I’m seriously going to lose it laughing if the “first person to mention a Serial Killer is scum” scumtell holds true again.
I’d rather be more careful than less, because I have a horrible track record with underestimating how much closed setups can benefit scum and their PRs sometimes. No name claim from me.
Kami, I don’t know, but there’s a weird tom/Rod dynamic happening here that I want to unravel.
flavorgaming, metagaming, and trying to guess game setup are all pretty lame methods of finding wolves
i think theres enough poste to make a large one when i get home
What do you mean by metagaming?
metagaming - using out of game information to guess if someone is a wolf.
i.e., the argument that was shot down by the person thinking it whhen they said, "i thought maybe they were a wolf because they didnt get modkilled for quoting mod communication" is metagaming. a good basis for this as well is, "could i do this in real life mafia?"
@Kami tom asked why I was trying to make him look like my buddy. Which implies that he thinks I'm scum. Seemed like an odd jump to make.
@Highroller proposing a mass claim and then not actually full claiming is *eyebrows*. And now we all know you actually do see value in withholding information. Not sure I trust you here.
Also the all threats to town is standard wording to keep the possibility of an SK alive. If not worded like so it removes the threat of a third party. Some mods even go the extra mile and include fake third party win cons in that sort of space (generally something like: Third Parties if they exist win by achieving the conditions of their PM.).
For the record I have no strong feelings on a mass claim.
@Terry what did you expect to get out of the question you asked me?
I’m seriously going to lose it laughing if the “first person to mention a Serial Killer is scum” scumtell holds true again.
I’d rather be more careful than less, because I have a horrible track record with underestimating how much closed setups can benefit scum and their PRs sometimes. No name claim from me.
Kami, I don’t know, but there’s a weird tom/Rod dynamic happening here that I want to unravel.
Maybe it’s because shadow Isn’t in this game
Also I explained why I see Tom as town, what is weird about that?
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I have a qualm about the instant assumption of a serial killer. Like, neutrals COULD be a thing in this game given the wording.
But why did he suddenly jump to serial killer??
@Highroller
Could you address this? There is one answer I will accept.
(I also am accustomed to the possibility of neutrals being brought up by the mod in win conditions but not their existence being confirmed through the same means.)
Also, is your stance on mass claim based on prior experiences (aside from the already brought up Banned Mafia)? If so, what are they? I ask because I know from having been mafia in a game where mass claim was brought up as a strategy frequently, it does put on the pressure, however I do not see the current benefit and if your idea was to break the game - why not mention that instead of wanting to quit beating around the bush? Were you suggesting only a flavor claim, or a full claim, and why in that particular order?
~~~
Well, maybe I should skim Banned. I only caught the post-game comments. I am noting the crudely suggested massclaim plan here.
Since I am unfamiliar with the flavor however, I would like to hear more suggestions as to whether the benefits of flavor claim outweigh the potential repercussions.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
Everyone's seen the movie Ghostbusters, right? You know the guy played by Bill Murray? Do you think he's a serial killer?
Nope, have not seen.
Though given the nature of Highroller's claim, I suspected the mass claim had more to do with flavor than actual roles.
unvote
Hold up. Stop whatever you're supposedly doing with your life right now, and watch this movie.
Vote RE1031
Also Richard Peck did nothing wrong.
Fight me.
Well, as a matter of fact, I did not finish my essay by morning. SO RIP ME
Eh, we 20+ days. I should be able to watch it before night 1 should it be helpful to the game.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
I’m seriously going to lose it laughing if the “first person to mention a Serial Killer is scum” scumtell holds true again.
I’d rather be more careful than less, because I have a horrible track record with underestimating how much closed setups can benefit scum and their PRs sometimes. No name claim from me.
Kami, I don’t know, but there’s a weird tom/Rod dynamic happening here that I want to unravel.
Maybe it’s because shadow Isn’t in this game
Also I explained why I see Tom as town, what is weird about that?
It feels very out of character for someone with supposedly limited information on a player that's normally pretty inscrutable.
For all we know, the mafia can target people based on whether or not they're Human or Ecto or something.
I can't fathom wanting to claim anything that isn't guaranteed to help, on Day 1, in a closed setup, before we have flipped scum roles, or when someone is at L-2. Unless you can walk me through exactly how flavorclaiming will help town and/or harm the mafia.
[b]Unvote Tom[b] RVS vote removed. I mostly skimmed the first two pages as I haven’t had a ton of time today. Quick thoughts:
1. I’m opposed to claiming anything at this point until we have a better understanding of the game.
2. I’d like to reiterate the question about why Rumanshi is numbering posts? Is this something he always does?
3. I feel like high roller is pushing too hard on this Rodemy thing and it’s giving me bad vibes.
4. First to mention serial killer is one.
Riku tends to inadvertently present himself as an easy target to push so I can't imagine he'd be grabbing everyone's attention in literally every single one of his posts by numbering them as mafia.
I don't understand it, but I also don't really care why he's doing it, and I don't expect him to actually explain it anytime soon.
Could be a scum thing, but based on meta I'm inclined to say no.
Riku tends to inadvertently present himself as an easy target to push so I can't imagine he'd be grabbing everyone's attention in literally every single one of his posts by numbering them as mafia.
I don't understand it, but I also don't really care why he's doing it, and I don't expect him to actually explain it anytime soon.
Could be a scum thing, but based on meta I'm inclined to say no.
Is it anti-town or disruptive? No. There is nothing to push there. So it is NAI.
But I've made the mistake before of townreading scum with attention-drawing posts, so there's that. Besides there are more reliable tells with Riku (he is significantly more aggressive as town) - and I'm hoping by the end of this phase his alignment will be clear.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
You guys know what they say about the guys who start the third party hunt right?
I’m pretty sure that was Highroller (I’m mobile so double checking at the moment is hard), and I hate that he still insists on mass claiming. Yes it helped us solve the game in Banned, but that was Day 2 AFTER I did rad stuff and had two scum dead. No way are we mass claiming Day 1. I wish I could say Highroller’s insistence on mass claiming was AI but I don’t think it is.
Ruma is probably town. Based on his own admission and my experience this is already outside his scum meta.
I have good gut feelings about EtR I can't explain. And negative feelings about Elijah I can't explain.
Rod still the player I'm most interested in here. I almost think what's pinging me might be a town marker but for now I'm not going that deep and sticking with the initial scum ping.
RE, Tom, and Vaimes have all given me zero insight into their alignment.
Wish I had a scum game to compare to but Highroller reads super pure despite the weirdness of the way he's calling for a claim. His opening of Banned inspired more confidence (or fear in my case) because he put the info out there like he had nothing to hide. Made his stance seem legit. Only flavor claiming here undermines that. But not interested in pushing him at all despite that.
I knew something was bothering me about Highrollers push for a mass claim here. Thanks scum me!
quote from="Grapefruit21 »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/799971-banned-mafia-game-over-town-landslide-victory?comment=75"]
While I agree with all of highroller's point for a normal or semi-normal game, I am totally opposed to a massclaim this game. Wuffles has spent way too long designing this game and a mass-claim would hinder the town mostly. I don't have a problem with people who claim day 1 if they believe it's for the greater good of the game, but it's not a good idea, highroller being an exception.
This isn't helpful but it's hilarious. For the record I think it's absolutely awful to mass claim early in a normal game. When people can just hide behind vanilla claims it doesn't accomplish much.
Here it could have upside if scum are low on manipulation, weren't given or can't come up with believeable fake claims, and we are able to design a useful best case scenario that doesn't rely on scum. Without knowing we'll have all three of those I think it's too risky and I'd much rather give information roles one night to be under the radar.
Anyway this isn't finding scum.
@Rezombified Why don't you care why people are voting you? And why do you think Vezok saying his role doesn't use the GY is valuable information? I'm of the opinion we should keep things very tight to the chest and that really doesn't give anything about his role or card type away.
@Highroller why are you pushing for a mass claim in a normal game? Seems to contradict yourself from last game but my editing from before might have me misunderstanding your point.
That wording is in the mod's post #4. And you earlier acknowledged this yourself: "The win condition was revealed".
Right, but Rodemy didn't know that.
Rodemy voted me believing that I had quoted my role PM. But then why would he vote someone who quoted the town role PM? Remember, he didn't know the mod had already posted it, so absent that possibility, the only way I would be able to do that was that I had received the town role PM, right? So if I'm town, why did he vote for me? Why would he want to lynch a town?
Rodemy's defense for this later was that the mod hadn't automatically killed me for quoting a role PM, therefore I must be lying. But, if I were lying, how did he think I was able to quote the town role PM win condition verbatim when he didn't know the mod had posted it?
Do you see how that doesn't make any sense at all?
Ruma is probably town. Based on his own admission and my experience this is already outside his scum meta.
I have good gut feelings about EtR I can't explain. And negative feelings about Elijah I can't explain.
Rod still the player I'm most interested in here. I almost think what's pinging me might be a town marker but for now I'm not going that deep and sticking with the initial scum ping.
RE, Tom, and Vaimes have all given me zero insight into their alignment.
Wish I had a scum game to compare to but Highroller reads super pure despite the weirdness of the way he's calling for a claim. His opening of Banned inspired more confidence (or fear in my case) because he put the info out there like he had nothing to hide. Made his stance seem legit. Only flavor claiming here undermines that. But not interested in pushing him at all despite that.
Yeah, I mulled over it and think that Rodemy made a scum derp and not a Rodemy derp.
vote rodemy
To me it feels like he kinda got mad that someone quoted the town win con and became confirmed town in his eyes so he tried to throw shade not realising the wincon is in the first post.
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Yeah, I mulled over it and think that Rodemy made a scum derp and not a Rodemy derp.
vote rodemy
To me it feels like he kinda got mad that someone quoted the town win con and became confirmed town in his eyes so he tried to throw shade not realising the wincon is in the first post.
Even ignoring that stuff (as it's hard to talk about without coming close to angleshooting) his handling of Tom makes no sense.
That wording is in the mod's post #4. And you earlier acknowledged this yourself: "The win condition was revealed".
Right, but Rodemy didn't know that.
Rodemy voted me believing that I had quoted my role PM.
False. I voted you thinking you were the serial killer. Then thought you were trying to prove you were town by “quoting your role pm”( but using the role pm in the beginning as a guide)
I never voted you for quoting your role pm, I just pointed out you couldn’t quote it. I figured I’d Catch scum due to not being modkilled. Make sense?
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I’d rather be more careful than less, because I have a horrible track record with underestimating how much closed setups can benefit scum and their PRs sometimes. No name claim from me.
Kami, I don’t know, but there’s a weird tom/Rod dynamic happening here that I want to unravel.
But I’m open to possibilities, once I have a bit more time to explore them.
i think theres enough poste to make a large one when i get home
Though given the nature of Highroller's claim, I suspected the mass claim had more to do with flavor than actual roles.
unvote
metagaming - using out of game information to guess if someone is a wolf.
i.e., the argument that was shot down by the person thinking it whhen they said, "i thought maybe they were a wolf because they didnt get modkilled for quoting mod communication" is metagaming. a good basis for this as well is, "could i do this in real life mafia?"
I'm used to "meta" meaning "this person has acted this way / that way in other games", which is fairly different.
No one else really moved the needle while I was asleep
@Highroller proposing a mass claim and then not actually full claiming is *eyebrows*. And now we all know you actually do see value in withholding information. Not sure I trust you here.
Also the all threats to town is standard wording to keep the possibility of an SK alive. If not worded like so it removes the threat of a third party. Some mods even go the extra mile and include fake third party win cons in that sort of space (generally something like: Third Parties if they exist win by achieving the conditions of their PM.).
For the record I have no strong feelings on a mass claim.
@Terry what did you expect to get out of the question you asked me?
Maybe it’s because shadow Isn’t in this game
Also I explained why I see Tom as town, what is weird about that?
But why did he suddenly jump to serial killer??
Votecount 1.1
Tom (1): EtR
Grapefruit21 (2): Vaimes, rezombied
Rumanshi (1): elijah
Atogaholic (1): KamikazeArchon
Rodemy (2): Grapefruit21, Highroller
Highroller (3): Rumanshi, Fuwa, Rodemy
Not Voting (7): Atogaholic, RE1031, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, tomsloger, Tubba Fett, vezokpiraka
With 16 alive, it takes 9 to lynch.
Day 1 Deadline is 1pm, MST, on Wednesday December 19th: Countdown Clock
Vote stands.
Hold up. Stop whatever you're supposedly doing with your life right now, and watch this movie.
Vote RE1031
Also Richard Peck did nothing wrong.
Fight me.
Could you address this? There is one answer I will accept.
(I also am accustomed to the possibility of neutrals being brought up by the mod in win conditions but not their existence being confirmed through the same means.)
Also, is your stance on mass claim based on prior experiences (aside from the already brought up Banned Mafia)? If so, what are they? I ask because I know from having been mafia in a game where mass claim was brought up as a strategy frequently, it does put on the pressure, however I do not see the current benefit and if your idea was to break the game - why not mention that instead of wanting to quit beating around the bush? Were you suggesting only a flavor claim, or a full claim, and why in that particular order?
~~~
Well, maybe I should skim Banned. I only caught the post-game comments. I am noting the crudely suggested massclaim plan here.
Since I am unfamiliar with the flavor however, I would like to hear more suggestions as to whether the benefits of flavor claim outweigh the potential repercussions.
Eh, we 20+ days. I should be able to watch it before night 1 should it be helpful to the game.
And maybe it will be game useful too
Yeaaaahhh
I think tom is on-the-sidelines scummy.
Unvote, vote tom
I kind of like RE. The numbers one.
- This is kind of a bad/shallow question, but I'm gonna let High answer before I butt in.
What's your experience with closed setups?
I can't fathom wanting to claim anything that isn't guaranteed to help, on Day 1, in a closed setup, before we have flipped scum roles, or when someone is at L-2. Unless you can walk me through exactly how flavorclaiming will help town and/or harm the mafia.
1. I’m opposed to claiming anything at this point until we have a better understanding of the game.
2. I’d like to reiterate the question about why Rumanshi is numbering posts? Is this something he always does?
3. I feel like high roller is pushing too hard on this Rodemy thing and it’s giving me bad vibes.
4. First to mention serial killer is one.
This is fun!
UNVOTE TOM PLEASE
I don't understand it, but I also don't really care why he's doing it, and I don't expect him to actually explain it anytime soon.
Could be a scum thing, but based on meta I'm inclined to say no.
Suggest previewing before posting
Glgl
But I've made the mistake before of townreading scum with attention-drawing posts, so there's that. Besides there are more reliable tells with Riku (he is significantly more aggressive as town) - and I'm hoping by the end of this phase his alignment will be clear.
I’m pretty sure that was Highroller (I’m mobile so double checking at the moment is hard), and I hate that he still insists on mass claiming. Yes it helped us solve the game in Banned, but that was Day 2 AFTER I did rad stuff and had two scum dead. No way are we mass claiming Day 1. I wish I could say Highroller’s insistence on mass claiming was AI but I don’t think it is.
I have good gut feelings about EtR I can't explain. And negative feelings about Elijah I can't explain.
Rod still the player I'm most interested in here. I almost think what's pinging me might be a town marker but for now I'm not going that deep and sticking with the initial scum ping.
RE, Tom, and Vaimes have all given me zero insight into their alignment.
Wish I had a scum game to compare to but Highroller reads super pure despite the weirdness of the way he's calling for a claim. His opening of Banned inspired more confidence (or fear in my case) because he put the info out there like he had nothing to hide. Made his stance seem legit. Only flavor claiming here undermines that. But not interested in pushing him at all despite that.
quote from="Grapefruit21 »" url="/forums/community-forums/mafia/799971-banned-mafia-game-over-town-landslide-victory?comment=75"]
@Highroller why are you pushing for a mass claim in a normal game? Seems to contradict yourself from last game but my editing from before might have me misunderstanding your point.
Rodemy voted me believing that I had quoted my role PM. But then why would he vote someone who quoted the town role PM? Remember, he didn't know the mod had already posted it, so absent that possibility, the only way I would be able to do that was that I had received the town role PM, right? So if I'm town, why did he vote for me? Why would he want to lynch a town?
Rodemy's defense for this later was that the mod hadn't automatically killed me for quoting a role PM, therefore I must be lying. But, if I were lying, how did he think I was able to quote the town role PM win condition verbatim when he didn't know the mod had posted it?
Do you see how that doesn't make any sense at all?
Quick, when I say roles that are neither town nor mafia that are threats to the town, which is the first that comes to mind?
Which is the worst that comes to mind?
For me the answer to both is serial killer. So, I'm assuming there's a serial killer in the game. Prepare for the worst.
Go forth and prosper.
You always are in my heart.
How are there only two votes on Rod?
vote rodemy
To me it feels like he kinda got mad that someone quoted the town win con and became confirmed town in his eyes so he tried to throw shade not realising the wincon is in the first post.
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Even ignoring that stuff (as it's hard to talk about without coming close to angleshooting) his handling of Tom makes no sense.
Agreed on Kami
That was RE's point
@People who don't read: I already explained about the POST numbers that I'm using - they are to hold myself accountable so I don't be a lazy sh**. <3
@elijah You still never elaborated. Why not.
What about that post makes you feel Tom's townish?
False. I voted you thinking you were the serial killer. Then thought you were trying to prove you were town by “quoting your role pm”( but using the role pm in the beginning as a guide)
I never voted you for quoting your role pm, I just pointed out you couldn’t quote it. I figured I’d Catch scum due to not being modkilled. Make sense?