover that they have not stopped.
What now??
Yes, I'd say that's cheating. There is sexual interaction with other people.
And I don't think I could ever forgive someone for breaking my confidence like that. She could swear whatever she wanted, I still wouldn't believe her.
SnoopDoggAtog makes a good point.
I've read (and can see from experience) that excessive masturbation (or any pleasurable, leisurely activity) can be a sign of serious understimulation (or learned aversion to outside stimulation). It's the same with porn. It tends to accompany depressiveness in general, especially if a person's life is sharply unsatisfying, monotonous, or repressed. They seek safe ways to cope with that understimulation.
Anything that brings a quick state of elation or transport (a "high") will help temporarily fill that gap - drugs, sex, masturbation, rich foods, excessive spending, violence/fighting, compulsive lying, and so on.
In my home town, the environment is very stagnant, the economy is bad, there are a lot of low-income single parents, and few people really have anything to do, ever. As a result, there's a huge amount of drug trafficking, underage drinking, underage pregnancy, and casual sex.
I don't think using something as a escape is wrong or unhealthy. Pretty much everyone does it. Really, that's what a vacation is - an escape. I think it's necessary. However, if you're finding you need escape too much, or if you seek out the high too much, it's most often a sign of some deeper problem (aside from probably side tracking your life in general).
That's what I meant by "sometimes more is necessary." For instance, there may be some reason you look at porn so much that you haven't realized (hypothetically). If that were the case, then just cutting off the porn only solves part of the problem (and probably doesn't even do that).
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
SnoopDoggAtog makes a good point.
I've read (and can see from experience) that excessive masturbation (or any pleasurable, leisurely activity) can be a sign of serious understimulation (or learned aversion to outside stimulation). It's the same with porn. It tends to accompany depressiveness in general, especially if a person's life is sharply unsatisfying, monotonous, or repressed. They seek safe ways to cope with that understimulation.
Anything that brings a quick state of elation or transport (a "high") will help temporarily fill that gap - drugs, sex, masturbation, rich foods, excessive spending, violence/fighting, compulsive lying, and so on.
In my home town, the environment is very stagnant, the economy is bad, there are a lot of low-income single parents, and few people really have anything to do, ever. As a result, there's a huge amount of drug trafficking, underage drinking, underage pregnancy, and casual sex.
I don't think using something as a escape is wrong or unhealthy. Pretty much everyone does it. Really, that's what a vacation is - an escape. I think it's necessary. However, if you're finding you need escape too much, or if you seek out the high too much, it's most often a sign of some deeper problem (aside from probably side tracking your life in general).
That's what I meant by "sometimes more is necessary." For instance, there may be some reason you look at porn so much that you haven't realized (hypothetically). If that were the case, then just cutting off the porn only solves part of the problem (and probably doesn't even do that).
This is a really good summary of the situation, Mame.
Some historians even ascribe wars and pogroms and genocides to this sort of ennui and sense of loss of purpose to life.
This is a really good summary of the situation, Mame.
Some historians even ascribe wars and pogroms and genocides to this sort of ennui and sense of loss of purpose to life.
I've heard a theory that the chances of a war inciting increase in a society with a larger population of umarried youth (i.e. young bachelors).
I'm not sure if that's entirely true, but it does seem to have the ring of truth.
I've even read some theorize that all war in general is basically a society saying, "Move down, move down, move down!" Looking for new land and new genes, not to mention conflict.
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
Source? (I'm curious...it sounds like social theory along the lines of a book I read called Non-zero about social dynamics, population theory, and game theory. Interesting stuff.)
Thanks
Harkius
Overheard someone talking about it, actually, so I don't know the source. I think it's just a rather ambient anthropological idea, not sure who first wrote about it or anything like that. Sorry.
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
There's a difference between mutually imposed conditions for the relationship and one party attempting to unilaterally impose conditions upon the other party. Deciding to be an exclusive relationship is an agreement both parties must come to together, one party deciding the other must obey a rule of their choosing is something else entirely. And I think the difference would be obvious. A condition both parties agree upon versus a condition one party tries to impose on the other.
Which isn't to say that there aren't relationships where one party doesn't try to impose a "no cheating" rule upon the other party who doesn't agree. That happens all the time. I just don't view it very favorably. Conditions and compromises both parties are agreeing to and satisfied with are fair, but become unfair when one party doesn't agree and isn't satisfied but the other tries to impose anyway.
Conditions and compromises are expected in any relationship, but there's a right way and a wrong way to approach them.
OK.
PS: I know the example I gave was a bit extreme, but I hope some people understood the point I was getting at. There'd be a line in there somewhere... where do you draw it?
PS: I know the example I gave was a bit extreme, but I hope some people understood the point I was getting at. There'd be a line in there somewhere... where do you draw it?
Between fair and unfair? I think each person would define fair and unfair conditions differently, but for me the line is how the conditions are presented. As long as both parties agree to it without manipulation (say when one party agrees, but has been browbeat into agreement) and are satisfied, I think it's fair. Otherwise, I wouldn't deem it fair. A condition can't be fair if one party has been forced into an agreement he or she doesn't feel happy with or doesn't feel is fair.
Personally, I don't like to give an inch. I'm not much for a lot of rules in a relationship, not even mutually agreed upon rules.
Personally, I don't like to give an inch. I'm not much for a lot of rules in a relationship, not even mutually agreed upon rules.
I think everyone has a good point when they talk about compromise, amd I do feel that's good for a relationship, but really I agree with your attitude. If your lover can't even try to accept you as is, chances are they can't really accept you at all.
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All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the light that you see. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel. All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
But the rainbow is an image of hope for many reasons, as it is a brilliant sight coming out of oftimes dismal weather.
I am married. I have regular almost daily sex with my wife. I also partake in the viewing of pornographic movies from time to time, even go to the lengths of watching them with my wife.
When your partner is extremely bothered by you watching such films it definately sounds like they have some insecurity issues they need to resolve.
In a marriage addings outside influence to the bedroom definately livens the whole experience. Just like anything else, overindulgence never leads to anything good. You need to keep it in moderation.
What about a situation in which your partner is looking at porn, posting their profile on porn sites that advertise for partners, and showing themselves to others via webcam?
Then you catch them at it, and they swear not to do it again.
Not too long afterwards, you discover that they have not stopped.
What now??
You dump them and find a new partner who won't lie to you.
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Hey all... I'm retired, not dead. Check out what I'm doing these days (and beg me to come back if you want):
"Sometimes guys who watch porn ignore their girlfriends."
Hell, to be honest, I don't know of any of my friends ditching their girl for some porn.
I guess it might be true of sexually inactive relationships at younger ages (highschool, possibly middle school), since the boys will be naturally curious about pornography.
But, to say that someone in a mature, adult relationship would ditch their SO for porn is a stretch.
mamelon: In general you should give up things if the other partner asks for it and has a sound reasoning for it, especially if its something that isnt actually in some way important or for some reason nessecerry. For example I would have no problem with giving up eating oranges or similar, but get me to quite magic/d&d or to stop eating lasagna, then hell no.
There is a fine line between accepting each others requests and accepting the other person for who they are. That line needs to be fully respected as its important to be able to be yourself in a relationship.
edit: Zyrakris: Do you really think its right for someone to set rules on others in relationships? If you dont think porn is bad then she shouldnt make you dont watch it and if you do think its bad then you should quit on your own accord not because she says so.
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so, if you watch porn, and your girlfriend knows, maybe she ought to accept you as you are, and maybe she can attempt to change you, but IMO part of a relationship is accepting your couple as he/she is
if we could line up every person that lives in china, and try to reach the last one walking, we would never be able to do it, because of it's demographic growth would get bigger and bigger and we could not be able to reach the end
Okay, this is much clearer. Thanks.
I see your point. See, I believe it's more important for people to learn to accept each other in relationships first, then they can talk about what they each need/want from each other and go from there. If either of them are to change, it's not because he said or she said, but because it's something that one or both of them want to do.
Change doesn't happen easily, it doesn't happen reluctantly, and you can't change another person. The person cannot even change herself/himself. Not by will alone. Many things are involved in change. It is as a teacher once said, "The mind can choose to start many things but it cannot choose to end them."
I don't think it's quite fair to say that you must always try to do as a lover asks, but I do see your point. It's good to try and accomodate each other in a relationship. After all, you are in it together. However, it's more than just hurtful for one member to say "You need to change."
I guess my attitude toward health and morality is a bit radical. I feel this way: acceptance first, then if changes is necessary, then change will come. It can come with work or without, it depends, but force of will alone usually isn't enough.
I'm rambling. Bleh.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
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............ yeah, I think you missed a point along the way. Her setting rules isn't questionable because you can't or won't, it's questionable because setting rules like that for your partner is questionable in itself. It doesn't matter if she's doing it to you, you're doing it to her or you both do it to each other, it's just not cool in the first place.
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I think views like this are taken too far to extremes. I mean you'd probably impose the condition "no cheating" on your partners, wouldn't you? Where do you draw the line between which rules are fair enough and which ones are too controlling?
EDIT: What if it came out your girlfriend was looking at child porn or something else you found disturbing? A lot of people here are saying you cant tell her to stop. =/
There's a difference between mutually imposed conditions for the relationship and one party attempting to unilaterally impose conditions upon the other party. Deciding to be an exclusive relationship is an agreement both parties must come to together, one party deciding the other must obey a rule of their choosing is something else entirely. And I think the difference would be obvious. A condition both parties agree upon versus a condition one party tries to impose on the other.
Which isn't to say that there aren't relationships where one party doesn't try to impose a "no cheating" rule upon the other party who doesn't agree. That happens all the time. I just don't view it very favorably. Conditions and compromises both parties are agreeing to and satisfied with are fair, but become unfair when one party doesn't agree and isn't satisfied but the other tries to impose anyway.
Conditions and compromises are expected in any relationship, but there's a right way and a wrong way to approach them.
Personally, I wouldn't try to stop her. I'd just leave her. And not in the "stop or I'll leave" way, I'd just leave. I'm not a fan of misrepresentation, especially when it involves criminal behaviour. That's just not the kind of person I'd want to be tied to.
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Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
As to other disturbing stuff, like sex with animals, no, I wouldn't try to stop her.
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Then you catch them at it, and they swear not to do it again.
Not too long afterwards, you discover that they have not stopped.
What now??
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edit: I have read some of this thread and while that doesn't mean ALL of it, I'll chime in on topic.
Sex involves several phases of arousal, and this arousal triggers the release of rewarding neurotransmitters even before consummation. Looking at porn is like taking a hit of crack. It makes you feel alive, energized, motivated, and invigorated. If you are like most people, you will continue to come back for this high, again and again, until something more energizing/motivating/invigorating comes along. A substantial advance in your career, or a real girlfriend with the "goods", say.
If this doesn't happen, or if you don't set limits early on about what settings/how often you look at porn, you will develop a dependence on this as a way to release and motivation. If you're an internet loner or a shut-in, or have preexisting depression or substance abuse problems, you're really at risk. Yes, you can become addicted to porn. And it's just as hard to break, even though it's a "natural" high. What's unnatural about it is it derails your social life and you need more and more explicit sexual content, more adrenaline, etc. to get the same high, so normal relationships and daily life don't "do it" for you, which drives you back to the computer.
If you can't break the cycle, get help. I'd imagine that now that gamblers have their own support groups, porn addiction should, too. It may be as simple as getting rid of your computer. Or not!
And I don't think I could ever forgive someone for breaking my confidence like that. She could swear whatever she wanted, I still wouldn't believe her.
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I've read (and can see from experience) that excessive masturbation (or any pleasurable, leisurely activity) can be a sign of serious understimulation (or learned aversion to outside stimulation). It's the same with porn. It tends to accompany depressiveness in general, especially if a person's life is sharply unsatisfying, monotonous, or repressed. They seek safe ways to cope with that understimulation.
Anything that brings a quick state of elation or transport (a "high") will help temporarily fill that gap - drugs, sex, masturbation, rich foods, excessive spending, violence/fighting, compulsive lying, and so on.
In my home town, the environment is very stagnant, the economy is bad, there are a lot of low-income single parents, and few people really have anything to do, ever. As a result, there's a huge amount of drug trafficking, underage drinking, underage pregnancy, and casual sex.
I don't think using something as a escape is wrong or unhealthy. Pretty much everyone does it. Really, that's what a vacation is - an escape. I think it's necessary. However, if you're finding you need escape too much, or if you seek out the high too much, it's most often a sign of some deeper problem (aside from probably side tracking your life in general).
That's what I meant by "sometimes more is necessary." For instance, there may be some reason you look at porn so much that you haven't realized (hypothetically). If that were the case, then just cutting off the porn only solves part of the problem (and probably doesn't even do that).
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
Gaymers | Magic Coffeehouse | Little Jar of Mamelon | Natural 20
Some historians even ascribe wars and pogroms and genocides to this sort of ennui and sense of loss of purpose to life.
I've heard a theory that the chances of a war inciting increase in a society with a larger population of umarried youth (i.e. young bachelors).
I'm not sure if that's entirely true, but it does seem to have the ring of truth.
I've even read some theorize that all war in general is basically a society saying, "Move down, move down, move down!" Looking for new land and new genes, not to mention conflict.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
Gaymers | Magic Coffeehouse | Little Jar of Mamelon | Natural 20
Why do I say these things here?
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Overheard someone talking about it, actually, so I don't know the source. I think it's just a rather ambient anthropological idea, not sure who first wrote about it or anything like that. Sorry.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
Gaymers | Magic Coffeehouse | Little Jar of Mamelon | Natural 20
OK.
PS: I know the example I gave was a bit extreme, but I hope some people understood the point I was getting at. There'd be a line in there somewhere... where do you draw it?
Between fair and unfair? I think each person would define fair and unfair conditions differently, but for me the line is how the conditions are presented. As long as both parties agree to it without manipulation (say when one party agrees, but has been browbeat into agreement) and are satisfied, I think it's fair. Otherwise, I wouldn't deem it fair. A condition can't be fair if one party has been forced into an agreement he or she doesn't feel happy with or doesn't feel is fair.
Personally, I don't like to give an inch. I'm not much for a lot of rules in a relationship, not even mutually agreed upon rules.
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I think everyone has a good point when they talk about compromise, amd I do feel that's good for a relationship, but really I agree with your attitude. If your lover can't even try to accept you as is, chances are they can't really accept you at all.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to be the peace that you feel.
All that I yearn for, for richer or poorer, is to fill your heart on my own.
Gaymers | Magic Coffeehouse | Little Jar of Mamelon | Natural 20
When your partner is extremely bothered by you watching such films it definately sounds like they have some insecurity issues they need to resolve.
In a marriage addings outside influence to the bedroom definately livens the whole experience. Just like anything else, overindulgence never leads to anything good. You need to keep it in moderation.
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You dump them and find a new partner who won't lie to you.
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Do you know if (if she even had) a previous boyfriend of hers that went through the same thing?
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thats not cheating thats being a prick.
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That's not a very strong point.
"Sometimes guys who watch porn ignore their girlfriends."
Hell, to be honest, I don't know of any of my friends ditching their girl for some porn.
I guess it might be true of sexually inactive relationships at younger ages (highschool, possibly middle school), since the boys will be naturally curious about pornography.
But, to say that someone in a mature, adult relationship would ditch their SO for porn is a stretch.