Do you expect real time interactions in such long days to be a thing?
i mean, yeah? they basically already have been.
For the bolded, i know you are an experienced player, how come you don't know what you are looking for?
i'm talking about things like trying to answer "do x and y make sense as scum partners?" or "z claimed this, does this make sense with their earlier play?"
I am used with spontaneous real time interactions, when the posts are one after another like in a tennis match. Can you tell me what posts do you consider as real time interactions?
I agree the last things are a base for associative reads and more complex analysis who should not exist so early in the game, i was talking about wolfy behaviour who can be spotted though.
yeah im not about to try to figure out what generic "wolfy behavior" is in an alien meta when i've subbed into day 1. in my experience, every different site has its own assumptions as to what wolves do or don't do, and different sites often flat-out contradict each other. (e.g. is "being defensive" a wolfy or towny trait??). other people more familiar with this site's meta can do that stuff.
this right here is close enough to real time for me.
Agree for this but was something similar before?
I think what is important in a game are your own sense of seizing fake-ness and this is not related to site's behaviour/meta, wolves may have some universal tells isn't it?
Being defensive can go either way, i think.
yeah im not about to try to figure out what generic "wolfy behavior" is in an alien meta when i've subbed into day 1. in my experience, every different site has its own assumptions as to what wolves do or don't do, and different sites often flat-out contradict each other. (e.g. is "being defensive" a wolfy or towny trait??). other people more familiar with this site's meta can do that stuff.
this right here is close enough to real time for me.
Agree for this but was something similar before?
i don't understand what you're asking here
I think what is important in a game are your own sense of seizing fake-ness and this is not related to site's behaviour/meta, wolves may have some universal tells isn't it?
Being defensive can go either way, i think.
no? do you have an example of a universal wolf tell?
i think some behaviors may be near-universally *more likely* to come from a wolf, but that's not the same thing, i don't think.
i do agree that sensing fake-ness is important, and i also think that there are some attributes of fake-ness that more commonly come from scum. but i also think that some metas put more pressure on townies to contribute content early, and in those metas, townies are gonna fake content more frequently, so fake-ness as a wolf tell becomes less reliable. for example.
to answer ZDS's question from early, i think ZDS is more likely to be town that cropcircles
shoutout to the extension cause i definitely spent most of the night ******* around on MTGA
7-1 in sealed baby let's go
I too am currently being distracted by the new set.
I can't get worked up about ZDS. I'm probably going to try and find a different target. It's just hard for me to get invested this early.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Is it worth it to ask - why specifically those posts out of the 380 or so when you caught up? If I was catching up/reading the thread, the posts you picked out don't feel especially notable compared to the other ones.
Quote from ZDS »
There is no such thing as "too blatant", and the blatant buddy interactions between the two go both ways (CC -> JT and JT -> CC).
Fair; it's just that to me they seem almost *too* on the nose. Don't really feel like pursuing this avenue until one of them has flipped, though.
For the record @WakeMeUp - you've played with me before. I'm Crossbell. I promise to be less insufferable in this game than I was in our previous game we played.
Pretty fine with WMU especially his post #398 which is a pretty nuanced interrogation of CC.
cayvie - you've at least skimmed all the posts in this game, can I get a birds-eye view (heh) of where your head is at/general impressions of all players ITT? Your posting style is refreshing but I'm still kinda iffy on your slot and getting an idea of where you're at will help me parse your alignment better.
I think I owe ZDS and explanation on by obvious bait. Crop Circles was playing too over defensive early on in my opinion, so with little to no meat behind it, I voted CC to see if I could get a reaction like I would expect an over defensive player to make and CC just kind of ignored it, which from either alignment is the right response in my opinion, but looking back at it several pages later (don't quote me on how many pages, I'm just guessing), I personally found it a bit obvious that's what I was doing. I unvoted because the lack of violent outbursts referring to bad stick pokers made me think that it wasn't the best reason to be voting them.
When's the deadline now? Sunday? Shoot, I'm VLA on weekends but we need to start some momentum towards a lynch. I'm a fan of the new replacements (*waves*) content so far. I'm still side eyeing the lack of comments regarding Vaimes from CC, seems like a noteworthy omission. I'm going to explore the Vaimes-CC interactions a bit.
For the rest of you, Help im a bug was in the very first mafia game I ever hosted, which was Lord of the Rings Mafia, 15+ years ago. And promptly got killed N1, in a game where there was *no* Day 1 before the first N1. So yes, died without ever actually playing. Because that was a thing we did back then.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
For the rest of you, Help im a bug was in the very first mafia game I ever hosted, which was Lord of the Rings Mafia, 15+ years ago. And promptly got killed N1, in a game where there was *no* Day 1 before the first N1. So yes, died without ever actually playing. Because that was a thing we did back then.
Still, nowhere near as terrible a decision as letting Vecna_Reborn be in charge.
For the record @WakeMeUp - you've played with me before. I'm Crossbell. I promise to be less insufferable in this game than I was in our previous game we played.
Pretty fine with WMU especially his post #398 which is a pretty nuanced interrogation of CC.
cayvie - you've at least skimmed all the posts in this game, can I get a birds-eye view (heh) of where your head is at/general impressions of all players ITT? Your posting style is refreshing but I'm still kinda iffy on your slot and getting an idea of where you're at will help me parse your alignment better.
wow hi ^^
there is just one condition for that sir, and i think you know it, and is not related to role play :). I owe you apologises for complaining about your role play back then btw
Can I know in simple words why did you vote for CC?
no? do you have an example of a universal wolf tell?
i think some behaviors may be near-universally *more likely* to come from a wolf, but that's not the same thing, i don't think.
i do agree that sensing fake-ness is important, and i also think that there are some attributes of fake-ness that more commonly come from scum. but i also think that some metas put more pressure on townies to contribute content early, and in those metas, townies are gonna fake content more frequently, so fake-ness as a wolf tell becomes less reliable. for example.
<snip>
no, but my experience is not near close to yours, if you started to play 15 years ago, from what i know game experience helps a lot in finding wolves.
I don't replicate my own town meta in my games, so i am always playing a little different, maybe because i am bored to repeat myself. My towntell is content related, i am alot more active scumhunting as villager. Aand i am spontaneous as town, but this is in this game harder to spot because of these long phases and the fact after a while you can't know when the posts are posted (we can't check timing)
I will think at the idea of town faking content tbh, it rubs me in the wrong way.
His initial response to ZDS was extremely overdefensive, and even now I still don't really understand why he suspects ZDS.
He has taken mostly safe stances in his reads post, and overall has been playing fairly reactively. I don't really see any inclination to figure things out.
His initial response to ZDS was extremely overdefensive, and even now I still don't really understand why he suspects ZDS.
He has taken mostly safe stances in his reads post, and overall has been playing fairly reactively. I don't really see any inclination to figure things out.
If you think i am not scumhunting, then why were you fine with one of my first posts? Did I say i am suspecting ZDS? Where?
Is interesting how you start to label now as 'overdefensive' a post you didn't quote - i wish details here ngl.
Also 'safe stances' in my reads post, can you walk me through your thought process please?
I really appreciate cayvie making the effort to look up my and CC's posts in spite of his "random shot to see what happens, and then look at the aftermath later" self-meta and despite not understanding at first what the deal was about (@cayvie maybe you missed it by skimming, CC and I were tied at four votes each at one point; the three replacements in a row killed both our wagons). It shows his willingness to contribute and figure things out is higher than his desire to look consistent.
Also saintly poop it's helpimabug! I don't remember if we ever played together but I do remember you from reading really old games. This game is such a blast from the past!
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@Vaimes I definitely agree with letting Grape breathe. He's in my scum team because of team-building and POE, and this being Day 1 with no flips yet there are many ways I could be proven wrong or change my mind. On his own, he's solidly null.
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I don't have an opinion yet on WMU's posts since my last intervention (I'm waiting for her conclusions) but I do like the general vibe of inquisitiveness / figuring things out on her own she gives out.
@WMU FYI, on desktop you can hover over where it says "X hours ago" or "Y days ago" to see the exact time-stamp of a post.
Also FYI, Proph meant to tell you CC isn't scumhunting (etc.), rather than speak about you and say you aren't scumhunting (etc.).
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@JoeTerry
1) What do you think of CC's lack of reactions to (iirc) *any* of the votes on him besides mine?
2) When you say you are going to explore the Vaimes-CC interactions, do you do that from a starting point of scum-reading CC, town-reading CC or null-reading CC?
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Due to the recent townieness or I'm-okay-with-it-ness of various players, I don't have null reads anymore (except Grape who gets downgraded to scum by POE). Here's where I stand (in player list order):
Not all my town reads have the same strength. For example the Axel read is based on imperfect meta (I know his town game, I don't remember his scum game) and Proph could have pocketted me with his stanning. Nevertheless I can say with confidence that I do town-read the entire "Good" block, not merely not-scum-read them. Even silver. If I look past our differing beliefs he's pretty okay.
This means I'm either crazy good at this game or crazy easy to pocket. In order to figure that out, I will only vote CC or JoeTerry.
If either of them is town, I need to kick myself out of any tunnel or pocket I'm in and completely reconsider everything.
I really appreciate cayvie making the effort to look up my and CC's posts in spite of his "random shot to see what happens, and then look at the aftermath later" self-meta and despite not understanding at first what the deal was about (@cayvie maybe you missed it by skimming, CC and I were tied at four votes each at one point; the three replacements in a row killed both our wagons). It shows his willingness to contribute and figure things out is higher than his desire to look consistent.
Also saintly poop it's helpimabug! I don't remember if we ever played together but I do remember you from reading really old games. This game is such a blast from the past!
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@Vaimes I definitely agree with letting Grape breathe. He's in my scum team because of team-building and POE, and this being Day 1 with no flips yet there are many ways I could be proven wrong or change my mind. On his own, he's solidly null.
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I don't have an opinion yet on WMU's posts since my last intervention (I'm waiting for her conclusions) but I do like the general vibe of inquisitiveness / figuring things out on her own she gives out.
@WMU FYI, on desktop you can hover over where it says "X hours ago" or "Y days ago" to see the exact time-stamp of a post.
Also FYI, Proph meant to tell you CC isn't scumhunting (etc.), rather than speak about you and say you aren't scumhunting (etc.).
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@JoeTerry
1) What do you think of CC's lack of reactions to (iirc) *any* of the votes on him besides mine?
2) When you say you are going to explore the Vaimes-CC interactions, do you do that from a starting point of scum-reading CC, town-reading CC or null-reading CC?
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Due to the recent townieness or I'm-okay-with-it-ness of various players, I don't have null reads anymore (except Grape who gets downgraded to scum by POE). Here's where I stand (in player list order):
Not all my town reads have the same strength. For example the Axel read is based on imperfect meta (I know his town game, I don't remember his scum game) and Proph could have pocketted me with his stanning. Nevertheless I can say with confidence that I do town-read the entire "Good" block, not merely not-scum-read them. Even silver. If I look past our differing beliefs he's pretty okay.
This means I'm either crazy good at this game or crazy easy to pocket. In order to figure that out, I will only vote CC or JoeTerry.
If either of them is town, I need to kick myself out of any tunnel or pocket I'm in and completely reconsider everything.
Im mobile only so can’t get into too many details, but I found this very interesting: The two players I was interested in voting after my recap were CC and Vaimes. Then shortly after CC makes a big catch up post that doesn’t even mention vaimes once. I don’t see how vaimes could just be completely omitted by someone (CC) doing a review especially because the person just voting you and like I said obviously baiting you pointed vaimes out as potential scum as well.
So I want to go back and look more carefully at their interactions because I’m wanting to make sure I’m not just tunneling, because you know only scum tunnel right? (Yes that’s a pointed and sarcastic remark aimed at you ZDS)
@CC It's out of topic, but FYI, you had a legacy that remained after you faded away. I saw a few new players here (back then) use the word "honestly" as a scum-tell without themselves knowing they were parroting an argument you had made in a game some time before (at least I think it was you). Obligatory
Yeah, that was me. I was being coy when I said I didn't remember. I'm still suspicious when people say "honestly" irl apropos of nothing. It's not as telling as when people use the word "categorically" when denying a public scandal, but still.
I wish to know @CC why DK would deserve a vote for this without any question and without engaging with him in an interaction, and why, when i subbed in you unvoted in P#355? Do you think a sub is changing AI?
The vote was to apply pressure and see his reaction. Since I'm not gonna get to see his reaction, there's no point in leaving the vote.
Quote from WMU(BIGG) »
Also, what impression do you have about your wagon I posted above and why didn't you show much stress for being voted?
I did't show stress because I'm not stressed. I really think people are misinterpreting my vote on ZDS as an OMGUS vote and taking it as defensiveness. I voted for ZDS because I couldn't follow his logic. See here:
Quote from ZDS when voting me »
And no the irony of accusing him of doing what he's accusing Proph of doing is not lost on me. But there's my second issue with this post: whereas Proph is experimenting by looking for lurkers too early and is ******* up as a result, CC hides carefully in a dark corner and seems to mostly focus on not ******* up. To bring back the digestive track, Proph had guts, CC has none.
Quote from Me in response »
The real difference here is that Proph put a target on half the players in the game for something that obviously isn't actually telling at all. It was clearly too early in the game to start lurker hunting as several of us hadn't even checked in. My accusation was against unjustified bandwagon votes, which is an accusation against just two players and is for a legitimate reason. As opposed to a meaningless accusation against half the town.
ZDS admits that he's accusing me of the same thing I was accusing Proph of, but he paints it as "hiding in dark corners" (not sure what that's supposed to mean) and says that makes it worse. That doesn't track.
Let me put it this way: if making "vague and safe non-stances" is telling, why would he go after me and not Proph for the Poppin Bottles(tm)? He acknowledges this contradiction (probably to hang a lantern on it), but that doesn't change the fact that it is a contradiction. This leads me to believe he is inventing the reason for his vote. I would have voted for him regardless of whether he used this logic against me or against someone else. I am not confusing my attack on ZDS as an defense of myself, but I think people are taking it that way.
Im mobile only so can’t get into too many details, but I found this very interesting: The two players I was interested in voting after my recap were CC and Vaimes. Then shortly after CC makes a big catch up post that doesn’t even mention vaimes once. I don’t see how vaimes could just be completely omitted by someone (CC) doing a review especially because the person just voting you and like I said obviously baiting you pointed vaimes out as potential scum as well.
So I want to go back and look more carefully at their interactions because I’m wanting to make sure I’m not just tunneling, because you know only scum tunnel right? (Yes that’s a pointed and sarcastic remark aimed at you ZDS)
1) Sure, do your best and give us your conclusions before deadline.
2) You overestimate your own importance, whatever that means.
3) When have I ever said or implied "only scum tunnel", other than in your dreams? The post you quoted literally ends with me admitting I'm tunneling. What is that strawman for?
I voted for ZDS because I couldn't follow his logic. See here:
Quote from ZDS when voting me »
And no the irony of accusing him of doing what he's accusing Proph of doing is not lost on me. But there's my second issue with this post: whereas Proph is experimenting by looking for lurkers too early and is ******* up as a result, CC hides carefully in a dark corner and seems to mostly focus on not ******* up. To bring back the digestive track, Proph had guts, CC has none.
Quote from Me in response »
The real difference here is that Proph put a target on half the players in the game for something that obviously isn't actually telling at all. It was clearly too early in the game to start lurker hunting as several of us hadn't even checked in. My accusation was against unjustified bandwagon votes, which is an accusation against just two players and is for a legitimate reason. As opposed to a meaningless accusation against half the town.
ZDS admits that he's accusing me of the same thing I was accusing Proph of, but he paints it as "hiding in dark corners" (not sure what that's supposed to mean) and says that makes it worse. That doesn't track.
Let me put it this way: if making "vague and safe non-stances" is telling, why would he go after me and not Proph for the Poppin Bottles(tm)? He acknowledges this contradiction (probably to hang a lantern on it), but that doesn't change the fact that it is a contradiction. This leads me to believe he is inventing the reason for his vote. I would have voted for him regardless of whether he used this logic against me or against someone else. I am not confusing my attack on ZDS as an defense of myself, but I think people are taking it that way.
There's no contradiction in explaining why I'm interpreting two superficially similar actions differently .
Also, I don't follow how you can say this is your main gripe with my vote. #102 contained two arguments: That what I called vague non-stances are neither vague nor not-stances (I'll call this "the yes-stance argument"), and that your multi-targetted accusation was more legitimate than Proph's multi-targetted accusation (I'll call this the "legitimate scattershot" argument).
Then there was #128 which focused only on the yes-stance argument, which became the main thing we argued about. The legitimate scattershot argument disappeared until... actually it hasn't resurfaced yet. The argument you just brought up is brand new.
Whereas the legitimate scattershot argument was about how different and better than Prophylaxis you were, your new argument is that I contradicted myself by pointing out the similarity between you and Proph.
Oh, and the line about going after you rather than Proph for "vague and safe non-stances" is also a reimagining of the yes-stance argument, which was about whether your stances were stance or not.
I question the strength and veracity of your scum-read on me when you can't correctly remember why you are scum-reading me in the first place, other than a vague sense of trying to find and exploit flaws in the case I made.
Oh and also, the line about going after you rather than Proph for "vague and safe non-stances" is a reimagining of the yes-stance argument, which was about whether your stances were stance or not.
Yo Terry, can you answer some questions I had from before:
Quote from Prophylaxis »
You're saying that drawing the distinction between Rodemy's roleplaying and Highroller's claim could be interpreted as forcing? You literally said that you thought it "seemed forced". Why are you now saying "it could be interpreted as forcing"? It could be me misunderstanding things but the fact that you're wording this from a third-party POV "it could be interpreted as forcing" doesn't make me feel good
Got it, re the posts you are agreeing with me on. Kind of a nitpicky question but why did you highlight specifically post 130? I reread that post and it was me bringing up Rodemy meta from 6 years ago, calling myself a ZDS stan, and then asking CC some questions. Don't specifically see what exactly in that post is so agreeable unless you liked my questions or something? (Or the "ignoring Rodemy because he's Rodemy", though I suppose that point is moot now that he is Amy)
Like he referred explicitly to Rodemy's claim as gutsy and then quoted a crumb that could easily be passed off as roleplay if he isn't actually Deer/doesn't have Deer as a safeclaim/etc.
(also I read ZDS's #12 as the first serious vote, that may have been incorrect but I vaguely recall him disliking RVS and trying to make real votes as much as possible?)
Finally doing a little bit of reading. Silver, did you think here that Rodemy was hinting at being "Deer", or that the quote ZDS pulled up meant that you thought ZDS believed Rodemy was hinting at being Deer? I don't understand what you were thinking here.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Silver hasn't posted anything to make me think he's Town yet. Doesn't mean he's scum, but he hasn't done anything especially Townie. Question: would you say this is par for you on Day 1, or has this game day been different for you for any reason?
Right now I have Vaimes and Highroller in my circle of Town, and basically no one else.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
@ZDS: I'm important. Trust me, I'm like the most important town person ever! Can you look me in the eyes and say that there is no reason for my interest in CC's lack of Vaimes discussion? Can you tell me that if it were you instead of me that it wouldn't be the slightest bit odd that he just ignored mentioning Vaimes at all? No matter how unimportant you think I am? You should know that I'm pretty full of myself from Voldemort, I'm just leaning into it more this game (and making Trump jokes at the same time).
Also, Strawman? Not really. Sarcasm (self pointed out even), precludes perceived Strawmanning. I was just taking a fun shot at you and your self identified tunneling by saying I was going to do avoid doing the same, which is funny because you are tunneled on me... get it?
Like he referred explicitly to Rodemy's claim as gutsy and then quoted a crumb that could easily be passed off as roleplay if he isn't actually Deer/doesn't have Deer as a safeclaim/etc.
(also I read ZDS's #12 as the first serious vote, that may have been incorrect but I vaguely recall him disliking RVS and trying to make real votes as much as possible?)
Finally doing a little bit of reading. Silver, did you think here that Rodemy was hinting at being "Deer", or that the quote ZDS pulled up meant that you thought ZDS believed Rodemy was hinting at being Deer? I don't understand what you were thinking here.
I believed that ZDS thought he was crumbing Deer; the fact ZDS thought he was crumbing Hunter doesn't really change this because my point was that from ZDS's PoV Highroller claimed openly and Rodemy's claim was buried under layers of roleplay making it easy to walk back, and therefore Rodemy's claim is less "gutsy" (I thought at the time it wasn't a crumb, he was pretty clearly roleplaying as Thor).
I guess he was referring to the flavor of the claim (bird is safe, hunter is not) but even if I agree that hunter is a gutsy thing to crumb Rodemy's crumb is easy to dismiss as roleplaying if he gets called on it.
Silver hasn't posted anything to make me think he's Town yet. Doesn't mean he's scum, but he hasn't done anything especially Townie. Question: would you say this is par for you on Day 1, or has this game day been different for you for any reason?
Right now I have Vaimes and Highroller in my circle of Town, and basically no one else.
I don't think you'll detect much that is AI from me on D1 but I tend to have a higher post count than I do this game (usually because I get into an argument about my meta or activity or apparent active lurking). It's hard for me to do analysis without flips so I tend towards just poking people for weird thoughts which looks like active lurking unless I get pushed, in which case I flail uselessly until people town read me for it
I *do* think I am probably? not within my wolf range? I'm more aggressive as a wolf, almost certainly would have picked a fight with someone over something "objectively wolfy" they did because it's easy content and I struggle most with finding things to say as a wolf whereas I'm not concerned with "appearing to lurk" as a villager and tend towards giving the benefit of the doubt, particularly on Day 1. But I would only expect that to mean anything to people who have played with me a lot or at least read/remember a lot of my games (might just be tom at this point, maybe Vaimes)
It looks like deadline is 1:00 PM tomorrow my time and I don't really have time to comb isos, but if anyone wants to semi-real time I'll be checking the thread off and on the rest of the night
CC probably dies but I don't think my vote is necessary.
@CC: even if you don't have the votes right now, you most likely will unless you swing a bunch of votes elsewhere, and people need time to process your claim if necessary.
Would be willing to lynch the following people today: ZDS, Proph, or Cayvie. (Sorry Cayvie, I know you just switched in, but your predecessor, Jackrito, did nothing but bandwagon all day.)
Someone needs to explain to me exactly why CropCircles is a better lynch candidate than the above, because the CropCircles wagon has been awful.
Would be willing to lynch the following people today: ZDS, Proph, or Cayvie. (Sorry Cayvie, I know you just switched in, but your predecessor, Jackrito, did nothing but bandwagon all day.)
Someone needs to explain to me exactly why CropCircles is a better lynch candidate than the above, because the CropCircles wagon has been awful.
huh, you were my strongest townread on tone (well you or JT), and our reads are, like, literal opposites.
I don't need room to breathe tbh
Nice to meet you, AMA
breathing woat
vampires goat
what do you think distinguishes your town play from your scum play?
I think what is important in a game are your own sense of seizing fake-ness and this is not related to site's behaviour/meta, wolves may have some universal tells isn't it?
Being defensive can go either way, i think.
yeah im getting there
what means vampires goat?
Rodemy was a pillar of towniness for me for his early RP style and sense for mixing it with game content.
i don't understand what you're asking here
no? do you have an example of a universal wolf tell?
i think some behaviors may be near-universally *more likely* to come from a wolf, but that's not the same thing, i don't think.
i do agree that sensing fake-ness is important, and i also think that there are some attributes of fake-ness that more commonly come from scum. but i also think that some metas put more pressure on townies to contribute content early, and in those metas, townies are gonna fake content more frequently, so fake-ness as a wolf tell becomes less reliable. for example.
to answer ZDS's question from early, i think ZDS is more likely to be town that cropcircles
yep, i'm asking you for self-meta! idk if i'd believe you, but i'd use your response to inform my read on you.
GOAT = greatest of all time
WOAT = worst of all time
breathing = worst
vampires = best
I too am currently being distracted by the new set.
I can't get worked up about ZDS. I'm probably going to try and find a different target. It's just hard for me to get invested this early.
help im a bug
Fair; it's just that to me they seem almost *too* on the nose. Don't really feel like pursuing this avenue until one of them has flipped, though.
Unvote
Vote CropCircles
To make it official I guess.
Pretty fine with WMU especially his post #398 which is a pretty nuanced interrogation of CC.
cayvie - you've at least skimmed all the posts in this game, can I get a birds-eye view (heh) of where your head is at/general impressions of all players ITT? Your posting style is refreshing but I'm still kinda iffy on your slot and getting an idea of where you're at will help me parse your alignment better.
you literally got to play all of your rares
I think I owe ZDS and explanation on by obvious bait. Crop Circles was playing too over defensive early on in my opinion, so with little to no meat behind it, I voted CC to see if I could get a reaction like I would expect an over defensive player to make and CC just kind of ignored it, which from either alignment is the right response in my opinion, but looking back at it several pages later (don't quote me on how many pages, I'm just guessing), I personally found it a bit obvious that's what I was doing. I unvoted because the lack of violent outbursts referring to bad stick pokers made me think that it wasn't the best reason to be voting them.
When's the deadline now? Sunday? Shoot, I'm VLA on weekends but we need to start some momentum towards a lynch. I'm a fan of the new replacements (*waves*) content so far. I'm still side eyeing the lack of comments regarding Vaimes from CC, seems like a noteworthy omission. I'm going to explore the Vaimes-CC interactions a bit.
For the rest of you, Help im a bug was in the very first mafia game I ever hosted, which was Lord of the Rings Mafia, 15+ years ago. And promptly got killed N1, in a game where there was *no* Day 1 before the first N1. So yes, died without ever actually playing. Because that was a thing we did back then.
wow hi ^^
there is just one condition for that sir, and i think you know it, and is not related to role play :). I owe you apologises for complaining about your role play back then btw
Can I know in simple words why did you vote for CC?
no, but my experience is not near close to yours, if you started to play 15 years ago, from what i know game experience helps a lot in finding wolves.
I don't replicate my own town meta in my games, so i am always playing a little different, maybe because i am bored to repeat myself. My towntell is content related, i am alot more active scumhunting as villager. Aand i am spontaneous as town, but this is in this game harder to spot because of these long phases and the fact after a while you can't know when the posts are posted (we can't check timing)
I will think at the idea of town faking content tbh, it rubs me in the wrong way.
Amy I'm going to continue to town read off of Rodemy's posts.
I don't much care who gets executed as long as it isn't Highroller/Cayvie/Amy/WMU/Vaimes tbqh, there's less than 36 hours left in the phase.
His initial response to ZDS was extremely overdefensive, and even now I still don't really understand why he suspects ZDS.
He has taken mostly safe stances in his reads post, and overall has been playing fairly reactively. I don't really see any inclination to figure things out.
Is interesting how you start to label now as 'overdefensive' a post you didn't quote - i wish details here ngl.
Also 'safe stances' in my reads post, can you walk me through your thought process please?
And please answer at my question, thanks.
Also saintly poop it's helpimabug! I don't remember if we ever played together but I do remember you from reading really old games. This game is such a blast from the past!
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@Vaimes I definitely agree with letting Grape breathe. He's in my scum team because of team-building and POE, and this being Day 1 with no flips yet there are many ways I could be proven wrong or change my mind. On his own, he's solidly null.
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I don't have an opinion yet on WMU's posts since my last intervention (I'm waiting for her conclusions) but I do like the general vibe of inquisitiveness / figuring things out on her own she gives out.
@WMU FYI, on desktop you can hover over where it says "X hours ago" or "Y days ago" to see the exact time-stamp of a post.
Also FYI, Proph meant to tell you CC isn't scumhunting (etc.), rather than speak about you and say you aren't scumhunting (etc.).
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@JoeTerry
1) What do you think of CC's lack of reactions to (iirc) *any* of the votes on him besides mine?
2) When you say you are going to explore the Vaimes-CC interactions, do you do that from a starting point of scum-reading CC, town-reading CC or null-reading CC?
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Due to the recent townieness or I'm-okay-with-it-ness of various players, I don't have null reads anymore (except Grape who gets downgraded to scum by POE). Here's where I stand (in player list order):
Good:
1. silvercrys3467 (previously null)
2. ZeDorkSlipeur
3. Rodemy r. Ampharos
4. Prophylaxis
5. Jackrito r. Cayvie (previously null)
6. Vaimes
7. Dkingsland967 r. xX_WakeMeUp1337_Xx (previously null)
9. Axelrod
11. Highroller
Bad:
8. Grapefruit21 (technically null)
10. TheRealStinkyJoeTerry
12. CropCircles42
Not all my town reads have the same strength. For example the Axel read is based on imperfect meta (I know his town game, I don't remember his scum game) and Proph could have pocketted me with his stanning. Nevertheless I can say with confidence that I do town-read the entire "Good" block, not merely not-scum-read them. Even silver. If I look past our differing beliefs he's pretty okay.
This means I'm either crazy good at this game or crazy easy to pocket. In order to figure that out, I will only vote CC or JoeTerry.
If either of them is town, I need to kick myself out of any tunnel or pocket I'm in and completely reconsider everything.
I should not play in work breaks -_-
having wrist strain issues, may or may not be around to any significant extent tomorrow
cayvie
amy
highroller
JoeTerry
proph
zds
---------------- would rather no chop than chop above this line
Axelrod
silvercrys3467
Vaimes
xX_WakeMeUp1337_Xx
---------------- happy to vote below this line
CropCircles
Grapefruit
So I want to go back and look more carefully at their interactions because I’m wanting to make sure I’m not just tunneling, because you know only scum tunnel right? (Yes that’s a pointed and sarcastic remark aimed at you ZDS)
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The vote was to apply pressure and see his reaction. Since I'm not gonna get to see his reaction, there's no point in leaving the vote.
I did't show stress because I'm not stressed. I really think people are misinterpreting my vote on ZDS as an OMGUS vote and taking it as defensiveness. I voted for ZDS because I couldn't follow his logic. See here: ZDS admits that he's accusing me of the same thing I was accusing Proph of, but he paints it as "hiding in dark corners" (not sure what that's supposed to mean) and says that makes it worse. That doesn't track.
Let me put it this way: if making "vague and safe non-stances" is telling, why would he go after me and not Proph for the Poppin Bottles(tm)? He acknowledges this contradiction (probably to hang a lantern on it), but that doesn't change the fact that it is a contradiction. This leads me to believe he is inventing the reason for his vote. I would have voted for him regardless of whether he used this logic against me or against someone else. I am not confusing my attack on ZDS as an defense of myself, but I think people are taking it that way.
Just realized I never revoted.
2) You overestimate your own importance, whatever that means.
3) When have I ever said or implied "only scum tunnel", other than in your dreams? The post you quoted literally ends with me admitting I'm tunneling. What is that strawman for?
There's no contradiction in explaining why I'm interpreting two superficially similar actions differently .
Also, I don't follow how you can say this is your main gripe with my vote.
#102 contained two arguments: That what I called vague non-stances are neither vague nor not-stances (I'll call this "the yes-stance argument"), and that your multi-targetted accusation was more legitimate than Proph's multi-targetted accusation (I'll call this the "legitimate scattershot" argument).
Then there was #128 which focused only on the yes-stance argument, which became the main thing we argued about. The legitimate scattershot argument disappeared until... actually it hasn't resurfaced yet. The argument you just brought up is brand new.
Whereas the legitimate scattershot argument was about how different and better than Prophylaxis you were, your new argument is that I contradicted myself by pointing out the similarity between you and Proph.
Oh, and the line about going after you rather than Proph for "vague and safe non-stances" is also a reimagining of the yes-stance argument, which was about whether your stances were stance or not.
I question the strength and veracity of your scum-read on me when you can't correctly remember why you are scum-reading me in the first place, other than a vague sense of trying to find and exploit flaws in the case I made.
(For people in need of context, see Proph's Popping Bottles Theory, CropCircles' first post, and my CC vote which he responds to in #102) 1) Sure, do your best and give us your conclusions before deadline.
CC still wolfy
minimal contribution until after night phase, probs
which with my luck means he's mafia
but we'll burn that bridge when we get to it
Right now I have Vaimes and Highroller in my circle of Town, and basically no one else.
Also, Strawman? Not really. Sarcasm (self pointed out even), precludes perceived Strawmanning. I was just taking a fun shot at you and your self identified tunneling by saying I was going to do avoid doing the same, which is funny because you are tunneled on me... get it?
I guess he was referring to the flavor of the claim (bird is safe, hunter is not) but even if I agree that hunter is a gutsy thing to crumb Rodemy's crumb is easy to dismiss as roleplaying if he gets called on it.
I don't think you'll detect much that is AI from me on D1 but I tend to have a higher post count than I do this game (usually because I get into an argument about my meta or activity or apparent active lurking). It's hard for me to do analysis without flips so I tend towards just poking people for weird thoughts which looks like active lurking unless I get pushed, in which case I flail uselessly until people town read me for it
I *do* think I am probably? not within my wolf range? I'm more aggressive as a wolf, almost certainly would have picked a fight with someone over something "objectively wolfy" they did because it's easy content and I struggle most with finding things to say as a wolf whereas I'm not concerned with "appearing to lurk" as a villager and tend towards giving the benefit of the doubt, particularly on Day 1. But I would only expect that to mean anything to people who have played with me a lot or at least read/remember a lot of my games (might just be tom at this point, maybe Vaimes)
CC probably dies but I don't think my vote is necessary.
@CC: even if you don't have the votes right now, you most likely will unless you swing a bunch of votes elsewhere, and people need time to process your claim if necessary.
Someone needs to explain to me exactly why CropCircles is a better lynch candidate than the above, because the CropCircles wagon has been awful.
huh, you were my strongest townread on tone (well you or JT), and our reads are, like, literal opposites.