Oh, sorry ZDS I missed the end of your first post about other places we could go
We were invited by a few other sites when it appeared the site closure was imminent, but uh. I've not made it a secret I don't really like Mafia451's software, for example. I've used too harsh words for it in the past, their site is excellent overall and the admins are friendly enough it's just not my cup of tea personally (or most of yours, I'd imagine; the site is set up more like a discord server with real time posts and branching discussion threads than a traditional forum)
We could theoretically just show up en mass to SmashBoards or MafiaScum or GiantITP "uninvited" and submit our games through their regular queues or something if we wished, I suppose
I should check out GiantITP at some point. Smashboards doesn't really have a queue system, but they have a good group of people. They're usually only managing micros, but could theoretically do better. That said, at that point, the community is just better off coming to MC since the friendly connections to Smashboards are already there.
For sure, though on the flip side, essentially the more featured the vote counter, the more townsided games will automatically be. I realized at some point the diminishing returns of trying for more than a versatile votecounter that can check any selection of posts.
I don't think this is a bad thing to be frank. Any difficulty coming from the difficulty of finding what you're looking for is completely artificial. If designs have to be tweaked and the balance on what is town sided versus scum sided is different in an environment with perfect votal info that's fine to me. As town when trying to solve the game having all of that information at your fingertips and getting down to solving is exactly the sort of thing that I fell in love with this game over.
Again I'm torn because we really are a partner community in everything but name with MC and I think a move there would absolutely be smoother. I just love the features of MU.
@Osie: would MC be interested in joining forces with us in a move to MU? Effectively get the best of both worlds by merging with MC and moving to the bigger site?
From what I can see, MafiaScum might make a good home, but I think that would just be as a group of players joining, I don't think we'd get any special treatment like MU is promising or anything. We don't have the connections and they didn't extend a hand (IIRC) when this was last discussed.
And for MC, is there any data/info we have on what their long-game survival strategy is?
Over the short-term, I love the sound of a playerbase with tons of overlap and a very similar playstyle. That's huge. But if we're just postponing a similar crisis for several more years, I'd rather rip the band-aid off now, and do the transition while we still have some strength, numbers, and good communication lines established. We'll have a stronger chance of establishing the design and playstyle identity we want now, than if we lose another 1/3 to 1/4 in a transition to MC and then try to move again later.
If MC has self-sustaining player-base growth or can come up with a solid recruitment plan to produce that, it's a different equation for me. But if they're in rough shape too, then I'd rather stay as allied communities than merge. A transition is risky enough, without having to try it twice in short order.
Okay, so full disclosure, recruitment and sustaining the site both have a sorta complicated situation.
I was the major figure for all of MC and I was stretched thin doing everything. I stepped away from being directly responsible for a lot of the administration and recruitment so that other people would get involved and so that I could focus on other things. Does this mean I have zero involvement in recruitment at this point? Well, realistically that's never going to be the case, and would be even less the case if MtGS games were moved to MC. But my personal active involvement in recruiting for every single individual game going on is not happening any more. It's just too tiring, especially given some of the additional work I had to put in to connection building for just a few recruitments here and there.
That said, with more heads active in the game, I'm hopeful that recruitment can go up significantly. And I am still actively going out and checking out new communities, it's just less of a feeling of obligation and more of a personal interest. I've found the most effective way to get people has been directly messaging people in a 'door-to-door" sort of effort. That said, continued posting of game advertisements across communities and regular events does have a significant effect.
The concern I would have is that MC's staff has essentially gutted itself, but the infusion of new people can cover a part of that, and there are definitely people who without the pandemic and with some new blood could regain some of their energy, myself included.
The site costs an average number which is somewhere less than $100 a year if no updates or improvements are purchased. With updates and improvements, that number can go up by roughly half an order of magnitude to over $500. That said, for the most part, updates and improvements should mostly be much less necessary now that most of the most major software concerns have been handled.
I am still on-site as the technical guru (and queue manager/reviewer). I have a few User's Guides written for Players and am working on additional ones for hosts and moderators (the mod one is very easy, the host one takes some work). I've also spent roughly a grand on the site in the past two years, about 3 times as much as everyone else put together. If I have reason to believe that the community is running well and that other people are contributing to the overall figure, I will be more than willing to spend further. Either way, I'll be able to spend time on the technical side for quite a while.
So as for long-term survival, I don't know exactly what the plans of the current pair of community leaders are, but I know that the connections exist to other communities, and I know that we've managed to stay relatively steady over the past two years despite a relative decline in activity from a portion of regulars that has plagued MtGS as well.
@Osie: would MC be interested in joining forces with us in a move to MU? Effectively get the best of both worlds by merging with MC and moving to the bigger site?
From what I can see, MafiaScum might make a good home, but I think that would just be as a group of players joining, I don't think we'd get any special treatment like MU is promising or anything. We don't have the connections and they didn't extend a hand (IIRC) when this was last discussed.
I could attempt to handle connections with MafiaScum, but fundamentally, they are more insular than MU and MC to begin with, they just make it work. As for a joint merge and move, I can't say for certain, but I doubt it, unfortunately. The communities have similarities in playerbase and some ability for crossover, but MC's primary thrust hasn't been long-phase games. In addition, MU has a reputation, and I find that a lot of smaller community members, while they might be okay with playing there once or twice, are not interested in a long-term move.
I haven't explicitly opined one way or the other, though I've definitely implied I would prefer MC to MU. That said, I'm going to put this out there, and the reasons behind this aren't petty or threatening, just a matter of preference... Were MtGS to move to MU (either Partner Communities or fully integrated), I would likely still play a game or two, might host 1-2 games, but I highly expect my activity in the community would die out soon after such a move.
I have decent footholds in half a dozen communities and feelers in a half dozen more. I have options for hosting for years to come should I be playing for that long. My interest in hosting on MU is academic at best, and in general while the experience of playing there has been just fine, it's not exciting.
I play social multiplayer games in significant part for the social element. I find that while MU has their own form of that, it is not one that I have found to draw me to the community. That's not to say that anyone was rude, or unwelcoming. But there was a degree of detachment for me that I did not experience elsewhere to the same degree even with MafiaScum (Similarly factory-like) or Mafia451 (Similarly hospital-waiting-room-like and memey). I fully expect that I will play another game on MU at some point, but I wouldn't ever be likely to want to make it a home.
I don't think that anyone should feel like there's a need for arguments or ultimatums, but I suspect that I'm not the only person who doesn't find MU to be the most enjoyable experience in the long term. The spirit of the site doesn't have to be a deal breaker for anyone, but it is for me.
Ok, so does someone want to touch base with MU and gather some facts on how this would work, if everything's the same as from 3 years ago?
I guess I could if we have a good talk about what to ask. But I think Silver is our best person there from how I’ve seen our interactions with the community.
I have a few connections and a tiny bit of a name thanks to the championship, but Silver has a lot more clout.
My stance on MU: I think going for the long queue thing only means we lose our identity.
We need the partner community there if we go for it.
And those of us interested join walruses, a mafia game here and there, some other forum fun and discord activity just so people know we exist and might venture to our community there to try a game.
We can host a game on the main site once in a while to get us known. But not as a main thing.
The partner community should be priority #1 and everything else is secondary if our hosts / players have excess energy.
If we try to go for main site long queues and our community combined, our hosts will burn out. And if we go for integration in the main site with long queues, our identity is gone.
Voxx is a better point of contact with MU than I am; I don't have a lot of real clout there other than by association with him lol. I've talked to Amy, Newcomb, and a few others during Champs but I'm not really a regular.
Voxx is a better point of contact with MU than I am; I don't have a lot of real clout there other than by association with him lol. I've talked to Amy, Newcomb, and a few others during Champs but I'm not really a regular.
He's also, you know, actually a mod there
I know. But he hasn’t played here since... game of thrones I think?
Are there any other sizable mafia communities with a similar playstyle we should be considering? I'm not familiar with two of those you mentioned, Silver, and I haven't played on MS in ages.
I've not actually played a game on GiantITP, I'm an infrequent visitor to the site for Dungeons and Dragons related discussions mainly. I know they have a semi-active Mafia community because they send a player to Champs every year but I don't actually know what their phases/playstyle/etc. are like (I've enjoyed their champs representatives, though, I can't imagine it's all spam posting or something)
Similarly, SmashBoards I'm only vaguely aware of as a place Osie has hosted games before because he asked me to replace into a game a while back
I was mainly just listing examples of places we haven't specifically been invited to but that we could just all decide to start playing games at, in theory lol
Voxx is a better point of contact with MU than I am; I don't have a lot of real clout there other than by association with him lol. I've talked to Amy, Newcomb, and a few others during Champs but I'm not really a regular.
He's also, you know, actually a mod there
I know. But he hasn’t played here since... game of thrones I think?
He hasn't actually played more than a couple games total since then afaik
He uh, overexerted himself playing wolf in a mash a while ago and is semi-retired now
I think if a community decided to massively sign up here in a game and take over the meta, we automatically would resist that. It’s not a very good idea
I think if a community decided to massively sign up here in a game and take over the meta, we automatically would resist that. It’s not a very good idea
I agree with this. Merging with another community would need to be somewhere we have close ties and are familiar with. DLP or MC are the only two with enough cross community pollination that I'd feel comfortable with that sort of move.
I am torn and I would move to either place. I think I'd lean towards MU but it feels like a betrayal of Osie who has been a community MVP for a long time now which moves me back to decision paralysis.
I think we're smaller than most other communities at this point and I wouldn't want to go to, idk, somewhere that only plays 12/12 games and try to force a meta shift or something
I just meant we could all decide to play somewhere else and start playing/designing games there not take it over, if that's more clear
I think I'd lean towards MU but it feels like a betrayal of Osie who has been a community MVP for a long time now which moves me back to decision paralysis.
If some place smaller and more insulated, with a style that more matches ours is the notion, maybe we should do some investigating and scout out some of the other communities that MU has networked together?
Maybe there's another good fit out there that has style, sustainability, and community?
Many of the DLP regulars play here, but they only post signups in their own forum once in a blue moon and their forum software is... maybe worse than Curse for mafia, truth to tell
I'm not sure that actually posting sign ups and moving MtGS games there would be welcomed by them or advisable even if it was, tbh
I've spectated and played with a handful of CFC players, if they're posting signups in their own forum again (even if it's just in Partnered Communities on MU) it might be worth reaching out to them (I've no idea what their current game style is like though)
I think Cuthalion is from there (or theOrg, my memory is a bit fuzzy in the subject)
Many of the DLP regulars play here, but they only post signups in their own forum once in a blue moon and their forum software is... maybe worse than Curse for mafia, truth to tell
Ehh, unmodded Xenforo isn't THAT bad. Curse is hot garbage.
"**** Curse" is a good meme but the features aren't really that bad
I think the only thing better about Xenforo is the reduced script load (not nothing!)
As far as actual forum features I think Curse is preferable (except on mobile where it barely even works if you try to do anything other than quick reply)
I would add to the cons of MC the fact that they themselves might have to move, and therefore going there could result in us having to move a 2nd time. The smaller playerbase con would also be that we would still be struggling to fill games most likely.
I would add to the cons of MC the fact that they themselves might have to move, and therefore going there could result in us having to move a 2nd time. The smaller playerbase con would also be that we would still be struggling to fill games most likely.
These are really the only cons, to my mind? Besides upkeep costs if the site continues to grow, anyway
I do prefer the MU vote counter/history features but I do without them here and at DLP where I've played occasionally (I... actually have a spreadsheet rigged to give me basically the same info, I can just keep using that tbh)
I guess my thing is, what do we suppose the fraction of each player base interested in long phase games is that isn't already playing here? Even if it's lopsided like 10% of MC and 1% of MU we'd get more players on MU just from the sheer size of it; and given the amount of crossover and cross-recruiting that goes on between us and MC I have a feeling there aren't many MC regulars who haven't at least heard of us
The community is obviously also a consideration, MU I wouldn't say is unfriendly but it is more of a loose amalgamation of players passing through than a tight knit group of players who all play together a lot
I would add to the cons of MC the fact that they themselves might have to move, and therefore going there could result in us having to move a 2nd time. The smaller playerbase con would also be that we would still be struggling to fill games most likely.
Honestly, if we pull together the larger site costs of 2022, we could pretty much keep going until 2025 just on the strength of recruitment power from the current MC senior staff (ScarletCelestial, Kaitou, Osie, Prophylaxis, Wisp). There are two major reasons why talk of MC as a site shutting down has even been in peripheral vision, which are the pandemic and the site costs. The site costs are a little hefty for one person with the pandemic negatively impacting site traffic, but split between even 3 people, let alone something like 5+, are not a big deal.
Like, personally, the $200 I believe we've got coming for the larger 2022 payment isn't the end of the world, but if I'm handling it solo, that means that there's not enough interest in keeping things going. Even if 3-5 people together only covered half of that, I'd be much more comfortable covering whatever's left over.
These are really the only cons, to my mind? Besides upkeep costs if the site continues to grow, anyway
There's an argument for increasing the yearly costs for the hosting space to increase bandwidth and all that jazz, if the site grows significantly. As mentioned, I'm pretty sure we could keep things stable, as for growing? Probably slowly, but there's definite possibilities.
I do prefer the MU vote counter/history features but I do without them here and at DLP where I've played occasionally (I... actually have a spreadsheet rigged to give me basically the same info, I can just keep using that tbh)
Already looking into the difficulty of implementation on this.
How many active players does MC have, how many games running, does either MU or MC have a tools edge?
Also, it sounds like MC is gradually shrinking as well? Do they have a recruitment or growth strategy?
MU's gathering of refugees from across the internet has been a pretty successful plan, that seems like a strong bet for long term viability. I'd rather move once, not twice, as any and every move is going to result in casualties.
This is essentially my opinion, yes.
I would say MC and MU have similar tools, with MU having just the slightest bit of an edge in terms of user friendliness.
Alternatively, if the MC folks are declining also, would they be interested in leaving together with us, so that we can form a stronger bulwark against contrasting playstyles and meta?
Many of the DLP regulars play here, but they only post signups in their own forum once in a blue moon and their forum software is... maybe worse than Curse for mafia, truth to tell
It's hard to think of a forum software less suited for mafia than DLP's, especially in recent years.
And I've played in 2+2.
Many of the DLP regulars play here, but they only post signups in their own forum once in a blue moon and their forum software is... maybe worse than Curse for mafia, truth to tell
It's hard to think of a forum software less suited for mafia than DLP's, especially in recent years.
And I've played in 2+2.
Badly modded Xenforo I suppose is worse than unmodded Xenforo.
And there's not really any reason we couldn't do long phase on both MU and MC, I think?
It was recently confirmed for me by Amy and Logic that MU wouldn't mind adding one or two reviewers to the team but they can cover forum moderation
I don't think we've heard back from MC admins but presumably they're understaffed and could use a hand?
I'd probably throw my hat into the ring for reviewing games but I don't really want to moderate posts tbqh
The main problem with it, as I see it, is the same as the problem with using MU's Partner Communities to have our own space and help them run a dedicated long phase queue; do we have enough hosts and games to fill two queues?
I think we probably have enough games to fill two queues for a few months, at least, assuming sign ups are posted one at a time, and we can advertise games for both queues in the discord server so people in our community can see games on both sites
I guess another downside is that inevitably some of us are going to prefer one site to another and that will result in the community drifting apart, probably? But that's probably inevitable in the long term either way.
(We should also probably move for a new poll regarding where we're moving, since this poll is pretty decisive)
Eta: whatever we decide, we may want to see about hosting an invitational on each site so those who haven't played on both sites can try the software before moving for an official vote
I'm pretty sure I have hosting permissions for the modbot on MU already from when I was playing turbos... I could host Marson or something over there in the invitational subforum since I'm fairly familiar with the software on both sites already (may need permission from Amy or somebody to actually host a game though, not 100 on how the invitational subforum works)
If we go chronologically through the queue though the next two games are Osie's still in sign ups and... probably? a normal? Except Osie and Cantrip are the next two normals lol, if Rodemy is still around ( ) he could host his maybe
We could ask Osie if he wants to move his french poem game to MC once sign ups fill here (if the people currently in it are amendable to the plan). As part of the trial of MC I mean.
We could ask Osie if he wants to move his french poem game to MC once sign ups fill here (if the people currently in it are amendable to the plan). As part of the trial of MC I mean.
Playing just few games here I think I don't have much to say in this matter, but this is also due to the fact I only played mafia for two years and few months now.
I don't think MU is a cold place, I always enjoyed the environement, possibly because my homeforum was Vbulletin until they switched to Xenforo late in 2018. I learned there a lot of things during the Mentor games and I still have in mind a game from February 2019 when I played with Achromatic. I think I admired his playstyle and his years of play were impressive for me at the time, and now after playing with this community I understand why I am feeling, like in that game, like a kid joining adults conversation every time when I am playing here. This is not a feeling related in any way with my real age, but with my mafia (game experience and capability) age.
I wish this community to keep playing and I will play here as much as I can from now on, here, on MC, on MU or wherever you decide to go.
My soul would go to MC, because Osie's effort in making that site welcoming for everyone pays off in a game environement easier to play in and very enjoyable.
The reverse of "what if MC will die as well" is what if the migration of MtGS there will make a stronger community, attracting players there?
MU has the fascinating tools and the subforums where several communities who lost homeforums are having games. I played on CFC an unusual game and I would always return to play there, and also I noticed GDS has an active community of players who know well each other from over a decade.
I think I agree with Rand, and follow the community to have the opportunity to play with them.
I'm pretty sure I have hosting permissions for the modbot on MU already from when I was playing turbos... I could host Marson or something over there in the invitational subforum since I'm fairly familiar with the software on both sites already (may need permission from Amy or somebody to actually host a game though, not 100 on how the invitational subforum works)
If we go chronologically through the queue though the next two games are Osie's still in sign ups and... probably? a normal? Except Osie and Cantrip are the next two normals lol, if Rodemy is still around ( ) he could host his maybe
I designed an open setup that is being reviewed by Cantrip (and maybe Osie) that will be hosted by Ace Marvel (CfC). I can ask him to host it on MU instead of CfC.
Not sure if I should comment on this since I'm fairly new here, and likely considered as more of a MC guy by most, but I consider this my new mafia home tbh.
I agree with what Osie has to say about MU personally, I came to this site and started playing here, because I heard good things about it off a couple of my friends mainly Wisp, Osie Togs and Proph. I loved it here pretty much straight away because you have that small close community thing, that I personally love. MC/MS as we used to be called had that a lot more back in the day so playing here made me feel nolgastic I guess.
I don't get that from MU which is why I can't play there about Champ and team events. This is nothing on the people from there because a lot are great in my exp. I just find MU a little bit too big, and lacking in heart, it felt more like a job/chore playing there because it feels like a business at times and too imposing. It does not feel like a community at all, and that is something which is important for me when it comes to mafia, I enjoy the games for many reasons, but I also enjoy it because it led to me making a lot of friends and a lot of other good times be it *****ing in spec chat or just chatting in general.
So I selfishly would like you to choose MC for those reasons because based off what some of you have said that is why you enjoy mafia also, I can't gurantee it will be great, I'm still staff there and used to be leader before Osie took over and build it back up to what it is today. My work lately there has being slacking for multiple reasons, doing a merge though would likely give me new energy to try and make it better again though since I think you all would make it more like the place that I spend perhaps the best 3 years of my life. Osie has already done a way better job selling it then me though, I never know the right to say lol.
Like I said though I have no real right to say anything this is your home, and you all build it up, so you should all make the choice that is right for you. I just wanted to give me piece feel free to ignore it.
I am acting as Necromancer for this to find out what happened with the result. I haven't playee here in years now and I was waxing nostalgic and decided to look up my ol' acquaintances to find this.
Has the transition to MU happened? Or was something else decided?
I am acting as Necromancer for this to find out what happened with the result. I haven't playee here in years now and I was waxing nostalgic and decided to look up my ol' acquaintances to find this.
Has the transition to MU happened? Or was something else decided?
Hey man, we are in the process of moving to MU but our contact there is very busy so it's taking a while (but hopefully not much longer). We are still active on discord as our community coordination hub: https://discord.gg/F7eVGkwF
I should check out GiantITP at some point. Smashboards doesn't really have a queue system, but they have a good group of people. They're usually only managing micros, but could theoretically do better. That said, at that point, the community is just better off coming to MC since the friendly connections to Smashboards are already there.
I don't think this is a bad thing to be frank. Any difficulty coming from the difficulty of finding what you're looking for is completely artificial. If designs have to be tweaked and the balance on what is town sided versus scum sided is different in an environment with perfect votal info that's fine to me. As town when trying to solve the game having all of that information at your fingertips and getting down to solving is exactly the sort of thing that I fell in love with this game over.
Again I'm torn because we really are a partner community in everything but name with MC and I think a move there would absolutely be smoother. I just love the features of MU.
From what I can see, MafiaScum might make a good home, but I think that would just be as a group of players joining, I don't think we'd get any special treatment like MU is promising or anything. We don't have the connections and they didn't extend a hand (IIRC) when this was last discussed.
Okay, so full disclosure, recruitment and sustaining the site both have a sorta complicated situation.
That said, with more heads active in the game, I'm hopeful that recruitment can go up significantly. And I am still actively going out and checking out new communities, it's just less of a feeling of obligation and more of a personal interest. I've found the most effective way to get people has been directly messaging people in a 'door-to-door" sort of effort. That said, continued posting of game advertisements across communities and regular events does have a significant effect.
The concern I would have is that MC's staff has essentially gutted itself, but the infusion of new people can cover a part of that, and there are definitely people who without the pandemic and with some new blood could regain some of their energy, myself included.
I am still on-site as the technical guru (and queue manager/reviewer). I have a few User's Guides written for Players and am working on additional ones for hosts and moderators (the mod one is very easy, the host one takes some work). I've also spent roughly a grand on the site in the past two years, about 3 times as much as everyone else put together. If I have reason to believe that the community is running well and that other people are contributing to the overall figure, I will be more than willing to spend further. Either way, I'll be able to spend time on the technical side for quite a while.
So as for long-term survival, I don't know exactly what the plans of the current pair of community leaders are, but I know that the connections exist to other communities, and I know that we've managed to stay relatively steady over the past two years despite a relative decline in activity from a portion of regulars that has plagued MtGS as well.
I could attempt to handle connections with MafiaScum, but fundamentally, they are more insular than MU and MC to begin with, they just make it work. As for a joint merge and move, I can't say for certain, but I doubt it, unfortunately. The communities have similarities in playerbase and some ability for crossover, but MC's primary thrust hasn't been long-phase games. In addition, MU has a reputation, and I find that a lot of smaller community members, while they might be okay with playing there once or twice, are not interested in a long-term move.
I have decent footholds in half a dozen communities and feelers in a half dozen more. I have options for hosting for years to come should I be playing for that long. My interest in hosting on MU is academic at best, and in general while the experience of playing there has been just fine, it's not exciting.
I play social multiplayer games in significant part for the social element. I find that while MU has their own form of that, it is not one that I have found to draw me to the community. That's not to say that anyone was rude, or unwelcoming. But there was a degree of detachment for me that I did not experience elsewhere to the same degree even with MafiaScum (Similarly factory-like) or Mafia451 (Similarly hospital-waiting-room-like and memey). I fully expect that I will play another game on MU at some point, but I wouldn't ever be likely to want to make it a home.
I don't think that anyone should feel like there's a need for arguments or ultimatums, but I suspect that I'm not the only person who doesn't find MU to be the most enjoyable experience in the long term. The spirit of the site doesn't have to be a deal breaker for anyone, but it is for me.
I guess I could if we have a good talk about what to ask. But I think Silver is our best person there from how I’ve seen our interactions with the community.
I have a few connections and a tiny bit of a name thanks to the championship, but Silver has a lot more clout.
We need the partner community there if we go for it.
And those of us interested join walruses, a mafia game here and there, some other forum fun and discord activity just so people know we exist and might venture to our community there to try a game.
We can host a game on the main site once in a while to get us known. But not as a main thing.
The partner community should be priority #1 and everything else is secondary if our hosts / players have excess energy.
If we try to go for main site long queues and our community combined, our hosts will burn out. And if we go for integration in the main site with long queues, our identity is gone.
He's also, you know, actually a mod there
I know. But he hasn’t played here since... game of thrones I think?
Similarly, SmashBoards I'm only vaguely aware of as a place Osie has hosted games before because he asked me to replace into a game a while back
I was mainly just listing examples of places we haven't specifically been invited to but that we could just all decide to start playing games at, in theory lol
He uh, overexerted himself playing wolf in a mash a while ago and is semi-retired now
I agree with this. Merging with another community would need to be somewhere we have close ties and are familiar with. DLP or MC are the only two with enough cross community pollination that I'd feel comfortable with that sort of move.
I am torn and I would move to either place. I think I'd lean towards MU but it feels like a betrayal of Osie who has been a community MVP for a long time now which moves me back to decision paralysis.
I just meant we could all decide to play somewhere else and start playing/designing games there not take it over, if that's more clear
Don't worry about that too much.
Maybe there's another good fit out there that has style, sustainability, and community?
I'm not sure that actually posting sign ups and moving MtGS games there would be welcomed by them or advisable even if it was, tbh
I've spectated and played with a handful of CFC players, if they're posting signups in their own forum again (even if it's just in Partnered Communities on MU) it might be worth reaching out to them (I've no idea what their current game style is like though)
I think Cuthalion is from there (or theOrg, my memory is a bit fuzzy in the subject)
Ehh, unmodded Xenforo isn't THAT bad. Curse is hot garbage.
I think the only thing better about Xenforo is the reduced script load (not nothing!)
As far as actual forum features I think Curse is preferable (except on mobile where it barely even works if you try to do anything other than quick reply)
(Well, without add-ons.)
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I do prefer the MU vote counter/history features but I do without them here and at DLP where I've played occasionally (I... actually have a spreadsheet rigged to give me basically the same info, I can just keep using that tbh)
I guess my thing is, what do we suppose the fraction of each player base interested in long phase games is that isn't already playing here? Even if it's lopsided like 10% of MC and 1% of MU we'd get more players on MU just from the sheer size of it; and given the amount of crossover and cross-recruiting that goes on between us and MC I have a feeling there aren't many MC regulars who haven't at least heard of us
The community is obviously also a consideration, MU I wouldn't say is unfriendly but it is more of a loose amalgamation of players passing through than a tight knit group of players who all play together a lot
Honestly, if we pull together the larger site costs of 2022, we could pretty much keep going until 2025 just on the strength of recruitment power from the current MC senior staff (ScarletCelestial, Kaitou, Osie, Prophylaxis, Wisp). There are two major reasons why talk of MC as a site shutting down has even been in peripheral vision, which are the pandemic and the site costs. The site costs are a little hefty for one person with the pandemic negatively impacting site traffic, but split between even 3 people, let alone something like 5+, are not a big deal.
Like, personally, the $200 I believe we've got coming for the larger 2022 payment isn't the end of the world, but if I'm handling it solo, that means that there's not enough interest in keeping things going. Even if 3-5 people together only covered half of that, I'd be much more comfortable covering whatever's left over.
There's an argument for increasing the yearly costs for the hosting space to increase bandwidth and all that jazz, if the site grows significantly. As mentioned, I'm pretty sure we could keep things stable, as for growing? Probably slowly, but there's definite possibilities.
Already looking into the difficulty of implementation on this.
Besides it not working on mobile, anyway
I would say MC and MU have similar tools, with MU having just the slightest bit of an edge in terms of user friendliness.
I like this.
And I've played in 2+2.
Badly modded Xenforo I suppose is worse than unmodded Xenforo.
And there's not really any reason we couldn't do long phase on both MU and MC, I think?
It was recently confirmed for me by Amy and Logic that MU wouldn't mind adding one or two reviewers to the team but they can cover forum moderation
I don't think we've heard back from MC admins but presumably they're understaffed and could use a hand?
I'd probably throw my hat into the ring for reviewing games but I don't really want to moderate posts tbqh
The main problem with it, as I see it, is the same as the problem with using MU's Partner Communities to have our own space and help them run a dedicated long phase queue; do we have enough hosts and games to fill two queues?
I think we probably have enough games to fill two queues for a few months, at least, assuming sign ups are posted one at a time, and we can advertise games for both queues in the discord server so people in our community can see games on both sites
I guess another downside is that inevitably some of us are going to prefer one site to another and that will result in the community drifting apart, probably? But that's probably inevitable in the long term either way.
(We should also probably move for a new poll regarding where we're moving, since this poll is pretty decisive)
Eta: whatever we decide, we may want to see about hosting an invitational on each site so those who haven't played on both sites can try the software before moving for an official vote
Will make it feel like less of a blind vote for people hopefully
If we go chronologically through the queue though the next two games are Osie's still in sign ups and... probably? a normal? Except Osie and Cantrip are the next two normals lol, if Rodemy is still around (
I could certainly do that.
I don't think MU is a cold place, I always enjoyed the environement, possibly because my homeforum was Vbulletin until they switched to Xenforo late in 2018. I learned there a lot of things during the Mentor games and I still have in mind a game from February 2019 when I played with Achromatic. I think I admired his playstyle and his years of play were impressive for me at the time, and now after playing with this community I understand why I am feeling, like in that game, like a kid joining adults conversation every time when I am playing here. This is not a feeling related in any way with my real age, but with my mafia (game experience and capability) age.
I wish this community to keep playing and I will play here as much as I can from now on, here, on MC, on MU or wherever you decide to go.
My soul would go to MC, because Osie's effort in making that site welcoming for everyone pays off in a game environement easier to play in and very enjoyable.
The reverse of "what if MC will die as well" is what if the migration of MtGS there will make a stronger community, attracting players there?
MU has the fascinating tools and the subforums where several communities who lost homeforums are having games. I played on CFC an unusual game and I would always return to play there, and also I noticed GDS has an active community of players who know well each other from over a decade.
I think I agree with Rand, and follow the community to have the opportunity to play with them.
I designed an open setup that is being reviewed by Cantrip (and maybe Osie) that will be hosted by Ace Marvel (CfC). I can ask him to host it on MU instead of CfC.
I don't necessarily want to poach a game from their queue/players, though, you know what I mean? Lol
Well it should end up as a mix of players I guess. They’re going to be cool with that.
I agree with what Osie has to say about MU personally, I came to this site and started playing here, because I heard good things about it off a couple of my friends mainly Wisp, Osie Togs and Proph. I loved it here pretty much straight away because you have that small close community thing, that I personally love. MC/MS as we used to be called had that a lot more back in the day so playing here made me feel nolgastic I guess.
I don't get that from MU which is why I can't play there about Champ and team events. This is nothing on the people from there because a lot are great in my exp. I just find MU a little bit too big, and lacking in heart, it felt more like a job/chore playing there because it feels like a business at times and too imposing. It does not feel like a community at all, and that is something which is important for me when it comes to mafia, I enjoy the games for many reasons, but I also enjoy it because it led to me making a lot of friends and a lot of other good times be it *****ing in spec chat or just chatting in general.
So I selfishly would like you to choose MC for those reasons because based off what some of you have said that is why you enjoy mafia also, I can't gurantee it will be great, I'm still staff there and used to be leader before Osie took over and build it back up to what it is today. My work lately there has being slacking for multiple reasons, doing a merge though would likely give me new energy to try and make it better again though since I think you all would make it more like the place that I spend perhaps the best 3 years of my life. Osie has already done a way better job selling it then me though, I never know the right to say lol.
Like I said though I have no real right to say anything this is your home, and you all build it up, so you should all make the choice that is right for you. I just wanted to give me piece feel free to ignore it.
Has the transition to MU happened? Or was something else decided?
Hey man, we are in the process of moving to MU but our contact there is very busy so it's taking a while (but hopefully not much longer). We are still active on discord as our community coordination hub: https://discord.gg/F7eVGkwF