@Fulcrum
you say that Proph hasnt been solving, but like I don't really see that?
and how is that the conclusion, like ya sure when it doubt look at the people who arent trying to solve, but like in terms of solving, Proph doesnt really come to mind? even some of the top posts have done less in terms of solving I believe
also what about DK or Asta? why did neither of them come to mind?
1. Silvercrys3467 -Has been pushing false dichotomy arguments for days -Role can easily be scum +Feels like trying to solve today +Was a strong Town read until midgame
2. Lastwhisper +Feels genuine +Role is a little weird on scum +Seems frequently lost on roles and mechanics -Slight doubts on reactions
3. shadowlancerxJackritoProphylaxis -Easily scum role/lots of room for falseclaim -Does not feel like solving +I kinda liked that he put effort into researching my meta early
4. Vaimes +Rhand was neutral hunting +Game didn't explode
5. KittyCupCake -Easily scum role +Is awesome
6. vezokpiraka +confirmed town
8. dkingsland967 +Twoish confirmations on BG -feels slimy -Role seems empty
11. Killjoy +feels town +fairly confirmed
16. fulcrum +role makes no sense on scum +Axel is dead +feels genuine -how Rhand approached
17. Asta -Role inconsistencies -some things feel too advanced, like being coached +feels fine otherwise, and pretty impressive if newbscum +role is slightly unusual for scum
That's mostly for me
also speaking of doing real stuff, idk how people have the audacity to say Proph isnt doing stuff, when we have posts like this? like what is this?
@Fulcrum
you say that Proph hasnt been solving, but like I don't really see that?
and how is that the conclusion, like ya sure when it doubt look at the people who arent trying to solve, but like in terms of solving, Proph doesnt really come to mind? even some of the top posts have done less in terms of solving I believe
also what about DK or Asta? why did neither of them come to mind?
He isn't solving me.
I've been playing with Proph for almost 7 years. I'm used to him working with me, bouncing ideas off of me, having decent, if paranoid, assessments of me. Here he's just, like, looking at my role stuff? I feel like when I try to talk to him there's nothing there.
Silver/Proph/Asta
Has an info and a manipulative, but only 1 ability I can RB? two claim issues. Maybe
DK/Proph/Asta
Lol gambit, especially with Asta now willing to bus if dk won't flip BG. Everyone here could easily be lying about/omitting parts of their claim. Very low posting team would explain a lot
Silver/DK/Asta
Also lol gambit, with silver doubling down on it. This team could have absolutely nothing I could RB? Idk, probably not this?
Silver/Proph/DK
DK would have known Asta was getting a message regarding a protect here, role balance works, but dk trying to convince silver to trust his results feels unaligned. Probably not this either?
For Dk/Asta/x... it had to be something like: dk gets run up, falseclaims BG (unless he has a real protect from my busdrive?), either way gets lucky the consensus is to protect Asta, but Asta then mistakenly claims being notified
If dk is scum without Asta, there needs to be some ability that was used on Asta (an actual BG or a fake message)
Wall incoming, but I think there’s enough info now to provide an early reads post.
Silver:
He’s having fun in RVS and his reaction to Shadow in #14 feels pure. I would be very surprised if that comes from scum!Silver because I don’t expect him to think about a post like that as scum and craft an answer when it’s totally not necessary.
His mixed feelings from Nacho pushing him are normal.
His vote on me seems to come out of nowhere, but when he explains it, he’s voting me for what town always mislynch me for when I get mislynched: my posts feel weird.
Verdict: town
Lastwhisper:
He starts his own sidegame instead of playing the game at first, and then calls Nacho wolfy for his reaction to KCC, which I think was a very pure reaction. Nacho gets more flak for that though; too much to all come from scum.
He doesn’t like tom’s gimmick, but his reaction to it is better than Axelrod’s: he merely says he’s not a fan of the gimmick and that tom doesn’t give him town vibes. Ergo, he’s not calling the gimmick itself scummy, which is good.
His response to Vaimes where he uses the word “probably” talking about his tells not being AI bugs me bigtime. It looks like he jokingly wants to get rid of Vaimes’ push.
His reads in #163 don’t look like real reads. He doesn’t give a real read on both Vaimes and Silver and waffles on Nacho. The only thing there is a townread on KJ.
A lot of scum!pings there, but his later posts are suddenly way better. I like how he questions Silver’s Rhand vote and how he starts real worldbuilding and pressuring Vezok.
Verdict: lean town (if he’s scum he won’t keep up his new posting)
Shadow:
Not enough posts for a read. Null.
I can read him very well though if he actually posts.
Vaimes:
He is in jokey spam-mode, which is a good sign. He knows his own meta though, and I’ve seen him make a whole town believe he’s town before.
There are a few things that trouble me: He voted Nacho, who was low hanging fruit at that point. He claims the existence of a neutral. And the things he’s accusing LW of are dependent of the alignment of the ones LW is interacting with.
I do like that he goes from Nacho to Axel now.
Verdict: Not sure. I’m going to classify him as null for now and will see where he goes with his Axel vote.
@Vaimes: talk more about Axel please. And what is your LW read right now?
KCC:
Claiming a scummy role from the get-go is the townie thing to do. Scum doesn’t like locking themselves into a claim from the start. I know a few players that do things like that, but KCC doesn’t strike me as one of those, unless she is consciously changing up her game. Which is totally unnecessary because she hasn’t played that many games recently that we all know her meta.
I like her Nacho reaction and have a total mindmeld with her question to Vaimes in #200
Verdict: town
Vezok:
Again a Nacho voter. The fact that she says he agrees with Vaimes on Nacho probably means that she isn’t scum with Vaimes. Saying later on that Nacho is scum because her posts don’t make sense points to a scummy mindset: not making sense is not a scumtell but something scum looks for when trying to get town lynched (I know that all too well). Also not a fan of the randomness of people she gives reads on.
Her vote on Mind is weak and using omgus as extra confidence is again a scummy mindset: omgus in itself is never a tell but often used by scum during fake hunting.
There’s a possible link with Fulcrum because of the way she defends her.
Verdict: scum
@Vezok: you said you gave a (non)read on LW because of the recent scumgame with him. I was also scum there. Why not give a read on me there?
Dkings:
No posts. Null.
Mindreaver:
I like his self-meta because it’s true. And if he does this as scum after a hiatus, that would be extremely dumb because now he has to keep up his energy level.
I mindmeld with him about Nacho and Vezok.
Verdict: town
Axelrod:
The fact that he chose a semi-serious RVS target is bothersome. What is worse is that he uses KCC’s later posts to strengthen that vote. And then he calls tom’s gimmick in itself scummy.
Verdict: scum
KillJoy:
He’s very easy to read as town, and this is town!him.
I wonder if he can mimick his towngame as scum. I haven’t seen him as scum in a loooong time. But I doubt he can. His towngame is extremely pure.
Verdict: town
Tom:
He is throwing out reads all the time, and with the songs he has to really think about them. All his reads are pretty much fleshed out. I know tom is capable of a lot as scum, but this would be too amazing to be true. I’m convinced this is town!tom.
He reminds me of that game where used animal behavior to talk about all of us, which also gave deep insight.
Verdict: town
Slothful:
Some of his questions feel like stating the obvious, but others seem like he’s trying to figure out the game. Not enough there for a read.
Verdict: null
Gemma:
Not a lot of explanation in her posts, but I liked all the votes she cast when she cast them (apart from the brief tom vote).
When she does post longer sentences, I tend to mindmeld with her (Vezok, the tom gimmick).
Verdict: town
Nacho:
I think the reaction she gave to KCC could come from either alignment, with a bigger chance of coming from town. Scum demanding claims on page 1 is pretty darn dumb, and Nacho isn’t dumb.
I like where her vote is right now.
I don’t like the mindreaver vote and the continued KCC pressure.
Verdict: lean town
Fulcrum:
Her first post feels like she distances herself from town a bit with how she talks about tom. Probably NAI though because she hasn’t been active on the site for a while.
I like how she wants Nacho to stop about KCC, which is indeed a needless distraction in thread by now.
Not much more there yet. I’ll need more to form a read.
Verdict: null
Asta:
Nothing really there. It bothers me that she did read the game when she posted #293 and didn’t comment on anything apart from answering a question directed at her.
Can be newb scum that doesn’t really know how to play scum.
Verdict: lean scum
Town
Silver
KCC
Mindreaver
KJ
Tom
Gemma
Lean town
LW
Nacho
Null
Shadow
Vaimes
Dkings
Slothful
fulcrum
Lean scum
Asta
Scum
Vezok
Axelrod
There almost has to be scum in the non-posters. Unless I’m wrong about one of my townclears, but this looks like a good base to start off with.
moving this here so I dont have to search for it
DK/Shadow dont count for anything since they didnt post much of anything at this point
I am trying to build teams in my head
and I just can't build one with the current PoE
like even if Proph is a wolf, where are his partners? maybe Asta? but DK's push feels so not partnery?
like wolves don't win this game if this is the PoE, and I feel like there isnt enough vote movement
the problem is I dont want to dismiss Proph's reads, I think his Asta read is more correct than his DK read
its highly likely Asta is a hit here
Dk/Proph are not really making this game any easier in terms of reading them
I am going to sleep, but I am starting to hate the Proph lynch, but like at the same time I really would hate myself if I pushed us away from a hit
like sure solving KCC/Proph is probably better for us given mechanical information, which I am starting to fall towards KCC being a better lynch
I have another tinfoil wolf read, but I am still trying to find the last wolf in that world, before I go about saying anything
DK crumbed his role, so like I dont see how to build a scum!DV world, with that ability if its real
and Asta makes it so hard to believe its not real with the whole mod confirm claim, so like idk what to do there
if DK is a wolf, and not the BG then Asta is outted
Quote from Asta »
I want to believe DK is definitely a bodyguard
A Fairy showed up and told me Queen Titania is going to protect me and I shouldn't fear death.
a wolf DK world only works here if DK/Asta are both wolves, or DK is something other than a BG, maybe a wolf jailor? but like in that world he comepletely made up the other aspects of his claim that make it trash for wolves in his own head? k
DK is confirmed to have visited Asta as well
in wolf Asta world, he chose to vote Rhand over Keldeo in this situation?
Quote from Asta »
Gonna go with Rhand honestly because he's throwing weird suspicion at Killjoy and Last. Been kind of a weird vibe feeling and Keldeo's post feels good to me right now.
this does not feel like a bus in the slightest
the problem here is Proph, but even in a wolf!world, I cant make a team with him, so I just think we are completely wrong
the problem here is Proph, but even in a wolf!world, I cant make a team with him, so I just think we are completely wrong
correction, I can't make a world with him being a wolf with our current PoE, so I think we are wrong in several places even if this is a hit
but like its never both KCC/Proph
my brain hurts, good night
it also doesnt help that DK's reaction to Proph is like so level-0
like Proph voting DK here isnt as strange as people are making out to be, when his PoE is literally DK/Asta/Fulcrum
I think I am settling on exactly this team, where Asta specifically bussed his own partner over Keldeo, maybe due to TMI?
or something along the lines of KCC/[redacted]/X
but like if KCC isn't dying here, then I am always going to either DK/Asta, never Proph
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Silver: I think the team is exactly dkings/Asta/fulcrum. I am focusing on dkings and Asta Today because I think they can be lynched.
Last:
Day 1 - shadow targets vezok with a blue orb.
Night 1 - I target Axel with a yellow orb. Gave my orb to Nacho instead.
Night 2 - I target dkings with a green orb. I was roleblocked.
Night 3 - I target KJ with an orange orb.
Night 4 - I target Silver with a blue orb.
I have the opportunity to still give an orb during the Day; haven't used that yet.
Sigh I just lost a post due to clicking one of my bookmarks when I was about to hit post reply :/
I'll just say this - for the people who are claiming I'm not solving, look at the posts I've made Yesterday WRT Keldeo. I was trying my best to get there on him but I failed to do so at the last minute.
Last: I can't build a team without Asta or dkings because I think both of their behavior has been awful and I think they really exposed themselves by lazily voting for me. I want to lynch either dkings or Asta Today.
KCC: You're wrong on me. Vote dkings or Asta instead.
fulcrum: You claim to say that when you try and talk to me there's nothing there, but you've only asked me two questions in your past 45 posts and I believe I've answered them both. I think you're mafia because of PoE and because of Keldeo's flip; not to mention that you and dkings went from pushing Rhand to pushing Axelrod late in Day 2.
Like, there could be the slimmest chance you're town because Vaimes has confirmed your ability as "non-mafia" but I feel pretty comfortable that all my townreads are out of their wolf ranges (or are confirmed town), so
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Gonna respond as best I can since last asked for my thoughts on fulcrum/kcc
KCC’s wagon is still reading weirdly full of town to me. It should be noted that if I were on a team with KCC I would have had NO reason to announce my double votes. Honestly if I were scum I probably would have tried to hide them for a full cycle or only deploy them when we were in better need of a lynch or in a lylo and try to say they didn’t activate until spring came back around since I wasn’t gonna have em for the first spring anyways.
Tom and Vezok are confirmed town, I know I’m town. I want DK to be town since I got a mod confirm that he’s protecting me from death. Killjoy and Last have been solvy and seem towny, even if pretty continually at odds? I actually wonder if scum have kinda tried to avoid shooting folks on KCC’s wagon to avoid confirming too many of them? Wild, baseless speculation there. Scum shots have been weird.
There’s the whole neighbor chat but it seems weird to have 2 masons confirmed as town and 3 others have town confirm. I just don’t entirely trust it.
Her efforts since then with roleblocking seem… fine? I dunno how much she’s helped or hurt town with what she’s done, really. Hard to read that, but maybe there’s value there.
I honestly don’t feel great about her and feel like she could be an easy late game mislynch for lylo even if she is town, so I dunno. Seems less than great as far as situations go.
Fulcrum was part of some effort to confirm Killjoy as maybe town and then handed off her stuff to Vaimes who proceeded to confirm Fulcrum had a rolecop role? I dunno, mechanics are a big blind spot since I clearly don’t know how to evaluate power.
I scanned through fulcrum’s posts but didn’t see any obvious plays alongside KCC, but they don’t really seem to mention each other much at all.
On the announcing of DK’s bodyguard.Please feel free to speculate why I would have done it, but I’ll go ahead and outline why I did do it as town, and spec why it would be a bad idea to do it as a wolf. Hoping this swings votes in a better favor.
As town: I did it because DKings was getting scumread. I’ve personally gotten townyish vibes but I’m not great at general defense or anything, didn’t have time to dig up particular examples. Honestly could be wrong on that entirely, but I did have the information that he was confirmed as protecting me. So I threw that in there to make sure people had the information to consider. I would hope I’m right and that DK is a town bodyguard. I have no serious reason to consider him scum right now. If someone has a massive read with receipts, I’ll listen but. In that absence I’m going with towny. Maybe DK really is a scum bodyguard, but I had no reason to think scum would get a bodyguard that would actually protect town.
In a world where DK and I are both scum: This seems like an extreme no-go. If either of us get taken down and read as scum, there are instant flags because I confirmed a message that isn’t apparently normal and we’ve tended to vote similarly (only split was on King day 2 and right now, since I swapped from Proph to not voting for the moment. Hoping to not vote DK right now honestly and eager to set up a different wagon, but I’m sticking with the vaimes/last/killjoy vote control in an effort to preserve this slot for town power). Obvious associations, and then my team loses two players, even if one of them is a bodyguard for some reason.
In a world where I’m scum and DK is town: I’ll be honest, this could work. If I confirm him as bodyguard and then he gets shot or lynched and flips town, it looks good for me. If I get lynched by town and flip scum, DK becomes a really easy mislynch. So if y’all are gonna lynch one of us, lynch me if only so DK is hard to set up as a mislynch because y’all are gonna have confirmation from a town that he was genuine bodyguard. Obviously would prefer that not happen, but. It is what it is.
Anyways sorry for the wall post all of a sudden. Hope it helps.
KCC: You're wrong on me. Vote dkings or Asta instead.
If you aren't scum, I don't understand anything in this game.
I don't think silver/Asta/dk works. I don't believe fulcrum is scum. It's slightly odd if scumYou orbs Axel N1 knowing I was bouncing your target, but fulcrum playing that game with a NK is nonsense.
Scum3 would need to be, like, Vaimes? But I'm really not seeing that, definitely never voting him over you
I feel like a lot of the hate on Asta are for reasons that wouldn't exist if he was in the scum chat.
Like, what?
I can see chat encouraging him to play up the newb card. I can see chat suggesting he keep the double vote secret until needed for a potential late game surprise. I can see chat helping come up with a decentish falseclaim of the double vote turning on later, when that was questioned. And I can see Asta making small slips while posting in keeping that story straight
@vezok
As long as killjoy votes with me, I don't care about his thoughts anymore, since I've come to terms with the fact that he is blissfully ignorant to the hardships of this game
Never understood the mind set of,"I will let everyone else solve the game for me", and it's not that he isn't trying to solve, it's just the lack of vote to justify thoughts and pressure, and sometimes just outright shade.
One more question: Does DV try to include symmetry in roles(i.e. scum roles having similar mechanics to town roles)?
Did you ever explain this reaction to my claim?
I vaguely remember this being brought up when you first partially claimed and you saying that you just hadn't full claimed yet. Though I don't remember revisiting it since you've fullclaimed
Man, I know it was a couple years ago, but think back to the last two days of Iji 2. Proph had me dead to rights and came around on you. He was RELENTLESS in his efforts to get me lynched. He had post after post citing evidence, contradictions, interactions, etc, and he got heated when no one listened. That is how town!Proph approaches a game; he's meticulous, takes detailed notes, and is never disengaged.
This game he has been anything but that. He replaced in late D1, so ok, being out of sorts D1 and even D2 is fine. But D3/D4 has not been town Proph.
Hell, he even just admitted he's basically OMGUS'ing his entire list of scum reads.
- If you don't take into account his claim and his mechanics, his behavior is awful. Rhand was chummy with him and he shifted from having no idea who the scum were/having trouble solving to laser focusing on Keldeo throughout Yesterday and me Today.
Something happened between D3 and D4 that revved up my analytical abilities. I'll give you one guess as to what it was.
though no lie, this post makes no sense? "Purposely" hid it? like are you new or not? you can't play the newb card and then pretend like you are playing 4D chess with the mafia
This also could be a slip?
"Purposely hiding" the second vote... that supposedly wasn't even available that first spring? That wouldn't be hiding, it's just not claiming. Like, how do you make an effort to hide something you don't have yet
This is like point 3 or 4 towards Asta falseclaimg something
Yeah I also thought that language looked out of place. I'm still betting that, if anyone stole Gemma's role, it was Asta.
@Fulcrum
you say that Proph hasnt been solving, but like I don't really see that?
and how is that the conclusion, like ya sure when it doubt look at the people who arent trying to solve, but like in terms of solving, Proph doesnt really come to mind? even some of the top posts have done less in terms of solving I believe
also what about DK or Asta? why did neither of them come to mind?
He isn't solving me.
I've been playing with Proph for almost 7 years. I'm used to him working with me, bouncing ideas off of me, having decent, if paranoid, assessments of me. Here he's just, like, looking at my role stuff? I feel like when I try to talk to him there's nothing there.
Tbh I'm pretty sure Last has no clue how Proph plays Mafia.
Silver/Proph/Asta
Has an info and a manipulative, but only 1 ability I can RB? two claim issues. Maybe
DK/Proph/Asta
Lol gambit, especially with Asta now willing to bus if dk won't flip BG. Everyone here could easily be lying about/omitting parts of their claim. Very low posting team would explain a lot
Silver/DK/Asta
Also lol gambit, with silver doubling down on it. This team could have absolutely nothing I could RB? Idk, probably not this?
Silver/Proph/DK
DK would have known Asta was getting a message regarding a protect here, role balance works, but dk trying to convince silver to trust his results feels unaligned. Probably not this either?
For Dk/Asta/x... it had to be something like: dk gets run up, falseclaims BG (unless he has a real protect from my busdrive?), either way gets lucky the consensus is to protect Asta, but Asta then mistakenly claims being notified
If dk is scum without Asta, there needs to be some ability that was used on Asta (an actual BG or a fake message)
A bit self-serving, but... if KCC is town, this might actually be a productive avenue of thought? What scum team would actually have abilities she can hit?
Silver: I think the team is exactly dkings/Asta/fulcrum. I am focusing on dkings and Asta Today because I think they can be lynched.
Last:
Day 1 - shadow targets vezok with a blue orb.
Night 1 - I target Axel with a yellow orb. Gave my orb to Nacho instead.
Night 2 - I target dkings with a green orb. I was roleblocked.
Night 3 - I target KJ with an orange orb.
Night 4 - I target Silver with a blue orb.
I have the opportunity to still give an orb during the Day; haven't used that yet.
Okay. So are you gonna give me the blue orb, or not?
Each Night in Spring, you will learn the name of a non-Mafia player who took an action that Night.
I guess, and I mean I GUESS it's possible that this could be a scum role. Given that it would prevent you from getting a teammate's name as a result.
And I won't lie, I did briefly consider that fulcrum was using me somehow to clear herself. There's still no explanation for why I targeted Last but ended up on her, and now I've conveniently "cleared" her. There's already a secret daykill floating around, and now there's a secret redirect? I think me being redirected is more likely than fulcrum and Last being swapped, because why even target Last with anything.
But, I think the "non-Mafia" thing not being attached to all of her abilities is a good sign, good enough that I would take her side.
Like I really don't understand what you're doing here, Proph.
You have the opportunity to help protect someone who can get an alignment check, someone who isn't fulcrum, unless you think we're scum together? And after admitting that you didn't even really care about your Night action, why is your first move as town not something like "oh my bad, I can still give out an orb during the Day, here you go."
One more question: Does DV try to include symmetry in roles(i.e. scum roles having similar mechanics to town roles)?
Did you ever explain this reaction to my claim?
I vaguely remember this being brought up when you first partially claimed and you saying that you just hadn't full claimed yet. Though I don't remember revisiting it since you've fullclaimed
Your ability not working on the NK and mine not working on mafia abilities.
@Vaimes
you do you, but I will haunt you if we lose to a fulcrum wolf world because you are deep inside her pockets
Quote from DK »
Tbh I'm pretty sure Last has no clue how Proph plays Mafia.
Well I mean the last time I saw Proph play as a wolf, was more than a year ago, and he powerwolfed most of the game till we finally caught him, and he decided to sing the day away. On the other hand, I don't really care? I don't really believe Proph is that polarized as player, so I am looking at this game for the most part. If he is doing this again, I am certain that Asta is not a wolf with him
so give me a team that makes sense with him?
Sigh I just lost a post due to clicking one of my bookmarks when I was about to hit post reply :/
I'll just say this - for the people who are claiming I'm not solving, look at the posts I've made Yesterday WRT Keldeo. I was trying my best to get there on him but I failed to do so at the last minute.
Last: I can't build a team without Asta or dkings because I think both of their behavior has been awful and I think they really exposed themselves by lazily voting for me. I want to lynch either dkings or Asta Today.
KCC: You're wrong on me. Vote dkings or Asta instead.
fulcrum: You claim to say that when you try and talk to me there's nothing there, but you've only asked me two questions in your past 45 posts and I believe I've answered them both. I think you're mafia because of PoE and because of Keldeo's flip; not to mention that you and dkings went from pushing Rhand to pushing Axelrod late in Day 2.
Like, there could be the slimmest chance you're town because Vaimes has confirmed your ability as "non-mafia" but I feel pretty comfortable that all my townreads are out of their wolf ranges (or are confirmed town), so
Bro, I really need you to get to town on me and talk to me if you're town, because this isn't working. You think I'm mafia because of Keldeo's flip? But you also think KCC is town and I voted Keldeo in response to the wagon on her. That read doesn't make sense. And with Rhand, you what, think scum!me pushed him so other people would want to kill him and then didn't even vote to get credit? You know me better than that.
I don't get why you think I need to be scum over silver and kcc.
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what happened to Proph?
you say that Proph hasnt been solving, but like I don't really see that?
and how is that the conclusion, like ya sure when it doubt look at the people who arent trying to solve, but like in terms of solving, Proph doesnt really come to mind? even some of the top posts have done less in terms of solving I believe
also what about DK or Asta? why did neither of them come to mind?
I know I am town, but like if DK is a wolf here, then I bet my left nut that this avoidance of our slapfight never comes from W/W
He isn't solving me.
I've been playing with Proph for almost 7 years. I'm used to him working with me, bouncing ideas off of me, having decent, if paranoid, assessments of me. Here he's just, like, looking at my role stuff? I feel like when I try to talk to him there's nothing there.
Has an info and a manipulative, but only 1 ability I can RB? two claim issues. Maybe
DK/Proph/Asta
Lol gambit, especially with Asta now willing to bus if dk won't flip BG. Everyone here could easily be lying about/omitting parts of their claim. Very low posting team would explain a lot
Silver/DK/Asta
Also lol gambit, with silver doubling down on it. This team could have absolutely nothing I could RB? Idk, probably not this?
Silver/Proph/DK
DK would have known Asta was getting a message regarding a protect here, role balance works, but dk trying to convince silver to trust his results feels unaligned. Probably not this either?
For Dk/Asta/x... it had to be something like: dk gets run up, falseclaims BG (unless he has a real protect from my busdrive?), either way gets lucky the consensus is to protect Asta, but Asta then mistakenly claims being notified
If dk is scum without Asta, there needs to be some ability that was used on Asta (an actual BG or a fake message)
DK/Shadow dont count for anything since they didnt post much of anything at this point
unvote vote proph I think I'm slightly more confident here
and I just can't build one with the current PoE
like even if Proph is a wolf, where are his partners? maybe Asta? but DK's push feels so not partnery?
like wolves don't win this game if this is the PoE, and I feel like there isnt enough vote movement
the problem is I dont want to dismiss Proph's reads, I think his Asta read is more correct than his DK read
its highly likely Asta is a hit here
Dk/Proph are not really making this game any easier in terms of reading them
like they both mess with the information we can get
this doesnt feel like town Proph, but it also doesnt feel like wolf Proph
vote: KCC
like I want to believe me for once
and I still think KCC's push on me was so disingenuous
also please don't hammer anyone anytime soon, we have till the 29th
@Asta
@DK
like in a world where you are all town, you need to be around for EoD, which is in two days
Specifically DK, I want your thoughts on wolves outside Proph
Asta, thoughts on fulcrum/KCC at this time?
Proph, build a team without Asta/DK, and tell me where ur at
like sure solving KCC/Proph is probably better for us given mechanical information, which I am starting to fall towards KCC being a better lynch
I have another tinfoil wolf read, but I am still trying to find the last wolf in that world, before I go about saying anything
DK crumbed his role, so like I dont see how to build a scum!DV world, with that ability if its real
and Asta makes it so hard to believe its not real with the whole mod confirm claim, so like idk what to do there
if DK is a wolf, and not the BG then Asta is outted
a wolf DK world only works here if DK/Asta are both wolves, or DK is something other than a BG, maybe a wolf jailor? but like in that world he comepletely made up the other aspects of his claim that make it trash for wolves in his own head? k
DK is confirmed to have visited Asta as well
in wolf Asta world, he chose to vote Rhand over Keldeo in this situation?
this does not feel like a bus in the slightest
the problem here is Proph, but even in a wolf!world, I cant make a team with him, so I just think we are completely wrong
correction, I can't make a world with him being a wolf with our current PoE, so I think we are wrong in several places even if this is a hit
but like its never both KCC/Proph
it also doesnt help that DK's reaction to Proph is like so level-0
like Proph voting DK here isnt as strange as people are making out to be, when his PoE is literally DK/Asta/Fulcrum
I think I am settling on exactly this team, where Asta specifically bussed his own partner over Keldeo, maybe due to TMI?
or something along the lines of KCC/[redacted]/X
but like if KCC isn't dying here, then I am always going to either DK/Asta, never Proph
I think I'm kinda ok for dk, more into KCC though.
lol
wonder if DK/Asta/KCC is a thing?
also if DK flips town here, I think I am done with Asta wolf worlds
anyways Bye!
The Current Season is Winter.
With 10 Alive it takes 6 to lynch.
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Curse PremiumLast:
Day 1 - shadow targets vezok with a blue orb.
Night 1 - I target Axel with a yellow orb. Gave my orb to Nacho instead.
Night 2 - I target dkings with a green orb. I was roleblocked.
Night 3 - I target KJ with an orange orb.
Night 4 - I target Silver with a blue orb.
I have the opportunity to still give an orb during the Day; haven't used that yet.
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Curse PremiumI'll just say this - for the people who are claiming I'm not solving, look at the posts I've made Yesterday WRT Keldeo. I was trying my best to get there on him but I failed to do so at the last minute.
Last: I can't build a team without Asta or dkings because I think both of their behavior has been awful and I think they really exposed themselves by lazily voting for me. I want to lynch either dkings or Asta Today.
KCC: You're wrong on me. Vote dkings or Asta instead.
fulcrum: You claim to say that when you try and talk to me there's nothing there, but you've only asked me two questions in your past 45 posts and I believe I've answered them both. I think you're mafia because of PoE and because of Keldeo's flip; not to mention that you and dkings went from pushing Rhand to pushing Axelrod late in Day 2.
Like, there could be the slimmest chance you're town because Vaimes has confirmed your ability as "non-mafia" but I feel pretty comfortable that all my townreads are out of their wolf ranges (or are confirmed town), so
The scum have days chat, right?
KCC’s wagon is still reading weirdly full of town to me. It should be noted that if I were on a team with KCC I would have had NO reason to announce my double votes. Honestly if I were scum I probably would have tried to hide them for a full cycle or only deploy them when we were in better need of a lynch or in a lylo and try to say they didn’t activate until spring came back around since I wasn’t gonna have em for the first spring anyways.
Tom and Vezok are confirmed town, I know I’m town. I want DK to be town since I got a mod confirm that he’s protecting me from death. Killjoy and Last have been solvy and seem towny, even if pretty continually at odds? I actually wonder if scum have kinda tried to avoid shooting folks on KCC’s wagon to avoid confirming too many of them? Wild, baseless speculation there. Scum shots have been weird.
There’s the whole neighbor chat but it seems weird to have 2 masons confirmed as town and 3 others have town confirm. I just don’t entirely trust it.
Her efforts since then with roleblocking seem… fine? I dunno how much she’s helped or hurt town with what she’s done, really. Hard to read that, but maybe there’s value there.
I honestly don’t feel great about her and feel like she could be an easy late game mislynch for lylo even if she is town, so I dunno. Seems less than great as far as situations go.
Fulcrum was part of some effort to confirm Killjoy as maybe town and then handed off her stuff to Vaimes who proceeded to confirm Fulcrum had a rolecop role? I dunno, mechanics are a big blind spot since I clearly don’t know how to evaluate power.
I scanned through fulcrum’s posts but didn’t see any obvious plays alongside KCC, but they don’t really seem to mention each other much at all.
On the announcing of DK’s bodyguard.Please feel free to speculate why I would have done it, but I’ll go ahead and outline why I did do it as town, and spec why it would be a bad idea to do it as a wolf. Hoping this swings votes in a better favor.
As town: I did it because DKings was getting scumread. I’ve personally gotten townyish vibes but I’m not great at general defense or anything, didn’t have time to dig up particular examples. Honestly could be wrong on that entirely, but I did have the information that he was confirmed as protecting me. So I threw that in there to make sure people had the information to consider. I would hope I’m right and that DK is a town bodyguard. I have no serious reason to consider him scum right now. If someone has a massive read with receipts, I’ll listen but. In that absence I’m going with towny. Maybe DK really is a scum bodyguard, but I had no reason to think scum would get a bodyguard that would actually protect town.
In a world where DK and I are both scum: This seems like an extreme no-go. If either of us get taken down and read as scum, there are instant flags because I confirmed a message that isn’t apparently normal and we’ve tended to vote similarly (only split was on King day 2 and right now, since I swapped from Proph to not voting for the moment. Hoping to not vote DK right now honestly and eager to set up a different wagon, but I’m sticking with the vaimes/last/killjoy vote control in an effort to preserve this slot for town power). Obvious associations, and then my team loses two players, even if one of them is a bodyguard for some reason.
In a world where I’m scum and DK is town: I’ll be honest, this could work. If I confirm him as bodyguard and then he gets shot or lynched and flips town, it looks good for me. If I get lynched by town and flip scum, DK becomes a really easy mislynch. So if y’all are gonna lynch one of us, lynch me if only so DK is hard to set up as a mislynch because y’all are gonna have confirmation from a town that he was genuine bodyguard. Obviously would prefer that not happen, but. It is what it is.
Anyways sorry for the wall post all of a sudden. Hope it helps.
Scumchat can't play the game for you. They can only provide help.
Also who do you think is scum? You're almost as confirmed as me yet you voted nobody today.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
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If you aren't scum, I don't understand anything in this game.
I don't think silver/Asta/dk works. I don't believe fulcrum is scum. It's slightly odd if scumYou orbs Axel N1 knowing I was bouncing your target, but fulcrum playing that game with a NK is nonsense.
Scum3 would need to be, like, Vaimes? But I'm really not seeing that, definitely never voting him over you
Like, what?
I can see chat encouraging him to play up the newb card. I can see chat suggesting he keep the double vote secret until needed for a potential late game surprise. I can see chat helping come up with a decentish falseclaim of the double vote turning on later, when that was questioned. And I can see Asta making small slips while posting in keeping that story straight
Ok, thanks for responding at least
I still ain't there on they have to be wolves, but I will vote DK at some point over you, or Asta
Ok...
@vezok
As long as killjoy votes with me, I don't care about his thoughts anymore, since I've come to terms with the fact that he is blissfully ignorant to the hardships of this game
Never understood the mind set of,"I will let everyone else solve the game for me", and it's not that he isn't trying to solve, it's just the lack of vote to justify thoughts and pressure, and sometimes just outright shade.
vote dk
Thanks. Now, please don't touch them until a votecount
It should be L-2
It's L-1 if Asta is lying
Why did you announce the votes when you did?
Did you ever explain this reaction to my claim?
I vaguely remember this being brought up when you first partially claimed and you saying that you just hadn't full claimed yet. Though I don't remember revisiting it since you've fullclaimed
The Current Season is Winter.
With 10 Alive it takes 6 to lynch.
Man, I know it was a couple years ago, but think back to the last two days of Iji 2. Proph had me dead to rights and came around on you. He was RELENTLESS in his efforts to get me lynched. He had post after post citing evidence, contradictions, interactions, etc, and he got heated when no one listened. That is how town!Proph approaches a game; he's meticulous, takes detailed notes, and is never disengaged.
This game he has been anything but that. He replaced in late D1, so ok, being out of sorts D1 and even D2 is fine. But D3/D4 has not been town Proph.
Hell, he even just admitted he's basically OMGUS'ing his entire list of scum reads.
Something happened between D3 and D4 that revved up my analytical abilities. I'll give you one guess as to what it was.
Yeah I also thought that language looked out of place. I'm still betting that, if anyone stole Gemma's role, it was Asta.
Tbh I'm pretty sure Last has no clue how Proph plays Mafia.
A bit self-serving, but... if KCC is town, this might actually be a productive avenue of thought? What scum team would actually have abilities she can hit?
What season is your RB again?
I guess, and I mean I GUESS it's possible that this could be a scum role. Given that it would prevent you from getting a teammate's name as a result.
And I won't lie, I did briefly consider that fulcrum was using me somehow to clear herself. There's still no explanation for why I targeted Last but ended up on her, and now I've conveniently "cleared" her. There's already a secret daykill floating around, and now there's a secret redirect? I think me being redirected is more likely than fulcrum and Last being swapped, because why even target Last with anything.
But, I think the "non-Mafia" thing not being attached to all of her abilities is a good sign, good enough that I would take her side.
You have the opportunity to help protect someone who can get an alignment check, someone who isn't fulcrum, unless you think we're scum together? And after admitting that you didn't even really care about your Night action, why is your first move as town not something like "oh my bad, I can still give out an orb during the Day, here you go."
Your ability not working on the NK and mine not working on mafia abilities.
you do you, but I will haunt you if we lose to a fulcrum wolf world because you are deep inside her pockets
Well I mean the last time I saw Proph play as a wolf, was more than a year ago, and he powerwolfed most of the game till we finally caught him, and he decided to sing the day away. On the other hand, I don't really care? I don't really believe Proph is that polarized as player, so I am looking at this game for the most part. If he is doing this again, I am certain that Asta is not a wolf with him
so give me a team that makes sense with him?
I dont get you, Why is Asta town? Where exactly is the team for you? The same question, if Proph is a wolf here, where is his team in this?
Bro, I really need you to get to town on me and talk to me if you're town, because this isn't working. You think I'm mafia because of Keldeo's flip? But you also think KCC is town and I voted Keldeo in response to the wagon on her. That read doesn't make sense. And with Rhand, you what, think scum!me pushed him so other people would want to kill him and then didn't even vote to get credit? You know me better than that.
I don't get why you think I need to be scum over silver and kcc.