Like. I half expected to get interrogated over that reads list I posted, I blatantly said two of my wolf leans were me sheeping other people and no one batted an eyelash. Mostly just went "yep, that sure is a reads list" and carried on what they were doing before.
That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about when I say no one is engaging me / trying to figure me out. It's like all the villagers this game either think I'm out of my wolf range but haven't explicitly said that yet or they just don't actually care about forcing interactions with me to get an actual read because they think I'm self resolving or something. Which, if it's the latter thing I suppose I'm flattered but it's still ~weird~.
I think I'm not engaging you for the whatever % of me not being invested is leading to my disconnect from the game. I saw your list and was just uninterested when that is an actively bad reaction to it. But that's where I was.
Now that I'm like 5% more motivated what exactly are you sheeping on Rhand/LnG about? Or just their position in the lists?
Anyway on Tom I find your reasoning utterly not compelling. His pushing back on my interpretation of his gimmick is like the most AI thing imaginable. And tom having reasonable thoughts is par for the course. Seems like enough to not really consider him for today but not enough for a town lean.
I’m not sure if I can distinguish new from scum, but Will’s posts have been giving me weird vibes indeed.
I get the not lynching Grape D1 sentiment, but I really think he’s scum.
He’s supposedly scumreading me, but he is answering my questions in a tone that suggests he is talking to town.
I save my biting sarcasm for scum reads or fools. And you're no fool. Anyway you continue to ask me questions, ignore my answers, and ignore my questions while pushing a paper thin case against me.
I don’t ignore your answers. I ask questions to get into your mindset and your answers confirm my idea that you’re mafia.
I went through your ISO and found 1 unanswered question from your side.
You say you’re focused on me, but you’re really not. I haven’t felt any real pressure coming from you.
I also don’t see a logical progression from the post where you said you felt better about me to where you voted me.
Like. I half expected to get interrogated over that reads list I posted, I blatantly said two of my wolf leans were me sheeping other people and no one batted an eyelash. Mostly just went "yep, that sure is a reads list" and carried on what they were doing before.
That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about when I say no one is engaging me / trying to figure me out. It's like all the villagers this game either think I'm out of my wolf range but haven't explicitly said that yet or they just don't actually care about forcing interactions with me to get an actual read because they think I'm self resolving or something. Which, if it's the latter thing I suppose I'm flattered but it's still ~weird~.
The big amount of early posts you made makes me not interested in pursuing you.
I obviously don’t agree with that reads list, but I don’t really see the point in engaging you over that. I’m assuming your reads will evolve.
Counterpoint: I don't really care about lunching specifically a wolf on D1. I care about getting accurate town reads in a handful of player and putting the wolves in a box where they have to break the town circle to generate enough mislunches to win.
I mean I agree with this in theory and can see you doing it, but I don't think it explains the thread level malaise.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I don’t ignore your answers. I ask questions to get into your mindset and your answers confirm my idea that you’re mafia.
I went through your ISO and found 1 unanswered question from your side.
You say you’re focused on me, but you’re really not. I haven’t felt any real pressure coming from you.
I also don’t see a logical progression from the post where you said you felt better about me to where you voted me.
By my quick dive in your ISO you never answered:
Even if I did why would my being unsure of my meta be scum indicative?
I'm really not sure why you're asking me this unless I misunderstood your question. (which was in regards to this question: Heh that does explain the first level play Chris was showing. That kept me confused. @tom: any other reason you can think of for Chris doing that other than what he just explained?)
Why would me spoiling the reasons be relevant?
All of those would have given me a ton of insight into what you're doing and you not answering any of them just feels like you're pushing on surface level scummy things without reasoning as to why they make me scum. Also because I was asking you pointed questions I was intentionally keeping my read unstated because I didn't want to antagonize you while you might answer my questions.
Everyone but Rhand and LnG feel really restrained to me. But not relaxed. It's like the tension waiting for an end of game inbounds play. Everyone is ready to pounce and there is a bit of hand fighting but no one is jumping on anything yet.
I think it makes me feel better about Rhand even though his vote was awful. Not sure on LnG yet. Chris is talking like he's broken the tension but he hasn't done anything yet.
Are you saying that this was a lie?
And ok, I missed 2 questions. Both of which you were using defensively. They were designed to make you look better, I don’t believe that they were designed to look into my alignment.
You can't respond to the bait after I tell you it's bait and expect it to help me at all
I dunno I might come back later and engage with these questions but they just kind of feel tacked on / forced now or something. Like I'm being appeased because you think I'm disappointed in you all or something. Not really disappointed just I was expecting... More I guess?
@Grape: I’m having some trouble believing you actually think a less skilled player is more capable than a more skilled player; it just doesn’t track logically.
I’m debating whether to go out on a limb for Ruma here and...I just don’t want to. Like, his posts don’t strike the scum!Ruma chord I exepect (they don’t really do much either way frankly), but him being awol is, irritatingly, not AI.
All that to say if he is wagoned, I won’t really try and stop it.
I’m debating whether to go out on a limb for Ruma here and...I just don’t want to. Like, his posts don’t strike the scum!Ruma chord I exepect (they don’t really do much either way frankly), but him being awol is, irritatingly, not AI.
All that to say if he is wagoned, I won’t really try and stop it.
Can you see why I found it pinging? I also find your subsequent response a little pinging.
Have you played with Ruma? You were in OTG4, but not sure if you remember. I don’t particularly care for ruma’s playstyle, and if you read his posts, he isn’t my biggest fan either. So here I am defending him from attacks on him for behavior that, while I despise it, isn’t AI. And I would lose no sleep if he gets lynched and flips town, but I still want to win.
Everyone but Rhand and LnG feel really restrained to me. But not relaxed. It's like the tension waiting for an end of game inbounds play. Everyone is ready to pounce and there is a bit of hand fighting but no one is jumping on anything yet.
I think it makes me feel better about Rhand even though his vote was awful. Not sure on LnG yet. Chris is talking like he's broken the tension but he hasn't done anything yet.
Are you saying that this was a lie?
And ok, I missed 2 questions. Both of which you were using defensively. They were designed to make you look better, I don’t believe that they were designed to look into my alignment.
It wasn't a lie it just didn't hold up. Note the use of weak and qualifying language. As for the questions why do you think they weren't designed to get insight into your alignment?
@Grape: I’m having some trouble believing you actually think a less skilled player is more capable than a more skilled player; it just doesn’t track logically.
It's like button mashing in a fighting game. It's a really effective tactic against noobs and something mediocre players will rely on from time to time, but once you're good it's not a play that comes naturally to one.
It’s a cute analogy but that doesn’t really hold up. I don’t think anyone loses skills and tactics as they get better at the game. No one is “too good” to be less capable of making a play.
It’s a cute analogy but that doesn’t really hold up. I don’t think anyone loses skills and tactics as they get better at the game. No one is “too good” to be less capable of making a play.
I guarantee a statistical analysis would find people who classify themselves as "good at/enjoy playing scum" are less likely to make "I know I'm town arguments" than players who class themselves at "bad at/dislike playing scum". It's not a strong enough point to make a read off on it's own but it's one of those building blocks that's nice to see.
That’s just wrong though. Speaking as someone who does consider myself good as scum, I use the “I know I’m town” line as both alignments pretty regularly.
I'm quite confident it isn't wrong. Town obviously uses the argument by far the most but I've noticed overtime that scum don't like to use that on it's own because it wears thin so quickly.
Think you guys lost track of the ball a bit, you aren't even talking about the same point you started with now (unless I'm sleep deprived and this conversation actually makes sense).
Anyway if Ruma had just been, I dunno, Ruma-posting as he does, and then vanished for a while, I would have been a bit frustrated sure but. no, his activity level alone isn't AI.
What's AI is that I caught him in RVS and he pretty much immediately fell straight off a cliff. He made some catch up posts the day I posted that and then his last post, days later, was "I have no idea what's going on in this game" or something to that effect.
Now, as I've said I'd be lying if I said I was some kind of Ruma expert. I could be wrong, sure. But my impression is that town!Ruma has opinions and things to say even if they don't seem to make sense to other people and he isn't shy about voicing them. So rather than just "let's lunch him because he isn't posting" this is like, something I've thought about and will continue to think about for a while.
He's >rand a wolf, period. This is not a policy lunch because he's lurking, for me anyway. Though even if I'm right and he is a wolf, lunching him tells us virtually nothing (other than that one of the players handling him with kid gloves is one of his partners) and kills our momentum pretty severely. So, yeah, willing to lunch elsewhere while the slot's activity gets sorted.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Want to throw out a question, quickly.
Tom and LnGrrrR have the earliest standing vote, and both voted each other. So after ~150 posts, no changing, which may be weird because there haven't been a lot of debate about Tom being scum, for example. Does that mean anything? I find peculiar that LnGrrrR hasn't changed his vote.
For example, I'm a much more easy target than Tom, and got under investigation. I also don't find enough evidenxes for a vote on Tom. Did I miss something on Tom? Also, maybe I'm too easy to be targeted that soon, assuming LnGrrrR is scum and I'm town?
Unfortunately, I can't advance a lot in this reasoning. Need more evidences.
@ LnGrrrR: Why do you consider Tom the best voting in the moment?
@ Everyone : Any thoughts on that? Sorry, this is the best I could bring for now. And I'm bored. May not be a good reasoning. But wanted to try.
Before anyone says something:
I'm not trying to create a [player vs player] scenario, which would be a scum indicative, nor trying to create an alarm on other people to clear my name of investigation. It'd be naive to try such things since you guys have more experience and would probably notice. Also, I'm making things clear by revealing my thought process.
UBRGrixis Shard: Grixis believes in a bold and impassioned search for satisfaction, perfection, and self expression. Those of Grixis colors have an eagerness to break the status quo and remake things in their own image. They disregard tradition and conventional approval, seeing them as unnecessary to achieve their goals, the well behaved rarely make history. Blue wants perfection. Black wants power. Red wants freedom.
UBRGrixis Shard: Grixis believes in a bold and impassioned search for satisfaction, perfection, and self expression. Those of Grixis colors have an eagerness to break the status quo and remake things in their own image. They disregard tradition and conventional approval, seeing them as unnecessary to achieve their goals, the well behaved rarely make history. Blue wants perfection. Black wants power. Red wants freedom.
I agree it's definitely weird. It's a bit what I was getting into with the weird stagnation this game is in. It's reasonably active but it just doesn't feel engaged. What do you think it says about their alignments.
@Silver I don't think it's relevant beyond being some small bit of a % in favor of Cantrip being town.
See that's a villagery post, Will. Just uh, yeah, the last bit isn't really necessary. It might ~seem like it is because you don't want other people to read into it / call you a wolf for doing it when you weren't / etcetera but in actuality you'll probably get wolf read for stating stuff like that up front because it's very self-aware that what you're doing looks bad and if you're a wolf you're lying about it anyway.
Probably should save the advice for the post game I guess. Meh.
Anyway, regarding your question, this is going to be a lot of information-instead-of-analysis buuuut.
Generally speaking voting is quite personality/player dependent. Some people (myself included) feel stagnant votes are anti-town because they don't create a pattern of voting as much as they create a line of it, and those people (including myself) will often use vote patterns when trying to find wolves (especially partners).
That doesn't mean it makes him a wolf, necessarily, though. I sometimes park my vote like that on D1 when I I would have to go read more of LnGrrr's games to see how he normally moves his vote as a villager and as a wolf to see if there's a pattern there. This is left as an exercise for the reader, but I might come back and do it myself later if I get more free time.
Anyway yeah it is kind of unusual that they've been voting each other for so long and not really actively pushing each other but what it means exactly requires more context we're unlikely to get on D1. Could be wolf partners distancing that aren't ready to push a mislunch elsewhere or two villagers just not sure where else to push yet, could be that one's a wolf and the other isn't (probably LnGrrr wolf in this case because tom's wagon is basically dead and he's just parking his vote there at the moment, and also I have a the lightest if independent town reads on tom).
Anyway this is starting to ramble but yeah it's definitely noted just not really something to read into unless LnGrrr is super loose with his vote all the time as a villager and not as a wolf.
(This post probably ninja'd a bunch because I got distracted but I'm not checking the page first lol.)
I wake up to a good question from Will, glad to see it.
I think this reflects very poorly on Lng, because in my experience scum will often times proceed through the game and not carry their vote with them. So Lng posting a decent amount but not really progressing his reads. It's a good catch.
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I wake up to a good question from Will, glad to see it.
I think this reflects very poorly on Lng, because in my experience scum will often times proceed through the game and not carry their vote with them. So Lng posting a decent amount but not really progressing his reads. It's a good catch.
Any reason you didn’t accompany this post with a vote? Do you have a reads list/player breakdown?
I wake up to a good question from Will, glad to see it.
I think this reflects very poorly on Lng, because in my experience scum will often times proceed through the game and not carry their vote with them. So Lng posting a decent amount but not really progressing his reads. It's a good catch.
Why is it a bad look for Lng, but not Tom? It’s similar circumstances.
LNG is already at 3, little reason to bring him to 4 atm
Tom is voting someone who is a wagon. LNG is not. If he felt that strongly he needed to push harder.
No read list atm. Going to doctor maybe one later. Health issues whoo
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Will is so confusing. I'm just gonna put it off indefinitely, until I really think i recognize his cologne and the way he moves and can separate that from his intent.
Still just want to kick lngrr out of this party not sure why anyone's saying I'm not pushing that or don't have strong scumreads.
We're, what, 4 days from deadline no wagon has been less than 4 from majority?
More lngrr votes pls.
I think ruma should be other wagon, but rhand votes are fine too i suppose.
Oog: 4th of july ish is pretty crazy for me workwise. Even among normal summertime craziness.
I'll be back to ~normal on saturday after jim james.
For anyone unfamiliar, Lng is somewhat of a low hanging fruit player in general, but as town he’s thoughtful, engaged, and can be incredulous. I don’t see any of that here, the most he’s really done is omgus and piddle around without digging into the thread. It’s not like, a rock solid case, but it’s day 1 and we need to not no lynch.
No lunch isn't the end of the world or anything but yeah. I'm hungry.
As far as wolf reads go:
Ruma
vast gulf
Rhand / LnGrrr
Not particularly willing to entertain other wagons at the moment.
I do prefer Ruma / LnGrrr wagons whoch presents a problem since I think everyone that actually wants to lunch Ruma is also on LnGrrr so we can't just shift wagons to Ruma. People on Rhand either need to find a new wagon or drum up some more interest in lunching him.
Oh, right, and regarding the sheeping thing I said earlier it was like, mostly just trusting people I'm townreading even if I don't necessarily agree 100% with their case because I have no strong wolf reads other than Ruma and he didn't seem to be getting any traction.
Eh, that sounds a bit revisionist? You're mentioned in them but he talks about other stuff, Grape meta and said something to Grape about Rhand and asked me a question I don't remember answering (lol). He doesn't feel to be focusing on you unnaturally to me.
Although his vote on you didn't read seriously combined with how stale the vote is... that's also noted.
Can't vote him any harder than I already am though.
But I am curious why you're asking for my take on LnGrrr when I'm already voting him instead of trying to get someone who isn't voting him on board.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
@Cantrip: wasn't really a question but you sort of missed a whole side conversation somehow lol.
Ok, I wasn't sure from the way you phrased your response. Sorry.
Quote from Silver »
I said someone who told me Ruma might be a wolf but they didn't think it was good catch was probably a partner and tom said he was one of the players who did.
I ~think that answers your question, as well, but yeah if Ruma's a wolf there's a pretty good chance one of those players is a partner trying not to bus but leaving the door open for it in the future.
Ok. I'm wondering if it's more likely that you're not getting any traction on the Ruma wagon because he's scum (and thus not being pushed by his buddies because town are indifferent), or if it's because he's town and no scum wants to look like they're going after lurker LHF.
I'd completely forgotten LnG was in the game till making this so I can't list him as scum even though people I trust are pushing him.
And who would that be, Mr Thunder Down Under?
You, Silver, and Shadow. I don't have town reads on you but I trust all of your judgement and think it's unlikely you're collectively in on dunking on LnG together.
*is deliberately not pushing LnGrrr while voting him*
Touche.
Blah... My head isn't in this game.
...but this and the subsequent explanation post feel a little off. Feeling disconnected from the game is one thing, but forgetting who you were voting doesn't seem like the kind of thing you space?
Can you see why I found it pinging? I also find your subsequent response a little pinging.
Have you played with Ruma? You were in OTG4, but not sure if you remember. I don’t particularly care for ruma’s playstyle, and if you read his posts, he isn’t my biggest fan either. So here I am defending him from attacks on him for behavior that, while I despise it, isn’t AI. And I would lose no sleep if he gets lynched and flips town, but I still want to win.
No, no, I realize what your opinion on Ruma generally is, but it still felt like you were specifically wanting to go on record as not seeing anything scummy, but still being ok with the lunch. Feels passive aggressive.
I think I'm not engaging you for the whatever % of me not being invested is leading to my disconnect from the game. I saw your list and was just uninterested when that is an actively bad reaction to it. But that's where I was.
Now that I'm like 5% more motivated what exactly are you sheeping on Rhand/LnG about? Or just their position in the lists?
Anyway on Tom I find your reasoning utterly not compelling. His pushing back on my interpretation of his gimmick is like the most AI thing imaginable. And tom having reasonable thoughts is par for the course. Seems like enough to not really consider him for today but not enough for a town lean.
I don’t ignore your answers. I ask questions to get into your mindset and your answers confirm my idea that you’re mafia.
I went through your ISO and found 1 unanswered question from your side.
You say you’re focused on me, but you’re really not. I haven’t felt any real pressure coming from you.
I also don’t see a logical progression from the post where you said you felt better about me to where you voted me.
Idk man youve been getting to know people doing your thing, I think youre voting scum with me rn, what do you want to engage about?
The big amount of early posts you made makes me not interested in pursuing you.
I obviously don’t agree with that reads list, but I don’t really see the point in engaging you over that. I’m assuming your reads will evolve.
I mean I agree with this in theory and can see you doing it, but I don't think it explains the thread level malaise.
Riku has been prodded.
By my quick dive in your ISO you never answered:
Even if I did why would my being unsure of my meta be scum indicative?
I'm really not sure why you're asking me this unless I misunderstood your question. (which was in regards to this question: Heh that does explain the first level play Chris was showing. That kept me confused. @tom: any other reason you can think of for Chris doing that other than what he just explained?)
Why would me spoiling the reasons be relevant?
All of those would have given me a ton of insight into what you're doing and you not answering any of them just feels like you're pushing on surface level scummy things without reasoning as to why they make me scum. Also because I was asking you pointed questions I was intentionally keeping my read unstated because I didn't want to antagonize you while you might answer my questions.
Are you saying that this was a lie?
And ok, I missed 2 questions. Both of which you were using defensively. They were designed to make you look better, I don’t believe that they were designed to look into my alignment.
I dunno I might come back later and engage with these questions but they just kind of feel tacked on / forced now or something. Like I'm being appeased because you think I'm disappointed in you all or something. Not really disappointed just I was expecting... More I guess?
All that to say if he is wagoned, I won’t really try and stop it.
(Inb4 he flips scum and throws egg in my face)
It wasn't a lie it just didn't hold up. Note the use of weak and qualifying language. As for the questions why do you think they weren't designed to get insight into your alignment?
It's like button mashing in a fighting game. It's a really effective tactic against noobs and something mediocre players will rely on from time to time, but once you're good it's not a play that comes naturally to one.
I guarantee a statistical analysis would find people who classify themselves as "good at/enjoy playing scum" are less likely to make "I know I'm town arguments" than players who class themselves at "bad at/dislike playing scum". It's not a strong enough point to make a read off on it's own but it's one of those building blocks that's nice to see.
Anyway if Ruma had just been, I dunno, Ruma-posting as he does, and then vanished for a while, I would have been a bit frustrated sure but. no, his activity level alone isn't AI.
What's AI is that I caught him in RVS and he pretty much immediately fell straight off a cliff. He made some catch up posts the day I posted that and then his last post, days later, was "I have no idea what's going on in this game" or something to that effect.
Now, as I've said I'd be lying if I said I was some kind of Ruma expert. I could be wrong, sure. But my impression is that town!Ruma has opinions and things to say even if they don't seem to make sense to other people and he isn't shy about voicing them. So rather than just "let's lunch him because he isn't posting" this is like, something I've thought about and will continue to think about for a while.
He's >rand a wolf, period. This is not a policy lunch because he's lurking, for me anyway. Though even if I'm right and he is a wolf, lunching him tells us virtually nothing (other than that one of the players handling him with kid gloves is one of his partners) and kills our momentum pretty severely. So, yeah, willing to lunch elsewhere while the slot's activity gets sorted.
But dude's a wolf as far as I'm concerned.
And no one's voted!
Votecount 1.6
Rhand (3) - Vaimes (#299), Grapefruit21 (#300), Will-98 (#329)
LnGrrrR (3) - tomsloger (#144), Silvercrys3467 (#348), shadowlancerx (#353)
Sir Chris (1) - Cantripmancer (#230)
tomsloger (1) - LnGrrrR (#153)
Grapefruit21 (1) - Rhand (#268)
Will-98 (1) - Sir Chris (#332)
Not Voting: Rumanshi, Tubba Fett
With 12 alive, it's 7 to lynch!
Tom and LnGrrrR have the earliest standing vote, and both voted each other. So after ~150 posts, no changing, which may be weird because there haven't been a lot of debate about Tom being scum, for example. Does that mean anything? I find peculiar that LnGrrrR hasn't changed his vote.
For example, I'm a much more easy target than Tom, and got under investigation. I also don't find enough evidenxes for a vote on Tom. Did I miss something on Tom? Also, maybe I'm too easy to be targeted that soon, assuming LnGrrrR is scum and I'm town?
Unfortunately, I can't advance a lot in this reasoning. Need more evidences.
@ LnGrrrR: Why do you consider Tom the best voting in the moment?
@ Everyone : Any thoughts on that? Sorry, this is the best I could bring for now. And I'm bored. May not be a good reasoning. But wanted to try.
Before anyone says something:
I'm not trying to create a [player vs player] scenario, which would be a scum indicative, nor trying to create an alarm on other people to clear my name of investigation. It'd be naive to try such things since you guys have more experience and would probably notice. Also, I'm making things clear by revealing my thought process.
Best MTG colour test ever: https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/8905d5/what_kind_of_mage_would_you_be_test_your_colors/
UBR Grixis Shard: Grixis believes in a bold and impassioned search for satisfaction, perfection, and self expression. Those of Grixis colors have an eagerness to break the status quo and remake things in their own image. They disregard tradition and conventional approval, seeing them as unnecessary to achieve their goals, the well behaved rarely make history. Blue wants perfection. Black wants power. Red wants freedom.
Best MTG colour test ever: https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/8905d5/what_kind_of_mage_would_you_be_test_your_colors/
UBR Grixis Shard: Grixis believes in a bold and impassioned search for satisfaction, perfection, and self expression. Those of Grixis colors have an eagerness to break the status quo and remake things in their own image. They disregard tradition and conventional approval, seeing them as unnecessary to achieve their goals, the well behaved rarely make history. Blue wants perfection. Black wants power. Red wants freedom.
@Silver I don't think it's relevant beyond being some small bit of a % in favor of Cantrip being town.
Probably should save the advice for the post game I guess. Meh.
Anyway, regarding your question, this is going to be a lot of information-instead-of-analysis buuuut.
Generally speaking voting is quite personality/player dependent. Some people (myself included) feel stagnant votes are anti-town because they don't create a pattern of voting as much as they create a line of it, and those people (including myself) will often use vote patterns when trying to find wolves (especially partners).
That doesn't mean it makes him a wolf, necessarily, though. I sometimes park my vote like that on D1 when I I would have to go read more of LnGrrr's games to see how he normally moves his vote as a villager and as a wolf to see if there's a pattern there. This is left as an exercise for the reader, but I might come back and do it myself later if I get more free time.
Anyway yeah it is kind of unusual that they've been voting each other for so long and not really actively pushing each other but what it means exactly requires more context we're unlikely to get on D1. Could be wolf partners distancing that aren't ready to push a mislunch elsewhere or two villagers just not sure where else to push yet, could be that one's a wolf and the other isn't (probably LnGrrr wolf in this case because tom's wagon is basically dead and he's just parking his vote there at the moment, and also I have a the lightest if independent town reads on tom).
Anyway this is starting to ramble but yeah it's definitely noted just not really something to read into unless LnGrrr is super loose with his vote all the time as a villager and not as a wolf.
(This post probably ninja'd a bunch because I got distracted but I'm not checking the page first lol.)
I wake up to a good question from Will, glad to see it.
I think this reflects very poorly on Lng, because in my experience scum will often times proceed through the game and not carry their vote with them. So Lng posting a decent amount but not really progressing his reads. It's a good catch.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
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was meant to say "when I don't have strong wolf reads or the game isn't moving very much, kind of like this one."
Why is it a bad look for Lng, but not Tom? It’s similar circumstances.
Tom is voting someone who is a wagon. LNG is not. If he felt that strongly he needed to push harder.
No read list atm. Going to doctor maybe one later. Health issues whoo
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Still just want to kick lngrr out of this party not sure why anyone's saying I'm not pushing that or don't have strong scumreads.
We're, what, 4 days from deadline no wagon has been less than 4 from majority?
More lngrr votes pls.
I think ruma should be other wagon, but rhand votes are fine too i suppose.
Oog: 4th of july ish is pretty crazy for me workwise. Even among normal summertime craziness.
I'll be back to ~normal on saturday after jim james.
When is the deadline?
Also, I will be V/LA from 7/6-7/13, will plan to check in at least every other day, but I’ll be on vacation.
Can everyone post their preferred lynch targets? I prefer Lng, am generally against rhand, and my thoughts on Ruma have already been stated.
As far as wolf reads go:
Ruma
vast gulf
Rhand / LnGrrr
Not particularly willing to entertain other wagons at the moment.
I do prefer Ruma / LnGrrr wagons whoch presents a problem since I think everyone that actually wants to lunch Ruma is also on LnGrrr so we can't just shift wagons to Ruma. People on Rhand either need to find a new wagon or drum up some more interest in lunching him.
How do you feel about lngrrs contributions since I started his wagon?
Theyve all been about me
Although his vote on you didn't read seriously combined with how stale the vote is... that's also noted.
Can't vote him any harder than I already am though.
But I am curious why you're asking for my take on LnGrrr when I'm already voting him instead of trying to get someone who isn't voting him on board.
Just ran into my head. Hmm.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Ok. I'm wondering if it's more likely that you're not getting any traction on the Ruma wagon because he's scum (and thus not being pushed by his buddies because town are indifferent), or if it's because he's town and no scum wants to look like they're going after lurker LHF.
I like this take...
...but this and the subsequent explanation post feel a little off. Feeling disconnected from the game is one thing, but forgetting who you were voting doesn't seem like the kind of thing you space?
No, no, I realize what your opinion on Ruma generally is, but it still felt like you were specifically wanting to go on record as not seeing anything scummy, but still being ok with the lunch. Feels passive aggressive.
Just to make sure we're on the same page, what's your definition of power wolf?