I hate how adement Chris is against voting for vezok.
I... I kinda wanna test something.
vote Chris
If he flips scum: we kill vezok and we are closer to winning
If he flips town: that pretty much clears vezok and we have one less person to worry about ;unless chris is wrong about everything. Which Tom seems adamant about.
Tom, if Chris is wrong and he isn’t wrong often from what I hear, what’s to say he is just Intentionally being wrong to sabotage the game?
no.
No world where hes more likely than vezok.
They can even be scum together!
Sorry, I haven't noticed that he's refusing to answer questions, in thread at least.
Well, I found it - if you mean who is mafia on the town wagons (Last and Rhand) from day 1.
Super huge apology if I'm running through things that have been already covered.
Highroller's made it a point that he's investigated my slot's wagon and come to the conclusion that there was more than one scum (Mindreaver/Anak) on that wagon.
Are you asking him about Rhand and Last because the two should ideally be similar to Tau in that they were mislynches waiting to happen?
Otherwise, I feel like he's already answered your question about Last at least, since Kami was also on that wagon.
Otherwise, after running through his ISO, yeah he's made it a point to not answer to you. I'm not necessarily seeing it as AI, that part at least though. It's not like he's refusing to solve. It's not like it wouldn't be easy just to pull up a couple names from the wagon and add an inkling of reasoning to it. Highroller's "solving at his own pace with disregard for others" was something I saw in Ghostbusters during my short time in that game. He hardtunneled Rodemy day 1 in that game and paid little mind to any other players despite being requested other reads. It'd certainly be helpful if he did respond to you, because then you could move on and not harp on something like this. But otherwise he's doing his job as town. He's pushing people he thinks is scum.
(Also, if you could save me the trouble and link the post where you claimed 1-shot investigative before today...)
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Within each grouping- via a combination of my own reads, unalignments I feel strongly about, and a healthy dose of setup gaming- this is every combination of alignments within these 3 groups
In order of likelihood.
For the first grouping, i thought/still think vezok scum, chris/rod town, Kami town or serial killer is *by far* the most likely of the choices.
Assumed that was made clear by, yknow, voting vezok.
Chris' setupgaming in return today has made me move the everyone town except Kami SK>mafia. Certainly not above that first world, but maybe 2nd most likely.
Still not really entertaining the notion of 5 blue names in there though.
My second set of names is much simpler.
Vaimes/lngrr
I think they're both scummy, and don't think they're partners.
No setup here. Nothing fancy. If they're both town...
****
Final grouping is the grouping of info roles. It also happens to be "the rest" as well as all the 2 letter abbreviations, but those are happy accidents
Note that i think the most likely world is that all 3 of kj/re/hr are town.
Here's what im saying with those 3 groups:
1. There's too many protectives unless the KP (kami apparently) is non-town.
Vezok is most likely mafia here. By far. I concede that i (tom) would not make that claim as scum. But too many signs point to vezok having done so.
I think Chris' issue was with being in 3 of 5 worlds. But i meant those all to be, like, tinfoil worlds. Prolly shoulda put another <big gap> between it and the others. Now I've got something else there
2. I am townreading everyone, to some extent, except vezok, vaimes, and lngrr. Vezok is in the last group, so vaimes and lngrr.
And they dont look like partners.
3. This is the rest. I think they're all town. Not locked in on any.
~~~~~~~~
(Sassy)tldr
Child this isn't hedging! This is me trying to solve the game and putting it in a handy chart for you plebes.
Puh-lease
Moving chris down two spots is as far as I'll let myself omgus. Was #2 at sod (3 behind grape but RIP)
Might keep kj ahead of him even after my temper tantrum. Hard to imagine zero actual info roles. It's only a n0 but... It's all we got unless re/hr unlock something or have secretly been the worlds weirdest masons this whole time
So, in conclusion, Chris and others succesfully convinced me today that vezok town is more likely than I thought.
But
I do still want to resolve that grouping in some way.
And vaimes/lngrr still aren't w/w imo
But honestly I'm fine with killing vezok/vaimes/lngrr/Kami
Probably in that order of preference, and that 4 names contains probably 2 mafia or 1 mafia and 1 SK. If we're real lucky we get 2 mafia and an SK.
Kami is a good way to learn a bit more about the setup, especially wrt vezok (and Chris), but i still dont actually think hes mafia
Bonus:
What I'd do with each flip barring new info
vezok> Vaimes or lngrr for sure
vezok> was thinking vaimes or lngrr anyway, but maybe kami Now?
Vaimes> lngrr is probably town! Let's talk vez/Kami some more
vaimes> kill lngrr with fire
lngrr> Vaimes town, vez/Kami
lngrr> Vaimes
kami> vezok is just scum idiots. Should have listened to me yesterday
kami> vaimes/lngrr i guess? Doesn't clear vez though
kami> whoops sorry vez. I gotta reread
Kami's push of EtR gave me majorly bad feels day 1. Rereading his ISO served as a reminder. The reasoning for shooting Wisp pings me majorly - I just can't see vig shooting a soft claim night 1.
I just think LnGrrrR and Kami need to be settled somehow. They're not a dichotomy but really we should have had LnGrrrR's flip night 2 if Kami was telling the truth. I doubt I'll vote outside there, except for Vaimes, maybe.
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KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I really don't think he has. Tom hasn't claimed but when Vez claimed Tom didn't affirm his claim. I would think tom would have done that by now. His other targets were Osie and me, Osie being a TV and me not actually having an active ability. So I don't think he's actually confirmed to actually have that ability.
Actually, @Vezok: When did you start tinfoiling me/grape? You were hardtownreading me all game last I checked.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
[quote from="Grapefruit21 »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/805970-death-in-the-family-day-2-together-in-death?comment=1652"]
KJ is town KJ due to multiple reasons, that I've also explained before plus his clear of grape.
Hey Vezok, draw me a line from this post to you tinfoiling hard enough to try and block me?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
[quote from="Grapefruit21 »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/805970-death-in-the-family-day-2-together-in-death?comment=1652"]
KJ is town KJ due to multiple reasons, that I've also explained before plus his clear of grape.
Hey Vezok, draw me a line from this post to you tinfoiling hard enough to try and block me?
</blockquote>
Well right at about the end of day 3, my only real scumread was Vaimes. I started thinking about what other possibilities exist in the game and arrived at a you and grape pairing. I thought blocking you would clear the tinfoil a bit and it did. Especially after grape died.
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[quote from="Grapefruit21 »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/805970-death-in-the-family-day-2-together-in-death?comment=1652"]
KJ is town KJ due to multiple reasons, that I've also explained before plus his clear of grape.
Hey Vezok, draw me a line from this post to you tinfoiling hard enough to try and block me?
</blockquote>
Well right at about the end of day 3, my only real scumread was Vaimes. I started thinking about what other possibilities exist in the game and arrived at a you and grape pairing. I thought blocking you would clear the tinfoil a bit and it did. Especially after grape died.
Why does that magically clear your tinfoil? Why am I guaranteed to have made the kill last night as scum? Describe the game state in such a way that I 100% make the kill last night as scum?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I'm positive last scum are in {Vaimes, tom, Lngrr, KA, RE} although with the exception of Vaimes I have found reasons to townread all of the others.
Vez answer my question. Why would you block me if you thought5 I was town (or more to the point, you thought other people were more likely scum.)?
There are still 3 scum alive. Vaimes is definitely not doing the kill due to me scumreading him and being a very probable target. I have no clear leads on another scum and I didn't really want to block any of the other people. I figured that if you were scum either with or without grape, you are the one under the least suspicion and attempt to do it.
It was more a risk-reward thing. Take the normal route of blocking one in the PoE randomly or blocking you and either catching you or reducing the chances that you could be scum by a lot. With grape dead this is not as needed as him flipping town makes you a lot more improbable to be scum. I also assumed you had no other abilities except the n0 alignment confirm due to not talking about them during the last few days.
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I'm positive last scum are in {Vaimes, tom, Lngrr, KA, RE} although with the exception of Vaimes I have found reasons to townread all of the others.
Vez answer my question. Why would you block me if you thought5 I was town (or more to the point, you thought other people were more likely scum.)?
There are still 3 scum alive. Vaimes is definitely not doing the kill due to me scumreading him and being a very probable target. I have no clear leads on another scum and I didn't really want to block any of the other people. I figured that if you were scum either with or without grape, you are the one under the least suspicion and attempt to do it.
It was more a risk-reward thing. Take the normal route of blocking one in the PoE randomly or blocking you and either catching you or reducing the chances that you could be scum by a lot. With grape dead this is not as needed as him flipping town makes you a lot more improbable to be scum. I also assumed you had no other abilities except the n0 alignment confirm due to not talking about them during the last few days.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I'm positive last scum are in {Vaimes, tom, Lngrr, KA, RE} although with the exception of Vaimes I have found reasons to townread all of the others.
Vez answer my question. Why would you block me if you thought5 I was town (or more to the point, you thought other people were more likely scum.)?
There are still 3 scum alive. Vaimes is definitely not doing the kill due to me scumreading him and being a very probable target. I have no clear leads on another scum and I didn't really want to block any of the other people. I figured that if you were scum either with or without grape, you are the one under the least suspicion and attempt to do it.
It was more a risk-reward thing. Take the normal route of blocking one in the PoE randomly or blocking you and either catching you or reducing the chances that you could be scum by a lot. With grape dead this is not as needed as him flipping town makes you a lot more improbable to be scum. I also assumed you had no other abilities except the n0 alignment confirm due to not talking about them during the last few days.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I don't believe that he didn't just block out of the Poe, but in his heavy town pool.
I don't believe he's town.
THEN WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION!?
What answer would you have taken?
It seems like you asked the question just so you can vote him for a reason you had already decided you weren't gonna believe.
Vezok did something that made no sense to me. So I asked him to explain. He did not do so satisfactorily.
Satisfactory answers might include proof that he's ever tinfoiling me this game. The issue is it came out of nowhere.
He could have also came in with something like "it started when Grape/you made post x which made me think that.... Like, something that indicated his thinking that before that night.
It's true that i couldn't think of a good answer that he was likely to give when I asked because I knew he hasn't telegraphed obviously the things I had problem with.
I also realized this as I was typing this: Rod, he was scum reading Grape and town reading me. He was afraid of a Gambit. Why me, his town read over Grape who he wasn't?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I don't believe that he didn't just block out of the Poe, but in his heavy town pool.
I don't believe he's town.
THEN WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION!?
What answer would you have taken?
It seems like you asked the question just so you can vote him for a reason you had already decided you weren't gonna believe.
Vezok did something that made no sense to me. So I asked him to explain. He did not do so satisfactorily.
Satisfactory answers might include proof that he's ever tinfoiling me this game. The issue is it came out of nowhere.
He could have also came in with something like "it started when Grape/you made post x which made me think that.... Like, something that indicated his thinking that before that night.
It's true that i couldn't think of a good answer that he was likely to give when I asked because I knew he hasn't telegraphed obviously the things I had problem with.
I also realized this as I was typing this: Rod, he was scum reading Grape and town reading me. He was afraid of a Gambit. Why me, his town read over Grape who he wasn't?
That sounds like a question you should ask him.
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I don't believe that he didn't just block out of the Poe, but in his heavy town pool.
I don't believe he's town.
THEN WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION!?
What answer would you have taken?
It seems like you asked the question just so you can vote him for a reason you had already decided you weren't gonna believe.
Vezok did something that made no sense to me. So I asked him to explain. He did not do so satisfactorily.
Satisfactory answers might include proof that he's ever tinfoiling me this game. The issue is it came out of nowhere.
He could have also came in with something like "it started when Grape/you made post x which made me think that.... Like, something that indicated his thinking that before that night.
It's true that i couldn't think of a good answer that he was likely to give when I asked because I knew he hasn't telegraphed obviously the things I had problem with.
I also realized this as I was typing this: Rod, he was scum reading Grape and town reading me. He was afraid of a Gambit. Why me, his town read over Grape who he wasn't?
That sounds like a question you should ask him.
I agree.
This was more trying to make you understand why his actions made no sense.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I don't believe that he didn't just block out of the Poe, but in his heavy town pool.
I don't believe he's town.
THEN WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION!?
What answer would you have taken?
It seems like you asked the question just so you can vote him for a reason you had already decided you weren't gonna believe.
Vezok did something that made no sense to me. So I asked him to explain. He did not do so satisfactorily.
Satisfactory answers might include proof that he's ever tinfoiling me this game. The issue is it came out of nowhere.
He could have also came in with something like "it started when Grape/you made post x which made me think that.... Like, something that indicated his thinking that before that night.
It's true that i couldn't think of a good answer that he was likely to give when I asked because I knew he hasn't telegraphed obviously the things I had problem with.
I also realized this as I was typing this: Rod, he was scum reading Grape and town reading me. He was afraid of a Gambit. Why me, his town read over Grape who he wasn't?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
So why is it when I become unnerved by how many people were so quickly ready to jump on the Anak bandwagon, that's such a mafia tell, whereas you did the same damn thing?
Anak was scum. I was townreading EtR.
If RE ends up flipping scum, then I'll look just as bad as you do for that post. If Vezok flips scum, then you look bad x2.
You reacted to a SCUM wagon weirdly
Yep, keep trying to spin this like you're not being a hypocrite.
You can't argue it's weird and mafia to react to a bandwagon with suspicion when that wagon is suddenly growing when you yourself said, "Hey, this bandwagon is suspicious because it is suddenly growing!" Not without being hypocritical, anyway.
There is nothing weird about my reaction. I never defended Anak, in point of fact I read him as mafia the whole time, and the reaction to people suddenly voting him right after having at least two other bandwagons beforehand is common sense. You're being a tryhard here.
If you're actually scumreading me as hard as you say, then vote me. Start a wagon and get some pressure there. You constantly telling me "stop hanging back" but you doing nothing to force me when you're scumreading me doen't actually make sense to me.
Easy there, tiger. KamikazeArchon and Vezok are ahead of the line before you.
I don't remember scumreading Rhand. Apperently I did for a sec. All I remember is townreading him after his whole "Grape verbs" dealeo.
Dude. You didn't defend Anak? Not directly, but when you say "This wagon is weird" you're implying that it's not a good wagon. That the wagon is being pushed by scum on town and shouldn't be continued. Or are you of the opinion that there's such a thing as a bad wagon on scum? Otherwise I don't see where you're going with this.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Dude. You didn't defend Anak? Not directly, but when you say "This wagon is weird" you're implying that it's not a good wagon. That the wagon is being pushed by scum on town and shouldn't be continued. Or are you of the opinion that there's such a thing as a bad wagon on scum? Otherwise I don't see where you're going with this.
This is embarrassing, Killjoy. I repeatedly said I believed that Anak was mafia, but that I didn't trust the sudden dogpile on him, which of course I didn't. It was like the third bandwagon that day. Of course there were mafia on it.
No the one on page 4 is the only actual scum read.
The "this is why I always scum read you" is me literally telling Rhand that it's posts similar to that that make me scum read him every game. That's just a thing with me and him. But I think I caught his scent finally after token redux. I might be able to read him now.
Is there any other wagons you've distrusted that weren't anaks? What does distrusting the dogpile mean if not "it was started by scum"? And what's the point of saying you distrust it other than trying to stop the wagon?
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
No the one on page 4 is the only actual scum read.
The "this is why I always scum read you" is me literally telling Rhand that it's posts similar to that that make me scum read him every game. That's just a thing with me and him. But I think I caught his scent finally after token redux. I might be able to read him now.
The point stands you read Rhand as mafia, so don't run around saying, "OH NO! HIGHROLLER READ GRAPE AS MAFIA!" FFS, you even posted that YOU would have read Grape as mafia had you not received an inspection (allegedly) saying that you were mafia, so don't throw shade at me because I thought Grape was mafia. It's not like you didn't mafiaread two confirmed towns.
Is there any other wagons you've distrusted that weren't anaks?
... Yes, of course. I've stated this repeatedly.
What does distrusting the dogpile mean if not "it was started by scum"?
... That mafia jumped on the wagon afterward, obviously.
And what's the point of saying you distrust it other than trying to stop the wagon?
... That mafia are on the wagon, obviously? You've played mafia before, why are you acting like this is some sort of foreign concept to you?
No world where hes more likely than vezok.
They can even be scum together!
Super huge apology if I'm running through things that have been already covered.
Highroller's made it a point that he's investigated my slot's wagon and come to the conclusion that there was more than one scum (Mindreaver/Anak) on that wagon.
Are you asking him about Rhand and Last because the two should ideally be similar to Tau in that they were mislynches waiting to happen?
Otherwise, I feel like he's already answered your question about Last at least, since Kami was also on that wagon.
Otherwise, after running through his ISO, yeah he's made it a point to not answer to you. I'm not necessarily seeing it as AI, that part at least though. It's not like he's refusing to solve. It's not like it wouldn't be easy just to pull up a couple names from the wagon and add an inkling of reasoning to it. Highroller's "solving at his own pace with disregard for others" was something I saw in Ghostbusters during my short time in that game. He hardtunneled Rodemy day 1 in that game and paid little mind to any other players despite being requested other reads. It'd certainly be helpful if he did respond to you, because then you could move on and not harp on something like this. But otherwise he's doing his job as town. He's pushing people he thinks is scum.
(Also, if you could save me the trouble and link the post where you claimed 1-shot investigative before today...)
vez
Vaimes
LnGrrrR/Kami
:II
vote: Kami
This is every world that i believe is possible. If you don't like that word, it's "potential solves"
(Lightly edited)
vezok/chris/rod/Kami
vezok/chris/rod/Kami
vezok/chris/rod/Kami
vezok/chris/rod/Kami
vezok/chris/rod/Kami
+
Vaimes/lngrr
Vaimes/lngrr
Vaimes/lngrr
<Big gap>
Vaimes/lngrr
+
HR/RE/KJ
HR/RE/KJ
HR/RE/KJ
HR/RE/KJ
Color code:
town/mafia/SK
Within each grouping- via a combination of my own reads, unalignments I feel strongly about, and a healthy dose of setup gaming- this is every combination of alignments within these 3 groups
In order of likelihood.
For the first grouping, i thought/still think vezok scum, chris/rod town, Kami town or serial killer is *by far* the most likely of the choices.
Assumed that was made clear by, yknow, voting vezok.
Chris' setupgaming in return today has made me move the everyone town except Kami SK>mafia. Certainly not above that first world, but maybe 2nd most likely.
Still not really entertaining the notion of 5 blue names in there though.
My second set of names is much simpler.
Vaimes/lngrr
I think they're both scummy, and don't think they're partners.
No setup here. Nothing fancy. If they're both town...
****
Final grouping is the grouping of info roles. It also happens to be "the rest" as well as all the 2 letter abbreviations, but those are happy accidents
Note that i think the most likely world is that all 3 of kj/re/hr are town.
Here's what im saying with those 3 groups:
1. There's too many protectives unless the KP (kami apparently) is non-town.
Vezok is most likely mafia here. By far. I concede that i (tom) would not make that claim as scum. But too many signs point to vezok having done so.
I think Chris' issue was with being in 3 of 5 worlds. But i meant those all to be, like, tinfoil worlds. Prolly shoulda put another <big gap> between it and the others. Now I've got something else there
2. I am townreading everyone, to some extent, except vezok, vaimes, and lngrr. Vezok is in the last group, so vaimes and lngrr.
And they dont look like partners.
3. This is the rest. I think they're all town. Not locked in on any.
~~~~~~~~
(Sassy)tldr
Child this isn't hedging! This is me trying to solve the game and putting it in a handy chart for you plebes.
Puh-lease
rod
kj
re
chris
hr
kami
vezok
lngrr
vaimes
Moving chris down two spots is as far as I'll let myself omgus. Was #2 at sod (3 behind grape but RIP)
Might keep kj ahead of him even after my temper tantrum. Hard to imagine zero actual info roles. It's only a n0 but... It's all we got unless re/hr unlock something or have secretly been the worlds weirdest masons this whole time
But
I do still want to resolve that grouping in some way.
And vaimes/lngrr still aren't w/w imo
But honestly I'm fine with killing vezok/vaimes/lngrr/Kami
Probably in that order of preference, and that 4 names contains probably 2 mafia or 1 mafia and 1 SK. If we're real lucky we get 2 mafia and an SK.
Kami is a good way to learn a bit more about the setup, especially wrt vezok (and Chris), but i still dont actually think hes mafia
What I'd do with each flip barring new info
vezok> Vaimes or lngrr for sure
vezok> was thinking vaimes or lngrr anyway, but maybe kami Now?
Vaimes> lngrr is probably town! Let's talk vez/Kami some more
vaimes> kill lngrr with fire
lngrr> Vaimes town, vez/Kami
lngrr> Vaimes
kami> vezok is just scum idiots. Should have listened to me yesterday
kami> vaimes/lngrr i guess? Doesn't clear vez though
kami> whoops sorry vez. I gotta reread
I just think LnGrrrR and Kami need to be settled somehow. They're not a dichotomy but really we should have had LnGrrrR's flip night 2 if Kami was telling the truth. I doubt I'll vote outside there, except for Vaimes, maybe.
I get that
I really don't think he has. Tom hasn't claimed but when Vez claimed Tom didn't affirm his claim. I would think tom would have done that by now. His other targets were Osie and me, Osie being a TV and me not actually having an active ability. So I don't think he's actually confirmed to actually have that ability.
Actually, @Vezok: When did you start tinfoiling me/grape? You were hardtownreading me all game last I checked.
Well right at about the end of day 3, my only real scumread was Vaimes. I started thinking about what other possibilities exist in the game and arrived at a you and grape pairing. I thought blocking you would clear the tinfoil a bit and it did. Especially after grape died.
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Anyway, all of us think Vaimes is scum. Let's lynch him today and decide more tomorrow.
vote vaimes
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Check out the Shop Thread
unvote vote vaimes
Cuando l’amico chiede, non v’è domani.
(When a friend asks, there is no tomorrow.)
vezokpiraka (2): tomsloger, Vaimes
KamikazeArchon (2): Highroller, RE1031
Vaimes (2): vezokpiraka, Rodemy
tomsloger (1): Sir Chris
Not Voting (3): Killjoy, LnGrrrR, KamikazeArchon
V/LA: -
With 10 alive, it’s 6 to lynch. Deadline is on April 18th.
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I don’t think any of y’all are town.
Also, this reminded me to check lngr. @Mod - lngr mentioned a V/LA in 3312.
I don't know why I didn't vote one of you the day before. We're one day behind on critical information due to "crossfire," maybe even two.
There are still 3 scum alive. Vaimes is definitely not doing the kill due to me scumreading him and being a very probable target. I have no clear leads on another scum and I didn't really want to block any of the other people. I figured that if you were scum either with or without grape, you are the one under the least suspicion and attempt to do it.
It was more a risk-reward thing. Take the normal route of blocking one in the PoE randomly or blocking you and either catching you or reducing the chances that you could be scum by a lot. With grape dead this is not as needed as him flipping town makes you a lot more improbable to be scum. I also assumed you had no other abilities except the n0 alignment confirm due to not talking about them during the last few days.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
I'm gonna Vote Vezok This likely clears Vaimes when Vez flips scum btw.
This is a horrible vote imo. You ask him for his reason. He gives it... and you say. Nah and vote.
It’s like the opposite version of scum scumreading someone and asking them a question and then going.. oh okay.
This vote gives me the feels
I don't believe that he didn't just block out of the Poe, but in his heavy town pool.
I don't believe he's town.
THEN WHY DID YOU ASK THE QUESTION!?
What answer would you have taken?
It seems like you asked the question just so you can vote him for a reason you had already decided you weren't gonna believe.
Please tell me all 500 posts of the tom/Chris dick swinging competition is scum theater, because I already know I don't want to read it.
Satisfactory answers might include proof that he's ever tinfoiling me this game. The issue is it came out of nowhere.
He could have also came in with something like "it started when Grape/you made post x which made me think that.... Like, something that indicated his thinking that before that night.
It's true that i couldn't think of a good answer that he was likely to give when I asked because I knew he hasn't telegraphed obviously the things I had problem with.
I also realized this as I was typing this: Rod, he was scum reading Grape and town reading me. He was afraid of a Gambit. Why me, his town read over Grape who he wasn't?
That sounds like a question you should ask him.
How do you know it’s a dick swinging competition if you didn’t read it?
This was more trying to make you understand why his actions made no sense.
I asked you something a while back. I don't even remember what it was tbh.
I don't wanna look for it tbh.
I'm all yours, baby. Whatchya want?
vote vaimes
You can't complain about an exchange between tom and chris you haven't read as if you read it already.
that's just fake,
Obviously it wasn't for any good reason.
Prepare to have your mind blown, Killjoy.
Ooops...
Yep, keep trying to spin this like you're not being a hypocrite.
You can't argue it's weird and mafia to react to a bandwagon with suspicion when that wagon is suddenly growing when you yourself said, "Hey, this bandwagon is suspicious because it is suddenly growing!" Not without being hypocritical, anyway.
There is nothing weird about my reaction. I never defended Anak, in point of fact I read him as mafia the whole time, and the reaction to people suddenly voting him right after having at least two other bandwagons beforehand is common sense. You're being a tryhard here.
Easy there, tiger. KamikazeArchon and Vezok are ahead of the line before you.
For the record, I knew because I skimmed some of it at work the other day, thought "Okay, I can't digest this right now," and closed MTGS.
rofl lol.
Then why make that remark?
Dude. You didn't defend Anak? Not directly, but when you say "This wagon is weird" you're implying that it's not a good wagon. That the wagon is being pushed by scum on town and shouldn't be continued. Or are you of the opinion that there's such a thing as a bad wagon on scum? Otherwise I don't see where you're going with this.
This is embarrassing, Killjoy. I repeatedly said I believed that Anak was mafia, but that I didn't trust the sudden dogpile on him, which of course I didn't. It was like the third bandwagon that day. Of course there were mafia on it.
The "this is why I always scum read you" is me literally telling Rhand that it's posts similar to that that make me scum read him every game. That's just a thing with me and him. But I think I caught his scent finally after token redux. I might be able to read him now.
Is there any other wagons you've distrusted that weren't anaks? What does distrusting the dogpile mean if not "it was started by scum"? And what's the point of saying you distrust it other than trying to stop the wagon?
... Yes, of course. I've stated this repeatedly.
... That mafia jumped on the wagon afterward, obviously.
... That mafia are on the wagon, obviously? You've played mafia before, why are you acting like this is some sort of foreign concept to you?
I've definitely had the thought they looked like they were distancing
Regardless of each of our alignments that's been our whole vibe. We both have far too much self esteem