All right, I looked at some stuff. I am not note-dumping, but I have identified a potential mafia, and at this point I am still hoping my target is town and I am not shooting myself in the foot by scum-hunting.
Vote: Trisscar who was Zionite.
I'll do up a "case" in a bit.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
@WMU: You're right. There, I said it. I had time to vote you... BUT I wanted to research more before I did, which I didn't have time for. So you can go ahead and vote away for me if that's your case, that I should have voted you without double checking the thread first. Sorry I told you to die before I was 100% ready to vote for you. If that's the case then check this out:
So Amy, please answer at the question regarding the differences you found in the MC game and my play here who makes you vote me.
And i was multitabling in games that now are finished, I can focus here more, post and interact more than once in 12 hours. One od these games was MU team game that Aquilla hosted.
I woke up, btw. At least for now I am reporting for duty.
The NKs are little odd for me, Fulcrum i think is mafia target, she was town read by many, but idk what to do with Wisp dying, if mafia he may be the victim of a redirected shot, but i am sure he is villager. Also i guess Tom Riddle-s may have different AIs.
Iirc Ose said the characters are not connected with AI so who has a bad character is not always scum and who has a good one is not always town.
It makes sense? I have to read that once more though.
I wish to read a little in who pushed ZDS. That push was scum orchestrated for sure.
Guess who called me scum for sure and didn't vote (yes, because I was the main one pushing the ZDS lynch)?
I said i want to look into that push and you suddenly was so upset and didn't even think at anything else that i am accusing you?
I have to dissapoint you, i have to look in all the day 1 for who pushed ZDS (especially if someone pushed, but not voted) and because i didn't read all the day yet I can't point at a certain player.
After this the thread continued with Tom who asked me in post 1959 why that wagon? and my answer still doesn't contain a precise direction. Later i told Amy that i want to check how ZDSs wagon formed and dissipated and my own - I didn't say i want to ignore Konan's wagon but, being so huge, until later in the game is a shot in the dark. To analyse ZDSs wagon from day start until Eod i need to work on PC, as well as for your Iso which i started but didn't finish. So to explain finally I didn't think at you at all.
Maybe you can help me in find how started the push for ZDS and why he became a pretty big wagon at a moment in the day. You trust the possibility for it to be 100% a villagers push?
What is interesting as second reaction is how much and the way Terraine defended you. Idk yet what to do with that defence.
But if you are a villager and ignored the benefit of the doubt in what I said and jumped to tell me "die scum" i am sad to play with such style. I could swear only a guilty conscience reacts like this.
Did terraines response feel more like defense of joe or attack of you?
what i wanted to know was what made you decide on the zds wagon. Like, even knowing he was town it doesnt seem any more notable than the bigger ones:
Wmu peak- #1665
WMU (7) - amy, fonti, konan, last, tom, KJ, lagoon
Konan (3) - ZDS, Terr, WMU
ZDS (3) - Rodemy, JoeTerry, Jack
tom (2) - kpaca, Tubba
Sloth (1) - Fuwa
Rod (1) - Triss
Not voting: Axel, Rhand, Sloth
Lord knows I strive for that orangeandblack5 brand recognition
Anyways, thanks for the details. It's p late so I'ma go to bed, but if there's anything in particular you think I should read let me know and I'll do my best to get to it (open offer)
8 pages in, I have townreads on Rodemy, Kpaca and gooLagoon.
Rodemy: he wouldn’t have backtracked on his gambit as mafia.
Kpaca: he’s asking the right questions. Sadly in his typical Kpaca way where he doesn’t share what the answers do to his reads. Town for sure if terry is mafia.
gooLagoon: gutread.
What about Ampharos? Do you have a take there?
Town or with Fulcrum. Probably town.
How did you feel about Fukcrum, before their flip, obviously?
All right, I looked at some stuff. I am not note-dumping, but I have identified a potential mafia, and at this point I am still hoping my target is town and I am not shooting myself in the foot by scum-hunting.
Vote: Trisscar who was Zionite.
I'll do up a "case" in a bit.
Care to expand on this I don't hate the idea of lynching here but want to know why you think so.
@WMU: You're right. There, I said it. I had time to vote you... BUT I wanted to research more before I did, which I didn't have time for. So you can go ahead and vote away for me if that's your case, that I should have voted you without double checking the thread first. Sorry I told you to die before I was 100% ready to vote for you. If that's the case then check this out:
So Amy, please answer at the question regarding the differences you found in the MC game and my play here who makes you vote me.
And i was multitabling in games that now are finished, I can focus here more, post and interact more than once in 12 hours. One od these games was MU team game that Aquilla hosted.
I woke up, btw. At least for now I am reporting for duty.
The NKs are little odd for me, Fulcrum i think is mafia target, she was town read by many, but idk what to do with Wisp dying, if mafia he may be the victim of a redirected shot, but i am sure he is villager. Also i guess Tom Riddle-s may have different AIs.
Iirc Ose said the characters are not connected with AI so who has a bad character is not always scum and who has a good one is not always town.
It makes sense? I have to read that once more though.
I wish to read a little in who pushed ZDS. That push was scum orchestrated for sure.
Guess who called me scum for sure and didn't vote (yes, because I was the main one pushing the ZDS lynch)?
I said i want to look into that push and you suddenly was so upset and didn't even think at anything else that i am accusing you?
I have to dissapoint you, i have to look in all the day 1 for who pushed ZDS (especially if someone pushed, but not voted) and because i didn't read all the day yet I can't point at a certain player.
After this the thread continued with Tom who asked me in post 1959 why that wagon? and my answer still doesn't contain a precise direction. Later i told Amy that i want to check how ZDSs wagon formed and dissipated and my own - I didn't say i want to ignore Konan's wagon but, being so huge, until later in the game is a shot in the dark. To analyse ZDSs wagon from day start until Eod i need to work on PC, as well as for your Iso which i started but didn't finish. So to explain finally I didn't think at you at all.
Maybe you can help me in find how started the push for ZDS and why he became a pretty big wagon at a moment in the day. You trust the possibility for it to be 100% a villagers push?
What is interesting as second reaction is how much and the way Terraine defended you. Idk yet what to do with that defence.
But if you are a villager and ignored the benefit of the doubt in what I said and jumped to tell me "die scum" i am sad to play with such style. I could swear only a guilty conscience reacts like this.
Did terraines response feel more like defense of joe or attack of you?
what i wanted to know was what made you decide on the zds wagon. Like, even knowing he was town it doesnt seem any more notable than the bigger ones:
Wmu peak- #1665
WMU (7) - amy, fonti, konan, last, tom, KJ, lagoon
Konan (3) - ZDS, Terr, WMU
ZDS (3) - Rodemy, JoeTerry, Jack
tom (2) - kpaca, Tubba
Sloth (1) - Fuwa
Rod (1) - Triss
Not voting: Axel, Rhand, Sloth
is wrong if i think an attack for me can be considered a defence for Terry? But was both, defence by explaining how phone posting works (i know better than he thinks, i am phone posting almost all time) and attack for me.
I went for the wagon of a flipped townie. I know I am villager but no one will believe me if i say so, but ZDS is proven villager so this can be analysed more objective.
I came late here, and i have to sleep, this Sunday was a day with rl surprises, i have to postpone for tomorow the wagons of day 1 analysis.
Looking at my wagon though, Fonti, Wisp, Tom and Lagoon migrated from my wagon on Konan's wagon, Amy voted Tubba and Konan ZDS, while KJ was the only one voting me at Eod..
Without reading the voting reasons is hard to say anything useful here.
Can I know why you voted me for town credit? I think this is the only post i remember from the Eod.
*...bloody national holiday...* Apologies for lack of posting, things happened.
Also not actually certain where the prod is supposed to be for this site, is it discord instead?
All right, I looked at some stuff. I am not note-dumping, but I have identified a potential mafia, and at this point I am still hoping my target is town and I am not shooting myself in the foot by scum-hunting.
Here's the first little bit on Zionite. He only had 5 posts total, one of which was begging off and one of which was his replace out post. So, really just three posts, and what he was doing in all of them was the thing where he looked like he was always playing catch up, and posting fairly disjointed and sometimes very random comments about people:
#121: In this posts is (1) his random vote; (2) a sort of non-opinion about goo lagoon's opening claim/request (basically, I agree with Sloth, why did you bring it up if you didn't want to discuss it, but also, I understand why you did it); (3) a fairly non-controversial opinion that LW's no alignment reveal claim is anti-town.
This post is fairly neutral, as an opening post. Nothing especially interesting, but definitely nothing that a Mafia couldn't write. Sticking to very safe topics.
#323: In this post, Zionite (1) wonders why Shadow wants to know if there are other no-reveal roles. I think that's slightly interesting because it's almost like he's saying it doesn't matter if there are other "no reveal" roles in the game. Which I would think, as Town, he'd be more interested in.
He also (2) thinks Tom is funny, but says he doesn't believe Tom really has a post restriction. This is interesting in as much as I don't think very many people ever seriously thought Tom had a posting restriction, and it makes me wonder how serious Zionite himself was here. Also, he isn't expressing annoyance, or sentiments that the gif posting is anti-Town, and that is interesting given his next post.
Then he (3) gives an opinion on Sloth/Killjoy (Town), and those are fine. They are super shallow reads, but I don't care so much about that this early on.
Then he says he "admires" Rodemy's dark mark gambit attempt, though he doesn't actually says it's making him think Rodemy is Town. That's also slightly interesting in as much as he will cast his only real vote for Rodemy in his next post.
Then he (5) expresses (slight?) suspicion about JT for his "meta" read on LW, which is mostly whatever. It's not at all the kind of comment that is going to generate any useful reactions. He's not questioning JT about the read or really giving an opinion on LW either. It's a very pointless comment.
Finally he (6) says this is difficult and he doesn't have an impression of most players. Which is the kind of comment I always raise my eyebrow at at least slightly.
So, this post has nothing good for me. Some neutral stuff and then some stuff which is slightly scum+
#704: This is the longest one. It's another "catch-up" type post where he's exclaiming about the size of the thread, and picking things that "jump" out to him.
First is further discussion about Shadow's request to "round up" all the non-role reveal people. Now he's definitely shading Shadow, saying that, if this was Shadow's opinion, then it means Shadow isn't trying to scum-hunt (because just going after people who claim no role-reveal is easy? or something); and also, he feels Shadow isn't actually trying to round them up anyway.
Then there's a slight dig at fulcrum, and a bunch of comments on stuff that literally didn't matter at all. I'm sure this is more me, but if I'm making a big catch up type post, I usually trying to keep it relevant, and not spend extra time on side-jokes.
Then there's a big waffle on Sloth (something different about him - but it doesn't necessarily make him scum). Like, again, I"m just not sure the point of comments like this.
He takes time to sort of advise LW to chill out.
He Likes a post of ZDS, without saying specifically what he likes, but ZDS voted Rodemy, and now is also when Zionite starts to get critical of Rodemy, so it appears it may be something of a Barn.
He also agrees with Kpaca (and me?) about Tom's gif posting. Still thinks it's funny, but now (it seems) he's starting to get annoyed. This appears at least somewhat in contrast to his earlier post where he did not seem to have these issues. He's mainly barning kpaca now.
Ends the post with a vote for Rodemy and now it's for his tone (basically Rodemy was getting mad at Sloth and Zionite thinks it looks performative).
And again, there's nothing here that strikes me in a Townish way, and several things that cause my eyebrow to raise, especially in hindsight. There isn't really enough here to say anything definitive, but when Trisscar came in it didn't get better.
That's all I can do for now.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
@Axelrod .....So your case is that, if I'm reading this correctly;
-Claiming something vague with no flip is in some way automatically or obviously or commonly pro-town as opposed to anti or null
-Speaking in gifs is anti-town and everyone should be automatically annoyed at or adverse to it
-The number 4 does not exist
-Zionite should have an impression of most of the players that had posted thus far in a large and many page game
-Going after no-role-reveal claims is hard or at least moderately difficult and is likely townie, and Shadow was actually trying and that should have been obvious
-Side-jokes are not needed in this game if you're town, even if you're writing a big post
-Being unsure about a player, and saying or indicating so, is not townie
-Telling a player to calm down is not townie
-...(I don't know what a barn is here, I assume it's some kind of purposeful vote wagon)...
-Barning is assured because votes or arguments were made against two different people
-In the course of... a little less than 400 posts? Zionite changed their mind about a player
-And despite those massive notes I, Trisscar, posted as I was going through this... thread... after replacing in, nothing has changed
....Yes? I'm not sure which of these you consider scum tells and which are just context for some of them.
Well, that's something of a response. Considering I haven't even gotten to the "you" part. How many times can you misrep and grossly exaggerate what I said in a single post? It's almost impressive.
I understand sarcasm is a think, but I'm pretty sure what I wrote didn't merit it.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Sorry for the delay everyone. Blah, blah, blah holiday.
The Ampharos soup has gotten luke warm. Flavor never fully developed.
Just going to post some notes I made:
Pg44:
Everyone doing a lot of set up gaming in a game where the rules explicitly say don’t bother. Tom especially seems all in on this. Are we sure he isn’t a SK?
Stinky joe first one to call this out (2193). Probably town.
Pg45:
I like that rhand forgot who he was replacing and then tried to read the guy who’s slot he took.
Pg46:
Rodemys rage (2252) feels completely contrived.
What is GooLagoon even doing? Like.....what purpose do any of their posts serve?
Also not a huge fan of WMUs suggestion that we maybe follow zds scum list(2307). Reaaaally not a fan.
Stinkyjoes frustration reads more natural to me than Rodemy’s.
Pg48:
Rhand is town. What kind of scum makes post 2355?
Trisscar seems……………absolutely useless to the town?
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...If that's how you're going to act, that is your prerogative I suppose.
?
Do you think I'm being rude? I'm not intending to be.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
All right, I looked at some stuff. I am not note-dumping, but I have identified a potential mafia, and at this point I am still hoping my target is town and I am not shooting myself in the foot by scum-hunting.
Vote: Trisscar who was Zionite.
I'll do up a "case" in a bit.
I'm confused how scumhunting could possibly be shooting yourself in the foot, in any world?
Lord knows I strive for that orangeandblack5 brand recognition
Anyways, thanks for the details. It's p late so I'ma go to bed, but if there's anything in particular you think I should read let me know and I'll do my best to get to it (open offer)
if im correctly remembering your brand...
Id like your reads on joe and kpaca
Yo, this is t om, yeah? Eating my own words about pfps but hey
Any particular reason why those two players? Will do rn but I'm curious why single them out
a fairly non-controversial opinion that LW's no alignment reveal claim is anti-town.
I don't know why this was common sentiment
If it were a D1 miller claim, it'd be lynch on sight, but I think the odds that a scum whose alignment doesn't flip would call attention to that fact like this to be relatively low, and given what I know of Wisp I feel comfortable saying that's something he'd claim as town. Consider - he's done a false D1 Miller claim before. Why would he expect a "no alignment flip" claim to be better for him than just claiming miller? Miller implies town, not flipping alignment really does not, and to state it with such confidence screams town Wisp to me
Jackrito can probably verify and presumably Fuwa (aa-dono) said the same. No idea how Wisp died but this claim being treated as scummy by consensus is not good.
Especially in a host who has hosted things like Miller ICs
I like that rhand forgot who he was replacing and then tried to read the guy who’s slot he took.
I wouldn't give out a townread for this, seen it before, and as the microreads guy I don't see how 2355 comes from nonScum as opposed to merely nonSK? I have no context on the rest of rhand but I'd like to hear where these microreads are coming from because neither is at all unfakeable
I wouldn't give out a townread for this, seen it before, and as the microreads guy I don't see how 2355 comes from nonScum as opposed to merely nonSK? I have no context on the rest of rhand but I'd like to hear where these microreads are coming from because neither is at all unfakeable
I have no idea what a microread is friendo
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I wouldn't give out a townread for this, seen it before, and as the microreads guy I don't see how 2355 comes from nonScum as opposed to merely nonSK? I have no context on the rest of rhand but I'd like to hear where these microreads are coming from because neither is at all unfakeable
I have no idea what a microread is friendo
Looking at one particular post and using that to figure out someone's alignment
In your case, looking at 2355 and determining this post never comes from scum would be a microread. idk how that fits into the wider context of your feelings on rhand as I haven't read them, but I use that kind of reasoning a lot (which is admittedly exploitable but hey) and I don't really see anything from either of those that paints him as definitively non-scum for making them
I can say he probably isn't the other SK from that tho
also I'm not usually one for giant wallposts mid-day but suffice to say that I'm reading through the joe iso and although I thought his opening posts were just bad and the one or two posts I had read on these last couple pages I didn't like, I think his thoughts and progression on Axel are extremely natural and I can see exactly where he is coming from on just about every point (sans the "if you've played with Axel you would know X" bits)
Gonna finish that but so far I'm liking what I've seen
Looking at one particular post and using that to figure out someone's alignment
In your case, looking at 2355 and determining this post never comes from scum would be a microread. idk how that fits into the wider context of your feelings on rhand as I haven't read them, but I use that kind of reasoning a lot (which is admittedly exploitable but hey) and I don't really see anything from either of those that paints him as definitively non-scum for making them
I can say he probably isn't the other SK from that tho
Well that seems like a weird statement to make.
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Lord knows I strive for that orangeandblack5 brand recognition
Anyways, thanks for the details. It's p late so I'ma go to bed, but if there's anything in particular you think I should read let me know and I'll do my best to get to it (open offer)
if im correctly remembering your brand...
Id like your reads on joe and kpaca
Yo, this is t om, yeah? Eating my own words about pfps but hey
Any particular reason why those two players? Will do rn but I'm curious why single them out
sup
Theyre like...
Your kind of players
I dont think either of them are carrows. Beyond that,
is wrong if i think an attack for me can be considered a defence for Terry? But was both, defence by explaining how phone posting works (i know better than he thinks, i am phone posting almost all time) and attack for me.
Lord knows I strive for that orangeandblack5 brand recognition
Anyways, thanks for the details. It's p late so I'ma go to bed, but if there's anything in particular you think I should read let me know and I'll do my best to get to it (open offer)
if im correctly remembering your brand...
Id like your reads on joe and kpaca
Yo, this is t om, yeah? Eating my own words about pfps but hey
Any particular reason why those two players? Will do rn but I'm curious why single them out
sup
Theyre like...
Your kind of players
I dont think either of them are carrows. Beyond that,
with one dead I'm not actually very concerned about what is presumably an even-night poisoner
That's p weak and I'd rather focus on finding people from the alignments that actually matter, if we poe the sk they get killed anyways so why bother
And i was multitabling in games that now are finished, I can focus here more, post and interact more than once in 12 hours. One od these games was MU team game that Aquilla hosted.
[font=georgia]If I get Joe correctly, if I'm elim'd and flip town Konan is cleared, and if Konan is elim'd and flips scum I'm next in line.
Awfully convenient if Joe and Konan are scum together.
Shade: JoeTerry (ignore if Konan is town)
I'll try to explain it more clearly. My opinion was that you are scum. Since what Konan was posting didn't seem to make much sense, I suspected it was because they were scum coming to assist you. However, if it turns out that you are not scum, Konan could just not be making sense in an NAI way. If you flip scum, I'm gonna take a good hard look at Konan, but it's not just a black and white thing. Now take a step back and think about what just happened. I made those comments regarding Konan and a huge wagon formed on him almost instantly, but that also doesn't make sense. Makes me think I could have been wrong about Konan and you are still scum, hence all the Shade. If I was wrong about Konan, then your scum buddies would be happy to take a counter wagon. Now examining the Konan counter wagon.
Is there some way to ping people?
Anyways Joe I'm interested how your read on Konan has evolved now that ZDS has indeed flipped town. I was kinda hoping you'd answer this in the rest of your ISO but I don't think you've mentioned him again?
For someone whose average post length is about on par with mine (nobody seriously reads walls most of the time anyways) I find it kinda hard to believe kpaca has that much of an issue with people just... posting?
On the other hand if S7G4 showed me anything it's that town can absolutely spend a good chunk of time (and, ironically, posts) complaining about a reasonable number of posts being made
the fact his first two pages are almost exclusively "post less" and "tom needs to stop and we need to force him to do so" is honestly p hypocritical
Posting the same question to wisp almost verbatim twice in a row and making "*writes down in notebook*" its own post are also both really questionable if he really thinks less posts are good for the town - did I miss some sarcasm somewhere kpaca because I don't see how these really fit together
also his play re:wisp is giving me major flashbacks to my own play in MHAFM on 451
particularly relevant as it was at least half designed by osie, but there was a D1 miller claim and I pushed it to the ends of the earth as scum because it's something I'd do anyways and it could be an easy way to get rid of a townie for free
8 pages in, I have townreads on Rodemy, Kpaca and gooLagoon.
Rodemy: he wouldn’t have backtracked on his gambit as mafia.
Kpaca: he’s asking the right questions. Sadly in his typical Kpaca way where he doesn’t share what the answers do to his reads. Town for sure if terry is mafia.
gooLagoon: gutread.
What about Ampharos? Do you have a take there?
Town or with Fulcrum. Probably town.
How did you feel about Fukcrum, before their flip, obviously?
I only started reading beyond page 8 or so after her flip.
I’m going to try to get another big chunk of the game read today.
Now that is a question with no answer because it's so dependent on context
However, when it comes to "X thing is bad for the town" and then doing X, that's generally less likely to come from someone whose mindset is genuinely focused on advancing the town
Most town hypocrisy tends to center on themselves and their own actions rather than being a general "this is bad for the gamestate" thing that they then perpetuate
Now that is a question with no answer because it's so dependent on context
However, when it comes to "X thing is bad for the town" and then doing X, that's generally less likely to come from someone whose mindset is genuinely focused on advancing the town
Most town hypocrisy tends to center on themselves and their own actions rather than being a general "this is bad for the gamestate" thing that they then perpetuate
you’re conflating me not wanting to sift through a lot of useless posts with me thinking more posts is bad for the town.
Those aren’t the same thing.
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is wrong if i think an attack for me can be considered a defence for Terry? But was both, defence by explaining how phone posting works (i know better than he thinks, i am phone posting almost all time) and attack for me.
And i was multitabling in games that now are finished, I can focus here more, post and interact more than once in 12 hours. One od these games was MU team game that Aquilla hosted.
wait
who are you
I don't remember to play with you, maybe one game but not more than one day phase so I don't think you have meta for me.
Likewise, I know almost nothing about you
Now that is a question with no answer because it's so dependent on context
However, when it comes to "X thing is bad for the town" and then doing X, that's generally less likely to come from someone whose mindset is genuinely focused on advancing the town
Most town hypocrisy tends to center on themselves and their own actions rather than being a general "this is bad for the gamestate" thing that they then perpetuate
you’re conflating me not wanting to sift through a lot of useless posts with me thinking more posts is bad for the town.
Those aren’t the same thing.
Huh
Any time I have seen "post less guys" thrown out the justification has ALWAYS been "it's bad for town to have too many posts to drown in"
I've actually used the tactic of drowning the thread out as scum before (granted, I was teamed with another high-posting player, but still) so I can see where that comes from
Don't think I've seen "I want to read less" as the main justification before
And i was multitabling in games that now are finished, I can focus here more, post and interact more than once in 12 hours. One od these games was MU team game that Aquilla hosted.
wait
who are you
I don't remember to play with you, maybe one game but not more than one day phase so I don't think you have meta for me.
Likewise, I know almost nothing about you
Right but like what account are you on MU
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I mean it's not like your "don't lynch Tom cause of N1 reasons" was super subtle during D1.
Also I'm just happy someone else sucks at the quoting besides me. Feels good
Vote: Trisscar who was Zionite.
I'll do up a "case" in a bit.
what i wanted to know was what made you decide on the zds wagon. Like, even knowing he was town it doesnt seem any more notable than the bigger ones:
Wmu peak- #1665
WMU (7) - amy, fonti, konan, last, tom, KJ, lagoon
Konan (3) - ZDS, Terr, WMU
ZDS (3) - Rodemy, JoeTerry, Jack
tom (2) - kpaca, Tubba
Sloth (1) - Fuwa
Rod (1) - Triss
Not voting: Axel, Rhand, Sloth
Eod1- #1869
Konan (11) - ZDS, Terr, WMU, tom, Axel, Last, kpaca, Rod, fulcrum, Fuwa, Lagoon
ZDS (2) - JoeTerry, Konan
Tubba (1) - Amy
Rodemy (1) - Triss
tom (1) - Tubba
WMU (1) - KJ
Not voting: Jack, Rhand, Sloth
Id like your reads on joe and kpaca
How did you feel about Fukcrum, before their flip, obviously?
Care to expand on this I don't hate the idea of lynching here but want to know why you think so.
is wrong if i think an attack for me can be considered a defence for Terry? But was both, defence by explaining how phone posting works (i know better than he thinks, i am phone posting almost all time) and attack for me.
I went for the wagon of a flipped townie. I know I am villager but no one will believe me if i say so, but ZDS is proven villager so this can be analysed more objective.
I came late here, and i have to sleep, this Sunday was a day with rl surprises, i have to postpone for tomorow the wagons of day 1 analysis.
Looking at my wagon though, Fonti, Wisp, Tom and Lagoon migrated from my wagon on Konan's wagon, Amy voted Tubba and Konan ZDS, while KJ was the only one voting me at Eod..
Without reading the voting reasons is hard to say anything useful here.
Can I know why you voted me for town credit? I think this is the only post i remember from the Eod.
Also not actually certain where the prod is supposed to be for this site, is it discord instead?
Kinda curious meself tbh.
#121: In this posts is (1) his random vote; (2) a sort of non-opinion about goo lagoon's opening claim/request (basically, I agree with Sloth, why did you bring it up if you didn't want to discuss it, but also, I understand why you did it); (3) a fairly non-controversial opinion that LW's no alignment reveal claim is anti-town.
This post is fairly neutral, as an opening post. Nothing especially interesting, but definitely nothing that a Mafia couldn't write. Sticking to very safe topics.
#323: In this post, Zionite (1) wonders why Shadow wants to know if there are other no-reveal roles. I think that's slightly interesting because it's almost like he's saying it doesn't matter if there are other "no reveal" roles in the game. Which I would think, as Town, he'd be more interested in.
He also (2) thinks Tom is funny, but says he doesn't believe Tom really has a post restriction. This is interesting in as much as I don't think very many people ever seriously thought Tom had a posting restriction, and it makes me wonder how serious Zionite himself was here. Also, he isn't expressing annoyance, or sentiments that the gif posting is anti-Town, and that is interesting given his next post.
Then he (3) gives an opinion on Sloth/Killjoy (Town), and those are fine. They are super shallow reads, but I don't care so much about that this early on.
Then he says he "admires" Rodemy's dark mark gambit attempt, though he doesn't actually says it's making him think Rodemy is Town. That's also slightly interesting in as much as he will cast his only real vote for Rodemy in his next post.
Then he (5) expresses (slight?) suspicion about JT for his "meta" read on LW, which is mostly whatever. It's not at all the kind of comment that is going to generate any useful reactions. He's not questioning JT about the read or really giving an opinion on LW either. It's a very pointless comment.
Finally he (6) says this is difficult and he doesn't have an impression of most players. Which is the kind of comment I always raise my eyebrow at at least slightly.
So, this post has nothing good for me. Some neutral stuff and then some stuff which is slightly scum+
#704: This is the longest one. It's another "catch-up" type post where he's exclaiming about the size of the thread, and picking things that "jump" out to him.
First is further discussion about Shadow's request to "round up" all the non-role reveal people. Now he's definitely shading Shadow, saying that, if this was Shadow's opinion, then it means Shadow isn't trying to scum-hunt (because just going after people who claim no role-reveal is easy? or something); and also, he feels Shadow isn't actually trying to round them up anyway.
Then there's a slight dig at fulcrum, and a bunch of comments on stuff that literally didn't matter at all. I'm sure this is more me, but if I'm making a big catch up type post, I usually trying to keep it relevant, and not spend extra time on side-jokes.
Then there's a big waffle on Sloth (something different about him - but it doesn't necessarily make him scum). Like, again, I"m just not sure the point of comments like this.
He takes time to sort of advise LW to chill out.
He Likes a post of ZDS, without saying specifically what he likes, but ZDS voted Rodemy, and now is also when Zionite starts to get critical of Rodemy, so it appears it may be something of a Barn.
He also agrees with Kpaca (and me?) about Tom's gif posting. Still thinks it's funny, but now (it seems) he's starting to get annoyed. This appears at least somewhat in contrast to his earlier post where he did not seem to have these issues. He's mainly barning kpaca now.
Ends the post with a vote for Rodemy and now it's for his tone (basically Rodemy was getting mad at Sloth and Zionite thinks it looks performative).
And again, there's nothing here that strikes me in a Townish way, and several things that cause my eyebrow to raise, especially in hindsight. There isn't really enough here to say anything definitive, but when Trisscar came in it didn't get better.
That's all I can do for now.
-Claiming something vague with no flip is in some way automatically or obviously or commonly pro-town as opposed to anti or null
-Speaking in gifs is anti-town and everyone should be automatically annoyed at or adverse to it
-The number 4 does not exist
-Zionite should have an impression of most of the players that had posted thus far in a large and many page game
-Going after no-role-reveal claims is hard or at least moderately difficult and is likely townie, and Shadow was actually trying and that should have been obvious
-Side-jokes are not needed in this game if you're town, even if you're writing a big post
-Being unsure about a player, and saying or indicating so, is not townie
-Telling a player to calm down is not townie
-...(I don't know what a barn is here, I assume it's some kind of purposeful vote wagon)...
-Barning is assured because votes or arguments were made against two different people
-In the course of... a little less than 400 posts? Zionite changed their mind about a player
-And despite those massive notes I, Trisscar, posted as I was going through this... thread... after replacing in, nothing has changed
....Yes? I'm not sure which of these you consider scum tells and which are just context for some of them.
I understand sarcasm is a think, but I'm pretty sure what I wrote didn't merit it.
The Ampharos soup has gotten luke warm. Flavor never fully developed.
Just going to post some notes I made:
Pg44:
Everyone doing a lot of set up gaming in a game where the rules explicitly say don’t bother. Tom especially seems all in on this. Are we sure he isn’t a SK?
Stinky joe first one to call this out (2193). Probably town.
Pg45:
I like that rhand forgot who he was replacing and then tried to read the guy who’s slot he took.
Pg46:
Rodemys rage (2252) feels completely contrived.
What is GooLagoon even doing? Like.....what purpose do any of their posts serve?
Also not a huge fan of WMUs suggestion that we maybe follow zds scum list(2307). Reaaaally not a fan.
Stinkyjoes frustration reads more natural to me than Rodemy’s.
Pg48:
Rhand is town. What kind of scum makes post 2355?
Trisscar seems……………absolutely useless to the town?
Do you think I'm being rude? I'm not intending to be.
I'm confused how scumhunting could possibly be shooting yourself in the foot, in any world?
Yo, this is t om, yeah? Eating my own words about pfps but hey
Any particular reason why those two players? Will do rn but I'm curious why single them out
Could have fooled me.
I don't know why this was common sentiment
If it were a D1 miller claim, it'd be lynch on sight, but I think the odds that a scum whose alignment doesn't flip would call attention to that fact like this to be relatively low, and given what I know of Wisp I feel comfortable saying that's something he'd claim as town. Consider - he's done a false D1 Miller claim before. Why would he expect a "no alignment flip" claim to be better for him than just claiming miller? Miller implies town, not flipping alignment really does not, and to state it with such confidence screams town Wisp to me
Jackrito can probably verify and presumably Fuwa (aa-dono) said the same. No idea how Wisp died but this claim being treated as scummy by consensus is not good.
Especially in a host who has hosted things like Miller ICs
I wouldn't give out a townread for this, seen it before, and as the microreads guy I don't see how 2355 comes from nonScum as opposed to merely nonSK? I have no context on the rest of rhand but I'd like to hear where these microreads are coming from because neither is at all unfakeable
I have no idea what a microread is friendo
Looking at one particular post and using that to figure out someone's alignment
In your case, looking at 2355 and determining this post never comes from scum would be a microread. idk how that fits into the wider context of your feelings on rhand as I haven't read them, but I use that kind of reasoning a lot (which is admittedly exploitable but hey) and I don't really see anything from either of those that paints him as definitively non-scum for making them
I can say he probably isn't the other SK from that tho
Gonna finish that but so far I'm liking what I've seen
Well that seems like a weird statement to make.
Theyre like...
Your kind of players
I dont think either of them are carrows. Beyond that,
Why
with one dead I'm not actually very concerned about what is presumably an even-night poisoner
That's p weak and I'd rather focus on finding people from the alignments that actually matter, if we poe the sk they get killed anyways so why bother
have you specced some other things I've been in or where does this confidence they're "my kind of players" come from
wait
who are you
Is there some way to ping people?
Anyways Joe I'm interested how your read on Konan has evolved now that ZDS has indeed flipped town. I was kinda hoping you'd answer this in the rest of your ISO but I don't think you've mentioned him again?
Who the heck is Konan? Another name for someone or did they sub in?
Im also inspector spacetime
Its more a player comparison though. Theyre like... idk mtgs versions of johncarter and flush or something
I have not played in any MU mashes
Is there any way to increase the posts per page of an iso because 15 is incredibly low
Also i believe dead players are in another spoiler
On the other hand if S7G4 showed me anything it's that town can absolutely spend a good chunk of time (and, ironically, posts) complaining about a reasonable number of posts being made
the fact his first two pages are almost exclusively "post less" and "tom needs to stop and we need to force him to do so" is honestly p hypocritical
Posting the same question to wisp almost verbatim twice in a row and making "*writes down in notebook*" its own post are also both really questionable if he really thinks less posts are good for the town - did I miss some sarcasm somewhere kpaca because I don't see how these really fit together
also his play re:wisp is giving me major flashbacks to my own play in MHAFM on 451
https://forum.mafia451.com/t/mha-mafia-game-thread-game-over/3835?u=orangeandblack5
particularly relevant as it was at least half designed by osie, but there was a D1 miller claim and I pushed it to the ends of the earth as scum because it's something I'd do anyways and it could be an easy way to get rid of a townie for free
EXACT same energy here
oh
that's dumb
I only started reading beyond page 8 or so after her flip.
I’m going to try to get another big chunk of the game read today.
Now that is a question with no answer because it's so dependent on context
However, when it comes to "X thing is bad for the town" and then doing X, that's generally less likely to come from someone whose mindset is genuinely focused on advancing the town
Most town hypocrisy tends to center on themselves and their own actions rather than being a general "this is bad for the gamestate" thing that they then perpetuate
you’re conflating me not wanting to sift through a lot of useless posts with me thinking more posts is bad for the town.
Those aren’t the same thing.
Can you reformulate?
Likewise, I know almost nothing about you
Seems like a good way to not take the blame for mislynches.
Wait so you think all his reads are bad and he scum read townies? How come do you know that?
Huh
Any time I have seen "post less guys" thrown out the justification has ALWAYS been "it's bad for town to have too many posts to drown in"
I've actually used the tactic of drowning the thread out as scum before (granted, I was teamed with another high-posting player, but still) so I can see where that comes from
Don't think I've seen "I want to read less" as the main justification before
Right but like what account are you on MU