Didn't really like the post where you unvoted KCC, but this post is pretty yikes.
It feels like you don't want to commit to anything, but keeping the possibility of KCC open even if you join another wagon. I'd say it also feels like distancing/bussing, but just a bit. As in this is scummy from any way you look at it, but it's a bit probable that is also on a buddy.
I start slow. I think I'm allowed not to commit when I feel I have no reads worth commitment this early in the game. That post was barely past 24 hrs into the game. We have 2 v/la's and multiple people lurking enough to compete with the v/la folks for non-participation after RVS, including you. My reads are not strong yet. They'll get there.
I was gonna ask Vaimes earlier if he thought KK would admit to having a better wolf game if he was a wolf in his first game back.
If anyone else would like to chime in on the subject I'm listening~~
Given that I told you I enjoy being declared town and that my method is most often doing things "no scum would ever do," I'm gonna go with: yes. I'd do that as scum, no question. (I'd say this as scum too )
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
Ok I figured out the problem I have with this post: it's that despite not actually scumreading Emiko, you make the point that 'TWTBAW is sometimes jsut a wolf'. I'm having trouble following that train of thought.
I agree that sometimes wolfy folks are just really really wolfy, but if you're not scumreading Emiko... why make the point that really wolfy people can just be wolves? You don't think Emiko is a wolf, so saying that feels out of place. Talk me throgh it.
I'm generally against the idea of people being "too wolfy" to be a wolf; wolves can use it to hide behind as a sort of "refuge in audacity". I simply don't think the mindset Emiko was posting from was all that wolfy to begin with. The action itself, sure, but not the mindset, and I generally hold that to be more important than the action in a vacuum.
Hi Silver. Two questions here: Do you think Vaimes kind of... countering your townread of him is alignment indicative of him? And why are you townreading me? I don't recall you saying. I'm pretty sure I made 4 posts as of now and three of them were voting Rhand in RVS for indiscernable reasons and a couple more posts not answering questions about it.
Your posts to Emiko (43 & 45) read solve-y and I think as a wolf you're more likely to appease there than counterattack with "why do you think I did it?"
As far as Vaimes, like, kind of? It's not really something I think he wouldn't do as a wolf, just that the way he went/is going about it feels more villagery than not I guess. We've mostly just been *****posting, don't really think that's AI for him (maybe for me, but the one who would know that best either doesn't recognize that or is a wolf). I'm not really trying to get a hard read on him yet because I don't think I need to; if he's wolf!Vaimes he's posting a lot and he'll lead me to his partners later (or lead me to him from his partners). I'm comfortable not lunching him right now.
Maybe I need some kind of key for my T/S list, heh.
I was sorting you/tom/emiko/Vaimes within the "lean town" tier.
@silvercrys3467 @Vaimes what do you think of the other person's alignment ?
I still have a slight town read on him because I don't think he'd jump into the game and poke the bear.
I did kind of think his poking was bait though.
and another one thats almost the same reason but makes it me specific. Yeah thatll look towny
I made this whole post and im not sure whether its a case or just fanfic of silvers internal dialogue if he is scum that doesnt prove anything.
Its technically believable that town silver thinks of himself as a bear and thinks scumvaimes would be scared of poking him. I dont personally believe that to be the case but thats not really relevant. But if silver believes it and townreads vaimes for it and is immediately more interested in...
Disagree with vaimes premise but still encourage him to go after emiko instead of him
Without having any questions for vaimes because hes town
That's a pretty good fanfic, but you're over-representing my townread on Vaimes a little bit there, don't you think?
And I dunno, I guess I'm confused as to why you think I was encouraging Vaimes to go after Emiko when I have both of them as town leans and I don't really think I was encouraging either of them to attack the other?
I wasn't saying I think scum!Vaimes would be afraid of poking me, just that I think he knows me well enough to know that I get irritable when people wolf read me for no reason and I thought he was trying to elicit an emotional reaction out of me, which I town read him for, but I also didn't want to give him the satisfaction (partly because it's a part of my game I'm trying and as yet failing to excise entirely) so I *****posted about it, and I'm pretty confident that if he is a wolf I'll get him later and he's going to either lead me to his partners or vice-versa with how much he's posting.
Ordinarily I'd town read you for this because you have a pretty bad track record faking scum reads on me so you just haven't bothered the last few times you wolfed against me but this reads more like you've decided to try it again than something I think you actually believe. This doesn't read like town!tom paranoia of my "eventually good scum game", more like wolf!tom making up reasons to vote me.
Killjoy / Emiko
KK / Vezok
Cantrip / Rhand / shadow / KCC
list is roughly sorted within tiers
Killjoy's #43 and #45 are enough to put him above Vaimes. Emiko's mindset just reads like a new town player from a different meta.
Vaimes I've discussed at length at this point.
KK / Vezok are slightly above null, I don't think either of them has really done anything AI but their posting/questions/responses feel townie overall.
Cantrip / Rhand / shadow / KCC are about true null.
megs feels off, do not like the vaimes smearing/shading without a vote.
tom has already decided how he's going to read me and is spinning a narrative to fit his read rather than finding the read that matches his perception of the game.
your question here starts from a bad assumption, namely that i think vaimes is scum. he might be, but right now i’m just calling out suspect behavior.
as that’s gone on i’ve gotten closer to scum vaimes world but i wouldn’t vote here unless i became convinced that he was scum.
let me review my thoughts for you:
i believe what has happened so far is that i called out a bad answer he gave (with regard to why he no-voted in RVS). he then ejected from the conversation when i called him out on it. i then... called him out on doing that. he’s also (last night?) tried to turn it around on me a bit, bit of a softy attack tho.
that’s kind of it as far as this direct interaction goes.
does this make him scum? idk, vaimes does weird stuff and i don’t think it’s out of range for him to bail on what he sees as baseless questioning as town. so on balance it’s not a lot.
but! there’s a little more going on there with this, particularly with how KCC was involved. my main tip-off here was to continue looking at kcc/vaimes as a pair, which is something you can now do too.
so let’s say i’m suspicious of vaimes. why not vote? these days i prefer to just point out odd things as we go, and i typically won’t vote until i have something really solid. this is a change from my earlier, more aggressive playstyle where i would use votes as pressure and try to push people hard. i intentionally adopted this new style for a couple of reasons (you are currently living one of those reasons yourself), and i don’t expect to change it for a while.
so i’m still feeling out the game. you may have seen my earlier “weird energy” comment (i think i made two posts with similar statements?). it’s too early for me to try and push a wagon since i’m not super sure of the gamestate myself yet.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
meg: tries to have a conversation with silver, gets interrupted by vaimes twice—and then ignored by silver!
Not trying to ignore you, sorry, just my thoughts on the subject are complicated and not at all settled
Basically you're saying you didn't have a scumread on Vaimes (but you were definitely shading him, and I guess I agree with Vaimes that it felt more evasive than anything here)
And you're trying to change your playstyle away from being so aggressive because of stuff like... I guess you're saying I have votes because I'm using my vote aggressively, but I don't think that's a very good characterization of my "wagon"
And like yeah maybe you're a villager trying to change playstyles but it's not really a "I think your playstyle is more aggressive than the way you're playing right now" thing it's a "I think everyone should vote because VCA" and a "I think you were evading my point" thing. Could've been a joke I misinterpreted but basically everything is a thin read this early in the game unless someone makes a pretty serious misstep.
And your recent posts are better but I think you're still a bit too... pouncy?
I dunno I'm just waffling on you.
It's more of a "balance of posts I like and posts I don't like" than a "hasn't posted enough for a read yet".
This is reasonable. But it makes me a little uneasy when someone who realizes how aggressively I play then avoids taking a stance on me
Part of it is just that our playstyles are pretty different, I think, I tend to let the wolves come to me and I tend to associate aggressiveness with wolves trying to ram mislunches through
So you just kind of viscerally feel wolfy but the mindset I see in your posts looks like aggressive town and I don't know if I should trust my instinct to wolf read you or my behavior read
Sort of like when I was the vig last game I was in and Vaimes felt viscerally wolfy but I thought he was town and I didn't shoot him N1 and he was a wolf
Though I guess the context doesn't quite transfer because my feeling about Vaimes was different, wasn't aggression but more I could just feel through his posts that he was in back to back wolf games and not having fun
Killjoy, Emiko mentioned their experience, didn't sound like a complete noob. Even as a noob, though, I wouldn't expect inexperienced scum to put forth a "1 in x/y/z" and then upon cross-examination go "or could be zero". Newer scum from what I've observed are more likely to amp up the possibilities of others being scummy than not unless they're receiving flak. Not a guaranteed read for me, but Emiko's continuing to make ok-ish-to-good posts.
Solvey Tom gets a slightly lesser townlean.
KCC mostly feels ok, but maybe a little more Business than last game.
I'm not sure I believe that Vez believes what he posted in 145 about RVS votes most often just being cigars.
Vez, I can't point to specifics, but I'm pretty sure I've seen players accurately catch scum from RVS votes/posts. You haven't?
Vote Megiddo for being overly open and helpful. I feel like town!Megs posts as he wants and damn the torpedoes.
Megiddo, what were your last two scum games? What are your thoughts on Tom? How about KoolKoal?