KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I’ve been spending some time going down the rabbit hole of “why Eco” and “did Eco really shoot Igno”, while waiting for HR to come on and say something.
And, gotta say, that was not the most inspiring of claims. I don’t want to completely rule out 2 vigs for the same reasons KJ said, but seems like a stretch. You didn’t even say your movie, or flavor, or, you know why.
And that’s completely aside from Vaimes sticking with his claim.
I’m working all day tomorrow again, but I’m going to try and have some more in depth posts Wednesday.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
IDK how many big posts you make in Mafia but... they're exhausting.
They can be...but this isn't. This is literally clicking 'View posts" under my handle and control Fing "Eco"
You're going to have to do it either way. You have a scum lean on me. Why would you take me at my word and not check?
Well if you change your story that's telling, but I don't see why you would since the info is there. Assuming you didn't lie about something on public record isn't a hard assumption to make.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Anyone else feel like HR posts and then yeets the laptop/phone/tablet/whatever across the room?
I'm honestly sticking around because I'm very curious to his response to Vaimes.
Even if we didn't have Vaimes....it still doesn't make sense right?
Nah. You asked him the same questions I asked him.
Also, weird choice to go "oh so now you're okay yeeting me for NO REASON, HUH?"
...Sir, the cop red-checked you, why are you pretending that's not a thing, you clearly saw it, you reference it in the same post.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I came into today feeling like I had this stitched up and was ready to bask in the town credit but apparently I completely have misread everything based on what's happened since the day start.
First order of business: Vote: HR
I'm fine following the cop check here. We don't need to go all the way immediately but I'm happy to start the ball rolling.
Great job, town! I knew you'd eventually arrive to the conclusion it took me seconds to arrive at in a game I was barely paying attention to. Proud of you.
Anyway I'll be taking my towncred now and ride it till the end, thanks.
Btw, Killjoy's scum too. Try not to take too long this time. VOTE: KILLJOY
Locked.
What are you seeing on KJ? The only thing that jumps out to me is the attempts to move off Rhand at the EoD. Which is not a great look on it's own but I have several others who I think look worse at the EoD.
I wonder at the possibility that there's a 3rder and it's Goo.
Btw, @Ter: Walk me through your progression on Rhand start to finish please.
Also, why did you never talk about what was off with 275/6 yesterDay? It's also really not as big a deal as you're making it.
Man, I really wanted to ask Eco why is "someone strawmaning you = light town read" for HR. Post-game I guess.
Also...... = ??
Apart from being terribly wrong (and overstating the strength of my read yesterday) about HR why am I in null? And why was I your second choice to kill today after KJ?
So before your flurry of posts I was very confident in a PoE of ZDS+[Sloth/HR/Ter]. Outside of a red check I wasn't planning on voting anyone except for ZDS today. So @Sloth why is ZDS town?
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
Was Eco scumreading Vaimes? I'm too lazy to check I'm gonna check now.According to 548, he wasn't. Unless it was a kneejerk reaction shot (which I would say isn't Eco's style) then Eco shot Igno, HR shot Eco, and in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
Was Eco scumreading Vaimes? I'm too lazy to check I'm gonna check now.According to 548, he wasn't. Unless it was a kneejerk reaction shot (which I would say isn't Eco's style) then Eco shot Igno, HR shot Eco, and in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
Why are we entertaining a world where Eco shot Igno when we have a player claiming the kill, regardless of their alignment?
For ignoramus to have saved me and be shot by Highroller, it would mean that bodyguards can absorb strongman kills, which. I guess is okay mechanically? A bodyguard death seems like something in-between prevention and redirection, at least to me.
I don't have much experience with this exact scenario.
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
and Eco shot himself? Or would you be assuming 2 scum shots last night and Eco not shooting at all? Because I’m virtually certain after yesterday that Eco would have shot at someone last night.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
Was Eco scumreading Vaimes? I'm too lazy to check I'm gonna check now.According to 548, he wasn't. Unless it was a kneejerk reaction shot (which I would say isn't Eco's style) then Eco shot Igno, HR shot Eco, and in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
Why are we entertaining a world where Eco shot Igno when we have a player claiming the kill, regardless of their alignment?
Because I don't quite believe the two vigs scenario, and the person claiming the kill has a redcheck on them.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Ohhh Ingo was in that PoE too but obviously they dead. Ter was the one I felt was most town (see earlier thing about the interaction with Eco raising her in my eyes) but Sloth's confidence today is beyond infectious and despite him having practically no impact on the Rhand wagon that I could discern (to my eyes it was basically Eco's doing and then a bit of credit to me) I kind of do want to give him a ton of credit.
So yeah. I went from elation feeling like I cracked the game open with Eco to realizing that everyone thought I was completely irrelevant (which makes sense given that I missed the end of day...)
...in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
...this world shouldn't exist according to your own reads. You clear Vaimes as Town. Vaimes has red checked HR. So why is your brain even bringing up this world?
Because I’m virtually certain after yesterday that Eco would have shot at someone last night.
Strongly agree with this.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm. Actually I might know what happened but it's only really relevant if Eco wasn't shot by scum either by HR true claiming his shot (doesn't account for the missing scum shot here unless HR is true claiming the NK which would be funny) or by scum trying to shoot Vaimes and Igno protecting him.
I came into today feeling like I had this stitched up and was ready to bask in the town credit but apparently I completely have misread everything based on what's happened since the day start.
First order of business: Vote: HR
I'm fine following the cop check here. We don't need to go all the way immediately but I'm happy to start the ball rolling.
Great job, town! I knew you'd eventually arrive to the conclusion it took me seconds to arrive at in a game I was barely paying attention to. Proud of you.
Anyway I'll be taking my towncred now and ride it till the end, thanks.
Btw, Killjoy's scum too. Try not to take too long this time. VOTE: KILLJOY
Locked.
What are you seeing on KJ? The only thing that jumps out to me is the attempts to move off Rhand at the EoD. Which is not a great look on it's own but I have several others who I think look worse at the EoD.
Like?
As for KJ, I talk about it in the post right after the one you're quoting. I'm also not impressed by his play toDay so far.
Apart from being terribly wrong (and overstating the strength of my read yesterday) about HR why am I in null? And why was I your second choice to kill today after KJ?
You're in the null because nothing you've done has placed you as solidly town or scum, imo.
Third choice, after HR (I've said this already, I thought?) - mostly because that indie bit between you and KJ was awkward af, so potentially genuine and not theater.
HR does not have that.
So before your flurry of posts I was very confident in a PoE of ZDS+[Sloth/HR/Ter].
Flurry of posts? As in, toDay's? You're going to have to explain to me in great ******* detail why I would ever be a scumread for you. Especially a confident one - go.
Outside of a red check I wasn't planning on voting anyone except for ZDS today. So @Sloth why is ZDS town?
Irreverence, muleheaded clinging to tunnelling, "nitpicky", a couple of moments of genuine mindmeld (when he called out KJ for the same things I was thinking before I did.)
I'm curious to see why you're confident on him being scum. Go on?
...in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
...this world shouldn't exist according to your own reads. You clear Vaimes as Town. Vaimes has red checked HR. So why is your brain even bringing up this world?
I'm mapping out the worlds that make sense in Sloth's world that Igno stopped the scum kill.
Sloth's world makes no sense unless HR is town. Why would he not shoot Vaimes? If HR shot Vaimes, Vaimes would be dead because HR is claiming strongman. Therefore, HR didn't shoot Vaimes. In either world, town or scum, he shot Igno, but then shot Eco? The only way it makes sense to me that HR shot Igno over... well anyone townie at all is if he's town.
I personally don't think that world exists (I think HR killed Eco), but it's the one that makes sense if HR is telling the truth.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
and Eco shot himself? Or would you be assuming 2 scum shots last night and Eco not shooting at all? Because I’m virtually certain after yesterday that Eco would have shot at someone last night.
It's role madness, I don't see a problem with scum having more than one KP.
I mean, it's possible Eco could have shot, but I don't see what makes it certain.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Ohhh Ingo was in that PoE too but obviously they dead. Ter was the one I felt was most town (see earlier thing about the interaction with Eco raising her in my eyes) but Sloth's confidence today is beyond infectious and despite him having practically no impact on the Rhand wagon that I could discern (to my eyes it was basically Eco's doing and then a bit of credit to me) I kind of do want to give him a ton of credit.
You should.
The greatest strikes are the ones you don't see
...in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.
...this world shouldn't exist according to your own reads. You clear Vaimes as Town. Vaimes has red checked HR. So why is your brain even bringing up this world?
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
and Eco shot himself? Or would you be assuming 2 scum shots last night and Eco not shooting at all? Because I’m virtually certain after yesterday that Eco would have shot at someone last night.
It's role madness, I don't see a problem with scum having more than one KP.
I mean, it's possible Eco could have shot, but I don't see what makes it certain.
But why does scum!HR kill Igno over literally anyone townie?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I was supposing if he were scum, and I was pushing a team that included him, I'd be the best shot. Free dead cop!
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
...Wait how hasn't it occurred to any of us that Igno protected you?
I feel dumb.
and Eco shot himself? Or would you be assuming 2 scum shots last night and Eco not shooting at all? Because I’m virtually certain after yesterday that Eco would have shot at someone last night.
It's role madness, I don't see a problem with scum having more than one KP.
I mean, it's possible Eco could have shot, but I don't see what makes it certain.
But why does scum!HR kill Igno over literally anyone townie?
...Again. Bodyguard.
I get there's a strongman, but I'm not sure that wouldn't be countered successfully by a bodyguard: After all, a kill still goes through.
Ftr, I've asked Cantrip what would happen, waiting to see if he answers.
But why does scum!HR kill Igno over literally anyone townie?
Isn't the point that in this scenario he didn't? That he targeted Vaimes and igno died protecting him?
ET's flip specifically says "Prevent all kills that would target that player during that Night" It's not a bastard game and it's kinda bastardy to lie in a mod flip
The desperation to derail the Rhand wagon, the complete focus on getting Eco killed, and again the massive effort at EoD for anyone but Rhand to die. Once HR dies I'm going to push him tomorrow. Go read his EoD again. That is a classic example of someone trying to get a buddy through one more phase.
As for you being in the PoE it was because I was confident of my town reads (which I'm very much doubting now). I think my reading the EoD after the fact completely underminded my understanding of it because I came out of it thinking that Eco, Axel, myself, and to a lesser extent KJ and Jack were smelling like roses. HR I still was riding my "he's no different to himself and I don't think he'd be able to play such an identical game as scum" read which is now obviously wrong and I didn't think Vaimes was scum. I still was sheeping KJ's read on you yesterday to an extent and felt that your early vote park on Rhand and then complete disinterest in developing a case or really driving the wagon home was indicative of someone who got stuck with an early distancing vote and couldn't find a safe route off their buddy in the EoD rush because they'd been counting on the other wagon to reach majority.
@KJ I think it was obvious I thought I had a catch over the conflict in the readslist but it turned out I was confusing his summary of Jack's with his own. Hence the subsequent unvote and self denigration.
The desperation to derail the Rhand wagon, the complete focus on getting Eco killed, and again the massive effort at EoD for anyone but Rhand to die. Once HR dies I'm going to push him tomorrow. Go read his EoD again. That is a classic example of someone trying to get a buddy through one more phase.
As for you being in the PoE it was because I was confident of my town reads (which I'm very much doubting now). I think my reading the EoD after the fact completely underminded my understanding of it because I came out of it thinking that Eco, Axel, myself, and to a lesser extent KJ and Jack were smelling like roses. HR I still was riding my "he's no different to himself and I don't think he'd be able to play such an identical game as scum" read which is now obviously wrong and I didn't think Vaimes was scum. I still was sheeping KJ's read on you yesterday to an extent and felt that your early vote park on Rhand and then complete disinterest in developing a case or really driving the wagon home was indicative of someone who got stuck with an early distancing vote and couldn't find a safe route off their buddy in the EoD rush because they'd been counting on the other wagon to reach majority.
Yes, I'm absolutely known for being concerned about keeping it safe.
That's the thing though, KJ's read on me was non-existent. "Oh he's not around and isn't doing anything with his vote, scum!" That's what you sheeped? Hm.
...okay.
As for ZDS: I read the eoD. What I saw was someone that was absolutely convinced they were right and would never second-guess it. Which fits with him as town. Him as scum is smarter, more flexible and more capable of diplomacy. A ssssssssssssssssssslippery snake as scum, a rock as town.
Sides, as scum he would have given up on Rhand way sooner. A 1-shot BP is not that useful if you're outted.
I'll read it again, but it sounds like you agree with me. @all can I get some feedback on this?
@Highroller: Pretend it's ET the video game and let your guilt fade.
I feel better now.
Also that might be a scum role in this setup with a BG and a vig already outed. You're basically a mirror of Eco's role, and the strongman bit is a bit too much for town to have I think.
I think it actually makes sense. Recklessness with this role can result in causing more harm than benefit.
And, gotta say, that was not the most inspiring of claims. I don’t want to completely rule out 2 vigs for the same reasons KJ said, but seems like a stretch. You didn’t even say your movie, or flavor, or, you know why.
I claimed Nada from They Live. I said this in response to one of your posts.
Did you think the guy yelling, "I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass... and I'm all out of bubble gum," was the doctor?
Lagoon cop check real or not is good enough for me, HR was the one I wanted dead most of yesterday, so this works for me. I also don't believe that he is a town vig and did not shoot me or Ter. We were the only two he pushed yesterday, so shooting elsewhere makes zero sense. I'm also semi shocked that Eco never shot me either since I was their main tunnel.
I don't want to speed yeet though, best to discuss things more first. I will be around more tomorrow though.
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And, gotta say, that was not the most inspiring of claims. I don’t want to completely rule out 2 vigs for the same reasons KJ said, but seems like a stretch. You didn’t even say your movie, or flavor, or, you know why.
And that’s completely aside from Vaimes sticking with his claim.
I’m working all day tomorrow again, but I’m going to try and have some more in depth posts Wednesday.
They can be...but this isn't. This is literally clicking 'View posts" under my handle and control Fing "Eco"
You're going to have to do it either way. You have a scum lean on me. Why would you take me at my word and not check?
Even if we didn't have Vaimes....it still doesn't make sense right?
Not using it on ANY OF HIS SUPPOSED SCUM READS.
But if he's a villager, yeah, the claim and the target are both terrible.
Also, weird choice to go "oh so now you're okay yeeting me for NO REASON, HUH?"
...Sir, the cop red-checked you, why are you pretending that's not a thing, you clearly saw it, you reference it in the same post.
I feel dumb.
First order of business:
Vote: HR
I'm fine following the cop check here. We don't need to go all the way immediately but I'm happy to start the ball rolling.
What are you seeing on KJ? The only thing that jumps out to me is the attempts to move off Rhand at the EoD. Which is not a great look on it's own but I have several others who I think look worse at the EoD.
Apart from being terribly wrong (and overstating the strength of my read yesterday) about HR why am I in null? And why was I your second choice to kill today after KJ?
So before your flurry of posts I was very confident in a PoE of ZDS+[Sloth/HR/Ter]. Outside of a red check I wasn't planning on voting anyone except for ZDS today. So @Sloth why is ZDS town?
I'm too lazy to checkI'm gonna check now.According to 548, he wasn't. Unless it was a kneejerk reaction shot (which I would say isn't Eco's style) then Eco shot Igno, HR shot Eco, and in the world where HR is town, scum probably did shoot Vaimes, killing Igno again if he was protecting him.You gave me a scare, thinking I somehow read the names wrong again, but no, I went back and checked just now.
Rude.
I don't have much experience with this exact scenario.
So yeah. I went from elation feeling like I cracked the game open with Eco to realizing that everyone thought I was completely irrelevant (which makes sense given that I missed the end of day...)
...this world shouldn't exist according to your own reads. You clear Vaimes as Town. Vaimes has red checked HR. So why is your brain even bringing up this world?
Strongly agree with this.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm. Actually I might know what happened but it's only really relevant if Eco wasn't shot by scum either by HR true claiming his shot (doesn't account for the missing scum shot here unless HR is true claiming the NK which would be funny) or by scum trying to shoot Vaimes and Igno protecting him.
Getta load o'this guy, getting the ball rolling.
Like?
As for KJ, I talk about it in the post right after the one you're quoting. I'm also not impressed by his play toDay so far.
You're in the null because nothing you've done has placed you as solidly town or scum, imo.
Third choice, after HR (I've said this already, I thought?) - mostly because that indie bit between you and KJ was awkward af, so potentially genuine and not theater.
HR does not have that.
Flurry of posts? As in, toDay's? You're going to have to explain to me in great ******* detail why I would ever be a scumread for you. Especially a confident one - go.
Irreverence, muleheaded clinging to tunnelling, "nitpicky", a couple of moments of genuine mindmeld (when he called out KJ for the same things I was thinking before I did.)
I'm curious to see why you're confident on him being scum. Go on?
Sloth's world makes no sense unless HR is town. Why would he not shoot Vaimes? If HR shot Vaimes, Vaimes would be dead because HR is claiming strongman. Therefore, HR didn't shoot Vaimes. In either world, town or scum, he shot Igno, but then shot Eco? The only way it makes sense to me that HR shot Igno over... well anyone townie at all is if he's town.
I personally don't think that world exists (I think HR killed Eco), but it's the one that makes sense if HR is telling the truth.
I mean, it's possible Eco could have shot, but I don't see what makes it certain.
The greatest strikes are the ones you don't see
"No impact" he says. Lol.
I get there's a strongman, but I'm not sure that wouldn't be countered successfully by a bodyguard: After all, a kill still goes through.
Ftr, I've asked Cantrip what would happen, waiting to see if he answers.
Isn't the point that in this scenario he didn't? That he targeted Vaimes and igno died protecting him?
ET's flip specifically says "Prevent all kills that would target that player during that Night" It's not a bastard game and it's kinda bastardy to lie in a mod flip
As for you being in the PoE it was because I was confident of my town reads (which I'm very much doubting now). I think my reading the EoD after the fact completely underminded my understanding of it because I came out of it thinking that Eco, Axel, myself, and to a lesser extent KJ and Jack were smelling like roses. HR I still was riding my "he's no different to himself and I don't think he'd be able to play such an identical game as scum" read which is now obviously wrong and I didn't think Vaimes was scum. I still was sheeping KJ's read on you yesterday to an extent and felt that your early vote park on Rhand and then complete disinterest in developing a case or really driving the wagon home was indicative of someone who got stuck with an early distancing vote and couldn't find a safe route off their buddy in the EoD rush because they'd been counting on the other wagon to reach majority.
Which doesn't matter, because either way you slice it, Highroller is scum and we are going to kill him.
Same here.
That's the thing though, KJ's read on me was non-existent. "Oh he's not around and isn't doing anything with his vote, scum!" That's what you sheeped? Hm.
...okay.
As for ZDS: I read the eoD. What I saw was someone that was absolutely convinced they were right and would never second-guess it. Which fits with him as town. Him as scum is smarter, more flexible and more capable of diplomacy. A ssssssssssssssssssslippery snake as scum, a rock as town.
Sides, as scum he would have given up on Rhand way sooner. A 1-shot BP is not that useful if you're outted.
I'll read it again, but it sounds like you agree with me.
@all can I get some feedback on this?
Eco is not the type who would holster when he was a top NK choice. I would put my confidence at over 95%.
I feel better now.
I think it actually makes sense. Recklessness with this role can result in causing more harm than benefit.
PMing Cantripmancer a question. Let's see if he answers.
Yeah, I can't say I blame them, honestly.
Why wouldn't I?
In fairness to me, he's solved now.
I claimed Nada from They Live. I said this in response to one of your posts.
Did you think the guy yelling, "I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass... and I'm all out of bubble gum," was the doctor?
Especially since my kill cannot be bodyguarded.
Lagoon cop check real or not is good enough for me, HR was the one I wanted dead most of yesterday, so this works for me. I also don't believe that he is a town vig and did not shoot me or Ter. We were the only two he pushed yesterday, so shooting elsewhere makes zero sense. I'm also semi shocked that Eco never shot me either since I was their main tunnel.
I don't want to speed yeet though, best to discuss things more first. I will be around more tomorrow though.