also, it just feels like manipulation to get us to stay on Rhand
I am glad im not the one on the other side of Silver's tunnel, regardless of either's alignment, its just relatively hard to deal with, given I had a front row seat to it, in Killjoy's game
@Tom
going back to an old post #194
don't believe that is a real read
and in response to #633, "Clearly town to me", does not help me at all
so no, I don't think so given how I still don't really like Vaimes, and given that there isn't a reason to town read you
theres no reason to scumread me (or vaimes) either
194 is a very "azrael when hes town" read tbh. But i feel like i learned that from him years ago and have done it for years atp what sounds fake about it?
also, it just feels like manipulation to get us to stay on Rhand
i mean hes not my first choice but i did think that reasoning wrt wagon speed was pretty poor. Id say <approximately 1> scum voted him there regardless of his alignment
also, it just feels like manipulation to get us to stay on Rhand
I am glad im not the one on the other side of Silver's tunnel, regardless of either's alignment, its just relatively hard to deal with, given I had a front row seat to it, in Killjoy's game
Hmmm. I got a bit snippy with you but I don't think I was really tunneling lol.
I'm not really tunneled on tom either, don't think, just ~pretty sure he's a wolf so
Whisper apparently (haven't read Modern, just going off of other opinions here) played very different in last scum game. Vows not to make the same mistake next time, comes in as scum and decides to come in strong. Took shadow's talk of [redacted] and turned it into waiting to claim.
Unless I'm missing the post where shadow hinted at being a PR, I originally thought he was hinting at it with saying [redacted] will only be redacted temporarily. Pretty sure that he just meant Modern though.
Idk, it actually seems plausible to me. Though I know I used to go for these kinds of theories.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
I had a pretty strong feeling shadow was waiting to claim [something], and waiting to claim when he has a n0 green on vezok is reasonable -- vezok gets wagoned pretty regularly so being able to unveil that post-wagon and look at the votes and such from it would be pretty good.
Emiko: Silver/tom/ a little bit Koolkoal. Do you think there's scum in that grouping?
Megs: Why do you think scum/scum is anywhere near likely? Tom has a well-defined history of not bussing unless necessary. And even when he does, he typically lets others do the work. Look at Modern. The only scum he ever actually votes seriously is grape. He votes az a bit but finds his way off whenever he could.
He jsut doesn't drive lynches against his buddies.
Tom:: Do you believe that people who think both you and silver are town should think I am scum? That's kinda what I think you've said, and why I'm so confused at you not pursuing it more.
I really need to get food now so I'll put my reading on hold for now.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@kj
I mean after both me and silver said you looked like scum if we were wrong i did think that anyone thinking that would at least look
But silver is scum why would i pursue that?
But, like, if i saw two people going at eachother like me and silver and thought they were both town, you better believe id look at the one thing they agreed on
@Killjoy: tom's a wolf but given his claimed view of the game state (that I'm a wolf and therefore your post isn't as bad) there's no reason for him to go after you right now
If you're town he needs to lunch me first so he can go "whoops, guess we were both town after all, how about that bad KJ post huh?"
I guess you're probably not wolves together though given this whole interaction
-------------
Anyone saying wisp might be town but also claiming a fake role needs to explain that better because that's like. A pretty weird line to take.
I don't remember him ever fake claiming as town like that, and it'd be pretty poor play all told
If the claim is fake he's probably a wolf. It didn't read at all like a joke or anything like that so...
I think you're town and the claim is real, but it seemed like someone (might have been Vaimes, can't remember) said you might be town and the claim is fake. Which doesn't make sense to me.
I think you're town and the claim is real, but it seemed like someone (might have been Vaimes, can't remember) said you might be town and the claim is fake. Which doesn't make sense to me.
youre straining my incredulity again. N0s are fake as a default and probably come from town more often
I think you're town and the claim is real, but it seemed like someone (might have been Vaimes, can't remember) said you might be town and the claim is fake. Which doesn't make sense to me.
youre straining my incredulity again. N0s are fake as a default and probably come from town more often
I know you and Wisp know the difference between MTGS meta and MU meta, tom.
And n0's are only meta in turbos on MU anyway as far as I'm aware. There's ~literally zero reason to leave seer cover in an MTGS mini.
Like. You're proposing that shadow hinted at having a PR and then Wisp just randomly decided to leave seer cover for some reason. That seems like an incredible leap to me.
(Also leaving n0s/fakepeeks is fairly standard on many sites if for no other reason than allowing any real peeks to be left without looking out of place. Its obviously most prevalent in open setups where you know theres a cop, like turbos. But theyre so ubiquitos that people also use it to mean "i think this is town but dont wish to explain"
Yes meta is different here. No theres probably no n0 in this game.)
Sure buddy. It isnt because 99% of n0s are fake or anything.
They aren't on MTGS, and the fact that you think this is a good argument is astonishing regardless of your alignment.
You're either (1) trying to leave them open as mislunches, or (2) you know wisp is lying somehow, or (3) you're somehow town and have been making extremely weird arguments all game. There really aren't any other options.
The correct way to play it, of course, is for last to not say another word about it and put vez top of any readslists.
If vez is town scum have to decide what THEY believe. Maybe it effects actions.
Last can choose to keep it up later days and leave additional peeks or tell us otherwise. Especially if hes sussing vez.
Only real drawback is if vez and/or last is scum because no benefits and it kinda forces us to ignore them for an amount of time
And in the off chance its a real claim it all works great. Especially this conversation
@kj
I mean after both me and silver said you looked like scum if we were wrong i did think that anyone thinking that would at least look
But silver is scum why would i pursue that?
Why pursue it? To see if it's a thing. It's another angle to poke at to see what pops out.
How have none of the people that think me and silver are both town started a kj wagon?
also how is this passive?
If they think me and silver are both town, and weve both said you look like scum if we were (but not believed that premise), and also just you objectively look like scum ******* around with a v/v fight...
Why no kj votes?
Thats [shadow/vaimes/kcc/vez] that i specifically remember but i feel like theres more than that
that if there are people who think you +silver are both town, they should be suspecting me. That I objectively look like scum in a v/v fight between you two.
You've even named the people who should be thinking that.
My point is that, given you think "town who think this should be thinking this" and (at least) four people who's alignment you would not know, provided you're town are doing not that. And you've noticed that there's that particular puzzle to be solved, but have no interest in solving it.
Explain why you noticed this, but don't actually care why it's not happening.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
More performers are making their way to the stage. Maybe the whole thing about traitors wanting to ruin the show was also fake news? It's so peaceful here right now...
@Killjoy: tom's a wolf but given his claimed view of the game state (that I'm a wolf and therefore your post isn't as bad) there's no reason for him to go after you right now
If you're town he needs to lunch me first so he can go "whoops, guess we were both town after all, how about that bad KJ post huh?"
I guess you're probably not wolves together though given this whole interaction
-------------
Anyone saying wisp might be town but also claiming a fake role needs to explain that better because that's like. A pretty weird line to take.
I don't remember him ever fake claiming as town like that, and it'd be pretty poor play all told
If the claim is fake he's probably a wolf. It didn't read at all like a joke or anything like that so...
I'm not saying tom should be pursuing me. He should be at least questioning the people who he believes should be voting me to see why they're not becasue in his eyes something's not right, but he doesn't seem to care.
Like I said before re: wisp. On the heels of blowing a fakeclaim in Modern, to immediately come in and fakeclaim again as scum seems... very very ballsy. But given that he didn't pick his target, I'd say it's more likely real than not. As far as Wisp himself, I'd give him a townlean because he seems more engaged than he typically is as scum.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@kj
I cannot possibly overstate how much ive moved on from this. If youd like to just say i was throwing shade into the world and doing nothing about it and move on... thats fine its probably even true
At this point my read of you is not scum with silver + probably just town anyway for getting so bogged down. Youre a but better at seeing the forest as scum.
I doubt id go back to that data point unless silver flipped town and you flipped scum anyway
If the claim is fake he's probably a wolf. It didn't read at all like a joke or anything like that so...
So you're, what, supposedly assuming the claim is fake and that therefore I'm (going to be in some unspecified future that might not even happen) pushing a mislunch when he retracts?
I feel like I've fallen into some kind of twilight zone where nothing makes sense. There's still literally zero reason to believe this is a fake claim or seer cover. How is that not sketchy as all hell?
No im pointing out how ridiculous your statement about me was?
Its almost as silly as your "hes frustrated scum" while you were top wagon and i was universally townread.
I uh
Don't think I was ever top wagon, maybe very briefly, and there were clearly enough people saying I was town that you couldn't push the mislunch through, dude.
And I have no idea how you think my statement about you is ridiculous. It's perfectly cogent to say "tom is trying to keep mislunches open" when you're trying to say Wisp left a fake peek with absolutely no basis for that.
Eh. Out all this, tom just looks so much worse than silver. tom is backtracking on his position of the whole. You either think it's fake and scummy or you don't. Feels like a bad position to take.
But the worst part of this is that he is accusing silver of keeping mislynches open when silver has clearly not done this.
I'm really starting to think tom is just scum. He seems to be misrepping people for no reason way too much.
unvote
vote tom
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Eh. Out all this, tom just looks so much worse than silver. tom is backtracking on his position of the whole. You either think it's fake and scummy or you don't. Feels like a bad position to take.
But the worst part of this is that he is accusing silver of keeping mislynches open when silver has clearly not done this.
I'm really starting to think tom is just scum. He seems to be misrepping people for no reason way too much.
unvote
vote tom
sorry what should i think is fake and scummy?
Last claim?
Its fake and NAI, and hes towny
Re: silver
If thats true, he is objectively keeping a mislynch open. Almost too obviously tbh. Where the misrep?
Or any misrep?
I am glad im not the one on the other side of Silver's tunnel, regardless of either's alignment, its just relatively hard to deal with, given I had a front row seat to it, in Killjoy's game
vote: Meggido
tell me why you voted Rhand in #608
194 is a very "azrael when hes town" read tbh. But i feel like i learned that from him years ago and have done it for years atp what sounds fake about it?
Down with any of silver/rhand/megs
(Or vezok once you rescind he seems like scum)
I'm not really tunneled on tom either, don't think, just ~pretty sure he's a wolf so
Whisper apparently (haven't read Modern, just going off of other opinions here) played very different in last scum game. Vows not to make the same mistake next time, comes in as scum and decides to come in strong. Took shadow's talk of [redacted] and turned it into waiting to claim.
Unless I'm missing the post where shadow hinted at being a PR, I originally thought he was hinting at it with saying [redacted] will only be redacted temporarily. Pretty sure that he just meant Modern though.
Idk, it actually seems plausible to me. Though I know I used to go for these kinds of theories.
@Whisper: Why'd you drop Rhand? I don't get it.
Theres an actual zero percent chance shadow would have gotten to choose target though thats literally never how n0s work
Megs: Why do you think scum/scum is anywhere near likely? Tom has a well-defined history of not bussing unless necessary. And even when he does, he typically lets others do the work. Look at Modern. The only scum he ever actually votes seriously is grape. He votes az a bit but finds his way off whenever he could.
He jsut doesn't drive lynches against his buddies.
Tom:: Do you believe that people who think both you and silver are town should think I am scum? That's kinda what I think you've said, and why I'm so confused at you not pursuing it more.
I really need to get food now so I'll put my reading on hold for now.
I mean after both me and silver said you looked like scum if we were wrong i did think that anyone thinking that would at least look
But silver is scum why would i pursue that?
Why would last claim something like this if it isn't real? What does last scum or last town have to gain from faking a n0 check on me?
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i think it is not likely .
a lot of night 0 cop claims are fake .
on some sites it is more likely to be fake .
If you're town he needs to lunch me first so he can go "whoops, guess we were both town after all, how about that bad KJ post huh?"
I guess you're probably not wolves together though given this whole interaction
-------------
Anyone saying wisp might be town but also claiming a fake role needs to explain that better because that's like. A pretty weird line to take.
I don't remember him ever fake claiming as town like that, and it'd be pretty poor play all told
If the claim is fake he's probably a wolf. It didn't read at all like a joke or anything like that so...
And n0's are only meta in turbos on MU anyway as far as I'm aware. There's ~literally zero reason to leave seer cover in an MTGS mini.
N0s never happen here so why would it be fake?
Dont think lasts claim should effect anyones read of him in any way
Whether i think leaving a n0 is "useful" or "a good idea" is not really relevant here. (I dont)
Yes meta is different here. No theres probably no n0 in this game.)
There's literally zero reason to think he's leaving fake seer cover though
He's played here a lot and knows we don't do that here
There's no other way you could know it's a fake peek.
You're either (1) trying to leave them open as mislunches, or (2) you know wisp is lying somehow, or (3) you're somehow town and have been making extremely weird arguments all game. There really aren't any other options.
If vez is town scum have to decide what THEY believe. Maybe it effects actions.
Last can choose to keep it up later days and leave additional peeks or tell us otherwise. Especially if hes sussing vez.
Only real drawback is if vez and/or last is scum because no benefits and it kinda forces us to ignore them for an amount of time
And in the off chance its a real claim it all works great. Especially this conversation
Im arguing that it being fake would be scummy
So lol "trying to leave them open as mislunches" thats literally you
You said here: that if there are people who think you +silver are both town, they should be suspecting me. That I objectively look like scum in a v/v fight between you two.
You've even named the people who should be thinking that.
My point is that, given you think "town who think this should be thinking this" and (at least) four people who's alignment you would not know, provided you're town are doing not that. And you've noticed that there's that particular puzzle to be solved, but have no interest in solving it.
Explain why you noticed this, but don't actually care why it's not happening.
tom: Why does scum!Last fakeclaim immediately after the end of Modern given what happened?
More performers are making their way to the stage. Maybe the whole thing about traitors wanting to ruin the show was also fake news? It's so peaceful here right now...
Rhand (4): tomsloger, Vaimes, vezokpiraka, Megiddo
Megiddo (3): Cantripmancer, KittyCupCake, Lastwhisper
tomsloger (2): Killjoy, Silvercrys3467
Killjoy (1): EmikoYuriemoto
Vaimes (1): Rhand
Not Voting (1): KoolKoal
V/LA: -
With 12 alive, it’s 7 to lynch. Deadline is on October 11th.
Like I said before re: wisp. On the heels of blowing a fakeclaim in Modern, to immediately come in and fakeclaim again as scum seems... very very ballsy. But given that he didn't pick his target, I'd say it's more likely real than not. As far as Wisp himself, I'd give him a townlean because he seems more engaged than he typically is as scum.
I cannot possibly overstate how much ive moved on from this. If youd like to just say i was throwing shade into the world and doing nothing about it and move on... thats fine its probably even true
At this point my read of you is not scum with silver + probably just town anyway for getting so bogged down. Youre a but better at seeing the forest as scum.
I doubt id go back to that data point unless silver flipped town and you flipped scum anyway
I feel like I've fallen into some kind of twilight zone where nothing makes sense. There's still literally zero reason to believe this is a fake claim or seer cover. How is that not sketchy as all hell?
Someone besides tom talk to me about this please.
Its almost as silly as your "hes frustrated scum" while you were top wagon and i was universally townread.
Don't think I was ever top wagon, maybe very briefly, and there were clearly enough people saying I was town that you couldn't push the mislunch through, dude.
And I have no idea how you think my statement about you is ridiculous. It's perfectly cogent to say "tom is trying to keep mislunches open" when you're trying to say Wisp left a fake peek with absolutely no basis for that.
But the worst part of this is that he is accusing silver of keeping mislynches open when silver has clearly not done this.
I'm really starting to think tom is just scum. He seems to be misrepping people for no reason way too much.
unvote
vote tom
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You think im trying to keep the their lynches open in a world where the claim is real?
Hahahjahahahaha
Last claim?
Its fake and NAI, and hes towny
Re: silver
If thats true, he is objectively keeping a mislynch open. Almost too obviously tbh. Where the misrep?
Or any misrep?