@Terraine
What do you think Sloth is doing regarding you? Specifically, starting way back at #7 and what he and I discussed involving number #10? I would quote them but I’m on mobile and I keep forgetting how to do it. (I’m even older than Sloth, I think)
.....everyone stop calling Sloth old. It's depressing as **** for me
I am trying to get a handle on Sloth. Like I keep saying he feels weird to me but I fooled him pretty damn good in prison....so that unease all could be him trying to get a handle on just what my town and scum tells are. 7 feels like joking...my reply back was just me being a dick to him cause I enjoy being a dick to him. 95% of our friendship is based on the aforementioned fact that we're both ********s.
I would like to think he as town would realize that my scum game is good enough that I wouldn't be so brazen as to out right antagonize him right out the gate.
Also, I need more in-depth content from you, buddy - how soon can you give it?
I’m *****e for content honestly. I’m a wallflower and it gets me into trouble, but it’s my modus operandi.
Also, I’ve been running ragged at work but I fulfilled my deadline with minutes to spare so I’ll be around more over the next few days.
Tubba what's your read on Sloth suggestion of NL to conf judge? I don't remember what post it was and don't feel like ferreting through the game to find it. If this wasn't you Sloth feel free to correct me
I’m not a fan of the fact he just keeps downplaying as dismissing me as not doing anything. I’ve definitely been MIA but I don’t think the whole claim talk qualifies as not trying to figure out the game…and it’s not like he somehow missed me in that cause he asks me directly to clarify my thoughts on something i said during it. After I post whether it be a question for a player like in #69 (hah) or answering and playing catch up in #242 he pops up to undermine it by saying “oh she’s not doing anything to solve the game”
[...]
His drive on me feels forced and reminds me of the Wonk game on DLP where there was a lot of activity from him like there is here…but it alway kept coming back to trying to force a lynch on me.
So in reverse order:
-This is the DLP Game you're bringing up.
The main differences between that game and this one is (1) I had no actual reasons to "scumread" you that game, it all came down to me using personality quirks and just defaulting back to that whenever I was asked to provide something more substantial (also sidebar, man I sucked that game how out of practice was I???), any votes I was able to get on you were just on drive and charisma; which leads me to (2) despite getting some people willing to vote you, no one really was agreeing with me or seeing what I was seeing.
In this game, #1 especially is obvious not true because I have given reasons, so why would this remind you of that game? #2 is less obvious, but also not true here, because others are finding scummy behavior on you using their own analysis independent of me.
-As for the first paragraph: Mechanics talk (i.e. "the whole claim talk") is the easiest way to appear to provide content without actually solving the game. Mechanics do not solve the game. I was also pressing you for layered thought on that question, because in mechanics talk, town is more likely to consider things in a deeper level while scum only want to appear to.
I'm not going to PBPA all your posts to show why I don't think you've been solving the game (there's a shift lately, but given the pressure, there should be regardless of alignment) that's a lot of unasked-for work.
You say I put you at L1 to make me look scummy. You mention it twice in the same post
But that didn't happen. Tom posted a VC in #205. Fonti was vote 1. There's no other votes that I can see for anyone let alone Az until #252. I was vote 2.
Is your argument here that scum!Azrael intentionally lied about about something easily and publicly verifiable in-thread as a way to get you?
If youre saying that scum!Azrael (or town!Azrael) accidentally did so, why is this a point against him?
Not to mention retaliation/self defensiveness, for having put you at the bottom of my list a couple posts ago. Funny how that immediately resulted in a vote against me.
It's not retaliation when I was the one prodding you before you even posted your list. In 242# I point out your cop out answer early in the game. in #246 I point out to Sloth I can't pressure someone who isn't present ie you. #247 I decide **** it ask Az maybe you'll get an answer. All of this before you plop down #250 where I'm at the bottom of your read. I was already suspecting you.
refute the points I'm making instead of slinging out mafia buzzwords.
Honestly, this is actually a good point.
It doesn't actually make Ter look better though, more like it makes Azrael look worse. Thoughts for later.
Anyway, Ter - you're in the eye of the tunnel, and no matter your alignment, that sucks. Trust me, I'm deeply familiar with it lol.
But it's really not that big a deal, just forget about defending yourself constantly (which is what you've been doing) - if you're town, focus on solving the game. Maybe it'll turn the tide.
Btw, who would you say is Azrael's partner?
What makes "odd level of certainty in the original sloth vote and then when pressed on it, not only does he give a cop out reason but just drops it and refuses to address it again" scummy > weird as hell?
Tubba what's your read on Sloth suggestion of NL to conf judge? I don't remember what post it was and don't feel like ferreting through the game to find it. If this wasn't you Sloth feel free to correct me
I don’t like it as I think no lynching is bad for town, I’ll admit my mechanics knowledge isn’t the greatest. I don’t think outing the judge (if town) is worth giving an extra kill to scum (if scum). I feel pretty good about Sloth but flattery gets you everywhere with me, still not going to hold it against him. Merely file it away for things to agonize about while trying to sleep.
I am trying to get a handle on Sloth. Like I keep saying he feels weird to me but I fooled him pretty damn good in prison....so that unease all could be him trying to get a handle on just what my town and scum tells are. 7 feels like joking...my reply back was just me being a dick to him cause I enjoy being a dick to him. 95% of our friendship is based on the aforementioned fact that we're both ********s.
I would like to think he as town would realize that my scum game is good enough that I wouldn't be so brazen as to out right antagonize him right out the gate.
One good place to start would be to dismiss the idea* that anything I'm doing has anything to do at all with Prison.
Also, I need more in-depth content from you, buddy - how soon can you give it?
I’m *****e for content honestly. I’m a wallflower and it gets me into trouble, but it’s my modus operandi.
Also, I’ve been running ragged at work but I fulfilled my deadline with minutes to spare so I’ll be around more over the next few days.
Tubba what's your read on Sloth suggestion of NL to conf judge? I don't remember what post it was and don't feel like ferreting through the game to find it. If this wasn't you Sloth feel free to correct me
(1) I had no actual reasons to "scumread" you that game, it all came down to me using personality quirks and just defaulting back to that whenever I was asked to provide something more substantial
Truth be told…I don’t get what your case on me in this one is. Yes….my play the first few days was weak. I’ll admit that. I felt like crap and I was phoning it in and unfocused…and I'll take my lumps for it. It feels forced to me to call that scummy with such a certainty as you and others have latched onto.
-As for the first paragraph: Mechanics talk (i.e. "the whole claim talk") is the easiest way to appear to provide content without actually solving the game. Mechanics do not solve the game.
Maybe mechanics talk doesn’t help you read people but it does help me. It gives me an insight into what others are looking for and what is driving them esp in a role heavy game such as this. Town is going to be more info driven in my eyes and scum more action driven because the scum team by nature does have more info than we do.
I was also pressing you for layered thought on that question, because in mechanics talk, town is more likely to consider things in a deeper level while scum only want to appear to.
In pressing people for thoughts on mechanics I can see what’s driving them slip through more than just slapping a vote on them to see what they do. It gets people talking.
Is your argument here that scum!Azrael intentionally lied about about something easily and publicly verifiable in-thread as a way to get you?
If youre saying that scum!Azrael (or town!Azrael) accidentally did so, why is this a point against him?
Intentional or not isn’t the important part of this. The important part is when I point out that this is bull***** he doesn’t bother correcting it. He ignores that and just keeps slinging out accusations of deflection. It keeps the momentum up on the wagon to refuse to recognize reasonable doubt and mistakes cause he's just dismissing them as unimportant.
It shows he cares more about being “right” and lynching me than he does on making sure other town players have the right info…which as I’ve said…Town needs info. Esp early on in the game info is much MUCH more vital for us than it is scum.
Btw, who would you say is Azrael's partner?
What makes "odd level of certainty in the original sloth vote and then when pressed on it, not only does he give a cop out reason but just drops it and refuses to address it again" scummy > weird as hell?
I am NOT GOOD at partner finding. I would need to ISO him and focus on interactions with others which from memory isn’t a deep well given a majority of his activity in the past few days has been us yelling at each other. As mentioned in my wall I’m not feeling super stoked on Tubba.
And on that note....Imma go hit virtual animals with weapons to dismember and skin them. 'Ta for a bit
(1) I had no actual reasons to "scumread" you that game, it all came down to me using personality quirks and just defaulting back to that whenever I was asked to provide something more substantial
Truth be told…I don’t get what your case on me in this one is. Yes….my play the first few days was weak. I’ll admit that. I felt like crap and I was phoning it in and unfocused…and I'll take my lumps for it. It feels forced to me to call that scummy with such a certainty as you and others have latched onto.
-As for the first paragraph: Mechanics talk (i.e. "the whole claim talk") is the easiest way to appear to provide content without actually solving the game. Mechanics do not solve the game.
Maybe mechanics talk doesn’t help you read people but it does help me. It gives me an insight into what others are looking for and what is driving them esp in a role heavy game such as this. Town is going to be more info driven in my eyes and scum more action driven because the scum team by nature does have more info than we do.
I was also pressing you for layered thought on that question, because in mechanics talk, town is more likely to consider things in a deeper level while scum only want to appear to.
In pressing people for thoughts on mechanics I can see what’s driving them slip through more than just slapping a vote on them to see what they do. It gets people talking.
Is your argument here that scum!Azrael intentionally lied about about something easily and publicly verifiable in-thread as a way to get you?
If youre saying that scum!Azrael (or town!Azrael) accidentally did so, why is this a point against him?
Intentional or not isn’t the important part of this. The important part is when I point out that this is bull***** he doesn’t bother correcting it. He ignores that and just keeps slinging out accusations of deflection. It keeps the momentum up on the wagon to refuse to recognize reasonable doubt and mistakes cause he's just dismissing them as unimportant.
It shows he cares more about being “right” and lynching me than he does on making sure other town players have the right info…which as I’ve said…Town needs info. Esp early on in the game info is much MUCH more vital for us than it is scum.
Btw, who would you say is Azrael's partner?
What makes "odd level of certainty in the original sloth vote and then when pressed on it, not only does he give a cop out reason but just drops it and refuses to address it again" scummy > weird as hell?
I am NOT GOOD at partner finding. I would need to ISO him and focus on interactions with others which from memory isn’t a deep well given a majority of his activity in the past few days has been us yelling at each other. As mentioned in my wall I’m not feeling super stoked on Tubba.
And on that note....Imma go hit virtual animals with weapons to dismember and skin them. 'Ta for a bit
Also, I need more in-depth content from you, buddy - how soon can you give it?
I’m *****e for content honestly. I’m a wallflower and it gets me into trouble, but it’s my modus operandi.
Also, I’ve been running ragged at work but I fulfilled my deadline with minutes to spare so I’ll be around more over the next few days.
Fulcrum: That is not her name.
She's almost definitely town based off of #240.
I meant everything I said on #235 about how she's playing this game, but the thing about that is that that's all well within her range as town, so it's ultimately largely NAI with a smidgen of possible scum manipulation rather than just manipulation. Therefore what I was doing in #235 is taking what I had noticed and over-amplify my feelings of it as a reaction test to see if it gave something away.
I was assuming font would reply with some combination of amusement, smackdown, 1v1ing and trying to figure out why I'm doing what I'm doing; where the "percentage" amount of each reaction would give me insight to her intent and therefore alignment.
#240 was probably the reaction I least expected, where she got annoyed and needed to leave to cool off. I don't believe fonti as scum would react like that, even if she was annoyed she'd try to pretend not to be and address it. Thus, she's town
If I'm wrong on that and she turns out to be scum here, well that means I have to change how I approach font as a player in general, but that doesn't help until a future game.
(@Fonti, so like I said earlier, I was trying to get a reaction, not this reaction.)
Think that's everyone right? Let me know.
Hmm, we'll need to talk about this after the game, I think.
If you're referring to your "What two roles" question, I don't think it's a useful question to ask/answer.
I agree with this. There’s too many variables to consider and I don’t understand the full ramifications of the roles. Why do you think this will help? Or are you just curious?
I think it gives info about how people think which is helpful when I don't know people well and I like seeing how the roles/mechanics are involved from different viewpoints. Fonti entered the game Day 1 saying she was going to be nightkilled because she's a mechanics boss which makes any excellent tiny hunter and the importance of mechanics and roles in a game this small has been highlighted by more than just her so of course I want to get multiple perspectives and a better understanding.
Though, your answer is helpful in its own way given that you earlier mentioned how difficult it was for you to generate content at this stage and, when given an opportunity, rather than answer you deflect questions onto me. Which fair play, but your reason for not answering is that your worried you don't understand the roles fully. I definitely don't, which is why I want to understand the mechanics better and have a discussion. Again, you seem hesitant to answer when no one is going to take your word at face value and say 100% the role dismissed has to be 1 of the 2 you mention. I mean, obviously don't trust Azrael, but his point that generating content that people can read you from is an important part of being town.
So font, was sloth's thing an innocent townie mistake or intentional town credit?
No idea. I'm not weighing it in my read on him.
The thing about the dropped role is it's super situational. Let's say the scum team has survivalist, judge and bod. They probably drop judge there, and keep the survivalist alive so they can coast to an easy victory later. There are some roles I think they almost never drop, like hunter, because unless scum get wiped really fast, there will probably be a bounced kill in the game.
Here's the thing--I make a lot of mistakes. A lot of people assume that I'm scum because my mistakes are easy town tells. However, I don't (usually) make the same mistake multiple times, so I tend to assume the same about others. I played witch hunt or tiny hunt or whatever where there was a choice option for the witches like 2 years ago and I feel like once you've had the set-up where a role is discarded by witches/they have a choice, you're not super likely to forget that element of the game. So, I guess my more specific question is has Sloth ever played this type of set-up before?
The Gravedigger and Undertaker should very carefully weigh whether it's worth coming forward on D2 and D3 respectively. It should be if they feel like the town is on the wrong track kind of thing. In a larger game, a scum!gravedigger could do significant damage, but with the role being split and the number of possible worlds being constrained by the game size, I don't think it's always necessary to force claims there. On D2, deciding whether the previous lynch was town or mafia and then asking the gravedigger to claim only if that decision is wrong could be a good idea. It'll be a case by case decision (if the witch kill was blocked, probably assume the dead person was town, etc).
When someone does claim, I recommend rereading the game with their role in mind, and judging their decisions through that lens. Pay extra attention to their logic for claiming.
I think they should claim only to confirm that we hit scum regardless of day. Also, D3 rather than D1 is interesting b/c worst case scenario we could be down to 3 people by the beginning of D3 so their claim would be pretty late and their chance of being alive pretty low by then. In a game this small, it seems like getting accurate info early is more important
I think it gives info about how people think which is helpful when I don't know people well and I like seeing how the roles/mechanics are involved from different viewpoints. Fonti entered the game Day 1 saying she was going to be nightkilled because she's a mechanics boss which makes any excellent tiny hunter and the importance of mechanics and roles in a game this small has been highlighted by more than just her so of course I want to get multiple perspectives and a better understanding.
Though, your answer is helpful in its own way given that you earlier mentioned how difficult it was for you to generate content at this stage and, when given an opportunity, rather than answer you deflect questions onto me. Which fair play, but your reason for not answering is that your worried you don't understand the roles fully. I definitely don't, which is why I want to understand the mechanics better and have a discussion. Again, you seem hesitant to answer when no one is going to take your word at face value and say 100% the role dismissed has to be 1 of the 2 you mention. I mean, obviously don't trust Azrael, but his point that generating content that people can read you from is an important part of being town.
Ok, I can see your point. From my perspective, I’d want an information role and a killing role. The info role will be more useful as the game goes and the POE gets tighter and controlling extra kills his always good. OdB and DoB present different problems to utilize, I’d think OdB would be more preferable for scum because extra kill. Survivor is good, but wouldn’t be my choice on a scum team. You want to be making the deaths, not dodging them. It’s too defensive. Judge, while a killing role, is too situational to be reliable, so I’d pass that one. So, I guess ideally, Hunter and Undertaker/Gravedigger? Of course it all depends on what they started with and what the open one was.
Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
Fulcrum looks a bit worse too, but I'm going with Ter/Tubba for the team, with Azrael and Fulcrum as potential backup choices who I need to reconsider if one of Ter/Tubba flips town.
Hm. Not feeling Font, but I agree on the logic of "if they turn out to be town look at these."
Too bad this is a flipless game lol.
Did you ever explain your Azrael vote in more detail than "posturing"? If you didn't you probably should.
Start with what you were getting at on #182 (which I answered in #206, not sure you saw).
Also, what led you to unvote here? He was not at L-1 at all.
One thing's for certain, there is a 3/8ths chance that scum have survivalist, meaning that they will never use their guess the role to get a double kill thing and that they know not to use that ability
I'm not great at math, but just to confirm: Given this and later posts you make, did you forget this is a 7-player game with only 2 scum?
Yeah, I'm about to bring up some old *****. What up
Also, I mean the following in the most non-aggressive way possible:
Sloth, you're an accountant, right?
Fonti, how bad is Sloth at mechanics?
ppppppfffffttthhahaha**** no.
The simplest word to describe what I am is director. What's your point?
Also can you answer the question in the quote? It's probably-not-but-potentially worthwhile.
Also, this is directed toward everyone, what card do you think is not in our deck (or what are the 2 most likely roles not to be chosen)? And why?
I honestly don't see what you could hope to gain from this answer.
I also don't see how any answer is going to be helpful or reliable: There are 8 roles. 5 of them are randomized. 3 remain and of the 3, the scum can discard 1.
We have no idea what any of those 3 are thus this question is...busywork, really.
When in danger, deflect. It's the most classic scum tactic in the book, and you're demonstrating it beautifully. Carry on.
Isn't Ter like pretty experienced? Would she really resort to the 'most classic scum tactic in the book' under a little bit of pressure? I mean, the only reason she would conceivably do that is because she thought her rep is so good that people would automatically dismiss her doing that as not scum indicative because she wouldn't be that rookie, but no one besides me has brought up this possibility and I don't even know her. Which to me means that would be an uber risky tactic for no reason and that pretty much everyone has jumped on this wagon is at least a little alarming. It's actually especially funny since she had an out/had time to develop a response and chose that. That said, could be some hard core busing by Azrael
Anyway, vote Azrael
ftr, depends on what you mean by experienced. Ter's been playing about as long as me, but while in that time I've played 20ish games, she's played no more than 7.
She's clever and resourceful, but also has some difficulties divorcing emotion from the game the way some experienced players do. This is in no way meant to disparage Ter, who is my closest friend and my dearest darling: I'm pretty sure she wouldn't think of herself as experienced either.
Why wouldn't you just ask this, anyway? Damnit Umami stop being scummy.
As for the rest of this post: Yes. Not the only reason. Is it? What was the out again?
Is your argument here that scum!Azrael intentionally lied about about something easily and publicly verifiable in-thread as a way to get you?
If youre saying that scum!Azrael (or town!Azrael) accidentally did so, why is this a point against him?
Intentional or not isn’t the important part of this. The important part is when I point out that this is bull***** he doesn’t bother correcting it. He ignores that and just keeps slinging out accusations of deflection. It keeps the momentum up on the wagon to refuse to recognize reasonable doubt and mistakes cause he's just dismissing them as unimportant.
It shows he cares more about being “right” and lynching me than he does on making sure other town players have the right info…which as I’ve said…Town needs info. Esp early on in the game info is much MUCH more vital for us than it is scum.
I mean this would have more weight if it was the only think he found odd about your, or if he continued harping on the l-1 narrative after it was clear to be wrong.
Neither of which are currently happening.
So font, was sloth's thing an innocent townie mistake or intentional town credit?
No idea. I'm not weighing it in my read on him.
The thing about the dropped role is it's super situational. Let's say the scum team has survivalist, judge and bod. They probably drop judge there, and keep the survivalist alive so they can coast to an easy victory later. There are some roles I think they almost never drop, like hunter, because unless scum get wiped really fast, there will probably be a bounced kill in the game.
Here's the thing--I make a lot of mistakes. A lot of people assume that I'm scum because my mistakes are easy town tells. However, I don't (usually) make the same mistake multiple times, so I tend to assume the same about others. I played witch hunt or tiny hunt or whatever where there was a choice option for the witches like 2 years ago and I feel like once you've had the set-up where a role is discarded by witches/they have a choice, you're not super likely to forget that element of the game. So, I guess my more specific question is has Sloth ever played this type of set-up before?
The answer is no.
I still have no idea where you're going with this. Please explain.
Fulcrum looks a bit worse too, but I'm going with Ter/Tubba for the team, with Azrael and Fulcrum as potential backup choices who I need to reconsider if one of Ter/Tubba flips town.
Hm. Not feeling Font, but I agree on the logic of "if they turn out to be town look at these."
Too bad this is a flipless game lol.
I don't see myself lynching anyone other than TerRaine today. I might be able to be convinced on Tubba.
Talk to me about Tubba - I thought you had him as Null. I think there were other players between him and Ter as well for you?
Azrael had been between Ter and Tubba but I'm thinking I might have seen a towntell? It's not a good one, but I'm not sure that it's something that Azrael would have thought to replicate?
Umami is so off-base from the rest of the game now that I'm a little worried I need to reconsider there... Is she new enough to be this much in her own world?
Umami doing her own thing isn't necessarily bad for her.
In fact, it might actually be a towntell, though not 100% confident on that statement for obvious reasons.
So font, was sloth's thing an innocent townie mistake or intentional town credit?
No idea. I'm not weighing it in my read on him.
The thing about the dropped role is it's super situational. Let's say the scum team has survivalist, judge and bod. They probably drop judge there, and keep the survivalist alive so they can coast to an easy victory later. There are some roles I think they almost never drop, like hunter, because unless scum get wiped really fast, there will probably be a bounced kill in the game.
Here's the thing--I make a lot of mistakes. A lot of people assume that I'm scum because my mistakes are easy town tells. However, I don't (usually) make the same mistake multiple times, so I tend to assume the same about others. I played witch hunt or tiny hunt or whatever where there was a choice option for the witches like 2 years ago and I feel like once you've had the set-up where a role is discarded by witches/they have a choice, you're not super likely to forget that element of the game. So, I guess my more specific question is has Sloth ever played this type of set-up before?
The answer is no.
I still have no idea where you're going with this. Please explain.
You're right, I should ask you directly. Have you ever played with this type of set up before where the witches have a you pick 2 (or whatever number)? I feel like it's the type of thing that, once you've seen, you don't forget, but that if you've never seen it before you might not even notice if you skip or skim the set-up
Umami is so off-base from the rest of the game now that I'm a little worried I need to reconsider there... Is she new enough to be this much in her own world?
tbf, I don't think it's necessarily a newness thing, I think it's more of a not engaged in the current thread so want to focus on something that interests me thing--thinking about different scum strategies interests me
What is that "innocent townie mistake" you alluded to though? Are you implying I missed something? Cause I can say that from before the start of the game I knew there were 2 scum, that all 7 players have one ability, and that there was an extra ability that scum chose to discard.
What is that "innocent townie mistake" you alluded to though? Are you implying I missed something? Cause I can say that from before the start of the game I knew there were 2 scum, that all 7 players have one ability, and that there was an extra ability that scum chose to discard.
I said 3/8 chance of scum getting survivalist, you said "what, did you forget there are 2 scum and 7 players overall" suggesting that you didn't realize there was a discarded role
ftr, depends on what you mean by experienced. Ter's been playing about as long as me, but while in that time I've played 20ish games, she's played no more than 7.
She's clever and resourceful, but also has some difficulties divorcing emotion from the game the way some experienced players do. This is in no way meant to disparage Ter, who is my closest friend and my dearest darling: I'm pretty sure she wouldn't think of herself as experienced either.
Why wouldn't you just ask this, anyway? Damnit Umami stop being scummy.
As for the rest of this post: Yes. Not the only reason. Is it? What was the out again?
Can you talk about your Azrael read?
Bolded.
I'm also interested in seeing how the info above affects your WiFoMy Ter assessment.
I mean this would have more weight if it was the only think he found odd about your, or if he continued harping on the l-1 narrative after it was clear to be wrong.
Neither of which are currently happening.
The other big part of his case was casting me voting him as a defensive reaction only done in order to save myself from lynch and no other reason....Which I showed not to be the case and you even commented on being a point.
It's not about him harping...its about me saying "that's not what happened" and him ignoring me outright to continue harping on "look how defensive she is!!!" instead of saying "ok mistake made I wasn't at L1. So here's other reasons her play is scummy."
By refusing to acknowledge his mistake and just continuing to go write anything I say off as "defensive" instead of showing WHY its defensive it just sounds like "Ignore the man behind the curtain!"
Umami is so off-base from the rest of the game now that I'm a little worried I need to reconsider there... Is she new enough to be this much in her own world?
Why is this a bad thing exactly?
Off in her own world means a different perspective. Everyone has blind spots. Different town play styles means more chances we spot each others.
The rest of the boldest part, it’s a bad joke.
Seriously though, I feel like it’s more important to you for me to scum read Ter than it is for you to convince me and it’s weirding me out a bit. Thoughts?
The rest of the boldest part, it’s a bad joke.
Seriously though, I feel like it’s more important to you for me to scum read Ter than it is for you to convince me and it’s weirding me out a bit. Thoughts?
Half-right: It's true that I've zero interest in convincing you to scumread Ter (or anyone), so by that logic pretty much anything is more important to me than that.
However, what I'm looking for in you has very little to do with Ter herself. In a few posts we'll be closer to 400 than to 300, and by this point I expect more solid stances from you. You're not a pusher, in my experience - by which I mean you don't try to lead or force people to follow you.
You do have formed/solid opinions, though; stances that I can summarize. By this point, I expect to know where you stand on most of the players - and I don't.
So hop to it
I mean this would have more weight if it was the only think he found odd about your, or if he continued harping on the l-1 narrative after it was clear to be wrong.
Neither of which are currently happening.
The other big part of his case was casting me voting him as a defensive reaction only done in order to save myself from lynch and no other reason....Which I showed not to be the case and you even commented on being a point.
41, 254, 260, 274 are all post that talk about valid points against you beyond either of those two arguments. While 254 and 260 do touch on one or both of them, there's more to it beyond that.
276 does come off as ~odd, and I want him to come back and expand: The implication of the post seems to be that other players had problematic posts that he addressed, but that you either did not have those posts or that he chose not to address them for <reasons>.
Which, yes, it's ~odd for his stated scummiest read. However, he also sus'd you several times before that point so it's not coming out of nowhere either.
.....everyone stop calling Sloth old. It's depressing as **** for me
I am trying to get a handle on Sloth. Like I keep saying he feels weird to me but I fooled him pretty damn good in prison....so that unease all could be him trying to get a handle on just what my town and scum tells are. 7 feels like joking...my reply back was just me being a dick to him cause I enjoy being a dick to him. 95% of our friendship is based on the aforementioned fact that we're both ********s.
I would like to think he as town would realize that my scum game is good enough that I wouldn't be so brazen as to out right antagonize him right out the gate.
I’m *****e for content honestly. I’m a wallflower and it gets me into trouble, but it’s my modus operandi.
Also, I’ve been running ragged at work but I fulfilled my deadline with minutes to spare so I’ll be around more over the next few days.
-This is the DLP Game you're bringing up.
The main differences between that game and this one is (1) I had no actual reasons to "scumread" you that game, it all came down to me using personality quirks and just defaulting back to that whenever I was asked to provide something more substantial (also sidebar, man I sucked that game how out of practice was I???), any votes I was able to get on you were just on drive and charisma; which leads me to (2) despite getting some people willing to vote you, no one really was agreeing with me or seeing what I was seeing.
In this game, #1 especially is obvious not true because I have given reasons, so why would this remind you of that game? #2 is less obvious, but also not true here, because others are finding scummy behavior on you using their own analysis independent of me.
-As for the first paragraph: Mechanics talk (i.e. "the whole claim talk") is the easiest way to appear to provide content without actually solving the game. Mechanics do not solve the game. I was also pressing you for layered thought on that question, because in mechanics talk, town is more likely to consider things in a deeper level while scum only want to appear to.
I'm not going to PBPA all your posts to show why I don't think you've been solving the game (there's a shift lately, but given the pressure, there should be regardless of alignment) that's a lot of unasked-for work.
Is your argument here that scum!Azrael intentionally lied about about something easily and publicly verifiable in-thread as a way to get you?
If youre saying that scum!Azrael (or town!Azrael) accidentally did so, why is this a point against him?
Honestly, this is actually a good point.
It doesn't actually make Ter look better though, more like it makes Azrael look worse. Thoughts for later.
Anyway, Ter - you're in the eye of the tunnel, and no matter your alignment, that sucks. Trust me, I'm deeply familiar with it lol.
But it's really not that big a deal, just forget about defending yourself constantly (which is what you've been doing) - if you're town, focus on solving the game. Maybe it'll turn the tide.
Btw, who would you say is Azrael's partner?
What makes "odd level of certainty in the original sloth vote and then when pressed on it, not only does he give a cop out reason but just drops it and refuses to address it again" scummy > weird as hell?
I don’t like it as I think no lynching is bad for town, I’ll admit my mechanics knowledge isn’t the greatest. I don’t think outing the judge (if town) is worth giving an extra kill to scum (if scum). I feel pretty good about Sloth but flattery gets you everywhere with me, still not going to hold it against him. Merely file it away for things to agonize about while trying to sleep.
This is your response to #7: You are correct, I do not believe you were antagonizing me right out the gate.
I wouldn't scumread you over that, are you crazy?
*Or the "narrative you're trying to push" if scum
Truth be told…I don’t get what your case on me in this one is. Yes….my play the first few days was weak. I’ll admit that. I felt like crap and I was phoning it in and unfocused…and I'll take my lumps for it. It feels forced to me to call that scummy with such a certainty as you and others have latched onto.
Maybe mechanics talk doesn’t help you read people but it does help me. It gives me an insight into what others are looking for and what is driving them esp in a role heavy game such as this. Town is going to be more info driven in my eyes and scum more action driven because the scum team by nature does have more info than we do.
You say it yourself
In pressing people for thoughts on mechanics I can see what’s driving them slip through more than just slapping a vote on them to see what they do. It gets people talking.
Intentional or not isn’t the important part of this. The important part is when I point out that this is bull***** he doesn’t bother correcting it. He ignores that and just keeps slinging out accusations of deflection. It keeps the momentum up on the wagon to refuse to recognize reasonable doubt and mistakes cause he's just dismissing them as unimportant.
It shows he cares more about being “right” and lynching me than he does on making sure other town players have the right info…which as I’ve said…Town needs info. Esp early on in the game info is much MUCH more vital for us than it is scum.
I am NOT GOOD at partner finding. I would need to ISO him and focus on interactions with others which from memory isn’t a deep well given a majority of his activity in the past few days has been us yelling at each other. As mentioned in my wall I’m not feeling super stoked on Tubba.
And on that note....Imma go hit virtual animals with weapons to dismember and skin them. 'Ta for a bit
This is making me feel some kind of way
Answer my question! please
Hmm, we'll need to talk about this after the game, I think.
Nope?
If you're referring to your "What two roles" question, I don't think it's a useful question to ask/answer.
I agree with this. There’s too many variables to consider and I don’t understand the full ramifications of the roles. Why do you think this will help? Or are you just curious?
Though, your answer is helpful in its own way given that you earlier mentioned how difficult it was for you to generate content at this stage and, when given an opportunity, rather than answer you deflect questions onto me. Which fair play, but your reason for not answering is that your worried you don't understand the roles fully. I definitely don't, which is why I want to understand the mechanics better and have a discussion. Again, you seem hesitant to answer when no one is going to take your word at face value and say 100% the role dismissed has to be 1 of the 2 you mention. I mean, obviously don't trust Azrael, but his point that generating content that people can read you from is an important part of being town.
Here's the thing--I make a lot of mistakes. A lot of people assume that I'm scum because my mistakes are easy town tells. However, I don't (usually) make the same mistake multiple times, so I tend to assume the same about others. I played witch hunt or tiny hunt or whatever where there was a choice option for the witches like 2 years ago and I feel like once you've had the set-up where a role is discarded by witches/they have a choice, you're not super likely to forget that element of the game. So, I guess my more specific question is has Sloth ever played this type of set-up before?
I think they should claim only to confirm that we hit scum regardless of day. Also, D3 rather than D1 is interesting b/c worst case scenario we could be down to 3 people by the beginning of D3 so their claim would be pretty late and their chance of being alive pretty low by then. In a game this small, it seems like getting accurate info early is more important
Ok, I can see your point. From my perspective, I’d want an information role and a killing role. The info role will be more useful as the game goes and the POE gets tighter and controlling extra kills his always good. OdB and DoB present different problems to utilize, I’d think OdB would be more preferable for scum because extra kill. Survivor is good, but wouldn’t be my choice on a scum team. You want to be making the deaths, not dodging them. It’s too defensive. Judge, while a killing role, is too situational to be reliable, so I’d pass that one. So, I guess ideally, Hunter and Undertaker/Gravedigger? Of course it all depends on what they started with and what the open one was.
Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
Terraine (2): sloth, azrael
Azrael (2): terr, umami
Not voting (3): tubba, fulcrum, osi
Deadline is noon PST may 30th (24 hours from this post)
Too bad this is a flipless game lol.
Talk to me about Tubba - I thought you had him as Null. I think there were other players between him and Ter as well for you?
Start with what you were getting at on #182 (which I answered in #206, not sure you saw).
Also, what led you to unvote here? He was not at L-1 at all.
Are you ready to talk about your Ter read now?
Also, do you have any thoughts on #208? Your focus was on #235, which ~eh. Get back to me.
The simplest word to describe what I am is director. What's your point?
Also can you answer the question in the quote? It's probably-not-but-potentially worthwhile.
I honestly don't see what you could hope to gain from this answer.
I also don't see how any answer is going to be helpful or reliable: There are 8 roles. 5 of them are randomized. 3 remain and of the 3, the scum can discard 1.
We have no idea what any of those 3 are thus this question is...busywork, really.
ftr, depends on what you mean by experienced. Ter's been playing about as long as me, but while in that time I've played 20ish games, she's played no more than 7.
She's clever and resourceful, but also has some difficulties divorcing emotion from the game the way some experienced players do. This is in no way meant to disparage Ter, who is my closest friend and my dearest darling: I'm pretty sure she wouldn't think of herself as experienced either.
Why wouldn't you just ask this, anyway? Damnit Umami stop being scummy.
As for the rest of this post: Yes. Not the only reason. Is it? What was the out again?
Can you talk about your Azrael read?
I'm never innocent.
I also don't know what you're talking about here. What "innocent townie mistake"?
I mean this would have more weight if it was the only think he found odd about your, or if he continued harping on the l-1 narrative after it was clear to be wrong.
Neither of which are currently happening.
Go on...?
******* what? Lol, explain yourself.
Am I in trouble, mom?
I still have no idea where you're going with this. Please explain.
Azrael had been between Ter and Tubba but I'm thinking I might have seen a towntell? It's not a good one, but I'm not sure that it's something that Azrael would have thought to replicate?
In fact, it might actually be a towntell, though not 100% confident on that statement for obvious reasons.
You're right, I should ask you directly. Have you ever played with this type of set up before where the witches have a you pick 2 (or whatever number)? I feel like it's the type of thing that, once you've seen, you don't forget, but that if you've never seen it before you might not even notice if you skip or skim the set-up
tbf, I don't think it's necessarily a newness thing, I think it's more of a not engaged in the current thread so want to focus on something that interests me thing--thinking about different scum strategies interests me
What is that "innocent townie mistake" you alluded to though? Are you implying I missed something? Cause I can say that from before the start of the game I knew there were 2 scum, that all 7 players have one ability, and that there was an extra ability that scum chose to discard.
I said 3/8 chance of scum getting survivalist, you said "what, did you forget there are 2 scum and 7 players overall" suggesting that you didn't realize there was a discarded role
Please reply to #327 and #330.
I'm also interested in seeing how the info above affects your WiFoMy Ter assessment.
The other big part of his case was casting me voting him as a defensive reaction only done in order to save myself from lynch and no other reason....Which I showed not to be the case and you even commented on being a point.
It's not about him harping...its about me saying "that's not what happened" and him ignoring me outright to continue harping on "look how defensive she is!!!" instead of saying "ok mistake made I wasn't at L1. So here's other reasons her play is scummy."
By refusing to acknowledge his mistake and just continuing to go write anything I say off as "defensive" instead of showing WHY its defensive it just sounds like "Ignore the man behind the curtain!"
Why is this a bad thing exactly?
Off in her own world means a different perspective. Everyone has blind spots. Different town play styles means more chances we spot each others.
This is all a very polite way of saying I'm a sore loser with a bad temper who takes things personally
The rest of the boldest part, it’s a bad joke.
Seriously though, I feel like it’s more important to you for me to scum read Ter than it is for you to convince me and it’s weirding me out a bit. Thoughts?
However, what I'm looking for in you has very little to do with Ter herself. In a few posts we'll be closer to 400 than to 300, and by this point I expect more solid stances from you. You're not a pusher, in my experience - by which I mean you don't try to lead or force people to follow you.
You do have formed/solid opinions, though; stances that I can summarize. By this point, I expect to know where you stand on most of the players - and I don't.
So hop to it
276 does come off as ~odd, and I want him to come back and expand: The implication of the post seems to be that other players had problematic posts that he addressed, but that you either did not have those posts or that he chose not to address them for <reasons>.
Which, yes, it's ~odd for his stated scummiest read. However, he also sus'd you several times before that point so it's not coming out of nowhere either.